RE: Help! Fish Oil and Increase Echolalia

[Guest guest]

Hi ,

I could be wrong on all of this, but this is what I remember being told during

my teaching days (and I taught reg. ed. not special ed).....echolalia is a

normal part of language development for most children. They tend to repeat

phrases back to you. There's two types: delayed and immediate. Delayed

echolalia is when the child repeats phrases, such as from TV, long after the

statement was originally uttered. Immediate echolalia is when the child repeats

words or phrases immediately after someone else has spoken them. Anyway, some

amount of echolalia seems to be within typical realms. Given that your son is

experimenting with volume also seems to indicate echolalia - there's probably a

connection. Children with autism who use echolalia (I was told) seem to be

stuck in a lang. development phase, and thereapists typically try to expand on

their echolalia to dev. appropriate or more meaningful speech. I certainly am

no expert on echolalia, but I'm wondering if your son is entering a different

phase of speech development at this time due to the fish oil. I know when I

gave my son fish oil, I saw lots of different behaviors, and it took a good

three weeks for them to calm down. It was as if the synapses in his brain were

being connected. Just a thought. From what I remember with a diagnosis of

autism, echolalia was not necessarily seen as a bad trait, it indicated that the

child was attempting to communicate, etc.....

My son also seems to repeat a lot of words and phrases, and he's 3. I remember

when my brother was young, he was the same way, it's just that he did not have

apraxia, and went through this phase much, much earlier.....around 15 months or

so.

@...: renee_schwartz_1976@...:

Sat, 19 Apr 2008 14:20:15 +0000Subject: [ ] Help! Fish Oil and

Increase Echolalia

Hi. About two weeks ago I started my 3yr old son (who has dyspraxia, sensory

integration disorder, low muscle tone) on Efalax fish oil. We haven't noticed

major changes as he was already using 1-4 word phrases in speech. What we

noticed was an increase in volume of speech but also an increase in the

repetition of our speech. He has always had some repeptition of our speech and

we thought part of it was learning the language and part of it could be

echolalic but ever since we gave him the fish oil we noticed an increase in the

echolalic speech. Has this happened to anyone else? I tell him to stop repeating

and try to answer the question with a yes or no and he'll eventually answer me

if I'm asking him a ? but it's too coincidental that the increase occurred with

the fish oil. I was thinking of swithching to ProEfa but I'm not sure why the

oil would trigger this reaction. Any advice would be appreciated. Also does

anyone else whose child only has a dx of dyspraxia notice that their child

repeats things? At the moment, our developmental pediatrician does not think our

son is autistic b/c he's engaged, has great eye contact, wants to be around

people, etc. but do dyspraxic/SI kids repeat or have echolalia at times? Again,

it's not all the time but just recently there's been an increase. Also, if

anyone has advice on how to minimize the repetition we would appreciate it.

Thanks

_________________________________________________________________

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resh_messenger_video_042008

[Guest guest]

My typical kid had no echolicia and then got it, after MMR. Took a

while to get her out of it.

>

>

> Hi ,

>

> I could be wrong on all of this, but this is what I remember being

told during my teaching days (and I taught reg. ed. not special

ed).....echolalia is a normal part of language development for most

children. They tend to repeat phrases back to you. There's two

types: delayed and immediate. Delayed echolalia is when the child

repeats phrases, such as from TV, long after the statement was

originally uttered. Immediate echolalia is when the child repeats

words or phrases immediately after someone else has spoken them.

Anyway, some amount of echolalia seems to be within typical realms.

Given that your son is experimenting with volume also seems to

indicate echolalia - there's probably a connection. Children with

autism who use echolalia (I was told) seem to be stuck in a lang.

development phase, and thereapists typically try to expand on their

echolalia to dev. appropriate or more meaningful speech. I certainly

am no expert on echolalia, but I'm wondering if your son is entering

a different phase of speech development at this time due to the fish

oil. I know when I gave my son fish oil, I saw lots of different

behaviors, and it took a good three weeks for them to calm down. It

was as if the synapses in his brain were being connected. Just a

thought. From what I remember with a diagnosis of autism, echolalia

was not necessarily seen as a bad trait, it indicated that the child

was attempting to communicate, etc.....

>

> My son also seems to repeat a lot of words and phrases, and he's

3. I remember when my brother was young, he was the same way, it's

just that he did not have apraxia, and went through this phase much,

much earlier.....around 15 months or so.

>

>

>

>

> @...: renee_schwartz_1976@...: Sat, 19 Apr

2008 14:20:15 +0000Subject: [ ] Help! Fish Oil and

Increase Echolalia

>

>

>

>

> Hi. About two weeks ago I started my 3yr old son (who has

dyspraxia, sensory integration disorder, low muscle tone) on Efalax

fish oil. We haven't noticed major changes as he was already using 1-

4 word phrases in speech. What we noticed was an increase in volume

of speech but also an increase in the repetition of our speech. He

has always had some repeptition of our speech and we thought part of

it was learning the language and part of it could be echolalic but

ever since we gave him the fish oil we noticed an increase in the

echolalic speech. Has this happened to anyone else? I tell him to

stop repeating and try to answer the question with a yes or no and

he'll eventually answer me if I'm asking him a ? but it's too

coincidental that the increase occurred with the fish oil. I was

thinking of swithching to ProEfa but I'm not sure why the oil would

trigger this reaction. Any advice would be appreciated. Also does

anyone else whose child only has a dx of dyspraxia notice that their

child repeats things? At the moment, our developmental pediatrician

does not think our son is autistic b/c he's engaged, has great eye

contact, wants to be around people, etc. but do dyspraxic/SI kids

repeat or have echolalia at times? Again, it's not all the time but

just recently there's been an increase. Also, if anyone has advice on

how to minimize the repetition we would appreciate it. Thanks

>

>

>

>

>

>

> _________________________________________________________________

> Use video conversation to talk face-to-face with Windows Live

Messenger.

> http://www.windowslive.com/messenger/connect_your_way.html?

ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_Refresh_messenger_video_042008

>

>

[Guest guest]

Thanks for your information. That seems to make sense. I hope that's

it. It's strange b/c there are moments when he will repeat back

things we are saying and I'm wondering what's going on w/him b/c he

would just answer the quesiton prior to the fish oil and then other

times he will just tell us what he's seeing, answer our questions

without a problem. Again, it's not that he repeats all the time or

all day, it's just we've noticed an increase in it. I will try to be

more patient with the fish oil and see what happens.

I know prior EI therapists and his teachers have commented on the

repetition and questioned whether it's a language development thing

or due to something else ie. autism/echolalia. Since he's not

diagnosed on the spectrum as of now, when I hear these 'spectrum'

like characteristics mentioned I worry that we've missed something or

should be doing something else. I know kids like my son who are

dyspraxic and have sensory integration disorder often have autistic

like qualities but do not present in a classical autistic fashion.

It's hard to know that we are doing all the right things. I just get

overwhelmed and scared that I'm not doing something for him that he

needs or getting him all that he needs. Thanks for the advice and

support.

[Guest guest]

Hi renee,

My son was diagnosed Apraxia/SI at age two and then Autism at age three. A lot

of

Autistic symptoms increase at three and that makes it easier to diagnose. Also A

LOT of

the symptoms that Autistic children have, come from SI. Has your son had a

complete

evaluation for Autism? They say that Autism never looks the same. Also remember

that

Autism is diagnosed behaviorally and with specific tools/measurements. If you

are

concerned at all ask for an ADOS. If he is fine, he'll do fine and if he has

autism at least

you will know.

In terms of minimizing the repetition, we use the " marionette " method. If I ask

him a

question, and he echoes rather than answers... my husband stands behind him and

responds correctly so he echoes that answer rather than the question.

I can not tell you enough, go get a full evaluation.

CC

At the moment, our developmental pediatrician does not think our son is

autistic b/c he's

engaged, has great eye contact, wants to be around people, etc. but do

dyspraxic/SI kids

repeat or have echolalia at times? Again, it's not all the time but just

recently there's been

an increase. Also, if anyone has advice on how to minimize the repetition we

would

appreciate it. Thanks

[Guest guest]

As far as repitition of language goes, the teacher in the autism unit at our

school says to change the way you are answering. It sometimes becomes a cycle

and a child gets stuck. She says if you change your verbage, they sometimes

respond differently. We parents have a tendency to answer the same question the

same way each time.

I do have a dyspraxic child and she does sometimes display perseverative

language, and I did notice an increase after starting the ProEFA, but after 3

weeks has returned to normal.

Jo

Mom of Annie

[Guest guest]

Just like most things there could be various reasons for echolalia.

It is part of normal speech development. Just like some children

may go through other stages late (babble, jargon) they may go through

this stage later as well.

" To determine whether a child has speech delay, the physician must

have a basic knowledge of speech milestones. Normal speech progresses

through stages of cooing, babbling, echolalia, jargon, words and word

combinations, and sentence formation. "

http://www.aafp.org/afp/990600ap/3121.html

" At 18 months, kids have a vocabulary of approximately 5-20 words,

made up chiefly of nouns, and are able to follow simple commands.

Their " jargon " is loaded with a lot of emotional content and they

also tend to repeat a word indefinitely (a phenomenon called

echolalia). "

http://www.efluxmedia.com/news_Want_Smarter_Kids_Stop_Showing_Them_Baby_Training\

_DVDs_07566.html

In regards to autism here's a great quote on the difference:

" Furthermore, the symptoms of ASD change in predictable ways with

the passage of time. For example, echolalia during early childhood

may be replaced by verbal literalism and difficulty with verbal humor

during later childhood or adolescence "

http://pediatrics.aappublications.org/cgi/content/full/105/5/e65

And when it comes to apraxia -I'm not really sure the correct word

would be echolalia as many apraxic children when younger have trouble

with repeating all words -but while they are learning to get words

into their motor memory it's not unusual for them to practice saying

the same word over and over. Also if they are able to repeat what

someone says -they are proud to do that. I know when Tanner started

being able to repeat more- he chose to repeat what Dakota said which

drove Dakota crazy -but (in front of both boys) I explained to Dakota

that his brother was learning how to talk and obviously liked the way

he sounded so that he should take that as a compliment! I've written

in the archives here how Tanner would practice saying certain things

over and over in the mirror " Do you want to play? " " Do YOU want to

play? " 'Do you WANT to play? " etc.

My now 11 year old son still will repeat words -but now just harder

words -or words that don't even seem hard -but for some reason are

hard to him. Just this morning he said " system " instead of " symptom "

because he said he had a sore throat but he has no other symptoms.

When he came up to me and said " Mommy I do have another system " I

thought he was talking about one of his games because he wanted to

purchase something online for his Wii. When I figured it out and

said " Oh you meant " symptom " He again said " system " and no matter how

many times I said " symptom " even slow he couldn't get it. So I broke

the word up and said " simp " he repeated that and then " tom " . Then he

said " symptom " over and over about three or four times. That's

perhaps not a perfect example -but there are times when Tanner is

with his friends and they'll say something " cool " and he says the

same thing (sometimes twice)

Like it is with most things we can look at each symptom in isolation,

but when it comes to diagnosis we need to look at the whole picture.

For apraxia (or dyspraxia same thing), if a child is starting the

stage of echolalia -count that as a good thing!! Encourage it even!

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