Re: off topic question - Ruth

[Guest guest]

that's sad how each state is so different. in NY, they would have to go and get training. or, bring in a trained person. but you have to fight for it.r_woman2 <me2ruth@...> wrote: >> Remember, having a disability does not entitle one to an IEP. Youhave to have a disability and because of that disability, need specialeducation services. I can see

where a lot of AS kids would havetrouble qualifying for an IEP, especially if they are doing wellacademically. It depends on how many people knocked the doors downahead of you as to how hard it will be. Also, it depends on theadministration and their outlook towards sped needs. This is all very true. Although people also have to remember that achild with a 504 plan is also legally considered disabled. I havebeen surprised at the level of assistance my son can get in a 504plan--in writing. The problem is, when there is no special ed deptinvolved to resolve things the general ed staff are unfamiliar with,your child's needs don't get met. The 504 plan ends up being inwriting only, and not because the teachers aren't trying or don'tcare. You go round and round in circles because people just don'thave the training and aren't the self-teaching type.Ruth

[Guest guest]

What you are referring to, I think, is the "purpose" section of the IDEA. In part is says, "

§300.1 Purposes. The purposes of this part are--

(a) To ensure that all children with disabilities have available to them a free appropriate public education that emphasizes special education and related services designed to meet their unique needs and prepare them for further education, employment, and independent living;..."

so while the school might say "we only have to focus on educational needs", they actually do have to focus on needs that will fit the above statement, which would include social skills.

RoxannaAutism Happens

Re: ( ) Re: off topic question - Ruth

Ruth, lots of parents buy into this " when the school says he/she is doing well ". yes, they don't want their child labeled !. so they are thankful when the team says he's the top roll model of his class. they are quick to declassify their child, and most regress. they have an overload and can't keep up. then there are parents like us who know better.

but even though your son needs social skills and his team states it doesn't interfere with his school work. it does interfere with is every day life and so does life skills. Roxanna or Pam has better wording for this. Maybe they can help me out here. if a child is doing well in academics and poor in social skills. that not going to help him when he is finished with H.S. and he can't apply for a job because he doesn't know how to dress, or apply himself for an interview. If I remember right, you said you need a speech teacher to help him express himself ? and social skills as well ? maybe with organization too. if not, what are you requesting for that they aren't helping you with?

have you ever gone into your school with an advocate ? when they see you have someone supporting you that knows their rights, they are a little more careful. Also, an advocate can catch something that you missed or remind you of things you forgot, or even just support you with your request for services for your son. Have you called state ed to see if you can get the help for your child that you need ? (even If you know your rights, an advocate their to support you helps out lots).

Roser_woman2 <me2ruth > wrote:

>> Now with Ruth, that school is just giving her a hard time !. Sheneeds to document everything and document everything that she isrequesting and let the school put it back in writing to her why theyaren't providing her son with ...Rose, I've done all this. Like I said, it isn't this simple if yourchild's academic ability level is above grade level. What they'll putin writing is that he is "successful in the classroom" and "accessingthe general curriculum", ignoring the fact that it is inappropriate tobe using grade level as a yardstick and ignoring any functionalproblems, because "it isn't causing any educational problems". Idoubt very much that that boy you heard about is really doing fine anddoesn't need an IEP. He wouldn't meet the dx if he was typical. He'scaught in the same vicious circle as my son. And I'll bet the schoolwould tell you that he is going "great". Sometimes even parents buyinto this, if they aren't good observers and don't notice their childis capable of a lot more than where they are at.Ruth

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[Guest guest]

Well, in a complete educational evaluation, they need to evaluate all areas of delay, even if it's not related to the dx. So they definitely do have to evaluate for OT and ST. Otherwise, they couldn't know whether the child needs OT or ST in the first place. As for disability category, that would be what OHI is for.

RoxannaAutism Happens

( ) Re: off topic question - Ruth

>> Part of the educational evaluation should include ST and OT. So heshould get an OT evaluation done and then if he needs OT, he wouldreceive it. He does not "have to have an IEP" in order to get OTservices. If he qualifies as needing OT, then he should receive OT. Not in our state (Texas). Motor skill delays/coordination problemsare not even an official disability category. They are specificallyexcluded. You only get them under the umbrella of "all the child'sneeds must be met" if you get an IEP. I don't think there is much OTgoing on in the schools in our state. Luckily most health insurancesand medicaid have at least some coverage. I know about this becausedevelopmental coordination disorder is one of my son's multiple dx.RuthNo virus found in this incoming message.

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[Guest guest]

Amen to that....you know I have read that so may times and now that you point it out...yes the schools do need to prepare our children...they need to prepare all the students for the real world ....which includes social skills, banking, looking for a job, filling out a job application, interviewing...etc.

Roxanne ...you are 100% correct and it states it right in IDEA...300.1 ...I am going to remember that number...

Jan

Janice Rushen

Mom, Mentor, Wife, Teacher, Advocate, Accountant,

Maid, Taxi, Shopper, Bulletin Board Artist

Nanny, Crafter, Therapist, Friend, Sister, Aunt,

Daughter, Grand-daughter, Personal Care Aide,

Student, Believer, and Giver.

>> Now with Ruth, that school is just giving her a hard time !. Sheneeds to document everything and document everything that she isrequesting and let the school put it back in writing to her why theyaren't providing her son with ...Rose, I've done all this. Like I said, it isn't this simple if yourchild's academic ability level is above grade level. What they'll putin writing is that he is "successful in the classroom" and "accessingthe general curriculum", ignoring the fact that it is inappropriate tobe using grade level as a yardstick and ignoring any functionalproblems, because "it isn't causing any educational problems". Idoubt very much that that boy you heard about is really doing fine anddoesn't need an IEP. He

wouldn't meet the dx if he was typical. He'scaught in the same vicious circle as my son. And I'll bet the schoolwould tell you that he is going "great". Sometimes even parents buyinto this, if they aren't good observers and don't notice their childis capable of a lot more than where they are at.Ruth

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[Guest guest]

That's it. When a parent has a concern with a child's social skills, and the school says it doesn't interfere with their academics. some schools won't give the child a social skills class just because the child is doing well in academics. Thanks, I'm going to share this with my friend who is also having an issue with this at her school. RoseRoxanna <madideas@...> wrote: What you are referring to, I think, is the

"purpose" section of the IDEA. In part is says, " §300.1 Purposes. The purposes of this part are-- (a) To ensure that all children with disabilities have available to them a free appropriate public education that emphasizes special education and related services designed to meet their unique needs and prepare them for further education, employment, and independent living;..." so while the school might say "we only have to focus on educational needs", they actually do have to focus on needs that will fit the above statement, which would include social skills. RoxannaAutism Happens Re: ( ) Re: off topic question - Ruth Ruth, lots of parents buy into this " when the school says he/she is doing well ". yes, they don't want their child labeled !. so they are thankful when the team says he's the top roll model of

his class. they are quick to declassify their child, and most regress. they have an overload and can't keep up. then there are parents like us who know better. but even though your son needs social skills and his team states it doesn't interfere with his school work. it does interfere with is every day life and so does life skills. Roxanna or Pam has better wording for this. Maybe they can help me out here. if a child is doing well in academics and poor in social skills. that not going to help him when he is finished with H.S. and he can't apply for a job because he doesn't know how to dress, or apply himself for an interview. If I remember right, you said you need a speech teacher to help him express himself ? and social skills as well ? maybe with organization too. if not, what are you

requesting for that they aren't helping you with? have you ever gone into your school with an advocate ? when they see you have someone supporting you that knows their rights, they are a little more careful. Also, an advocate can catch something that you missed or remind you of things you forgot, or even just support you with your request for services for your son. Have you called state ed to see if you can get the help for your child that you need ? (even If you know your rights, an advocate their to support you helps out lots). Roser_woman2 <me2ruth > wrote: >> Now with Ruth, that school is just giving

her a hard time !. Sheneeds to document everything and document everything that she isrequesting and let the school put it back in writing to her why theyaren't providing her son with ...Rose, I've done all this. Like I said, it isn't this simple if yourchild's academic ability level is above grade level. What they'll putin writing is that he is "successful in the classroom" and "accessingthe general curriculum", ignoring the fact that it is inappropriate tobe using grade level as a yardstick and ignoring any functionalproblems, because "it isn't causing any educational problems". Idoubt very much that that boy you heard about is really doing fine anddoesn't need an IEP. He wouldn't meet the dx if he was typical. He'scaught in the same vicious circle as my son. And I'll bet the schoolwould tell you that he is going "great". Sometimes even parents buyinto this, if they aren't good observers and don't notice their

childis capable of a lot more than where they are at.Ruth No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.4.5/1537 - Release Date: 7/6/2008 5:26 AM

[Guest guest]

Well, if a child has social skill problems, it will affect academics. It also affects how well they can participate in regular classes, with peers, small group studies, large group projects, etc.

RoxannaAutism Happens

Re: ( ) Re: off topic question - Ruth

Ruth, lots of parents buy into this " when the school says he/she is doing well ". yes, they don't want their child labeled !. so they are thankful when the team says he's the top roll model of his class. they are quick to declassify their child, and most regress. they have an overload and can't keep up. then there are parents like us who know better.

but even though your son needs social skills and his team states it doesn't interfere with his school work. it does interfere with is every day life and so does life skills. Roxanna or Pam has better wording for this. Maybe they can help me out here. if a child is doing well in academics and poor in social skills. that not going to help him when he is finished with H.S. and he can't apply for a job because he doesn't know how to dress, or apply himself for an interview. If I remember right, you said you need a speech teacher to help him express himself ? and social skills as well ? maybe with organization too. if not, what are you requesting for that they aren't helping you with?

have you ever gone into your school with an advocate ? when they see you have someone supporting you that knows their rights, they are a little more careful. Also, an advocate can catch something that you missed or remind you of things you forgot, or even just support you with your request for services for your son. Have you called state ed to see if you can get the help for your child that you need ? (even If you know your rights, an advocate their to support you helps out lots).

Roser_woman2 <me2ruth > wrote:

>> Now with Ruth, that school is just giving her a hard time !. Sheneeds to document everything and document everything that she isrequesting and let the school put it back in writing to her why theyaren't providing her son with ...Rose, I've done all this. Like I said, it isn't this simple if yourchild's academic ability level is above grade level. What they'll putin writing is that he is "successful in the classroom" and "accessingthe general curriculum", ignoring the fact that it is inappropriate tobe using grade level as a yardstick and ignoring any functionalproblems, because "it isn't causing any educational problems". Idoubt very much that that boy you heard about is really doing fine anddoesn't need an IEP. He wouldn't meet the dx if he was typical. He'scaught in the same vicious circle as my son. And I'll bet the schoolwould tell you that he is going "great". Sometimes even parents buyinto this, if they aren't good observers and don't notice their childis capable of a lot more than where they are at.Ruth

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[Guest guest]

>

> What you are referring to, I think, is the " purpose " section of the

IDEA. In part is says, "

> �300.1 Purposes. The purposes of this part are--

>

> (a) To ensure that all children with disabilities have available to

them a free appropriate public education that emphasizes special

education and related services designed to meet their unique needs and

prepare them for further education, employment, and independent

living;... "

>

> so while the school might say " we only have to focus on educational

needs " , they actually do have to focus on needs that will fit the

above statement, which would include social skills.

Yes, this is what I was talking about. There is also a place

somewhere, if I remember correctly, that actually uses the word

" functioning " .

Of course, that is out of context, though, and it is never that simple.

Ruth

[Guest guest]

>

> Well, in a complete educational evaluation, they need to evaluate

all areas of delay, even if it's not related to the dx. So they

definitely do have to evaluate for OT and ST. Otherwise, they

couldn't know whether the child needs OT or ST in the first place. As

for disability category, that would be what OHI is for.

Roxanna, they don't have to do anything if they can find a reason they

can put in writing to justify why not. " Child find " is not happening.

They put the burden of proof that the child " needs " an evaluation on

the parents. Rather than the school districts " finding " the disabled

children, the children's parents are having to do the evaluations on

their own dime and present them to the school and try to make a case.

This is pretty much the way it goes in Texas. Even if your child has

an obvious case, they won't do everything they are supposed to. Just

because there are laws that say otherwise, doesn't mean it is a done

deal. The IDEA laws are not terribly well followed in many states. I

feel like special ed has turned into something only for the rich and

the poor (the poor because they qualify for services the rest of us

can't get--at least it seems that way to me--correct me if I'm wrong).

The majority of society is not getting any benefit. Huge numbers of

people in my state are either homeschooling or sending their kids to

private schools, some of them incredibly expensive special ed schools,

because they can't get special ed services from the schools. And I

can't say as I see much being done about it. I work full-time and

don't have deep pockets, so the cause won't be getting much from me

other than whatever roads I pave for my own kids. Like I've said many

times, I'm just thankful I can get good health insurance for my kids.

Ruth

[Guest guest]

>

> That's it. When a parent has a concern with a child's social

skills, and the school says it doesn't interfere with their academics.

some schools won't give the child a social skills class just because

the child is doing well in academics.

> Thanks, I'm going to share this with my friend who is also having

an issue with this at her school.

I don't think that is why. The school administrators are educated

enough to know better. They don't do it because they don't have

enough kids to make a class and it isn't cost effective. It's a

headache. In the case of my son, they would have to hire a new

teacher who specializes in gifted kids with social skills problems and

either find other kids scattered all over our 45,000-student school

district with similar receptive/expressive communication skills or

give him one-on-one. They don't have a teacher qualified to teach him

speech right now. And I know from my own experience, that it is very

difficult to find someone with experience working with bright kids

with LDs. It would be a major thing. To do it right, they would have

to bus some kids to other schools to get them all together to form a

class.

Ruth

[Guest guest]

You all are going to have to stop putting my name in the subject line

if you want me to shut up LOL.

Ruth

[Guest guest]

I think our sons are so similar. Once you find that teacher who can teach bright kids with communication problems, please send the bus to Austin, TX to pick up Dylan!

( ) Re: off topic question - Ruth

>> That's it. When a parent has a concern with a child's socialskills, and the school says it doesn't interfere with their academics.some schools won't give the child a social skills class just becausethe child is doing well in academics.> Thanks, I'm going to share this with my friend who is also havingan issue with this at her school.I don't think that is why. The school administrators are educatedenough to know better. They don't do it because they don't haveenough kids to make a class and it isn't cost effective. It's aheadache. In the case of my son, they would have to hire a newteacher who specializes in gifted kids with social skills problems andeither find other

kids scattered all over our 45,000-student schooldistrict with similar receptive/expressiv e communication skills orgive him one-on-one. They don't have a teacher qualified to teach himspeech right now. And I know from my own experience, that it is verydifficult to find someone with experience working with bright kidswith LDs. It would be a major thing. To do it right, they would haveto bus some kids to other schools to get them all together to form aclass.Ruth

[Guest guest]

if this is known in the state of Texas, why hasn't anyone started a class action? r_woman2 <me2ruth@...> wrote: >> Well, in a complete educational evaluation, they need to evaluateall areas of delay, even if it's not related to the dx. So theydefinitely do have to evaluate for OT and ST. Otherwise, theycouldn't know whether the child needs OT or ST in

the first place. Asfor disability category, that would be what OHI is for.Roxanna, they don't have to do anything if they can find a reason theycan put in writing to justify why not. "Child find" is not happening.They put the burden of proof that the child "needs" an evaluation onthe parents. Rather than the school districts "finding" the disabledchildren, the children's parents are having to do the evaluations ontheir own dime and present them to the school and try to make a case.This is pretty much the way it goes in Texas. Even if your child hasan obvious case, they won't do everything they are supposed to. Justbecause there are laws that say otherwise, doesn't mean it is a donedeal. The IDEA laws are not terribly well followed in many states. Ifeel like special ed has turned into something only for the rich andthe poor (the poor because they qualify for services the rest of uscan't get--at least it seems that

way to me--correct me if I'm wrong).The majority of society is not getting any benefit. Huge numbers ofpeople in my state are either homeschooling or sending their kids toprivate schools, some of them incredibly expensive special ed schools,because they can't get special ed services from the schools. And Ican't say as I see much being done about it. I work full-time anddon't have deep pockets, so the cause won't be getting much from meother than whatever roads I pave for my own kids. Like I've said manytimes, I'm just thankful I can get good health insurance for my kids.Ruth

[Guest guest]

Ruth, no one wants you to shut up !!!! I'm learning so much from all the hard fighting you have to go through. and if everyone keeps posting their experiences that they went through, maybe someone here will have something they tried that worked for them, that you haven't tried yet. we all care and just want to find a way to help you get the services your son needs through his school. Roser_woman2 <me2ruth@...> wrote: You all are going to have to stop putting

my name in the subject lineif you want me to shut up LOL. :)Ruth

[Guest guest]

I agree, some schools/areas do the most work to get out of providing even common, simple services. I advocated for a family once at a very small school and the sped director and principal acted as if the children got a disability just to annoy them and take their money. It was beyond just annoying and ridiculous - I literally had the principal screaming in my face, pointing his finger at me the whole time. Luckily, I kept my sense of humor. If it had been about my own kids, I would have quickly lost it and been in tears - which the mother was by that point. I don't think I've seen people quite so dedicated to deny services as these. And I had to get a lawyer to get services for my own kids at my own school. I think this other school was far worse.

Anyway, I agree about who gets the services. It works much the same way here. Most all the people I know in my school district with kids who are AS have left the school and either homeschool or take their kids to private schools. We could never afford the private schools plus, I don't think they could manage the behaviors either. It's also a long drive to the closest LD school for me, even if I could afford the tuition.

We do have an "autism scholarship" program here in Ohio. They will pay a set fee towards services in the IEP so parents can have a choice. I have never been so thrilled with this program because of two reasons - one reason being that there are so few places to get services in our area. It will work for those folks living in metro areas but not for people in smaller towns.

Don't lose all hope though - gather evidence, keep paperwork and perhaps you can file a complaint with the state at some point. Maybe you can find some others to join you? You might also get together with the superintendent of schools and the director of sped with a few sped parents and have regular meetings to discuss problems in the school. We've done that before and actually things went fairly well. No big huge earth moving changes - but small changes. Chip away...

RoxannaAutism Happens

( ) Re: off topic question - Ruth

>> Well, in a complete educational evaluation, they need to evaluateall areas of delay, even if it's not related to the dx. So theydefinitely do have to evaluate for OT and ST. Otherwise, theycouldn't know whether the child needs OT or ST in the first place. Asfor disability category, that would be what OHI is for.Roxanna, they don't have to do anything if they can find a reason theycan put in writing to justify why not. "Child find" is not happening.They put the burden of proof that the child "needs" an evaluation onthe parents. Rather than the school districts "finding" the disabledchildren, the children's parents are having to do the evaluations ontheir own dime and present them to the school and try to make a case.This is pretty much the way it goes in Texas. Even if your child hasan obvious case, they won't do everything they are supposed to. Justbecause there are laws that say otherwise, doesn't mean it is a donedeal. The IDEA laws are not terribly well followed in many states. Ifeel like special ed has turned into something only for the rich andthe poor (the poor because they qualify for services the rest of uscan't get--at least it seems that way to me--correct me if I'm wrong).The majority of society is not getting any benefit. Huge numbers ofpeople in my state are either homeschooling or sending their kids toprivate schools, some of them incredibly expensive special ed schools,because they can't get special ed services from the schools. And Ican't say as I see much being done about it. I work full-time anddon't have deep pockets, so the cause won't be getting much from meother than whatever roads I pave for my own kids. Like I've said manytimes, I'm just thankful I can get good health insurance for my kids.RuthNo virus found in this incoming message.

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[Guest guest]

> Don't lose all hope though - gather evidence, keep paperwork and

perhaps you can file a complaint with the state at some point. Maybe

you can find some others to join you? You might also get together

with the superintendent of schools and the director of sped with a few

sped parents and have regular meetings to discuss problems in the

school.

Well, like I said, I've been doing all these things for several years

now. And things keep progressing. My attitude has really changed

though. I don't see " getting services " as some big answer. Except

maybe getting the school to pay for my own speech/OT therapists. The

more I get experience having to find someone who can work effectively

both with autism and with high-IQ kids with LDs, the more I'm

skeptical the school would ever be able to come up with such a person.

And how long would it take them? My kids are going into 8th grade!

At the least, I can see that will be just as big a battle to get

effective SPED teachers and get them trained just for my kids as it

would to get services in the first place. Anyway, I think I finally

found a therapy center that can give my sons good, thorough speech

evaluations, and I'm going to see what they think the schools can

actually do to help my kids. My son with the AS dx is in the middle

of his evaluation right now (it is taking more than one session), and

I'm going to ask her what she thinks about evaluating the other one,

even though he doesn't get his AS/ADHD eval until Aug. 11. I'm just

thinking they have a lot more openings in the summer than during the

school year, even though he isn't firmly dx'd yet.

I spent a lot of last school year doing my own evaluations, thinking,

and letting the school experiment. They kept the son with the dx

under " observation " for half the school year. I'm thinking about

writing the principal for another full eval, at least for the one with

an AS dx and maybe the other, since their other eval was not complete

and I have all this new info. Seems like it ought to be a cinch.

Thanks for listening!

Ruth

[Guest guest]

Ruth, What kind of therapy center did you find ? also, what kind of speech evaluation are they doing ?. is it speech pragmatics ? CAPT Testings ?. My son was accepted to go to a speech pathologist to help him with expressive language/verbalizing his needs & problem solving twice a week and my insurance would pay for it. BUT, it's a 1 1/2 hour drive each way. with the prices of gas, I was so sorry I couldn't afford to take him there. They saw my concerns and was willing to work with my son. but the expense to get him there and back couldn't work for us. the next option was to ask the school to help with the gas expenses. they said no because we can teach him that here at school. but they wouldn't give him that help over this summer and on his school IEP says, he is doing well but we will give him help with : then they listed all the examples I

wrote to them with incidents that happened in school. they couldn't justify that by saying " he is doing well " because I wrote a detailed letter with names of kids/adults that were there. so there was no way out of that one. but they are now taking everything I say literally and only write up the concerns I send them in writing. BUT - everything else is fine. At my meetings I now say, I know you don't see it because you just don't understand HFA at all. you only understand the classic autism and my son loses out. Ruth, like you, with my most important concerns, I have to take him for outside help with the professionals that take my insurance. it's something how everybody outside the school See's the same concerns - except the team at school who works with my child. that explains the budget thing. Even parents that I see that p/u their child at the same

time I do, see it... A parent that doesn't even have a special needs child, See's what my concerns are. There is this one teacher that works with my son - She is very nice and has lots of energy. But I think she would be best working with pre-k students. She would be perfect for that . But not with my son in 6th grade. I think she compensates for " not seeing or understanding HFA children by showing off all her energy, trying to ACT funny and friendly but is just clueless to my sons needs. My son's the one losing out while she's smiling all over the place. I just had to add this, at an event the school was having on the last day of school. I've even heard other teachers talking about her behind her back. One even said what's wrong with her... I guess they feel the same way I do... Roser_woman2 <me2ruth@...> wrote: > Don't lose all hope though - gather evidence, keep paperwork andperhaps you can file a complaint with the state at some point. Maybeyou can find some others to join you? You might also get togetherwith the superintendent of schools and the director of sped with a fewsped parents and have regular meetings to discuss problems in theschool. Well, like I said, I've been doing all these

things for several yearsnow. And things keep progressing. My attitude has really changedthough. I don't see "getting services" as some big answer. Exceptmaybe getting the school to pay for my own speech/OT therapists. Themore I get experience having to find someone who can work effectivelyboth with autism and with high-IQ kids with LDs, the more I'mskeptical the school would ever be able to come up with such a person.And how long would it take them? My kids are going into 8th grade! At the least, I can see that will be just as big a battle to geteffective SPED teachers and get them trained just for my kids as itwould to get services in the first place. Anyway, I think I finallyfound a therapy center that can give my sons good, thorough speechevaluations, and I'm going to see what they think the schools canactually do to help my kids. My son with the AS dx is in the middleof his evaluation right now (it is taking more

than one session), andI'm going to ask her what she thinks about evaluating the other one,even though he doesn't get his AS/ADHD eval until Aug. 11. I'm justthinking they have a lot more openings in the summer than during theschool year, even though he isn't firmly dx'd yet.I spent a lot of last school year doing my own evaluations, thinking,and letting the school experiment. They kept the son with the dxunder "observation" for half the school year. I'm thinking aboutwriting the principal for another full eval, at least for the one withan AS dx and maybe the other, since their other eval was not completeand I have all this new info. Seems like it ought to be a cinch.Thanks for listening!Ruth

[Guest guest]

> What kind of therapy center did you find ?

It is a speech/physical/occupational therapy center. The difference

is that pretty much all they do is autism and they get it. It's not

all that big, and although I've been asking around and trying places,

I just found it a few months ago (had been on a waiting list).

also, what kind of speech evaluation are they doing ?. is it speech

pragmatics ? CAPT Testings ?.

This is hard to describe. I'm going to put a link below that explains

the issue. In a nutshell, kids with above-average IQs and above with

autism can't really be tested with conventional speech evaluations.

They can intellectualize too well. I don't know why this is so hard

for so many people to understand. This link explains how to get

around the conventional tests. I don't think schools, in general at

least, have people who are trained to test like this. IME, most

therapy centers don't either.

http://www.aspieinfo.com/for_speech_paths.htm

(click on the link " How to assess for pragmatic language deficits... " )

I know what you mean about the school's " but he's doing great " and

" but we can do that " . Don't give up though. Keep picking at them

with evidence and logic. That's what I keep doing, and we keep

progressing. Way too slow, of course, but at least we aren't going

backwards.

Good luck, and thanks for the support!

Ruth

[Guest guest]

Ruth, you are so right - the schools don't understand this and some professionals (speech pathologist) don't either. Our social skills teacher (specializes in autism) said to me the schools don't get it because they use the basic testings that are good for N.T. children. but not good for our Autistic kids because our kids are too high functioning for these test. Does that make sense to you ? My son can memorize all these test... he also said our kids are visual learners, and these test the schools use - like for pragmatics - are all visual - so my son does well with those testings. they just don't have any other type of testings for him... Thanks for posting this information !, I'm going to check it out tonight... Roser_woman2 <me2ruth@...> wrote: > What kind of therapy center did you find ? It is a speech/physical/occupational therapy center. The differenceis that pretty much all they do is autism and they get it. It's notall that big, and although I've been asking around and trying places,I just found it a few months ago (had been on a waiting list). also, what kind of speech evaluation are they doing ?. is it speechpragmatics ? CAPT Testings ?. This is hard to describe. I'm going to put a link

below that explainsthe issue. In a nutshell, kids with above-average IQs and above withautism can't really be tested with conventional speech evaluations. They can intellectualize too well. I don't know why this is so hardfor so many people to understand. This link explains how to getaround the conventional tests. I don't think schools, in general atleast, have people who are trained to test like this. IME, mosttherapy centers don't either.http://www.aspieinfo.com/for_speech_paths.htm(click on the link "How to assess for pragmatic language deficits...")I know what you mean about the school's "but he's doing great" and"but we can do that". Don't give up though. Keep picking at themwith evidence and logic. That's what I keep doing, and we keepprogressing. Way too slow, of course, but at least we aren't goingbackwards.Good

luck, and thanks for the support!Ruth

[Guest guest]

Great link, Ruth! As I was reading your post, I was thinking of Winner and here you linked to her article.

My ds's current ST went to a conference by Winner. She came back with a lot of great ideas and does her own informal assessments in addition to the "regular" assessments.

RoxannaAutism Happens

( ) Re: off topic question - Ruth

> What kind of therapy center did you find ? It is a speech/physical/occupational therapy center. The differenceis that pretty much all they do is autism and they get it. It's notall that big, and although I've been asking around and trying places,I just found it a few months ago (had been on a waiting list). also, what kind of speech evaluation are they doing ?. is it speechpragmatics ? CAPT Testings ?. This is hard to describe. I'm going to put a link below that explainsthe issue. In a nutshell, kids with above-average IQs and above withautism can't really be tested with conventional speech evaluations. They can intellectualize too well. I don't know why this is so hardfor so many people to understand. This link explains how to getaround the conventional tests. I don't think schools, in general atleast, have people who are trained to test like this. IME, mosttherapy centers don't either.http://www.aspieinfo.com/for_speech_paths.htm(click on the link "How to assess for pragmatic language deficits...")I know what you mean about the school's "but he's doing great" and"but we can do that". Don't give up though. Keep picking at themwith evidence and logic. That's what I keep doing, and we keepprogressing. Way too slow, of course, but at least we aren't goingbackwards.Good luck, and thanks for the support!RuthNo virus found in this incoming message.

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