RE: 21 Months Post Op Duodenal Switch

[Guest guest]

<< You cannot have this with RnY>>

, my dear, you are FOS. And you just keep going the way you are, and eat

your way right back up to 555. You will, if you don't change your habits,

which it appears that you have not now. There is NO perfect surgery. I am

nearly 22 years post op. I do fine. But I did it because I use ALL of my

tools, not just the surgery. I'm glad that you have found " perfection. "

Write to me again in 10 years. At that time, I will be out 32 years, and

still 150. You won't be.

Jac

Friends are angels who lift you up, when your wings have forgotten how to

fly.

http://www.pictureitdigitaldesigns.com/

http://members.cox.net/XXXFARMPAINTS

mail to: jholdaway@...

21 Months Post Op Duodenal Switch

I joined this group pre-op but have waited nearly 2 years to voice my

opinion on this procedure. I have no interest in the politics of the

weight loss debate, and I have absolutely nothing to lose or gain by

supporting either side. I only wish to relate my personal experience

so others can judge which direction to take. I underwent open

Duodenal Switch surgery in Delano California on March 29th, 2002

weighing 555 lbs.

First of all, understand that I have broken nearly all the rules.

(this is not a recommendation, it's my own personal failing) I ate

too much too fast, I didn't exercize, and I almost never take my

vitamin pills. I try, but basically ignore most dietary restrictions

and had half a chicken whopper on the way home from the hospital 10

days after surgery. The claims that you can eat whatever you want

with DS were confirmed, and I eat anything and everything. My

stomach has returned to its pre-op size and is functioning Perfectly.

The result is I've lost 230 lbs to date, am continuing to lose about

1/2 lb. every week, and all my health problems are gone. I've had no

complications even with my huge starting weight. My cholesterol is

118 (a positive effect not often discussed) even though I eat pizza

and fast food on a daily basis, and I feel great with lots of

energy. My 1.5 year blood tests were all great even with the poor

vitamin adherence. Side effects: I've probably vomited 5 times in

21 months, I have frequent loose stools, and my heartburn has

returned (although less severe then before)

Conclusion: DS is the gold standard in weight loss surgery. There

is currently no substitute and that includes RnY. I have one close

friend and several associates who have undergone RnY and the severe

diet restrictions are/will affect their lives forever. They are all

at risk of regaining the weight if their eating habits change, and

frankly they worry all the time.

I am not impressed by the claims that DS is more dangerous than the

other options. My belief is that the choice of doctor is far more

important than the type of surgery when discussing complications and

deaths, and when statistics were presented, I found that these rates

were often based on 1 or 2 individual cases out of hundreds.

I will advocate DS over RnY and Lap to anyone. I have no

reservations. If you're going to roll the dice, you might as well be

betting on a normal post-op life with all the pleasures of eating,

and without the worries of weight regain and a non-functional

stomach. You cannot have this with RnY. Email me if you have

further questions.

Homepage: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Graduate-OSSG

Unsubscribe: mailto:Graduate-OSSG-unsubscribe

[Guest guest]

Thank you for sharing your opinion. I'm sure everyone else has one too.

I'm not going to waste my time correcting your erroneous statements regarding

the RNY. I'm sure you had your reasons for putting down a procedure you

didn't have, however I dont much care what they are. I will support whatever

anyone chooses as a weight loss tool, the important thing is that they choose

something.

Judy

Lap Proximal RNY 7/23/02

Drs. & Rabkin/SF

54/5'3 " - 257/140

size 22/XXL - 6/S

bmi 46/24

-66 inches

[Guest guest]

> However, I can out eat the sucker in a week if I put my mind to it.

OR should I say, take my mind AWAY from the task at hand? I can never

pretend I am normal. I'm not. Never was, never will be.

>

** isnt' one of the main reasons we have surgery to get our health back? yes

we love those scales when the numbers are low but the vast majority of us go

into surgery because of our comorbid conditions and we want our health back.

eating fast food daily, eating normal amounts like before will not give us

our health for long. I'm afraid we are deluding yourselves while on a

honeymoon if we think we can eat anything, any time, any amount just because

we had a DS over an RNY.

sue

[Guest guest]

Conclusion: DS is the gold standard in weight loss surgery. There

is currently no substitute and that includes RnY. I have one close

friend and several associates who have undergone RnY and the severe

diet restrictions are/will affect their lives forever. They are all

at risk of regaining the weight if their eating habits change, and

frankly they worry all the time.

- let us all know how you're doing at 5 years + out... I'll be curious.

Glad it's going great now - but you may find (and I said MAY) that you are

not " invincible " either.

B

Distal RNY 12/27/95

275/138 5'8 "

21 Months Post Op Duodenal Switch

I joined this group pre-op but have waited nearly 2 years to voice my

opinion on this procedure. I have no interest in the politics of the

weight loss debate, and I have absolutely nothing to lose or gain by

supporting either side. I only wish to relate my personal experience

so others can judge which direction to take. I underwent open

Duodenal Switch surgery in Delano California on March 29th, 2002

weighing 555 lbs.

First of all, understand that I have broken nearly all the rules.

(this is not a recommendation, it's my own personal failing) I ate

too much too fast, I didn't exercize, and I almost never take my

vitamin pills. I try, but basically ignore most dietary restrictions

and had half a chicken whopper on the way home from the hospital 10

days after surgery. The claims that you can eat whatever you want

with DS were confirmed, and I eat anything and everything. My

stomach has returned to its pre-op size and is functioning Perfectly.

The result is I've lost 230 lbs to date, am continuing to lose about

1/2 lb. every week, and all my health problems are gone. I've had no

complications even with my huge starting weight. My cholesterol is

118 (a positive effect not often discussed) even though I eat pizza

and fast food on a daily basis, and I feel great with lots of

energy. My 1.5 year blood tests were all great even with the poor

vitamin adherence. Side effects: I've probably vomited 5 times in

21 months, I have frequent loose stools, and my heartburn has

returned (although less severe then before)

Conclusion: DS is the gold standard in weight loss surgery. There

is currently no substitute and that includes RnY. I have one close

friend and several associates who have undergone RnY and the severe

diet restrictions are/will affect their lives forever. They are all

at risk of regaining the weight if their eating habits change, and

frankly they worry all the time.

I am not impressed by the claims that DS is more dangerous than the

other options. My belief is that the choice of doctor is far more

important than the type of surgery when discussing complications and

deaths, and when statistics were presented, I found that these rates

were often based on 1 or 2 individual cases out of hundreds.

I will advocate DS over RnY and Lap to anyone. I have no

reservations. If you're going to roll the dice, you might as well be

betting on a normal post-op life with all the pleasures of eating,

and without the worries of weight regain and a non-functional

stomach. You cannot have this with RnY. Email me if you have

further questions.

Homepage: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Graduate-OSSG

Unsubscribe: mailto:Graduate-OSSG-unsubscribe

[Guest guest]

,

I think it is helpful that you put an additional surgery in the

spotlight on our list. There are several different procedures currently

available

to us, and it is important for people to be aware of each one, including the

pros and cons, before making their decisions.

It is interesting that discussion of the various procedures prompts us

to fall into " camps " -- typically those who are experiencing success with the

procedure they had will be in favor of it, while those who have either

disappointing results or problems will be inclined to favor a procedure other

than

the one they had. It seems interesting, also, that many times we try to

promote " our " procedure as being superior in some way -- which, in fact, all of

the

procedures have SOME element of them that, based on that factor alone, would

make it superior to the others.

I had the vertical banded gastroplasty in May 2000. While I initially

spent a great deal of time on the ObesityHelp.com website, I eventually had

to leave it because I couldn't handle being told over and over and over again

that I had a surgery that was far inferior to the " gold standard, " RNY. I AM

aware of the large number of people who do not lose well or maintain their

weight loss with the VBG -- however, that has not been my personal experience.

Even though it has not been my experience, I would caution others about the

relative " risks " of this procedure choice. But, I also caution about the

downside

to the other procedures as well -- because each have their downside.

From my readings, it does appear that the BPD/DS has very good

statistical results regarding total weight loss and maintenance -- especially

for the

super morbidly obese individual. It does, however, have many of the same

nutritional concerns of the distal RNY procedure -- primarily protein

malnutrition and calcium deficiency.

It concerns me that you are disregarding (for whatever reason) -- what

I'm sure was your surgeon's advice -- your need to provide appropriate

vitamin and nutrient supplementation. As you have been lurking on this list for

quite some time, I'm sure that you have seen messages from many people with

malabsorptive procedures (mainly RNY) that were rolling along merrily for

anywhere

between one and three years before they had a nutritional crash. You have a

great deal of malabsorption with your procedure; and given that your diet is,

self admittedly, lacking in " good " nutrition, it would seem likely that your

body will deplete its nutritional stores at some point in the future. You did

mention that your labwork from 18 months post op still showed good results -- I

hope that you will be diligent about continuing to monitor your labs and look

for any trends that might indicate an approaching decline.

You mentioned that you started at 555 pounds and have lost 230 pounds.

This is tremendous accomplishment. Not knowing your height, it is not

possible to be certain, but I wonder if you are not still, however, considered

to

be morbidly obese by BMI standards at your current weight of 325 pounds? My

question here is whether or not you are hampering your ability to lose your

remaining weight by eating as you are currently. You do mention that you are

still losing approximately 1/2 pound per week. At that rate, you will be losing

around 25 pounds in the coming year (I don't mean to insult you by doing the

math that I am certain you have already done). While it is much better to lose

25 pounds than to gain it (of course!), does it get you to where you want to

be? Also, as you probably know, the more weight you lose, the slower your

weight loss will become due the reduced caloric needs of your smaller body. A

body that can lose weight when it is at 300 pounds is likely to stop losing

weight when it gets to 275 if a further reduction of calories does not occur.

Of course, the loss of additional weight at is secondary to issues of

retaining health and maintaining the loss already achieved.

I imagine that your aim was to highlight the effectiveness of the

BPD/DS surgery rather than to have people analyze your personal situation --

however, you did use yourself as an example, thereby opening this up.

While the BPD/DS does seem to have excellent statistics with regard to

maintenance of weight loss, I do know that we have at least one person on

this list who had the procedure and DID regain a substantial amount of weight.

When she attempted to warn others on the DS lists about this, she was summarily

dismissed and basically forced to leave those lists. People did not want to

hear the negatives.

I must admit with all of this discussion I do find it refreshing to

see those with RNY on the defensive instead of the offensive in terms of

promotion of procedure type -- hopefully they may understand how I might feel

about

my own " inferior " procedure selection.

Beth

Houston, TX

VBG - Dr. Srungaram

05/31/00 - 314 lbs.

11/01/02 - Abdominoplasty

11/29/02 - 160 lbs.

5'10 "

[Guest guest]

Each of us has picked a surgery based on our own needs. I know that no

one can convince me that the SRVG was wrong for me any more then I can

convince you the the DS was wrong for you. I am glad you are having such

success with your surgery. I am glad that you have a better quality of

life. But to assume that my success or quality of life is bad based on

the surgery I had is just flat out wrong. My quality of life is 100%

better then it was 2.5 years ago. My success has been slow but I am

successful in every way that counts to me. I wish you continued success

and hope that the surgery continues to work for you. Please let us know.

Lori Owen - Denton, Texas

SRVG 7/16/01

Dr. Ritter/Dr. Bryce

479/356/hoping for close to 200

On Sun, 18 Jan 2004 03:00:22 -0000 " " writes:

> I joined this group pre-op but have waited nearly 2 years to voice my

>

> opinion on this procedure. I have no interest in the politics of

> the

> weight loss debate, and I have absolutely nothing to lose or gain by

>

> supporting either side. I only wish to relate my personal

> experience

> so others can judge which direction to take. I underwent open

> Duodenal Switch surgery in Delano California on March 29th, 2002

> weighing 555 lbs.

>

> First of all, understand that I have broken nearly all the rules.

> (this is not a recommendation, it's my own personal failing) I ate

> too much too fast, I didn't exercize, and I almost never take my

> vitamin pills. I try, but basically ignore most dietary

> restrictions

> and had half a chicken whopper on the way home from the hospital 10

>

> days after surgery. The claims that you can eat whatever you want

> with DS were confirmed, and I eat anything and everything. My

> stomach has returned to its pre-op size and is functioning

> Perfectly.

>

> The result is I've lost 230 lbs to date, am continuing to lose about

>

> 1/2 lb. every week, and all my health problems are gone. I've had

> no

> complications even with my huge starting weight. My cholesterol is

>

> 118 (a positive effect not often discussed) even though I eat pizza

>

> and fast food on a daily basis, and I feel great with lots of

> energy. My 1.5 year blood tests were all great even with the poor

> vitamin adherence. Side effects: I've probably vomited 5 times in

>

> 21 months, I have frequent loose stools, and my heartburn has

> returned (although less severe then before)

>

> Conclusion: DS is the gold standard in weight loss surgery. There

>

> is currently no substitute and that includes RnY. I have one close

>

> friend and several associates who have undergone RnY and the severe

>

> diet restrictions are/will affect their lives forever. They are all

>

> at risk of regaining the weight if their eating habits change, and

> frankly they worry all the time.

>

> I am not impressed by the claims that DS is more dangerous than the

>

> other options. My belief is that the choice of doctor is far more

> important than the type of surgery when discussing complications and

>

> deaths, and when statistics were presented, I found that these rates

>

> were often based on 1 or 2 individual cases out of hundreds.

>

> I will advocate DS over RnY and Lap to anyone. I have no

> reservations. If you're going to roll the dice, you might as well

> be

> betting on a normal post-op life with all the pleasures of eating,

> and without the worries of weight regain and a non-functional

> stomach. You cannot have this with RnY. Email me if you have

> further questions.

>

>

> Homepage: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Graduate-OSSG

>

> Unsubscribe: mailto:Graduate-OSSG-unsubscribe

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Severe diet restrictions? What severe diet restrictions? I am 4.5 years

post-op and my only restriction is the amount of food I eat and that is

a good thing - now, instead of eating like a 7'5 " , 400 # defensive

tackle, I eat like a 150# female who is eating healthy things and

occasionally eats a bit of candy or cake. Just wish I was the 150#s!!

Amber/FLRN

21 Months Post Op Duodenal Switch

I joined this group pre-op but have waited nearly 2 years to voice my

opinion on this procedure. I have no interest in the politics of the

weight loss debate, and I have absolutely nothing to lose or gain by

supporting either side. I only wish to relate my personal experience so

others can judge which direction to take. I underwent open Duodenal

Switch surgery in Delano California on March 29th, 2002 weighing 555

lbs.

First of all, understand that I have broken nearly all the rules. (this

is not a recommendation, it's my own personal failing) I ate too much

too fast, I didn't exercize, and I almost never take my vitamin pills.

I try, but basically ignore most dietary restrictions and had half a

chicken whopper on the way home from the hospital 10 days after surgery.

The claims that you can eat whatever you want with DS were confirmed,

and I eat anything and everything. My stomach has returned to its

pre-op size and is functioning Perfectly.

The result is I've lost 230 lbs to date, am continuing to lose about 1/2

lb. every week, and all my health problems are gone. I've had no

complications even with my huge starting weight. My cholesterol is 118

(a positive effect not often discussed) even though I eat pizza and fast

food on a daily basis, and I feel great with lots of energy. My 1.5

year blood tests were all great even with the poor vitamin adherence.

Side effects: I've probably vomited 5 times in 21 months, I have

frequent loose stools, and my heartburn has returned (although less

severe then before)

Conclusion: DS is the gold standard in weight loss surgery. There is

currently no substitute and that includes RnY. I have one close friend

and several associates who have undergone RnY and the severe diet

restrictions are/will affect their lives forever. They are all at risk

of regaining the weight if their eating habits change, and frankly they

worry all the time.

I am not impressed by the claims that DS is more dangerous than the

other options. My belief is that the choice of doctor is far more

important than the type of surgery when discussing complications and

deaths, and when statistics were presented, I found that these rates

were often based on 1 or 2 individual cases out of hundreds.

I will advocate DS over RnY and Lap to anyone. I have no reservations.

If you're going to roll the dice, you might as well be betting on a

normal post-op life with all the pleasures of eating, and without the

worries of weight regain and a non-functional stomach. You cannot have

this with RnY. Email me if you have further questions.

Homepage: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Graduate-OSSG

Unsubscribe: mailto:Graduate-OSSG-unsubscribe

[Guest guest]

Severe diet restrictions? What severe diet restrictions? I am 4.5 years

post-op and my only restriction is the amount of food I eat and that is

a good thing - now, instead of eating like a 7'5 " , 400 # defensive

tackle, I eat like a 150# female who is eating healthy things and

occasionally eats a bit of candy or cake. Just wish I was the 150#s!!

Amber/FLRN

21 Months Post Op Duodenal Switch

I joined this group pre-op but have waited nearly 2 years to voice my

opinion on this procedure. I have no interest in the politics of the

weight loss debate, and I have absolutely nothing to lose or gain by

supporting either side. I only wish to relate my personal experience so

others can judge which direction to take. I underwent open Duodenal

Switch surgery in Delano California on March 29th, 2002 weighing 555

lbs.

First of all, understand that I have broken nearly all the rules. (this

is not a recommendation, it's my own personal failing) I ate too much

too fast, I didn't exercize, and I almost never take my vitamin pills.

I try, but basically ignore most dietary restrictions and had half a

chicken whopper on the way home from the hospital 10 days after surgery.

The claims that you can eat whatever you want with DS were confirmed,

and I eat anything and everything. My stomach has returned to its

pre-op size and is functioning Perfectly.

The result is I've lost 230 lbs to date, am continuing to lose about 1/2

lb. every week, and all my health problems are gone. I've had no

complications even with my huge starting weight. My cholesterol is 118

(a positive effect not often discussed) even though I eat pizza and fast

food on a daily basis, and I feel great with lots of energy. My 1.5

year blood tests were all great even with the poor vitamin adherence.

Side effects: I've probably vomited 5 times in 21 months, I have

frequent loose stools, and my heartburn has returned (although less

severe then before)

Conclusion: DS is the gold standard in weight loss surgery. There is

currently no substitute and that includes RnY. I have one close friend

and several associates who have undergone RnY and the severe diet

restrictions are/will affect their lives forever. They are all at risk

of regaining the weight if their eating habits change, and frankly they

worry all the time.

I am not impressed by the claims that DS is more dangerous than the

other options. My belief is that the choice of doctor is far more

important than the type of surgery when discussing complications and

deaths, and when statistics were presented, I found that these rates

were often based on 1 or 2 individual cases out of hundreds.

I will advocate DS over RnY and Lap to anyone. I have no reservations.

If you're going to roll the dice, you might as well be betting on a

normal post-op life with all the pleasures of eating, and without the

worries of weight regain and a non-functional stomach. You cannot have

this with RnY. Email me if you have further questions.

Homepage: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Graduate-OSSG

Unsubscribe: mailto:Graduate-OSSG-unsubscribe

[Guest guest]

Thanks Beth, for putting a more neutral energy on DS. It is a shame we

have to take sides on this. I have done a tremendous amount of research in

the last few months. I have talked to surgeons, read information booklets,

talked to people who have had the DS, and have read all the information I

could find on the internet.

My conclusion is similar to what you found as far as weight loss, especially

for super obese people. I have spoken to many people in my area who have

had the surgery (mostly with Dr. Baltazar in Spain.)

There was one man in particular who had diabetes before the surgery, and not

only got rid of it, but eating sugar no longer effects his blood sugar.

When I talked to him, he was only 3 months out and had already lost well

over 100 lbs, without changing his eating habits except to eat less, due to

the redesigned stomach. He did say that he was an exception, and most

people don't loose as much that fast. At this point his labs are fine. I

am very interesed to see how he does long-term.

There was one woman in the group who ate a large Hersey bar almost every

day. She has maintained her weight loss (she is almost skinny) for three

years.

There are mixed reviews on the nutrition angle. Some people absorb B12 and

iron just fine. (they still have the part of the stomach with the

instrinsic factor.) They do supplement with A, D, E and K. Other people

have the same sort of malabsorption issues as the RNY.

I think that DS is probably similar to RNY in that there are many different

versions of the surgery. Also, everyone's experience after surgery is

different. As far as I could tell, there have been no studies done that are

longer than five years on long-term weight loss and nutrition. This is

partly because it has not been done in this country for very long. But, so

far with studies done between 3 and 5 years, it looks good on all counts.

Most surgeons do follow up with labs and adjust supplements accordingly.

Some people need protein supplements, some people don't. Just as with RNY,

there are some patients who ignore the surgeon's advice and get very ill.

I really think it is okay that different kinds of surgery work. Most of us

researched different weight loss options before we choose our surgery. Our

decisions were based on the information available at the time. For some of

us, it didn't turn out like we had hoped. I will be watching for long terms

results of DS. I am hoping that it is also successful. The more different

kinds of surgeries available the more choices weight loss surgery candidates

will have.

By the way, I am very happy with my surgery. I had a very distal RNY, which

eventually needed a revision. I have no regrets. I have a lifestyle now

that I could never have imagined. However, if everything they say about the

DS were true and it was available 10 years ago I may have chosen that over

RNY.

Barbara Jean

Re: 21 Months Post Op Duodenal Switch

> From my readings, it does appear that the BPD/DS has very good

> statistical results regarding total weight loss and maintenance --

especially for the

> super morbidly obese individual. It does, however, have many of the same

> nutritional concerns of the distal RNY procedure -- primarily protein

> malnutrition and calcium deficiency.

>

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 01/19/2004 1:01:32 AM Eastern Standard Time,

bjeangrove11@... writes:

> I think that DS is probably similar to RNY in that there are many different

> versions of the surgery

This is like saying apples and oranges are similar because they are both

versions of fruit. The DS and RNY are both weight loss surgeries, but the

actual

procedures are very different. Although why we'd want to debate them on

this list is beyond me, since we're all supposed to be way past the point where

what we had is rather irrelevant, no?

Judy

Lap Proximal RNY 7/23/02

Drs. & Rabkin/SF

54/5'3 " - 257/140

size 22/XXL - 6/S

bmi 46/24

-66 inches

[Guest guest]

One issue that many people face when picking a WLS procedure is the

insurance company. Many companies will NOT pay for the DS nor the LapBand.

Perhaps this will change over time, but in the interim, many people find they

must

choose between the ones that their insurance provider will pay for. Of

course, if one is a self-pay candidate, they should consider ALL of the surgery

choices. I do believe, though, that DS is typically the most highly priced. Of

course, if you are already looking at 20,000 or more, what is another few

thousand, LOL!

Additionally, there are not very many surgeons who are performing the

BPD/DS. I live in Texas -- a very large and very populous state -- however

there is not even ONE surgeon in the state who does the procedure. Access to

this procedure is extremely limited for the majority of WLS patients.

Most of us desperately want a surgery that will effect our eating lives

the least. We want to left alone with our food. It is a sensual pleasure we

do not want taken from us. This is what makes the lure of the DS so strong.

I think, however, that people do need to look at the other factors out

there. There are really only three ways to lose weight:

Reduce the amount of food energy (calories) that go INTO the body

Increase the amount of food energy (calories) that are utilized by the

body

Reduce the amount of food energy (calories) that are utilized by the

body

Number One is a no brainer -- less in leads to weight loss. For some

people, though, this requires a HUGE decrease in calories ingested -- for

example, the people who gain weight on plain veggies.

Number Two is where exercise (UGH) comes in OR a change in the TYPE of

fuel that is ingested. It is my opinion that one reason that low carb diets

work for people is that it forces the body to work on a fuel source that is

less efficient for it -- it must work harder to extract the needed energy.

Number Three is the malabsorbtion component of the RNY and DS

surgeries. Less calories are pulled out of the food ingested. Some of this is

due to

lack of full digestion of the food -- so that some of it is unusable to the

body; some of it is because there are less available " receptors " (small

intestine) to absorb what comes through.

With the DS there is heavy reliance on Number Three -- malabsorbtion

of calories. While does an excellent job of reducing the amount of food energy

stored, requiring the body to pull from what it has previously stored --

there is NO WAY to get around the fact that things OTHER than calories move

through the body and not be absorbed. If the " calories " end up in the toilet,

then

so MUST the nutrients.

This is why supplementing is key for most people who have

malabsorptive procedures. They can only live for " so long " on the nutritional

storehouse.

RNY uses a combination of Numbers One and Three, with the distal RNY

placing even more emphasis on Number Three.

VBG and AGB rely solely on Number One.

Of course, with all of the procedures, we can help things out by adding

Number Two to the mix.

I think that there are two things out there that " bother " people about the

BPD/DS. One is " fear " of the extensive malabsorbtion. Concern that they will

eventually have serious health issues with it. The other " issue " in my

opinion, is a social biases against continuing to eat with " abandon " and still

lose

weight -- while it is our " dream " there is a substantial amount of " guilt " that

goes along with it -- the idea of being " gluttonous " but still being

" rewarded " with weight loss (or perhaps, not being " punished " with weight gain)

goes

against the mores that we have grown up with. The idea that acts should have

consequences -- that overeating is " punishable " with excess weight. The old

" There's no such thing as a free lunch! "

I think many people have " issues " with the BPD/DS on medical grounds -- but I

also think there are other societal issues in play.

Beth

Houston, TX

VBG - Dr. Srungaram

05/31/00 - 314 lbs.

11/01/02 - Abdominoplasty

11/29/02 - 160 lbs.

5'10 "

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 01/19/2004 12:17:00 PM Eastern Standard Time,

bjeangrove11@... writes:

> Also, I see nothing wrong with bringing up DS. It does not have to be a

> debate. Are we so closed minded we don't even want to hear about other WLS

> surgeries?

>

I didn't say we shouldn't talk about all of the surgeries, we all need long

term support. And saying which one you had is important because the long term

problems and solutions can be different for each type. I just didn't see the

point of debating which one is best on this list. I see enough of that on my

other lists

Judy

Lap Proximal RNY 7/23/02

Drs. & Rabkin/SF

54/5'3 " - 257/140

size 22/XXL - 6/S

bmi 46/24

-66 inches

[Guest guest]

I think what she's saying is that there are many versions of the RNY

that go under the title RNY, and probably many versions of DS that

go under the title of DS.

That said, I agree, it's sorta irrelevant NOW for us to debate them,

because we're all more than 12 months out, and the one thing that's

apparent to me is that success with any surgery, long-term, depends

on ourselves.

Pam in Niceville

Re: 21 Months Post Op Duodenal Switch

In a message dated 01/19/2004 1:01:32 AM Eastern Standard Time,

bjeangrove11@... writes:

> I think that DS is probably similar to RNY in that there are many

different

> versions of the surgery

This is like saying apples and oranges are similar because they are

both

versions of fruit. The DS and RNY are both weight loss surgeries,

but the actual

procedures are very different. Although why we'd want to debate

them on

this list is beyond me, since we're all supposed to be way past the

point where

what we had is rather irrelevant, no?

Judy

Lap Proximal RNY 7/23/02

Drs. & Rabkin/SF

54/5'3 " - 257/140

size 22/XXL - 6/S

bmi 46/24

-66 inches

[Guest guest]

I meant that the one thing that both surgeries have in common is that each

one has many different versions. eg DS has many versions and RNY has many

versions. I understand very thoroughly the difference between the two

surgeries. And yes, they are alike in that they are both weight loss

surgeries.

Also, I see nothing wrong with bringing up DS. It does not have to be a

debate. Are we so closed minded we don't even want to hear about other WLS

surgeries?

Re: 21 Months Post Op Duodenal Switch

> In a message dated 01/19/2004 1:01:32 AM Eastern Standard Time,

> bjeangrove11@... writes:

>

> > I think that DS is probably similar to RNY in that there are many

different

> > versions of the surgery

>

> This is like saying apples and oranges are similar because they are both

> versions of fruit. The DS and RNY are both weight loss surgeries, but

the actual

> procedures are very different. Although why we'd want to debate them on

> this list is beyond me, since we're all supposed to be way past the point

where

> what we had is rather irrelevant, no?

>

> Judy

> Lap Proximal RNY 7/23/02

> Drs. & Rabkin/SF

> 54/5'3 " - 257/140

> size 22/XXL - 6/S

> bmi 46/24

> -66 inches

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

It just seems to me that THANK goodness there are choices for WLS. Not all

surgeries work for ALL people....which is why MANY (not all) have revisions

to a different TYPE of surgery. But to come on a list and blast us saying

that the DS is the ONLY and the BEST WLS....well that is rude and

inconsiderate. Especially since, for the most part, we tend to be supportive

of each other regardless of their surgery. (Except for the occasional tiff

<grin>)

Debbie &

in Gig Harbor

(170cm medial)

ladybostons@...

http://www.cafeshops.com/copsstore

http://www.marykay.com/debbiemcneice

[Guest guest]

I've hesitated to reply to this thread, but now I will speak up. When

I went for my surgery, I really didn't have a preference on

any " type " of surgery, I just knew that my comorbs were very serious

and my weight was affecting my health tremendously. It was truly

a " do or risk dying young " kind of thing. I knew that the way I ate

needed to change. With any type of weight loss surgery I knew that I

would very likely lose the weight, thus improving my health. If

insurance would pay, the type of surgery did not matter to me because

it was amenas to an end to regain my health. That is what it was

about for me. I wanted my health back at all costs and the weight

loss was secondary to that.

I can see what the appeal of the DS would be for someone (ability to

continue eating what you want and perhaps in similiar amounts to pre

op days, while still losing weight). But *for me* I did not want to

continue to eat sugar and other stuff that was bad for me, I wanted

to be healthy above anything else and that meant a big overhaul on

the way I was eating. The RNY accomplished that for me and I have no

regrets.

There is nothing wrong with being pleased with your surgery, There IS

something wrong when you feel the need to not only advocate your OWN

surgery, but then to put down any other surgery that is not DS. Each

of us has individual needs and base our our choice of surgery on

that. For example, the LapBand is a fine surgery, but was ultimately

not for me in that I did need to have dumping as a sort of " damage

control " , and with my comorbs, did not have the time to wait for the

slower weight loss (my health was that bad). I know people with

LapBand and it is working out great for them and you know what? That

makes me very happy to see their successes. Ditto for any other type

of surgery, including your own beloved DS.

I think it says a lot about you that instead of being here to help

others and support them, that you have a need to establish

the " superiority " of your own particular surgery. What is *that*

about? Perhaps you might want to see a counselor or something to work

on any underlying issues you may have, including self sabotoge (as

that is what is happening with your lack of proper supplementation).

Best to you...

~Kricket

[Guest guest]

Well put.

The tone of his post reminds me a lot of the way people talk after

having undergone a religious conversion....you're so doggone happy, and

everything is wonderful and you can't understand why everybody doesn't

want to experience what you're experiencing.

So the joy starts to border on arrogance -- " what's the matter with

you people, anyway? " .

Ultimately, the morning comes and you smell the coffee and life -- REAL

life -- proceeds from there.

Which is when he's quite likely to find out there's literally no free

lunch.

/john

(rny 12-99)

> I've hesitated to reply to this thread, but now I will speak up. When

> I went for my surgery, I really didn't have a preference on

> any " type " of surgery, I just knew that my comorbs were very serious

> and my weight was affecting my health tremendously. It was truly

> a " do or risk dying young " kind of thing. I knew that the way I ate

> needed to change. With any type of weight loss surgery I knew that I

> would very likely lose the weight, thus improving my health. If

> insurance would pay, the type of surgery did not matter to me because

> it was amenas to an end to regain my health. That is what it was

> about for me. I wanted my health back at all costs and the weight

> loss was secondary to that.

>

> I can see what the appeal of the DS would be for someone (ability to

> continue eating what you want and perhaps in similiar amounts to pre

> op days, while still losing weight). But *for me* I did not want to

> continue to eat sugar and other stuff that was bad for me, I wanted

> to be healthy above anything else and that meant a big overhaul on

> the way I was eating. The RNY accomplished that for me and I have no

> regrets.

>

> There is nothing wrong with being pleased with your surgery, There IS

> something wrong when you feel the need to not only advocate your OWN

> surgery, but then to put down any other surgery that is not DS. Each

> of us has individual needs and base our our choice of surgery on

> that. For example, the LapBand is a fine surgery, but was ultimately

> not for me in that I did need to have dumping as a sort of " damage

> control " , and with my comorbs, did not have the time to wait for the

> slower weight loss (my health was that bad). I know people with

> LapBand and it is working out great for them and you know what? That

> makes me very happy to see their successes. Ditto for any other type

> of surgery, including your own beloved DS.

>

> I think it says a lot about you that instead of being here to help

> others and support them, that you have a need to establish

> the " superiority " of your own particular surgery. What is *that*

> about? Perhaps you might want to see a counselor or something to work

> on any underlying issues you may have, including self sabotoge (as

> that is what is happening with your lack of proper supplementation).

>

> Best to you...

>

> ~Kricket

>

>

> Homepage: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Graduate-OSSG

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