Re: chiari 1 and nvl

[Guest guest]

I have a question for the group.. Does anyone on this list have a chiari 1

malformation. I myself have chiari 1 (brain malformaiton) and am on the wacma

listserv.

Someone mentioned a connection between the mom having chiari 1 and the child

having a nonverbal learning disability. I had never heard of this correlation

before.

, have you heard of this connection? i did not see anything in the book

on this.

Thanks

Sharon Lang

[Guest guest]

> Someone mentioned a connection between the mom having chiari 1

and the child having a nonverbal learning disability. I had never

heard of this correlation before.

No have not heard that before -but it's good to put it out there and

see if anyone answers. Anyone else have chiari 1 and is the parent of a child

diagnosed with a nonverbal learning disability?

Then again NLD is not a speech/language delay or impairment...

(most are here for those reasons)

" There is an excellent vocabulary and more than typical verbal

expression, starting at a young age. "

http://www.nldontheweb.org/tanguay_3.htm

'What is NLD? Nonverbal learning disorders (NLD) is a neurological

syndrome consisting of specific assets and deficits. The assets

include early speech and vocabulary development, remarkable rote

memory skills, attention to detail, early reading skills development

and excellent spelling skills. In addition, these individuals have

the verbal ability to express themselves eloquently. Moreover,

persons with NLD have strong auditory retention. Four major

categories of deficits and dysfunction also present themselves:

•motoric (lack of coordination, severe balance problems, and

difficulties with graphomotor skills).

•visual-spatial-organizational (lack of image, poor visual recall,

faulty spatial perceptions, difficulties with executive function*

and problems with spatial relations).

•social (lack of ability to comprehend nonverbal communication,

difficulties adjusting to transitions and novel situations, and

deficits in social judgment and social interaction).

•sensory (sensitivity in any of the sensory modes: visual, auditory,

tactile, taste or olfactory)

http://www.nldline.com/

But nope they are different too -here's a website from a parent who

has one child with each diagnosis and she explains the difference

http://www.nldline.com/newpage27.htm

We do have some members who have a child with chiari 1 malformation.

Here's just a few of the archives -I tried to include the emails so

you can email them and see if anything runs in the family tree.

Hope this helps a bit:

~~~~~~~~~~~~

Hello to all,

We took JJ for his follow up yesterday. As of yet, the neurologist

cannot explain his regression in speech and development, he doesn't

want to blame it on the chiari.

He has referred us to the specialist at U of M that deals directly

with autism, he told us there is a high likelihood that JJ is mildly

autistic. I don't see it, especially since JJ tries to communicate

through signs, etc. And I would say for 2 weeks now he has had alot

to say (though he can't say it).

Surgery may be an option for us at this point, however, we have to

take JJ for his follow up MRI where they will check CSF flow and the

amount of the herniation in his brain. It's all hurry up and wait.

Your prayers are appreciated.

Re: [ ] New member

Hi Laurie,

Oh my! Your Mic sounds just like my son JJ. He has

speech of about eight words prior to his first

birthday and after that he quit talking except for

Dada. He also quit eating anything (especially table

food) for at least 3 months. His ped. told me not to

worry about, however, his dad and I put him on

Pediasure ourselves. He started eating some baby food

again, but he only has a diet now of cereal, bananas,

and chicken nuggets. Sometimes a cracker or two, or

maybe a piece of toast. But he puts everything in his

mouth whole and then moves it back and forth.

Sometimes he might swallow, others he just spits it

out. Most recently we had an EEG and and MRI and

found out that he has other issues besides his

apraxia. By the way, he has serious sensory

dysfunction problems also. Anyhow, to make a long

story short, he has a Chiari 1 brain malformation.

We're dealing with that.

On to your question about some oral motor activities.

Are you letting Mic use a toothbrush? JJ loves to

brush his teeth (he probably does it about 20 times a

day ;-)). We have been using ice to get him used to

us being in his mouth and suckers. This has helped

him some, because prior to his speech therapy he

couldn't tolerate anything cold.

He doesn't like people to touch his mouth too often or

his face for that matter, but we let him do most of

the work.

If you have any more questions please feel free to

contact me.

Kim,

Mom to Carissa age 9, normal as can be, and JJ 23

months, apraxic, sensory integration dysfunction and

most recently ACM1

propanegirl@...

Re: [ ] Re: Neuro-psychological assessments?

.........to add to 's point......BOTH of my boys were MIS

diagnosed as

Autism/PDD...BOTH were late talkers...NEITHER of them is autistic or

showed ANY

(IN MY OPINION) of autism in ANY WAY. It's a great " umbrella " to

use, because

it covers MANY things. Please don't be afraid to ask questions, and

find

another doctor if you're not comfortable with what's going on. When

I mentioned

apraxia to my pediatrician, and his response was " what's

that " ...let's just say

I knew I was on my own.

You are you child's LOUDEST VOICE....don't ever forget that.

~Karyn

[ ] Re: Neuro-psychological assessments?

Hi Kim,

I am not an expert on Arnold Chiari Malformation 1, however as a

parent who has been there twice -I do have some suggestions for you

to raise to your child's neurologist.

As far a surgery -typically I suggest second opinions, and after

speaking with MDs you respect finding out if it's possible to wait

out surgery to do it at a later age. (This is what we did for my son

Dakota who also had huge adenoids and tonsils which blocked his

hearing and was credited to his late speech as well. We were

advised this by friends who are MDs to " wait if possible until he is

three " for Dakota since it's hard to explain surgery to a two year

old. We were told by Dakota's doctors we could wait, and by the

time Dakota was three -the age we were told we could wait until -

Dakota no longer required the surgery and we were all thrilled.)

However since JJ is diagnosed with Arnold Chiari Malformation 1

(ACM) -it

appears from what I read

that surgery can prevent further paralysis and may be crucial. And

I even read it may reverse symptoms? So I wouldn't suggest in your

case holding off on surgery if it is needed and confirmed by a

second opinion (second opinions in my opinion are only from MDs who

are based out of an entirely different hospital systems from each

other)

Here are my concerns to raise based upon your posts here:

I'm sure paralysis may be a sign of ACM -but how does anyone know

that the " possible paralysis of the voice box " (Larynx ) that the

one MD suspects isn't from the ACM as you say is common -but instead

apraxia of the voice box (larynx)? The larynx is one of the areas

of speech typically affected by apraxia as you know. I'm saying

this especially since the neurologist diagnosed JJ as having

apraxia.

I received a call from the Reeve Foundation based upon a

post I sent here asking what is the difference between partial

paralysis

and severe apraxia since both are problems of the brain sending

signals to the muscles of the body where the signals sometimes go

through -and sometimes do not. I was asked to submit a paper at

that time -they were interested (and I am not a PhD!) I just did a

search and here is an article on this:

'PATTERNS OF LARYNGEAL APRAXIA IN TWO PATIENTS WITH BROCA'S APHASHIA'

http://www.phonetik.uni-muenchen.de/~hoole/pdf/laraos_fipkm.pdf

Is JJ responding to appropriate intensive therapies for apraxia?

Have you tried EFAs? If not, why not? Other than regression and

lack of speech -is JJ showing any signs at all of autism? If I read

correctly -solely based on JJ's lack of speech is autism being

suspected -is this true? Do you believe JJ is autistic, or has

autistic tendencies? Are you and JJ's MDs aware that if JJ is not

autistic -yet is given that diagnosis solely due to his lack of

speech he will almost definitely be given ABA therapy which is not

appropriate

for a

child (or anyone) who does not require ABA therapy (autistic,

behavioral problems)? ABA therapy does not provide enough speech or

occupational therapy for a child with a motor planning problem of

speech. Typically children with apraxia also have weakness of the

muscles somewhere in the body as well -does JJ have any hypotonia or

dysarthria? If so -he would need strengthening therapies as well as

motor planning therapies. ABA therapy again does not provide the

therapy that is needed to help JJ to speak if he is not autistic.

Again -my concern is why the jump to autism when there has only been

a 4 fold rise in autism in the last 10 years, while there has been a

30 fold rise in speech and language impairments in the same time

period according to Dr. Mark Geier's study of the US Department of

Education Statistics.

http://www.cherab.org/information/geiermd.html A name is not just a

name when it comes to late talkers/speech impaired -therapy is what

separates the conditions -and is most important in accurate

diagnosis.

http://www.cherab.org/information/adhd-speech.html

Conditions can overlap of course -you can have a child with CP and

apraxia, or autism and apraxia -or in your child's case Arnold

Chiari Malformation 1 and apraxia, etc. etc. Apraxia can also stand

alone. The average child who has apraxia has some amount of mild

hypotonia (even though for some such as Carolyn's or Suzanne's child

can be severe) -and also has some amount of sensory integration

dysfunction. With DSI however -I hate when people credit lack of

speech to DSI " processing issues " OT is critical for almost all

(all?) who have speech and language disorders -however DSI therapy -

which is primarily OT therapy is not going to solely treat an

apraxic child. Therapy again is the division.

If apraxia is diagnosed -and the child is nonverbal -in addition to

treating the Arnold Chiari Malformation 1 in whatever way needed -I

suggest you speak with your child's MD about aggressively treating

the apraxia and see what happens to JJ's speech. Has there been

improvements

already?

I know you have read messages from those with apraxic children who

were misdiagnosed as autistic and were given ABA therapy. Again -

ABA therapy is wonderful for a child with PDD or autism or

behavioral problems -it is not appropriate for a child with apraxia

or other speech and language disorders who require various types of

multisensory speech and occupational therapies, and as 19 year old

's mother Robin has so painfully reminded us more than once -

may be detrimental.

So when you go for JJ's long awaited neuropsychology exam to see if

he has autism -raise these questions about therapy. Perhaps before

the appointment -ask the neurologist if you can start JJ on EFAs if

you didn't start them already -results are typically in a day to

three weeks for most with speech and language delays from various

reasons ranging from PDD/autism and apraxia -to " just " late

talkers. Based on what you said -being that lack/regression of

speech is the only " sign " of autism -if JJ starts surging in speech

in the next day to three weeks -the MDs can cross autism off the

list of possible diagnosis.

Wow. No wonder the neurologist couldn't answer your question will

JJ ever talk -doesn't appear he's sure what is causing the lack of

speech to begin with. Do you have The Late Talker book?

http://www.speech-express.com/late.talker.html Why not ask him if he

wants to borrow your copy?

I'm sure that Dr. Agin will answer you soon. Of course even an MD

or any professional won't be able to know for sure unless they

themselves evaluated JJ and knew his history. Hope my suggestions

helped a bit.

My prayers are with you and JJ, and I'm sending you positive energy.

=====

[Guest guest]

Hi Sharon -

I do not have a Chiari Malformation but I do have Syringomyliea, which is often

associated with Chiari.

If you find any more information about this, can you please send it my way?

Thanks,

sbutler@...

Re: [ ] chiari 1 and nvl

I have a question for the group.. Does anyone on this list have a chiari 1

malformation. I myself have chiari 1 (brain malformaiton) and am on the wacma

listserv.

Someone mentioned a connection between the mom having chiari 1 and the child

having a nonverbal learning disability. I had never heard of this correlation

before.

, have you heard of this connection? i did not see anything in the book on

this.

Thanks

Sharon Lang

[Guest guest]

Sharon,

There is a woman by the name of Deantha who is on the dyspraxia families board

and is quite active on the dysgraphia board who has this diagnosis. She is very

positive that there is absolutely a coorelation between dyspraxia and Chiari 1

malformation. She indicated that while many get an MRI; it takes a trained eye

to detect it.

Janice

[sPAM]Re: [ ] chiari 1 and nvl

I have a question for the group.. Does anyone on this list have a chiari 1

malformation. I myself have chiari 1 (brain malformaiton) and am on the wacma

listserv.

Someone mentioned a connection between the mom having chiari 1 and the child

having a nonverbal learning disability. I had never heard of this correlation

before.

, have you heard of this connection? i did not see anything in the book on

this.

Thanks

Sharon Lang

[Guest guest]

Janice

Do you think Deantha would email me offlist.

thanks

sharon

Janice <jscott@...> wrote:

Sharon,

There is a woman by the name of Deantha who is on the dyspraxia families board

and is quite active on the dysgraphia board who has this diagnosis. She is very

positive that there is absolutely a coorelation between dyspraxia and Chiari 1

malformation. She indicated that while many get an MRI; it takes a trained eye

to detect it.

Janice

[sPAM]Re: [ ] chiari 1 and nvl

I have a question for the group.. Does anyone on this list have a chiari 1

malformation. I myself have chiari 1 (brain malformaiton) and am on the wacma

listserv.

Someone mentioned a connection between the mom having chiari 1 and the child

having a nonverbal learning disability. I had never heard of this correlation

before.

, have you heard of this connection? i did not see anything in the book on

this.

Thanks

Sharon Lang

[Guest guest]

Janice does she mean dyspraxia in the UK sense? (body) Perhaps that's it?

Then again only one parent there -and zero here (just checked). I'd

also check links between chiari and Asperger's Disorder since today

more probably get that diagnosis (one would think )

Here's the handful of parents I found who has a child diagnosed with

nonverbal learning disability. Also one page of resources and an

article written by a 13 year old with NLVD or NVD from the archives:

+ Trapped. Martha talks about Nonverbal Learning Disabilities,

and being trapped in a world which makes very little sense.

http://pbsmail.org/ct/97qHYS91SEes/trapped

Stories by Kids

Trapped!

By: Martha , Age 13, Dorset , Vermont

I am 13 years old and have a mild form of NLD. Until this year, I had

been dealing with it well. Yes it made some things like math hard,

but as for the other things, it didn't bother me at all.

But all of a sudden this year when I returned to my school, I

suddenly found out what my parents and teachers mean when they always

say I have trouble working out what people were really feeling, or as

they put it " correctly interpreting people's emotions. " The other

day, my favorite teacher, who is also my advisor, laughed at

something I told her. I freaked out and was in tears all day because

I thought she was laughing at me.

In fact, it wasn't at me at all. She was laughing at herself. It had

nothing to do with me at all. When my friends make eye contact with

me, I shy away and ask why they are glaring at me. I never make eye

contact with anyone because whatever I see in their face I will not

understand.

I feel as if I am trapped in a world that doesn't make sense, and in

a world where very few understand me. The only two people I can

really talk to are my teacher, , and my best friend Carol who

also has NLD. No one else understands! And I don't understand either!

ASPERGER's DISORDER AND NONVERBAL LEARNING DISABILITIES:

How are These Two Disorders Related to Each Other?

by Dinklage, PhD

" There is clearly a great deal of overlap between Asperger's Disorder

(AD) and Nonverbal Learning Disabilities (NVLD) "

http://www.nldontheweb.org/Dinklage_1.htm

Hello everyone,

Greetings from here in NH. I haven't been on in a while but thought I

would

pose a question and maybe get some discussion started. This group has

always been a fantastic help to me and I am sure there are some good

thoughts about this out there as well.

I am at a completely different stage/phase in life as most that write

in. My

son is 7yrs and nine months. he was diagnosed at nine months of age

with

" global developmental delays " and " low tone " and started occupational

therapy at that time. He has had that as well as physical therapy,

music

therapy and speech and language/oral motor therapy, etc. pretty

continuously

along the way until recently. He has also been in " classes "

or " groups "

along the way, sometimes positive sometimes not. At age four he was

" officially " " diagnosed " with sensory integration disorder (primarily

being

undersensitive, rather than overly) and at age five he

was " officially "

" diagnosed " with " global apraxia " . Although I feel the therapy has

helped

(depending on therapist of course) all along, it has not " cured " him.

Neither did the proefa seem to have any effect (two a day for three

months).

Neither did the brushing for six weeks seem to have any effect. This

past

fall a developmental pediatrician from an ivy league college medial

facility

diagnosed him also with " nonverbal learning disability " but says that

he is

one of the 4% of the kids she has diagnosed in her long career who

don't

" exactly fit the picture in that his apraxia is by far the most

prominent

problem " . He was in a mainstream first grade class up until a few

weeks ago

at which point my husband and I decided to homeschool him. He enjoyed

the

children and they really miss him and according to the teacher and

all the

support staff (special ed. therapists, director, etc.) he was " doing

fabulously " ....at grade level, no behavioral problems, etc. etc. He

was

pulled from class each week for two 1/2 hrs of speech and three 1/2

hrs of

individual OT and also for an adaptive, multi-age gym class. The

school day

is 8am to 3pm. To make a very long story short, the problem was when

he came

home. This child was EXHAUSTED. He was so tired I can't hardly

describe

it. But he would not go to sleep for a nap, wiggling all around for

an hour

in his bed (this was only suggestion from school early on and so for

two

weeks I faithfully put him down every afternoon after school). Crying,

whining, thirsty, hungry, thumbsucking, etc. until falling into bed

between

six pm and seven pm. But what bugged me the most is that he began to

" stare " into space, lift both hands(like enstein) and mumble to

himself, repeatedly, unless interupted. He scratched his crotch

repeatedly,

unaware of what he was doing. He would turn his head to one side and

back

repeatedly like a tic. He would blow on both hands one at a time

repeatedly. And he immediately, as soon as school started began

grinding

his teeth severely at night. I checked with numerous other first grade

parents and they all said their children were cranky and tired after

school

for the first few weeks. My son's tiredness and crankiness and bizarre

behaviours just got worse and worse through the fall. ALL of these

things

are gradually receding since we began homeschooling (but of course he

isn't

getting any therapy at all, which I feel badly about). Interestingly

he has

also reverted to taking a nap on many days between 1-3pm and going to

bed

around 8pm. My son also is having some difficulty learning to read. In

kindergarten the teacher said he was the top reader and doing

fantastic. In

first grade he was in the " average " group in spite of being a year

older

than most and having incredible amount of " enrichment " at home. All

school

personnel disagree with my assessment that he is having great

difficulty

with reading (he is extremely bright, knows quite a few 'sight' words

and

guesses a lot and reverses a lot) and claim they absolutely cannot

give him

any special help since he is " at grade level " . The school also claims

they

do not see any of the " tic-like " behaviors and reported that they

have no

more ideas on how to help me cope with them at home. Here are my

questions:

1. (maybe Drs. Agin/Laveman?) Has anyone followed the group known as

" children with apraxia " into school age? If so, what is the

correlation/co-morbidity between apraxia and nonverbal learning

disability?

2. I can understand that low tone and difficulty motor planning would

create

extreme fatigue and tiredness in someone expected to basically keep

up with

average peers in a busy environment. Is there any known treatment for

treating this??? Has carn-aware been proven effective?

3. According to the literature kids with nld are usually very good

readers

early on.....does anyone have any ideas/ or know of any effective

programs

to teach reading to a child with nld that is struggling with decoding

words?

4. Does ANYONE out there have a child with this description??

5. As parents which would you pick....the therapy or a decrease of the

bizarre behaviors (assuming of course that you couldn't pick both -

in our

state the school does not have to provide therapy by law if you choose

homeschooling)?

It has been hard to keep reading the list of messages lately because

nothing

has " resolved " my son's apraxia and I feel in some ways like I

am " starting

over " with this new diagnosis. I am trying to educate myself on that

and

trying to devote my time to figuring out ways to help him, rather than

responding to the new people who write in with the same questions I

had five

years ago (I am afraid I might put too negative a spin on things if I

respond!). My son is such a great kid, smily and happy, very bright

and

funny (now that he is out of school and anxiety is decreasing, I can

see

this side of him again) and so worth not 'losing'. Thanks for reading

all

the way through and thanks in advance for any thoughts, prayers,

advice,

knowledge you can pass my way....either back to the list or to me

privately.

Thanks again! And thanks again, , for creating this chat group

and to

for so faithfully researching new topics all the time (the dog

ones

were great!).

Carol (mom to two great boys)

Re:Autism miss-diagnosis?

Interesting that this post happened today.

I read this group since our youngest has apraxia/pdd-nos. Our middle

child

started with articulation issues (dealt with via early Childhood

Special

Education). Then his teacher suggested we have him tested via the

schoold

district for ASD. The district returned an educational dx (they

cannot provide a

medical dx) of Aspergers. We had him evaluated by a local Children's

Hospital

psychologist who just today told us that he is a quandry to her. He

has a few

markers that may indicate Aspergers, a few markers that indicate

anxiety and a

few markers that indicate a nonverbal learning disability. How is

that for

specificity?

In response to your question, I have a few reactions...

1. Yes, it is extremely frustrating. As the parent, my first reaction

is to

fall into the " find it so I can fix it " frame of mind. However I also

need to

remember that our son is a work in progress and I need to be open to

all the

opinions that are offered to me. I also need to remember that we, as

a culture,

know relatively very little about how the brain works and the reality

of our

world is that there probably is *no* easy fix for this stuff that

confronts our

kids. That totally sucks, but it is the truth.

2. Regardless of the name given to how he learns, my focus (in my

opinion)

needs to be on what happens to him on a daily basis: do the

therapies/interventions/modifications he encounters help him or

hinder him? I am

learning to ask the question, " what will that do to help him " when

someone

suggests we try something new. Concretely, with this new piece of

information

about nonverbal learning disability I plan on talking to his teacher

at school

this week before school starts (he is going into Kindergarten) to get

her

feedback on what resources he has avalible. Since he is identified as

ASD in his

IEP, what will be added or changed to accomodate this new

information? Even

though his educational dx is ASD and I have been told that isn't an

accurate dx,

the services he will receive under that dx won't hurt him, and are

reasonable

services for working with his probable nonverbal learning issues. As

has been

alluded to many times on this group--the issues we all are dealing

with have MANY commonalities-even if they are not all the same from a

label

point of view, so when we talk to each other, and share our

expreiences, we

better help our children

3. I need to be his advocate. There is no one else who has all the

pieces to

his puzzle except for me (and my big purple binder) so I need to let

the right

people know what they need to know to best help him. I am not his

therapist, nor

have I gone to school to be one. I am also not his doctor or his

teacher. I am

his mother and I have to both educate myself, but also rely on the

information

others give me to decide what is best for him--whether that be going

GCFC,

seeing a specialist, transitioning out of speech through the district

or

whatever.

I hope that this helps you. I am sorry that I can't give a clear cut

answer,

but alas, we are not dealing with clear cut problems. Feel free to

backchannel

me for specifics of this never ending journey.

Baumann

Kate,

It has been a few years since my son was 2.5 years old, he's now 10,

but I can recall the frustration and anger in him. During Early

Intervention the special ed teacher designed magnets with clip art on

it. We had well over 100 categories by the time we were done, but it

seemed to alleviate his frustration level. Another issue we faced

were his sensory overload. He had vestibular dysfunction and the OT

plus home exercises built up his vestibular. Another area was the

hypersensitivities in his hearing. AIT and Tomatis improved that,

plus supplementing with Coromega (omegas 3) and Vitamin E brought him

out of the " fog " .

There was so much trouble inside his body that I needed to clear up

before the therapy actually began to work. Seeing a vision therapist

cleared up his binocular dysfunction, OT worked on his vestibular and

dysgraphia, ST worked on his verbal apraxia and central auditory

processing, and VT built up his cognitive training.

I " m happy to report at 10 years old he has been in a regular classroom

with supplemental help and private therapy since Kindergarten. No one

but his Child Study Team knows he has any issues. His teachers have

always been surprised when they are asked to attend his IEP meetings

because they dont see his nonverbal learning disability.

all the best,

Joanne

have you read The Out of Sync Child, or the LP Solution by Dr. Stordy.

they can be found at your local library.

,

I can't thank you enough for taking the time to write your story for

us to hear.

I am the mother of an eight year old boy with global apraxia and a

learning

disability called nonverbal learning disability (but he doesn't fit

that

diagnosis exactly either). He also has low tone and has a higher

tolerance for

pain than normal. He has also had hearing problems in his left ear

and on and

off problems with allergies. You will probably be so surprised at how

many

questions all these moms have for you! I have some too and thank

you again

for going to the effort to share with us and also for being honest

with us. I

also feel like crying when I hear what you have been through and

admire you

greatly for doing the work you are doing....my husband does the same

work!

Anyway, here are my questions:

1.) Same as 's mom....I know you mentioned you withdrew and

blocked the

world out and went into your own world in order to survive. I am

curious about

how that looked to other people? Did they see you have any nervous

habits? did

they try to stop you from acting a certain way? Were there times that

you could

know you couldn't " do what others were asking you to do " as well as

you could at

other times? Like for example....were there some days you know or

knew you

would not sound as clear as others? Or not be able to run/ sit up at

your desk

as well as other times?

2.) Did you ever learn to ride a bike?

3.) If you had a child in school today faced with the same issues,

what would

you do for that child? How can the mother or father help?

You are admired by me and many others and how glad we are you never

gave up!

Carol

p.s. have you read the book called Dyslexia, My Life. His experience

reminds

me quite a bit of yours.

[Guest guest]

http://www.chiarione.org/symptoms.html

[Guest guest]

Bradovich, who used to be on this board, ha a mom with Chiari

and a PDD Nos daughter with apraxia. So, in that case it was a

grandma.

>

> I have a question for the group.. Does anyone on this list have a

chiari 1 malformation. I myself have chiari 1 (brain malformaiton)

and am on the wacma listserv.

>

> Someone mentioned a connection between the mom having chiari 1

and the child having a nonverbal learning disability. I had never

heard of this correlation before.

>

> , have you heard of this connection? i did not see anything

in the book on this.

>

>

> Thanks

>

>

> Sharon Lang

>