Too much vitamin E?

[Guest guest]

I hope the researchers here can help calm my fears on this one... I started

looking into exactly how much my son is getting when his school noticed he was

looking a little yellow/orange. I was pretty sure it was just the orange veggies

in the juice he loves, and I was right (checked with his doctor today), but I

did notice that if he's on one scoop of NV and the 2 EFAs and 1 EPA of the

Nordic fish oils, he's getting a LOT of vitamin E.

From what I've read, and from what his doc said today when I asked him, that

might be something to worry about. Is it? If not, why not?

My son is getting not-quite-one-scoop and not every day (I try!). From my

calculations that's about 65 I.U. vitamin E?

Thanks for any help with this,

[Guest guest]

Hi ! The NV is a water soluble form of vitamin e -all of the vitamins and

any other nutrients and all the essential amino acids in NV are from whole foods

and the entire food is water soluble due to the processing since it's a powder.

I was told they would not have been able to make it water soluble if it was

created as a liquid -so we should all be happy it's a powder because I know I

am! Here are again the ingredients

http://pursuitofresearch.org/ingredients.html So it would be like worrying about

getting too much vitamin C from eating too many apples. When nutrients are from

food sources it is less likely there are any issues -it's when you supplement

them from the bottle there can be issues.

As far as the fat soluble 15 IUs in each capsule of fish oil you mentioned -I

always go by the chart here http://ods.od.nih.gov/factsheets/vitamine/ for upper

tolerable levels as I know in this group for a year or so we were using 200 IU

to 400 IU with for the most part a 1:1 ratio of alpha to gamma tocopherol with

no reports of side effects until speak which had way higher dosages with if I

can recall close to a 3:1 ratio of alpha over the gamma -so in many ways a very

different tocopherol in dosage and formula.

But again if you go by http://ods.od.nih.gov/factsheets/vitamine/ even a 3 year

old can have " up to " 300 IU a day and be within upper tolerable levels. It's

not going to format here in plain text -but I will copy and paste it below -but

again check out the site.

Table 3: Tolerable Upper Intake Levels (ULs) for Vitamin E [6]

Age Male Female Pregnancy Lactation

1-3 years 200 mg

(300 IU) 200 mg

(300 IU)

4-8 years 300 mg

(450 IU) 300 mg

(450 IU)

9-13 years 600 mg

(900 IU) 600 mg

(900 IU)

14-18 years 800 mg

(1,200 IU) 800 mg

(1,200 IU) 800 mg

(1,200 IU) 800 mg

(1,200 IU)

19+ years 1,000 mg

(1,500 IU) 1,000 mg

(1,500 IU) 1,000 mg

(1,500 IU) 1,000 mg

(1,500 IU)

Final advice...it's OK if your ped isn't super knowledgeable about nutrition yet

as most of the info is just getting into the better doctor offices and mainly on

a PhD level -but you should find someone to work with that is a medical doctor

with a knowledge in nutrition as well to speak with. It makes me smile how many

docs can be so quick to prescribe meds and worry about vitamins. Not saying you

shouldn't worry about too much of anything -you can die from too much water too

-too much water you drown..but even if your child is a peanut -you need someone

that is a respected professional that can assure you not only are you providing

your child with essential nutrients which is awesome -but you are probably

feeding your child healthier than 99 percent of the world right now. And yes -I

can say it -but you need to hear it from a professional- and if you find one who

fits the description (again it will most likely be a better doctor from a

leading hospital system and possibly a PhD) you will hear just that because that

is what I have heard- and from a number now. And here's why feeding your child

the essential nutrients from whole food sources in theory is so important for

our population http://pursuitofresearch.org/science.html and why I started

http://www.wholefoodtherapy.com ;to let the world know it's important for all.

To eat is human but to digest is divine is something Dr. Suhas just told me -

he's one of the docs behind NV http://pursuitofresearch.org/advisors.html

=====

[Guest guest]

Hi - I'm with you on being alert of making sure a child doesn't get too

much in the way of fat soluble vitamins. My son and many here had horrific

experiences with too high fat soluble vitamin e...and I can tell you while he

used to be able to take one fat soluble 200 alpha/200 gamma tocopherol capsule

and did great with that with his fish oils as did many in this group -but once

he was (in my opinion) overdosed on it to this day Tanner will get a headache on

even ONE 200/200 vitamin e capsule. I know he's not the only one.

Tanner's been on NV for a year now which I knew was water soluble and that all

the nutrients are from whole foods. To be honest the even small 15 IU amount of

fat soluble vitamin e per capsule was one of the reasons I lowered Tanner's fish

oils to the 2 ProEFA and 1 ProEPA because I know his body is sensitive to fat

soluble vitamin e so want to keep that ultra low if it's not from food or water

soluble. I'm just thrilled that for the first time I was able to do that

without a regression as he would of before -which makes me believe NV has in

fact improved his metabolic system and aided his digestion and utilization of

the nutrients he does consume.

About the chart -it's from the National Institutes of Health/NIH. I respect

their information and typically follow their advice guidelines for dosage. I

too dig on everything! Keep digging -it's a good thing

=====

[Guest guest]

,

I was surprised when you said that NV contained a water soluble form of vitamin

E that came from food, and I did some research and discovered that vitamin E is

made into water soluble through a manufacturing process (therefore not a natural

form from foods), for the purpose of better absorption and when absorbed into

the body, vit e. reverts back into fat soluble form.

See this link

http://www.medicinenet.com/script/main/art.asp?articlekey=10736

There is a difference between the vitamins that are naturally water soluble

(such as vitamins B and C) and the " water solubilized " form of a vitamin (such

as vitamin E) that is naturally a fat soluble vitamin. This form of vitamin E is

" water solubilized " by the addition of certain compounds during a specific

manufacturing process. It is hypothesized that this " water solubilized form " of

vitamin E is more efficiently absorbed through the intestinal wall into the

body.

In sum, to respond to your questions:

• " The difference (if any) between vitamins that are " water soluble " and those

that are not " -- There is a big difference between the water soluble vitamins

and the fat soluble vitamins and this is absolutely a critical distinction.

• " Specifically Vitamin E " -- Vitamin E is a fat soluble vitamin. Although it can

be " water solubilized " in the lab to help its absorption through the intestinal

wall, once it is absorbed into the body it would appear to behave as a fat

soluble vitamin does.

And look at this study

http://www.douglaslabs.com/pdf/trials/Aqua-E%20Clinical%20Study.pdf

It talks about the preparation of vitamin E into a water soluble form for a

population of people who are deficient due to malabsorption issues in their

intestines (diseases etc). THis study shows that a group of patients using Aqua

E increased their absorption through this water soluble formula and it is

achieved by the use of TPGS to achieve micelle-like particles (what TPGS is, I

don't know).

It also says " In conclusion, this water-soluble formulation is significantly

more effective than fat-soluble forms in normalizing

vitamin E status in malabsorbing cystic fibrosis and especially

in providing the complete vitamin E complex of natural

tocopherols plus tocotrienols as found in foods. "

So, water soluble vitamin E is manufactured to replicate naturally occuring fat

soluble vitamin E found in foods as a way to deliver vitamin E that can be

absorbed in the intestines for those who suffer malabsorption issues and are

deficit in fat solulbe vitamins. I am sure you did not mean to imply that the

water soluble vitamin E in NV came directly from food since it does not.

However, it may offer an explanation as to why some kids are doing very well on

nv since they may be absorbing the water soluble vitamin E more efficiently in

their intestines than the traditional vitamiin E.

What about the other fat soluble vitamins such as A, D and K in NV, are they in

their natural form or are they converted to water soluble as well?

Just raisiing questions that I think need to be discussed.

Lori

>

>

> >http://www.douglaslabs.com/pdf/trials/Aqua-E%20Clinical%20Study.pdf

> > Hi ! The NV is a water soluble form of vitamin e -all of the vitamins

and any other nutrients and all the essential amino acids in NV are from whole

foods and the entire food is water soluble due to the processing since it's a

powder. I was told they would not have been able to make it water soluble if it

was created as a liquid -so we should all be happy it's a powder because I know

I am! Here are again the ingredients

http://pursuitofresearch.org/ingredients.html So it would be like worrying about

getting too much vitamin C from eating too many apples. When nutrients are from

food sources it is less likely there are any issues -it's when you supplement

them from the bottle there can be issues.

> >

> > As far as the fat soluble 15 IUs in each capsule of fish oil you mentioned

-I always go by the chart here http://ods.od.nih.gov/factsheets/vitamine/ for

upper tolerable levels as I know in this group for a year or so we were using

200 IU to 400 IU with for the most part a 1:1 ratio of alpha to gamma tocopherol

with no reports of side effects until speak which had way higher dosages with if

I can recall close to a 3:1 ratio of alpha over the gamma -so in many ways a

very different tocopherol in dosage and formula.

> >

> > But again if you go by http://ods.od.nih.gov/factsheets/vitamine/ even a 3

year old can have " up to " 300 IU a day and be within upper tolerable levels.

It's not going to format here in plain text -but I will copy and paste it below

-but again check out the site.

> >

> > Table 3: Tolerable Upper Intake Levels (ULs) for Vitamin E [6]

> > Age Male Female Pregnancy Lactation

> > 1-3 years 200 mg

> > (300 IU) 200 mg

> > (300 IU)

> > 4-8 years 300 mg

> > (450 IU) 300 mg

> > (450 IU)

> > 9-13 years 600 mg

> > (900 IU) 600 mg

> > (900 IU)

> > 14-18 years 800 mg

> > (1,200 IU) 800 mg

> > (1,200 IU) 800 mg

> > (1,200 IU) 800 mg

> > (1,200 IU)

> > 19+ years 1,000 mg

> > (1,500 IU) 1,000 mg

> > (1,500 IU) 1,000 mg

> > (1,500 IU) 1,000 mg

> > (1,500 IU)

> >

> > Final advice...it's OK if your ped isn't super knowledgeable about nutrition

yet as most of the info is just getting into the better doctor offices and

mainly on a PhD level -but you should find someone to work with that is a

medical doctor with a knowledge in nutrition as well to speak with. It makes me

smile how many docs can be so quick to prescribe meds and worry about vitamins.

Not saying you shouldn't worry about too much of anything -you can die from too

much water too -too much water you drown..but even if your child is a peanut

-you need someone that is a respected professional that can assure you not only

are you providing your child with essential nutrients which is awesome -but you

are probably feeding your child healthier than 99 percent of the world right

now. And yes -I can say it -but you need to hear it from a professional- and if

you find one who fits the description (again it will most likely be a better

doctor from a leading hospital system and possibly a PhD) you will hear just

that because that is what I have heard- and from a number now. And here's why

feeding your child the essential nutrients from whole food sources in theory is

so important for our population http://pursuitofresearch.org/science.html and

why I started http://www.wholefoodtherapy.com ;to let the world know it's

important for all. To eat is human but to digest is divine is something Dr.

Suhas just told me - he's one of the docs behind NV

http://pursuitofresearch.org/advisors.html

> >

> > =====

> >

[Guest guest]

Lori I'll get it in writing for you from the company. I was told it's water

soluble but if it was made as a liquid it would be fat soluble and know the

product is 100 percent natural and that no expense was spared in how this

product is manufactured. I can just go right to the source and ask again and

this time to get it in writing as I don't recall all the details and know little

about the various ways of manufacturing and really don't want to have to start

another line of research !!

I can tell you (and Lor think I have!) that Tanner gets a headache with ONE

200/200 alpha gamma fat soluble vitamin e capsule any of the few times I tried

to give that to him -and he has not had any headaches (and is doing amazing) on

NV and he is on SIX scoops a day- every day. In fact I can't even imagine

Tanner doing any better in any area as it's again across the board- and at this

point I have to expand http://pursuitofresearch.org/pursuit.html what is there.

I also know all his doctors and all my friends and at this point some very well

respected PhDs all over this country and the world outside of the world renowned

medical doctors behind it approved it. But will get something in writing when I

can -probably this week. Trust me -too much vitamin e was a concern to me and I

did check into it with the doctors and I am no longer concerned.

=====

[Guest guest]

Can you eat too much food with vitamin e in it too since NV is from whole foods?

Does water soluble have to do with that it is food that mixes with water? Kate

>

> Lori I'll get it in writing for you from the company. I was told it's water

soluble but if it was made as a liquid it would be fat soluble and know the

product is 100 percent natural and that no expense was spared in how this

product is manufactured. I can just go right to the source and ask again and

this time to get it in writing as I don't recall all the details and know little

about the various ways of manufacturing and really don't want to have to start

another line of research !!

>

> I can tell you (and Lor think I have!) that Tanner gets a headache with ONE

200/200 alpha gamma fat soluble vitamin e capsule any of the few times I tried

to give that to him -and he has not had any headaches (and is doing amazing) on

NV and he is on SIX scoops a day- every day. In fact I can't even imagine

Tanner doing any better in any area as it's again across the board- and at this

point I have to expand http://pursuitofresearch.org/pursuit.html what is there.

I also know all his doctors and all my friends and at this point some very well

respected PhDs all over this country and the world outside of the world renowned

medical doctors behind it approved it. But will get something in writing when I

can -probably this week. Trust me -too much vitamin e was a concern to me and I

did check into it with the doctors and I am no longer concerned.

>

> =====

>

[Guest guest]

I have not yet seen anything that cautions about eating foods with vitamin E. My

son has turned orange from too much carrot juice, and the doc says that's not

even a problem at all. My mom says I turned yellow from squash when I was a

baby.

I just want to reiterate that my doc's aunt who had liver damage was taking MEGA

doses of vitamin E and several others. I think we are right to ask these

questions and get a very clear picture of what kind and how much vitamin E our

kids get from these products, but I also trust 's intentions, 100%, to find

out and present what she knows. In the meantime, I'm going to keep using the NV

without too much concern. I know she trusts the docs she's consulted who say

it's okay. And I also know she doesn't blame us a bit for wanting it explained

as much as possible.

I also trust my doc, who says that my son's liver is okay for now, and that I

should merely check into into it very carefully and keep an eye on the vitamin

E.

> >

> > Lori I'll get it in writing for you from the company. I was told it's water

soluble but if it was made as a liquid it would be fat soluble and know the

product is 100 percent natural and that no expense was spared in how this

product is manufactured. I can just go right to the source and ask again and

this time to get it in writing as I don't recall all the details and know little

about the various ways of manufacturing and really don't want to have to start

another line of research !!

> >

> > I can tell you (and Lor think I have!) that Tanner gets a headache with ONE

200/200 alpha gamma fat soluble vitamin e capsule any of the few times I tried

to give that to him -and he has not had any headaches (and is doing amazing) on

NV and he is on SIX scoops a day- every day. In fact I can't even imagine

Tanner doing any better in any area as it's again across the board- and at this

point I have to expand http://pursuitofresearch.org/pursuit.html what is there.

I also know all his doctors and all my friends and at this point some very well

respected PhDs all over this country and the world outside of the world renowned

medical doctors behind it approved it. But will get something in writing when I

can -probably this week. Trust me -too much vitamin e was a concern to me and I

did check into it with the doctors and I am no longer concerned.

> >

> > =====

> >