NV question

November 5, 2010

Hi Bibi!

I would say to start then with just a pinch But...you just may have to wait

until school is out and you are able to be alone with him to watch and find out

why he is becoming so hyper and where he bites and hits. For those here that

don't know I just want to fill in background that your child is ten years old,

diagnosed with autism, and he also became hyper on fish oils to the point that

family members make you stop them.

No matter what I'd stop the NV right now- even if you do decide to start

honestly with no more than a pinch and S.L.O.W.L.Y. work up from there to 2

pinches etc. Question for you...if you are alone with him and he's hyper due to

fish oils or NV- does he try to bite or hit you? Does he ever try to bite when

not on any supplements ever? Do you believe the biting is due to frustration

because from all I read as speech increases biting should fade. Let me know.

I do hope that together we can figure out a way to help! When do you have the

next school break? I don't know how the schools work in the UK.

Here's some good info on biting from a UK autism site since that's where you are

which provides reasons and suggestions for biting as well as resources.

Perhaps follow up with some of the professionals/organizations listed below and

bring the NV and get their opinion? Based on Horlicks it doesn't make sense

that he can consume something that high in sugar with no negative reaction and

yet have such dramatic changes on something so healthy with essential nutrients.

I'm odd in that I don't see negative behavior as " bad " because honestly to me

any change means something is going on...but you just have to see if you can

work around this in a way that is safe for him and all around him (which again

to me means try again when he's not in school -but first let me know if he tries

to hit you or your family)

~~~~~~~~~~~~~

This information sheet aims to provide general information on biting behaviour

in individuals with an autism spectrum disorder (ASD), as well as making some

suggestions on possible responses to this type of behaviour.

Possible reasons for biting

* Communication difficulties: for individuals who may not be able to

communicate their wants, needs, and emotional states effectively, biting can be

an extremely effective way of letting others know that something is not right,

and is therefore a very useful and powerful form of communication.

* Learned behaviour: we all learn from experiences that we have had and we

use this information to determine how to behave in the future. If we find that

behaving in a particular way brings about a good outcome for us (by either

reducing or stopping an undesirable experience or increasing a desirable one)

then we are more likely to behave that way again in the future. Some individuals

might also appreciate the physical or emotional reaction of others in response

to biting. The individual may enjoy the sound of a raised voice or the sense of

control created by behaving in a way which brings a predictable reaction from

others (Clements and Zarkowska, 2000).

* Frustration or distress: sometimes biting can be an expression of sheer

frustration or distress in response to a range of different stressors and

challenging situations. It is important to remember that life can be

exceptionally overwhelming at times for individuals with an ASD and that

sometimes, the person may engage in a behaviour (such as biting) that is a

response to this.

* An attempt to gain sensory input: many people with an ASD experience

sensory difficulties, so it can be helpful to consider the possible sensory

functions of particular behaviours. Chewing and biting are proprioceptive

activities. That is, they provide sensory input to the proprioceptive system,

which regulates what different parts of the body are doing at different times.

Biting can also provide oral stimulation and may provide pleasant or even

necessary stimulation to this sensory system.

* Toothache or jaw pain (as with teething children): in some cases, biting

may be a response to physical pain, in particular tooth or jaw ache.

* Developmental stages: the mouthing of objects is a normal part of

development. Babies put various objects in their mouths to explore the size,

shape, and texture of the objects. This normally becomes a problem if the child

continues to mouth objects frequently past the age of 18 months or so. However,

a child who missed the initial mouthing phase due to sensitivity in the mouth

area or medical issues may have to go through this phase later.

How to respond

* Rule out medical and dental causes

Ensure that an individual (particularly someone who has limited

communication) is not biting as a response to physical pain such as toothache or

jaw ache. It can be a good idea to arrange a check-up with the dentist or GP to

rule out any possible physical causes for the behaviour.

* Functional analysis

Getting to the bottom of why the individual bites is crucial in

determining the best way of responding to the behaviour (ie if the biting is an

expression of frustration, the focus of intervention will be on teaching the

person alternative and more appropriate ways of coping with frustration). A good

way of determining why a person may be engaging in a particular behaviour is to

keep a record of behavioural incidents. In the 'Related resources'section at the

bottom of this page, you will find a sample 'recording sheet' which can be used

to keep a note of what happens before, during and after biting incidents. This

can help to identify patterns that provide clues about why the behaviour may be

occurring. Some individuals (particularly adolescents and adults with

high-functioning autism or Asperger syndrome) may be able to communicate their

reasons for biting, either verbally or through the use of visual strategies

(refer to our Visual supports information sheet, available free from the Autism

Helpline, for more information about visual strategies).

* Improve communication

Assist the individual to develop alternative, more appropriate ways of

communicating their wants, needs, physical discomfort and emotional states.

Visual strategies (as described in our Visual supports information sheet,

available free from the Autism Helpline) can be very effective for people with

an ASD, as they can be used in a broad range of situations and are particularly

useful for indicating physical pain or communicating emotional states. Social

stories can also be helpful in describing why it is not appropriate to bite and

by outlining what the individual is able to do instead of biting. The Gray

Center's website provides further information about social stories:

www.thegraycenter.org

* Environmental modifications

Try to plan for situations that the individual finds challenging and make

necessary adjustments to the environment (such as minimising unpleasant sensory

stimuli, reducing the number of people, increasing structure through the use of

timetables or schedules, and maintaining familiar routines where possible).

* Increase sensory opportunities

If the individual is biting to gain sensory input, then it is important to

provide alternative and more appropriate ways of meeting this need. The

following are some ideas on alternative ways of providing this sensory input.

* Chewy Tubes are cylindrical pieces of rubber tubing (which are safe,

non-toxic, washable and latex-free) that can be sucked or chewed on and provide

good resistance for people who need the sensory input provided by biting.

Studies have shown that chewies appear to provide a calming, focusing and

organising function and act as a release for stress (Scheerer, 1991). Chewy

Tubes can be ordered from www.kapitex.com or telephone 01937 580211.

* Another option may be to put together a bum bag of items that provide a

range of sensory experiences, such as raw pasta or dried fruit, that the

individual can be re-directed to.

* Anger management and relaxation training

Some people with an ASD may experience difficulties managing emotions such

as stress, anxiety and frustration, which may lead to behavioural outbursts such

as biting. It can therefore be of assistance for individuals to learn how to

identify the physical cues or bodily sensations which indicate that they are

becoming agitated and then to develop a repertoire of alternative, more

appropriate activities to assist them to calm down. Examples of these may

include taking a few deep breaths, counting to ten, going for a walk, listening

to music, walking away from the scene, or asking for help. Relaxation approaches

such as deep breathing, thinking positive thoughts, redirection to pleasant,

calming activities (such as taking a bath, listening to relaxing music,

aromatherapy, playing on a computer, swinging, jumping on a trampoline), may

also help.

* Supervise and redirect

Try to anticipate problems and prevent them if possible. It may be

necessary to provide extra supervision initially (particularly during situations

that are known to be difficult for the individual) and be ready to intervene

quickly if necessary. Redirect the individual to another activity or area where

there are fewer opportunities for biting and provide encouragement for the first

occurrence of appropriate behaviour (eg Jane, nice looking at your book).

* Reinforce appropriate behaviour

It is important to pay attention to instances of behaviour that we want to

encourage to help the individual learn that other, more appropriate ways of

behaving lead to positive outcomes. Rewards can take the form of verbal praise

and attention, preferred activities, toys, tokens or small amounts of favourite

foods or drinks. Clearly name the behaviour that you are rewarding eg Satti,

thats good sharing with your sister! and ensure that rewards are provided

immediately after the behaviour that you wish to encourage.

* Respond quickly and consistently to incidents of behaviour

* Keep responses to biting behaviour to a minimum by limiting verbal

comments, facial expressions and other displays of emotion, as these may

inadvertently reinforce the behaviour. Try to speak calmly and clearly and keep

facial expressions neutral.

* Dependent on reason for biting (to be explored via functional analysis),

respond to the underlying cause of the behaviour. Some examples are provided

below:

* Communication difficulties: encourage individual to use alternative forms

of communication (eg, visual signs or symbols), for example ', you need

to use your signs/point to what you want'. Use a range of symbols that the

individual can carry around to communicate basic needs such as 'yes', 'no',

'stop', 'go away - I need space', 'pain'. For further information regarding the

use of picture symbols visit the Picture Exchange Communication System (PECS)

website at www.pecs.org.uk

* Frustration or distress: remind individual of anger management/relaxation

strategies, eg ', you need to calm down. Take three deep breaths.'

* Sensory issues: re-direct individual to alternative sensory activity such

as Chewy Tube, or bum bag with edible items.

* Redirect the individual to another activity and praise the first

occurrence of appropriate behaviour eg 'Jackie, that's nice listening to your

music.'

* Maintain physical space and closely supervise the individual following an

incident of biting. Be ready to redirect the individual if necessary.

When and how to get extra help

If the biting behaviour is presenting significant risks to the person or those

around them or is resistant to intervention, it may be important to get

specialist help to deal with the behaviour. Arrange an appointment with your GP

to discuss the issue and to request referral to a behavioural specialist if

appropriate. For further information about where and how to get extra help you

can also contact:

Autism Helpline

393 City Road

London EC1V 1NG

Tel: 0845 0704004

(opening hours Monday-Friday, 10am-4pm)

Email: autismhelpline@...

The Challenging Behaviour Foundation

c/o Friends Meeting House

Northgate

Rochester ME1 1LS

Website: www.thecbf.org.uk

Email: info@...

References and recommended reading

, J. (1995). Autism PDD: creative ideas during the school years. Ontario:

Publications.

Attwood, T. (1998). Asperger syndrome: a guide for parents and professionals.

London: Kingsley Publishers.

Clements, J. (2005). People with autism behaving badly: helping people with ASD

move on from behavioural and emotional challenges. London: Kingsley

Publishers

Clements, J. and Zarkowska, E. (2000). Behavioural concerns and autistic

spectrum disorders: explanations and strategies for change. London:

Kingsley Publishers.

Dunn Buron, K. and Curtis, M. (2003). The incredible 5-point scale. Autism

Asperger Publishing Company

Fouse, B. and Wheeler, M. (1997). A treasure chest of behavioural strategies for

individuals with autism. Arlington: Future Horizons Inc.

Gray, C. (2002). My social stories book. London: Kingsley Publishers.

Hannah, L. (2001. Teaching young children with autistic spectrum disorders to

learn. Great Britain: Crowes Complete Print.

Howlin, P. (1998). Children with autism and Asperger syndrome: a guide for

practitioners and carers. Chichester: Wiley & Sons Ltd.

Leicestershire County Council and Fosse Health Trust (1998) Autism: how to help

your young child. London: The National Autistic Society.

May, F. (2005). Understanding behaviour. London: The National Autistic Society.

Scheerer, C. R. (1992). Perspectives on an oral motor activity: the use of

rubber tubing as a chewy. The American Journal of Occupational Therapy, 46 (4),

344-352.

Schopler, E. (ed.) (1995). Parent survival manual. New York: Plenum Press.

Whitaker, P. (2001). Challenging Behaviour and Autism: Making sense making

progress. London: The National Autistic Society.

Wilkes, K. (2005). The sensory world of autism: a better understanding. London:

The National Autistic Society

Wilkes, K. (2006). Going to the dentist: a guide for parents and carers of

children with ASD. London: The National Autistic Society.

Wing, L. (1996). The autistic spectrum: a guide for parents and professionals.

London: Constable.

Quick link to this page: http://www.autism.org.uk/18591

=====

November 5, 2010

I don't know but maybe he is feeling some kind of detox and this is how he is

reacting.Â Sometimes when yeast/bacteria or viruses exit our system one can have

symptoms of fatigue, frustration, behavioural issues, etc. Maybe try starting it

again when school is out for Christmas vacation so that if this is detox he can

relax and not have the additional expectationsÂ the school puts on in which can

increase his frustration andÂ lead to the biting. Detox can last from a few days

to 2 weeks depending on what is in the system.

Â

This is just my thoughts,

Demi

From: bb_paul <bb_paul@...>

Subject: [ ] NV question

Date: Friday, November 5, 2010, 8:24 AM

Â

Hi everybody,

I have written to this group before about giving NV to my 10 year old autistic

son, .

The first time around, I gave him NV with equal amount of Horlicks and he had

very bad hyperactivity with biting and hitting others. When I reported it to

this group, everyone suggested giving NV without Horlicks. So, I started again

without Horlicks and also with just 1/2 scoop a day. He was biting others again

after few days. With 's advice, after few days I again started NV, this time

at 1/8 of a scoop, but unfortunately, he bit a school staff and another kid

right on the second day and was grabbing and pulling at others clothes.

Because he goes to school, I cant continue giving him NV if he bites other

children and staff. Does anyone have any suggestions as to how I should give NV

to him now? He drinks a lot of water when he takes NV so thats not a problem. I

really feel bad that I am not able to give him atleast half the dosage to see if

he has any improvements. This group has parents with a lot of experience esp.

with NV and are very helpful, so I'm hoping some one will have some answer for

me.

Thanks,

bibi

November 23, 2010

Hi,

My friend has been giving her child NV for 3 weeks now. She hasn't seen seen

surges at this point. She just added Pro-EFA since her child was previously not

on fish oil. She added the fish oil last weekend and her daughter is now acting

very defiant and saying things like " Don't touch me. " Up until now she has been

able to count-down to get her cooperate but it is no longer working. Could this

be the NV finally kicking in?

Thanks, Sheryl

November 24, 2010

Hi Sheryl,

I know you emailed me in private as well but there are to many unknowns for me

to answer this. You don't say the child's age or what dosage the parent is

using. I'm guessing that the child doesn't have a speech impairment or is an

older child because otherwise a three word sentence " don't touch me " would be

welcome by any of us (as weird as that would sound) that have an essentially

nonverbal preschool child.

So I also would like to know diagnosis and what exactly the parent was areas the

parent was looking for improvements in. I would like to know if the child was

hydrated and if the child was regular (bowel movements) and if there was any

change in the bowels. Without any of the information I just asked for -I don't

know if anyone could answer. Yes we could say that some on NV can become more

sassy if that was an appropriate developmental stage for that child's age- but

that is not a well documented side effect for just anyone -child to adult to go

through. The most well documented side effect is in the first week a bit more

hyper -but particularly in those dealing with autism some say on closer

inspection it's not really hyper as much as it's awareness.

If you don't notice any changes in any of these areas

http://pursuitofresearch.com/pursuit-of-research/ (YAY the new site is coming

along!!!) after a week -I'd like anyone in that situation to look at the above

questions and ask here. We need to know why it's not working in the rare

situations it's not...and we need to know how often this happens and why.

But back to the original question...we know that both fish oils and NV can

stimulate production of neurotransmitters and thus in the first week we

sometimes do see more cranky or sassy attitudes- however the child has been on

NV for 3 weeks and it's rare if never to last that long- so perhaps this is from

the fish oils? Either way I'd have to know what exactly she is looking for in

the way of improvement as well as the rest to know what exactly isn't working.

Hope that helps!

=====

November 24, 2010

The girl is 6 yrs. old and on 2 scoops per day.Â She has a diagnosis of

autism.Â She is verbal but her receptive and expresive language skills are

still pretty delayed.Â Although she is producing sentences she also produces

" jibberish " .Â She has pragmatic difficulties.Â There are behavioralÂ concerns

as well.Â Mom would like to get her behavior more managable.Â She also

receives OT for sensory integration.

I don't think the defiant behavior happened in the first 2-1/2 or 3 wks.Â It

just started happening in week 3.Â Mom started giving fish oils in week 3.Â

Would fish oils do this?

Â

Thanks,Â Sheryl

From: kiddietalk <kiddietalk@...>

Subject: [ ] Re: NV question

Date: Wednesday, November 24, 2010, 8:20 AM