Re: my daughter is driving me crazy

[Guest guest]

Tonya,

I have thought and thought about your message. I have tried to come

up with ways to help. One thing that I was able to put together is

that you mentioned Aubrey's speech skills are delayed. BINGO! That

is part of what is going on. I'm sure that she is somewhat

frustrated by that, especially if she is excelling in other areas.

A speech delay, no matter how minor, can affect behavior, most

definitely.

The second thought I had was to get your hand on the book " 123

Magic. " It was a godsend for me both at home and in the classroom.

I know you said that Aubrey's teachers do not mention any problems

and that is frequently the case. Kids can hold back their behavior

and be " good " for only so long and then when they get home where it

is safe to act out, they do. Lucky us. But if you try a method

such as that described by Dr. Phelan, and you hang in there and are

consistent, I think you will find it makes a difference.

One other thought...I would be very interested to find out more

about RSS kids and their social skills. There are more than a few

parents who have commented on their RSS children being more self-

absorbed, not as social as their peers, preferring to play alone. I

know this has been the case with Max. (He is getting better,

finally.) I don't know if it is the PDD-like tendencies that the

kids have - meaning they have some characteristics of PDD without

having the actual diagnosis or enough to make that diagnosis. But

what you are describing is not unusual for our kids.

I hope that in some way I am helping you here. There is no magic

remedy. I'll bet, however, that once Aubrey's communication skills

improve, you will see other behaviors improve as well. There is a

definite connection.

Jodi Z

[Guest guest]

Hi Tonya,

I am going thru the same thing with Coby. This behavior started

almost 18 months ago and I am STILL trying to get it under control.

Coby has violent outbursts, kicks, screams, throws things, bites,

and pinches. He only has a couple of kinds of toys that he will

play with and seems to obsess on them. I am still undecided about

Coby's play. He does NOT do any imaginary play and very rarely

plays WITH others. He may play side by side with his twin, but most

times not actually with her. He has a very low attention span and

can not sit still to listen to a book.

Coby has RSS and his twin sister Carlee does not. They will be 3 in

October. I also have 2 older children, Shye 10 and Brock 8. I have

a Child Development Associate Certification, taken multiple

redirecting behaviors classes and seminars, and worked in day care

for the past 10 years, 5 of those while owning my own. After all of

that I still can NOT figure out how to control Coby.

It is SOOOO frustrating!!! The doctors continue to ask, " do all of

your kids act this way, " or blame it on my discipline practices. I

know that I am doing the same thing I have done with all my children

and it does NOT work with Coby. I have always been able to tell

that his outbursts and anger were different.

I use time outs. (He has such a high tolerense for pain that

spanking him does not phase him.) I use a booster seat now that has

a lap belt in it with a tray on it, but when I first started I had

to use a car seat. It was the only thing that I could keep him in.

I didn't see any results until I found something I could sit him in

and then go about my routine. He could sit there and scream and

kick all he wanted and the household stayed on track. Once he gets

control of his self and calms down then I let him out. I should add

that he is in the same room with me. He sees me and the other kids

and that we continue to do whatever we were doing. I don't lock him

up and keep him in another room…hmmmm there's a thought...HEHEHEHE

After doing exactly the same thing every time Coby does something

wrong for the past 18 months, I have seen little progress.

Example: While camping Coby would be in the sand with all the other

kids and instead of playing with them he would throw sand at them.

EVERYTIME he threw sand he was put in a time out in his booster

seat. We actually started keeping count on the 3rd day and we lost

count that evening at 16 times he had been put in time out. Ok, can

you be more consistent then that??? He still never comprehended

that if he threw sand he would get in trouble. He is a very

intelligent little boy, so I don't think that it is that, but it's

just like he doesn't get it.

Carlee has always been a sweet easy child; however, the last month

with her has changed as well. I feel like her changes are normal

and age appropriate though. She is trying to learn her boundaries

and see what she can and can not get away with. Once she is

disciplined for the behavior she rarely tries it again. I think

that is the difference between her and Coby. She learns from her

mistakes.

Coby goes to Riley Children's Hospital on Tuesday for an evaluation

at their behavioral center. He will see a MD and a psychiatrist. I

pray that we get some kind of results. It is to the point that our

family outings have become too much for me to handle. I am the only

one that can handle Coby, so I spend the day fighting him and

missing what my other children are getting to do and enjoy.

I'm sorry I don't have any answers for you, but hopefully you can

find some comfort in the fact that Aubrey is not the only one acting

this way. If you ever want to talk or vent please don't hesitate to

message me. I truly do understand exactly how you feel.

le

[Guest guest]

As if my first post wasn't long enough...!

I just read Jodi's post. I have to agree with her 100%. Coby's

behaviors did change as his vocabulary improved. Coby has several PPD

traits. I have spoken with many rss parent that say the same about

their children.

Coby has started taking Zoloft and it has helped. I had a very hard

time making the decision to start medication, but my doctor told me

once Coby's behavior started to affect the family structure it was

time for action. It is not fare to Coby that I get so frustrated with

him that all we do is fight. He is not getting the best from me. I

decided that I would rather use medication and have quality time with

him.

Have you spoken with your doctors?

le

[Guest guest]

Tonya,

I don't know if anyone has said this or if it is possible, but she

could be frustrated. If she has speech issues and can't seem to get

her point across, she may feel that this is her only outlet. So it

could be frustration. Also, in preschool, she may notice that she is

not the same as her class mates. My son discovered that he was

different around age 4 when all the 3 year olds were bigger than him.

(His words). Anyhow, just a thought. Have you considered teacher her

some sign language. It can reduce the frustration because even if she

can't say what she wants, she could sign it.

Hope this helps.

Blessings,

Carmen, mom to Storm, rss, almost 10 and a slew of others!

[Guest guest]

Tonya and everyone,

Wow, it's amazing to hear of similar behavior issues. My 3 1/2 year

old - nonRSS - has been very difficult. I've always found

it frustrating to deal with - and without being able to communicate

it with friends or family due to perspective issues that reflect on

their interaction with him. I too have tried all avenues - rewards,

time-outs... - he just doesn't get it. What I've found with

though is that he is incredibly like I was as a child.

I've done some serious reflection over the last 3 years and have

figured out that his behavior is similar to mine as a child in that

he demands and NEEDS an incredible amount of attention. He is

overstimilated with too much interaction and play, and

understimiluated without enough. The scary thing is - I was just

like that (according to my mother)and she had to get help trying to

deal with me. We found out later my IQ was very high in some areas

and that I had a learning disability. The point to all this is -

I'm trying not to assume 's intelligence, behavior or

whatever is something of an oddity - but, more of a personality that

is all his own and one that I will need to learn to work with. For

his preschool health exam - I'm bringing my thoughts to our

pediatrician and hope he will lead me in the right direction. I'm

sad to hear we are all dealing with the similar issues - but, glad

to know I'm not the only one. My husband thinks after reading many

posts to him - (I love men's simplistic views) that " with all the

commonality - maybe it's just the age " . I have to agree with him to

some extent. I know several friends who have shown similar

difficulties. Anyway, thank you for listening.....again, I'm sorry

to hear of everyone's troubles and hope that we all find the answers

we need.

- H

> I haven't been posting much lately, been more of a reader. I have

a question that I hope someone will be able to give me advice on.

Aubrey's behavior is horrible. I have tried just about everything to

get her to listen. Stickers, bribes,standing in corner, taking away

toys. You name it, I've tried it. Well the thing is when she gets in

trouble it doesn't seem to phase her and she seems to throw tantrums

for no apparent reason. It's not just every now and then either,

this goes on every day, several times a day. She also seems to have

more fun playing by herself than with me except when she wants me to

read her stories. However, at the daycare she goes to they have

never mentioned her acting like this. I know she excells doing fine

motor skills, but is way behind in gross motor and speech skills.

Could this just be put off as terrible two's, even though she's 3

1/2, or could this be some sort of behavior or developmental

problem. Any insight would be appreciated as I am at the point

> of pulling my hair out.

> Thanks,

> Tonya mom to Aubrey

>

>

> __________________________________________________

>

[Guest guest]

Tonya

You have gotten some excellent advice from others. All are worth examining.

Both my RSS son and my non RSS daughter were HORRIBLE when in their 3's. I

remember saying to anyone that would listen to me " what is that myth about

terrible twos?? My kids were great then, but 3???? I want to by-pass 3 and

go from 2 to 4!!!! "

There could be a large combination of things happening. Be thankful it's not

at school. You are describing Adam pretty well at that age (however he was

really outgoing and social back then) but his " not listening " and " doing his

own thing " behaviours were real BAD at school and not so bad here (I had

adjusted my style of dealing with him) but in a school with a bunch of other

kids, they couldn't. You don't need to be hearing how " bad " she was every

day.

One secret that was the ONLY thing to work with Adam.

I gave him a choice about everything. And I got good at it too. In fact I

still do it just automatically.

Say it's bed time and he needs to tidy up and get his pajamas on. I will

first, give him a warning " 5 minutes until you go to bed " or " when this show

is over " (some way for him to comprehend what I meant, before he could tell

time).......using a timer never worked (he would just readjust it!) But he

would then get another warning " 2 minutes to bed time " and then " 1 minute to

bed time " . And then I would walk over and turn the t.v. off (or whatever it

was that was going on) but my physically moving my body into his space,

(whether playing or watching a video) would ensure his attention.

Also I got to anticipate that there was no point in saying " turn off the

t.v. now " because he wouldn't. I just didn't get into those power struggles.

I just got up and turned it off. In the grand scheme of things I would think

" what do I really want him to do right now? turn off the t.v.? or clean up

and put on pajamas? " Well it's clean and pajamas, hence why I would turn off

the t.v.

then I would label the next event clearly and with little words as possible.

It's time for bed. Would you like to tidy up the cars or the crayons? He

would pick one and I would do the other. You see, if I had just said " clean

up " he would have done a bit, or none at all, or thrown a fit.....and for

any of those options I would have ended up probably cleaning it all up

myself. So this way he was DOING what I expected but with help AND he got to

choose (or have control).

Then I would say " OK pajamas first or brushing your teeth? " And he would

choose, again I would be right there to ensure he followed through and if I

sensed he was going to stray off I would remind him of HIS choice.

I did this for a while and slowly Adam got use to the routines so that I

didn't have to be right close to him all the way (I could be in his room,

folding back his blankets while he brushed his teeth). But if I just yelled

from my chair " OK go to bed " (which I could do with my daughter) ahhh, Adam

would have been swinging from the ceiling.

Also after awhile of always saying 5 minutes left, 2 minutes left, 1 minute

left......he got a feel for what that 5 meant without being able to tell

time. And he became more accepting of those routines.

So the key is.......provide choices (notice I still got him to bed, with

pajamas and teeth brushed......but HE thinks he had the control.....that was

the WHOLE secret to Adam, and in some respects it still is).....and secondly

LOTS of warning before change (ie. going out in the car now, or going to

bed) Even if we were going somewhere that Adam loved (like the park) he

could give me a hassle " not yet, I'm busy " if I didn't give him that warning

time.

Debby

my daughter is driving me crazy

> I haven't been posting much lately, been more of a reader. I have a

question that I hope someone will be able to give me advice on. Aubrey's

behavior is horrible. I have tried just about everything to get her to

listen. Stickers, bribes,standing in corner, taking away toys. You name it,

I've tried it. Well the thing is when she gets in trouble it doesn't seem to

phase her and she seems to throw tantrums for no apparent reason. It's not

just every now and then either, this goes on every day, several times a day.

She also seems to have more fun playing by herself than with me except when

she wants me to read her stories. However, at the daycare she goes to they

have never mentioned her acting like this. I know she excells doing fine

motor skills, but is way behind in gross motor and speech skills. Could this

just be put off as terrible two's, even though she's 3 1/2, or could this be

some sort of behavior or developmental problem. Any insight would be

appreciated as I am at the point

> of pulling my hair out.

> Thanks,

> Tonya mom to Aubrey

>

>

> __________________________________________________

>

[Guest guest]

Debby, where have you been all my life . Oh my gosh - I LOVE your

suggestions. Your advice is absolutely fantastic. Thank you so

much. Looks like we will be incorporating the Debby's timing

technique and choice awards today!

Thank you again and have a great day!

- H

> Tonya

> You have gotten some excellent advice from others. All are worth

examining.

> Both my RSS son and my non RSS daughter were HORRIBLE when in

their 3's. I

> remember saying to anyone that would listen to me " what is that

myth about

> terrible twos?? My kids were great then, but 3???? I want to by-

pass 3 and

> go from 2 to 4!!!! "

> There could be a large combination of things happening. Be

thankful it's not

> at school. You are describing Adam pretty well at that age

(however he was

> really outgoing and social back then) but his " not listening "

and " doing his

> own thing " behaviours were real BAD at school and not so bad here

(I had

> adjusted my style of dealing with him) but in a school with a

bunch of other

> kids, they couldn't. You don't need to be hearing how " bad " she

was every

> day.

>

> One secret that was the ONLY thing to work with Adam.

>

> I gave him a choice about everything. And I got good at it too. In

fact I

> still do it just automatically.

>

> Say it's bed time and he needs to tidy up and get his pajamas on.

I will

> first, give him a warning " 5 minutes until you go to bed " or " when

this show

> is over " (some way for him to comprehend what I meant, before he

could tell

> time).......using a timer never worked (he would just readjust

it!) But he

> would then get another warning " 2 minutes to bed time " and then " 1

minute to

> bed time " . And then I would walk over and turn the t.v. off (or

whatever it

> was that was going on) but my physically moving my body into his

space,

> (whether playing or watching a video) would ensure his attention.

>

> Also I got to anticipate that there was no point in saying " turn

off the

> t.v. now " because he wouldn't. I just didn't get into those power

struggles.

> I just got up and turned it off. In the grand scheme of things I

would think

> " what do I really want him to do right now? turn off the t.v.? or

clean up

> and put on pajamas? " Well it's clean and pajamas, hence why I

would turn off

> the t.v.

> then I would label the next event clearly and with little words as

possible.

> It's time for bed. Would you like to tidy up the cars or the

crayons? He

> would pick one and I would do the other. You see, if I had just

said " clean

> up " he would have done a bit, or none at all, or thrown a

fit.....and for

> any of those options I would have ended up probably cleaning it

all up

> myself. So this way he was DOING what I expected but with help AND

he got to

> choose (or have control).

> Then I would say " OK pajamas first or brushing your teeth? " And he

would

> choose, again I would be right there to ensure he followed through

and if I

> sensed he was going to stray off I would remind him of HIS choice.

>

> I did this for a while and slowly Adam got use to the routines so

that I

> didn't have to be right close to him all the way (I could be in

his room,

> folding back his blankets while he brushed his teeth). But if I

just yelled

> from my chair " OK go to bed " (which I could do with my daughter)

ahhh, Adam

> would have been swinging from the ceiling.

>

> Also after awhile of always saying 5 minutes left, 2 minutes left,

1 minute

> left......he got a feel for what that 5 meant without being able

to tell

> time. And he became more accepting of those routines.

>

> So the key is.......provide choices (notice I still got him to

bed, with

> pajamas and teeth brushed......but HE thinks he had the

control.....that was

> the WHOLE secret to Adam, and in some respects it still

is).....and secondly

> LOTS of warning before change (ie. going out in the car now, or

going to

> bed) Even if we were going somewhere that Adam loved (like the

park) he

> could give me a hassle " not yet, I'm busy " if I didn't give him

that warning

> time.

>

> Debby

>

>

> my daughter is driving me crazy

>

>

> > I haven't been posting much lately, been more of a reader. I

have a

> question that I hope someone will be able to give me advice on.

Aubrey's

> behavior is horrible. I have tried just about everything to get

her to

> listen. Stickers, bribes,standing in corner, taking away toys. You

name it,

> I've tried it. Well the thing is when she gets in trouble it

doesn't seem to

> phase her and she seems to throw tantrums for no apparent reason.

It's not

> just every now and then either, this goes on every day, several

times a day.

> She also seems to have more fun playing by herself than with me

except when

> she wants me to read her stories. However, at the daycare she goes

to they

> have never mentioned her acting like this. I know she excells

doing fine

> motor skills, but is way behind in gross motor and speech skills.

Could this

> just be put off as terrible two's, even though she's 3 1/2, or

could this be

> some sort of behavior or developmental problem. Any insight would

be

> appreciated as I am at the point

> > of pulling my hair out.

> > Thanks,

> > Tonya mom to Aubrey

> >

> >

> > __________________________________________________

> >