Re: Digest Number 5167

[Guest guest]

First, please everyone, don't take this the wrong way, but for me this is an

optional, elective procedure. I'm <big breath> 5'3 " and weight 237, my BMI

is 41.5 (first time I've said those numbers to anyone). Other than high

cholesterol, I'm in good health. I'm comfortable with my body. (kinda,

sorta) So, I'm doing this for vanity reasons. I've been thin before,

although not in a long time, and I like myself better that way. If I dont

get this covered 100% by my surgery, or very close to 100% I'm not going to

do it. I have insurance (Healthnet HMO) that is supposed to cover surgical

procedures 100%. If the doctor/IPA is contracted with my insurance, then

they are supposed to accept what the insurance company pays them and not come

looking to me for more. I'm aleady leaning toward Dr. Jossart. First

because he gave me a January appointment and Dr. Rabkin gave me one in late

March. Second, because his rates are lower. I'm submitting my referral and

insurance info before my appt. on 1/10 and his office is supposed to find out

before I come in if the procedure is approved and if everything is covered.

I told them when I called that I wasn't paying anything out of pocket. So.

We'll see. I have been going to Dr. Rabkins classes; they've been very

helpful and I've learned a lot. The only thing I dont understand is the

program fee. Can someone explain what that is. And another thing. I'm

moving to the DC/MD area in April. If I cant get it done here, I'll try

again there. And for those who are interested, my picture is on my AOL

homepage.

Judy

[Guest guest]

Judy,

First, I'm sure T (timarie) will get an answer to you

before I do, but I figure ... what the heck...

I've gone to both doc's. My heart belongs to Jossart,

and here are the reasons. It has NOTHING to do with

skill or compentencies, but important reasons anyway,

I believe.

When I went to my consult with Rabkin, I was with not

less than 7 other possible patients. We had a 1 hour

'education' meeting with a now former employee, who

claimed the computer equipement was broken and she had

to 'just draw'. It was only later that I found that

she made the same claim several other tmes, and one

time the receptionist held the educational meeting.

Then, we were herded (yes!) back into the office and

took turns having our insurance reviewed (skimmed),

met with a PA (who in my case was rude and cold, but

others like him), and the shooed out the door. I

never met the doctor. I was told then that they would

not even schedule me until I paid the $3,000 program

fee....with a money order. My personal check would

not suffice.

Later, after several phone calls, I was told it would

be AT LEAST 6 WEEKS before they would even submit my

paperwork, because they were so booked up on surgeries

that they couldn't schedule them until then, and the

insurance companies were requesting that they not

submit the paper.

In the meantime, I was lied to not less than 5 times

about paperwork. NONE of my phone calls were ever

returned, I always had to call back.

Until a goddess turned me on to Dr. J's office. I

called in, got an appointment WITH THE DOCTOR, saw

him..spent almost 2 hours with him while he questioned

me, I questioned him, and he examined me. HE

DID...NOT HIS PA.

Then the paperwork was submitted within 2 days.

Unfortunately, I was denied, but am resubmitting under

new insurance.

Now...some will tell you that Dr. R is worth waiting

for...but I have a lot more confidence in a doctor who

will actually meet with me than one who sends in his

help to do so. If he's going to cut open my gut, I

want to look him in the eye. It felt like Rabkin

wanted only to herd us in, and herd us out, and

collect the money. I'm not saying he thinks

that...but his practice made me feel that way.

SO...now that I've pissed off the Rabkinites in the

room, I'll let others speak to it...

Babs

> Date: Sat, 15 Dec 2001 12:54:48 EST

> From: JPG1747@...

> Subject: Introduction

>

> Hi, my name is Judy. I live in San Francisco and

> I'm considering the surgery

> with either Dr. Jossart or Dr. Rabkin. It depends

> on scheduling, insurance,

> and payment matters. Any feedback would be

> appreciated. I just got on this

> list a couple of days ago and I really appreciate

> all of the information you

> all are sharing. Thanks.

>

>

> [Non-text portions of this message have been

> removed]

>

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

Judy,

You didn't say your age, but I am assuming you are relatively young

if you don't have a list of co-morbidities. I am 32 now and for a

long time my weight didn't give me any health issues. I actually had

normal blood pressure and low chlorestorol. It seemed like when I

hit age 30, my health started a downward spiral. Some of it came on

quick, but other things had been problems that I was ignoring for a

long time. I have asthma which is mostly allergy induced, but the

weight made it much worse. I had sleep apnea, but denied the problem

for years. I could go on, but I think you get my point. I guess all

I am saying is that you may want to consider that surgery is not only

for vanity reasons, but to prevent serious health problems from

occurring. My BMI was 40 when I went in for surgery so I was

considered a " light weight " . Now that I am down 80 lbs., I can see

what a major difference the weight loss has made in my life.

Unless you have gone through a thorough exam including a sleep study,

you may have co-morbidities that you aren't aware of. When I first

started to look into surgery, I too said I would never do it if I had

to pay for any part of it. Now I am so glad I did pay the program

fee and my insurance co-pay. Besides looking a lot better, I feel

better than I have in years and years.

Kathy M.

DS 7/19/01

213 pre-op

133 today

[Guest guest]

Judy,

Let me tell you about High Cholesterol. If you are on meds for HC,

they are pretty spooky drugs. The more I read about the drug I was

taking...the more scared I became..then of course, they took it off

the market because people were dropping dead from it! Oh, the name

was Baycol. Now I was switched to an old standby, but when you read

the side affects long term, and realize the constant 3 month blood

tests are to make sure that your liver is not bellying up on you, you

will realize how damn serious this HC is!

Hopefully, just the HC will be your only side affect from your

weight. I wish it had been for me, but now that I have a brand new

titanium and plastic knee, I understand that my body is falling apart

one step at a time. My BMI ranged between 38 and 41 prior to

surgery! I will say, now that I am post op, if I had had this

surgery just to look good, the first two weeks I would have put my

head in the oven. They were pretty damn tough for me. These past two

weeks have been a great improvement, but now I am not looking for the

truck that hit me, I am just looking for the VW bug that hit me!

It's a very serious surgery, but I support you regardless of your

reasons, just understand that certainly is not the " easy way out! "

laughing..regardless of what many of our detractors say to us!

Best of luck,

Theresa

Surgery date: DS Nov. 19, 2001

Dr. Gregg Jossart

Highest weight: 293

Surgery weight: 251

Current weight: 224

Height: 5' 7.5 "

> First, please everyone, don't take this the wrong way, but for me

this is an

> optional, elective procedure. I'm <big breath> 5'3 " and weight

237, my BMI

> is 41.5 (first time I've said those numbers to anyone). Other

than high

> cholesterol, I'm in good health. I'm comfortable with my body.

(kinda,

> sorta) So, I'm doing this for vanity reasons. I've been thin

before,

> although not in a long time, and I like myself better that way. If

I dont

> get this covered 100% by my surgery, or very close to 100% I'm not

going to

> do it. I have insurance (Healthnet HMO) that is supposed to cover

surgical

> procedures 100%. If the doctor/IPA is contracted with my

insurance, then

> they are supposed to accept what the insurance company pays them

and not come

> looking to me for more. I'm aleady leaning toward Dr. Jossart.

First

> because he gave me a January appointment and Dr. Rabkin gave me one

in late

> March. Second, because his rates are lower. I'm submitting my

referral and

> insurance info before my appt. on 1/10 and his office is supposed

to find out

> before I come in if the procedure is approved and if everything is

covered.

> I told them when I called that I wasn't paying anything out of

pocket. So.

> We'll see. I have been going to Dr. Rabkins classes; they've been

very

> helpful and I've learned a lot. The only thing I dont understand

is the

> program fee. Can someone explain what that is. And another

thing. I'm

> moving to the DC/MD area in April. If I cant get it done here,

I'll try

> again there. And for those who are interested, my picture is on

my AOL

> homepage.

>

> Judy

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Add to that that there are no 40-50 year long-term studies on the Statin

drugs for lowering cholesterol. Who knows if I run a higher risk of liver

cancer or cirrosis (sp?!) of the liver or WHATEVER because I take these

drugs? The FDA doesn't require such long-term studies (if they did, we'd

never have a drug approved), and because I'd be dead in 10 years (or less!)

without the drugs, a 40-50 year study is irrelevant as far as they're

concerned.

As for me, I'm going to cry with joy the day I toss my Lipitor!!!

I also have to echo what Theresa said -- I'm like you, Judy -- 5'0 " ,

225-230, and in good health other than the cholesterol. However, I'm

already starting to experience knee pain, and it's getting worse daily. If

I don't have this surgery, I will surely wind up with permanent knee damage

and surgery for that. Or worse. My family has high blood pressure and

diabetes in its genes. 3 of my 4 grandparents died before they were 65.

The future for a MO person, even a healthy MO person (oxymoron of a term

considering that MO people are automatically NOT healthy) isn't to rosy.

You might consider the surgery " elective " for now, but how elective will it

be 5 years from now when you've gained more weight and developed more

co-morbids? The more co-morbids you have, the higher the risk for surgery.

That's why I don't consider this elective. Yeah, I want to be thin

(dammit!), but mostly I want to get rid of the drugs and the knee pain and

the sluggishness I feel at the end of a day. I have two young children to

keep up with, and I fully plan on being here to see *their* grandchildren.

/rant off.

~alyssa, pre-op

surgery date: 12/20 (holy cow!)

surgeon: dr. k

Re: Digest Number 5167

> Judy,

>

> Let me tell you about High Cholesterol. If you are on meds for HC,

> they are pretty spooky drugs. The more I read about the drug I was

> taking...the more scared I became..then of course, they took it off

> the market because people were dropping dead from it! Oh, the name

> was Baycol. Now I was switched to an old standby, but when you read

> the side affects long term, and realize the constant 3 month blood

> tests are to make sure that your liver is not bellying up on you, you

> will realize how damn serious this HC is!

>

> Hopefully, just the HC will be your only side affect from your

> weight. I wish it had been for me, but now that I have a brand new

> titanium and plastic knee, I understand that my body is falling apart

> one step at a time.

[Guest guest]

It's an optional procedure for everyone...you can opt for surgery or opt for

death. See? It's optional.

As for me, I'm not waiting around for the comorbidities to find me -- I k

now they will if I give them enough time. No matter how " healthy " a MO

person is, by definition, they're NOT healthy. Our bodies were not meant to

handle 100 lbs extra, and sooner or later, they'll let us know. You've been

lucky so far...are you counting on remaining lucky? I'm not.

~alyssa

Re: Digest Number 5167

> First, please everyone, don't take this the wrong way, but for me this is

an

> optional, elective procedure.

[Guest guest]

In a message dated Tue, 18 Dec 2001 6:49:23 PM Eastern Standard Time,

" snurfles17 " writes:

> Hi Judy!

>

> While you may feel now that this is an elective surgery, you will

> still be taking an extremely important step towards better health.

> BMI of 41.5 and high cholesterol is not something to take lightly.

> I'm hoping you can get approved because you will be doing your body a

> service. And even if you're doing it for vanity, I'm sure there are

> plenty of us out there who can relate to that!

>

> Good luck to you!

>

> Tracey in Santee (San Diego)

>

Thanks Tracey. As soon as I get my new insurance infoermation, I'm sending it

to Dr. Jossart's office so they can submit a claim and then we'll see what

happens. So far his office has been great to work with so I'm very optimistic

about it all.

Judy

[Guest guest]

Hi Judy!

While you may feel now that this is an elective surgery, you will

still be taking an extremely important step towards better health.

BMI of 41.5 and high cholesterol is not something to take lightly.

I'm hoping you can get approved because you will be doing your body a

service. And even if you're doing it for vanity, I'm sure there are

plenty of us out there who can relate to that!

Good luck to you!

Tracey in Santee (San Diego)

> First, please everyone, don't take this the wrong way, but for me

this is an

> optional, elective procedure. I'm <big breath> 5'3 " and weight

237, my BMI

> is 41.5 (first time I've said those numbers to anyone). Other

than high

> cholesterol, I'm in good health. I'm comfortable with my body.

(kinda,

> sorta) So, I'm doing this for vanity reasons. I've been thin

before,

> although not in a long time, and I like myself better that way. If

I dont

> get this covered 100% by my surgery, or very close to 100% I'm not

going to

> do it. I have insurance (Healthnet HMO) that is supposed to cover

surgical

> procedures 100%. If the doctor/IPA is contracted with my

insurance, then

> they are supposed to accept what the insurance company pays them

and not come

> looking to me for more. I'm aleady leaning toward Dr. Jossart.

First

> because he gave me a January appointment and Dr. Rabkin gave me one

in late

> March. Second, because his rates are lower. I'm submitting my

referral and

> insurance info before my appt. on 1/10 and his office is supposed

to find out

> before I come in if the procedure is approved and if everything is

covered.

> I told them when I called that I wasn't paying anything out of

pocket. So.

> We'll see. I have been going to Dr. Rabkins classes; they've been

very

> helpful and I've learned a lot. The only thing I dont understand

is the

> program fee. Can someone explain what that is. And another

thing. I'm

> moving to the DC/MD area in April. If I cant get it done here,

I'll try

> again there. And for those who are interested, my picture is on

my AOL

> homepage.

>

> Judy

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

In duodenalswitch@y..., JPG1747@a... wrote:

> First, please everyone, don't take this the wrong way, but for me

this is an

> optional, elective procedure. I'm <big breath> 5'3 " and weight

237, my BMI

> is 41.5 (first time I've said those numbers to anyone). Other

than high

> cholesterol, I'm in good health. I'm comfortable with my body.

(kinda,

> sorta) So, I'm doing this for vanity reasons

Hi Judy,

I am 5'4 weigh 240 lbs. with a BMI 41. I also felt that I was in good

health other than lower back pain. (I had a ruptured disk in 1996, I have

had surgery to help the sciatica) it has left me with some pain when I

stand or walk on my feet for long periods. Anyway that is why I wanted to

have surgery. My doc's tell me that if I could lose the weight than I

would feel better. Also my family has a history of Type 2 diabetes, heart

disease etc. My surgery is scheduled for January 9, 2002. I just had my

pre-op testing done last week. I went for an EKG. They did it 3 times

and asked me how I felt. They wanted to know if I had been having chest

pains. I told them no. They said my ekg was abnormal and that it showed

I have stress on my heart. They are going to keep on eye on me and see if

it gets any better after surgery. My PCP says that it could be from the

excess weight. So even though you are feeling fine now and you feel it is

just vanity reasons. You never know what your body is going through with

the excess weight. I feel that I am doing the best thing for myself, I

could not lose the weight on my own I have tried desperately. It has made

me very depressed about my weight and how I feel about my body. I know

that you have to do what is right for you. So keep searching and you will

figure it out. Good Luck !

M.

pre-op 01/09/02

BMI 41/ 240 lbs.

AGE 39

DR. K

OPEN

__________________________________________________