Re: Do we have a right as parents.

[Guest guest]

I too have no regrets about giving my girls meds. If you could see my 16 yr old's horrible meltdowns without the meds you'd be a believer in the meds. My girls don't like who they are without medicine. They are spacy, bouncing off the walls and very defiant. My 21 yr old started on meds when she was in second or third grade. My 16 yr old was making mostly Fs in first grade, By 2nd grade she was on meds and made the honor roll.

......................................................................................................

I don't have any regrets about giving my son meds. I have seen him crying and in emotional pain way to many times because he has done something impulsive and as a result thinks he is a terrible kid. He has suggested to me that I just kill him for doing something wrong. The meds help that immensely. He feels good about himself. I don't do it for me or the teachers I do it for him because of that look on his face that breaks my heart when he hates himself. He will never be able to mimic the nt world and I don't think that he cares. But he is happy most of the time and when he isn't he can cope. Thats whats important to me not someone elses personal opinion about giving kids meds.Vickie>> Do we have a right as parents to make such radical decisions? To put an innocent child on heavy medication, mind altering drugs - which puts them into a stupor - a good behavior stupor. so that we can manage them and teach them, and develop into model people with model behavior. so they can mimic the NT world? Okay, that's the negative way of looking at it. now for the positive side: minimizing the stimming and tantrums, nit-pickiness, curt responses and chutzpah, in order to help them focus and bring out the real true sweet side of your child's personality.>

____________________________________________________________

All is not lost! Click now for professional data recovery.

[Guest guest]

I see both, actually. I totally think it depends on your kid......but that's obvious.

Ian was on ADHD meds and then, as he entered 5th, started getting really frustrated, mad, etc. We think a lot of it was seeing that he was not fitting. Yet,,,,,amazingly, he is very happy with the way he is. Anyway,,,,,we ended up putting him on Risperdal for anger. This helped a bit.In the end, after a lot of crap, we pulled him out and let him do school virtually at home. The minute we took the "stressor" out of the equation, he was a million times better.

He's not on any meds.

He's still "active",,,,but he's aging and learning to "cool it". But, it's just gonna be the way he is.

Taking the "stressor" out of the equation made the Risperdal un-needed.

He talks, engages in conversation, wants people and friends in his life but is totally happy with how he is and with himself.

***Then,,,,there's my son, Jack. He's always been "active".........never put on anything because he didn't really "fit" the criteria. Didn't talk till about 3, trouble reading/processing. He hated to sit to read. Didn't want to write.....was calm, though, if that makes sense. Tested for hearing/sight/, seen many docs to see if there was an LD. Everyone said, "Nope, and he's very smart.....some things just take time."

This year, 3rd, his teacher, (who all my kids have had), asked if we had ever thought that maybe his processing speed issues were becasue he couldn't "calm down in his head".

Went to a new doc and he agreed. We put him on an ADHD med and he honestly has become himself (but better). He was told by the doc that he is still the one in control of his decisions,,,,,,good and bad, but that the med will help him think about the choice a bit more.

He's getting great "behavior sheets" sent home now. And he knows it. It makes him happy.....and.......he doesnt' mind sitting and reading now with me. He is still wild at home (they do wear off...he he), but that's him.

***So,,,,I guess like the other ladies are saying,,,it's very personal. If it helps you son in the environment that he'll be in, then how can you not? BUT,,,,,,I think if you do it so that they DO fit,,,,,,,,then it becomes a bit choice.

We, actually, are deciding where to send Ian for 8th grade. He wants to go to school to see friends, he says. So,,,,,btwn a school system that he was in,,,,that knows him and says they'll work with us,,,,but a bigger school.

OR....

a small, private church school. I think we're going for the small one, simply because he can always "improve" on skills and learn to adapt to the larger setting,,,,,but I fear sticking him back in a bigger school and seeing the spiral again. (I know,,,,my problem)...

So,

good luck with your decision......it's a biggie,,,,,,but I dont' think it's one that you just make and then stick with forever.

It's one that has to be re-evaluated when times/emotions/situations change.

Robin

Normal is just a cycle on a washing machine!!

From: Norma Filbrun <n.filbrun1@...>Subject: ( ) Re: Do we have a right as parents. Date: Tuesday, May 12, 2009, 8:43 AM

I too have no regrets about giving my girls meds. If you could see my 16 yr old's horrible meltdowns without the meds you'd be a believer in the meds. My girls don't like who they are without medicine. They are spacy, bouncing off the walls and very defiant. My 21 yr old started on meds when she was in second or third grade. My 16 yr old was making mostly Fs in first grade, By 2nd grade she was on meds and made the honor roll.

............. ......... ......... ......... ......... ......... ......... ......... ......... ......... ........

I don't have any regrets about giving my son meds. I have seen him crying and in emotional pain way to many times because he has done something impulsive and as a result thinks he is a terrible kid. He has suggested to me that I just kill him for doing something wrong. The meds help that immensely. He feels good about himself. I don't do it for me or the teachers I do it for him because of that look on his face that breaks my heart when he hates himself. He will never be able to mimic the nt world and I don't think that he cares. But he is happy most of the time and when he isn't he can cope. Thats whats important to me not someone elses personal opinion about giving kids meds.Vickie>> Do we have a right as parents to make such radical decisions? To

put an innocent child on heavy medication, mind altering drugs - which puts them into a stupor - a good behavior stupor. so that we can manage them and teach them, and develop into model people with model behavior. so they can mimic the NT world? Okay, that's the negative way of looking at it. now for the positive side: minimizing the stimming and tantrums, nit-pickiness, curt responses and chutzpah, in order to help them focus and bring out the real true sweet side of your child's personality.> ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ ___ All is not lost! Click now for professional data recovery.

[Guest guest]

Well, the " right " meds won't have them in a stupor. It can take a couple weeks

or so to adjust to some meds and maybe it seems that way at first, but that

should pass as the body adjusts. If not, then not the right med and try

another.

Another way to look at it for some targeted problems and/or behaviors is that

some meds target certain things, like the brain & neurotransmitters. So perhaps

the problem is the dopamine level or with serotonin, etc. The " right " med can

help fix the balance, which can correct the " problem. " Similarly, I thought

recently I might be low on iron and finally took an iron supplement. Felt 110%

better than I'd felt in weeks, seemed amazing how much better, apparently I was

lacking it.

>

> Do we have a right as parents to make such radical decisions? To put an

innocent child on heavy medication, mind altering drugs - which puts them into a

stupor - a good behavior stupor. so that we can manage them and teach them, and

develop into model people with model behavior. so they can mimic the NT world?

Okay, that's the negative way of looking at it. now for the positive side:

minimizing the stimming and tantrums, nit-pickiness, curt responses and

[Guest guest]

First, do not assume that meds put people or kids into "stupors." If that occurs, it is the wrong med or the wrong dosage. Meds are also not "mind altering" in the sense that I think you are saying it, as if it takes away the person and leaves behind someone else. Look at medication for something outside of the mind, for an example. Should we not medicate for diabetes because it will "alter" who they are? Of course not. We have to provide what their body needs or correct what the body is doing wrong, even if that is provided in the form of medication. Many times, it is through medication that we can control and manage life disorders. And that is the whole point. Meds are created to solve problems like this and to improve life quality and life expectancy. It is not different for neurological problems. When we take medication for depression or OCD, it helps curb the glitch that is causing a major life problem. It's not taken so we turn into zombies or alter who we are as people. A neurological problem is not something a person wills into being. People are not choosing to have depression or OCD or attention deficit.

As for "do we have a right as parents?" We have more than a right, we have an obligation. If the problem becomes so great that it affects daily life or development in the child, we are obligated to find help for that. If that pat

h leads to medication, then it does. I find that most parents try very hard to avoid meds and only try meds as a last resort after therapies and counseling and other forms of "help" have been exhausted.

Roxanna

Autism Happens

( ) Do we have a right as parents.

Do we have a right as parents to make such radical decisions? To put an innocent child on heavy medication, mind altering drugs – which puts them into a stupor – a good behavior stupor6 so that we can manage them and teach them, and develop into model people with model behavior… so they can mimic the NT world? Okay, that’s the negative way of looking at it. now for the positive side: minimizing the stimming and tantrums, nit-pickiness, curt responses and chutzpah, in order to help them focus and bring out the real true sweet side of your child’s personality.

I’m obviously facing this fork in the road, and cannot sleep at night! This, after 5 professional ‘second’ opinions! Not to mention, fancy top-notch Manhattan doctors!

Agggggggggggggggggggggg!

We found the real 'Hotel California' and the 'Seinfeld' diner. What will you find? Explore WhereItsAt.com.

[Guest guest]

I worry like this too. My counselor said to me " It's to bad your

daughter's anxiety is ruining her childhood " wow ...this lady never

ever gives any advice on medication at all.

I worry to about adverse reactions and tramatizing her even more.

But it is something to think about. That we are allowing

anxiety (most of the time) ruin our kids lives.

Pam

" Brooklyn " <bestmombrooklyn@...> wrote:

>

> Do we have a right as parents to make such radical decisions? To put an

innocent child on heavy medication, mind altering drugs - which puts them into a

stupor - a good behavior stupor. so that we can manage them and teach them, and

develop into model people with model behavior. so they can mimic the NT world?

Okay, that's the negative way of looking at it. now for the positive side:

minimizing the stimming and tantrums, nit-pickiness, curt responses and

chutzpah, in order to help them focus and bring out the real true sweet side of

your child's personality.

>

>

>

> I'm obviously facing this fork in the road, and cannot sleep at night! This,

after 5 professional 'second' opinions! Not to mention, fancy top-notch

Manhattan doctors!

>

>

>

> Agggggggggggggggggggggg!

>

[Guest guest]

I doubt that a councelor can make any recommendations about meds other than to

refer you to a doctor. Even Psycologists can not prescribe meds. Certainly

licensed therepists and licensed clinical social workers (which is what most

councelors are) can not. If you want more information you really need to talk

to a MD about it.

Vickie

> >

> > Do we have a right as parents to make such radical decisions? To put an

innocent child on heavy medication, mind altering drugs - which puts them into a

stupor - a good behavior stupor. so that we can manage them and teach them, and

develop into model people with model behavior. so they can mimic the NT world?

Okay, that's the negative way of looking at it. now for the positive side:

minimizing the stimming and tantrums, nit-pickiness, curt responses and

chutzpah, in order to help them focus and bring out the real true sweet side of

your child's personality.

> >

> >

> >

> > I'm obviously facing this fork in the road, and cannot sleep at night! This,

after 5 professional 'second' opinions! Not to mention, fancy top-notch

Manhattan doctors!

> >

> >

> >

> > Agggggggggggggggggggggg!

> >

>

[Guest guest]

The MD and the therapist should ideally work together.

My daughter has struggled since preschool with severe anticapatory anxiety about

school and had anxiety and panic off and on in the school. Parents are caught in

the middle. Ideally school at least should not be such a anxiety producing

place. But it is. Ideally

therapist should be able to treat anxiety. But kids with AS don't

often do well in therapy (Attwood). My daughter included.

This therapist has worked with us for the last 5 years and is saying look this

anxiety is just getting worse. And another school placement has stressed too

they are often geared for the ADHD student that want more stimulation not less.

Now the MD psychitrist tells AS parents we don't like to give

medication for AS kids they are sensitive. Have you parent done

all you can to help treat the anxiety?

The parent (my life story) is in the middle of schools not geared to AS kids,

therapist that have limited tools that kids with AS want to employ (insight

being a big issue with Executive Function Disorder)

and psychitrist (rightfully so) reluctant to treat AS kids.

If our kids with AS have anxiety issues we struggle in finding

treatment. And our kids suffer.

Noone is to blame though. The National Institute of Health

is studing AS kids on antianxiety/depressent medications to find a safe dose and

medication. It just is not soon enough.

Some of our As kids drown in anxiety. Noone is to blame. Not the therapist that

has worked with us for years saying enough suffering,

or the MD saying lets be careful or the school saying there are limits to what

we can but in place.

Although I wish it was easier to get treatment and get all the team

working together it is not.

Most AS kids do well without medication, this is often more the case. But some

do not.

I hope that sharing this struggle helps others cope with

the struggle some AS parents have to endure until they

truely find a MD and therapist that really understand

how to create a treatment plan for our kidos.

Pam

> > >

> > > Do we have a right as parents to make such radical decisions? To put an

innocent child on heavy medication, mind altering drugs - which puts them into a

stupor - a good behavior stupor. so that we can manage them and teach them, and

develop into model people with model behavior. so they can mimic the NT world?

Okay, that's the negative way of looking at it. now for the positive side:

minimizing the stimming and tantrums, nit-pickiness, curt responses and

chutzpah, in order to help them focus and bring out the real true sweet side of

your child's personality.

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > I'm obviously facing this fork in the road, and cannot sleep at night!

This, after 5 professional 'second' opinions! Not to mention, fancy top-notch

Manhattan doctors!

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Agggggggggggggggggggggg!

> > >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

I truly understand how hard the decision is. But here is my take on it:

Medication (the right medication, in the right dose) can provide your child with

relief from many of the things that he can't manage alone. Stimming, meltdowns,

tantrums -- those are all strong reactions to the stresses he's feeling. He's

struggling to cope with anxiety and anger and overwhelming feelings that come

out in his behaviors, because he's trying to sooth himself, release the

overwhelming feelings, etc.

I see medication (again, used carefully) as a tool to help him cope. Period.

It's not about making life easier for everyone else -- it's about making life

better for HIM. If you can use medication to manage his anxiety and

sensitivities, then he can deflect some of the energy he's expending now on just

coping into actual positive activities like learning and communicating with

people and developing friendships or effective relationships with the people

around him.

Medication can help reduce his anxiety and stress, so he's not using all that

energy just to make his way through every day. It may be able to help him

concentrate, or reduce the feelings that create " noise " in his head, so he can

listen and participate and actually enjoy what's going on.

You need to feel confident in the professionals you're working with, so that you

understand why you're medicating. But I think if you can decide that it would

be good for your child's needs, regardless of the needs of the people around

him/her right now, then I think it could be an important piece of improving your

child's life.

Also, I know you're struggling with figuring out your responsibility in

" imposing " something on your child. But the flip side is that if there is

something that medical professionals recognize as an accepted and appropriate

way of helping your child, should you as a parent withhold that helping aid from

your child?

Diane

>

> Do we have a right as parents to make such radical decisions? To put an

innocent child on heavy medication, mind altering drugs - which puts them into a

stupor - a good behavior stupor. so that we can manage them and teach them, and

develop into model people with model behavior. so they can mimic the NT world?

Okay, that's the negative way of looking at it. now for the positive side:

minimizing the stimming and tantrums, nit-pickiness, curt responses and

chutzpah, in order to help them focus and bring out the real true sweet side of

your child's personality.

>

>

>

> I'm obviously facing this fork in the road, and cannot sleep at night! This,

after 5 professional 'second' opinions! Not to mention, fancy top-notch

Manhattan doctors!

>

>

>

> Agggggggggggggggggggggg!

>

[Guest guest]

Great post, Diane. I also agree with Roxanna's post from earlier - how can we as parents NOT medicate our children if necessary. Like she said, if a child was diabetic there would be no question IF we would medicate. For my son, the medications he takes don't solve his problems or make them go away but enable him to be calm enough (less anxious, more focused, etc.) that he is able to make better choices and do the work necessary to make his life better.On May 13, 2009, at 12:10 PM, dphock wrote:I truly understand how hard the decision is. But here is my take on it:Medication (the right medication, in the right dose) can provide your child with relief from many of the things that he can't manage alone. Stimming, meltdowns, tantrums -- those are all strong reactions to the stresses he's feeling. He's struggling to cope with anxiety and anger and overwhelming feelings that come out in his behaviors, because he's trying to sooth himself, release the overwhelming feelings, etc. I see medication (again, used carefully) as a tool to help him cope. Period. It's not about making life easier for everyone else -- it's about making life better for HIM. If you can use medication to manage his anxiety and sensitivities, then he can deflect some of the energy he's expending now on just coping into actual positive activities like learning and communicating with people and developing friendships or effective relationships with the people around him. Medication can help reduce his anxiety and stress, so he's not using all that energy just to make his way through every day. It may be able to help him concentrate, or reduce the feelings that create "noise" in his head, so he can listen and participate and actually enjoy what's going on.You need to feel confident in the professionals you're working with, so that you understand why you're medicating. But I think if you can decide that it would be good for your child's needs, regardless of the needs of the people around him/her right now, then I think it could be an important piece of improving your child's life.Also, I know you're struggling with figuring out your responsibility in "imposing" something on your child. But the flip side is that if there is something that medical professionals recognize as an accepted and appropriate way of helping your child, should you as a parent withhold that helping aid from your child? Diane >> Do we have a right as parents to make such radical decisions? To put an innocent child on heavy medication, mind altering drugs - which puts them into a stupor - a good behavior stupor. so that we can manage them and teach them, and develop into model people with model behavior. so they can mimic the NT world? Okay, that's the negative way of looking at it. now for the positive side: minimizing the stimming and tantrums, nit-pickiness, curt responses and chutzpah, in order to help them focus and bring out the real true sweet side of your child's personality.> > > > I'm obviously facing this fork in the road, and cannot sleep at night! This, after 5 professional 'second' opinions! Not to mention, fancy top-notch Manhattan doctors!> > > > Agggggggggggggggggggggg!>

[Guest guest]

You're right--and that's scary.

NO child should be medicated to the point that they are in a drooling stupor.

It amazes me that there are doctors out there that will allow a child to be

medicated to that degree. Any doctor or parent that would allow a child to be

in that condition makes me wonder.

Then again, you don't know what the child is going through. Is she in the

process of trying a new med?? Are they just discovering that hey, this drug

makes her a zombie, and we need a change?? Was the last dose too low, and now

this one is too much and they are working through that?? It could be a lot of

things.

This is a problem I was worried about with my son, you know?? I don't want him

to be a drooling zombie. The doctor explained to me that if a child is in that

state, they are overmedicated, and the dosage or drug should be changed

immediately. The purpose of the drug is to help the child focus and do their

work, not make them little zombies.

Kinda hard to judge that situation without all the info.

I hope that situation gets worked out, and those parents aren't abusing the meds

the girl is on to make her where she is " not a bother. " Sad if that's the case.

> > >

> > > Do we have a right as parents to make such radical decisions? To put an

innocent child on heavy medication, mind altering drugs - which puts them into a

stupor - a good behavior stupor. so that we can manage them and teach them, and

develop into model people with model behavior. so they can mimic the NT world?

Okay, that's the negative way of looking at it. now for the positive side:

minimizing the stimming and tantrums, nit-pickiness, curt responses and

chutzpah, in order to help them focus and bring out the real true sweet side of

your child's personality.

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > I'm obviously facing this fork in the road, and cannot sleep at night!

This, after 5 professional 'second' opinions! Not to mention, fancy top-notch

Manhattan doctors!

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Agggggggggggggggggggggg!

> > >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Right now, we are not medicating our son, but when he goes back to school, we

will see if he needs it, and we will be medicating him for the ADHD--only if he

needs it. We will see how he does without and go from there.

The doctor said he has social anxiety--but that it was mild, and if we keep him

interacting with other people, that she thinks he won't need meds at all for it.

We don't have any social skills groups here either, I just try to get him in

some play groups with the homeschool society. It would be nice if there were

more of those therapies in our area. I feel your pain.

Wow about the paxil. I would have stopped that, too. Hope she is doing better

now!!

> > > > >

> > > > > Do we have a right as parents to make such radical decisions? To put

an innocent child on heavy medication, mind altering drugs - which puts them

into a stupor - a good behavior stupor. so that we can manage them and teach

them, and develop into model people with model behavior. so they can mimic the

NT world? Okay, that's the negative way of looking at it. now for the positive

side: minimizing the stimming and tantrums, nit-pickiness, curt responses and

chutzpah, in order to help them focus and bring out the real true sweet side of

your child's personality.

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > I'm obviously facing this fork in the road, and cannot sleep at night!

This, after 5 professional 'second' opinions! Not to mention, fancy top-notch

Manhattan doctors!

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > Agggggggggggggggggggggg!

> > > > >

> > > >

> > >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

I have never been pushed into medication for AS. Just the opposite.

We are on the east coast. I belong to the group ASPEN in NJ.

I have been lectured how there is no approved medication for AS

repeatedly. But our kids do drown in anxiety.

And so they are treated on very very low doses.

The Mass General has a page on Asperger and medication.

http://www2.massgeneral.org/schoolpsychiatry/info_autism.asp#aspergerdisorder

The National Institute of Health is running trials in a few

medications for AS. I hope this link works.

http://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/results?term=asperger+trial+

Our kids are so sensitive. Stanford is a major center

in neuropsychology on the west coast. Don't tell me

you have been there already

How can manage to get our sensitive kids to these centers?

I can't.

I don't see a clear cut medication for our kids, which is what the

doctors tell us and why I am too dragging my feet. But know I need to do this.

Pam

> > > > >

> > > > > Do we have a right as parents to make such radical decisions? To put

an innocent child on heavy medication, mind altering drugs - which puts them

into a stupor - a good behavior stupor. so that we can manage them and teach

them, and develop into model people with model behavior. so they can mimic the

NT world? Okay, that's the negative way of looking at it. now for the positive

side: minimizing the stimming and tantrums, nit-pickiness, curt responses and

chutzpah, in order to help them focus and bring out the real true sweet side of

your child's personality.

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > I'm obviously facing this fork in the road, and cannot sleep at night!

This, after 5 professional 'second' opinions! Not to mention, fancy top-notch

Manhattan doctors!

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > Agggggggggggggggggggggg!

> > > > >

> > > >

> > >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Was your daughter on the very low does that Mass General recommends

for our kids? 1 mg and only very slowly increased.

Apparently for our kids higher does do no good.

Pam

> > > > >

> > > > > Do we have a right as parents to make such radical decisions? To put

an innocent child on heavy medication, mind altering drugs - which puts them

into a stupor - a good behavior stupor. so that we can manage them and teach

them, and develop into model people with model behavior. so they can mimic the

NT world? Okay, that's the negative way of looking at it. now for the positive

side: minimizing the stimming and tantrums, nit-pickiness, curt responses and

chutzpah, in order to help them focus and bring out the real true sweet side of

your child's personality.

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > I'm obviously facing this fork in the road, and cannot sleep at night!

This, after 5 professional 'second' opinions! Not to mention, fancy top-notch

Manhattan doctors!

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > Agggggggggggggggggggggg!

> > > > >

> > > >

> > >

> >

>