No improvement on NV - up the dose?

October 16, 2010

I have a 4 year old that I suspect has apraxia (still in the process of getting

evaluated through school system)that has been on NV for 4 weeks now. He is also

on the fish oils (EPA and EFA). I honestly can't say that I have seen any

improvement at all. I've ordered another month's worth of NV because I really

want to give this a try. I've read about all the different areas the children

improve in, and I really don't see anything. Perhaps it is because he doesn't

seem to have any other delays/difficulties other than unintelligible speech and

a funky hand grip? His speech is very unclear and is mostly vowels. I'd love to

see the success that others are seeing. Anyone else not see any changes?

He is taking two level scoops/day currently. Should I try upping it to 2

mounded or heaping scoops/day? What's the daily limit for a 39lb 4yo?

Thanks,

Gwen

October 16, 2010

Gwen,

I'm sure will comment too. NV is water soluble so he will eliminate any his

body doesn't use. In my opinion, yes, I would raise him to 2 heaping scoops/day.

Many of my clients have had subtle changes at first and then had larger surges.

We've seen surges in speech intelligibility, fine motor, independence, gross

motor, etc. has it documented on the

http://pursuitofresearch.com/pursuit.html site.

Also make sure he is drinking enough fluids. His weight x .06 to get the amount

of fluids per day (regardless of NV use). If drinking caffeine, increase other

fluids.

Definitely continue the NV with heaping scoops & give it a few weeks.

Also, is he getting any PROMPT therapy at school or privately? If not, I highly

recommend it. It is very effective for kids with apraxia, as well as structured

oral placement exercises.

Email me off list if u have any therapy questions.

Warmest wishes,

Barbara A , M.S.,CCC-SLP

President,

Help Me Speak, LLC

www.helpmespeak.com

2500 Wallington Way

Suite 103

Marriottsville, MD 21104

410-442-9791

Ask me about NutriiVeda!

On Oct 16, 2010, at 7:39 AM, " Truth " <gwen2jason@...> wrote:

> I have a 4 year old that I suspect has apraxia (still in the process of

getting evaluated through school system)that has been on NV for 4 weeks now. He

is also on the fish oils (EPA and EFA). I honestly can't say that I have seen

any improvement at all. I've ordered another month's worth of NV because I

really want to give this a try. I've read about all the different areas the

children improve in, and I really don't see anything. Perhaps it is because he

doesn't seem to have any other delays/difficulties other than unintelligible

speech and a funky hand grip? His speech is very unclear and is mostly vowels.

I'd love to see the success that others are seeing. Anyone else not see any

changes?

>

> He is taking two level scoops/day currently. Should I try upping it to 2

mounded or heaping scoops/day? What's the daily limit for a 39lb 4yo?

>

> Thanks,

> Gwen

>

October 16, 2010

It's actually most of the parents working with doctors with the NV that have

taken the dosages higher and yes some 4 year olds are on 3 scoops ...but as you

can find in the archives -they were seeing dramatic surges at just the 2 -but

even more at the 3. There are a handful of cases where there are mild surges

and then it's raised and there are dramatic...but not sure if there are any

cases where it works after a month after seeing no changes at all.

Most of us start at level scoops and even without medical input for sure go to

heaping scoops. For sure yes I'd try the heaping scoops but if that doesn't

work- unless there is someone that comes forward that had surges after a month

(well other than the Demi story below -but there is a reason it took longer when

you read it) you may just be one of the parents it didn't work for.

First some questions just to make sure.

Has your child been regular? And change in amount or smell of stools?

Is your child on any other supplements (outside of essential fatty acids/fish

oils)

Is your child on medication?

What is your child's diagnosis? He has no other symptoms of anything other than

impaired speech? Has he been to a neurodevelopmental pediatrician- I mean there

needs to be a diagnosis as to why his speech is impaired and what do you mean by

" funky " hand grip? Can you give an example? Does he have any tonal issues in

the extremities do you know?

I'm sure you looked at the list here http://pursuitofresearch.org/pursuit.html

and not all are for speech- we are seeing surges in academics (even in preschool

age) as well as imaginative play -singing and humming that type of thing.

Sudden interest in books -sounding out letters and words- nothing like any of

that?

PLEASE do let us know what happens when you go to a heaping scoop -and the only

thing you want to watch is the protein level. For a 4 year old boy you'd want

him to have 35 to 105 grams of protein a day as part of a healthy diet

http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/nutrition-for-kids/nu00606 each level scoop is

10- so right now he's getting 20 grams. So no -raising it has not been an issue

due to that- and this; NV is a natural whole food product that is " clean "

meaning each food in it is tested free of heavy metals, herbicides and

pesticides- and all nutrients are from the foods in it. Water soluble means

your body won't store it -even though from the foods there is vitamin A and D

etc. -due to the powder form and the way it was developed by the world renowned

medical doctors behind it http://pursuitofresearch.org/advisors.html again it's

water soluble.

I have my fingers crossed for you that your story is like Demi's (which by the

way at 10 her child's doctor raised her up to 6 scoops a day)

I wanted to post something that my daughter has done. She has been on Nutriiveda

for a couple of months now but some of the months she had colds, then flus and

then colds again so progress has been slower. Anyway everyone around us has told

us she is more attentive and her level of understanding has increased. We have

noticed this and also that she is now really trying to say more and more words.

I hope I am not jinxing this by saying this.

She basically said single words and some two word combinations before Nutriiveda

but now is trying to say more. She is 10 years old.

A few huge things that have happened is last week she went to her therapeutic

horse back riding lesson and she said to the horse " walk on Arielle. " The

therapist there was so excited she could not wait to tell us. This is the

second 3 word sentence she has said on her own since we started Nutriiveda. The

first was " walk on horse. " She may say the words in isolation, when prompted

one by one but never on her own as a sentence and she could never say Arielle.

As well, when visitors come by after they have been there for a while and she

feels it is time for them to go, she takes them by the hand, takes them to the

door and tells them... " out " and " go home. " Everyone is just happy she is saying

something and taking the initiative so they abide by her request :-)

A couple of weeks ago my husband left some paper towel packages at the base of

the stairs in the basement. She went by herself and took them one by one and

went to the storage area and put them one by one on the shelf that we stack them

on. She would never had done this before. My husband went down stairs about 10

mins later to put them away and could not find them and then went into the

storage area as the door was still open and the light was still on and realized

she had just put them away. She went into the rec room after and there she was

relaxing watching some TV after she had finished putting the things away. My

husband just could not believe it.

All this is great and I think that for some kids it is not an overnight thing

but something that improves over time with the help of Nutriiveda. It seems like

it is repairing something and depending on what needs to be repaired it may take

longer for some. At least this is what I think may be happening.

Thanks,

Demi

http://pursuitofresearch.org/testimonials.html

=====

October 16, 2010

Thanks ,

No, I haven't noticed any difference in stools, as he was and remains regular.

He's not on any other supplements other than the fish oils and no medications

either. He has not been to a neurodevelopmental physician and has no diagnoses

at this point.

At nearly 2yo, we had him evaluated through early intervention and was told that

he didn't qualify. He had almost no words (but many approximations), but could

put 2 approximations of words together (such as " a oo " for thank you). Because

he understood everything and had over 100 signs, they seemed completely

unconcerned and assumed he would talk in time. His speech has gradually

improved in that time in sentence length and structure but not clarity. Now, at

age 4, I've come to realize that he is not going to start talking clearly

without therapy and have started the process of getting him speech therapy

through the school system. Next week, we get the results of the evaluation that

they did.

A friend describes listening to his speech as listening to a radio station that

is not quite tuned in. He speaks in complete sentences, tone and inflection are

appropriate, but it is unclear. Words will either be all vowels, or no ending

consonants, or he will often substitute one consonant for another ( " puk " instead

of pup). For the most part, grammar and syntax seems fine with the exception of

the pronoun " me " which he always uses instead of " I " (Me go backyard).

As for the pencil grip, he holds a pencil and eating utensils the way you would

hold a hand trowel to dig. The pencil is held against the palm. Even when a

pencil is put in his hands the correct way, he has difficulty keeping it in

position, as it flops forward. He has no difficulty with other fine motor

skills like stringing beads or playing with tiny toys. Gross motor skills seem

fine. He learned to ride a two wheeled bike on his 4th birthday without

training wheels. He jumps, climbs, runs, catches like any other 4 yo and even

better in some cases.

He has always loved books and knows all the letters of the alphabet and their

sounds but can not produce many of the sounds correctly. Even sounds that he

can say in isolation can not always be repeated in a word. Some sounds, like y,

he can in some words like " yes " , but not in isolation. When looking at his

mouth during speech, it almost appears as if he doesn't know where to put his

tongue. Sometimes it is of to one side or the other in a weird sort of way.

It's like he knows his tongue should be doing something, but has no idea what.

When you show him how to move his mouth to form sounds, he can usually follow

and repeat. For instance, I have to remind him to put his teeth on his bottom

lip for the " F " sound.

Sorry that got so long.

Gwen

>

> It's actually most of the parents working with doctors with the NV that have

taken the dosages higher and yes some 4 year olds are on 3 scoops ...but as you

can find in the archives -they were seeing dramatic surges at just the 2 -but

even more at the 3. There are a handful of cases where there are mild surges

and then it's raised and there are dramatic...but not sure if there are any

cases where it works after a month after seeing no changes at all.

>

> Most of us start at level scoops and even without medical input for sure go to

heaping scoops. For sure yes I'd try the heaping scoops but if that doesn't

work- unless there is someone that comes forward that had surges after a month

(well other than the Demi story below -but there is a reason it took longer when

you read it) you may just be one of the parents it didn't work for.

>

> First some questions just to make sure.

>

> Has your child been regular? And change in amount or smell of stools?

> Is your child on any other supplements (outside of essential fatty acids/fish

oils)

> Is your child on medication?

> What is your child's diagnosis? He has no other symptoms of anything other

than impaired speech? Has he been to a neurodevelopmental pediatrician- I mean

there needs to be a diagnosis as to why his speech is impaired and what do you

mean by " funky " hand grip? Can you give an example? Does he have any tonal

issues in the extremities do you know?

> I'm sure you looked at the list here http://pursuitofresearch.org/pursuit.html

and not all are for speech- we are seeing surges in academics (even in preschool

age) as well as imaginative play -singing and humming that type of thing.

Sudden interest in books -sounding out letters and words- nothing like any of

that?

>

> PLEASE do let us know what happens when you go to a heaping scoop -and the

only thing you want to watch is the protein level. For a 4 year old boy you'd

want him to have 35 to 105 grams of protein a day as part of a healthy diet

http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/nutrition-for-kids/nu00606 each level scoop is

10- so right now he's getting 20 grams. So no -raising it has not been an issue

due to that- and this; NV is a natural whole food product that is " clean "

meaning each food in it is tested free of heavy metals, herbicides and

pesticides- and all nutrients are from the foods in it. Water soluble means

your body won't store it -even though from the foods there is vitamin A and D

etc. -due to the powder form and the way it was developed by the world renowned

medical doctors behind it http://pursuitofresearch.org/advisors.html again it's

water soluble.

>

> I have my fingers crossed for you that your story is like Demi's (which by the

way at 10 her child's doctor raised her up to 6 scoops a day)

>

> I wanted to post something that my daughter has done. She has been on

Nutriiveda

> for a couple of months now but some of the months she had colds, then flus and

> then colds again so progress has been slower. Anyway everyone around us has

told

> us she is more attentive and her level of understanding has increased. We have

> noticed this and also that she is now really trying to say more and more

words.

> I hope I am not jinxing this by saying this.

>

> She basically said single words and some two word combinations before

Nutriiveda

> but now is trying to say more. She is 10 years old.

>

> A few huge things that have happened is last week she went to her therapeutic

> horse back riding lesson and she said to the horse " walk on Arielle. " The

> therapist there was so excited she could not wait to tell us. This is the

> second 3 word sentence she has said on her own since we started Nutriiveda.

The

> first was " walk on horse. " She may say the words in isolation, when prompted

> one by one but never on her own as a sentence and she could never say Arielle.

>

> As well, when visitors come by after they have been there for a while and she

> feels it is time for them to go, she takes them by the hand, takes them to the

> door and tells them... " out " and " go home. " Everyone is just happy she is

saying

> something and taking the initiative so they abide by her request :-)

>

> A couple of weeks ago my husband left some paper towel packages at the base of

> the stairs in the basement. She went by herself and took them one by one and

> went to the storage area and put them one by one on the shelf that we stack

them

> on. She would never had done this before. My husband went down stairs about 10

> mins later to put them away and could not find them and then went into the

> storage area as the door was still open and the light was still on and

realized

> she had just put them away. She went into the rec room after and there she was

> relaxing watching some TV after she had finished putting the things away. My

> husband just could not believe it.

>

> All this is great and I think that for some kids it is not an overnight thing

> but something that improves over time with the help of Nutriiveda. It seems

like

> it is repairing something and depending on what needs to be repaired it may

take

> longer for some. At least this is what I think may be happening.

>

> Thanks,

> Demi

> http://pursuitofresearch.org/testimonials.html

>

> =====

>

October 16, 2010

I just reread what I wrote and where I said he was evaluated by EI at nearly

2yo, it should read nearly 3 yo.

Gwen

> >

> > It's actually most of the parents working with doctors with the NV that have

taken the dosages higher and yes some 4 year olds are on 3 scoops ...but as you

can find in the archives -they were seeing dramatic surges at just the 2 -but

even more at the 3. There are a handful of cases where there are mild surges

and then it's raised and there are dramatic...but not sure if there are any

cases where it works after a month after seeing no changes at all.

> >

> > Most of us start at level scoops and even without medical input for sure go

to heaping scoops. For sure yes I'd try the heaping scoops but if that doesn't

work- unless there is someone that comes forward that had surges after a month

(well other than the Demi story below -but there is a reason it took longer when

you read it) you may just be one of the parents it didn't work for.

> >

> > First some questions just to make sure.

> >

> > Has your child been regular? And change in amount or smell of stools?

> > Is your child on any other supplements (outside of essential fatty

acids/fish oils)

> > Is your child on medication?

> > What is your child's diagnosis? He has no other symptoms of anything other

than impaired speech? Has he been to a neurodevelopmental pediatrician- I mean

there needs to be a diagnosis as to why his speech is impaired and what do you

mean by " funky " hand grip? Can you give an example? Does he have any tonal

issues in the extremities do you know?

> > I'm sure you looked at the list here

http://pursuitofresearch.org/pursuit.html and not all are for speech- we are

seeing surges in academics (even in preschool age) as well as imaginative play

-singing and humming that type of thing. Sudden interest in books -sounding out

letters and words- nothing like any of that?

> >

> > PLEASE do let us know what happens when you go to a heaping scoop -and the

only thing you want to watch is the protein level. For a 4 year old boy you'd

want him to have 35 to 105 grams of protein a day as part of a healthy diet

http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/nutrition-for-kids/nu00606 each level scoop is

10- so right now he's getting 20 grams. So no -raising it has not been an issue

due to that- and this; NV is a natural whole food product that is " clean "

meaning each food in it is tested free of heavy metals, herbicides and

pesticides- and all nutrients are from the foods in it. Water soluble means

your body won't store it -even though from the foods there is vitamin A and D

etc. -due to the powder form and the way it was developed by the world renowned

medical doctors behind it http://pursuitofresearch.org/advisors.html again it's

water soluble.

> >

> > I have my fingers crossed for you that your story is like Demi's (which by

the way at 10 her child's doctor raised her up to 6 scoops a day)

> >

> > I wanted to post something that my daughter has done. She has been on

Nutriiveda

> > for a couple of months now but some of the months she had colds, then flus

and

> > then colds again so progress has been slower. Anyway everyone around us has

told

> > us she is more attentive and her level of understanding has increased. We

have

> > noticed this and also that she is now really trying to say more and more

words.

> > I hope I am not jinxing this by saying this.

> >

> > She basically said single words and some two word combinations before

Nutriiveda

> > but now is trying to say more. She is 10 years old.

> >

> > A few huge things that have happened is last week she went to her

therapeutic

> > horse back riding lesson and she said to the horse " walk on Arielle. " The

> > therapist there was so excited she could not wait to tell us. This is the

> > second 3 word sentence she has said on her own since we started Nutriiveda.

The

> > first was " walk on horse. " She may say the words in isolation, when

prompted

> > one by one but never on her own as a sentence and she could never say

Arielle.

> >

> > As well, when visitors come by after they have been there for a while and

she

> > feels it is time for them to go, she takes them by the hand, takes them to

the

> > door and tells them... " out " and " go home. " Everyone is just happy she is

saying

> > something and taking the initiative so they abide by her request :-)

> >

> > A couple of weeks ago my husband left some paper towel packages at the base

of

> > the stairs in the basement. She went by herself and took them one by one and

> > went to the storage area and put them one by one on the shelf that we stack

them

> > on. She would never had done this before. My husband went down stairs about

10

> > mins later to put them away and could not find them and then went into the

> > storage area as the door was still open and the light was still on and

realized

> > she had just put them away. She went into the rec room after and there she

was

> > relaxing watching some TV after she had finished putting the things away. My

> > husband just could not believe it.

> >

> > All this is great and I think that for some kids it is not an overnight

thing

> > but something that improves over time with the help of Nutriiveda. It seems

like

> > it is repairing something and depending on what needs to be repaired it may

take

> > longer for some. At least this is what I think may be happening.

> >

> > Thanks,

> > Demi

> > http://pursuitofresearch.org/testimonials.html

> >

> > =====

> >

October 16, 2010

Oh girl we'll get you up to speed here!!! Yes you want the school to be

involved but no...they are not the ones you go to for the evaluation -please

don't leave it up to them alone! Clearly from what you wrote your child should

have been getting occupational therapy OT already. Funny thing about our kids

is that they do seem " normal " until they start getting older and not able to

keep up. Cognitive and receptive ability does not necessarily have anything to

do with diagnosis. In fact your child can be have a genius IQ and have impaired

speech. One has nothing to do with another and your child still needs a

diagnosis. That's why I didn't say developmental delay because the older they

get the less likely it's developmental. And the thing is the older they are

when you seek appropriate diagnosis and therapy the less time you have to get

them up to speed by kindergarten. Please consider not starting kindergarten

until your child is 6 years old -you have time and I have articles on that. So

yes your child does have something other than speech -speech impairment and some

type of gross motor issue -that's two things. And none of us are skilled to

know our kids have " nothing else " wrong. I can share first emails I sent to

grouplists about Tanner -completely normal except he couldn't talk. Ended up

Tanner had oral and verbal apraxia, hypotonia, motor planning deficits in the

body and sensory issues to name a few. Due to early intervention which it's not

too late for your babe to start- my son appears " normal " and has been

mainstreamed and a good student with an active social life since kindergarten.

About NV -I was looking for any improvements over what he already did..and in

regards to elimination was looking to see if his bowel movements have more of a

foul odor to them than normal -any increase in amount or times of day because

those would be signs of the natural detox from the casein free whey isolate.

And yes let us know if you go to heaping scoops if you notice any changes -if

you don't I'd stop it for a month or so...and I wouldn't start again until you

find a private SLP to work with for your son. It appears there are a few times

now where the professionals are able to notice the surges more than the parents

as odd as that sounds. And then again on the other hand it's possible you have

one of the only children NV isn't working for -but I wouldn't give up yet as the

success rate is that high.

But again main thing is we need to get you a diagnosis -and the school is not

going to do that. Without an outside evaluation your child will probably be

offered 2 or 3 times a week of group speech therapy -and that's probably what he

has now right? Depending upon your child's severity and diagnosis one on one

therapy may be appropriate.

Have you read The Late Talker book that I co authored? You need someone to help

you look over the IEP goals set by the school to tell you if they are

appropriate for your child.

Let us know what state or country you are in and we can see if as a group we can

offer suggestions of good private SLPs and for sure I'd take him for a

neuromedical exam as well with a pediatric neurologist or developmental

pediatrician to confirm or rule out any soft signs that the average parent

doesn't always notice -especially when young. The younger they are when they

get diagnosed and therapy -the better

=====

October 17, 2010

So the school won't give a diagnoses? From what they are saying so far, it

sounds like he will qualify for one-on-one therapy a few times a week, but not

the pre-school program. We have only had cheap short-term insurance due to a

job change for the last 6 mo, so that is the reason that I went with the school

system. Our regular insurance starts in Nov. and will try to get him in with a

speech therapist then.

I'd love to know the names of good therapists and physicians to evaluate him.

We live in the Hampton Roads area of Virginia. Virginia Beach to be exact, but

we are close to Norfolk and Chesapeake as well. I feel like I'm going in blind

as far as picking a therapist.

As for starting school, I wouldn't have started him at 5 anyway. We homeschool

and even my " normal " 7yo dd is technically a year behind because I opted her out

of kindergarten at 5 (while actually doing kindergarten at home). I plan to go

at his own pace

I read your book when my son was around 2 and again about a year ago, but I was

in serious denial at that point and need to go check it back out and read it

again.

I'll let everyone know if a heaping scoop will produce any changes soon.

Gwen

>

> Oh girl we'll get you up to speed here!!! Yes you want the school to be