Re: How do you deal with temp tantrums???

[Guest guest]

holy cow, i just wrote a HUGE response and it got deleted. so im going to cut it

down a LOT.

i just got the book 123 magic. to stop bad behavior it goes something like this:

(bad behavior) " gage no wrestling with the baby in the cart "

(5 seconds no change) " that's 1 "

(5 more no change) " that's 2. if you get 3, that's 2 minutes " one minute time

out for each year of age.

(5 more seconds) " that 3, take 2 "

no pleading, no arguing, no yelling, no evil eye, no anything excitable except

what i just wrote.

it took gage about 3 tests to get the point. he's 2.5 years old and apraxic.

he's got about 35 words that my husband and i understand and much less for other

people so frusturation is a HUGE issue in our home.

something else that may have been a factor in resolving some frusturation is

that i finally invested in activities that he reaaalllly enjoys. just today we

did the match the right sticker with the shape and stick it (they all started

with the same letter for each category) and he pronounced " A-ee " " B-ee " " Th-ee "

which is HUGE for him. so doing activities that she really enjoys might help

too.

anywhoo about the book. today is day 3 of this for us and he seems to get it. we

even went out to lowes and he did really well. he did end up with 1 time out but

it was 2 minutes holding onto the side of the cart instead of being allowed to

sit in the racecar seat. all in all today we had 3 timeouts all together where

on a typical day we usually have atleas 6 or 7. i would recommend the book. it

says it teaches self accountability, and it seems to work. all i have to do is

say, " that's 1 " and he'll turn around and walk away ... or *gasp* share! i hope

it sticks. we need somthing...anything. our house gets too crazy somedays to

feel sane. if you have any questions about it let me know, i'd be happy to post

more....

Jen

[Guest guest]

Hi, I don't have much advice but am definitely in the same boat. We cannot

go anywhere with our daughter either for the same reasons. is 4.5

and also has apraxia. I just recently purchased the book The Out Of Sync

Child and would highly recommend it. I have only started reading it but it

makes so much sense. I think many of our children also have sensory

integration disorders. I haven't gotten to the section yet that offers

solutions but for my daughter I realized that it helps her get reorganized

if I give her deep masssages or a big bear hug works sometimes also.

Discipline does not work at all with her either. I truly think that they

cannot help themselves and are just overwhelmed.

Sorry I couldn;t be of more help but very interested in any other parents

experiences with this issue.

Anja

On Sun, Aug 9, 2009 at 10:35 PM, tookiecrunch <tookiecrunch@...>wrote:

>

>

> We have officially become the parents people give " The LOOk " because their

> child is screaming, throwing and out of control.

> Our daughter is 3 1/2 diag. with apraxia. She speaks about 60 words now

> that are understood mostly by us. She gets very frustrated if she is asked

> to repeat something.

> We have resorted to almost isolation because it has become so difficult to

> deal with her in public.

> Today we went to church hoping for the best. As soon as we got into the

> preschool room, she became frustrated over blocks and began throwing them

> everywhere (nearly hitting the other children).

> We truly are at a loss on HOW to discipline her. I tried ignoring the

> tantrum until she " uses her words " , time out (which I really don't think

> she understands). Neither of these seem to work. Does anybody know of any

> books, support groups, seminars, ANYTHING that might help! Any advice would

> be greatly appreciated.

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

I think it has very little to do with discipline. Here is a copy of what

a typical 3yr old WOULD be saying.

Use pronouns I, you, me correctly

Is using some plurals and past tenses

Knows at least three prepositions, usually in, on, under

Knows chief parts of body and should be able to indicate these if not

name

Handles three word sentences easily

Has in the neighborhood of 900-1000 words

About 90% of what child says should be intelligible

Verbs begin to predominate

Understands most simple questions dealing with his environment and

activities

Relates his experiences so that they can be followed with reason

Able to reason out such questions as " what must you do when you are

sleepy, hungry, cool, or thirsty? "

Should be able to give his sex, name, age

Should not be expected to answer all questions even though he

understands what is expected.

Compare that to what your daughter is saying-- 900-1000 words vs 60! My

dd is 8yrs old. At 3yrs she was not saying 5words--but we knew she

understood everything we said to her. When she was 4 and we got her

Apraxia dx--it was a very knowledgeable Ped Neurologist who said- please

get this child some form of alternate communication before she loses all

the smarts that she has right now! We went a week later for a Augmentive

Communication Evaluation. Also--we were already teachiing her sign at

home. It was her EI SLP who suggested sign at 1yr old--I guess she could

already see what our future was going to be like! The School district

bought her a basic communcating device so she could try to get her point

across with pictures. Her preschool also started using PECS and once she

was in our school district for K--our insurance paid for a Dyanavox--a

much more advanced communicating device.

What the SLP and the Ped Neuro told me is its not about them being bad

or using typical time-outs or punishments--its about reducing the

frustration they must feel at knowing their brain knows 1000 words--but

their mouth cannot get the words out. Imagine what she must feel like

trying to get her point across and not being able to--the SLP suggested

keeping our mouth shut and see what its like trying to get someone to

understand you. than imagine being punished in a time-out for trying to

get your parents to understand you.

hope this helps.

>

> We have officially become the parents people give " The LOOk " because

their child is screaming, throwing and out of control.

> Our daughter is 3 1/2 diag. with apraxia. She speaks about 60 words

now that are understood mostly by us. She gets very frustrated if she is

asked to repeat something.

> We have resorted to almost isolation because it has become so

difficult to deal with her in public.

>

[Guest guest]

I�totally second the mom who suggested the 123 Magic Method.� Our twins are

3 1/2, and we started implementing it at age 2, when our son had maybe about 20

words total or so and we were dealing with block-throwing, hair-pulling, and

general discipline mayhem with 2 year-old twins!� It took a little while for

them to really " get " it, but it definitely works!� Both kids usually stop

whatever bad behavior they're doing by the time I simply say " 1 " or " That's

1 " .� If I do end up getting to 3 and they have to serve a time-out, they are

very repentent, our son will even apologize afterward, totally unprompted, with

a quick " Sorry CeCe " and a hug for his sister.� Our daughter has gotten to the

point where she'll even just put herself in time-out if she realizes she needs

to cool down.�

I know many parents who have used the 123 Magic Method with kids in a wide range

of ages, and it definitely does work!

Good luck!

B.

[Guest guest]

He might be experiencing too much stress because of trying to find his own

identity and having problem�expressing�himself.Activities that might calm

him can help. Does he like swinging ? Do you know anything that calms him

down?Sensory Integration Therapies might give you some idea.If he is getting

Occupational Therapy, you can ask his therapist what you can do. You can also

make him get tired by making him run ,climb stairs etc. before you go to any

outing so that he will not have much energy to throw tantrums. This is my idea,

but�every�child is unique what works for one, might not work for another. It

is good to give it a try though...

[Guest guest]

I can second this. Before we started using signs, my son (2.5 yo) would

resort immediately to screams. You could hear him across Target and we'd

have to carry him out under our arm. He now knows about 40-50 signs (thanks

to Signing Time DVDs, yay!) and has completely changed.

On Mon, Aug 10, 2009 at 7:34 AM, Maureen <mosense@...> wrote:

>

>

>

> I think it has very little to do with discipline. Here is a copy of what

> a typical 3yr old WOULD be saying.

>

> Use pronouns I, you, me correctly

> Is using some plurals and past tenses

> Knows at least three prepositions, usually in, on, under

> Knows chief parts of body and should be able to indicate these if not

> name

> Handles three word sentences easily

> Has in the neighborhood of 900-1000 words

> About 90% of what child says should be intelligible

> Verbs begin to predominate

> Understands most simple questions dealing with his environment and

> activities

> Relates his experiences so that they can be followed with reason

> Able to reason out such questions as " what must you do when you are

> sleepy, hungry, cool, or thirsty? "

> Should be able to give his sex, name, age

> Should not be expected to answer all questions even though he

> understands what is expected.

>

> Compare that to what your daughter is saying-- 900-1000 words vs 60! My

> dd is 8yrs old. At 3yrs she was not saying 5words--but we knew she

> understood everything we said to her. When she was 4 and we got her

> Apraxia dx--it was a very knowledgeable Ped Neurologist who said- please

> get this child some form of alternate communication before she loses all

> the smarts that she has right now! We went a week later for a Augmentive

> Communication Evaluation. Also--we were already teachiing her sign at

> home. It was her EI SLP who suggested sign at 1yr old--I guess she could

> already see what our future was going to be like! The School district

> bought her a basic communcating device so she could try to get her point

> across with pictures. Her preschool also started using PECS and once she

> was in our school district for K--our insurance paid for a Dyanavox--a

> much more advanced communicating device.

>

> What the SLP and the Ped Neuro told me is its not about them being bad

> or using typical time-outs or punishments--its about reducing the

> frustration they must feel at knowing their brain knows 1000 words--but

> their mouth cannot get the words out. Imagine what she must feel like

> trying to get her point across and not being able to--the SLP suggested

> keeping our mouth shut and see what its like trying to get someone to

> understand you. than imagine being punished in a time-out for trying to

> get your parents to understand you.

>

> hope this helps.

>

>

> >

> > We have officially become the parents people give " The LOOk " because

> their child is screaming, throwing and out of control.

> > Our daughter is 3 1/2 diag. with apraxia. She speaks about 60 words

> now that are understood mostly by us. She gets very frustrated if she is

> asked to repeat something.

> > We have resorted to almost isolation because it has become so

> difficult to deal with her in public.

> >

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Anja..you seemed to almost have hit the nail on the head.I experienced these

embarrassing tantrums while shopping and just continued getting just the

basics.But I remember one particularly enlightening moment when my then 6 or

7 year old at the time had a tantrum in a doctors waiting room and I held

her very tight after a little squirming she calmed right down and actually

enjoyed the bear squeeze. We even talked about it together and she agreed it

felt good when she was upset and having a tantrum.She has outgrown them as

she is 11 now but you brought back lots of memories..Also what amazed me is

my daughters cognizant of what she was doing but her inability to

control..When she was thru them she would almost look proud as she realized

she had done better and was more mature.Her word for it.But punishment never

help, only escalated the temper tantrum..

Roxanne

_____

From:

[mailto: ] On Behalf Of Anja

Sent: Monday, August 10, 2009 6:41 AM

Subject: Re: [ ] How do you deal with temp tantrums???

Hi, I don't have much advice but am definitely in the same boat. We cannot

go anywhere with our daughter either for the same reasons. is 4.5

and also has apraxia. I just recently purchased the book The Out Of Sync

Child and would highly recommend it. I have only started reading it but it

makes so much sense. I think many of our children also have sensory

integration disorders. I haven't gotten to the section yet that offers

solutions but for my daughter I realized that it helps her get reorganized

if I give her deep masssages or a big bear hug works sometimes also.

Discipline does not work at all with her either. I truly think that they

cannot help themselves and are just overwhelmed.

Sorry I couldn;t be of more help but very interested in any other parents

experiences with this issue.

Anja

[Guest guest]

i do agree that the frusturation can be overwhelming all the way around.

however, as a mom of an apraxic 2 year old, i know his ability to get his point

across. in my experience, with his level of intelegence, knowledge of some sign

language, vocabulary, gestures, etc, just because i dont understand an attempt

(which is always very highly praised)doesnt mean its okay to spit in my face or

pee on the floor. for a child like mine who doesnt want to be comforted or

coddled, he needs the discipline and especially self discipline. the 123 magic

method simply brings to light the difference between appropriate and

inappropriate, acceptable and unacceptable behavior. the 5 second intervals and

the short time outs are just to reinforce the take a deep breath concept and

encourage a self directed change in behavior. one of the things i appreciated

the most about the book is that it covered some of the touchy issues in our

house like interrupting, teasing, bedtime, meal time,possessiveness,arguing,

plus oppositional defiance and conduct etc.... and also talked about the

different ways your child may press your buttons: badgering,

temper/indimidation,threats, martyrdom, the butter up approach, and physical

tactics. although my son falls into only 1, maybe 2 of these categories, i felt

like i still came out way ahead. even though it sounds too simple to be true

when you start reading, i reaaaalllly appreciated that it mentioned that it

worked for young children with limited verbal ability (wether age or disability

related) because the last thing i want is for my lil guy to feel cornered into

more submissive behavior. he's limited enough as it is.

[Guest guest]

My 2 1/2 year old son has apraxia and just started throwing BIG time fits too.

Up until this point he really did not seem that frustrated for his lack of

specking although he just started this summer to really start specking a little.

He has lots and lots of words he can repeat but only has about 20 he uses all

the time. It is so embrassing because people look at you like your child is a

first class brat. I do not feel like explaining to every stranger, " look my son

has a problem, it is not my fault, I am a good mother, I really am " . I almost

feel with the more words he has now, the more frustrated he has become that he

can not truly express himself. I feel so sorry for him but I know that doesn't

help either. I have tried to be firmer but that doesn't seem to help either. I

too am at a lose, and the more words he gets the less outside people understand

him, that too I am sure is so frustrating. These children are not dumb, they

know they can not talk

like there peers, I can only imagine how hard it is for them. My heart breaks

everyday.

I will be happy to see if others have suggestions that we can do to help our

frustrated children

________________________________

From: tookiecrunch <tookiecrunch@...>

Sent: Sunday, August 9, 2009 10:35:10 PM

Subject: [ ] How do you deal with temp tantrums???

We have officially become the parents people give " The LOOk " because their child

is screaming, throwing and out of control.

Our daughter is 3 1/2 diag.. with apraxia. She speaks about 60 words now that

are understood mostly by us. She gets very frustrated if she is asked to repeat

something.

We have resorted to almost isolation because it has become so difficult to deal

with her in public.

Today we went to church hoping for the best. As soon as we got into the

preschool room, she became frustrated over blocks and began throwing them

everywhere (nearly hitting the other children).

We truly are at a loss on HOW to discipline her. I tried ignoring the tantrum

until she " uses her words " , time out (which I really don't think she

understands) . Neither of these seem to work. Does anybody know of any books,

support groups, seminars, ANYTHING that might help! Any advice would be greatly

appreciated.

[Guest guest]

I had business cards made up that explains that my son may run away, act

inappropriate, not respond or respond inappropriately and I can hand the card

to a stranger if I need to because I do not have time to explain to the

other people at the mall or whatever and I have asked strangers for help

also. I leave as soon as a tantrum starts coming on. Charlotte Henry

In a message dated 8/10/2009 2:22:34 P.M. Central Daylight Time,

ctarpey20@... writes:

My 2 1/2 year old son has apraxia and just started throwing BIG time fits

too. Up until this point he really did not seem that frustrated for his lack

of specking although he just started this summer to really start specking

a little. He has lots and lots of words he can repeat but only has about 20

he uses all the time. It is so embrassing because people look at you like

your child is a first class brat. I do not feel like explaining to every

stranger, " look my son has a problem, it is not my fault, I am a good mother,

I really am " . I almost feel with the more words he has now, the more

frustrated he has become that he can not truly express himself. I feel so sorry

for him but I know that doesn't help either. I have tried to be firmer but

that doesn't seem to help either. I too am at a lose, and the more words he

gets the less outside people understand him, that too I am sure is so

frustrating. These children are not dumb, they know they can not talk

like there peers, I can only imagine how hard it is for them. My heart

breaks everyday.

I will be happy to see if others have suggestions that we can do to help

our frustrated children

________________________________

From: tookiecrunch <_tookiecrunch@tookiecru_

(mailto:tookiecrunch@...) >

_ childrensaprachi_

(mailto: )

Sent: Sunday, August 9, 2009 10:35:10 PM

Subject: [childrensapraxianeSubject: [childrensapraxiane<WBR>t] How

We have officially become the parents people give " The LOOk " because their

child is screaming, throwing and out of control.

Our daughter is 3 1/2 diag.. with apraxia. She speaks about 60 words now

that are understood mostly by us. She gets very frustrated if she is asked

to repeat something.

We have resorted to almost isolation because it has become so difficult to

deal with her in public.

Today we went to church hoping for the best. As soon as we got into the

preschool room, she became frustrated over blocks and began throwing them

everywhere (nearly hitting the other children).

We truly are at a loss on HOW to discipline her. I tried ignoring the

tantrum until she " uses her words " , time out (which I really don't think she

understands) . Neither of these seem to work. Does anybody know of any

books, support groups, seminars, ANYTHING that might help! Any advice would be

greatly appreciated.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Guest guest]

roxanne,

My son is just turning 10 this month and you brought back memories for me of

when he was younger.

We could never do time out's because that would just escalate to the point of

him not knowing what

he was doing and you could tell that he just wasn't " there " anymore.� After

the tantrum, he would see

things that he destroyed and get upset, he just didn't know that he did it.�

It was very stressful to watch.

What you said about the bear squeeze is more right than you know.� We were

asked to take part in a

conference for OT's.� I made a short video of my son having his " tantrum " .�

I put a weighted backpack

on him and within 30 seconds he was calming right down.� Weight if very

important for the proprioceptive

system and to this day, we still have the school use weight for a specific

amount of time a day.� General

rule is 20 minutes on, 20 off and about 10% of the childs body weight in the

backpack.� (A vest is better,

but in a pinch a backpack with a few cans in it works wonders!).

Signing helped with the apraxia part of things, took alot of pressure off.� We

also used pecs in the house.

The behaviour management specialist had us try to head off the tantrums by

offering other choices.�

For example, if he wanted to play with the garden hose when it wasn't an

acceptable moment to do it,

i would offer something that he would want more.� It took ALOT of practise

because we were always

having to be 10 steps ahead, but now it works great.

Most of the tantrums weren't his fault, he was doing things for a specific

sensory reason. If he was ripping

things I would make him a basket full of paper that he could rip and put into

recycling. I always looked at

why he had tantrums and would act accordingly.� Of course, if he was just

trying to be a typical, push my

button kid, he would lose some activity, but on the whole most of the tantrums

were in response to something

sensory.

hth

sandy

________________________________

[Guest guest]

Most people will not agree with my cure for tantrums but what I did is take her

home when she has a tantrum. If I was going grocery shopping and she wanted to

go I would tell her no yelling or you will go home. If she started to throw a

tantrum I would leave my cart at the service desk and ask for them to watch it

and take her home. My husband would watch her while I finished my shopping. My

husband and I would take turns going places with her and we both did the same

thing leave and bring her home if she was bad. It didn't take more than a few

times to make her realise she would not be allowed to have a tantrum. Now when

we go to the store or anywhere else she is very well behaved. I finally listened

to my Mother who said if you wouldn't let your non LT child do this why are you

letting her. Treat her the same as you did them and you will get the same

behavior. IT WORKS!!!

[Guest guest]

This must be so incredibly difficult, but my first thought is to teach her a few

basic signs that she can rely on when the words won't come. I taught my 2 year

old son the sign for HELP and MORE and I swear those two signs have been a

lifesaver, especially in church when we need to be quiet! check out the signing

times videos at the library, too. I also began signing with " the baby signing

book " and " Baby Talk " books!

Good Luck!

[Guest guest]

You are not aloe. We went to a church who actually asked us to leave once.

I made up business cards about my sons condition say ing he may not respond

or may respond inappropriately, he has restricted interests

AUTISM

COMMUNICATION

-May be non-verbal or have limited verbal abilities-may appear deaf; may

not respond to verbal cues-may repeat words or phrases in place of normal

communications-may have difficulty expressing needs; uses gestures or points.

BEHAVIOR

May have tantrums-display extreme distress for no apparent reason-may

exhibit inappropriate laughing or giggling- may show no real fear or dangers-

may have little or no eye contact-may appear insensitive to pain-may be

sensitive to touch, sound, or bright lights- may exhibit self-stimulating

behaviors: hand flapping, finger flicking, body rocking

IN CRIMINAL JUSTICE SITUATIONS

may not understand rights- may have difficulty remembering facts or details

of offenses- may become anxious in new situations-may not understand

consequences of their actions

on the other side of the card it says

AUTISM

helpful hints for interactions with individuals with autism

-use simple language:speak slowly and clearly

-use concrete terms and ideas

repeat simple questions allowing 10-15 seconds for a response

-proceed slowly and give praise and encouragement

-do not attempt to physically stop self stimulating behavioe ( I point this

one out because this is the part people do not seem to get)

REMEMBER each individual with autism is unique and may act or react

differently

PLEASE contact a responsible party who is familiar with the individual

I also have a sticker on my front window of my car for criminal justice

situations (my son jumped out of the car once)

There is an autism ribbon on the back of the car

This should slow down people who are insensitive or just do not understand

I hope this helps. Even if your child does not have autism I have found

that most people understand I ask them to read the card and then give it back

to me. Otherwise they will just put it in their pocket without reading it.

Most of the time people apologize and tell me they were not staring or they

did not mean to stare.

I have given the cards out to all the teachers and associate teachers also.

Hope this helps.

Charlotte Henry

-

In a message dated 8/9/2009 9:51:32 P.M. Central Daylight Time,

tookiecrunch@... writes:

We have officially become the parents people give " The LOOk " because their

child is screaming, throwing and out of control.

Our daughter is 3 1/2 diag. with apraxia. She speaks about 60 words now

that are understood mostly by us. She gets very frustrated if she is asked to

repeat something.

We have resorted to almost isolation because it has become so difficult to

deal with her in public.

Today we went to church hoping for the best. As soon as we got into the

preschool room, she became frustrated over blocks and began throwing them

everywhere (nearly hitting the other children).

We truly are at a loss on HOW to discipline her. I tried ignoring the

tantrum until she " uses her words " , time out (which I really don't think she

understands)We truly are at a loss on HOW to discipline her. I tried

ignoring the tantrum until she " uses her words " , time out (which I really

don't

think she understands)

[Guest guest]

I second this procedure. I would do the same. As soon as the tantrum or sensory

behavior started, I would pick him up..drop everything and go home. I was lucky

in that this didn't happen often but when it did..we left.

From:

[mailto: ] On Behalf Of joanwetterhahn

Sent: Monday, August 10, 2009 3:06 PM

Subject: [ ] Re: How do you deal with temp tantrums???

Most people will not agree with my cure for tantrums but what I did is take her

home when she has a tantrum. If I was going grocery shopping and she wanted to

go I would tell her no yelling or you will go home. If she started to throw a

tantrum I would leave my cart at the service desk and ask for them to watch it

and take her home. My husband would watch her while I finished my shopping. My

husband and I would take turns going places with her and we both did the same

thing leave and bring her home if she was bad. It didn't take more than a few

times to make her realise she would not be allowed to have a tantrum. Now when

we go to the store or anywhere else she is very well behaved. I finally listened

to my Mother who said if you wouldn't let your non LT child do this why are you

letting her. Treat her the same as you did them and you will get the same

behavior. IT WORKS!!!

[Guest guest]

We all know the Terrible Two's are not just a myth! Whether they are Apraxic or

not!!

I also learned when

my 11 yr old was 2 that one outing a day was about all they could

handle. Acting up in the store could be hunger, tiredness or just plain

frustrations of being two years old. They do not understand that the

world does not revolve around them. So though no child should be allowed

to spit in anyones face--its noticing why they might be acting up. Is it

time for lunch? is it too late in the day for a 2yr old too be out? Are

they beyond exhausted from being brought to three different stores in a

3hr period? So when mine have gotten to that point---yes, its not a threat--its

just time to go home! I've left full carts of food behind to get that kid home

by paying for the milk I came in for on the express lane.

I've seen people in Walmart at 7:30pm with 2-3yr olds who should be home

in their pj's! But I understand that people work and thats the only time

they have to get to the stores! I just feel horrible for those poor

babies who are in walmart at that time of night. thats when I realize

how good it is to be a sahm.

So--it has to do with finding the source of their extreme frustration

and acting out. Do they need to be taken home because they've just had

enough or are they trying to communicate something and getting

frustrated that no one understands what they might be trying to say.

>

> My 2 1/2 year old son has apraxia and just started throwing BIG time

fits too. Up until this point he really did not seem that frustrated for

his lack of specking although he just started this summer to really

start specking a little. He has lots and lots of words he can repeat but

only has about 20 he uses all the time.

[Guest guest]

Thanks for ALL the great advice. It's amazing how you can feel so isolated and

alone one minute and not so alone and empowered the next.  I will definitely

give the bear hug (deep massage), the book 123...magic and taking her home

immediately. I will also step outside of MY embarrassment and step into her

shoes to try to see things from her point of frustration(Very well put Maureen).

I can't wait to share with you what WORKED.

Thanks

> From: Myra Bauza <myra.bauza@...>

> Subject: RE: [ ] Re: How do you deal with temp tantrums???

> " "

< >

> Date: Monday, August 10, 2009, 3:33 PM

> I second this procedure. I would do

> the same. As soon as the tantrum or sensory behavior

> started, I would pick him up..drop everything and go home. I

> was lucky in that this didn't happen often but when it

> did..we left.

>

> From:

> [mailto: ]

> On Behalf Of joanwetterhahn

> Sent: Monday, August 10, 2009 3:06 PM

>

> Subject: [ ] Re: How do you deal with

> temp tantrums???

>

>

>

> Most people will not agree with my cure for tantrums but

> what I did is take her home when she has a tantrum. If I was

> going grocery shopping and she wanted to go I would tell her

> no yelling or you will go home. If she started to throw a

> tantrum I would leave my cart at the service desk and ask

> for them to watch it and take her home. My husband would

> watch her while I finished my shopping. My husband and I

> would take turns going places with her and we both did the

> same thing leave and bring her home if she was bad. It

> didn't take more than a few times to make her realise she

> would not be allowed to have a tantrum. Now when we go to

> the store or anywhere else she is very well behaved. I

> finally listened to my Mother who said if you wouldn't let

> your non LT child do this why are you letting her. Treat her

> the same as you did them and you will get the same behavior.

> IT WORKS!!!

>

>

>

>

>

> ------------------------------------

>

>

[Guest guest]

I was thinking the same thing. None of us have all the answers--so if you find

what works---please let us know!

>

> You are not alone.

>

[Guest guest]

This is a very interesting topic. Thank you all for your ideas and input. My

daughter is almost 3 1/2 and we are just now beginning to have tantrums. She has

very few words, has been mostly happy-go-lucky, yet she does also have sensory

issues and motor dyspraxia as well.

I truly feel that each child (and each family) will need to adopt strategies

that work for them. I don't think that there is a magic method or book for

everyone. How great, though, when you find the one for you!

Until recently, working to avoid tantrums has worked for us. This has included:

minimizing errands with her, making sure her sensory, sleep, eating, and

exercise needs are met, spending lots of time with her so I can be a

mind-reader, and empathy. It has been a lot of work, but I think it has been

successful FOR US.

Now, I think my little girl is testing the limits more and making her demands

known. For us, the tantrums reflect a development shift, and I am grateful

(well, part of me is grateful ;-)) Her new behaviors have also come with new

skills! But the tantrums are still hard.

I don't believe time-outs will ever be apart of our household. We can put

ourselves in a time out ( " I'm upset and I need some time to think " ), but we

don't time-out each other. In a public setting, we just leave. At home, I try to

remind myself that my daughter is entitled to have her own feelings. What she is

not entitled to do is make unreasonable demands of me. So I say things like, " I

know this doesn't feel right to you. I'm sorry about that. ______ is going to

happen now. " I expect myself to be respectful to her, and if I can't be, then I

need a break. I've been needing breaks lately, that's for sure!

One thing that has helped us so much in the last year and a half has been our

" Bye-bye " song. We sing it to the park, to a desired toy in the store, to the

play room, etc.. What a life-saver!

Good luck everyone. I look forward to more ideas.

MRL

[Guest guest]

Sandy,

I'm really interested in this idea of using weight. My daughter constantly hits

people that pass her by. Because she's 3 and 1/2 and pretty darn cute, most

people take it quite well, but so far, nothing I do has gotten her to stop. She

has propioceptive issues as well, and sometimes I think she's doing it just for

the sensation of feeling her hand hit another person. It's not done in a mean

way at all. I wonder if weights would help that?

She also tends to pull hair, I think because she has so few words to get other

people's attention. Interestingly, her hair pulling is mainly with little kids

- especially girls.

Marla

>

> roxanne,

>

> My son is just turning 10 this month and you brought back memories for me of

when he was younger.

> We could never do time out's because that would just escalate to the point of

him not knowing what

> he was doing and you could tell that he just wasn't " there " anymore.� After

the tantrum, he would see

> things that he destroyed and get upset, he just didn't know that he did it.�

It was very stressful to watch.

>

> What you said about the bear squeeze is more right than you know.� We were

asked to take part in a

> conference for OT's.� I made a short video of my son having his

" tantrum " .� I put a weighted backpack

> on him and within 30 seconds he was calming right down.� Weight if very

important for the proprioceptive

> system and to this day, we still have the school use weight for a specific

amount of time a day.� General

> rule is 20 minutes on, 20 off and about 10% of the childs body weight in the

backpack.� (A vest is better,

> but in a pinch a backpack with a few cans in it works wonders!).

>

> Signing helped with the apraxia part of things, took alot of pressure off.�

We also used pecs in the house.

> The behaviour management specialist had us try to head off the tantrums by

offering other choices.�

> For example, if he wanted to play with the garden hose when it wasn't an

acceptable moment to do it,

> i would offer something that he would want more.� It took ALOT of practise

because we were always

> having to be 10 steps ahead, but now it works great.

> Most of the tantrums weren't his fault, he was doing things for a specific

sensory reason. If he was ripping

> things I would make him a basket full of paper that he could rip and put into

recycling. I always looked at

> why he had tantrums and would act accordingly.� Of course, if he was just

trying to be a typical, push my

> button kid, he would lose some activity, but on the whole most of the tantrums

were in response to something

> sensory.

>

> hth

> sandy

>

>

>

>

> ________________________________

>

[Guest guest]

Marla,

the weight was, and still is, a huge part of our life.  Proprioceptive and

vestibular is a big

thing with my son.  I can tell the typical tantrum from a sensory one and once i

started looking

at why he would melt down, things became so much easier for us.

I had my mother in law sew a lining into a jean vest so i could put weight into

it. Most times

i just have the school put on his backpack with a special weighted lap dog in it

so he won't seem

out of place to other children.

there are spandex vests to give that huggy feeling and a ton of other

(cheaper)ways to ensure that

the weight is distributed more evenly on the body.  If I were you, I'd just try

a small backpack with

a few soup cans in it and see how it goes.  If memory serves me right, i think

the " out-of-sync child "

had alot of great ideas for this.

I also have an exercise ball for him to sit on instead of a chair.  He has one

at school as well, but they

ordered through a catalogue at 10x the price when the walmart one is just as

good!  Therabands might

work to stop the hitting too, you just have to make sure she always something

with her that she can

fidget with.  The book should be better for you to see exactly what you could

use for different situations.

There was another book as well with great ideas, same author, " the out-of-sync

child has fun " tons of

great ideas in that one as well..

You might want to make a pecs book. I made one very cheaply with pecs signs i

got for free when I

googled free pecs signs.  d it with me everywhere!

If you need more ideas, just let me know!

sandy

________________________________

From: marlajean_d <marlajean_d@...>

Sent: Tuesday, August 11, 2009 3:13:24 AM

Subject: [ ] Re: How do you deal with temp tantrums???

 

Sandy,

I'm really interested in this idea of using weight. My daughter constantly hits

people that pass her by. Because she's 3 and 1/2 and pretty darn cute, most

people take it quite well, but so far, nothing I do has gotten her to stop. She

has propioceptive issues as well, and sometimes I think she's doing it just for

the sensation of feeling her hand hit another person. It's not done in a mean

way at all. I wonder if weights would help that?

She also tends to pull hair, I think because she has so few words to get other

people's attention. Interestingly, her hair pulling is mainly with little kids -

especially girls.

Marla

>

> roxanne,

>

> My son is just turning 10 this month and you brought back memories for me of

when he was younger.

> We could never do time out's because that would just escalate to the point of

him not knowing what

> he was doing and you could tell that he just wasn't " there " anymore.� After

the tantrum, he would see

> things that he destroyed and get upset, he just didn't know that he did it.�

It was very stressful to watch.

>

> What you said about the bear squeeze is more right than you know.� We were

asked to take part in a

> conference for OT's.� I made a short video of my son having his

" tantrum " .� I put a weighted backpack

> on him and within 30 seconds he was calming right down.� Weight if very

important for the proprioceptive

> system and to this day, we still have the school use weight for a specific

amount of time a day.� General

> rule is 20 minutes on, 20 off and about 10% of the childs body weight in the

backpack.� (A vest is better,

> but in a pinch a backpack with a few cans in it works wonders!).

>

> Signing helped with the apraxia part of things, took alot of pressure off.�

We also used pecs in the house.

> The behaviour management specialist had us try to head off the tantrums by

offering other choices.�

> For example, if he wanted to play with the garden hose when it wasn't an

acceptable moment to do it,

> i would offer something that he would want more.� It took ALOT of practise

because we were always

> having to be 10 steps ahead, but now it works great.

> Most of the tantrums weren't his fault, he was doing things for a specific

sensory reason. If he was ripping

> things I would make him a basket full of paper that he could rip and put into

recycling. I always looked at

> why he had tantrums and would act accordingly.� Of course, if he was just

trying to be a typical, push my

> button kid, he would lose some activity, but on the whole most of the tantrums

were in response to something

> sensory.

>

> hth

> sandy

>

>

>

>

> ____________ _________ _________ __

>

__________________________________________________________________

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[Guest guest]

One of our more interesting stores not to go into for us was Home Depot.  My son

would know the way to get there, and when we got to the corner near the store,

he'd

be telling us to turn left because he knew that turning right was home depot!

By accident, we found that those big yellow headphones that workers wear to

protect

their ears worked wonders.  He just hated the noise being in a store and he was

able

to put them on anytime he felt nervous or overwhelmed.  We have about 10 pairs

now.

we keep them in the car, house, school...you name it we have a pair stashed!!!

It was the first time he was able to self soothe, and even when he had no words,

he was

able to sign when he wanted them. 

My son will be 10 in a couple of weeks and he's now a pro at determining when he

wants

the headphones.  We get some stares but that's ok. We explain to those who are

curious

enough to ask and that's ok too.

just one of the tricks we use for going out into public!

hth

sandy

________________________________

From: Anja <anjasanchez@...>

Sent: Monday, August 10, 2009 6:41:02 AM

Subject: Re: [ ] How do you deal with temp tantrums???

 

Hi, I don't have much advice but am definitely in the same boat. We cannot

go anywhere with our daughter either for the same reasons. is 4.5

and also has apraxia. I just recently purchased the book The Out Of Sync

Child and would highly recommend it. I have only started reading it but it

makes so much sense. I think many of our children also have sensory

integration disorders. I haven't gotten to the section yet that offers

solutions but for my daughter I realized that it helps her get reorganized

if I give her deep masssages or a big bear hug works sometimes also.

Discipline does not work at all with her either. I truly think that they

cannot help themselves and are just overwhelmed.

Sorry I couldn;t be of more help but very interested in any other parents

experiences with this issue.

Anja

On Sun, Aug 9, 2009 at 10:35 PM, tookiecrunch <tookiecrunch>wrote:

>

>

> We have officially become the parents people give " The LOOk " because their

> child is screaming, throwing and out of control.

> Our daughter is 3 1/2 diag. with apraxia. She speaks about 60 words now

> that are understood mostly by us. She gets very frustrated if she is asked

> to repeat something.

> We have resorted to almost isolation because it has become so difficult to

> deal with her in public.

> Today we went to church hoping for the best. As soon as we got into the

> preschool room, she became frustrated over blocks and began throwing them

> everywhere (nearly hitting the other children).

> We truly are at a loss on HOW to discipline her. I tried ignoring the

> tantrum until she " uses her words " , time out (which I really don't think

> she understands) . Neither of these seem to work. Does anybody know of any

> books, support groups, seminars, ANYTHING that might help! Any advice would

> be greatly appreciated.

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Thanks for sharing! My daughter also does not like loud noises or certain

noises, she doesn't mind when she turns the computer up to were you can hear

it 4 rooms over, LOL, so I am assuming it is only certain types of loud

noises she does not like. She started that as a baby. We could not go to

restaurants for example. She would start to scream and cry and not stop

until we would leave. I will definitely try headphones with her and see if

that will help her in certain situations

Anja

On Tue, Aug 11, 2009 at 4:25 PM, sandy lehmann <mommie2chris@...>wrote:

>

>

> One of our more interesting stores not to go into for us was Home Depot.

> My son

> would know the way to get there, and when we got to the corner near the

> store, he'd

> be telling us to turn left because he knew that turning right was home

> depot!

> By accident, we found that those big yellow headphones that workers wear to

> protect

> their ears worked wonders. He just hated the noise being in a store and he

> was able

> to put them on anytime he felt nervous or overwhelmed. We have about 10

> pairs now.

> we keep them in the car, house, school...you name it we have a pair

> stashed!!!

> It was the first time he was able to self soothe, and even when he had no

> words, he was

> able to sign when he wanted them.

>

> My son will be 10 in a couple of weeks and he's now a pro at determining

> when he wants

> the headphones. We get some stares but that's ok. We explain to those who

> are curious

> enough to ask and that's ok too.

>

> just one of the tricks we use for going out into public!

>

> hth

> sandy

>

> ________________________________

> From: Anja <anjasanchez@... <anjasanchez%40gmail.com>>

> < %40>

> Sent: Monday, August 10, 2009 6:41:02 AM

> Subject: Re: [ ] How do you deal with temp tantrums???

>

>

> Hi, I don't have much advice but am definitely in the same boat. We cannot

> go anywhere with our daughter either for the same reasons. is 4.5

> and also has apraxia. I just recently purchased the book The Out Of Sync

> Child and would highly recommend it. I have only started reading it but it

> makes so much sense. I think many of our children also have sensory

> integration disorders. I haven't gotten to the section yet that offers

> solutions but for my daughter I realized that it helps her get reorganized

> if I give her deep masssages or a big bear hug works sometimes also.

> Discipline does not work at all with her either. I truly think that they

> cannot help themselves and are just overwhelmed.

> Sorry I couldn;t be of more help but very interested in any other parents

> experiences with this issue.

> Anja

>

> On Sun, Aug 9, 2009 at 10:35 PM, tookiecrunch <tookiecrunch

> >wrote:

>

> >

> >

> > We have officially become the parents people give " The LOOk " because

> their

> > child is screaming, throwing and out of control.

> > Our daughter is 3 1/2 diag. with apraxia. She speaks about 60 words now

> > that are understood mostly by us. She gets very frustrated if she is

> asked

> > to repeat something.

> > We have resorted to almost isolation because it has become so difficult

> to

> > deal with her in public.

> > Today we went to church hoping for the best. As soon as we got into the

> > preschool room, she became frustrated over blocks and began throwing them

> > everywhere (nearly hitting the other children).

> > We truly are at a loss on HOW to discipline her. I tried ignoring the

> > tantrum until she " uses her words " , time out (which I really don't think

> > she understands) . Neither of these seem to work. Does anybody know of

> any

> > books, support groups, seminars, ANYTHING that might help! Any advice

> would

> > be greatly appreciated.

> >

> >

> >

>

>

[Guest guest]

My son also doesn't like certain types of loud noises. What I am wondering is

that do we need to desensitize them by exposing them to these sounds as much as

possible or should we protect them so that they are not overload.

>

> >

> >

> > We have officially become the parents people give " The LOOk " because

> their

> > child is screaming, throwing and out of control.

> > Our daughter is 3 1/2 diag. with apraxia. She speaks about 60 words now

> > that are understood mostly by us. She gets very frustrated if she is

> asked

> > to repeat something.

> > We have resorted to almost isolation because it has become so difficult

> to

> > deal with her in public.

> > Today we went to church hoping for the best. As soon as we got into the

> > preschool room, she became frustrated over blocks and began throwing them

> > everywhere (nearly hitting the other children).

> > We truly are at a loss on HOW to discipline her. I tried ignoring the

> > tantrum until she " uses her words " , time out (which I really don't think

> > she understands) . Neither of these seem to work. Does anybody know of

> any

> > books, support groups, seminars, ANYTHING that might help! Any advice

> would

> > be greatly appreciated.

> >

> >

> >

>

>

[Guest guest]

Emel- exposing him to sounds he is sensitive to can cause more harm..wait till

he is desensitized and can deal the the exposure to them.Do this by looking into

nutritional deficiences and support with vitamins if necessary.Also mercury

toxicity and other metals can cause many sensory issues many here are dealing

with.We detoxed metals through chelation with my older son when he was between

ages 2-3 and I cannot recommend it enoiugh. We had to avoid most social

environments because of sound sensitivity...he also had massive light

sensitivities and was hpersensitive to clothing textures etc etc.Different

methods for different children for healing...all I am saying os this is a BIG

area to explore- the chelation and nutritional supplements.Sent from my

BlackBerry® smartphone with SprintSpeed

Re: [ ] How do you deal with temp tantrums???

My son also doesn't like certain types of loud noises. What I am wondering is

that do we need to desensitize them by exposing them to these sounds as much as

possible or should we protect them so that they are not overload.

>

> >

> >

> > We have officially become the parents people give " The LOOk " because

> their

> > child is screaming, throwing and out of control.

> > Our daughter is 3 1/2 diag. with apraxia. She speaks about 60 words now

> > that are understood mostly by us. She gets very frustrated if she is

> asked

> > to repeat something.

> > We have resorted to almost isolation because it has become so difficult

> to

> > deal with her in public.

> > Today we went to church hoping for the best. As soon as we got into the

> > preschool room, she became frustrated over blocks and began throwing them

> > everywhere (nearly hitting the other children).

> > We truly are at a loss on HOW to discipline her. I tried ignoring the

> > tantrum until she " uses her words " , time out (which I really don't think

> > she understands) . Neither of these seem to work. Does anybody know of

> any

> > books, support groups, seminars, ANYTHING that might help! Any advice

> would

> > be greatly appreciated.

> >

> >

> >

>

>