MMR

[Guest guest]

Hi all!!!

Please check out the Letters to the Northland Age of today (12/2) when they

are posted on http://www.northnz.co.nz <http://www.northnz.co.nzoset>

Perhaps some of you would like to contribute a letter in reply to Coralie

Zimmer and Jarman?

Here is the letter Erwin Alber of VINE has sent:

Dear Editor,

Coralie Zimmer and Jarman defend the MMR-vaccine, Coralie on the

grounds that " the symptoms of autism appear around the time of vaccination,

but this does not automatically mean that one causes the other " . The US

Centre for Disease Control also states:

" Typically, symptoms of autism are first noted by

parents as their child begins to have difficulty with delays in speaking

after age one. MMR vaccine is first given to children at 12 to 15 months of

age. Therefore autism cases with an apparent onset within a few weeks after

MMR vaccination may simply be an expected but unrelated chance occurrence " .

Dr Wakefield, the specialist who first pointed to a possible link

between MMR and autism (and bowel disease) is unrepentant. Despite massive

criticism leading to his resignation of his position at the Royal Free

Hospital in London, he has the support of many parents caring for autistic

children. He says parental fears of a link between MMR and autism and bowel

disease have merit and that there is genuine ground for concern.

Dr Aitken, a specialist in the treatment of autism, believes there

is a clear link between autism and the MMR jab.

" When I was training, one in 2,500 [children were autistic]. Now it is one

in 250. At the moment, the only logical explanation for this is MMR, " he

said.

Here are (excerpts from) two letters we have received from New Zealand

parents:

" Damian was a very happy baby and progressed like any other, babbling,

chatting and playing like a normal baby boy. Then came the 15-month

vaccination, when he was injected with the measles vaccine in one leg and

the DPT-booster in the other.

Two days later he had a reaction, a high fever of 105 and a measles rash.

On his next visit the Plunket nurse commented on " very little chatter " , on

the visit at 20 months " no eye contact " and thought he had a hearing

problem. He continued to suffer from frequent fevers and at the age of two

Damian was diagnosed with autism at the Starship Hospital. When Damian was

4 we applied for compensation which ACC refused on the grounds of NO MEDICAL

EVIDENCE. "

" Nadia was born in March 1995, a beautiful, healthy little girl. We made

sure she received every vaccination as scheduled. When Nadia was 15 months

old she had the MMR and hepatitis B injections. She was grizzly and

unsettled afterwards and on the 7th day she had a rash over her whole little

body and a high temperature. Our GP said: " 5% of children react this way,

there is no reason to worry " and that she would report this reaction to the

Centre of Adverse Reaction Monitoring (CARM) in Dundedin. We now know that

this was not done. Nadia kept developing normally, but stopped putting on

weight and became more " picky " over what she would eat.

When she was 18 months old, she developed a fear of heights and of the bath,

even though she had loved water and baths; otherwise she seemed bright and

normal. She could say three or four sentences, but then she gradually

started losing her language and no longer seemed to understand a lot of what

was being said to her. Our GP said it was just a phase she was going

through.

At 21 months, Nadia was very sick. Her asthma which had developed at 13

months returned and she had two lots of ear infections and several lots of

antibiotics to clear them. While this was going on, the practice nurse at

our GP's clinic rung us more than once to remind us that Nadia's last lot

of vaccinations were due. I said to her: " Let us wait till Nadia is better

before we do it " .

In February 1997, Nadia was given her 4th DPTH and almost immediately

developed a very large lump on her leg. On the first day she really couldn't

walk at all and she limped for about 3 more days. Naturally we took her to

our GP who measured the red lump on her leg and said she would report this

reaction to the appropriate authorities. We later found out that this was

not done.

After that vaccination, Nadia deteriorated quickly before our eyes. She

started this horrible, high pitched screaming and strange behaviour like

opening and closing cupboard doors and turning electrical light switches on

and off continuously, turning her body sideways and lifting her arm up into

the air, and rocking back and forward on her feet. She stopped playing with

her toys and lost all interest in her surroundings. She was now 2 years

old, and almost mute, obviously disturbed, She weighed only 11.5 kg and

often we suspected her to be in pain.

Our GP referred her to a paediatrician, but the day before our appointment

Nadia didn't wake up in the morning. The diagnosis was nocturnal seizure

and now four months of real hell began. Nadia was put through a series of

tests - MRI scan, CT scan, lumbar puncture, 24 hour EEG. All the tests were

normal except the EEG which showed a left-sided dysfunction. We did mention

vaccine-damage at this time but were told this was excluded!!

She was finally diagnosed as having Landau-Kleffner Syndrome, an acquired

aphasia in childhood, with convulsive disorder and secondary disturbances -

no cause, no prognosis, no treatment. My husband and I are very exhausted

right now, trying to convince the medical profession that our little girl

was brain damaged as a result of being vaccinated. We wonder what the

future holds for Nadia. "

Erwin Alber

Vaccination Information Network

PO Box 149

Kaeo, Northland

Erwin suggests, you could send the following letter, but do please write

your own if you'd prefer.

Dear Editor,

Coralie Zimmer and Jarman's stance concerning the MMR-vaccine

appears to be widespread. A British Department of Health spokesman

insisted: " Parents who received payments after their children died following

MMR would not get the money now as science has moved on. MMR protects

against death and we stand by the fact that no child has died as a result of

MMR. "

The Sunday Express has revealed that at least 26 families claim their

children died as a result of the controversial measles, mumps and rubella

jab.

In some cases the Government has awarded parents up to £100,000 under

its 1979 Vaccine Damage Payment Act. In others, post mortem reports

concluded the jab was the most likely cause of death. Despite this, the

Department of Health insists no child has ever died from MMR. The parents

are now demanding an official inquiry into the deaths. "

, 40, whose daughter Stacey died, said: " The Government

should

take responsibility. It has never given proper warnings of the risk and

still doesn't despite the evidence. Tony Blair can see his children at home.

I have to visit my daughter at her grave. "

Experts writing in the Journal of Pediatrics concluded that of 48

children who reacted to the measles component of the jab, eight died and the

rest had seizures or brain damage. And a recent study on 1.8 million

children by the Finnish Health Board linked neurological reactions, allergic

attacks, epilepsy and meningitis to the vaccine.

Many of the families of children who have died have taken legal

action. Barr, of solicitors , has details of 24

cases. He said: " It is widely acknowledged in medical literature and by the

American government that the triple vaccine can, on rare occasions, kill,

yet this Government won't accept it. "

Jackie Fletcher, of the pressure group Jabs, which is trying to

highlight the potential dangers, said: " The Government should be giving

people full and accurate information about health risks. "

Francis's son, , began behaving abnormally two years after

he had MMR in January 1990. He lost control of his movements and slept for

18 hours at a time. Within months he fell into a coma and died in December.

, then seven, had developed a degenerative brain condition called SSPE

(sub-acute sclerosis pan encephalitis), linked to the measles component.

The disease can have a long incubation period and Mrs Francis, 40, an

auxiliary nurse and 's consultant think the vaccine was the only way

could have developed it. The family, from Easington, north Yorkshire,

are taking legal action against the vaccine's manufacturer.

Shipman was born in 1985 and was a healthy three-year-old when

he received the MMR vaccine. When he was nine his parents Elaine and

of Eastwood, Nottingham, noticed he was having problems with his balance and

co-ordination. He too was diagnosed with SSPE and died in June 1999, aged

14. They received £30,000 compensation.

His father, a lorry driver, said: " We took into hospital in

October 1994 and by Christmas he was in a wheelchair. We were told by the

consultant who treated him that his condition was caused by his

vaccination. "

In 1995 the Government's vaccine damage tribunal paid £30,000

compensation to , of Gateshead, for brain damage after he was

given MMR at the age of four. died nine years later aged 13. Biopsy

material taken from his brain and intestines will form a central plank of

the scientific evidence in support of a legal case due to be heard in

October next year. Up to 300 cases relate to this brand of vaccine -

Pluserix - which was banned by the Department of Health in 1992 after being

linked with meningitis. This was two years after an identical vaccine was

banned in Canada.

and Faye say the jab transformed their healthy, intelligent

son into a child needing round-the-clock care. It took them six years and

four hearings, however, to persuade the vaccine damage tribunal of this.

Faye, 59, said: " It's not about money, but truth. It's diabolical that

the Government refuses to acknowledge the risks of MMR. "

Judith Dwyer, 45, of Tongwynlaif, near Cardiff, received a payment

after her four-year-old daughter Chloe died following a " booster " jab in

1989. She too was given a version later banned because of its dangerous side

effects. Chloe developed pins and needles in her legs, then paralysis and

problems breathing. She was rushed to hospital but it was too late.

After an eight-year fight Judith, an intensive care technician,

persuaded a tribunal the jab was the likely cause of Chloe's death. In

September 1996 it accepted this and paid out.

Mother of two Judith said: " Health visitors called me a scare mongerer

and laughed. But we fought to raise the profile of vaccine damage. "

Stacey Berry, of Atherton, Manchester was 13 when she had a booster

jab in November 1994. Days later she started having fits, " stopped smiling,

and stared into space. "

She was diagnosed with the brain disease SSPE and given two years to

live. She died in November 2000, aged 19. A post mortem examination

concluded the disease was a " rare complication " of the vaccine " .

Coulter was 15 when he suffered a fit and died in his

sleep 10 days after being vaccinated. He had an unblemished health record

and no history of epilepsy but no explanation has been offered other than

the statement on his death certificate - " asphyxiation due to severe

epileptic seizure " . His mother Anne of Hillsborough, northern Ireland said:

" Nothing would replace , but I want answers. I want peace of mind

for my daughters should they ever have children. "

Hannah Buxton was 18 months old when she reacted to her first MMR jab.

She started having fits and died 18 months later in February 1992.

Parents Carol and Tony of Towcester, Northants, did not know Hannah

had been given the strain of vaccine later withdrawn after it was deemed

unsafe.

In March that year a tribunal blamed the vaccine for her death.

Nicola Gentle, 29, of Plymouth, Devon, is convinced her 15-month-old

baby Emma Jane died because of the triple vaccine she was given in September

1998. Within six hours she was on a life-support machine. Three days later

she was

brain dead but a coroner said he could not say for certain whether or not

MMR had killed her.

Shirley Fitzgerald's son Kieren was given the MMR jab in June 1991

when he was 14 months. He reacted within days. " He stopped smiling, laughing

and crying and became frightened of his toys, " said Shirley.

Kieren also developed bowel problems - linked to MMR by some

scientists. In July 1992, he died, aged two.

Toddler Harriet died following an MMR vaccination in 1998. Six

weeks later she suffered fits and died in her parents arms. and Pat

, of Peasedown St , near Bath, took the case to tribunal.

Jade Scrimger was vaccinated with MMR at 17 months and died from

meningitis three days later in October 1998. Her mother Sheena has since

discovered the drug used on her daughter was later banned by the Department

of Health because it caused meningitis.

She has abandoned the idea of taking legal action against the vaccine

manufacturers, however, because lawyers say it is not worth it. In Britain

the maximum award for a child's death is £7,500.

Five days after Elaine Adam's 16-month-old son Stevie was given the

MMR vaccine 1991 he too developed meningitis and died.

Elaine and her husband , of East Kilbride, were convinced MMR

was to blame but their fears were dismissed by doctors. Mrs Adam has refused

to allow her second child, Terry, six, to have the jab.

___________________

Also, he adds that the February issue of (New Zealand) Healthy Options

features a letter by Margaret Dalton of the Immunisation Advisory Centre

(IMAC again) in which she quotes the following from the Reference Guide on

Vaccines and Vaccine Safety by the US National partnership for Immunisation

2001:

" Scientific studies have not provided evidence to support a causal

relationship between DPT immunisation and serious acute neurological illness

resulting in permanent neurological injury " .

You may wish to comment!

editorial@...

[Guest guest]

In the US there is usually a second booster around five or six. Many

people get titer levels checked. If they are adequate you don't need

the booster.

The problem with this is, the so called people they talk about not

making antibodies even after the vaccine, can happen to anyone. You

can have any vaccine repeatedly and still not be protected from the

disease.

> Can a child be vaccinated using single vaccines for Measles, Mumps

and

> Rubella after a combined MMR vaccine?

[Guest guest]

Glad that Sammy had a good eye check and good luck on getting those

injections further apart. The info on the MMR is great. I never would

have thought of that. Hugs, Michele ( 17, pauci & spondy)

MMR

Hi All,

Just wanted to mention that if your child is due for an MMR booster and

you

have concerns about whether it's okay for them to have the

immunization, the

next time you have his or her labwork done, request that they also run

the

tests to check the titers for measles, mumps and rubella.

Sammy was supposed to have the booster shot as part of her kindergarten

entrance shots, but can't since she's on Humira. She got a doctor's

note

excusing her, but at her pediatrician's suggestion we also had her

titers checked,

and they indicated that the initial doses given to her when she was a

baby

have probably given her sufficient immunity already. It helped with my

peace of

mind to know that as the thought of her entering elementary school

unprotected against potentially serious diseases while on drugs that

suppressed her

immune system had me worried.

BTW, we had an eye appt. today, and although her pressures are creeping

back

up a bit, there was no sign of inflammation and we'd finished tapering

down

her steroid drops to the minimal maintenance dose (Pred Mild twice a day

which

is the equivalent of 1/4 drop of Pred Forte daily) two weeks ago.

Hooray!

I guess the next step will be lengthening the interval between Humira

injections from 10 to 14 days. Please wish us luck!

--Lori (Sammy, 5, pauci/uveitis)

[Guest guest]

If you can re-snag the URL to the CDC concerning WRV then please do post it.

This would be interesting.

Unless I'm mistaken the MMR is a live, attenuated virus vaccine. I think that

means that the virus is, indeed, live, but incapable of reproducing for more

than one generation or so. The strains are supposed to be the same old

laboratory ones used in vaccination brews since the 1950s or so.

Needless to say, Wakefield's discovery of measles colonies in gut biopsies and

in the cerebral spinal fluid of autistic children seems to fly in the face of

attenuation claims. I think, Wakefield had them measles PCR'd (a sort of genetic

or DNA test) and they were vaccine-strain positive.

-------------- Original message --------------

From: angela <angelashelley29@...>

I read the other day on the CDC website that wild rubella virus is one of the

known causes of autism. Is this true? Is the MMR vaccine live? If it is then

how hard is it to conceive that the MMR vaccine may lead to autism? I'm

confused.

---------------------------------

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[Guest guest]

I think this may be a case of if something doesn't make sense it should be

thrown out.

I did not find any particular web site for the rubella infection that clearly

states that autism and pre-natal rubella (German Measles) infection are related

to each other. I did find something termed congenital rubella syndrome.

Here is a clinical description of congenital rubella syndrome:

An illness, usually manifesting in infancy, resulting from rubella infection in

utero and characterized by signs or symptoms from the following categories:

Cataracts/congenital glaucoma, congenital heart disease (most commonly patent

ductus arteriosus or peripheral pulmonary artery stenosis), loss of hearing,

pigmentary retinopathy.

Purpura, splenomegaly, jaundice, microcephaly, mental retardation,

meningoencephalitis, radiolucent bone disease.

There's nothing in any of this to really suggest autism is necessarily an

outcome of rubella infection in pregnant women.

Add in some background for CRS:

The number of reported cases of congenital rubella syndrome in the United States

has declined more than 97.4% from 77 cases in 1970 to a total of 2 cases in

1996. Between 1990 and 1996, 92 cases of CRS have been reported to the National

Congenital Rubella Syndrome Registry. Of these cases, 75 (82%) were indigenous,

and 17 (18%) were imported.

Here are some thoughts:

If pre-natal rubella infection causes autism then it doesn't make sense that

cases of congenital rubella syndrome declined to a total of 2 cases in 1996,

while autism was on the rise in the same time frame. In some cases states have

seen a 5X digit increase in autism diagnosis since the early 1990s.

If pre-natal rubella infection is a known cause of autism then certainly a

pretty major outbreak of rubella among pregnant women was missed by the CDC

entirely beginning in the early 1990s.

If pre-natal rubella infection causes autism, which has been in epidemic

proportions for many years, then certainly it seems that vaccinating lots of

women in their childbearing years would be logical.

http://www.deafblind.com/crs.html

-------------- Original message --------------

From: angela <angelashelley29@...>

Here it is..

http://www.cdc.gov/nip/vacsafe/concerns/autism/autism-mmr.htm#2

The part I'm reffering to is under # 6.

" Ironically, infection of pregnant woman with " wild " rubella virus is one of

the few known causes of autism. "

---------------------------------

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used cars.

[Guest guest]

I wonder which vaccine manufacturer paid for the studies to which they refer?

Sounds like the whole thing is an attempt to discredit Wakefield and protect the

MMR vaccine manufacturer.

S S

<tt>

Here it is..<BR>

   <BR>

  <a

href= " http://www.cdc.gov/nip/vacsafe/concerns/autism/autism-mmr.htm#2 " >http://ww\

w.cdc.gov/nip/vacsafe/concerns/autism/autism-mmr.htm#2</a><BR>

   <BR>

  The part I'm reffering to is under # 6. <BR>

   <BR>

  " Ironically, infection of pregnant woman with " wild " rubella virus is one of

the few known causes of autism. "    <BR>

_______________________________________________

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[Guest guest]

It's not only the children who bottom out with the MMR. Our

workplace, a large hospital, began requiring an MMR update with

yearly screening a couple of years ago. Three coworkers ended up

with arthritic response. One, a surgeon, could not operate for many

weeks and was on steroids etc. That surgeon is now on indeterminate

leave with leukemia. Yet, no one sees the connection.

> >

> > My NT 16 year old daughter told me her PE teacher's 3 year old

son

> was

> > diagnosed with autism on Tuesday. Happy Holidays, right? I have

no

> > idea on the severity but why does this continue to happen if the

> > mercury has been removed from the childhood vaccines?

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Speaking of MMR can someone point me to some biomed information

specifically for autism due to the MMR vaccine? I couldn't find

anything specific to the MMR.

I am almost 100% certain my 13 year old non- verbal son's autism was

caused by the MMR. His 2001 brain MRI shows " the possibility of post

vaccinations autoimmune demyelination as well as atypical Subacute

sclerosing panencephalitis (SSPE). " SSPE is an altered form of the

measles virus attacking the brain – in it's true form. Add his 105

degree fever and regression after his MMR shot to the mystery and it

doesn't seem like much of a mystery any longer.

We did the Cutler ALA chelation protocol for about 8 months and have

not seen any results and I just think I am barking up the wrong tree.

Thanks

Mark

> > >

> > > My NT 16 year old daughter told me her PE teacher's 3 year old

> son

> > was

> > > diagnosed with autism on Tuesday. Happy Holidays, right? I

have

> no

> > > idea on the severity but why does this continue to happen if

the

> > > mercury has been removed from the childhood vaccines?

> > >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

>

> Speaking of MMR can someone point me to some biomed information

> specifically for autism due to the MMR vaccine? I couldn't find

> anything specific to the MMR.

Try here

http://www.sarnet.org/lib/DTbriefing2006.htm

http://www.ima.org.il/imaj/ar99nov11.pdf

> We did the Cutler ALA chelation protocol for about 8 months and have

> not seen any results and I just think I am barking up the wrong tree.

Have you tried high dose vitamin A protocol?

http://www.danasview.net/vitamina.htm

Dana

[Guest guest]

My son had the same problems immediately following his MMR/ varicella. high

temp and a terrible night of screams and jerking ... i knew something was

seriously wrong ... he regressed immediately into autism and his MRI showed

encephalitis of his brain and so its extremely obvious to me what caused his

autism.

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

The book " Evidence of Harm " has some information I think. As did Dr.

McCandless' book Starving Brains in relation to MMR vaccine and

finding the actual virus dna matched to the vaccine strain in the

colons of autistic children.

> > > >

> > > > My NT 16 year old daughter told me her PE teacher's 3 year

old

> > son

> > > was

> > > > diagnosed with autism on Tuesday. Happy Holidays, right? I

> have

> > no

> > > > idea on the severity but why does this continue to happen if

> the

> > > > mercury has been removed from the childhood vaccines?

> > > >

> > >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Do a search on Wakefield.

S S

<p>The book " Evidence of Harm " has some information I think. As did

Dr. <br>

McCandless' book Starving Brains in relation to MMR vaccine and <br>

finding the actual virus dna matched to the vaccine strain in the <br>

colons of autistic children.<br>

<br>

><br>

> Speaking of MMR can someone point me to some biomed information <br>

> specifically for autism due to the MMR vaccine? I couldn't find <br>

> anything specific to the MMR.<br>

> <br>

> I am almost 100% certain my 13 year old non- verbal son's autism <br>

was <br>

> caused by the MMR. His 2001 brain MRI shows " the possibility of <br>

post <br>

> vaccinations autoimmune demyelination as well as atypical Subacute <br>

> sclerosing panencephalitis (SSPE). " SSPE is an altered form of the <br>

> measles virus attacking the brain – in it's true form. Add his 105 <br>

> degree fever and regression after his MMR shot to the mystery and <br>

it <br>

> doesn't seem like much of a mystery any longer.<br>

> <br>

> We did the Cutler ALA chelation protocol for about 8 months and <br>

have <br>

> not seen any results and I just think I am barking up the wrong <br>

tree.<br>

> <br>

> Thanks<br>

> <br>

> Mark<br>

_______________________________________________

Join Excite! - http://www.excite.com

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[Guest guest]

Look into the High Dose Vit-A protocol.

_____

From: [mailto: ]

On Behalf Of April Skotnicki

Sent: Wednesday, December 20, 2006 8:56 AM

Subject: [ ] Re: MMR

My son had the same problems immediately following his MMR/ varicella. high

temp and a terrible night of screams and jerking ... i knew something was

seriously wrong ... he regressed immediately into autism and his MRI showed

encephalitis of his brain and so its extremely obvious to me what caused his

autism.

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

>

> I am almost 100% certain my 13 year old non- verbal son's autism was

> caused by the MMR.

Have you tried any antiviral regimens? LDN?

Nell

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 2/9/07 1:16:27 PM Pacific Standard Time,

dgarza@... writes:

> I wonder if 3 separate vaccines would be the best way to approach this.

> Single dose vials. And maybe even wait until she's older. The CDC says there

> is no thimerisol in the MMR, but would that mean no " reported " thimerisol

> (for multiple use vaccine), some small amount that they don't have to

> report? I'm just fishing for info and advice!

If you don't want to give the vaccine the is another way to get around it.

The Rubella part of the vaccine is made not from chickens but from an aborted

human fetus. Many of the newer vaccines are. People can and have taken a

religious exception for this vaccine. Even if you don't believe in the religious

exemption they are less likely to fight you on it then if you give the doctors

that as the reason.

http://www.cogforlife.org/vaxexempt.htm

http://www.immunize.org/concerns/vaticandocument.htm

The two documents are specifically about rubella but there is more info on

the respective websites.

Colleen

[Guest guest]

We have not vaccinated our daughter ( age 2) with the MMR. Nor will we do

so until she is about 8 or so. We kept her pretty well isolated from others (no

mall, crowded areas, we had water jugs in the car with hand soap to wash before

we unbuckled or touched her, etc.) when she was an infant. When they are

younger, (2-6 ish) the effects of the illness are not as bad as when they are

teenagers or adults. We'll have passed several crucial developmental/cognitive

milestones by that point in time. However, when we do finally get her these

shots, it will be done one at a time, not in a cocktail of all three. But then

any time she is sick she immediately goes to the doctor, and her pediatrician is

well aware that she is without vaccines.

Re: Autism chances in second child

Hi ,

I We did not follow the pediatricians

recommended schedule. At 15 months when it was time for the MMR we

first were going to seperate the vaccine and give them separately

over several months but then decided to forgo further vaccinations

altogether on the advice of DD's DAN!

.

<http://geo./serv?s=97359714/grpId=3297531/grpspId=1705061616/msgId

=101744/stime=1171044100/nc1=3848645/nc2=4025377/nc3=3>

[Guest guest]

Drea

With the MMR it isn't mercury that you need to worry about but rather

the viruses themselves, along with all the other nasty stuff (toxins

and such), contained in the vaccine. For many kids instead of

boosting the immune system, it overwhelms and detroys the immune

system.

Chronic viral infections are very common in our kids and they can be

difficult to overcome. You may want to consider this and really do a

lot of research before agreeing to the MMR for your child.

Sheresa

>

> , and others,

>

> My daughter has not yet had her MMR vaccine (or her second MMR?).

She's 3

> years old. When we were at the pediatrician, they were all out of

the

> vaccine. I am reluctant to continue vaccinations with her, but my

husband is

> very worried about immigration and people from other countries

bringing

> disease with them. We live in Arizona where we have alot of

immigrants from

> Mexico. He brings up a very good point. Do any of you worry about

this sort

> of thing by not vaccinating your child(ren)? Or do you beleive that

you are

> strengthening their immune systems so they are able to fight the

virus that

> causes measles or mumps?

>

> I wonder if 3 separate vaccines would be the best way to approach

this.

> Single dose vials. And maybe even wait until she's older. The CDC

says there

> is no thimerisol in the MMR, but would that mean no " reported "

thimerisol

> (for multiple use vaccine), some small amount that they don't have

to

> report? I'm just fishing for info and advice!

>

> Drea

>

> _____

>

> From:

> [mailto: ] On Behalf Of genuine4321

> Sent: Friday, February 09, 2007 11:00 AM

>

> Subject: Re: Autism chances in second child

>

>

>

> Hi ,

>

> I We did not follow the pediatricians

> recommended schedule. At 15 months when it was time for the MMR we

> first were going to seperate the vaccine and give them separately

> over several months but then decided to forgo further vaccinations

> altogether on the advice of DD's DAN!

>

> .

>

> <http://geo./serv?

s=97359714/grpId=3297531/grpspId=1705061616/msgId

> =101744/stime=1171044100/nc1=3848645/nc2=4025377/nc3=3>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Drea, I can understand your concern regarding exposure. In CT where

I live, an unvaccinated child cannot go to school when there is an

outbreak of any of the viruses that they are not vaccinated for

until that risk is past, I think the standard is 10 days. I am

comfortable with that procedure and overall I think the chances of

exposure is very small anyway. I agree with Sheresa's post regarding

the toxins and the virus itself being the problem. Thimerosal

compounds that problem.

If you really feel you must vaccinate then definitely do single dose

vaccinations and give vitamin A and vitamin C. Here is a vaccine

recommendation schedule from my DAN! doctor's website.

http://www.avontherapeuticcenter.com/vaccinerecommendations3.html

> >

> > , and others,

> >

> > My daughter has not yet had her MMR vaccine (or her second

MMR?).

> She's 3

> > years old. When we were at the pediatrician, they were all out

of

> the

> > vaccine. I am reluctant to continue vaccinations with her, but

my

> husband is

> > very worried about immigration and people from other countries

> bringing

> > disease with them. We live in Arizona where we have alot of

> immigrants from

> > Mexico. He brings up a very good point. Do any of you worry

about

> this sort

> > of thing by not vaccinating your child(ren)? Or do you beleive

that

> you are

> > strengthening their immune systems so they are able to fight the

> virus that

> > causes measles or mumps?

> >

> > I wonder if 3 separate vaccines would be the best way to

approach

> this.

> > Single dose vials. And maybe even wait until she's older. The

CDC

> says there

> > is no thimerisol in the MMR, but would that mean no " reported "

> thimerisol

> > (for multiple use vaccine), some small amount that they don't

have

> to

> > report? I'm just fishing for info and advice!

> >

> > Drea

> >

> > _____

> >

> > From:

> > [mailto: ] On Behalf Of

genuine4321

> > Sent: Friday, February 09, 2007 11:00 AM

> >

> > Subject: Re: Autism chances in second child

> >

> >

> >

> > Hi ,

> >

> > I We did not follow the pediatricians

> > recommended schedule. At 15 months when it was time for the MMR

we

> > first were going to seperate the vaccine and give them

separately

> > over several months but then decided to forgo further

vaccinations

> > altogether on the advice of DD's DAN!

> >

> > .

> >

> > <http://geo./serv?

> s=97359714/grpId=3297531/grpspId=1705061616/msgId

> > =101744/stime=1171044100/nc1=3848645/nc2=4025377/nc3=3>

> >

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Drea,

We have a 7yr grandson who was lead/mercury toxic at age 2. He was

behind on all immunizations[thank heavens!] due to constant illness.

He's had no vaccines since those early ones. He lives in a big city

and goes to school with a very diverse population-no trouble so far.

His younger brother who will begin K in fall 2007 has had NO

vaccines. He's the healthiest of our 5 grandchildren. He currently

is in pre-school part-time, also with very diverse population.

We all went through the typical childhood illnesses in our large

family in the 50's-60's. Measles and mumps were no fun but not life

threatening. At one point, whooping cough came around. All but the

baby had been fully vaccinated - however, all 9 of us[ages 3mos to

10 yrs] came down with it. That's not saying much for vaccine

efficacy.

> > >

> > > , and others,

> > >

> > > My daughter has not yet had her MMR vaccine (or her second

> MMR?).

> > She's 3

> > > years old. When we were at the pediatrician, they were all out

> of

> > the

> > > vaccine. I am reluctant to continue vaccinations with her, but

> my

> > husband is

> > > very worried about immigration and people from other countries

> > bringing

> > > disease with them. We live in Arizona where we have alot of

> > immigrants from

> > > Mexico. He brings up a very good point. Do any of you worry

> about

> > this sort

> > > of thing by not vaccinating your child(ren)? Or do you beleive

> that

> > you are

> > > strengthening their immune systems so they are able to fight

the

> > virus that

> > > causes measles or mumps?

> > >

> > > I wonder if 3 separate vaccines would be the best way to

> approach

> > this.

> > > Single dose vials. And maybe even wait until she's older. The

> CDC

> > says there

> > > is no thimerisol in the MMR, but would that mean no " reported "

> > thimerisol

> > > (for multiple use vaccine), some small amount that they don't

> have

> > to

> > > report? I'm just fishing for info and advice!

> > >

> > > Drea

> > >

> > > _____

> > >

> > > From:

> > > [mailto: ] On Behalf Of

> genuine4321

> > > Sent: Friday, February 09, 2007 11:00 AM

> > >

> > > Subject: Re: Autism chances in second child

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Hi ,

> > >

> > > I We did not follow the pediatricians

> > > recommended schedule. At 15 months when it was time for the

MMR

> we

> > > first were going to seperate the vaccine and give them

> separately

> > > over several months but then decided to forgo further

> vaccinations

> > > altogether on the advice of DD's DAN!

> > >

> > > .

> > >

> > > <http://geo./serv?

> > s=97359714/grpId=3297531/grpspId=1705061616/msgId

> > > =101744/stime=1171044100/nc1=3848645/nc2=4025377/nc3=3>

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

[Guest guest]

Hello all,

The misconception here (in other words, the lies we've been told) is

that these diseases are untreatable and that we will probably die from

them if we catch them. While I don't doubt that immigrants could pose a

problem, these diseases ARE treatable. BUT, most Dr.s will not tell you

this! Why?? Because it is homeopathy that has been able (for the past

200 years!!) to cure people from these awful illnesses! Because of the

controversy that exists in this country between allopathy and

homeopathy, most of us are completely in the dark about the

possibilities that homeopathy holds.

Here is a link to an online classes that you can take that can help you

understand the risks involved in vaccinations and also the ways that

these diseases can be treated IF you happen to get them!!

http://www.nccn.net/~wwithin/vaccineclass.htm

<http://www.nccn.net/%7Ewwithin/vaccineclass.htm>

http://www.nccn.net/~wwithin/vaccineclass.htm

Sorry to sound so passionate, but I believe that both of my boys were

poisoned by vaccines, and I am very strongly against them!!

Sincerely,

Susie, mom to Corbin and

[Guest guest]

Thank you to everyone for your opinions, advice and links on MMR!

Drea

<http://geo./serv?s=97359714/grpId=3297531/grpspId=1705061616/msgId

=101764/stime=1171065570/nc1=1/nc2=2/nc3=3>

[Guest guest]

I just wanted to chime in about the MMR issue? Or risk of having another

child with autism. I have 2 children, the oldest(6)has mild autism and the

youngest(4), has developmental delay because of recurrent ear infections. When

my son

was born(he is the youngest) my daughter had yet to be diagnosed with autism.

The only thing that I did differently was vaccinations. Once, I found out

there could possibly be a link, my son did not receive any more. The last one

he

received was the chicken pox one. He has not received any MMR or anything

after that. As far as I am concerned, he, nor my daughter will not receive any

more. I truly believe that if he would have had all his vaccinations on schedule

he would be adhd or have autism. I shudder to even think about it. My

suggestion is to just research like crazy the pros and cons so that you and your

family can come to a decision that is best for your situation. Good luck!

Ginger

[Guest guest]

Drea,

Interesting information here: _http://www.whale.to/v/rapp.html_

(http://www.whale.to/v/rapp.html)

Good luck you you~

[Guest guest]

Hi group!! Looks like I missed some posting but the MMR heading

really caught my attention and I need to state my feelings

on " again " !! My son was severely affected by his vac's, with the

last round at 5 being the most obvious/severe and him ending up in

hospital within minutes after!!(I compared his past shot records

with medical records and was so shakin to realize that each time a

new medical issue arose within a month of each round, the affects

are usually slow/suttle and most dont connect the 2, vac's/medical

issues) This time was hell for him for several months after and much

improvement with natural supplementing/healing(still recovery

needed). He was so bad he stopped growing, stopped walking

(completely lost muscle strength/use), much pain daily, he was

wasteing away befor our eyes. Also want to let everyone know that

when it comes to vac's, there is a lot of denial out there in the

medical community and therefor my son suffered much more than he

should have!! So for those considering vac's, be prepared to deal

with it pretty much alone if issues arise from them!!! I am

extriemest when it comes to not vaccinating and dont want to upset

or offend anyone. My son started to show sighns of blindness around

1mth, was diagnosed blind by 6mths(induced by 1st hospital vac B, I

believe), during these few months, deteriating muscle strength,

constipation(DTaP, worse with each round), Seizures started just

after first MMR shot, kidney issues, nonverbal, gi damaged, severe

spectrum, viral infections over and over, etc!! Proud to announce

his vision slowly returned(healing from viral/toxin affects I

believe)!!! I became obssesed with researching on the vac subject

and have come to realize they are worthless when it comes to

protecting against most disease and just is causing a medical

epedimic in our country but making some very wealthy(2nd biggest

money maker in the world, flouride is toxic and up there also).

Please research on the Amish(they dont vaccinate) and are very

healthy. This is due to pure foods(non chemical) and not vaccinating

(toxins and viral). Our bodies are made to overcome these diseases

naturally and then immune for life. They do have a child that is

spectrum but this child was brought in to the community after being

vaccinated. This concerns me due to I suspect vac affects/health may

be contageous!! This has been shown in studies with families with

spectrum children and then health issues triggering with close

family members(just slow progression/not obvious). Measles is being

found in the intestinal track of spectrum children(this is possibly

from the vacs themselves). Please take time to research this subject

on vac's and use high caution!! If vaccinating is a deciession,

please strengthen the immune with lots of vitamin C, garlic etc.

Here is an interesting article, pay close attention to section 6 and

7(is it possible polio still exsists???)!! Sorry to those who have

had to listen to this more than once, but it was almost tragic for

our family and is still hard for me to not talk about(this is how I

have been able to deal with it)!! Wish someone one would have told

me about all this 18yrs ago(oldest daughter, arthritis diagnoses as

teen/gi issues, add, older son adhd, both had severe colic(1st

obvious clue), vac induced etc.)Also, they succeeded in the bird flu

scare and made billions again this year. The flu vac is worthless

against flu(most all flu is bird disease anyways and the vac is only

supposidly good against a couple of them(I doubt this also) and

there is hundreds of flu's out there! Most I know who got the flu

vac ended up very sick with flu anyways! If there was an epedimic

desease arising then I could almost understand a possible need, even

though I would strongly doubt the affects of. Jennie<><

http://thinktwice.com/Polio.pdf

>

> I just wanted to chime in about the MMR issue? Or risk of having

another

> child with autism. I have 2 children, the oldest(6)has mild autism

and the

> youngest(4), has developmental delay because of recurrent ear

infections. When my son

> was born(he is the youngest) my daughter had yet to be diagnosed

with autism.

> The only thing that I did differently was vaccinations. Once, I

found out

> there could possibly be a link, my son did not receive any more.

The last one he

> received was the chicken pox one. He has not received any MMR or

anything

> after that. As far as I am concerned, he, nor my daughter will not

receive any

> more. I truly believe that if he would have had all his

vaccinations on schedule

> he would be adhd or have autism. I shudder to even think about it.

My

> suggestion is to just research like crazy the pros and cons so

that you and your

> family can come to a decision that is best for your situation.

Good luck!

>

>

> Ginger

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

You will get better from Mumps measles and rubella without any treatment

whatsever. A child in good health, well nourished and with medic al

facilities available is extremely unlikely to die or suffer any ill

effects whatsoever. In the undeveloped world these diseases are killers

but not in the first world. Some children can suffer badly (and die)

from measles encephalitis which is measles getting into the brain. But

they are a small proportion. Your own body and immunity system is

overwhelmingly likely to be able to deal with all three. Immigrants have

nothing to do with anything.

Sally Eva (UK)

Susie Baxter wrote:

>

> Hello all,

> The misconception here (in other words, the lies we've been told) is

> that these diseases are untreatable and that we will probably die from

> them if we catch them. While I don't doubt that immigrants could pose a

> problem, these diseases ARE treatable. BUT, most Dr.s will not tell you

> this! Why?? Because it is homeopathy that has been able (for the past

> 200 years!!) to cure people from these awful illnesses! Because of the

> controversy that exists in this country between allopathy and

> homeopathy, most of us are completely in the dark about the

> possibilities that homeopathy holds.

> Here is a link to an online classes that you can take that can help you

> understand the risks involved in vaccinations and also the ways that

> these diseases can be treated IF you happen to get them!!

> http://www.nccn. net/~wwithin/ vaccineclass. htm

> <http://www.nccn.net/%7Ewwithin/vaccineclass.htm>

> <http://www.nccn. net/%7Ewwithin/ vaccineclass. htm

> <http://www.nccn.net/%7Ewwithin/vaccineclass.htm>>

> http://www.nccn. net/~wwithin/ vaccineclass. htm

> <http://www.nccn.net/%7Ewwithin/vaccineclass.htm>

> Sorry to sound so passionate, but I believe that both of my boys were

> poisoned by vaccines, and I am very strongly against them!!

> Sincerely,

> Susie, mom to Corbin and

>

>

> ------------------------------------------------------------------------

>

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21:04

>