Re: Taking Iron and Calcium Citrate Together -

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 11/30/01 1:28:34 PM, duodenalswitch writes:

<<

So, am I clear that iron can be taken with calcium without sabotaging

the absorption of both, as long as it's calcium citrate rather than

carbonate?

This would make it much easier to get the evening's pills in...

>>

Yes, I do believe this is true -- Please, someone on the list who knows

better tell me if I'm wrong. The citrate form of calcium does NOT bind with

iron and can be taken in conjunction with it. That's about the only

advantage to taking those horse pills! LOL That, and the supposition that

they are absorbed better... (I do know some post-ops who are on Tums, calcium

carbonate and their labs are fine, though).

I love taking the majority of calciums in the evening and early a.m. with the

iron pills --- It eliminates a lot of the pills during the day. I only have

to take two at any one time for breakfast and lunch, then the ADEK and two

citrates for dinner. I also feel more comfortable drinking coffee (even if

it's decaffinated) or if I'm out and the only diet soda they have is diet

pepsi or diet coke (NOT caffine-free!) during the morning/early afternoon.

All the best,

lap ds with gallbladder removal

January 25, 2001

Dr. Gagner/Mt. Sinai/NYC

10 months post-op and still feelin' fabu

preop: 307 lbs/bmi 45

now: 200 lbs (maybe celebrating this weekend by getting under 200? I hope

so!!)/size sweet 16

[Guest guest]

Kay- I was told by the nutritionist to take my iron seperately. Not with

calcium. I take iron when I first wake up with a big glass of water. I

don't eat for about 2 hours after. I also take it just prior to going to

sleep and don't eat at least for 2 hours before. Ellen(Pam

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 12/2/01 4:41:40 PM, duodenalswitch writes:

<< Kay- I was told by the nutritionist to take my iron seperately. Not with

calcium. I take iron when I first wake up with a big glass of water. I

don't eat for about 2 hours after. I also take it just prior to going to

sleep and don't eat at least for 2 hours before. Ellen(Pam

>>

Ellen)Pam: Are you taking calcium citrate? Niccole (Mt Sinai's former

nutritionist) said that the citrate CAN BE taken with iron (it is the ONLY

form of calcium that can be). So, that's how I take them together. So far,

my labs have been fine.

I know that the carbonate and other forms of calcium will bind with iron and

this will render them useless.

all the best,

lap ds with gallbladder removal

January 25, 2001

Dr. Gagner/mt. Sinai/NYC

10 months post-op and still feelin ' fabu

preop: 307 lbs/bmi 45

now: 298 lbs (YAHOOOOOOO)/size sweet 16

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 12/3/01 10:26:00 AM, duodenalswitch writes:

<<<<<< Since calcium is one of THE most important supplements we should be

taking, why would any nutritionist recommend citrate, when, according

to Hess's study, microcrystalline hydroxyapatite is 20% more

absorbable? Yeah, it's a little more expensive (not so bad on

advnut.com) but why not be on the safe side, ESPECIALLY if you're

young and female(like we are; I'm 31) and have to live MANY more

years with this surgery?>>>>>>

: The nutritionist didn't really recommend anything --- I chose the

citrate b/c of what I've heard and read about it's supposed malapsorption vis

a vis the other choices (and I'm referring to carbonate here). I think

Niccole (the former nutritionist at Mt. Sinai) stated that she had inquired

about the microcrystalline hydroxyapitite (calapatite brand name, I think?)

and she hadn't gotten ANY response from the manufacturer at all. Therefore,

she didn't have any information to compare with Citrate at that time. I haVe

heard of this and might check it out in the future.

Thing is -- can it be taken with iron????? I like the daily routine of

having my calcium pills with iron twice out of the three times a day I must

take it. So far, my labs have been well, so I should research the calapitate

more and see if it can be taken with iron...

<<<<<P.S. 198--WOW! See, you need to indulge more often! Did you fix

your signature line? At one point, it read " 298!>>>>>>

Yup - fixed it a long time ago.... I adjust it whenever I get news of a major

loss (or sometimes a minor gain! LOL)

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 12/3/01 11:23:51 AM Eastern Standard Time, ruisha@...

writes:

<<

lap ds with gallbladder removal

January 25, 2001

Dr. Gagner/mt. Sinai/NYC

10 months post-op and still feelin' fabu

preop: 307 lbs/bmi 45

now: 298 lbs/si >>

,

This is not correct I am sure.. Maybe you should change it.

Sheri

[Guest guest]

,

Since calcium is one of THE most important supplements we should be

taking, why would any nutritionist recommend citrate, when, according

to Hess's study, microcrystalline hydroxyapatite is 20% more

absorbable? Yeah, it's a little more expensive (not so bad on

advnut.com) but why not be on the safe side, ESPECIALLY if you're

young and female(like we are; I'm 31) and have to live MANY more

years with this surgery?

P.S. 198--WOW! See, you need to indulge more often! Did you fix

your signature line? At one point, it read " 298! "

> Ellen)Pam: Are you taking calcium citrate? Niccole (Mt Sinai's

former

> nutritionist) said that the citrate CAN BE taken with iron (it is

the ONLY

> form of calcium that can be). So, that's how I take them

together. So far,

> my labs have been fine.

>

> I know that the carbonate and other forms of calcium will bind with

iron and

> this will render them useless.

>

> all the best,

>

> lap ds with gallbladder removal

> January 25, 2001

> Dr. Gagner/mt. Sinai/NYC

>

> 10 months post-op and still feelin ' fabu

>

> preop: 307 lbs/bmi 45

> now: 298 lbs (YAHOOOOOOO)/size sweet 16

[Guest guest]

No, my dear, I don't think it can be taken with iron. Please be

absolutely positively certain that you can do so with the citrate.

Don't just take one person's word on it. It could be catastrophic if

she were even partially wrong.

Love,

>

> In a message dated 12/3/01 10:26:00 AM, duodenalswitch@y... writes:

>

> <<<<<< Since calcium is one of THE most important supplements we

should be

> taking, why would any nutritionist recommend citrate, when,

according

> to Hess's study, microcrystalline hydroxyapatite is 20% more

> absorbable? Yeah, it's a little more expensive (not so bad on

> advnut.com) but why not be on the safe side, ESPECIALLY if you're

> young and female(like we are; I'm 31) and have to live MANY more

> years with this surgery?>>>>>>

>

> : The nutritionist didn't really recommend anything --- I

chose the

> citrate b/c of what I've heard and read about it's supposed

malapsorption vis

> a vis the other choices (and I'm referring to carbonate here). I

think

> Niccole (the former nutritionist at Mt. Sinai) stated that she had

inquired

> about the microcrystalline hydroxyapitite (calapatite brand name, I

think?)

> and she hadn't gotten ANY response from the manufacturer at all.

Therefore,

> she didn't have any information to compare with Citrate at that

time. I haVe

> heard of this and might check it out in the future.

>

> Thing is -- can it be taken with iron????? I like the daily

routine of

> having my calcium pills with iron twice out of the three times a

day I must

> take it. So far, my labs have been well, so I should research the

calapitate

> more and see if it can be taken with iron...

>

>

> <<<<<P.S. 198--WOW! See, you need to indulge more often! Did you

fix

> your signature line? At one point, it read " 298!>>>>>>

>

> Yup - fixed it a long time ago.... I adjust it whenever I get news

of a major

> loss (or sometimes a minor gain! LOL)

[Guest guest]

> No, my dear, I don't think it can be taken with iron. Please be

> absolutely positively certain that you can do so with the citrate.

> Don't just take one person's word on it. It could be catastrophic

if

> she were even partially wrong.

: It wasn't just Niccole but other post-ops confirmed that

this was true... that citrate CAN be taken with iron (it does not bind

with it).

As I mentioned before, my calcium as been fine with the three month

and six month labs. I would think that if there was a catastrophic

affect, it would definately have showed up by then???????

Did Mt. Sinai's new nutritionist recommend calapitate instead of

citrate or was this something you decided on after your independent

research? I'm very curious because it wasn't even on the list of

recommended vitamins for post-op BPD/DS patients, although I know very

well that many people do use it as a calcium supplement...

I will, however, contact the company and see if I can get an

'official' answer from them. Perhaps this will alleviate any fears

anyone on the list *may* have regarding taking the citrate with

iron...

all the best,

lap ds with gallbladder removal

January 25, 2001

Dr. Gagner/mt. Sinai/NYC

10 months post-op and still feelin' fabu

preop: 307 lbs/bmi 45

now: 298 lbs/si

[Guest guest]

OK, .

FIX YOUR SIGNATURE LINE! Whew--I feel better!

OK, then. In the packet that the new Sinai nutritionists give out,

Cal Apatite (brand name of microcrystalline hydroxyapatite compound)

is listed as a post-three-week calcium option, along with Tums,

Viactiv, Citracal, etc. That's right; just bunched up with the rest

of them! There's no mention of which is superior, merely a note

saying to discuss the options with the nutritionist. When I saw the

nutritionist she didn't even mention the MCHC. Maybe she was

planning to do so at the 3 week follow up visit. At any rate, the

information that I've found about this form of calcium comes from

Hess's patient binder (on duodenalswitch.com), the archives of this

list, and other internet sources, most of which SEEM credible but I

have yet to verify the internet stuff.

Best,

> > No, my dear, I don't think it can be taken with iron. Please be

> > absolutely positively certain that you can do so with the

citrate.

> > Don't just take one person's word on it. It could be

catastrophic

> if

> > she were even partially wrong.

>

>

> : It wasn't just Niccole but other post-ops confirmed that

> this was true... that citrate CAN be taken with iron (it does not

bind

> with it).

> As I mentioned before, my calcium as been fine with the three month

> and six month labs. I would think that if there was a catastrophic

> affect, it would definately have showed up by then???????

>

>

> Did Mt. Sinai's new nutritionist recommend calapitate instead of

> citrate or was this something you decided on after your independent

> research? I'm very curious because it wasn't even on the list of

> recommended vitamins for post-op BPD/DS patients, although I know

very

> well that many people do use it as a calcium supplement...

>

> I will, however, contact the company and see if I can get an

> 'official' answer from them. Perhaps this will alleviate any fears

> anyone on the list *may* have regarding taking the citrate with

> iron...

>

> all the best,

>

> lap ds with gallbladder removal

> January 25, 2001

> Dr. Gagner/mt. Sinai/NYC

> 10 months post-op and still feelin' fabu

>

> preop: 307 lbs/bmi 45

> now: 298 lbs/si

[Guest guest]

> OK, .

>

> FIX YOUR SIGNATURE LINE! Whew--I feel better!>>>>

Oh, I thought you were referring to a previous time... I don't have a

sig line, I write it manually and spontaneously to whatever I feel

like that day. So, when you told me before, I didn't realize I

had mistyped. I'm sure I'll be doing that quite a bit nowadays b/c I

just can't get used to typing 198! Or, 100 anything for that matter!

LOL

>

> OK, then. In the packet that the new Sinai nutritionists give out,

> Cal Apatite (brand name of microcrystalline hydroxyapatite

compound)

> is listed as a post-three-week calcium option, along with Tums,

> Viactiv, Citracal, etc. That's right; just bunched up with the rest

> of them! There's no mention of which is superior, merely a note

> saying to discuss the options with the nutritionist. When I saw the

> nutritionist she didn't even mention the MCHC. Maybe she was

> planning to do so at the 3 week follow up visit. At any rate, the

> information that I've found about this form of calcium comes from

> Hess's patient binder (on duodenalswitch.com), the archives of this

> list, and other internet sources, most of which SEEM credible but I

> have yet to verify the internet stuff.>>>>>

I've heard it's a reliable source of calcium. I remember some

post-ops discussing it at one of the meetings awhile ago. I just

recall Niccole saying it could very well be a good supplement but she

had not recieved anything from the company (they seemed pretty

non-responsive for some reason or another) so she couldn't really

comment or base anything on facts that she's read, received, reviewed,

etc. Perhaps Liz has a different take and/or has this information?

I'm not sure.

They didn't talk about which was best for me until the three week

visit. Then, I was taking carbonate (Caltrate) and I switched to the

citrical basically because I found it easily at the store, heard it

was absorbed well and then I found out it could be taken with iron and

that's what cinched the deal for me! LOL

All the best,

lap ds with gallbladder removal

January 25, 2001

Dr. Gagner/Mt. Sinai/NYC

10 months post-op and still feelin' fabu

preop: 307 lbs/bmi 45

now: 198 (yes - I did lose not gain

[Guest guest]

My mom has already been diagnosed as having osteoparosis, and 5 years

ago she fell & smashed her elbow. Long story short, the old

prosthesis was removed due to infection, & was left out for 8 weeks.

My mom's orthopedic surgeon fully expected to need to use donor bone

to anchor the new prosthesis. I had bought some cal-apatite, and gave

her a bottle & asked her to take it. She did, and when the surgeon

went in to set the new prosthesis, he found that she had grown NEW

BONE, despite her osteoparosis, and it was good, healthy bone- no

donor bone was needed. He asked her if she was doing anything

different (she's been on CA citrate forever), and she showed him the

cal-apatite. He was impressed enough to look into the research, &

FWIW, he says we need both citrate and MCHA- that the MCHA rebuilds

bone and the citrate stabilizes serum ca levels (blah blah.. mom

wandered at this point). Anyway, what I've done is this: I take

citrate with my iron tablets in the am & pm, then at lunchtime I take

the cal-apatite. I'm about to have my 6 month levels drawn, so we'll

see how its working.. will keep y'all updated..

BTW.. not sure if it can be taken w/iron..so I just don't. And I can

buy it locally here (not the Cal-Apatite- I WISH!!--but MCHA)at both

Central Market and Whole Foods.

Liane

>

> In a message dated 12/3/01 10:26:00 AM, duodenalswitch@y... writes:

>

> <<<<<< Since calcium is one of THE most important supplements we

should be

> taking, why would any nutritionist recommend citrate, when, according

> to Hess's study, microcrystalline hydroxyapatite is 20% more

> absorbable?

> can it be taken with iron????? I like the daily routine of

> having my calcium pills with iron twice out of the three times a day

I must

> take it. So far, my labs have been well, so I should research the

calapitate

> more and see if it can be taken with iron...

>

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 12/4/01 5:54:05 AM, duodenalswitch writes:

<< He was impressed enough to look into the research, &

FWIW, he says we need both citrate and MCHA- that the MCHA rebuilds

bone and the citrate stabilizes serum ca levels (blah blah.. mom

wandered at this point). Anyway, what I've done is this: I take

citrate with my iron tablets in the am & pm, then at lunchtime I take

the cal-apatite. I'm about to have my 6 month levels drawn, so we'll

see how its working.. will keep y'all updated..

BTW.. not sure if it can be taken w/iron..so I just don't. And I can

buy it locally here (not the Cal-Apatite- I WISH!!--but MCHA)at both

Central Market and Whole Foods.

>>

Hmmmm.... Liane: That's an interesting and tempting routine -- to ADD the

MCHA to the citrates.... Let us know what the iron levels are like and it's

great to hear from personal experience in re the MCHA and it's effects...

I'll have to check out the MCHA ... is it the same as Cal-Apatite (that just

being the brand name of one form of MCHA) or is Cal-Apatite something a

little different?

all the best,

lap ds with gallbladder removal

January 25, 2001

Dr. Gagner/mt. Sinai/NYC

10 months post-op and still feelin' fabu

preop: 307 lbs/bmi 45

now: 198 lbs/size sweet 16

[Guest guest]

Liane,

I like this idea of mixing the Cal Apatite with citrate. Which Cal

Apatite do you use? The one with boron? How many a day do you take?

Thanks,

> >

> > In a message dated 12/3/01 10:26:00 AM, duodenalswitch@y...

writes:

> >

> > <<<<<< Since calcium is one of THE most important supplements we

> should be

> > taking, why would any nutritionist recommend citrate, when,

according

> > to Hess's study, microcrystalline hydroxyapatite is 20% more

> > absorbable?

>

> > can it be taken with iron????? I like the daily routine of

> > having my calcium pills with iron twice out of the three times a

day

> I must

> > take it. So far, my labs have been well, so I should research the

> calapitate

> > more and see if it can be taken with iron...

> >

[Guest guest]

Yes, I do take calcium citrate and I think it was that told me to do

it seperately.. But, if your blood work keep is good then keep doing what

you are doing. Mine is also good so I am just use to doing it this way so

what the heck. Keep up the good work. Ellen(Pam

[Guest guest]

Where can one get cal-apatite. Is it better than Citrical? Ellen(Pam

[Guest guest]

-

the first bottle of cal apatite was the metagenics brand.. but the

website was down until the lawsuit was settled, so I bought Biochem

Formula IX Bone Density Factors with boron. The metagenics brand has

1000mg/tablet of MCHA, the bone density formula has 1250 mg/2

tablets.. I was taking 1 of the metagenics brand, & now 2 of the

others. I have 6 month labs due, so I'll soon find out if my routine

is working. I take the cal-apatite at noon with lunch. If my levels

of calcium and iron are off, I guess I'll be taking things a bit

differently, eh?

I'll keep you posted-

Liane

> > He was impressed enough to look into the research, &

> > FWIW, he says we need both citrate and MCHA- that the MCHA rebuilds

> > bone and the citrate stabilizes serum ca levels (blah blah.. mom

> > wandered at this point).

[Guest guest]

> Hmmmm.... Liane: That's an interesting and tempting routine -- to

ADD the

> MCHA to the citrates.... Let us know what the iron levels are like

and it's

> great to hear from personal experience in re the MCHA and it's

effects...

>

> I'll have to check out the MCHA ... is it the same as Cal-Apatite

(that just

> being the brand name of one form of MCHA) or is Cal-Apatite something a

> little different?

>

Cal-Apatite is MCHA.. that's just what Metagenics calls their formula.

If you want to investigate prices in local health food stores, ask

for the MCHA- they'll probably have several formulations. Thus far,

Cal Apatite has the biggest bang per pill, but I'm still looking!

And yep, when I have new labs.. I'll share.

Liane =)

who is still on the plateau from heck and jealous of everyone.. even

the preops! <joke>