Re: A.S. not A.S.

[Guest guest]

I don't usually post either. Life is way too hectic. But I will email privately if I nerd advice or support. You can do the same.Sent from my iPhoneBlessings, DonnaOn May 25, 2009, at 11:33 PM, BRYAN DOLEZAL <DOLEZAL123@...> wrote:

I've always been here but not always active due to LIFE but you can

ALWAYS email me privately, too; I AM ALWAYS THERE THAT WAY!!!

So, if you don't hear from me, it is because I usually not posting....I

just have too much going on right now myself, so not as active as other

times......but I get all the posts (just don't read 'em all!).... Ruthie

From: donnalmooreDate: Mon, 25 May 2009 23:21:09 -0500Subject: Re: ( ) A.S. not A.S.

Yeah, I think you are right. If the court pulls the past records there is enough to keep custody away from mom. We have letters from a psychiatrist, a social worker, & two counselors at the residential center who have all tried to work with her & found her unfit to deal with Mack. So, hopefully that will be helpful. Now we just have to figure out who to talk to. I used to be on a first name basis with the juvenile court coordinator, so I may give her a cal tomorrow. Maybe if I get the ball rolling & give my husband specific people to call & talk to, then he will be able to take it from there.

Thanks so much for the support. Hope you will continue to be there as we walk thus difficult path.

Sent from my iPhone

Blessings, Donna

On May 25, 2009, at 10:58 PM, BRYAN DOLEZAL <DOLEZAL123msn> wrote:

Seems like if the state gets involved, mom can cooperate, or she will be deemed an unfit parent or likewise, as this is beyond HER at thispoint; she is NOT parenting him nor meeting his needs at this time, andthe child needs help.......guess that does make it reque; we both agreethat our son needs help, and if it means the system, it does.....isn't a dreamfor us but we have great family (one set of family pays enough in taxeseach year that I always tell my son and myself that Gm. & Gp. are payingfor him living there-----and they are!!!!----in a round about way.....

From: donnalmooreDate: Mon, 25 May 2009 21:03:34 -0500Subject: Re: ( ) A.S. not A.S.

The reason we had a reduced rate is because the facility was private & sponsored my the United Methodist Church. So, they gave us a special rate.

My husband & I would be willing to put him in State's custody. We are in Louisiana. The problem is going to be the adoptive mother. Although she walked out, my husband agreed to a limited joint custody. He has final decisions when there is a disagreement, but when we tried to place him in the residential center she called & delayed it by 6 months. After three more arrests for attacking teachers, police, & me, twice, she finally agreed. If she tries to stop my husband from putting him in State custody, I just hope that the State doesn't place him with her & expect my husband to continue to pay for everything. It is such a mess.

I will try NAMI again.

Thanks for the support.Sent from my iPhone

Blessings, Donna

On May 25, 2009, at 8:43 PM, BRYAN DOLEZAL <DOLEZAL123msn> wrote:

WOW---in Iowa, you private pay the FULL RATE, I WILL TELL YOU THAT....in Iowa, the waiting lists are NOT THREE YEARS EITHER!!!!! So, that juststinks.............. I would re-check in to NAMI; we have multiple groups in the Cedar Rapids, IAarea; they do trainings, have specific programs for specific problems here, and I willguarantee you the groups we went to here included the poorest of poor to upper class;I know that for sure!! We had grandparents living in very great neighborhoods thatwere basically fostering their grandchildren with needs trying to help out....single parents,foster parents, and couples......I would TRY AGAIN! The people leading our groups hereare middle class for sure (or higher) so I would just try again...... YOUR INCOME DOES NOT MATTER if you are trying to get him in to services PROVIDED YOUARE WILLING TO COMMIT HIM. We do not qualify for title 19 ourselves; we had it for him becausehe was on a waiver but the waiver programs ARE NOT INCOME BASED........so, title 19 / medicaid andqualifying is NOT THE ISSUE but if you want state funding you have to be willing to put the child in to thestate's custody; we are because he has to have the services, and we have all our rights; we can see himwhenever we want (provided he is being good), etc.; we are NOT ABUSERS or anything so we are differentthan the common case but we are doing what we have to do.....In Iowa, though, you private pay the regularfull rate, not based on income, and it is about $200 a day for residential or PMIC here....I know that for surebecause we were going to do it to 'get a spot' where we wanted once, and decided quickly against that, as wecannot afford that at all!!!!! Ruthie Dolezal

From: donnalmooreDate: Mon, 25 May 2009 18:56:20 -0500Subject: Re: ( ) A.S. not A.S.

I used to attend NAMI meetings but it seemed their focus was on families who qualified for Medicaid or SSI. Our income is to high. Too high for public, yet the rest of us would live in poverty after paying Gor the programs he needs.

The longest hospitalization he has had was 10 days. He is a model patient in that short of a stay. Now 16 months in residential he showed the behaviors. They released him even though the incidents had not decreased since admission. I believe it was because we were a private pay & only paid $600/month. We were the only private kid there. The state would pay $5000/month, but the state would not pay for him to stay there. If the state took custody they would have to spend 3 months reevaluating him & thenplace him wherever there was an available bed. I had already investigated all the other facilities & knew this one was best & he had been on the waiting list for 3 years.

That's why I am so frustrated now!Sent from my iPhone

Blessings, Donna

On May 25, 2009, at 5:11 PM, BRYAN DOLEZAL <DOLEZAL123msn> wrote:

I've addressed this in another e-mail but it is a battle; our story is / was asawful or worse, and it takes A HECK OF A LONG TIME TO GET THE CHILD OUT;our 15 year old was repeating all forms of abuse he learned while visiting his biological father's home to our then 3 year old son including sexual abuse, andwe thought the system would come and get him the next day; HELL NO THEY DID NOT;we had to have him home another 6, and 3 hospitalizations before they would help, and it was only because we did commital papers, etc., so you would just not believe the hell thatparents of mental illness parents go through! It is HORRIBLE.............and there are a lot of us. N.A.M.I.: look that up that is a great place and resource; in YOUR COMMUNITY theycan tell you places to go, take the child, etc.; stand for National Alliance of the Mentally Ill;they have classes for free, support groups, and is run and classes done by people just like me (Iwas going to train to do it and our son just keeps making us too busy so we / I end up not at the time)but everyone doing it, lives with the reality of every single day mental illness with family members, work,etc..............great resource to check in to!!!!! Ruthie Dolezal

From: jrushen Date: Mon, 25 May 2009 12:20:31 -0700Subject: Re: ( ) A.S. not A.S.

How old is your son???? I can't believe that the state won't do anything....he sounds so violent and I too would be frightened. Did you call the State Assistance office? Does he have a medical card? My son does. What about MH/MR? There has to be someone that can help you....did you call you local state representative? He/she may have some ideas. You case sounds so awful...there must be some place for him as he is not funcitoning well at home and I fear for your safety as well as the emotional state of all you!!!!

Jan

I will pray for you and your family also!

Janice Rushen

"I will try to be open to all avenues of wisdom and hope"

absolutely NOT; he cannot live at home safely; he is a danger to himself and others OFTEN, and we justcannot have him home anymroe right now; and, he does not have an IEP or a 504 with his 12 diagnosis including Type Idiabetes; have spent over $10,000 just in lawyer fees to try for 'em; spent another school year trying and fighting.... even thoughhe runs from school 3-6 times a month, can't get one; he does that because of the environment and overwhelmed, but no, we donot want him home; we fought like HECK to get him in to the system....he is legally mentally ill and when those parts of him comeover, he can be off a day to months and months, and cannot be in the family home unless we want to hire people to stay up 24/7,,,,,,,, Ruthie

From: me2ruth (DOT) comDate: Mon, 25 May 2009 14:15:58 +0000Subject: Re: ( ) A.S. not A.S.

>> We are advocating to get him out of there but his DHS worker is not ready to yet; she is still fighting> > for him in there; we love him being close, just that they are such horrible communicators, and not willing> > to accept FACT he has A.S. in the first place; Hi Ruthie; I remember you from before. Can't forget a name like yours. I just wanted to wish you luck. Sounds like your son would be better off at home with a good IEP in the local school. And it sounds from your other son's experience that he could get that, right? Is that what you are thinking? Maybe you will just have to be patient and carefully jump through all the DHS worker's hoops to get him out as soon as possible.Ruth

[Guest guest]

I guess I just need to get back into the proactive stance & get things done. I think doing something will actually helps stress.I am knowledgeable about AS, but none of those strategies seem to work with him. We had excellent therapists at the residential center who helped us put a great plan in place for him upon returning home. We have visual schedules, procedures, etc., but he rejects them all. It is like teenage rebellion times the ODD & the attachment disorder & abandonment issues. We have not been able to find a therapist who really understands AS, except the one in residential. So they try to approach him as bipolar or ODD & his processing is so totally beyond their understanding. He can repeat all the right words, but can't carry forth on the actions.Some days he & I really connect & he will tell me that I am the only one who understands, but then other days be hates me Gor bring consistent & holding him accountable for his actions.It is a difficult road. I am trying hard to stay here to support my husband & help our son. I committed to that 6 years ago, but sometimes it is difficult.Thanks again for all the advice & support. I know that I will be talking with you again soon .Sent from my iPhoneBlessings, DonnaOn May 25, 2009, at 11:31 PM, BRYAN DOLEZAL <DOLEZAL123@...> wrote:

I am not sure what you mean about everyone else placing your son in the

hospital, but THAT could be the problem. He breaks your property, which, by

the way, you CAN PRESS CHARGES FOR----maybe it depends upon his age? BUT

you sure as heck can in IOWA!!!! That is ridiculous; never heard of that before but

yes you can here anyway.....anyway, put the child in the car, and take him to the hospital

WHERE THERE IS A PSYCHE UNIT. You tell them "HE IS A DANGER TO HIMSELF AND OTHERS."

He just got done "punching a hole in our wall," "Telling me I am an fing b 20 times," that he

is going to kill me, break every bone in my body, etc."; if you cannot drive him to the hospital,

when you call 911, you are asking for a police escort to the hospital. YOU DO HAVE TO GOTO A HOSPITAL WITH A CHILD'S PSYCHE UNIT (not all have it)......but yes you can, and yes

you should; this stuff about other people placing him in the hospital is CRAZY!!! YOU CAN DO IT!!!

One time, our son blew up during therapy, the therapist had us come back, and told us we were taking him to

the hospital, but that was something we figured we were doing before we went to therapy; we were hoping

the therapist could calm him down and we could 'avoid it' this time but that didn't work either; we had to

agree to it, and we took him......

As for a psychiatrist: yes, you may have to drive, but child cannot be without medications or a psychiatrist,

in my opinion. THAT IS THE FIRST THING YOU MUST DO; you cannot just keep letting him control the house, and

not get help. Sounds like you live in fear of him, and that is not living, but I would get him a great therapist and

psychiatrist, and don't wait another day; you can't, then call his pediatrician and demand the name of one or get a

referral to see him right away..............

As for you, I would get books and read, read, read, and get as knowledgeable about A.S. as you can, and you do

have to change your mind set to work effectively with these kids; we have had to, I know, as I have done it, as has

my husband as these children DO NOT SEE THE WORLD AS THE REST OF US. In fact, I don't think they want to kill or

harm at all but don't know what else to do, as I see them as miserable, unable to communicate effectively when they

want and need to at times, and I think I am getting where I can just about tell you exactly how my son feels; it amazes

my son when I say something and he can actually say that is exactly what he was trying to say, or what he wishes he

could have said, or he corrects me, but at least it gave us somewhere to start from............

GOOD LUCK.....I don't think you should walk out though rather tackle the bull by the horns here, and get some help. I

also think that you have a great start......For what it is worth, MOST FEMALES do these calls, care, etc.; it is JUST the

way our society IS most of the time...........not all the time, but MOST OF THE TIME....and we can do 10 things at once;

that is why our husbands married us (I am about to have 4 sons come 6-3), but as the mom of 3 boys, I can tell you,

all 3 of them comment with their dad about how amazing I AM; they don't know I do that multiple tasking stuff, so it

IS REAL, and so take it as a compliment; we do it because we can, and thank GOD we can, because SOMEONE has to! HANG

in there and do the best you can. SOunds like the mom quit momming years ago!!!! You may be the step-mom but you are

the mom; he LIVES WITH YOU ALL THE TIME; that MAKES YOU THE MOM!!!!!

Ruthie

From: donnalmooreDate: Mon, 25 May 2009 22:44:20 -0500Subject: Re: ( ) A.S. not A.S.

He sees a psychiatrist who prescribes his meds. This psychiatrist has not done any hospitalizations because she has only been seeing him for a year. He has not actually attacked me but one time this year & I did not call the police. He has become much more verbally threatening & my other son restrains him until he calms down. Or he tries to destroy property- ours & his. But that is not an arrestable offense because he lives here. The reason he has not attacked me is because I no longer put any demands on him.

I go to my room & do not talk to him. I don't tell him to do homework or chores. I can't even tell him to turn off the cartoons so that I can watch TV in my own living room. All of this is to keep from pushing his button & setting him off so that he attacks me. This does not stop him from telling me that he is going to break every bone in my body, break my arm, or choke me to death. At this point they say it is just my perception & my fear. Well, past behavior illicits fear.

Our last psychiatrist who treated him for 4 years before she retired, placed him in the hospital twice. Once he was placed from the ER after the police took him there after he attacked me, them, & threatened to kill all of us & himself. Everytime we got about 4/5 hours notice that he was being released. We were told that if we refused to take him that we would be charged with child abandonment. Not a charge that I can afford as an educator.

As far as a mental health case manager, we have never had one or had one suggested to us by anyone. I don't even know where to go for one. When I tried to get a psychiatrist through the Community Mental Health Center, they told me that they didn't take our insurance. We have two insurances. I called the state office of MH once & they were absolutely no help.

I've tried to find another psychiatrist by getting referrals from other people, but none of the "good" ones are taking new patients. I feel like we can't win for losing.

Where do you get a mental health case manager?

Any help will be appreciated.Sent from my iPhone

Blessings, Donna

On May 25, 2009, at 9:54 PM, "" <hotmail> wrote:

Donna, was reading some of your posts. Does he have a mental health case manager? Any ongoing mental health services? Just seems like he would. And that they would be the ones trying to find a placement for him. Also, what with the threat of violence or actual violence -- have you committed him before due to those reasons? I know they just end up in the hospital and on maybe on meds and are released, but wondering if then you could have him directly placed somewhere, saying he is not welcome back at home, etc.??? >> The reason we had a reduced rate is because the facility was private & > sponsored my the United Methodist Church. So, they gave us a special > rate.> > My husband & I would be willing to put him in State's custody. We are

[Guest guest]

Oh, yes, it is difficult; even I have thought of the D word over it, but my husband

did not ask to have two special needs kids any more than I did, and he SIGNED UP for

the one giving us the MOST problems, as he met him at 5, and adopted him at 7, so

that is not a GOOD CHOICE for me; social workers with DHS (or whatever it is called

in your state) will tell you though, it is NOT OKAY FOR ONE OF YOU TO THINK IT,

WANT TO MOVE OUT, LIVE SEPARATELY, etc. because that means the child needs HELP /

it has GONE TOO FAR!!!! That is NOT okay......we have a right to life, too. And, it

really is abuse of parent by child! YOU MIGHT EVEN MEET A PROFESSIONAL OR TWO THATWILL TELL YOU IT IS.......it is rare as they hate to admit or think it because it is always PARENTS

that are these awful abusers but in our case, we have heard it a lot.

And, I do agree that proactive and just doing it also gets rid of the stress. That, a huge

open mind that can be flexible and open to changes, constantly coming up with new ideas on

what we can do for this child.....and then be willing to TRY ANYTHING.

BONUS: THIS STEPSON is telling you you mean everything to him, in his own way; hold on to that!!!!

Imagine how alone he feels.... has ODD vs. conduct vs. explosive disorder, too (I think I left that

out); certain meds make him self-harm then, too ABILIFY IS ONE OF 'em, so it is just a matter of patience,

and at this point, getting the child in to a place that he can live daily safe, and you and your spouse

can visit and be a safe part of his life and family..................that is working out GREAT for us.

Our fourth and last baby will be born 6-3.....we decided that did not have a right to keep that

from us, as we always wanted to have 4.......this time though, the system promises they will NOT let

hurt or abuse him, and that is part of why we get to have long term, adult plans, so perhaps our last one has

an even bigger purpose than we ever thought...............but life does go on............

Ruthie Dolezal

From: donnalmoore@...Date: Tue, 26 May 2009 00:18:52 -0500Subject: Re: ( ) A.S. not A.S.

I guess I just need to get back into the proactive stance & get things done. I think doing something will actually helps stress.

I am knowledgeable about AS, but none of those strategies seem to work with him. We had excellent therapists at the residential center who helped us put a great plan in place for him upon returning home. We have visual schedules, procedures, etc., but he rejects them all. It is like teenage rebellion times the ODD & the attachment disorder & abandonment issues. We have not been able to find a therapist who really understands AS, except the one in residential. So they try to approach him as bipolar or ODD & his processing is so totally beyond their understanding. He can repeat all the right words, but can't carry forth on the actions.

Some days he & I really connect & he will tell me that I am the only one who understands, but then other days be hates me Gor bring consistent & holding him accountable for his actions.

It is a difficult road. I am trying hard to stay here to support my husband & help our son. I committed to that 6 years ago, but sometimes it is difficult.

Thanks again for all the advice & support. I know that I will be talking with you again soon .

Sent from my iPhone

Blessings, Donna

On May 25, 2009, at 11:31 PM, BRYAN DOLEZAL <DOLEZAL123msn> wrote:

I am not sure what you mean about everyone else placing your son in thehospital, but THAT could be the problem. He breaks your property, which, bythe way, you CAN PRESS CHARGES FOR----maybe it depends upon his age? BUTyou sure as heck can in IOWA!!!! That is ridiculous; never heard of that before butyes you can here anyway.....anyway, put the child in the car, and take him to the hospitalWHERE THERE IS A PSYCHE UNIT. You tell them "HE IS A DANGER TO HIMSELF AND OTHERS."He just got done "punching a hole in our wall," "Telling me I am an fing b 20 times," that he is going to kill me, break every bone in my body, etc."; if you cannot drive him to the hospital,when you call 911, you are asking for a police escort to the hospital. YOU DO HAVE TO GOTO A HOSPITAL WITH A CHILD'S PSYCHE UNIT (not all have it)......but yes you can, and yesyou should; this stuff about other people placing him in the hospital is CRAZY!!! YOU CAN DO IT!!! One time, our son blew up during therapy, the therapist had us come back, and told us we were taking him tothe hospital, but that was something we figured we were doing before we went to therapy; we were hopingthe therapist could calm him down and we could 'avoid it' this time but that didn't work either; we had toagree to it, and we took him...... As for a psychiatrist: yes, you may have to drive, but child cannot be without medications or a psychiatrist,in my opinion. THAT IS THE FIRST THING YOU MUST DO; you cannot just keep letting him control the house, andnot get help. Sounds like you live in fear of him, and that is not living, but I would get him a great therapist and psychiatrist, and don't wait another day; you can't, then call his pediatrician and demand the name of one or get areferral to see him right away.............. As for you, I would get books and read, read, read, and get as knowledgeable about A.S. as you can, and you dohave to change your mind set to work effectively with these kids; we have had to, I know, as I have done it, as hasmy husband as these children DO NOT SEE THE WORLD AS THE REST OF US. In fact, I don't think they want to kill orharm at all but don't know what else to do, as I see them as miserable, unable to communicate effectively when theywant and need to at times, and I think I am getting where I can just about tell you exactly how my son feels; it amazesmy son when I say something and he can actually say that is exactly what he was trying to say, or what he wishes hecould have said, or he corrects me, but at least it gave us somewhere to start from............ GOOD LUCK.....I don't think you should walk out though rather tackle the bull by the horns here, and get some help. Ialso think that you have a great start......For what it is worth, MOST FEMALES do these calls, care, etc.; it is JUST theway our society IS most of the time...........not all the time, but MOST OF THE TIME....and we can do 10 things at once;that is why our husbands married us (I am about to have 4 sons come 6-3), but as the mom of 3 boys, I can tell you,all 3 of them comment with their dad about how amazing I AM; they don't know I do that multiple tasking stuff, so itIS REAL, and so take it as a compliment; we do it because we can, and thank GOD we can, because SOMEONE has to! HANGin there and do the best you can. SOunds like the mom quit momming years ago!!!! You may be the step-mom but you arethe mom; he LIVES WITH YOU ALL THE TIME; that MAKES YOU THE MOM!!!!! Ruthie

From: donnalmooreDate: Mon, 25 May 2009 22:44:20 -0500Subject: Re: ( ) A.S. not A.S.

He sees a psychiatrist who prescribes his meds. This psychiatrist has not done any hospitalizations because she has only been seeing him for a year. He has not actually attacked me but one time this year & I did not call the police. He has become much more verbally threatening & my other son restrains him until he calms down. Or he tries to destroy property- ours & his. But that is not an arrestable offense because he lives here. The reason he has not attacked me is because I no longer put any demands on him.

I go to my room & do not talk to him. I don't tell him to do homework or chores. I can't even tell him to turn off the cartoons so that I can watch TV in my own living room. All of this is to keep from pushing his button & setting him off so that he attacks me. This does not stop him from telling me that he is going to break every bone in my body, break my arm, or choke me to death. At this point they say it is just my perception & my fear. Well, past behavior illicits fear.

Our last psychiatrist who treated him for 4 years before she retired, placed him in the hospital twice. Once he was placed from the ER after the police took him there after he attacked me, them, & threatened to kill all of us & himself. Everytime we got about 4/5 hours notice that he was being released. We were told that if we refused to take him that we would be charged with child abandonment. Not a charge that I can afford as an educator.

As far as a mental health case manager, we have never had one or had one suggested to us by anyone. I don't even know where to go for one. When I tried to get a psychiatrist through the Community Mental Health Center, they told me that they didn't take our insurance. We have two insurances. I called the state office of MH once & they were absolutely no help.

I've tried to find another psychiatrist by getting referrals from other people, but none of the "good" ones are taking new patients. I feel like we can't win for losing.

Where do you get a mental health case manager?

Any help will be appreciated.Sent from my iPhone

Blessings, Donna

On May 25, 2009, at 9:54 PM, "" <hotmail> wrote:

Donna, was reading some of your posts. Does he have a mental health case manager? Any ongoing mental health services? Just seems like he would. And that they would be the ones trying to find a placement for him. Also, what with the threat of violence or actual violence -- have you committed him before due to those reasons? I know they just end up in the hospital and on maybe on meds and are released, but wondering if then you could have him directly placed somewhere, saying he is not welcome back at home, etc.??? >> The reason we had a reduced rate is because the facility was private & > sponsored my the United Methodist Church. So, they gave us a special > rate.> > My husband & I would be willing to put him in State's custody. We are

[Guest guest]

I guess I need to make some phone calls today & help to guide my husband along. I know that things were much better around here when Mack was in residential & safe. Homelife was easier & happier. We could actually enjoy our visits with him even though he was 5 hours away.I just hope that I can find someone to help.Congratulations on the baby! I understand the bigger purpose for your baby. When my ex-husband & I adopted Sam, our 16yo son's behavior escalated. But our adoption worker for Sam helped us to find resources to get the help he needed. We would never have found it without her help.Thanks again. Take care of yourself & those boys!!!Sent from my iPhoneBlessings, DonnaOn May 26, 2009, at 6:51 AM, BRYAN DOLEZAL <DOLEZAL123@...> wrote:

Oh, yes, it is difficult; even I have thought of the D word over it, but my husband

did not ask to have two special needs kids any more than I did, and he SIGNED UP for

the one giving us the MOST problems, as he met him at 5, and adopted him at 7, so

that is not a GOOD CHOICE for me; social workers with DHS (or whatever it is called

in your state) will tell you though, it is NOT OKAY FOR ONE OF YOU TO THINK IT,

WANT TO MOVE OUT, LIVE SEPARATELY, etc. because that means the child needs HELP /

it has GONE TOO FAR!!!! That is NOT okay......we have a right to life, too. And, it

really is abuse of parent by child! YOU MIGHT EVEN MEET A PROFESSIONAL OR TWO THATWILL TELL YOU IT IS.......it is rare as they hate to admit or think it because it is always PARENTS

that are these awful abusers but in our case, we have heard it a lot.

And, I do agree that proactive and just doing it also gets rid of the stress. That, a huge

open mind that can be flexible and open to changes, constantly coming up with new ideas on

what we can do for this child.....and then be willing to TRY ANYTHING.

BONUS: THIS STEPSON is telling you you mean everything to him, in his own way; hold on to that!!!!

Imagine how alone he feels.... has ODD vs. conduct vs. explosive disorder, too (I think I left that

out); certain meds make him self-harm then, too ABILIFY IS ONE OF 'em, so it is just a matter of patience,

and at this point, getting the child in to a place that he can live daily safe, and you and your spouse

can visit and be a safe part of his life and family..................that is working out GREAT for us.

Our fourth and last baby will be born 6-3.....we decided that did not have a right to keep that

from us, as we always wanted to have 4.......this time though, the system promises they will NOT let

hurt or abuse him, and that is part of why we get to have long term, adult plans, so perhaps our last one has

an even bigger purpose than we ever thought...............but life does go on............

Ruthie Dolezal

From: donnalmooreDate: Tue, 26 May 2009 00:18:52 -0500Subject: Re: ( ) A.S. not A.S.

I guess I just need to get back into the proactive stance & get things done. I think doing something will actually helps stress.

I am knowledgeable about AS, but none of those strategies seem to work with him. We had excellent therapists at the residential center who helped us put a great plan in place for him upon returning home. We have visual schedules, procedures, etc., but he rejects them all. It is like teenage rebellion times the ODD & the attachment disorder & abandonment issues. We have not been able to find a therapist who really understands AS, except the one in residential. So they try to approach him as bipolar or ODD & his processing is so totally beyond their understanding. He can repeat all the right words, but can't carry forth on the actions.

Some days he & I really connect & he will tell me that I am the only one who understands, but then other days be hates me Gor bring consistent & holding him accountable for his actions.

It is a difficult road. I am trying hard to stay here to support my husband & help our son. I committed to that 6 years ago, but sometimes it is difficult.

Thanks again for all the advice & support. I know that I will be talking with you again soon .

Sent from my iPhone

Blessings, Donna

On May 25, 2009, at 11:31 PM, BRYAN DOLEZAL <DOLEZAL123msn> wrote:

I am not sure what you mean about everyone else placing your son in thehospital, but THAT could be the problem. He breaks your property, which, bythe way, you CAN PRESS CHARGES FOR----maybe it depends upon his age? BUTyou sure as heck can in IOWA!!!! That is ridiculous; never heard of that before butyes you can here anyway.....anyway, put the child in the car, and take him to the hospitalWHERE THERE IS A PSYCHE UNIT. You tell them "HE IS A DANGER TO HIMSELF AND OTHERS."He just got done "punching a hole in our wall," "Telling me I am an fing b 20 times," that he is going to kill me, break every bone in my body, etc."; if you cannot drive him to the hospital,when you call 911, you are asking for a police escort to the hospital. YOU DO HAVE TO GOTO A HOSPITAL WITH A CHILD'S PSYCHE UNIT (not all have it)......but yes you can, and yesyou should; this stuff about other people placing him in the hospital is CRAZY!!! YOU CAN DO IT!!! One time, our son blew up during therapy, the therapist had us come back, and told us we were taking him tothe hospital, but that was something we figured we were doing before we went to therapy; we were hopingthe therapist could calm him down and we could 'avoid it' this time but that didn't work either; we had toagree to it, and we took him...... As for a psychiatrist: yes, you may have to drive, but child cannot be without medications or a psychiatrist,in my opinion. THAT IS THE FIRST THING YOU MUST DO; you cannot just keep letting him control the house, andnot get help. Sounds like you live in fear of him, and that is not living, but I would get him a great therapist and psychiatrist, and don't wait another day; you can't, then call his pediatrician and demand the name of one or get areferral to see him right away.............. As for you, I would get books and read, read, read, and get as knowledgeable about A.S. as you can, and you dohave to change your mind set to work effectively with these kids; we have had to, I know, as I have done it, as hasmy husband as these children DO NOT SEE THE WORLD AS THE REST OF US. In fact, I don't think they want to kill orharm at all but don't know what else to do, as I see them as miserable, unable to communicate effectively when theywant and need to at times, and I think I am getting where I can just about tell you exactly how my son feels; it amazesmy son when I say something and he can actually say that is exactly what he was trying to say, or what he wishes hecould have said, or he corrects me, but at least it gave us somewhere to start from............ GOOD LUCK.....I don't think you should walk out though rather tackle the bull by the horns here, and get some help. Ialso think that you have a great start......For what it is worth, MOST FEMALES do these calls, care, etc.; it is JUST theway our society IS most of the time...........not all the time, but MOST OF THE TIME....and we can do 10 things at once;that is why our husbands married us (I am about to have 4 sons come 6-3), but as the mom of 3 boys, I can tell you,all 3 of them comment with their dad about how amazing I AM; they don't know I do that multiple tasking stuff, so itIS REAL, and so take it as a compliment; we do it because we can, and thank GOD we can, because SOMEONE has to! HANGin there and do the best you can. SOunds like the mom quit momming years ago!!!! You may be the step-mom but you arethe mom; he LIVES WITH YOU ALL THE TIME; that MAKES YOU THE MOM!!!!! Ruthie

From: donnalmooreDate: Mon, 25 May 2009 22:44:20 -0500Subject: Re: ( ) A.S. not A.S.

He sees a psychiatrist who prescribes his meds. This psychiatrist has not done any hospitalizations because she has only been seeing him for a year. He has not actually attacked me but one time this year & I did not call the police. He has become much more verbally threatening & my other son restrains him until he calms down. Or he tries to destroy property- ours & his. But that is not an arrestable offense because he lives here. The reason he has not attacked me is because I no longer put any demands on him.

I go to my room & do not talk to him. I don't tell him to do homework or chores. I can't even tell him to turn off the cartoons so that I can watch TV in my own living room. All of this is to keep from pushing his button & setting him off so that he attacks me. This does not stop him from telling me that he is going to break every bone in my body, break my arm, or choke me to death. At this point they say it is just my perception & my fear. Well, past behavior illicits fear.

Our last psychiatrist who treated him for 4 years before she retired, placed him in the hospital twice. Once he was placed from the ER after the police took him there after he attacked me, them, & threatened to kill all of us & himself. Everytime we got about 4/5 hours notice that he was being released. We were told that if we refused to take him that we would be charged with child abandonment. Not a charge that I can afford as an educator.

As far as a mental health case manager, we have never had one or had one suggested to us by anyone. I don't even know where to go for one. When I tried to get a psychiatrist through the Community Mental Health Center, they told me that they didn't take our insurance. We have two insurances. I called the state office of MH once & they were absolutely no help.

I've tried to find another psychiatrist by getting referrals from other people, but none of the "good" ones are taking new patients. I feel like we can't win for losing.

Where do you get a mental health case manager?

Any help will be appreciated.Sent from my iPhone

Blessings, Donna

On May 25, 2009, at 9:54 PM, "" <hotmail> wrote:

Donna, was reading some of your posts. Does he have a mental health case manager? Any ongoing mental health services? Just seems like he would. And that they would be the ones trying to find a placement for him. Also, what with the threat of violence or actual violence -- have you committed him before due to those reasons? I know they just end up in the hospital and on maybe on meds and are released, but wondering if then you could have him directly placed somewhere, saying he is not welcome back at home, etc.??? >> The reason we had a reduced rate is because the facility was private & > sponsored my the United Methodist Church. So, they gave us a special > rate.> > My husband & I would be willing to put him in State's custody. We are

[Guest guest]

>

> I don't usually post either. Life is way too hectic.

I'm going to butt in here for a sec and wish you two sympathy and the best of

luck. Donna, you gave me some great advice awhile back, and I had no idea you

were going through all this. It is nice that you guys share all this.

Although my aspie is not physical, I'm am identifying with some things. My 14yo

doesn't respond to certain typical aspie treatments either, like visuals. In

his case, I think it is because, unlike most aspies, his visual-spatial learning

skills are very average while his auditory learning skills are extraordinary. I

still haven't figured out what this means as far as interventions go. It is

something I want to discuss this week with the autism team/IEP team at school

this week. But, because of his very slow processing speed and weak working

memory, we can't just switch over to auditory interventions since he has

difficulty recalling things on demand and juggling multiple things in his active

memory. He needs to have EVERYTHING written down, but he resists that. I

haven't figured it out yet.

Ruth

[Guest guest]

I guess how I FEEL ABOUT MY HUSBAND / MARRIAGE is, and what I would consider

before leaving is this:

ARE YOU LEAVING BECAUSE YOU ARE NO LONGER IN LOVE WITH YOUR HUSBAND?

ARE YOU LEAVING BECAUSE HE IS A HORRIBLE, no good abusive man with issues?

Are you leaving because he treats you terrible, you have no fun together?

Are you leaving because you cannot stand the likes of the man?

THE LIST COULD GO ON AND ON AND ON.................

but when I put this ever in to my own thoughts, life, and perspective, I am truly married

to MR. WONDERFUL for ME (maybe not for someone else, but he is EVERYTHING I NEED IN

a MAN in my life; my total opposite; I am the hyped up get it done and he is the annoyingly over

the top calm but together, we work great!!! I love him with all my being, and cannot imagine a

day without him. During my bed rest, he has been my everything, the mom / dad of the house,

helps me dress, sits with me nightly to give me attention and love, makes all the meals, keeps the

fridge in my room stocked (as I am ON BED REST so it is all bed side----he put it there like the DR. ORDERED

but went and bought the small fridge, wedges, etc. for me to rest so I can bring our baby in to the

world, and FULL TERM---it all worked.............there are MANY MANY REASONS I LOVE MY HUSBAND...

but, whenever I forget, or think I did, regardless of MONEY, I find a way to book a room, get the kids out

of the house, and away we go for an hour, a night, a weekend, AND I am always, always, always reminded

that MY HUSBAND IS NOT THE PROBLEM OR THE ISSUES and in fact, our MARRIAGE IS FINE.....rather, the CHILDREN

are the issue / creating the stress...............18 years is NOT VERY LONG...........in that scope, I married this man

for LIFE, and whenever I forget again, we do this..................so far, it has never failed that we are great together....

and I will tell you, it has NOTHING TO DO WITH INTAMACY-------we have gone to hotels for the night, weekend, and

never done ANY OF THAT STUFF, actually, it was just about being TOGETHER, swimming, sitting in the hot-tub, having

dinner at the hotel, getting a drink together (we are NOT big drinkers but A DRINK), etc., etc. And, we are GREAT!!!!

So, that is something ELSE to think about...................that is just my opinion.........but that is why we are still married

after 9 years, and I remind my son and myself often that no man, or not many, would EVER do what our BRYAN has done

for us...........nor put up with it!!! I am grateful, and I TELL HIM SO OFTEN.............perhaps your hubby needs to TELL YOU!!

Ruthie

From: donnalmoore@...Date: Tue, 26 May 2009 07:08:28 -0500Subject: Re: ( ) A.S. not A.S.

I guess I need to make some phone calls today & help to guide my husband along. I know that things were much better around here when Mack was in residential & safe. Homelife was easier & happier. We could actually enjoy our visits with him even though he was 5 hours away.

I just hope that I can find someone to help.

Congratulations on the baby! I understand the bigger purpose for your baby. When my ex-husband & I adopted Sam, our 16yo son's behavior escalated. But our adoption worker for Sam helped us to find resources to get the help he needed. We would never have found it without her help.

Thanks again. Take care of yourself & those boys!!!Sent from my iPhone

Blessings, Donna

On May 26, 2009, at 6:51 AM, BRYAN DOLEZAL <DOLEZAL123msn> wrote:

Oh, yes, it is difficult; even I have thought of the D word over it, but my husbanddid not ask to have two special needs kids any more than I did, and he SIGNED UP forthe one giving us the MOST problems, as he met him at 5, and adopted him at 7, sothat is not a GOOD CHOICE for me; social workers with DHS (or whatever it is calledin your state) will tell you though, it is NOT OKAY FOR ONE OF YOU TO THINK IT,WANT TO MOVE OUT, LIVE SEPARATELY, etc. because that means the child needs HELP /it has GONE TOO FAR!!!! That is NOT okay......we have a right to life, too. And, it really is abuse of parent by child! YOU MIGHT EVEN MEET A PROFESSIONAL OR TWO THATWILL TELL YOU IT IS.......it is rare as they hate to admit or think it because it is always PARENTSthat are these awful abusers but in our case, we have heard it a lot. And, I do agree that proactive and just doing it also gets rid of the stress. That, a hugeopen mind that can be flexible and open to changes, constantly coming up with new ideas onwhat we can do for this child.....and then be willing to TRY ANYTHING. BONUS: THIS STEPSON is telling you you mean everything to him, in his own way; hold on to that!!!!Imagine how alone he feels.... has ODD vs. conduct vs. explosive disorder, too (I think I left thatout); certain meds make him self-harm then, too ABILIFY IS ONE OF 'em, so it is just a matter of patience,and at this point, getting the child in to a place that he can live daily safe, and you and your spousecan visit and be a safe part of his life and family..................that is working out GREAT for us. Our fourth and last baby will be born 6-3.....we decided that did not have a right to keep thatfrom us, as we always wanted to have 4.......this time though, the system promises they will NOT let hurt or abuse him, and that is part of why we get to have long term, adult plans, so perhaps our last one hasan even bigger purpose than we ever thought...............but life does go on............ Ruthie Dolezal

From: donnalmooreDate: Tue, 26 May 2009 00:18:52 -0500Subject: Re: ( ) A.S. not A.S.

I guess I just need to get back into the proactive stance & get things done. I think doing something will actually helps stress.

I am knowledgeable about AS, but none of those strategies seem to work with him. We had excellent therapists at the residential center who helped us put a great plan in place for him upon returning home. We have visual schedules, procedures, etc., but he rejects them all. It is like teenage rebellion times the ODD & the attachment disorder & abandonment issues. We have not been able to find a therapist who really understands AS, except the one in residential. So they try to approach him as bipolar or ODD & his processing is so totally beyond their understanding. He can repeat all the right words, but can't carry forth on the actions.

Some days he & I really connect & he will tell me that I am the only one who understands, but then other days be hates me Gor bring consistent & holding him accountable for his actions.

It is a difficult road. I am trying hard to stay here to support my husband & help our son. I committed to that 6 years ago, but sometimes it is difficult.

Thanks again for all the advice & support. I know that I will be talking with you again soon .

Sent from my iPhone

Blessings, Donna

On May 25, 2009, at 11:31 PM, BRYAN DOLEZAL <DOLEZAL123msn> wrote:

I am not sure what you mean about everyone else placing your son in thehospital, but THAT could be the problem. He breaks your property, which, bythe way, you CAN PRESS CHARGES FOR----maybe it depends upon his age? BUTyou sure as heck can in IOWA!!!! That is ridiculous; never heard of that before butyes you can here anyway.....anyway, put the child in the car, and take him to the hospitalWHERE THERE IS A PSYCHE UNIT. You tell them "HE IS A DANGER TO HIMSELF AND OTHERS."He just got done "punching a hole in our wall," "Telling me I am an fing b 20 times," that he is going to kill me, break every bone in my body, etc."; if you cannot drive him to the hospital,when you call 911, you are asking for a police escort to the hospital. YOU DO HAVE TO GOTO A HOSPITAL WITH A CHILD'S PSYCHE UNIT (not all have it)......but yes you can, and yesyou should; this stuff about other people placing him in the hospital is CRAZY!!! YOU CAN DO IT!!! One time, our son blew up during therapy, the therapist had us come back, and told us we were taking him tothe hospital, but that was something we figured we were doing before we went to therapy; we were hopingthe therapist could calm him down and we could 'avoid it' this time but that didn't work either; we had toagree to it, and we took him...... As for a psychiatrist: yes, you may have to drive, but child cannot be without medications or a psychiatrist,in my opinion. THAT IS THE FIRST THING YOU MUST DO; you cannot just keep letting him control the house, andnot get help. Sounds like you live in fear of him, and that is not living, but I would get him a great therapist and psychiatrist, and don't wait another day; you can't, then call his pediatrician and demand the name of one or get areferral to see him right away.............. As for you, I would get books and read, read, read, and get as knowledgeable about A.S. as you can, and you dohave to change your mind set to work effectively with these kids; we have had to, I know, as I have done it, as hasmy husband as these children DO NOT SEE THE WORLD AS THE REST OF US. In fact, I don't think they want to kill orharm at all but don't know what else to do, as I see them as miserable, unable to communicate effectively when theywant and need to at times, and I think I am getting where I can just about tell you exactly how my son feels; it amazesmy son when I say something and he can actually say that is exactly what he was trying to say, or what he wishes hecould have said, or he corrects me, but at least it gave us somewhere to start from............ GOOD LUCK.....I don't think you should walk out though rather tackle the bull by the horns here, and get some help. Ialso think that you have a great start......For what it is worth, MOST FEMALES do these calls, care, etc.; it is JUST theway our society IS most of the time...........not all the time, but MOST OF THE TIME....and we can do 10 things at once;that is why our husbands married us (I am about to have 4 sons come 6-3), but as the mom of 3 boys, I can tell you,all 3 of them comment with their dad about how amazing I AM; they don't know I do that multiple tasking stuff, so itIS REAL, and so take it as a compliment; we do it because we can, and thank GOD we can, because SOMEONE has to! HANGin there and do the best you can. SOunds like the mom quit momming years ago!!!! You may be the step-mom but you arethe mom; he LIVES WITH YOU ALL THE TIME; that MAKES YOU THE MOM!!!!! Ruthie

From: donnalmooreDate: Mon, 25 May 2009 22:44:20 -0500Subject: Re: ( ) A.S. not A.S.

He sees a psychiatrist who prescribes his meds. This psychiatrist has not done any hospitalizations because she has only been seeing him for a year. He has not actually attacked me but one time this year & I did not call the police. He has become much more verbally threatening & my other son restrains him until he calms down. Or he tries to destroy property- ours & his. But that is not an arrestable offense because he lives here. The reason he has not attacked me is because I no longer put any demands on him.

I go to my room & do not talk to him. I don't tell him to do homework or chores. I can't even tell him to turn off the cartoons so that I can watch TV in my own living room. All of this is to keep from pushing his button & setting him off so that he attacks me. This does not stop him from telling me that he is going to break every bone in my body, break my arm, or choke me to death. At this point they say it is just my perception & my fear. Well, past behavior illicits fear.

Our last psychiatrist who treated him for 4 years before she retired, placed him in the hospital twice. Once he was placed from the ER after the police took him there after he attacked me, them, & threatened to kill all of us & himself. Everytime we got about 4/5 hours notice that he was being released. We were told that if we refused to take him that we would be charged with child abandonment. Not a charge that I can afford as an educator.

As far as a mental health case manager, we have never had one or had one suggested to us by anyone. I don't even know where to go for one. When I tried to get a psychiatrist through the Community Mental Health Center, they told me that they didn't take our insurance. We have two insurances. I called the state office of MH once & they were absolutely no help.

I've tried to find another psychiatrist by getting referrals from other people, but none of the "good" ones are taking new patients. I feel like we can't win for losing.

Where do you get a mental health case manager?

Any help will be appreciated.Sent from my iPhone

Blessings, Donna

On May 25, 2009, at 9:54 PM, "" <hotmail> wrote:

Donna, was reading some of your posts. Does he have a mental health case manager? Any ongoing mental health services? Just seems like he would. And that they would be the ones trying to find a placement for him. Also, what with the threat of violence or actual violence -- have you committed him before due to those reasons? I know they just end up in the hospital and on maybe on meds and are released, but wondering if then you could have him directly placed somewhere, saying he is not welcome back at home, etc.??? >> The reason we had a reduced rate is because the facility was private & > sponsored my the United Methodist Church. So, they gave us a special > rate.> > My husband & I would be willing to put him in State's custody. We are

[Guest guest]

I agree, Ruthie. I love my husband & he is my soulmate. It is the child who is our problem, not our marriage.Thanks for helping me to put it in perspective.Sent from my iPhoneBlessings, DonnaOn May 26, 2009, at 7:34 AM, BRYAN DOLEZAL <DOLEZAL123@...> wrote:

I guess how I FEEL ABOUT MY HUSBAND / MARRIAGE is, and what I would consider

before leaving is this:

ARE YOU LEAVING BECAUSE YOU ARE NO LONGER IN LOVE WITH YOUR HUSBAND?

ARE YOU LEAVING BECAUSE HE IS A HORRIBLE, no good abusive man with issues?

Are you leaving because he treats you terrible, you have no fun together?

Are you leaving because you cannot stand the likes of the man?

THE LIST COULD GO ON AND ON AND ON.................

but when I put this ever in to my own thoughts, life, and perspective, I am truly married

to MR. WONDERFUL for ME (maybe not for someone else, but he is EVERYTHING I NEED IN

a MAN in my life; my total opposite; I am the hyped up get it done and he is the annoyingly over

the top calm but together, we work great!!! I love him with all my being, and cannot imagine a

day without him. During my bed rest, he has been my everything, the mom / dad of the house,

helps me dress, sits with me nightly to give me attention and love, makes all the meals, keeps the

fridge in my room stocked (as I am ON BED REST so it is all bed side----he put it there like the DR. ORDERED

but went and bought the small fridge, wedges, etc. for me to rest so I can bring our baby in to the

world, and FULL TERM---it all worked.............there are MANY MANY REASONS I LOVE MY HUSBAND...

but, whenever I forget, or think I did, regardless of MONEY, I find a way to book a room, get the kids out

of the house, and away we go for an hour, a night, a weekend, AND I am always, always, always reminded

that MY HUSBAND IS NOT THE PROBLEM OR THE ISSUES and in fact, our MARRIAGE IS FINE.....rather, the CHILDREN

are the issue / creating the stress...............18 years is NOT VERY LONG...........in that scope, I married this man

for LIFE, and whenever I forget again, we do this..................so far, it has never failed that we are great together....

and I will tell you, it has NOTHING TO DO WITH INTAMACY-------we have gone to hotels for the night, weekend, and

never done ANY OF THAT STUFF, actually, it was just about being TOGETHER, swimming, sitting in the hot-tub, having

dinner at the hotel, getting a drink together (we are NOT big drinkers but A DRINK), etc., etc. And, we are GREAT!!!!

So, that is something ELSE to think about...................that is just my opinion.........but that is why we are still married

after 9 years, and I remind my son and myself often that no man, or not many, would EVER do what our BRYAN has done

for us...........nor put up with it!!! I am grateful, and I TELL HIM SO OFTEN.............perhaps your hubby needs to TELL YOU!!

Ruthie

From: donnalmooreDate: Tue, 26 May 2009 07:08:28 -0500Subject: Re: ( ) A.S. not A.S.

I guess I need to make some phone calls today & help to guide my husband along. I know that things were much better around here when Mack was in residential & safe. Homelife was easier & happier. We could actually enjoy our visits with him even though he was 5 hours away.

I just hope that I can find someone to help.

Congratulations on the baby! I understand the bigger purpose for your baby. When my ex-husband & I adopted Sam, our 16yo son's behavior escalated. But our adoption worker for Sam helped us to find resources to get the help he needed. We would never have found it without her help.

Thanks again. Take care of yourself & those boys!!!Sent from my iPhone

Blessings, Donna

On May 26, 2009, at 6:51 AM, BRYAN DOLEZAL <DOLEZAL123msn> wrote:

Oh, yes, it is difficult; even I have thought of the D word over it, but my husbanddid not ask to have two special needs kids any more than I did, and he SIGNED UP forthe one giving us the MOST problems, as he met him at 5, and adopted him at 7, sothat is not a GOOD CHOICE for me; social workers with DHS (or whatever it is calledin your state) will tell you though, it is NOT OKAY FOR ONE OF YOU TO THINK IT,WANT TO MOVE OUT, LIVE SEPARATELY, etc. because that means the child needs HELP /it has GONE TOO FAR!!!! That is NOT okay......we have a right to life, too. And, it really is abuse of parent by child! YOU MIGHT EVEN MEET A PROFESSIONAL OR TWO THATWILL TELL YOU IT IS.......it is rare as they hate to admit or think it because it is always PARENTSthat are these awful abusers but in our case, we have heard it a lot. And, I do agree that proactive and just doing it also gets rid of the stress. That, a hugeopen mind that can be flexible and open to changes, constantly coming up with new ideas onwhat we can do for this child.....and then be willing to TRY ANYTHING. BONUS: THIS STEPSON is telling you you mean everything to him, in his own way; hold on to that!!!!Imagine how alone he feels.... has ODD vs. conduct vs. explosive disorder, too (I think I left thatout); certain meds make him self-harm then, too ABILIFY IS ONE OF 'em, so it is just a matter of patience,and at this point, getting the child in to a place that he can live daily safe, and you and your spousecan visit and be a safe part of his life and family..................that is working out GREAT for us. Our fourth and last baby will be born 6-3.....we decided that did not have a right to keep thatfrom us, as we always wanted to have 4.......this time though, the system promises they will NOT let hurt or abuse him, and that is part of why we get to have long term, adult plans, so perhaps our last one hasan even bigger purpose than we ever thought...............but life does go on............ Ruthie Dolezal

From: donnalmooreDate: Tue, 26 May 2009 00:18:52 -0500Subject: Re: ( ) A.S. not A.S.

I guess I just need to get back into the proactive stance & get things done. I think doing something will actually helps stress.

I am knowledgeable about AS, but none of those strategies seem to work with him. We had excellent therapists at the residential center who helped us put a great plan in place for him upon returning home. We have visual schedules, procedures, etc., but he rejects them all. It is like teenage rebellion times the ODD & the attachment disorder & abandonment issues. We have not been able to find a therapist who really understands AS, except the one in residential. So they try to approach him as bipolar or ODD & his processing is so totally beyond their understanding. He can repeat all the right words, but can't carry forth on the actions.

Some days he & I really connect & he will tell me that I am the only one who understands, but then other days be hates me Gor bring consistent & holding him accountable for his actions.

It is a difficult road. I am trying hard to stay here to support my husband & help our son. I committed to that 6 years ago, but sometimes it is difficult.

Thanks again for all the advice & support. I know that I will be talking with you again soon .

Sent from my iPhone

Blessings, Donna

On May 25, 2009, at 11:31 PM, BRYAN DOLEZAL <DOLEZAL123msn> wrote:

I am not sure what you mean about everyone else placing your son in thehospital, but THAT could be the problem. He breaks your property, which, bythe way, you CAN PRESS CHARGES FOR----maybe it depends upon his age? BUTyou sure as heck can in IOWA!!!! That is ridiculous; never heard of that before butyes you can here anyway.....anyway, put the child in the car, and take him to the hospitalWHERE THERE IS A PSYCHE UNIT. You tell them "HE IS A DANGER TO HIMSELF AND OTHERS."He just got done "punching a hole in our wall," "Telling me I am an fing b 20 times," that he is going to kill me, break every bone in my body, etc."; if you cannot drive him to the hospital,when you call 911, you are asking for a police escort to the hospital. YOU DO HAVE TO GOTO A HOSPITAL WITH A CHILD'S PSYCHE UNIT (not all have it)......but yes you can, and yesyou should; this stuff about other people placing him in the hospital is CRAZY!!! YOU CAN DO IT!!! One time, our son blew up during therapy, the therapist had us come back, and told us we were taking him tothe hospital, but that was something we figured we were doing before we went to therapy; we were hopingthe therapist could calm him down and we could 'avoid it' this time but that didn't work either; we had toagree to it, and we took him...... As for a psychiatrist: yes, you may have to drive, but child cannot be without medications or a psychiatrist,in my opinion. THAT IS THE FIRST THING YOU MUST DO; you cannot just keep letting him control the house, andnot get help. Sounds like you live in fear of him, and that is not living, but I would get him a great therapist and psychiatrist, and don't wait another day; you can't, then call his pediatrician and demand the name of one or get areferral to see him right away.............. As for you, I would get books and read, read, read, and get as knowledgeable about A.S. as you can, and you dohave to change your mind set to work effectively with these kids; we have had to, I know, as I have done it, as hasmy husband as these children DO NOT SEE THE WORLD AS THE REST OF US. In fact, I don't think they want to kill orharm at all but don't know what else to do, as I see them as miserable, unable to communicate effectively when theywant and need to at times, and I think I am getting where I can just about tell you exactly how my son feels; it amazesmy son when I say something and he can actually say that is exactly what he was trying to say, or what he wishes hecould have said, or he corrects me, but at least it gave us somewhere to start from............ GOOD LUCK.....I don't think you should walk out though rather tackle the bull by the horns here, and get some help. Ialso think that you have a great start......For what it is worth, MOST FEMALES do these calls, care, etc.; it is JUST theway our society IS most of the time...........not all the time, but MOST OF THE TIME....and we can do 10 things at once;that is why our husbands married us (I am about to have 4 sons come 6-3), but as the mom of 3 boys, I can tell you,all 3 of them comment with their dad about how amazing I AM; they don't know I do that multiple tasking stuff, so itIS REAL, and so take it as a compliment; we do it because we can, and thank GOD we can, because SOMEONE has to! HANGin there and do the best you can. SOunds like the mom quit momming years ago!!!! You may be the step-mom but you arethe mom; he LIVES WITH YOU ALL THE TIME; that MAKES YOU THE MOM!!!!! Ruthie

From: donnalmooreDate: Mon, 25 May 2009 22:44:20 -0500Subject: Re: ( ) A.S. not A.S.

He sees a psychiatrist who prescribes his meds. This psychiatrist has not done any hospitalizations because she has only been seeing him for a year. He has not actually attacked me but one time this year & I did not call the police. He has become much more verbally threatening & my other son restrains him until he calms down. Or he tries to destroy property- ours & his. But that is not an arrestable offense because he lives here. The reason he has not attacked me is because I no longer put any demands on him.

I go to my room & do not talk to him. I don't tell him to do homework or chores. I can't even tell him to turn off the cartoons so that I can watch TV in my own living room. All of this is to keep from pushing his button & setting him off so that he attacks me. This does not stop him from telling me that he is going to break every bone in my body, break my arm, or choke me to death. At this point they say it is just my perception & my fear. Well, past behavior illicits fear.

Our last psychiatrist who treated him for 4 years before she retired, placed him in the hospital twice. Once he was placed from the ER after the police took him there after he attacked me, them, & threatened to kill all of us & himself. Everytime we got about 4/5 hours notice that he was being released. We were told that if we refused to take him that we would be charged with child abandonment. Not a charge that I can afford as an educator.

As far as a mental health case manager, we have never had one or had one suggested to us by anyone. I don't even know where to go for one. When I tried to get a psychiatrist through the Community Mental Health Center, they told me that they didn't take our insurance. We have two insurances. I called the state office of MH once & they were absolutely no help.

I've tried to find another psychiatrist by getting referrals from other people, but none of the "good" ones are taking new patients. I feel like we can't win for losing.

Where do you get a mental health case manager?

Any help will be appreciated.Sent from my iPhone

Blessings, Donna

On May 25, 2009, at 9:54 PM, "" <hotmail> wrote:

Donna, was reading some of your posts. Does he have a mental health case manager? Any ongoing mental health services? Just seems like he would. And that they would be the ones trying to find a placement for him. Also, what with the threat of violence or actual violence -- have you committed him before due to those reasons? I know they just end up in the hospital and on maybe on meds and are released, but wondering if then you could have him directly placed somewhere, saying he is not welcome back at home, etc.??? >> The reason we had a reduced rate is because the facility was private & > sponsored my the United Methodist Church. So, they gave us a special > rate.> > My husband & I would be willing to put him in State's custody. We are

[Guest guest]

Ruthie, congrats on the upcoming baby! Wow! Exciting!

I don't know much about how these places operate but I would wonder if they don't have a "second opinion" appeal process somewhere. Ask for the guidelines in writing and also investigate someone who is "equal" in stature as the guy in charge. You might be able to get an evaluation from someone who is considered as good as or better than this guy in charge. Everyone has a boss, you might go up the food chain and write polite but detailed complaints.

Roxanna

Autism Happens

RE: ( ) A.S. not A.S.

Our 15 1/2 yr old is not able to safely reside in the family home at this time (it's been like this since age 10).

He is living in a center right now that doesn't believe he has A.S. but the truth is, the simple fact he DOES is

driving him literally insane in that setting. Because one has to utilize the help of the system, and there are so

few places that specialize in A.S. (the one about 3 hours from our home won't take him because he is also a

type I diabetic which STINKS for him and us!)......that there really are not many options. We feel he has been

progressing where he is, but now, they are trying to make him NOT A.S. / expecting him to conform to their little

box, and that just isn't going to happen, so his hand movements are up, he has been running away (literally walks out the

door to walk around but comes back because he cannot stand the noise or kids arguing, etc. ).

Last week, he was getting kicked and punched by a peer, never crossed his mind to yell at staff for help, once he was sick of it,

he took his belt off and hit the peer (requiring him to need staples in his face) but the peer then took the belt and

started beating our son with it until staff finally noticed and stopped things / took other peer to hospital for staples. It is

frustrating to say the least because how can one have Autism one day, not the next? No one that has ever worked with him

or us the past five years gets it, and is just as frustrated and angry as we are / feels bad for us. Have any suggestions

at all on what we can do? I am tired of being the crazy mom or dad with the support of everyone on the team BUT the place he

lives (the DHS worker, attorney for our son, home workers, etc., all side with us / refuse to deny the diagnoses; it makes NO SENSE

to them either but in all their efforts, this bold headed psychiatrist just won't listen to us, period!!!!).............frustrating!

Thanks.

Ruthie & Dolezal

Mom to two with A.S. (15 and 8), one normal 6 year old, and baby to be delivered 10 days from TODAY).....

Wanna slim down for summer? Go to America Takes it Off to learn how.

[Guest guest]

Thanks, Roxanna...............he has a supervisor, and he is a 'panty waste'

like a lot of supervisors............our DHS worker is also pitching a fit with them,

so we are waiting a few more days to see what else she finds out....meanwhile, I

did go and take the missing glasses all of a sudden FOUND by them in, and we have

to pay to replace them, so we are going to MAKE the place he lives PAY FOR IT:

or, it IS going to get ugly because the child should NOT be going this long with out glasses

or all the stories that have come with them! Have a great day, Roxanna.....

We are putting all our issues in to writing as we cannot trust them....that way it is NOT

stated but WRITTEN................takes a bit longer but we feel best in the long run...what's another

day, is kind of our opinion at this point!!!

Ruthie Dolezal

From: MadIdeas@...Date: Tue, 26 May 2009 13:51:13 -0400Subject: Re: ( ) A.S. not A.S.

Ruthie, congrats on the upcoming baby! Wow! Exciting!I don't know much about how these places operate but I would wonder if they don't have a "second opinion" appeal process somewhere. Ask for the guidelines in writing and also investigate someone who is "equal" in stature as the guy in charge. You might be able to get an evaluation from someone who is considered as good as or better than this guy in charge. Everyone has a boss, you might go up the food chain and write polite but detailed complaints.

RoxannaAutism Happens

RE: ( ) A.S. not A.S.

Our 15 1/2 yr old is not able to safely reside in the family home at this time (it's been like this since age 10).He is living in a center right now that doesn't believe he has A.S. but the truth is, the simple fact he DOES isdriving him literally insane in that setting. Because one has to utilize the help of the system, and there are sofew places that specialize in A.S. (the one about 3 hours from our home won't take him because he is also atype I diabetic which STINKS for him and us!)......that there really are not many options. We feel he has beenprogressing where he is, but now, they are trying to make him NOT A.S. / expecting him to conform to their littlebox, and that just isn't going to happen, so his hand movements are up, he has been running away (literally walks out thedoor to walk around but comes back because he cannot stand the noise or kids arguing, etc. ). Last week, he was getting kicked and punched by a peer, never crossed his mind to yell at staff for help, once he was sick of it,he took his belt off and hit the peer (requiring him to need staples in his face) but the peer then took the belt and started beating our son with it until staff finally noticed and stopped things / took other peer to hospital for staples. It isfrustrating to say the least because how can one have Autism one day, not the next? No one that has ever worked with himor us the past five years gets it, and is just as frustrated and angry as we are / feels bad for us. Have any suggestionsat all on what we can do? I am tired of being the crazy mom or dad with the support of everyone on the team BUT the place helives (the DHS worker, attorney for our son, home workers, etc., all side with us / refuse to deny the diagnoses; it makes NO SENSE to them either but in all their efforts, this bold headed psychiatrist just won't listen to us, period!!!!).............frustrating! Thanks. Ruthie & DolezalMom to two with A.S. (15 and 8), one normal 6 year old, and baby to be delivered 10 days from TODAY).....

Wanna slim down for summer? Go to America Takes it Off to learn how.

[Guest guest]

Have you tried contacting the Child Advocate's Office? Pam We found the real 'Hotel California' and the 'Seinfeld' diner. What will you find? Explore WhereItsAt.com.

[Guest guest]

you may want to contact the Federation of Families in your state:

Baton RougeLouisiana FFCMH (State Organization)

Vee Boyd5627 Superior Drive, Suite A-2Baton Rouge, LA 70816

Ph: (225) 293-3508Fax: (225) 293-3510Toll Free: (800) 224-4010 (parent line)Email: volboyd@...Website: www.laffcmh.com We found the real 'Hotel California' and the 'Seinfeld' diner. What will you find? Explore WhereItsAt.com.

[Guest guest]

I am sure your dh feels like he is giving up on him if he places him somewhere else. Try to convince him that this is not giving up, it is just changing placements so he has more structure.

Roxanna

Autism Happens

Re: ( ) A.S. not A.S.

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> Hi Ruthie; I remember you from before. Can't forget a name like yours. I just wanted to wish you luck. Sounds like your son would be better off at home with a good IEP in the local school. And it sounds from your other son's experience that he could get that, right? Is that what you are thinking? Maybe you will just have to be patient and carefully jump through all the DHS worker's hoops to get him out as soon as possible.

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Wanna slim down for summer? Go to America Takes it Off to learn how.

Wanna slim down for summer? Go to America Takes it Off to learn how.

[Guest guest]

Roxanna,

I think that is true. But Mack has been placed in residential before and it was

not that much of an issue. I think that is because we felt it would help Mack.

But then Mack was discharged 16 months later and really had not made significant

changes, except for more explicit cursing and more disrespectful language and

behavior. But according to them he had made such wonderful progress and all we

needed to do was to keep the same structure in place that they had.

So, we set up schedules and procedures and levels and consequences and rewards

and tried to run our home this way. All we got from Mack was more resistance

and abuse. He was and is still prone to violent and aggressive outbursts and

the only reason that he is not more violent is because we just quit having the

same expectations. But this is not helping him because he is capable of doing

the things we are asking because he did them in the residential setting.

Anyway, at this point there just do not seem to be any places to send him. He

is spending time with his mom right now. My husband took him there on Friday.

I don't know how long he will stay, but it does give us a little break. His mom

is not committed to taking him long-term at this point. She even told my

husband that she will call him to come and get him on a moment's notice if there

are any problems. Yet she claims that she wants him to live with her, when

..........she has a job, a place to live, etc.................

Now my husband is depressed and just keeps walking around talking about how Mack

has disappointed him and is going to amount to nothing. I keep telling him that

we just need to find the right placement and the right help for Mack. I just

don't know where that is.

Donna

---- Roxanna <MadIdeas@...> wrote:

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> I am sure your dh feels like he is giving up on him if he places him

somewhere else.? Try to convince him that this is not giving up, it is just

changing placements so he has more structure.

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> > Hi Ruthie; I remember you from before. Can't forget a name like yours. I

just wanted to wish you luck. Sounds like your son would be better off at home

with a good IEP in the local school. And it sounds from your other son's

experience that he could get that, right? Is that what you are thinking? Maybe

you will just have to be patient and carefully jump through all the DHS worker's

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[Guest guest]

Thanks for the suggestions. We will contact them this week.Sent from my iPhoneBlessings, DonnaOn May 31, 2009, at 7:43 AM, ppanda65@... wrote:

you may want to contact the Federation of Families in your state:

Baton RougeLouisiana FFCMH (State Organization)

Vee Boyd5627 Superior Drive, Suite A-2Baton Rouge, LA 70816

Ph: (225) 293-3508Fax: (225) 293-3510Toll Free: (800) 224-4010 (parent line)Email: volboydlaffcmh (DOT) orgWebsite: www.laffcmh.com We found the real 'Hotel California' and the 'Seinfeld' diner. What will you find? Explore WhereItsAt.com.

[Guest guest]

Sounds like he is trying to accept that Mack will never be the Mack he wants him to be. I suppose we all do that to some extent - we want our kids to grow up to be independent and have a good life. It is hard and depressing when you see that they won't do as well as you would like. Hang in there. Keep pushing for a placement so you can get your life back!! I will be praying that something opens up somewhere for him. Try those numbers Pam sent and see what they might do to help. Sometimes you just have to keep calling people and eventually, someone will know something that helps. It is not ideal. It should not be this hard to get help for him.

Roxanna

Autism Happens

Re: ( ) A.S. not A.S.

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Wanna slim down for summer? Go to America Takes it Off to learn how.

[Guest guest]

Adding to what Roxanna said, "It should not be this hard to get help for him," unfortunately,

for a lot of us, it is way over the top HARD, HARD, HARD. We cannot get an IEP, even though we have 12 diagnoses

all of which make him eligible; can't get a 504, even though he has severe Depression, Anxiety, Behavioral issues, ADHD,

and TYPE I diabetes---all eligible categories (and for at least the diabetes, one would THINK the school would WANT a plan

for their safety and to protect themselves!!!!!)........................

IN MY HUSBAND AND MY OPINIONS: Part of it is that people do not want to

accept Asperger's Syndrome as a diagnosis either; or, that is OUR issue all the time (arguing whether he has or doesn't have it!); each PSYCHOLOGIST

or PSYCHIATRIST, just wants to see it as the mental health stuff, and say the child can change it, is

responsible for the behaviors, and like they are just not autistic at all. That is what we run in to all the time.

It is NOT an excuse! Well, WE AGREE but it is an explanation, and something that VALIDATES OUR CHILD; there

are PARTS OF THEM THAT NO AMOUNT OF THERAPY, treatment, etc. will be changing (perhaps not in all our children,

but in the ones like some of us have, Donna, US FOR SURE, that IS the case---our children are very angry, have tempers

over the top, and abusive IN ADDITION TO THE ASPERGERS)......so, that is very, very frustrating. It took US 10 years to

even finally hear the words ASPERGERS and get help that we needed....from ages 2-10, we just kept TRYING TO GET

SOMEONE, ANYONE TO GIVE US SOME ANSWERS AND HELP!!!! Now, we advocate to be believed, and the diagnoses he

does have to be accepted by everyone that works with him so he can progress; he would be a different person if the professionals

would QUIT BICKERING and just help him and our family already, and that is the truth! SAD, but TRUE!!!

Good day.

Ruthie Dolezal

From: MadIdeas@...Date: Mon, 1 Jun 2009 08:27:33 -0400Subject: Re: ( ) A.S. not A.S.

Sounds like he is trying to accept that Mack will never be the Mack he wants him to be. I suppose we all do that to some extent - we want our kids to grow up to be independent and have a good life. It is hard and depressing when you see that they won't do as well as you would like. Hang in there. Keep pushing for a placement so you can get your life back!! I will be praying that something opens up somewhere for him. Try those numbers Pam sent and see what they might do to help. Sometimes you just have to keep calling people and eventually, someone will know something that helps. It is not ideal. It should not be this hard to get help for him.

RoxannaAutism Happens

Re: ( ) A.S. not A.S.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > We are advocating to get him out of there but his DHS worker is not ready to yet; she is still fighting> > > > > > > > for him in there; we love him being close, just that they are such horrible communicators, and not willing> > > > > > > > to accept FACT he has A.S. in the first place; > > > > > > Hi Ruthie; I remember you from before. Can't forget a name like yours. I just wanted to wish you luck. Sounds like your son would be better off at home with a good IEP in the local school. And it sounds from your other son's experience that he could get that, right? Is that what you are thinking? Maybe you will just have to be patient and carefully jump through all the DHS worker's hoops to get him out as soon as possible.> > > > > > Ruth> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Wanna slim down for summer? Go to America Takes it Off to learn how. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

Wanna slim down for summer? Go to America Takes it Off to learn how.

[Guest guest]

Donna,

I was wondering if you started working on his future plans, if that makes a difference in his desire to do things? Or a difference in wanting to learn better coping skills? Or does he not bother with future plans and just live in the moment?

Roxanna

Autism Happens

Re: ( ) A.S. not A.S.

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Wanna slim down for summer? Go to America Takes it Off to learn how.

Wanna slim down for summer? Go to America Takes it Off to learn how.

[Guest guest]

Ahhh, you just answered my last post. Definitely keep working to get him in another placement for your own well being. Let us know how that is going when you can.

Roxanna

Autism Happens

Re: ( ) A.S. not A.S.

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> > > We are advocating to get him out of there but his DHS worker is not ready to yet; she is still fighting

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> > > for him in there; we love him being close, just that they are such horrible communicators, and not willing

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> > > to accept FACT he has A.S. in the first place;

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> > Hi Ruthie; I remember you from before. Can't forget a name like yours. I just wanted to wish you luck. Sounds like your son would be better off at home with a good IEP in the local school. And it sounds from your other son's experience that he could get that, right? Is that what you are thinking? Maybe you will just have to be patient and carefully jump through all the DHS worker's hoops to get him out as soon as possible.

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> > Ruth

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> Wanna slim down for summer? Go to America Takes it Off to learn how.

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Wanna slim down for summer? Go to America Takes it Off to learn how.

Wanna slim down for summer? Go to America Takes it Off to learn how.