Re: Trying to figure out what is going on

[Guest guest]

Patti

He is getting no vitiamins or supplements. I am going to be ordering some

vitiamins soon, mine had sugar of course. Will a multivitamin give him enough

magnesium. Or should I consult about a supplement? I've read many times here,

about people taking kids off the supplements.... it's all still confusing to me.

He eats a banana every am and if he's lucky some days he may get 1/2 of one in

the evening. I always heard the potassium would help leg aches. His die off

(in the form of pooh) hasn't been bad at all, other than a few runny

diapers,(which i caused by giving him raw apple), his pooh is good. His die off

has manifested in behavior more than anything. At least I am assuming it is die

off....??

You say give episom salt baths when die off is bad, which i assumed one did if

they were having die off in the form of diarehha. Or do you give the baths for

any form of die off, pooh and/or behavioral.

I still can't figure out why his behavior would do a 180, nothing has changed

in his diet other than the motrin. I did add carrots to his chicken nuggets

this Tuesday do you think that could cause anything?

Thanks

becky

Patti wrote:

Hi Becky,

Sensitivity to phenols is not really an SCD issue... but is one that many of the

parents of autistic kids are familiar with. So, no... you won't find mention of

it in BTVC. I honestly don't know much about it, except that many parents report

it. I would have to Google " phenols " to find out what foods are high in them...

but I am going to leave that up to you. I know some parents use the " NoFenol "

enzymes from Houston Nutraceuticals, which seems to help some.

We also know that some kids have difficulty tolerating probiotics. Not sure

exactly why this is. It could be due to various factors.... could even be

related to the effect probiotics have on calcium oxalate crystals in the body.

It seems that probiotics tend to cause those crystals to dissolve.... which is a

GOOD thing, BUT it leaves you with two things, if the theory behind

Tamaro's research holds true... you have oxalic acid waste which gets dumped

into the gut to be disposed of, and is very irritating, AND it frees up calcium

to float around unmanaged in the body and brain. This can be irritating to the

neuro system. So, to be very brief (it's a complicated and basically non-SCD

issue) you can counter that with adequate magnesium (not the citrate form, I

found out!!).... but you also MUST have adequate vitamins A, D and K on board to

help the body put that freed calcium where it belongs, in the bones and teeth.

That's all I'm going to say about the topic, but

you can learn a lot more from over at her Vitamin K list:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/VitaminK/

(Be sure to read her " files " section for the basic research paper and the

protocol.)

<<G has woken up the last 3

nights around 11:00pm and been crying. Since he has limited

language skills we can never figure out why. He is moving his legs

alot and will grab at them, so we are assuming it's leg cramps.

Last week during the day, he complained of a leg hurting and

needing " med-cin " . Could leg aches be a sign of something.>>

Magnesium might help a LOT.... but I'm honestly don't know what would cause the

leg cramps. Do you have him on magnesium already? What about CLO (still thinking

about the vitamin A & D)? What other supplements?

YES.... the bit of sugar in the Motrin can really mess things up at this point,

so don't give that again. If you have to give Motrin, use the adult tablets (you

might have to get it compounded if the dosage isn't right.... these tablets are

hard to split in half).... and grind them up and mix in applesauce or something.

There would still be a trace of starch filler in that, but way better than

giving the sugar. Ideally, you would not use this for very long, or very

often... but if he's in pain, you have to do something, I know. Motrin

(ibuprofen) is really hard on the gut, by the way. There is just no good options

for pain relievers... they're all bad in some way, darn it.

Are you giving him epsom salts baths? This is a great way to get magnesium in

through the skin..... helps ease die-off symptoms and is calming.

Patti

[Guest guest]

Becky,

Some kids definitely don't tolerate carrots well in the beginning... . but not

sure that explains everything you're seeing.

Cutting out the sugary Motrin might mean that NOW the gut bugs are really

starving.... and beginning to die.

Yes, die-off can ABSOLUTELY manifest itself in behavioral symptoms..... I'd say

for MOST of the kids it does! Get him in a tub with epsom salts!!

Some don't see big changes in poop necessarily. Every kid is different, that is

for sure.

Yes, sometimes it seems to work best for a lot of kids to pull the supps.... or

at least *most* of them, in the beginning.... just to clear the picture and have

as few variables as possible. BUT, magnesium does help with detoxing and

calming, so it might be a good thing. You would most likely not get enough in a

multiple. I would take a look at something like the magnesium glycinate that

Kirkman Labs has.... and follow their dosage recommendations (only the ones in

capsules are legal... not the " sweet powder " ). But, to be honest, for now...

just epsom salts baths might be all you need.

Patti

Re: Trying to figure out what is going on

Patti

He is getting no vitiamins or supplements. I am going to be ordering some

vitiamins soon, mine had sugar of course. Will a multivitamin give him enough

magnesium. Or should I consult about a supplement? I've read many times here,

about people taking kids off the supplements.... it's all still confusing to me.

He eats a banana every am and if he's lucky some days he may get 1/2 of one in

the evening. I always heard the potassium would help leg aches. His die off (in

the form of pooh) hasn't been bad at all, other than a few runny diapers,(which

i caused by giving him raw apple), his pooh is good. His die off has manifested

in behavior more than anything. At least I am assuming it is die off....??

You say give episom salt baths when die off is bad, which i assumed one did if

they were having die off in the form of diarehha. Or do you give the baths for

any form of die off, pooh and/or behavioral.

I still can't figure out why his behavior would do a 180, nothing has changed

in his diet other than the motrin. I did add carrots to his chicken nuggets this

Tuesday do you think that could cause anything?

Thanks

becky

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[Guest guest]

Becky,

Just in answer to the Epsom Salt baths... they are good for any kind of die-off

issue. I would get him in it. This might at least help him cope somewhat.

Charlene

Patti

He is getting no vitiamins or supplements. I am going to be ordering some

vitiamins soon, mine had sugar of course. Will a multivitamin give him enough

magnesium. Or should I consult about a supplement? I've read many times here,

about people taking kids off the supplements.... it's all still confusing to me.

He eats a banana every am and if he's lucky some days he may get 1/2 of one in

the evening. I always heard the potassium would help leg aches. His die off (in

the form of pooh) hasn't been bad at all, other than a few runny diapers,(which

i caused by giving him raw apple), his pooh is good. His die off has manifested

in behavior more than anything. At least I am assuming it is die off....??

You say give episom salt baths when die off is bad, which i assumed one did if

they were having die off in the form of diarehha. Or do you give the baths for

any form of die off, pooh and/or behavioral.

I still can't figure out why his behavior would do a 180, nothing has changed

in his diet other than the motrin. I did add carrots to his chicken nuggets this

Tuesday do you think that could cause anything?

Thanks

becky

Patti wrote:

Hi Becky,

Sensitivity to phenols is not really an SCD issue... but is one that many of

the parents of autistic kids are familiar with. So, no... you won't find mention

of it in BTVC. I honestly don't know much about it, except that many parents

report it. I would have to Google " phenols " to find out what foods are high in

them... but I am going to leave that up to you. I know some parents use the

" NoFenol " enzymes from Houston Nutraceuticals, which seems to help some.

We also know that some kids have difficulty tolerating probiotics. Not sure

exactly why this is. It could be due to various factors.... could even be

related to the effect probiotics have on calcium oxalate crystals in the body.

It seems that probiotics tend to cause those crystals to dissolve.... which is a

GOOD thing, BUT it leaves you with two things, if the theory behind

Tamaro's research holds true... you have oxalic acid waste which gets dumped

into the gut to be disposed of, and is very irritating, AND it frees up calcium

to float around unmanaged in the body and brain. This can be irritating to the

neuro system. So, to be very brief (it's a complicated and basically non-SCD

issue) you can counter that with adequate magnesium (not the citrate form, I

found out!!).... but you also MUST have adequate vitamins A, D and K on board to

help the body put that freed calcium where it belongs, in the bones and teeth.

That's all I'm going to say about the topic, but

you can learn a lot more from over at her Vitamin K list:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/VitaminK/

(Be sure to read her " files " section for the basic research paper and the

protocol.)

<<G has woken up the last 3

nights around 11:00pm and been crying. Since he has limited

language skills we can never figure out why. He is moving his legs

alot and will grab at them, so we are assuming it's leg cramps.

Last week during the day, he complained of a leg hurting and

needing " med-cin " . Could leg aches be a sign of something.>>

Magnesium might help a LOT.... but I'm honestly don't know what would cause

the leg cramps. Do you have him on magnesium already? What about CLO (still

thinking about the vitamin A & D)? What other supplements?

YES.... the bit of sugar in the Motrin can really mess things up at this

point, so don't give that again. If you have to give Motrin, use the adult

tablets (you might have to get it compounded if the dosage isn't right.... these

tablets are hard to split in half).... and grind them up and mix in applesauce

or something. There would still be a trace of starch filler in that, but way

better than giving the sugar. Ideally, you would not use this for very long, or

very often... but if he's in pain, you have to do something, I know. Motrin

(ibuprofen) is really hard on the gut, by the way. There is just no good options

for pain relievers... they're all bad in some way, darn it.

Are you giving him epsom salts baths? This is a great way to get magnesium in

through the skin..... helps ease die-off symptoms and is calming.

Patti

[Guest guest]

Hi Becky - We are new (2 wks now) to the diet with our 3yr ASD son,

but I saw this post and thought I would add my 2 cents. :-) The day

we added carrots in, we had a horrible day too. I had several replies

on this board tell me that carrots are pretty hard to digest, and

that they might be causing some problems. The other thing I saw was

the bananas. I know the diet really recommends them, but BOTH our DAN

doctor and nutritionist had us remove them from my son's diet last

year b/c they said that 90% of autisic kids have unknown bad

reactions to them. Apparently they encourage yeast, as they are

very " yeasty " food, and can cause lots of problems overall. Ben

didn't test allergic to them on the IgG or IgE tests at all, but BOY

what a difference when we took them out of his diet. He had been

eating them almost every day for 2 years (LOVED them). Anyway, he

still can't tolerate them well....

We are getting ready to try the " phenol-assist " for Ben from

Kirkman...He has major issues with salicylates. I need to check and

see if this brand is legal? Anyway, I read this section in " Why Can't

my Child Behave? " book last night, p.198 and wanted to share this

too. I know it's not related to the SC Diet really, but since people

have been talking a bit about no-fenol, I thought it was worth

sharing. Here it is.....

" It is estimated that about half of the children identified as

autistic are deficient in the enzyme phenol sulfotranferase.

Researchers in England have developed a test to measure the amount of

this enzyme in the bloodstream, and many autistic children had almost

none of the enzyme at all! It is possible that this inability to

detoxify phenolic compounds in the body may disrupt the ability of

the brain to send messages, resulting in autistic symptoms. "

We are hoping that using the phenolic enzymes might really help

things...will keep posted!

Hope things get better for you Becky!!! Hang in there. :-)

:-)

> Hi Becky,

>

> Sensitivity to phenols is not really an SCD issue... but is one

that many of the parents of autistic kids are familiar with. So,

no... you won't find mention of it in BTVC. I honestly don't know

much about it, except that many parents report it. I would have to

Google " phenols " to find out what foods are high in them... but I am

going to leave that up to you. I know some parents use the " NoFenol "

enzymes from Houston Nutraceuticals, which seems to help some.

>

> We also know that some kids have difficulty tolerating

probiotics. Not sure exactly why this is. It could be due to various

factors.... could even be related to the effect probiotics have on

calcium oxalate crystals in the body. It seems that probiotics tend

to cause those crystals to dissolve.... which is a GOOD thing, BUT it

leaves you with two things, if the theory behind Tamaro's

research holds true... you have oxalic acid waste which gets dumped

into the gut to be disposed of, and is very irritating, AND it frees

up calcium to float around unmanaged in the body and brain. This can

be irritating to the neuro system. So, to be very brief (it's a

complicated and basically non-SCD issue) you can counter that with

adequate magnesium (not the citrate form, I found out!!).... but you

also MUST have adequate vitamins A, D and K on board to help the body

put that freed calcium where it belongs, in the bones and teeth.

That's all I'm going to say about the topic, but

> you can learn a lot more from over at her Vitamin K

list:

> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/VitaminK/

> (Be sure to read her " files " section for the basic research paper

and the protocol.)

>

> <<G has woken up the last 3

> nights around 11:00pm and been crying. Since he has limited

> language skills we can never figure out why. He is moving his

legs

> alot and will grab at them, so we are assuming it's leg cramps.

> Last week during the day, he complained of a leg hurting and

> needing " med-cin " . Could leg aches be a sign of something.>>

>

> Magnesium might help a LOT.... but I'm honestly don't know what

would cause the leg cramps. Do you have him on magnesium already?

What about CLO (still thinking about the vitamin A & D)? What other

supplements?

>

> YES.... the bit of sugar in the Motrin can really mess things up

at this point, so don't give that again. If you have to give Motrin,

use the adult tablets (you might have to get it compounded if the

dosage isn't right.... these tablets are hard to split in half)....

and grind them up and mix in applesauce or something. There would

still be a trace of starch filler in that, but way better than giving

the sugar. Ideally, you would not use this for very long, or very

often... but if he's in pain, you have to do something, I know.

Motrin (ibuprofen) is really hard on the gut, by the way. There is

just no good options for pain relievers... they're all bad in some

way, darn it.

>

> Are you giving him epsom salts baths? This is a great way to get

magnesium in through the skin..... helps ease die-off symptoms and is

calming.

>

> Patti

>

>

[Guest guest]

Patti

His pooh has been good. I see no signs of carrots in his pooh, so I am

assuming he is digesting/tolerating them. Could I see behavioral stuff from the

carrots instead of seeing it in the pooh????

Becky

Patti wrote:

Becky,

Some kids definitely don't tolerate carrots well in the beginning... . but not

sure that explains everything you're seeing.

Cutting out the sugary Motrin might mean that NOW the gut bugs are really

starving.... and beginning to die.

Yes, die-off can ABSOLUTELY manifest itself in behavioral symptoms..... I'd say

for MOST of the kids it does! Get him in a tub with epsom salts!!

Some don't see big changes in poop necessarily. Every kid is different, that is

for sure.

Yes, sometimes it seems to work best for a lot of kids to pull the supps.... or

at least *most* of them, in the beginning.... just to clear the picture and have

as few variables as possible. BUT, magnesium does help with detoxing and

calming, so it might be a good thing. You would most likely not get enough in a

multiple. I would take a look at something like the magnesium glycinate that

Kirkman Labs has.... and follow their dosage recommendations (only the ones in

capsules are legal... not the " sweet powder " ). But, to be honest, for now...

just epsom salts baths might be all you need.

Patti

Re: Trying to figure out what is going on

Patti

He is getting no vitiamins or supplements. I am going to be ordering some

vitiamins soon, mine had sugar of course. Will a multivitamin give him enough

magnesium. Or should I consult about a supplement? I've read many times here,

about people taking kids off the supplements.... it's all still confusing to me.

He eats a banana every am and if he's lucky some days he may get 1/2 of one in

the evening. I always heard the potassium would help leg aches. His die off (in

the form of pooh) hasn't been bad at all, other than a few runny diapers,(which

i caused by giving him raw apple), his pooh is good. His die off has manifested

in behavior more than anything. At least I am assuming it is die off....??

You say give episom salt baths when die off is bad, which i assumed one did if

they were having die off in the form of diarehha. Or do you give the baths for

any form of die off, pooh and/or behavioral.

I still can't figure out why his behavior would do a 180, nothing has changed in

his diet other than the motrin. I did add carrots to his chicken nuggets this

Tuesday do you think that could cause anything?

Thanks

becky

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Well.... that does seem like an indication that he is tolerating them gut wise.

I honestly don't know... you had said that you were wondering if it could have

been caused by the carrots. Seems like you would see more of a gut thing,

though.

I am really wiped out tonight... long week.... doing the best I can here. I'm

not sure but I feel you've probably just got plain-old die-off on your hands. I

will check in tomorrow. Do the baths.... and lets see how things go.

P

Re: Trying to figure out what is going on

Patti

His pooh has been good. I see no signs of carrots in his pooh, so I am

assuming he is digesting/tolerating them. Could I see behavioral stuff from the

carrots instead of seeing it in the pooh????

Becky

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How much magnesium should our kids be getting everyday? Is it safe to supp

w/mag. if you are giving epsom salts baths too? Jenn & K

Re: Trying to figure out what is going on

Becky,

Just in answer to the Epsom Salt baths... they are good for any kind of

die-off issue. I would get him in it. This might at least help him cope

somewhat.

Charlene

Patti

He is getting no vitiamins or supplements. I am going to be ordering some

vitiamins soon, mine had sugar of course. Will a multivitamin give him enough

magnesium. Or should I consult about a supplement? I've read many times here,

about people taking kids off the supplements.... it's all still confusing to me.

He eats a banana every am and if he's lucky some days he may get 1/2 of one in

the evening. I always heard the potassium would help leg aches. His die off (in

the form of pooh) hasn't been bad at all, other than a few runny diapers,(which

i caused by giving him raw apple), his pooh is good. His die off has manifested

in behavior more than anything. At least I am assuming it is die off....??

You say give episom salt baths when die off is bad, which i assumed one did if

they were having die off in the form of diarehha. Or do you give the baths for

any form of die off, pooh and/or behavioral.

I still can't figure out why his behavior would do a 180, nothing has changed

in his diet other than the motrin. I did add carrots to his chicken nuggets this

Tuesday do you think that could cause anything?

Thanks

becky

Patti wrote:

Hi Becky,

Sensitivity to phenols is not really an SCD issue... but is one that many of

the parents of autistic kids are familiar with. So, no... you won't find mention

of it in BTVC. I honestly don't know much about it, except that many parents

report it. I would have to Google " phenols " to find out what foods are high in

them... but I am going to leave that up to you. I know some parents use the

" NoFenol " enzymes from Houston Nutraceuticals, which seems to help some.

We also know that some kids have difficulty tolerating probiotics. Not sure

exactly why this is. It could be due to various factors.... could even be

related to the effect probiotics have on calcium oxalate crystals in the body.

It seems that probiotics tend to cause those crystals to dissolve.... which is a

GOOD thing, BUT it leaves you with two things, if the theory behind

Tamaro's research holds true... you have oxalic acid waste which gets dumped

into the gut to be disposed of, and is very irritating, AND it frees up calcium

to float around unmanaged in the body and brain. This can be irritating to the

neuro system. So, to be very brief (it's a complicated and basically non-SCD

issue) you can counter that with adequate magnesium (not the citrate form, I

found out!!).... but you also MUST have adequate vitamins A, D and K on board to

help the body put that freed calcium where it belongs, in the bones and teeth.

That's all I'm going to say about the topic, but

you can learn a lot more from over at her Vitamin K list:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/VitaminK/

(Be sure to read her " files " section for the basic research paper and the

protocol.)

<<G has woken up the last 3

nights around 11:00pm and been crying. Since he has limited

language skills we can never figure out why. He is moving his legs

alot and will grab at them, so we are assuming it's leg cramps.

Last week during the day, he complained of a leg hurting and

needing " med-cin " . Could leg aches be a sign of something.>>

Magnesium might help a LOT.... but I'm honestly don't know what would cause

the leg cramps. Do you have him on magnesium already? What about CLO (still

thinking about the vitamin A & D)? What other supplements?

YES.... the bit of sugar in the Motrin can really mess things up at this

point, so don't give that again. If you have to give Motrin, use the adult

tablets (you might have to get it compounded if the dosage isn't right.... these

tablets are hard to split in half).... and grind them up and mix in applesauce

or something. There would still be a trace of starch filler in that, but way

better than giving the sugar. Ideally, you would not use this for very long, or

very often... but if he's in pain, you have to do something, I know. Motrin

(ibuprofen) is really hard on the gut, by the way. There is just no good options

for pain relievers... they're all bad in some way, darn it.

Are you giving him epsom salts baths? This is a great way to get magnesium in

through the skin..... helps ease die-off symptoms and is calming.

Patti