Re: WLS & Stomach Cancer

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 11/26/01 9:03:20 PM, duodenalswitch writes:

<<

I was nervously discussing my pre-op appointment with Dr. Hess with a

friend of mine. She told me that her father had terrible ulcers 30

years ago, and had most of his stomach removed. Twenty-five years

later he had stomach cancer. Research later determined that all such

surgeries eventually went on to develope stomach cancer, basically

because of the change in the position of the stomach after surgery.

Has anyone else heard of this? Thanks, E

>>

Chris: I haven't heard of specific studies with stomach cancer BUT having

abdominal/stomach surgery *IS* a risk factor (along with other factors such

as eating preserved/pickled foods often, etc., genetics). That would mean by

association that WLS surgeries *COULD* place people at more increased risk

for stomach cancer than if they didn't have any surgery on their stomach at

all.

The surgery you are describing (to remove peptic ulcers) sounds like the

traditional BPD --- this surgery, which involves removal of the lower

antreum, does have cancer risks associated with it, most clearly pancreatic

cancer.

I do not think the 'position' of the stomach changes much with the DS ---- It

involves a sleeve gastrectomy (removal of the fundus only) and it retains

it's full functionality. Also, the pyloric valve is left intact so there

isn't the issue of stomach acids coming in contact with the upper intestines

(a factor for development of pancreatic cancer from what I remember). This

'reflux' of acid in the new connection between the stomach and intestines

could be a factor in stomach cancer as well.

I would definately like to see the exact studies that would link stomach

cancers with stomach surgeries. I also wonder if the sleeve gastrectomy

carries the same amount of risk since it is the most 'natural' way to leave

the stomach intact, imho.

I think I did post some links for stomach and pancreatic cancer when I was

researching this pre-op. You can check the archives and see if these

articles are helpful. I don't think they reference specific medical studies

that have been done but only mention that there is an increased risk of

stomach cancer with any kind of stomach surgery.

all the best,

lap ds with gallbladder removal

January 25, 2001

Dr. Gagner/Mt. Sinai/NYC

10 months post-op and still feelin' fabu

preop: 307 lbs/bmi 45

now: 204 lbs (gained 3 lbs! Yikes!)/size sweet 16/large-MEDIUM in normal

people's clothing

[Guest guest]

This could also be the Billroth II procedure, which is well-documented

as connected to gastric cancer. See

http://www.fourlane.com/mgb/cancer.htm for more info.

M.

---

in Valrico, FL, age 39

Lap DGB/DS by Dr. Rabkin 10-19-99

http://www.duodenalswitch.com/Patients/M/melaniem.html

Direct replies: mailto:melanie@...

> WLS & Stomach Cancer

>

>

> I was nervously discussing my pre-op appointment with Dr. Hess with a

> friend of mine. She told me that her father had terrible ulcers 30

> years ago, and had most of his stomach removed. Twenty-five years

> later he had stomach cancer. Research later determined that all such

> surgeries eventually went on to develope stomach cancer, basically

> because of the change in the position of the stomach after surgery.

> Has anyone else heard of this? Thanks, E

>

>

> ----------------------------------------------------------------------

>

[Guest guest]

> This could also be the Billroth II procedure, which is

well-documented

> as connected to gastric cancer. See

> http://www.fourlane.com/mgb/cancer.htm for more info.

>

>

: This is true --- I think this is the only WLS procedure in

which there are direct, documented studies done on a connection

proper. THe other stuff I read stated that ANY stomach surgery could

possibly put people at an increased risk, but they also seemed to

focus on the 'regurgitation issue' which just isn't present with the

sleeve gastrectomy....

all the best,

T

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 11/27/01 12:15:57 PM, duodenalswitch

writes:

<<

Heck in 25-30 years there might be a cure for cancer by then... I'll

risk it.

>>

I would stress that whatever connection exists it is NOT one that has been

clearly researched. All studies done have NOT indicated that anyone with DS

(or RNY) has developed stomach cancer because of it. The only procedure in

which this link has been established is the Biliroth II (and the mini-gastric

bypass utilizes this technique of linking up the intestines to the stomach

wall).

If the stomach is invaded and restructured there is a possibility of

increased risk of stomach cancer -- This is a very general statement and I'm

not even sure if it would apply to the DS since the sleeve gastrectomy does

not remove the lower stomach nor does reflux of stomach acid, etc. play any

role (I think this was one of the main reason stated for irritation of the

stomach wall that leads to changes in cells and possible cancer development).

Stomach cancer is particularly worrisome because (like pancreatic cancer) the

early symptoms are vague and could mimic post-op aliments (such as stomach

pains, cramps, etc.). The disease progresses quite quickly and is usually

fatal when diagnosed (most often at a later stage). So, being concerned

about this as a future possible side effect of WLS (or DS specifically) isn't

irrational or over-reactive imho. The good news is: The studies that have

been done on DS patients HAVEN'T shown any patterns of development of stomach

(or pancreatic) cancer!!! And, since the sleeve gastrectomy does not allow

for acid reflux around a 'stomal opening, I don't think that the stomach

lining (or the nearby intestinal lining) would become constantly exposed or

irritated and the cell lining wouldn't mutate. The only possibility is the

surgery itself irritating the stomach lining and causing some kind of

cellular change. This is temporary, though and I would think that a more

permanant irritation would be required for the development of cancer.

All the best,

lap ds with gallbladder removal

January 25, 2001

Dr. Gagner/Mt. Sinai/NYC

10 months post-op and still feelin' fabu

preop: 307 lbs/bmi 45

now: 204/size sweet 16/large-MEDIUM in normal people's clothing

[Guest guest]

30 YEARS ago? 30 years?

Hell....if they had guaranteed me 30 years from the date I had my surgery I

would have stomach cancer, I would have done it in a heartbeat (word used

advisedly). 30 years? I was looking at maybe 3 years of life left, at the

outside. Trading that for maybe stomach cancer in 30 years, by which time

cancer may be just a minor inconvenience.....well, that's a no-brainer.

For me, anyhow....as I said, I am somewhat atypical.

Ford

Re: WLS & Stomach Cancer

In a message dated 11/26/01 9:03:20 PM, duodenalswitch

writes:

<<

I was nervously discussing my pre-op appointment with Dr. Hess with a

friend of mine. She told me that her father had terrible ulcers 30

years ago, and had most of his stomach removed. Twenty-five years

later he had stomach cancer. Research later determined that all such

surgeries eventually went on to develope stomach cancer, basically

because of the change in the position of the stomach after surgery.

Has anyone else heard of this? Thanks, E

[Guest guest]

The surgery for ulcers is called the Billroth II. And yes, the

cancer rate is high and horrible. That is the exact reason that the

RNY was developed-- to avoid the bile reflux into the stomach that

happens after the Billroth II.

Now listen to this.. there are about 4 or 5 surgeons who do this

surgery for weight loss. And they try and convince people that the

surgery is harmless. Go figure!

/Seattle

> I was nervously discussing my pre-op appointment with Dr. Hess with

a

> friend of mine. She told me that her father had terrible ulcers 30

> years ago, and had most of his stomach removed. Twenty-five years

> later he had stomach cancer. Research later determined that all

such

> surgeries eventually went on to develope stomach cancer, basically

> because of the change in the position of the stomach after

surgery.

> Has anyone else heard of this? Thanks, E

[Guest guest]

Ford,

I know how you feel I am 28 so when I kept reading the posts about the quality

of life isssues I thought to myself " what quality of life do I have now " I will

take my chances with the surgery and to date I can't complain!

Lisbeth (living and loving life)

Ford Ivey wrote: 30 YEARS ago? 30 years?

Hell....if they had guaranteed me 30 years from the date I had my surgery I

would have stomach cancer, I would have done it in a heartbeat (word used

advisedly). 30 years? I was looking at maybe 3 years of life left, at the

outside. Trading that for maybe stomach cancer in 30 years, by which time

cancer may be just a minor inconvenience.....well, that's a no-brainer.

For me, anyhow....as I said, I am somewhat atypical.

Ford

Re: WLS & Stomach Cancer

In a message dated 11/26/01 9:03:20 PM, duodenalswitch

writes:

<<

I was nervously discussing my pre-op appointment with Dr. Hess with a

friend of mine. She told me that her father had terrible ulcers 30

years ago, and had most of his stomach removed. Twenty-five years

later he had stomach cancer. Research later determined that all such

surgeries eventually went on to develope stomach cancer, basically

because of the change in the position of the stomach after surgery.

Has anyone else heard of this? Thanks, E

----------------------------------------------------------------------

[Guest guest]

Heck in 25-30 years there might be a cure for cancer by then... I'll

risk it.

~Toni

30 YEARS ago? 30 years?

>

> Hell....if they had guaranteed me 30 years from the date I had my

surgery I

> would have stomach cancer, I would have done it in a heartbeat

(word used

> advisedly). 30 years? I was looking at maybe 3 years of life left,

at the

> outside. Trading that for maybe stomach cancer in 30 years, by

which time

> cancer may be just a minor inconvenience.....well, that's a no-

brainer.

>

> For me, anyhow....as I said, I am somewhat atypical.

>

> Ford

>

> Re: WLS & Stomach Cancer

>

>

>

> In a message dated 11/26/01 9:03:20 PM, duodenalswitch@y...

> writes:

>

> <<

>

> I was nervously discussing my pre-op appointment with Dr. Hess with

a

>

> friend of mine. She told me that her father had terrible ulcers 30

>

> years ago, and had most of his stomach removed. Twenty-five years

>

> later he had stomach cancer. Research later determined that all such

>

> surgeries eventually went on to develope stomach cancer, basically

>

> because of the change in the position of the stomach after surgery.

>

> Has anyone else heard of this? Thanks, E

>

>

>

> --------------------------------------------------------------------

--

>

[Guest guest]

Let's not lose sight of the fact that stomach cancer at 30 years out was

associated with a surgery other than the DS. In 30 years, I'll be 90. I

sure don't want to get stomach cancer then.

Best-

Nick

Re: WLS & Stomach Cancer

> >

> >

> >

> > In a message dated 11/26/01 9:03:20 PM, duodenalswitch@y...

> > writes:

> >

> > <<

> >

> > I was nervously discussing my pre-op appointment with Dr. Hess with

> a

> >

> > friend of mine. She told me that her father had terrible ulcers 30

> >

> > years ago, and had most of his stomach removed. Twenty-five years

> >

> > later he had stomach cancer. Research later determined that all such

> >

> > surgeries eventually went on to develope stomach cancer, basically

> >

> > because of the change in the position of the stomach after surgery.

> >

> > Has anyone else heard of this? Thanks, E

> >

> >

> >

> > --------------------------------------------------------------------

> --

> >

[Guest guest]

> Let's not lose sight of the fact that stomach cancer at 30

> years out was associated with a surgery other than the DS.

> In 30 years, I'll be 90. I sure don't want to get stomach

> cancer then.

Yes, it is worth reiterating that the woman who asked about her uncle (I

think it was), said he'd had stomach surgery and ended up with cancer

many years later. Sounds exactly like a Billroth II story to me.

Reputable surgeons abandoned the Billroth II years ago, and the

alternatives have eliminated the bile reflux that was the causative

factor in cancers arising from the Billroth II.

[Guest guest]

Thanks to all who responded with such great info. about WLS and

Stomach Cancer. I knew someone in this group would have the

answer...turns out there are many of you that do! Just to set the

record straight, I was refering to a friend's father's experience.

With each piece of info. I'm one step closer to going through with

this. I have my consult with Dr. Hess in Ohio Dec. 13th.

Thanks, E (from Illinois)

[Guest guest]

This would be ANOTHER reason to not have RNY surgery. They now cut the

stomach away and leave it " floating " . From what I understand, they just

seal it up and let it float free. There is no way to look at the inside of

something that is sealed! Scary thought!

Jerry, Southern Gal from LA still waiting on insurance approval.

>From: evershade1@...

>Reply-To: duodenalswitch

>To: duodenalswitch

>Subject: WLS & Stomach Cancer

>Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2001 00:56:45 -0000

>

>I was nervously discussing my pre-op appointment with Dr. Hess with a

>friend of mine. She told me that her father had terrible ulcers 30

>years ago, and had most of his stomach removed. Twenty-five years

>later he had stomach cancer. Research later determined that all such

>surgeries eventually went on to develope stomach cancer, basically

>because of the change in the position of the stomach after surgery.

>Has anyone else heard of this? Thanks, E

>

>

>----------------------------------------------------------------------

>

[Guest guest]

> This would be ANOTHER reason to not have RNY surgery. They now cut

the

> stomach away and leave it " floating " . From what I understand, they

just

> seal it up and let it float free. There is no way to look at the

inside of

> something that is sealed! Scary thought!

> Jerry, Southern Gal from LA still waiting on insurance approval.

Jerry, my surgeon does the Fobi (rny) and the DS. He does not leave

the Fobi patients with a " floating " stomach.

" A gastrostomy tube with a silastic size marker. The tube allows

for temporary decompression and feeding after surgery, where the size

maker provides a way to access the bypassed stomach in the future

should the need arise. "

The stomach can be accessed for feedings if necessary (the tube can

be found using x-ray technique.) That is Dr. Husted's technique, much

better than just floating around, huh?

I am pre-op for the DS, but he explains both procedures in his

seminar. Thank God he does BOTH because that is where I got the best

information about DS!! It didn't take me but a quick time to see

that DS was for me.

Dr. Husted has a cool website. If you click " procedures " , there is

an animation of the procedure (a section for each procedure)

Wanda

praying for insurance appeal to go thru!

[Guest guest]

> Dr. Husted has a cool website. If you click " procedures " , there is

> an animation of the procedure (a section for each procedure)

Duhhhhhh, I forgot to post the site

http://www.johnhustedmd.com/

Wanda

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 11/29/2001 8:23:08 AM Pacific Standard Time,

psbilyeu@... writes:

> It was complications with this tube that AJ friend n just had to

> have surgery again--Amy might know more about this.

>

Her problem is where the bile comes from...it completely seperated from

whatever its stitched or stapled to. She was in alot of pain and throwing up

etc. I'm still not completely clear on the situation but she's NOT doing

well. She came home Monday but now her left side is all swollen up. I'm

hoping she doesnt have some sort of clot. She's really having a hard time.

I hope you'll all keep her in your prayers. She's a nice lady and has been

so supportive and such a cheerleader for me and my weight loss. She started

out at 276 and is about 5'7 or 5'6 I guess. She s only 47. She has lost 100

lbs...and looked great but this is really pulling her down. She's going to

Seattle to the surgeon today so hopefully we'll know whats going on before

the day is over.

~*~ AJ ~*~

Age 37 5'8'' Post op 7/24/01 Open DS

self pay - Dr Baltasar -Alcoy Spain

07/24/01 BMI 64 415.1

08/24/01 BMI 58 386.5 -28.6 lbs!

09/24/01 BMI 55.8 367.1 -48.0 lbs! -37.75 inches

10/24/01 BMI 52.6 346.0 -69.1 lbs!

11/24/01 BMI 49.8 322.0 -93.1lbs! -77 inches

11/26/01 BMI 48.8 321.0 -94.1 lbs

My profile:

http://www.obesityhelp.com/morbidobesity/profile.phtml?N=E982002956

My websites:

www.wls4aj.homestead.com

www.wlsbellingham.homestead.com

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 11/29/01 1:31:21 PM Eastern Standard Time,

duodenalswitch writes:

<< >>

AJ - did this woman have the DS or the RNY? I am confused. Carole

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 11/29/01 1:31:21 PM Eastern Standard Time,

duodenalswitch writes:

<< >>

AJ - did this woman have the DS or the RNY? I am confused. Carole

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 11/29/2001 11:36:38 AM Pacific Standard Time,

MsMystic1@... writes:

> AJ - did this woman have the DS or the RNY? I am confused.

Sorry...she had the RNY...

~*~ AJ ~*~

Age 37 5'8'' Post op 7/24/01 Open DS

self pay - Dr Baltasar -Alcoy Spain

07/24/01 BMI 64 415.1

08/24/01 BMI 58 386.5 -28.6 lbs!

09/24/01 BMI 55.8 367.1 -48.0 lbs! -37.75 inches

10/24/01 BMI 52.6 346.0 -69.1 lbs!

11/24/01 BMI 49.8 322.0 -93.1lbs! -77 inches

11/26/01 BMI 48.8 321.0 -94.1 lbs

My profile:

http://www.obesityhelp.com/morbidobesity/profile.phtml?N=E982002956

My websites:

www.wls4aj.homestead.com

www.wlsbellingham.homestead.com

[Guest guest]

It was complications with this tube that AJ friend n just had to

have surgery again--Amy might know more about this.

Pammi

> > This would be ANOTHER reason to not have RNY surgery. They now

cut

> the

> > stomach away and leave it " floating " . From what I understand,

they

> just

> > seal it up and let it float free. There is no way to look at the

> inside of

> > something that is sealed! Scary thought!

> > Jerry, Southern Gal from LA still waiting on insurance approval.

>

> Jerry, my surgeon does the Fobi (rny) and the DS. He does not

leave

> the Fobi patients with a " floating " stomach.

> " A gastrostomy tube with a silastic size marker. The tube

allows

> for temporary decompression and feeding after surgery, where the

size

> maker provides a way to access the bypassed stomach in the future

> should the need arise. "

> The stomach can be accessed for feedings if necessary (the tube can

> be found using x-ray technique.) That is Dr. Husted's technique,

much

> better than just floating around, huh?

>

> I am pre-op for the DS, but he explains both procedures in his

> seminar. Thank God he does BOTH because that is where I got the

best

> information about DS!! It didn't take me but a quick time to see

> that DS was for me.

>

> Dr. Husted has a cool website. If you click " procedures " , there is

> an animation of the procedure (a section for each procedure)

>

> Wanda

> praying for insurance appeal to go thru!

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 11/29/01 1:31:42 PM, duodenalswitch writes:

<< I'm

hoping she doesnt have some sort of clot. She's really having a hard time.

I hope you'll all keep her in your prayers. She's a nice lady and has been

so supportive and such a cheerleader for me and my weight loss. She started

out at 276 and is about 5'7 or 5'6 I guess. She s only 47. She has lost 100

lbs...and looked great but this is really pulling her down. She's going to

Seattle to the surgeon today so hopefully we'll know whats going on before

the day is over. >>

Ouch, how terrible AJ -- She will remain in my thoughts and prayers as she

gets this looked at... I can only imagine any late term complication such as

this would really be a surprise (even though everyone knows it's always

possible) and be quite depressing...

Please let her know that we are thinking of her and wishing her a smooth

recovery...

Hugs to her!

all the best,

lap ds with gallbladder removal

January 25, 2001

Dr. Gagner/Mt. Sinai/NYC

10 months post-op and still feelin' fabu

preoP: 307 lbs/bmi 45

now: 201 lbs/size sweet 16

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 11/29/01 1:31:21 PM Eastern Standard Time,

duodenalswitch writes:

<< >>

AJ - did this woman have the DS or the RNY? I am confused. Carole

[Guest guest]

Wanda, wow, that animation is so COOL! Thanks so much for posting

the link!

BMI 44

Pre-op Consult on Dec 6

Dr. Scholten, Grand Rapids MI

> > Dr. Husted has a cool website. If you click " procedures " , there

is

> > an animation of the procedure (a section for each procedure)

>

> Duhhhhhh, I forgot to post the site

>

> http://www.johnhustedmd.com/

>

> Wanda