Re: B-12. Necessary for all WLS'ers?

[Guest guest]

hi, I just joined this group. My stats are below. My doctor doesn't

require B-12 supplements and my labs so far have been fine. I specifically

asked

about taking a B-12 supplement and they said I didn't have to do that as long

as my labs were normal.

Judy

Lap RNY 7/23/02

Dr. Rabkin/SF

54/5'3 " /257/140

size 22/XXL - 6-8/S

bmi 46/24

-66 inches

[Guest guest]

> We were discussing this over at obesityhelp.com. Many surgeons, mine

> included, do not require supplementing B-12 if you do not need it. ....

Someone else said that eventually not taking B-

> 12 will lead to neurological problems. Anyone ever heard of that

> occuring in post-ops? Anyone else long term not taking B-12 and

> doing OK?

B-12 may not be necessary for all types of WLS, but I can't imagine how anyone

with a RNY can do without it. B-12 has to meet up with a substance called

" intrinsic factor " in order to be used by our bodies, and that factor is found

only in the lower part of the stomach. While there is some of that factor at the

rejoining at the bottom of the Y, it is generally too late to be effective for

our B-12 absorption. That's why we do either sublingual (doesn't require the

stomach) or the shots. My surgeon insisted on it, for life. I've had this

confirmed by a pharmacist when I asked a particular pharmacy to carry the

sublingual for me.

And as far as damage without it -- it happened to me, when I went about 3 months

without taking any B-12 after a move, and lost my regular source (this was B.V.

- before Vitalady). I don't know if the damage I suffered was permanent, but I

know that I started having spells of confusion and difficulty in remembering the

simplest sequences. When a WLS friend suggested that my problem might be related

to B-12 deficiency, I got some, and immediately doubled up on the dose. It seems

to have done the trick, and I now take it daily rather than weekly. My son is a

vegetarian, and as such does not get enough B-12 in his diet -- when his school

work started to suffer because of forgetfulness, I got him started on B-12

daily, and his memory has greatly improved.

I do know of one woman, but I know this information anecdotally and not

first-hand, who suffered permanent, irreparable nerve damage from B-12

deficiency after WLS.

B-12 is cheap in sublinguals and tastes good. B-12 in shots is cheap too. It's

one of the cheapest supplements we can take, so my belief is, why chance it? We

know the consequences without it can be devastating, and we know we can't

overdose from too much of it (as we could, for example, with Vit A or

Potassium). I'll just keep taking it, thank you, since it helps me remember to

take everything else!

~~ Lyn G

[Guest guest]

Absolutely. Some are permanently disabled.

The question is why some get by LONGER than others. I went with no B12

supps for 6 yrs and my levels were still " fine " , but had fallen from 1800 to

300 over those 6 yrs, when I reviewed. Started shots then, but dropped

into the 200's before we found the right dose.

Don was also 6 yrs, and we started him when he hit the 300's, but he does ok

on 2 per month.

We feel better and I am more comfy if we hold 600-800 level, all the time,

not just a day after the shot. We make sure that any blood work is done

BEFORE a shot, not after, so it's more accurate. I don't want to see below

600 on the LAST day before the shot.

But I've also seen damage from B-1 shortage. Unfortunately, it's easy to

get in food, even. One of the ones we CAN absorb. But we tend to avoid the

foods it comes in. And there are many multi-vites on the market that do not

include the B's! If you can imagine. This one is so easy to avoid, the

damage SO permanent.

Thanks,

Vitalady, Inc. T

www.vitalady.com

If you are interested in PayPal, please click here:

https://www.paypal.com/affil/pal=orders%40vitalady.com

B-12. Necessary for all WLS'ers?

> We were discussing this over at obesityhelp.com. Many surgeons, mine

> included, do not require supplementing B-12 if you do not need it. I

> took the shots for a few months post-op, never felt any different,

> then stopped. At 20 mo post-op, labs continue to be fine and surgeon

> says that not everyone needs B-12. (That raises another question, if

> my surgeon bypasses the same length for everyone, then why do some

> need B-12 and others don't??) I also do not supplement iron and iron

> levels are fine too. Someone else said that eventually not taking B-

> 12 will lead to neurological problems. Anyone ever heard of that

> occuring in post-ops? Anyone else long term not taking B-12 and

> doing OK?

>

> Cindy in VA

> lap RNY 2/8/02

>

>

> Homepage: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Graduate-OSSG

>

> Unsubscribe: mailto:Graduate-OSSG-unsubscribe

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

According to my nutrition class information, we can store enuff B-12

for a few years but then bam! (as a certain chef says) our levels are

in the ole' potty. So you can " get away " with not supplementing for

a time but (now, here's the kicker) no way to know just how long each

person can go without supps. You might make it 3 years but I might

only make it 18 months. Better to go ahead and at the very least do

sublinguals. Some of us absorb plenty from the little pink pills

others do not. My levels soared to 1800 on 1000 mcg. a day, so I've

backed off to 500 a day but there are others that have used twice

what I did and watched their levels go in the ole' crapper. If ya'

ain't gonna supp. then get blood work done every few months to

monitor.

How come we aren't all equal? Who knows? How come some obese women

get diabetes but others don't? Some can get pregnant just

thinking 'bout it but others struggle to have a child, isn't fair but

that's the way it is.

Alice

The Loon

RNY 12/28/00

We were discussing this over at obesityhelp.com. Many surgeons, mine

included, do not require supplementing B-12 if you do not need it. I

took the shots for a few months post-op, never felt any different,

then stopped. At 20 mo post-op, labs continue to be fine and surgeon

says that not everyone needs B-12...

[Guest guest]

I wish wasn't traveling. She went thru this at 1 yr postie. Had levels

that were " fine " , moved to 3 subs a day. And 60 days later was in full

pernicious anemia. Took her nearly a year to climb back out. Levels were

more than fine in June, only " ok " in Sept, and disaster by Nov, even after

increasing.

There is no guessing with this stuff. With my distal, I shoulda run out LONG

before I did. I hate unpredictable stuff. LOL! One of the shortest limb

proximals I know was in trouble at 6 months out. So, THAT is certainly not

the criteria.

Thanks,

Vitalady, Inc. T

www.vitalady.com

If you are interested in PayPal, please click here:

https://www.paypal.com/affil/pal=orders%40vitalady.com

Re: B-12. Necessary for all WLS'ers?

> According to my nutrition class information, we can store enuff B-12

> for a few years but then bam! (as a certain chef says) our levels are

> in the ole' potty. So you can " get away " with not supplementing for

> a time but (now, here's the kicker) no way to know just how long each

> person can go without supps. You might make it 3 years but I might

> only make it 18 months. Better to go ahead and at the very least do

> sublinguals. Some of us absorb plenty from the little pink pills

> others do not. My levels soared to 1800 on 1000 mcg. a day, so I've

> backed off to 500 a day but there are others that have used twice

> what I did and watched their levels go in the ole' crapper. If ya'

> ain't gonna supp. then get blood work done every few months to

> monitor.

> How come we aren't all equal? Who knows? How come some obese women

> get diabetes but others don't? Some can get pregnant just

> thinking 'bout it but others struggle to have a child, isn't fair but

> that's the way it is.

> Alice

> The Loon

> RNY 12/28/00

>

> We were discussing this over at obesityhelp.com. Many surgeons, mine

> included, do not require supplementing B-12 if you do not need it. I

> took the shots for a few months post-op, never felt any different,

> then stopped. At 20 mo post-op, labs continue to be fine and surgeon

> says that not everyone needs B-12...

>

>

> Homepage: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Graduate-OSSG

>

> Unsubscribe: mailto:Graduate-OSSG-unsubscribe

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

I will be 3 years out in November and my medical doctor just added the B

vitamins. The surgeon didn't seem too concerned, so go figure.

Neci

[Guest guest]

Yes, yes and more yes! And, our bodies store enough B-12 for a

couple of years, but I've heard that by the time our blood tests show

as too low, often damage has already been done. It's just not worth

the risk.

in NJ

************************

> >

>

> B-12 is cheap in sublinguals and tastes good. B-12 in shots is

cheap too. It's one of the cheapest supplements we can take, so my

belief is, why chance it? We know the consequences without it can be

devastating, and we know we can't overdose from too much of it (as we

could, for example, with Vit A or Potassium). I'll just keep taking

it, thank you, since it helps me remember to take everything else!

>

> ~~ Lyn G

[Guest guest]

In  Kushner, R. MD, Managing the Obese Patient After Bariatric Surgery: A

Case Report of Severe Malnutrition and Review of the Literature, Journal of

Parenteral and Enternal Nutrition, Vol 9 Issue 2, 2000, pp 126-132, Dr.

Kushner estimates that only 75% of RNY patients will need B-12

supplementation.  The FDA RDI is only 9 mcg a day.  It would not be

surprising to find that there are some RNY patients who are able to absorb

this small amount from food even in the absence of Intrinsic Factor.

Ray Hooks

For WLS nutrition info, visit

http://www.bariatricsupplementsystem.com

 

cindyjrubin wrote:

> We were discussing this over at obesityhelp.com.  Many surgeons, mine

> included, do not require supplementing B-12 if you do not need it.  I

> took the shots for a few months post-op, never felt any different,

> then stopped.  At 20 mo post-op, labs continue to be fine and surgeon

> says that not everyone needs B-12. (That raises another question, if

> my surgeon bypasses the same length for everyone, then why do some

> need B-12 and others don't??) I also do not supplement iron and iron

> levels are fine too.  Someone else said that eventually not taking B-

> 12 will lead to neurological problems.  Anyone ever heard of that

> occuring in post-ops?  Anyone else long term not taking B-12 and

> doing OK?

>

> Cindy in VA

> lap RNY 2/8/02

>

> Homepage:  http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Graduate-OSSG

>

> Unsubscribe: mailto:Graduate-OSSG-unsubscribe

>  

>  

>

>

[Guest guest]

I guess my last message did not go through. I am curious about this

" study " . It estimates that ONLY 75% of RNY patients need b12

supplementation. That means that RNY patients need b12 supplementation

then not. I would prefer to err on the side of caution that to take a

risk and hope that I would be that 25%. The second thing I wondered is

how far post op these patients were. If the study included patients that

were say less then a year post op to those that were 20 years post op, I

would think this would be an unfair comparison. It seems to me, based on

the experience on this board, that most RNY patients MAY NOT have trouble

with b12 until several years down the line. So it would seem that we

should be comparing those that are at least 3 years out for this study.

JMHO.

Lori Owen - Denton, Texas

SRVG 7/16/01

Dr. Ritter/Dr. Bryce

In Kushner, R. MD, Managing the Obese Patient After Bariatric Surgery: A

Case Report of Severe Malnutrition and Review of the Literature, Journal

of

Parenteral and Enternal Nutrition, Vol 9 Issue 2, 2000, pp 126-132, Dr.

Kushner estimates that only 75% of RNY patients will need B-12

supplementation. The FDA RDI is only 9 mcg a day. It would not be

surprising to find that there are some RNY patients who are able to

absorb

this small amount from food even in the absence of Intrinsic Factor.

Ray Hooks

For WLS nutrition info, visit

http://www.bariatricsupplementsystem.com

[Guest guest]

> In Kushner, R. MD, Managing the Obese Patient After Bariatric Surgery: A

> Case Report of Severe Malnutrition and Review of the Literature, Journal

of

> Parenteral and Enternal Nutrition, Vol 9 Issue 2, 2000, pp 126-132, Dr.

> Kushner estimates that only 75% of RNY patients will need B-12

> supplementation. The FDA RDI is only 9 mcg a day. It would not be

> surprising to find that there are some RNY patients who are able to absorb

> this small amount from food even in the absence of Intrinsic Factor.

I do find it interesting that the bariatricsupplements.com website

encourages WLS post-ops to take B-12 sublingually for the very reasons that

have been mentioned here, and coincidentally charges about twice as much for

it as I pay at Trader Joe's for the same formula (b-12, b-6 and folic). Have

you read that information?

https://secure.contactdesigns.net/cgi-bin/bariatricsupplementsystem.com/bariatri\

csupplementsystem.cgi/nutritional_implications.html

~ ~ Lyn G

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 10/11/2003 7:54:19 PM Eastern Standard Time,

loriowen@... writes:

I would prefer to err on the side of caution that to take a

risk and hope that I would be that 25%.

===========================================

Lori, to me erring on the side of caution would mean going with the odds and

taking the B12.

Fay Bayuk -

[Guest guest]

Are you looking at your labs yourself and using clinical normal? Or are you

watching the downward trend so you can reverse it before you hit that

clinical normal? I was watching, so never " felt " ill.

Had to convince my PCP that I cannot get B12 from food because it can't

mate with intrinsic factor. He insisted on testing just before each shot to

be sure. LOL! He's sure.

Thanks,

Vitalady, Inc. T

www.vitalady.com

If you are interested in PayPal, please click here:

https://www.paypal.com/affil/pal=orders%40vitalady.com

Re: B-12. Necessary for all WLS'ers?

> hi, I just joined this group. My stats are below. My doctor doesn't

> require B-12 supplements and my labs so far have been fine. I

specifically asked

> about taking a B-12 supplement and they said I didn't have to do that as

long

> as my labs were normal.

>

> Judy

> Lap RNY 7/23/02

> Dr. Rabkin/SF

> 54/5'3 " /257/140

> size 22/XXL - 6-8/S

> bmi 46/24

> -66 inches

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Oh this is disturbing. I have placed this somewhere in the top ten on my

list of " Things They Do Not Tell You. " I had my WLS at Mt. Sinai and they do

not supplement with B12 unless it is indicated by labs. I have my second year

annual coming up beginning of November, and I intend to GRILL Dr. Gagner (now

at Cornell) about this as if he was a cheese sandwich. In anticipation of

my annual, I will get my labs done in a couple of weeks and assuming that my

labs are fine, and my B12 is somewhere around 600 (last labs I had done in May

03 put B12 at 668), what dosage of supplementation do our list veterans

suggest would be a wise daily preventive? I know we are all different and it

is

often trial and error, but what is a reasonable starting point?

I must say that yesterday was the first time I have referred back to my labs

to check figures CLOSELY since I had surgery. I always just assumed that if

nothing was " flagged " as being " out of range " then I was okay. I truly had

NO IDEA that it was important to keep track of " trends " (as has been recently

discussed about ferritin levels) and not to just rely on being " in range. "

While I don't want to be a paranoid, it's obvious from reading here that more

attention needs to be paid to this stuff, so right now I am deep in

" DUUUHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH " mode!

Hoping that her recent bout of " middle-age mental murkiness " is just that and

NOT a B12 deficiency,

Lucille

In a message dated 10/11/2003 9:53:00 AM Eastern Daylight Time,

Graduate-OSSG writes:

> B-12 may not be necessary for all types of WLS, but I can't imagine how

> anyone with a RNY can do without it. B-12 has to meet up with a substance

called

> " intrinsic factor " in order to be used by our bodies, and that factor is

> found only in the lower part of the stomach. While there is some of that

factor

> at the rejoining at the bottom of the Y, it is generally too late to be

> effective for our B-12 absorption. That's why we do either sublingual (doesn't

> require the stomach) or the shots. My surgeon insisted on it, for life. I've

had

> this confirmed by a pharmacist when I asked a particular pharmacy to carry

> the sublingual for me.

>

> And as far as damage without it -- it happened to me, when I went about 3

> months without taking any B-12 after a move, and lost my regular source (this

> was B.V. - before Vitalady). I don't know if the damage I suffered was

> permanent, but I know that I started having spells of confusion and difficulty

in

> remembering the simplest sequences. When a WLS friend suggested that my

problem

> might be related to B-12 deficiency, I got some, and immediately doubled up

> on the dose. It seems to have done the trick, and I now take it daily rather

> than weekly. My son is a vegetarian, and as such does not get enough B-12 in

> his diet -- when his school work started to suffer because of forgetfulness,

> I got him started on B-12 daily, and his memory has greatly improved.

> I do know of one woman, but I know this information anecdotally and not

> first-hand, who suffered permanent, irreparable nerve damage from B-12

deficiency

> after WLS.

>

> B-12 is cheap in sublinguals and tastes good. B-12 in shots is cheap too.

> It's one of the cheapest supplements we can take, so my belief is, why chance

> it? We know the consequences without it can be devastating, and we know we

> can't overdose from too much of it (as we could, for example, with Vit A or

> Potassium). I'll just keep taking it, thank you, since it helps me remember to

> take everything else!

>

> ~~ Lyn G

>

>

> ________________________________________________________________________

> ________________________________________________________________________

>

> Message: 9

> Date: Fri, 10 Oct 2003 16:32:50 -0700

>

> Subject: Re: B-12. Necessary for all WLS'ers?

>

> Absolutely. Some are permanently disabled.

>

> The question is why some get by LONGER than others. I went with no B12

> supps for 6 yrs and my levels were still " fine " , but had fallen from 1800 to

> 300 over those 6 yrs, when I reviewed. Started shots then, but dropped

> into the 200's before we found the right dose.

>

> Don was also 6 yrs, and we started him when he hit the 300's, but he does ok

> on 2 per month.

>

> We feel better and I am more comfy if we hold 600-800 level, all the time,

> not just a day after the shot. We make sure that any blood work is done

> BEFORE a shot, not after, so it's more accurate. I don't want to see below

> 600 on the LAST day before the shot.

>

> But I've also seen damage from B-1 shortage. Unfortunately, it's easy to

> get in food, even. One of the ones we CAN absorb. But we tend to avoid the

> foods it comes in. And there are many multi-vites on the market that do not

> include the B's! If you can imagine. This one is so easy to avoid, the

> damage SO permanent.

>

>

> Thanks,

>

>

> Vitalady, Inc. T

> www.vitalady.com

>

>

[Guest guest]

Ray, ONLY 75%? ONLY? " Only " suggests that is a small percentage, don't

you think? 75% is a huge percentage. I am certainly not a doctor, but

just common sense would suggest to me that if the statistics show that a large

majority of patients -- 75% -- will eventually need B12 supplementation, then

it's suprising that such isn't being done SOP. What does Dr. Kushner say about

this? Therefore, if ONLY 25% would NOT require supplementation, I would

think prudence would indicate that everyone of us should slam down some B12

supps, esp if dosing doesn't have deleterious effect. Understand I am not

being

confrontational (I appreciate your input enormously), I am just trying to

understand. Since it's obvious you are a maven about this stuff, and knowing

the literature as you do, in YOUR opinion, would you recommend preventive B12

supplementation?

Thanks!

Lucille

In a message dated 10/11/2003 8:02:06 PM Eastern Daylight Time,

Graduate-OSSG writes:

> Subject: Re: B-12. Necessary for all WLS'ers?

>

> In Kushner, R. MD, Managing the Obese Patient After Bariatric Surgery: A

> Case Report of Severe Malnutrition and Review of the Literature, Journal of

> Parenteral and Enternal Nutrition, Vol 9 Issue 2, 2000, pp 126-132, Dr.

> Kushner estimates that only 75% of RNY patients will need B-12

> supplementation. The FDA RDI is only 9 mcg a day. It would not be

> surprising to find that there are some RNY patients who are able to absorb

> this small amount from food even in the absence of Intrinsic Factor.

>

> Ray Hooks

>

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 10/12/2003 10:12:10 AM Eastern Standard Time,

loriowen@... writes:

Oops sorry. I meant to say that I would prefer to err on the side of

caution then to take the risk and hope I would be that 25%. It only

seems to make sense to take the b12 with a 75/25 ratio.

Lori Owen - Denton, Texas

===============================================

I should have known you would not have meant how I read it. Sorry.

Fay

[Guest guest]

Oops sorry. I meant to say that I would prefer to err on the side of

caution then to take the risk and hope I would be that 25%. It only

seems to make sense to take the b12 with a 75/25 ratio.

Lori Owen - Denton, Texas

SRVG 7/16/01

Dr. Ritter/Dr. Bryce

On Sun, 12 Oct 2003 05:30:01 EDT fbayuk@... writes:

> In a message dated 10/11/2003 7:54:19 PM Eastern Standard Time,

> loriowen@... writes:

> I would prefer to err on the side of caution that to take a

> risk and hope that I would be that 25%.

> ===========================================

>

> Lori, to me erring on the side of caution would mean going with the

> odds and

> taking the B12.

>

>

> Fay Bayuk -

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Re: B-12. Necessary for all WLS'ers?

>

> Hoping that her recent bout of " middle-age mental murkiness " is just that

and

> NOT a B12 deficiency,

>

With your B12 at around 600 you don't really need to worry about permanent

damage.

As for the " murkiness " , I have found that it has a lot to do with

supplements, sleep, nutrition, water intake, etc. I think that what a lot

of accept as " mental murkiness " can be helped greatly by adjusting

supplements, etc.

I have also found that when I get really fuzzy, that it can be because of

some vertebrae in my neck that are messed up. I have proven this over and

over. When I get like this, (and my neck really hurts) I go to my

chiropractor to get an adjustment, and the murkiness really does dissappear,

sometimes immediately.

Barbara Jean

[Guest guest]

Well, as long as middle age starts AFTER 54, we are fine here. I only have a

coupla days to go.

Veteran (skip the wise) here. B12 is about as predictable as tomorrow. LOL!

It WILL fall, that part is guaranteed. But at what speed? Who knows?

went to 3 subs per day when her doc said shots were over reacting & was in

full pernicious anemia in 60 days. Where is Jacquemil? She was low, did a

sub a day and skyrocketed her levels. She is distal, is proximal. That

part doesn't make any difference.

I've seen the most conservative proximals possible lose B12 at 6 months, and

yet me, at drastically distal lasted 6 yrs? So, time & degree of distalhood

are not the criteria.

Know that it WILL go down without " steps " , you have to customize those steps

to fit your trends. I wish I could just say, well, OK, you have 100cm

bypassed, 500mcg 3X per week is the formula. Not so. Your body will call

the shots on this. Your brain will correlated the data. Personally, if I

could so sublinguals (no lozenges or chewables for me --- yuck), I would

HAVE to take them daily or not at all. I could never work my system on a

non-daily dose. But since I can't just swallow them with others, pills are

out for me. I just do shots. I'm nervous about both ends of a needle, but

I'm NOT doing sublinguals, so I just shoot & think of all the sublunguals

I'm not doing. LOL!

Even so, once we started the shots, most just do monthly, but that didn't

hold respectable levels. My PCP was so nervous about shooting me that he

tested for his own protection, much to my delight so I could follow the

whole process. You do realize I make my PCP's head hurt with my quest for

trivia, right?

Thanks,

Vitalady, Inc. T

www.vitalady.com

If you are interested in PayPal, please click here:

https://www.paypal.com/affil/pal=orders%40vitalady.com

Re: B-12. Necessary for all WLS'ers?

> >

> > Absolutely. Some are permanently disabled.

> >

> > The question is why some get by LONGER than others. I went with no B12

> > supps for 6 yrs and my levels were still " fine " , but had fallen from

1800 to

> > 300 over those 6 yrs, when I reviewed. Started shots then, but dropped

> > into the 200's before we found the right dose.

> >

> > Don was also 6 yrs, and we started him when he hit the 300's, but he

does ok

> > on 2 per month.

> >

> > We feel better and I am more comfy if we hold 600-800 level, all the

time,

> > not just a day after the shot. We make sure that any blood work is done

> > BEFORE a shot, not after, so it's more accurate. I don't want to see

below

> > 600 on the LAST day before the shot.

> >

> > But I've also seen damage from B-1 shortage. Unfortunately, it's easy

to

> > get in food, even. One of the ones we CAN absorb. But we tend to avoid

the

> > foods it comes in. And there are many multi-vites on the market that do

not

> > include the B's! If you can imagine. This one is so easy to avoid, the

> > damage SO permanent.

> >

> >

> > Thanks,

> >

> >

> > Vitalady, Inc. T

> > www.vitalady.com

> >

> >

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

I'm guilty of rarely taking any supplements at all, (no B-12, no iron, no

multi, no nuthin' except my antidepressant) and I'm healthy as a horse,

especially since I had my gall bladder out, and the revision that took that

loop of jejunum out. My labs are always just fine, and I feel fine. My hair

is in good condition, my nails are in good condition, and I still have the

dry skin I had pre-WLS. After 21 1/2 years, I'm just too lazy to change.

<VBG> I eat, in my estimation, a balanced diet of meat and cheese protein

and veggies, very few starchy foods or sweets. I eat 4 or 5 times a day,

when I remember to eat or just get hungry (mostly the latter).I know I'm an

" oddball, " according to current WLS rules, but I followed my surgeon's

instructions " way back when " and modified my habits. At this point, I

figure, if it ain't broke, don't fix it.

Jac

http://www.pictureitdigitaldesigns.com/

http://members.cox.net/XXXFARMPAINTS

mail to: jholdaway@...

Re: B-12. Necessary for all WLS'ers?

> We were discussing this over at obesityhelp.com. Many surgeons, mine

> included, do not require supplementing B-12 if you do not need it. ....

Someone else said that eventually not taking B-

> 12 will lead to neurological problems. Anyone ever heard of that

> occuring in post-ops? Anyone else long term not taking B-12 and

> doing OK?

B-12 may not be necessary for all types of WLS, but I can't imagine how

anyone with a RNY can do without it. B-12 has to meet up with a substance

called " intrinsic factor " in order to be used by our bodies, and that factor

is found only in the lower part of the stomach. While there is some of that

factor at the rejoining at the bottom of the Y, it is generally too late to

be effective for our B-12 absorption. That's why we do either sublingual

(doesn't require the stomach) or the shots. My surgeon insisted on it, for

life. I've had this confirmed by a pharmacist when I asked a particular

pharmacy to carry the sublingual for me.

And as far as damage without it -- it happened to me, when I went about 3

months without taking any B-12 after a move, and lost my regular source

(this was B.V. - before Vitalady). I don't know if the damage I suffered was

permanent, but I know that I started having spells of confusion and

difficulty in remembering the simplest sequences. When a WLS friend

suggested that my problem might be related to B-12 deficiency, I got some,

and immediately doubled up on the dose. It seems to have done the trick, and

I now take it daily rather than weekly. My son is a vegetarian, and as such

does not get enough B-12 in his diet -- when his school work started to

suffer because of forgetfulness, I got him started on B-12 daily, and his

memory has greatly improved.

I do know of one woman, but I know this information anecdotally and not

first-hand, who suffered permanent, irreparable nerve damage from B-12

deficiency after WLS.

B-12 is cheap in sublinguals and tastes good. B-12 in shots is cheap too.

It's one of the cheapest supplements we can take, so my belief is, why

chance it? We know the consequences without it can be devastating, and we

know we can't overdose from too much of it (as we could, for example, with

Vit A or Potassium). I'll just keep taking it, thank you, since it helps me

remember to take everything else!

~~ Lyn G

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