ldn

April 13, 2003

Hi Nicolay,

I am not sure that Skip or any other compounder will ship to Bulgaria but I

will list the numbers that I have for them. I think that I heard that the

Apothecure will ship to other countries, you might try them.

1. Skips (800) 553-7429

(561) 218-8873 Fax number

2. Apothecure (800) 969-6601

(800) 687-5252 Fax number

3. Larry Frieders (630) 859-0333

(630) 859-0114 Fax number

These are the three compounders that I know fill prescriptions for Low Dose

Naltrexone for Mser's. Good luck to you. Joyce.

>From: " nicolay yordanov " <nico_yordanov@...>

>mcduff@...

>CC: low dose naltrexone

>Subject: [low dose naltrexone] LDN

>Date: Sat, 12 Apr 2003 11:00:37 +0300

>

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Hi,

I live in Bulgaria.

To get LDN -3 mg is practically impossible.

Please advice me e-mail address of SKIP'S PHARMACY OR IRMAT PHARMACY or some other witch are agree shipped LDN to Bulgaria.

Your response will be greatly appreciated.

Thank you very much.

Sincerely yours

Nikolay Yordanov

MS HELPLINE

Varna,BulgariaMSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service: 2 months FREE*

April 26, 2003

HI there. What has Calcium EAP done for you?

I just started LDN on the 17th, so I've taken 10 so far.

Welcome to the group.

----- Original Message -----

From: jmfranken@...

blueswede06@...

Cc: Lowdosenaltrexone

Sent: Saturday, April 26, 2003 14:33

Subject: [low dose naltrexone] LDN

Hi - I just joined the group yesterday and just took my first dose of LDN last night. I have had MS for 13+ years - and am beginning to have a lot of trouble walking I have walked with a limp for 10 years but over the last 3, I have gotten worse using a cane most of the time. I have tried Calcium EAP (Dr Neiper's treatment from Germany) and recently Bee Sting Therapy (ouch) which I am still doing - I hope the LDN will help with the spasticity in my left leg, fatigue and just give me a better quality of life so I can do something normal - like shop or clean, etc. I got my prescription from a Dr.Cohen in Conn. I am not sure where you live - but he has a Pain Clinic and is very willing to help. As I have just started I will be happy to stay in touch with you and give you feed back if you wish. I agree that the FDA approved drugs offer little help and are costly and who needs to feel like you have the flu everyother day. Good luck - try on the internet for Alternative Medicine Doctors in your area.

April 30, 2003

I agree with all you said , especially the part of how this dis-ease,

any disease gets your attention, no matter what you're doing, how rich you

are, how handsome you are, etc. It stops you in your tracks and makes you

focus inside -- whether you want to or not; that's why it's a Gift in a

strange way.

I think we need to give all the docs a break though. They are spiritual

beings having a human experience just like we are. They operate within

their own limited perspective of what is real and what works. We need to

forgive them as we are all innocent. I don't believe they are not thinking

in our best interests, they may have more Ego than some but we all do. We

should

gently educate them with what does work for us. If LDN is not the answer,

so be it. I hope and believe it is, but realize it may not work for me. If

it does, believe me, a lot of MDs will be getting an education! I

am from Missouri in that I want to be shown. I am open to alternatives

because I know the body has its own healing mechanism -- it's just

getting that set into motion that docs come in.

So let's all love these people in our lives as much as we are able to and

help them too as they are trying to help us -- we are all on the same

boat, we all need to keep learning how to love in a deeper way. Isn't that

what Life is about anyway?

cheers, phil

On Wed, 30 Apr 2003, [iso-8859-1] paul stanley wrote:

> Well, I got my blood results from the 2 clinics, and

> the variation in cd4 cells was about 200..... I'm

> relatively healthy, except my platelet count is very

> low, due to the virus they said. I feel fine, but.....

> The chemist I get my naltrexone from just grinds down

> tablets into a 3mg capsule for me, but they are all

> odd and broken differently, which I don't think is the

> correct way for it to be taken. SO when I get a bit

> more money together I'll phone Dr Bihari and

> Apothecure. In the meantime, they have suggested

> prednisone to boost the platelets because I refuse to

> go on HAART (ABC) drugs. So I am taking vit E too as E

> defiency causes thrombocytopenia (low platelet count)

> too.

>

> I feel that doctors treat you nicely, but a little

> patronizing in that they act like you're not immune

> from dis-ease, and they are. Like superior humans or

> something. Whereas I feel that because my attention

> has turned inwards on what's going on inside my body,

> I've come to realize that time is ticking away for all

> of us, like cells are dying every second, and to get

> on with the main reason I'm alive - to love and

> nurture. And on a deeper level than I would have

> otherwise known without the virus. Something I feel

> people outside our circle are yet to discover, filling

> up their lives with deception and ignorance and

> delusion etc. Not for one minute would I give up how

> diagnosis has altered my mind and awareness. Sure

> there have been harrowing valleys, but I always rise

> up stronger in the mind when the depressive spell

> breaks and i know where to go to with my future, but

> most importantly, how to take the first steps towards

> a better understood tomorrow.

> SO when I go to see a doctor, especially in a viral

> setting, I forgive and improvise that we don't see eye

> to eye on the subject of my body. I sometimes wonder

> if doctors are the biggest group in society who are in

> denial that we die and leave our bodies for what comes

> next, taking liberties in mentally pushing patients

> closer to death with poisonous half cure drugs to

> diffuse their own fears. Of course, I'm not talking

> about Dr Bihari. Everyhting I have read of him has him

> humbly supporting patients to have a quality of life

> and believe in themselves and the body and brain. But

> the whole medical fraternity that revolves around

> money and medications is a bit like Mc's I feel.

> Value for money and nutrition to a certain degree, but

> a lot of excess too, the fat of toxins and stigmas.

> Noone telling you to feel good about yourself.

> This has come from an exclusive part of my psyche and

> I hope some relate to how I feel.

>

> http://mobile..au - Mobile

> - Check & compose your email via SMS on your Telstra or Vodafone mobile.

>

April 30, 2003

You sure nailed the reality of living with MS. I have been dealing

with this " blessing " for twenty five years. This disease has made me

more aware of my body and all the mesages it is trying to comunicate

to me. My first steps were to go vegetarian. This change included a

rigid supplement regimin that included anti-oxidents, EFA's, vitamins,

and all organic produce and soy protien.

I would also like to say that people sometimes lose sight of their

Spiritual Self. I practice Qi Gong and Meditation, never forget you

Spirit.

Where I live, MS is recognized as a qualifying condition for Medicinal

Marijuana Exemption. Did you know our brains have cannabinoid

receptors? It also offers neuroprotection by

Tetrahydrocannabinol(THC), the Main Active Compound in Marijuana.

(http://www.jneurosci.org/cgi/content/abstract/21/17/6475) I use it to

reduce pain, spasms, and improve my " 6 hours " of sleep and improves my

" quality of life " .

before I really became involved in my new " life style, My voodoo neuro

goddess had me try betaserone. Not a good idea. Needless to say, I

learned and am still learning.

So, my next logical step was Bee Venom Therapy which led to LDN. I

start the LDN in 2 days, and the BVT as soon as my local Bee Keeper

gets his hives back up and going (bear tore them apart).

I am also instituting a " Paleolithic " diet. (http://www.paleodiet.com/)

" Bee Sting " and " Paleo, " Medicinal Marijuana, and Qi Gong kinda paints

me a little on the eccentric side of most peoples reality. But

really, whats real?

April 30, 2003

I recently saw a series of Qi Gong offered through a local organization called the St. ph's Wellness Center in Cleveland, Ohio. Could you tell me more about Qi Gong? My understanding is that it is a comination of breathing techniques and meditation. Also, has the BVT been effective?

-----Original Message-----From: Terry Humphrey Colquhoun [mailto:yukon42042@...]Sent: Wednesday, April 30, 2003 8:39 AMlow dose naltrexone Subject: Re: [low dose naltrexone] LDNYou sure nailed the reality of living with MS. I have been dealingwith this "blessing" for twenty five years. This disease has made memore aware of my body and all the mesages it is trying to comunicateto me. My first steps were to go vegetarian. This change included arigid supplement regimin that included anti-oxidents, EFA's, vitamins,and all organic produce and soy protien. I would also like to say that people sometimes lose sight of theirSpiritual Self. I practice Qi Gong and Meditation, never forget youSpirit.Where I live, MS is recognized as a qualifying condition for MedicinalMarijuana Exemption. Did you know our brains have cannabinoid receptors? It also offers neuroprotection byTetrahydrocannabinol(THC), the Main Active Compound in Marijuana.(http://www.jneurosci.org/cgi/content/abstract/21/17/6475) I use it toreduce pain, spasms, and improve my "6 hours" of sleep and improves my"quality of life".before I really became involved in my new" life style, My voodoo neurogoddess had me try betaserone. Not a good idea. Needless to say, Ilearned and am still learning. So, my next logical step was Bee Venom Therapy which led to LDN. Istart the LDN in 2 days, and the BVT as soon as my local Bee Keepergets his hives back up and going (bear tore them apart). I am also instituting a "Paleolithic" diet. (http://www.paleodiet.com/)"Bee Sting" and "Paleo," Medicinal Marijuana, and Qi Gong kinda paintsme a little on the eccentric side of most peoples reality. Butreally, whats real?

April 30, 2003

Phil,

I've been frustrated a bit with my doctors, so thank you for reminding me of their perspective.

Thanks, also, for the reminder that loving and helping others as much as we can can also help in healing ourselves.

-----Original Message-----From: G. Harding [mailto:philh@...]Sent: Wednesday, April 30, 2003 7:43 AMpaul stanleyCc: low dose naltrexone Subject: Re: [low dose naltrexone] LDNI agree with all you said , especially the part of how this dis-ease,any disease gets your attention, no matter what you're doing, how rich youare, how handsome you are, etc. It stops you in your tracks and makes youfocus inside -- whether you want to or not; that's why it's a Gift in astrange way.I think we need to give all the docs a break though. They are spiritualbeings having a human experience just like we are. They operate withintheir own limited perspective of what is real and what works. We need toforgive them as we are all innocent. I don't believe they are not thinkingin our best interests, they may have more Ego than some but we all do. Weshouldgently educate them with what does work for us. If LDN is not the answer,so be it. I hope and believe it is, but realize it may not work for me. Ifit does, believe me, a lot of MDs will be getting an education! Iam from Missouri in that I want to be shown. I am open to alternativesbecause I know the body has its own healing mechanism -- it's justgetting that set into motion that docs come in.So let's all love these people in our lives as much as we are able to andhelp them too as they are trying to help us -- we are all on the sameboat, we all need to keep learning how to love in a deeper way. Isn't thatwhat Life is about anyway?cheers, philOn Wed, 30 Apr 2003, [iso-8859-1] paul stanley wrote:> Well, I got my blood results from the 2 clinics, and> the variation in cd4 cells was about 200..... I'm> relatively healthy, except my platelet count is very> low, due to the virus they said. I feel fine, but.....> The chemist I get my naltrexone from just grinds down> tablets into a 3mg capsule for me, but they are all> odd and broken differently, which I don't think is the> correct way for it to be taken. SO when I get a bit> more money together I'll phone Dr Bihari and> Apothecure. In the meantime, they have suggested> prednisone to boost the platelets because I refuse to> go on HAART (ABC) drugs. So I am taking vit E too as E> defiency causes thrombocytopenia (low platelet count)> too.>> I feel that doctors treat you nicely, but a little> patronizing in that they act like you're not immune> from dis-ease, and they are. Like superior humans or> something. Whereas I feel that because my attention> has turned inwards on what's going on inside my body,> I've come to realize that time is ticking away for all> of us, like cells are dying every second, and to get> on with the main reason I'm alive - to love and> nurture. And on a deeper level than I would have> otherwise known without the virus. Something I feel> people outside our circle are yet to discover, filling> up their lives with deception and ignorance and> delusion etc. Not for one minute would I give up how> diagnosis has altered my mind and awareness. Sure> there have been harrowing valleys, but I always rise> up stronger in the mind when the depressive spell> breaks and i know where to go to with my future, but> most importantly, how to take the first steps towards> a better understood tomorrow.> SO when I go to see a doctor, especially in a viral> setting, I forgive and improvise that we don't see eye> to eye on the subject of my body. I sometimes wonder> if doctors are the biggest group in society who are in> denial that we die and leave our bodies for what comes> next, taking liberties in mentally pushing patients> closer to death with poisonous half cure drugs to> diffuse their own fears. Of course, I'm not talking> about Dr Bihari. Everyhting I have read of him has him> humbly supporting patients to have a quality of life> and believe in themselves and the body and brain. But> the whole medical fraternity that revolves around> money and medications is a bit like Mc's I feel.> Value for money and nutrition to a certain degree, but> a lot of excess too, the fat of toxins and stigmas.> Noone telling you to feel good about yourself.> This has come from an exclusive part of my psyche and> I hope some relate to how I feel.>> http://mobile..au - Mobile> - Check & compose your email via SMS on your Telstra or Vodafone mobile.>>>

May 1, 2003

Hi ,

Well put. I have finally come to a stage in life where I am finally taking

charge of my life. I tell myself that I am in control of my destiny.

Therefore, I found a doctor who is willing to work with me, to follow the

path that I choose to take and not the other way around. The way I look at

it, the doctor works for me, I don't work for him. You really do need to get

into this frame of mind and be assertive in regards to this whole process or

you are doomed to experience a different fate. Joyce.

>From: paul stanley <paulyboystanley@...>

>low dose naltrexone

>Subject: [low dose naltrexone] LDN

>Date: Wed, 30 Apr 2003 18:59:01 +1000 (EST)

>

>Well, I got my blood results from the 2 clinics, and

>the variation in cd4 cells was about 200..... I'm

>relatively healthy, except my platelet count is very

>low, due to the virus they said. I feel fine, but.....

>The chemist I get my naltrexone from just grinds down

>tablets into a 3mg capsule for me, but they are all

>odd and broken differently, which I don't think is the

>correct way for it to be taken. SO when I get a bit

>more money together I'll phone Dr Bihari and

>Apothecure. In the meantime, they have suggested

>prednisone to boost the platelets because I refuse to

>go on HAART (ABC) drugs. So I am taking vit E too as E

>defiency causes thrombocytopenia (low platelet count)

>too.

>

>I feel that doctors treat you nicely, but a little

>patronizing in that they act like you're not immune

>from dis-ease, and they are. Like superior humans or

>something. Whereas I feel that because my attention

>has turned inwards on what's going on inside my body,

>I've come to realize that time is ticking away for all

>of us, like cells are dying every second, and to get

>on with the main reason I'm alive - to love and

>nurture. And on a deeper level than I would have

>otherwise known without the virus. Something I feel

>people outside our circle are yet to discover, filling

>up their lives with deception and ignorance and

>delusion etc. Not for one minute would I give up how

>diagnosis has altered my mind and awareness. Sure

>there have been harrowing valleys, but I always rise

>up stronger in the mind when the depressive spell

>breaks and i know where to go to with my future, but

>most importantly, how to take the first steps towards

>a better understood tomorrow.

>SO when I go to see a doctor, especially in a viral

>setting, I forgive and improvise that we don't see eye

>to eye on the subject of my body. I sometimes wonder

>if doctors are the biggest group in society who are in

>denial that we die and leave our bodies for what comes

>next, taking liberties in mentally pushing patients

>closer to death with poisonous half cure drugs to

>diffuse their own fears. Of course, I'm not talking

>about Dr Bihari. Everyhting I have read of him has him

>humbly supporting patients to have a quality of life

>and believe in themselves and the body and brain. But

>the whole medical fraternity that revolves around

>money and medications is a bit like Mc's I feel.

>Value for money and nutrition to a certain degree, but

>a lot of excess too, the fat of toxins and stigmas.

>Noone telling you to feel good about yourself.

>This has come from an exclusive part of my psyche and

>I hope some relate to how I feel.

>

>http://mobile..au - Mobile

>- Check & compose your email via SMS on your Telstra or Vodafone mobile.

_________________________________________________________________

Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online

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May 8, 2003

my experience as well, it's been 2 weeks today. It's a good drug to use

with no side effects... I recommend it and hope it just keeps getting

better!!!

Phil

On Thu, 8 May 2003, blueswede06 wrote:

> Hello fellow Msers,

> I started LDN on May 1st, almost a week ago. Every day I hope

> it will stop the progression of MS, but, only time will tell this.

> What i can say is that it has really helped with my symptoms. I

> have reduced my neurontin from 400mg daily, to 300mg daily and will

> probably reduce it to 200mg daily. Pain level remains consistent,

> even with the reduced dose. My worst symptom, FATIGUE, is

> drastically reduced. Prior to the LDN, by 2:00pm, I wanted to quit

> working and just go home and sleep. Since starting the LDN, I have

> had 1 day with mild fatigue, and 1 day with very mild fatigue. I

> thought I was doing a good job of keeping my mental state positive,

> until I started this scrip.

> I am so much happier, and energetic. Thinking back, I feel

> like the person I was 5-6 years ago. I am sleeping much better-when

> very tired, I can sleep for 8 hours and wake feeling very

> refreshed. Prior to, I was lucky to get 5-6 hours a night,

> regardless of how tired I was.

> I realize its too early to know just what LDN will do for me,

> but based on early results, I am very optomistic. I urge anyone

> with MS to consider this treatment. I don't know if it will stop

> the MS, but it has dramatically improved the quality of life. I

> really feel like living again, don't feel like I am just existing,

> and waiting to see what the future brings!!! I still have my aches

> and pains, and an occaisional weird symptom(strange itch or

> sensation), but I feel like doing things.

> I hope my experiences will help others out there, as we need

> all the help we can get...............

>

> Best Wishes, blueswede

>

July 2, 2003

Your neuro probably won't prescribe it but there are other ways of getting a

prescription. we all went through this. I went to three doctors before I

called Dr Bihari in New York. And I have been on it for almost 4 weeks.

Good Luck and don't give up.

Marie

----- Original Message -----

From: " jposbo_77357 " <osborne0601@...>

Sent: Wednesday, July 02, 2003 11:15 AM

Subject: [low dose naltrexone] ldn

> well, I have been browsing through ya'lls chats for about 3 days now,

> since I first heard about ldn....I go to see my neuro at the end of

> this month and I have printed all the literature out about it....I am

> Very interested in alternative medicines...I have been on Avonex

> since Dec. 96, and I am very needle phobic as the result...I used to

> be able to administer the shot myself, but I am Catholic, and it took

> several rosaries, novenas and the intercessetion of every angel and

> Saint that I could think of to help me. But now I don't even have

> the strength to plunge the needle through my skin..and then ouch

> depress the plunger of the needle......so I am very excited to say

> the least....about this alternative treatment....now all I have to do

> is pray that my neuro will be open to prescribe it for me.

>

July 2, 2003

Hi,

I have a friend who has blood injection phobia, as it is called. I just went to his dr.'s appt with him. He faints when giving blood. I got him to sit, half-reclined, and coached him to continually flex his calf muscles (by moving his feet back and forth) as well as the forearm of the arm that is not getting blood drawn from. I had him do this starting one minute before and one minute after getting his blood drawn. Not only did he NOT faint, but he said he felt fine and did not even feel ill at all. In my logic, since blood injection phobia is believed to be related to a drop in blood pressure, muscle contraction (especially the soleus of the calf region) may help to sustain blood pressure and prevent its depression.

- Christian

well, I have been browsing through ya'lls chats for about 3 days now,

since I first heard about ldn....I go to see my neuro at the end of

this month and I have printed all the literature out about it....I am

Very interested in alternative medicines...I have been on Avonex

since Dec. 96, and I am very needle phobic as the result...I used to

be able to administer the shot myself, but I am Catholic, and it took

several rosaries, novenas and the intercessetion of every angel and

Saint that I could think of to help me. But now I don't even have

the strength to plunge the needle through my skin..and then ouch

depress the plunger of the needle......so I am very excited to say

the least....about this alternative treatment....now all I have to do

is pray that my neuro will be open to prescribe it for me.

July 4, 2003

I am very intrigued about the whole ldn concept....I came on line

yesterday and stated that I was new to the group and apparently I did

not state my views very clearly..... I got a few responses and I

appreciate that very much thank ya'll so very much. Now if ya'll

could please answer a few questions before i go to the dr at the end

of this month? my husband is very leary of this. I have printed out

all the stuff, he has read it and all but he says i am doing so well

on avonex why rock the boat? i take the avonex injection weekly but

daily i take 80mg baclofen and 450mg nuerontin and i am TIRED of

putting that many chemicals into MY body PLUS the avonex? do i

continue everything and just discontinue the avonex even that would

be a plus at this stage of the game. I really need some

information. i think i could maybe talk my neuro into maybe a trial

of perhaps a month or two just to see what happens? I mean what

could it hurt? Pat

July 4, 2003

I was on Copaxone, it did nothing for the progression (secondary progression???). I stopped the Copaxone and all other drugs too. There were some minor leg cramps at first (perhaps it is the nerves coming back alive that is the cause of that???). At this time the leg cramps are gone. Bladder control is now normal. No more fatigue! Sense of balance returned. No longer need Vigeria! I can feel myself returning to normal. LDN does stop the progression allowing the body to heal itself. I no longer get the terrible leg pains I once had. All MS pain is gone! I threw out sever thousand dollars worth of poisonous drugs I was taking.

----- Original Message -----

From: jposbo_77357

low dose naltrexone

Sent: Friday, July 04, 2003 11:34 AM

Subject: [low dose naltrexone] ldn

I am very intrigued about the whole ldn concept....I came on line yesterday and stated that I was new to the group and apparently I did not state my views very clearly..... I got a few responses and I appreciate that very much thank ya'll so very much. Now if ya'll could please answer a few questions before i go to the dr at the end of this month? my husband is very leary of this. I have printed out all the stuff, he has read it and all but he says i am doing so well on avonex why rock the boat? i take the avonex injection weekly but daily i take 80mg baclofen and 450mg nuerontin and i am TIRED of putting that many chemicals into MY body PLUS the avonex? do i continue everything and just discontinue the avonex even that would be a plus at this stage of the game. I really need some information. i think i could maybe talk my neuro into maybe a trial of perhaps a month or two just to see what happens? I mean what could it hurt? Pat

July 4, 2003

Hi there Pat,

I can certainly understand your husbands feelings that you would be rocking

the boat by going off what is considered a proven drug especially if you

feel it is helping you. I don't think anyone here would want to tell you to

do that. I personally feel that the LDN is the way to go but then I've never

been on any of those ABCR's myself. I consider myself lucky that I never got

on that merry go round. Who really knows for sure. I bet you will get

everyone to agree that for us there is no question. I'm just not confortable

telling someone to go off of the drugs if they think they are helping. I

like the idea of giving it a trial period if you are getting to that point

where you might make that decision for yourself. I told myself I would give

it a year. Well it is just over a year for me and so far so good, thank the

Lord. Not sure a month or two would be enough but whatever you decide to do,

please let us know what happens ok? We are all in this together. As far as

what to continue and what to discontinue. The only thing that you cannot

take with the LDN is anything with a narcotic in it. Maybe try to Avonex

first and then slowly try to get off the other things. I wish I was more

familiar with all those drugs. Good luck and let us know. Oh and welcome to

the group. Joyce.

From: " jposbo_77357 "

low dose naltrexone

Subject: [low dose naltrexone] ldn

Date: Fri, 04 Jul 2003 15:34:04 -0000