Guest guest Posted May 18, 2009 Report Share Posted May 18, 2009 And from whom? I really want to have my daughter (6 in mid-July) evaluated and screened for learning disabilities. She's almost classic AS, rather mild, but she also has HUGE issues with math. I spent a ridiculous amount of time today trying to get through to her what 'plus 1' means. No kidding. I tried explaining it every different way I could think of (one more than X, what's the next number after X?) and with EVERY new question, I had to end up holding up my fingers and spelling it out to her! She has MAJOR problems with distraction, has to have constant prodding to finish a task... she's making me batty!! Anyway, I'm wondering to whom I would take her to do a real assessment to rule out and then hopefully definitively diagnose the learning struggles so I can get her the proper help. Any suggestions? She's seen a neurologist - he was the one to dx AS based on the history I'd supplied, and a psychologist, who suggested the neuro workup to rule out neurological pathology vs AS or ADHD. I was told today about a neuroscience assessment center (of course there's a very long waiting list to get in), but am I also correct to say that a neuropsych does this type of screening? I just don't quite know what to push for. We live far, FAR from any place where these resources are available, and I'd like to do some one-stop-shopping and find out how to help this kid before she goes back to school in August. Thanks to all of you in advance for your wisdom. It's such a great blessing to have somewhere to go for advice! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 19, 2009 Report Share Posted May 19, 2009 Most AS kids have math calculations as a strength. Kids with AS with NLD (a non verbal learning disorder) may have serious problems with math facts. There are some genetic disorder that kidos have autistic traits and specific LD's (girls with Syndrome or girls and boys carriers of fragile X). If there was a genetic disorder they may be issues with growth or with hyperlaxity of joints. If neither are present forget the genetic issues. A nueropsch does the testing for NLD and also for ADHD. NLDline is a web site with a wealth of info. Even without the DX of NLD learning profile you can use their stratgies. Often it means no timed math tests, a resource room for math. There is a good book on executive function issues by Lynn Meltzer and kids with AS, autism, ADHD all have this frontal lobe issues with organization, attention, transitioning, emotional control more or less. Kids with NLD or ADHD or AS etc have issues with multiple instructions. You have to give them one at a time. Kids with AS seems to do well with visual presentations like charts etc where kids with NLD are verbal learners and can't cope with too much visual presentations. A neuropsch report gets at specfic cognition deficits better than pschs that do tests for ADHD alone. Neurops tests cost between 2K - 5K. We did our daughters at age 9. What are her other strengths and weakmesses beside math calculations. Is she a good decoder for reader? Does she transition well? How is she at ball catching visual spatial stuff, how are her motor skills is she clumsy? Is she verbally gifted? Does she have issues with auditory processing (hears stuff the wrong way). Does she wear glasses? Pam 94@...> wrote: > > And from whom? > > I really want to have my daughter (6 in mid-July) evaluated and screened for learning disabilities. She's almost classic AS, rather mild, but she also has HUGE issues with math. I spent a ridiculous amount of time today trying to get through to her what 'plus 1' means. No kidding. I tried explaining it every different way I could think of (one more than X, what's the next number after X?) and with EVERY new question, I had to end up holding up my fingers and spelling it out to her! She has MAJOR problems with distraction, has to have constant prodding to finish a task... she's making me batty!! > > Anyway, I'm wondering to whom I would take her to do a real assessment to rule out and then hopefully definitively diagnose the learning struggles so I can get her the proper help. Any suggestions? > > She's seen a neurologist - he was the one to dx AS based on the history I'd supplied, and a psychologist, who suggested the neuro workup to rule out neurological pathology vs AS or ADHD. I was told today about a neuroscience assessment center (of course there's a very long waiting list to get in), but am I also correct to say that a neuropsych does this type of screening? > > I just don't quite know what to push for. We live far, FAR from any place where these resources are available, and I'd like to do some one-stop-shopping and find out how to help this kid before she goes back to school in August. > > Thanks to all of you in advance for your wisdom. It's such a great blessing to have somewhere to go for advice! > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 19, 2009 Report Share Posted May 19, 2009 you can request the school district test her for learning disabilities and make sure any and all request are made in writing, they have a certain amount of time to respond to your request this is a law here in pa they have 60 days to respond i think my son is just now going thru the process i contacted pen which is the pennsylvania education network they gave me all my rights and the laws as the school district has to go by finally after we moved to a new school district within the first two weeks of him in new school they had talked with me in person and via email, they immediately started testing and evaluating him and also gathered outside info pertaining to the AS dx he already has, so now after fighting for 2 yrs we are getting some where but my best advice would be request in writing and dont back down dont let them convince you that your child doesnt need to be tested tell them you concerns and that you wont quit until you know your child is recieving exactly what she needs when she needs it. sherryFrom: andie <andie6294@...> Sent: Monday, May 18, 2009 11:21:00 PMSubject: ( ) What type of testing/screening/assessment should I be asking for? And from whom? I really want to have my daughter (6 in mid-July) evaluated and screened for learning disabilities. She's almost classic AS, rather mild, but she also has HUGE issues with math. I spent a ridiculous amount of time today trying to get through to her what 'plus 1' means. No kidding. I tried explaining it every different way I could think of (one more than X, what's the next number after X?) and with EVERY new question, I had to end up holding up my fingers and spelling it out to her! She has MAJOR problems with distraction, has to have constant prodding to finish a task... she's making me batty!! Anyway, I'm wondering to whom I would take her to do a real assessment to rule out and then hopefully definitively diagnose the learning struggles so I can get her the proper help. Any suggestions? She's seen a neurologist - he was the one to dx AS based on the history I'd supplied, and a psychologist, who suggested the neuro workup to rule out neurological pathology vs AS or ADHD. I was told today about a neuroscience assessment center (of course there's a very long waiting list to get in), but am I also correct to say that a neuropsych does this type of screening? I just don't quite know what to push for. We live far, FAR from any place where these resources are available, and I'd like to do some one-stop-shopping and find out how to help this kid before she goes back to school in August. Thanks to all of you in advance for your wisdom. It's such a great blessing to have somewhere to go for advice! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 19, 2009 Report Share Posted May 19, 2009 > > A neuropsch report gets at specfic cognition deficits > better than pschs that do tests for ADHD alone. Neurops > tests cost between 2K - 5K. We did our daughters at age 9. This is all really great advice! But I just have to FYI that if you are lucky you have a children's hospital or other neurobehavioral clinic near you that takes insurance. We got our neuropsych eval covered under our insurance. We paid less than $100 in co-pays for all the appointments. That included diagnostic eval, 4-hr neuropsych eval for child, parental input incorporating several hours, and a few follow-up visits/phone calls for Q & A and help with school. Ruth Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 19, 2009 Report Share Posted May 19, 2009 I spend too much money. That is a great idea. Also my advocate today told me not to update up neuropsych (last one was 2 years ago) because then the school can reject it. She wanted us to ask the school to order one and pay for it. Your idea Ruth is better. I think as parent's we need to get to the heart of our kids problems. I hate playing political games where our kids get hurt waiting for the school to do the right thing. This is such a great group!!! Pam > > > > A neuropsch report gets at specfic cognition deficits > > better than pschs that do tests for ADHD alone. Neurops > > tests cost between 2K - 5K. We did our daughters at age 9. > > This is all really great advice! But I just have to FYI that if you are lucky you have a children's hospital or other neurobehavioral clinic near you that takes insurance. We got our neuropsych eval covered under our insurance. We paid less than $100 in co-pays for all the appointments. That included diagnostic eval, 4-hr neuropsych eval for child, parental input incorporating several hours, and a few follow-up visits/phone calls for Q & A and help with school. > > Ruth > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 19, 2009 Report Share Posted May 19, 2009 Sherry good advice! My only addition is if the child has attentional or organizational issues, the school learning consultant won't find these issues. My daughter does well on school educational tests because at the lower grades they test for knowledge. Our school was ready to label my daughter as emotional rather than learning impaired. They still do not get her learning issues. I just don't think even special education teachers grasp LD's around what they call " megacognitive issues " kids that don't get the " gestalt " the big picture. I am finally getting that my daughter need to be taught how to learn ...how to cope with her exective function disorder. We can make life simplier for them but at some age ...middle school they need to start to learn " learning " strategies .. Good luck, Pam together etc... Pam > > you can request the school district test her for learning disabilities and make sure any and all request are made in writing, they have a certain amount of time to respond to your request this is a law here in pa they have 60 days to respond i think my son is just now going thru the process i contacted pen which is the pennsylvania education network they gave me all my rights and the laws as the school district has to go by finally after we moved to a new school district within the first two weeks of him in new school they had talked with me in person and via email, they immediately started testing and evaluating him and also gathered outside info pertaining to the AS dx he already has, so now after fighting for 2 yrs we are getting some where but my best advice would be request in writing and dont back down dont let them convince you that your child doesnt need to be tested tell them you concerns and that you wont quit until you know your child is > recieving exactly what she needs when she needs it. sherry > > > > > ________________________________ > From: andie <andie6294@...> > > Sent: Monday, May 18, 2009 11:21:00 PM > Subject: ( ) What type of testing/screening/assessment should I be asking for? > > > > > > And from whom? > > I really want to have my daughter (6 in mid-July) evaluated and screened for learning disabilities. She's almost classic AS, rather mild, but she also has HUGE issues with math. I spent a ridiculous amount of time today trying to get through to her what 'plus 1' means. No kidding. I tried explaining it every different way I could think of (one more than X, what's the next number after X?) and with EVERY new question, I had to end up holding up my fingers and spelling it out to her! She has MAJOR problems with distraction, has to have constant prodding to finish a task... she's making me batty!! > > Anyway, I'm wondering to whom I would take her to do a real assessment to rule out and then hopefully definitively diagnose the learning struggles so I can get her the proper help. Any suggestions? > > She's seen a neurologist - he was the one to dx AS based on the history I'd supplied, and a psychologist, who suggested the neuro workup to rule out neurological pathology vs AS or ADHD. I was told today about a neuroscience assessment center (of course there's a very long waiting list to get in), but am I also correct to say that a neuropsych does this type of screening? > > I just don't quite know what to push for. We live far, FAR from any place where these resources are available, and I'd like to do some one-stop-shopping and find out how to help this kid before she goes back to school in August. > > Thanks to all of you in advance for your wisdom. It's such a great blessing to have somewhere to go for advice! > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 19, 2009 Report Share Posted May 19, 2009 Your school should be able to do an educational evaluation. I would request one from the school in writing. A complete educational evaluation should give you some ideas where her problem areas are. If you don't like the school's assessment, you can request one from an independent source at their expense. But if she is having so much trouble with math, seems like it would show up. Also, when teaching math, use concrete examples. Instead of counting what comes after a number, get five pencils and "add" one more pencil. Then count how many. Any time you can make it visual, it might help. Also there is a math program geared towards kids with math problems called "touch math." I know our elementary school uses this in the resource math class. --> http://www.touchmath.com/ Here is a link to an article on dyscalculia --> http://www.ldonline.org/article/Dyscalculia Roxanna Autism Happens ( ) What type of testing/screening/assessment should I be asking for? And from whom? I really want to have my daughter (6 in mid-July) evaluated and screened for learning disabilities. She's almost classic AS, rather mild, but she also has HUGE issues with math. I spent a ridiculous amount of time today trying to get through to her what 'plus 1' means. No kidding. I tried explaining it every different way I could think of (one more than X, what's the next number after X?) and with EVERY new question, I had to end up holding up my fingers and spelling it out to her! She has MAJOR problems with distraction, has to have constant prodding to finish a task... she's making me batty!! Anyway, I'm wondering to whom I would take her to do a real assessment to rule out and then hopefully definitively diagnose the learning struggles so I can get her the proper help. Any suggestions? She's seen a neurologist - he was the one to dx AS based on the history I'd supplied, and a psychologist, who suggested the neuro workup to rule out neurological pathology vs AS or ADHD. I was told today about a neuroscience assessment center (of course there's a very long waiting list to get in), but am I also correct to say that a neuropsych does this type of screening? I just don't quite know what to push for. We live far, FAR from any place where these resources are available, and I'd like to do some one-stop-shopping and find out how to help this kid before she goes back to school in August. Thanks to all of you in advance for your wisdom. It's such a great blessing to have somewhere to go for advice! We found the real 'Hotel California' and the 'Seinfeld' diner. What will you find? Explore WhereItsAt.com. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 20, 2009 Report Share Posted May 20, 2009 is this child in question diagnosed with AS or any other dx because the one school said my son could qualify under other health impairment even if they dont see a actual learning disability which my sons old school did not do the proper procedures but as i said before now i am more aware and in a new school district who seem to really care about all the children involved. sherryFrom: susanonderko <susanonderko@...> Sent: Tuesday, May 19, 2009 6:02:55 PMSubject: Re: ( ) What type of testing/screening/assessment should I be asking for? Sherry good advice! My only addition is if the child has attentional or organizational issues, the school learning consultant won't find these issues. My daughter does well on school educational tests because at the lower grades they test for knowledge. Our school was ready to label my daughter as emotional rather than learning impaired. They still do not get her learning issues. I just don't think even special education teachers grasp LD's around what they call "megacognitive issues" kids that don't get the "gestalt" the big picture. I am finally getting that my daughter need to be taught how to learn ...how to cope with her exective function disorder. We can make life simplier for them but at some age ...middle school they need to start to learn "learning" strategies .. Good luck, Pam together etc... Pam > > you can request the school district test her for learning disabilities and make sure any and all request are made in writing, they have a certain amount of time to respond to your request this is a law here in pa they have 60 days to respond i think my son is just now going thru the process i contacted pen which is the pennsylvania education network they gave me all my rights and the laws as the school district has to go by finally after we moved to a new school district within the first two weeks of him in new school they had talked with me in person and via email, they immediately started testing and evaluating him and also gathered outside info pertaining to the AS dx he already has, so now after fighting for 2 yrs we are getting some where but my best advice would be request in writing and dont back down dont let them convince you that your child doesnt need to be tested tell them you concerns and that you wont quit until you know your child is > recieving exactly what she needs when she needs it. sherry > > > > > ____________ _________ _________ __ > From: andie <andie6294@. ..> > > Sent: Monday, May 18, 2009 11:21:00 PM > Subject: ( ) What type of testing/screening/ assessment should I be asking for? > > > > > > And from whom? > > I really want to have my daughter (6 in mid-July) evaluated and screened for learning disabilities. She's almost classic AS, rather mild, but she also has HUGE issues with math. I spent a ridiculous amount of time today trying to get through to her what 'plus 1' means. No kidding. I tried explaining it every different way I could think of (one more than X, what's the next number after X?) and with EVERY new question, I had to end up holding up my fingers and spelling it out to her! She has MAJOR problems with distraction, has to have constant prodding to finish a task... she's making me batty!! > > Anyway, I'm wondering to whom I would take her to do a real assessment to rule out and then hopefully definitively diagnose the learning struggles so I can get her the proper help. Any suggestions? > > She's seen a neurologist - he was the one to dx AS based on the history I'd supplied, and a psychologist, who suggested the neuro workup to rule out neurological pathology vs AS or ADHD. I was told today about a neuroscience assessment center (of course there's a very long waiting list to get in), but am I also correct to say that a neuropsych does this type of screening? > > I just don't quite know what to push for. We live far, FAR from any place where these resources are available, and I'd like to do some one-stop-shopping and find out how to help this kid before she goes back to school in August. > > Thanks to all of you in advance for your wisdom. It's such a great blessing to have somewhere to go for advice! > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 20, 2009 Report Share Posted May 20, 2009 i totally agree it seems unfair and a shame to these children that we all have to fight so hard to get them the resources and support they need to be able to be more independent when they become adults. it is just not right. sherryFrom: susanonderko <susanonderko@...> Sent: Tuesday, May 19, 2009 5:54:53 PMSubject: ( ) Re: What type of testing/screening/assessment should I be asking for? I spend too much money. That is a great idea. Also my advocate today told me not to update up neuropsych (last one was 2 years ago) because then the school can reject it. She wanted us to ask the school to order one and pay for it. Your idea Ruth is better. I think as parent's we need to get to the heart of our kids problems. I hate playing political games where our kids get hurt waiting for the school to do the right thing. This is such a great group!!! Pam > > > > A neuropsch report gets at specfic cognition deficits > > better than pschs that do tests for ADHD alone. Neurops > > tests cost between 2K - 5K. We did our daughters at age 9. > > This is all really great advice! But I just have to FYI that if you are lucky you have a children's hospital or other neurobehavioral clinic near you that takes insurance. We got our neuropsych eval covered under our insurance. We paid less than $100 in co-pays for all the appointments. That included diagnostic eval, 4-hr neuropsych eval for child, parental input incorporating several hours, and a few follow-up visits/phone calls for Q & A and help with school. > > Ruth > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 20, 2009 Report Share Posted May 20, 2009 That's really not true that most AS kids are great at math. Everyone is different and has a different profile. Roxanna Autism Happens ( ) Re: What type of testing/screening/assessment should I be asking for? Most AS kids have math calculations as a strength. Kids with AS with NLD (a non verbal learning disorder) may have serious problems with math facts. There are some genetic disorder that kidos have autistic traits and specific LD's (girls with Syndrome or girls and boys carriers of fragile X). If there was a genetic disorder they may be issues with growth or with hyperlaxity of joints. If neither are present forget the genetic issues. A nueropsch does the testing for NLD and also for ADHD. NLDline is a web site with a wealth of info. Even without the DX of NLD learning profile you can use their stratgies. Often it means no timed math tests, a resource room for math. There is a good book on executive function issues by Lynn Meltzer and kids with AS, autism, ADHD all have this frontal lobe issues with organization, attention, transitioning, emotional control more or less. Kids with NLD or ADHD or AS etc have issues with multiple instructions. You have to give them one at a time. Kids with AS seems to do well with visual presentations like charts etc where kids with NLD are verbal learners and can't cope with too much visual presentations. A neuropsch report gets at specfic cognition deficits better than pschs that do tests for ADHD alone. Neurops tests cost between 2K - 5K. We did our daughters at age 9. What are her other strengths and weakmesses beside math calculations. Is she a good decoder for reader? Does she transition well? How is she at ball catching visual spatial stuff, how are her motor skills is she clumsy? Is she verbally gifted? Does she have issues with auditory processing (hears stuff the wrong way). Does she wear glasses? Pam 94@...> wrote: > > And from whom? > > I really want to have my daughter (6 in mid-July) evaluated and screened for learning disabilities. She's almost classic AS, rather mild, but she also has HUGE issues with math. I spent a ridiculous amount of time today trying to get through to her what 'plus 1' means. No kidding. I tried explaining it every different way I could think of (one more than X, what's the next number after X?) and with EVERY new question, I had to end up holding up my fingers and spelling it out to her! She has MAJOR problems with distraction, has to have constant prodding to finish a task... she's making me batty!! > > Anyway, I'm wondering to whom I would take her to do a real assessment to rule out and then hopefully definitively diagnose the learning struggles so I can get her the proper help. Any suggestions? > > She's seen a neurologist - he was the one to dx AS based on the history I'd supplied, and a psychologist, who suggested the neuro workup to rule out neurological pathology vs AS or ADHD. I was told today about a neuroscience assessment center (of course there's a very long waiting list to get in), but am I also correct to say that a neuropsych does this type of screening? > > I just don't quite know what to push for. We live far, FAR from any place where these resources are available, and I'd like to do some one-stop-shopping and find out how to help this kid before she goes back to school in August. > > Thanks to all of you in advance for your wisdom. It's such a great blessing to have somewhere to go for advice! > We found the real 'Hotel California' and the 'Seinfeld' diner. What will you find? Explore WhereItsAt.com. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 20, 2009 Report Share Posted May 20, 2009 Our DS biggest hurdle is, and was math. And, it can overlap, or be part of so many other problems. If you have math problems, you may also have spatial problems, you probably don't have an internal numberline. Many people have a sort of zero point at their nose, numbers that go off to the right are positive and in an ORDER, and ones to the left are negative. DS never had that internal organization, which for him, translated into executive functioning, which translated into problems everywhere! Numbers had no order or recognizible pattern, i.e. he couldn't see patterns in other things. Touchpoints or touchmath were very helpful for him, but I sympathize with you. I really wish we had strongly addressed his math deficits and related. However, as he was born in the " stone age " of 1984, nobody realized this. Instead we drilled and drilled on memorizing addition and subtraction facts, and multiplication tables, which to this day, he still doesn't know. So I guess my point is there can be underlying processing difficulties that show themselves as math weakness. I would insist on a lot of tests if this is showing up as math difficulty. Good luck with your daughter. Sue in TN > Also, when teaching math, use concrete examples.? Instead of counting what comes after a number, get five pencils and " add " one more pencil.? Then count how many.? Any time you can make it visual, it might help.? Also there is a math program geared towards kids with math problems called " touch math. " ? I know our elementary school uses this in the resource math class. > -->? > http://www.touchmath.com/ > > Here is a link to an article on dyscalculia -->? http://www.ldonline.org/article/Dyscalculia > > > ?Roxanna > > Autism Happens > > > > > > > ( ) What type of testing/screening/assessment should I be asking for? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > And from whom? > > > > I really want to have my daughter (6 in mid-July) evaluated and screened for learning disabilities. She's almost classic AS, rather mild, but she also has HUGE issues with math. I spent a ridiculous amount of time today trying to get through to her what 'plus 1' means. No kidding. I tried explaining it every different way I could think of (one more than X, what's the next number after X?) and with EVERY new question, I had to end up holding up my fingers and spelling it out to her! She has MAJOR problems with distraction, has to have constant prodding to finish a task... she's making me batty!! > > > > Anyway, I'm wondering to whom I would take her to do a real assessment to rule out and then hopefully definitively diagnose the learning struggles so I can get her the proper help. Any suggestions? > > > > She's seen a neurologist - he was the one to dx AS based on the history I'd supplied, and a psychologist, who suggested the neuro workup to rule out neurological pathology vs AS or ADHD. I was told today about a neuroscience assessment center (of course there's a very long waiting list to get in), but am I also correct to say that a neuropsych does this type of screening? > > > > I just don't quite know what to push for. We live far, FAR from any place where these resources are available, and I'd like to do some one-stop-shopping and find out how to help this kid before she goes back to school in August. > > > > Thanks to all of you in advance for your wisdom. It's such a great blessing to have somewhere to go for advice! > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 20, 2009 Report Share Posted May 20, 2009 Right Roxanna brings up a good point. . Maybe it's better to talk about strengths and weaknesses kids with visual spatial processing issues often have trouble with ball catching, math calculations and sometimes are more auditory learners (sometimes fit the profile of NLD and benefit from stratgies for visual spatial issues). Then there are the kids with good visual processing, that may do well with ball catching, math calculations, orientation, like to build 3D stuff (usually not NLD kids). Kids with social impairment are often given a DX of AS and may have various cognitive profiles. These cognitve profiles can affect learning. Some may be dyslexic, have ADHD, have NLD, have auditory processing issues or some are even gifted in reasoning skills. For a parent with a new DX it is hard to figure out what is what. A neuropsch report is helpful in understanding cognitve strengths and weaknesses. Where a school education evaluation often is not (unless the issues are so pronounced). I did find as a " mom " I had a good idea of my kids strengths and weaknesses all figured out very early. Just " mom " is not an expert and the neuropsch report makes it more concrete. For example, my daughter was always slow and studied a few things at a time. I new she had a slow processing speed. I did not know how slow and I didn't know there was a test for it. But I new it. I knew my daughter has visual spatial issues because she was easily disorientated but I didn't know this would impact math. I knew my daughter didn't retain math facts but I didn't know why. Roxanna brings up a good point. Pam > > > > > > And from whom? > > > > > > I really want to have my daughter (6 in mid-July) evaluated and screened for learning disabilities. She's almost classic AS, rather mild, but she also has HUGE issues with math. I spent a ridiculous amount of time today trying to get through to her what 'plus 1' means. No kidding. I tried explaining it every different way I could think of (one more than X, what's the next number after X?) and with EVERY new question, I had to end up holding up my fingers and spelling it out to her! She has MAJOR problems with distraction, has to have constant prodding to finish a task... she's making me batty!! > > > > > > Anyway, I'm wondering to whom I would take her to do a real assessment to rule out and then hopefully definitively diagnose the learning struggles so I can get her the proper help. Any suggestions? > > > > > > She's seen a neurologist - he was the one to dx AS based on the history I'd supplied, and a psychologist, who suggested the neuro workup to rule out neurological pathology vs AS or ADHD. I was told today about a neuroscience assessment center (of course there's a very long waiting list to get in), but am I also correct to say that a neuropsych does this type of screening? > > > > > > I just don't quite know what to push for. We live far, FAR from any place where these resources are available, and I'd like to do some one-stop-shopping and find out how to help this kid before she goes back to school in August. > > > > > > Thanks to all of you in advance for your wisdom. It's such a great blessing to have somewhere to go for advice! > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 20, 2009 Report Share Posted May 20, 2009 Thanks for the advice! I requested an evaluation in the beginning of the school year. They sent the school psychologist to observe her, and she said that liese's (very odd) behaviors were a mere maturity issue. This woman observed her in class (kindergarten, mind you) for 1.5 hrs ONE DAY. She decided that liese's learning wasn't being effected enough to warrant an evaluation. She has since been dx w AS, OCD tendencies, and possible ADHD. I want to know now how to HELP HER, and what accommodations to ask the school for! I suppose I could wait and jump through the school district's hoops once she gets into 1st grade. In the mean time, I've found a place called the neuroscience assessment center which is part of the university children's hospital. > > > Your school should be able to do an educational evaluation.? I would request one from the school in writing.? A complete educational evaluation should give you some ideas where her problem areas are.? If you don't like the school's assessment, you can request one from an independent source at their expense.? But if she is having so much trouble with math, seems like it would show up.? > > Also, when teaching math, use concrete examples.? Instead of counting what comes after a number, get five pencils and " add " one more pencil.? Then count how many.? Any time you can make it visual, it might help.? Also there is a math program geared towards kids with math problems called " touch math. " ? I know our elementary school uses this in the resource math class. > -->? > http://www.touchmath.com/ > > Here is a link to an article on dyscalculia -->? http://www.ldonline.org/article/Dyscalculia > > > ?Roxanna > > Autism Happens > > > > > > > ( ) What type of testing/screening/assessment should I be asking for? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > And from whom? > > > > I really want to have my daughter (6 in mid-July) evaluated and screened for learning disabilities. She's almost classic AS, rather mild, but she also has HUGE issues with math. I spent a ridiculous amount of time today trying to get through to her what 'plus 1' means. No kidding. I tried explaining it every different way I could think of (one more than X, what's the next number after X?) and with EVERY new question, I had to end up holding up my fingers and spelling it out to her! She has MAJOR problems with distraction, has to have constant prodding to finish a task... she's making me batty!! > > > > Anyway, I'm wondering to whom I would take her to do a real assessment to rule out and then hopefully definitively diagnose the learning struggles so I can get her the proper help. Any suggestions? > > > > She's seen a neurologist - he was the one to dx AS based on the history I'd supplied, and a psychologist, who suggested the neuro workup to rule out neurological pathology vs AS or ADHD. I was told today about a neuroscience assessment center (of course there's a very long waiting list to get in), but am I also correct to say that a neuropsych does this type of screening? > > > > I just don't quite know what to push for. We live far, FAR from any place where these resources are available, and I'd like to do some one-stop-shopping and find out how to help this kid before she goes back to school in August. > > > > Thanks to all of you in advance for your wisdom. It's such a great blessing to have somewhere to go for advice! > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 21, 2009 Report Share Posted May 21, 2009 > > Kids with social impairment are often given a DX of AS and may have > various cognitive profiles. These cognitve profiles can affect > learning. Some may be dyslexic, have ADHD, have NLD, have auditory > processing issues or some are even gifted in reasoning skills. Just to give another example, my AS son has just average visual-spatial learning skills and out-the-roof auditory learning skills. He is considered to be gifted (pretty borderline but within the range) in general, but he is just average/high average in math. He has difficulties in school because of slow processing speed, working memory (which present as executive dysfunction). This last time, his processing speed ended up being in the lowest one percentile. So, he literally has IQ scores ranging from the bottom first percentile to the top first percentile! His working memory is something like low average. One thing that really confused me that I think we finally got resolved was his NLD-like symptoms. He always does very well on visual-processing evaluating, but has always had problems doing things like reading fast-food menus and worksheets. We've had a lot of problems with him avoiding worksheets like the plague. And he has the very superior auditory learning skills that are so common to NLD. But he always did fine with geometry and construction toys. Anyway, they (school district autism team) say it is his executive dysfunction. He's having a hard time holding all the pieces simultaneously in his head long enough to put it together. I'm finally satisfied with this explanation. Ruth Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 21, 2009 Report Share Posted May 21, 2009 > > I had an idea Ruth to have a neuropsych explain learning stratgies to the school (how to learn strategies). I haven't met with the > neuropych yet (this weekend) but I get the sense that the ball is > being thrown over the fence. The neuropsychs do tests > but aren't really educators. Let's see if I get anywhere with this. Yeah, I did this sort of indirectly when we got our neuropsych eval a couple of years ago. Our neuropsych eval has really been the root of everything that has happened at school for our son. It got used over and over again. It included quite an extensive recommendations section. I couldn't get our neuropsych to come to any meetings, but he did have a postdoc student of his talk to the school diag. This wasn't terribly effective, as she was too young and inexperienced. But another thing he did that helped a lot was have the postdoc student write a special addendum to the eval (in consultation with himself) about initiation difficulties and our son specifically. It was 3 or 4 pages long, and again, has been used over and over again by school staff. He did this after I complained about all the problems we were having with the school staff thinking our son was just willfully being lazy when he sat in class doing nothing, not understanding that he really didn't know what he was supposed to be doing. > A good book is " Executive Function in Education " by Lynn > Meltzer Phd (yeah! an actual learning consultant). Yes! I have this book too (recommended by the neuropsych). I'm going to have to bring out the section on math, because for some reason the autism team is focusing on writing and executive dysfunction and ignoring math problems. I think this is because my son is gifted in language arts and is quite clearly underachieving in that area, whereas in math they consider him to be just average anyway. So, I'm going to have to build a case for reality. Although part of me thinks we don't want to try to do too much, and maybe it is okay to just focus on the writing as long as he is doing average in grade-level math with the accommodations he has (which he is, even a little above average). > But in the public schools most kids don't > need this level of skill development Pam, you will be surprised. Nowadays, the public schools have a track where the kids can start taking AP or IB classes their sophomore or junior year in high school. They have enough AP classes that they can take 3 or 4 AP at a time their junior and senior years. Not that any but the most gifted and motivated students could handle that. I know neither of my kids will be doing that! And the kids can't succeed in these AP classes if they don't have the background or the study skills like you describe. That is what the Pre-AP classes in jr high and the first couple of years in high school are about. As an aside, the autism team is recommending my son be encouraged to get back into the Pre-AP/AP track with accommodations for his organizational/planning deficits (no change in content). We discussed starting out with just one class. They didn't say much, but I know from experience that the accommodations will need to be ironed out. Anyway, I'm so happy for my son. He's been really missing the intellectual stimulation of the more advanced classes. One of the autism team members has a husband/2 kids with Asperger who are gifted, so she was very familiar with all these issues and very attentive. That was probably a big stroke of luck to get her on the team. I think I probably have her to thank. I've been bugging my son for weeks, anticipating the possibility of this decision, and he's decided he wants to try history. Getting him to make a decision like that is really quit a big step for him. It really did take him all that time to make it, as he was emoting over how he wanted to take two. It was a big step for him to get over the emoting and feeling like it wasn't fair and making a decision within reality. My aspie is finally maturing! > Don't burn out Ruth you are doing an amazing job. Thanks, Pam and group! I really appreciate the support! Ruth Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 21, 2009 Report Share Posted May 21, 2009 where do you live? go on internet and look for parent education network they have all the info on school law and your rights as a parent, they can answer your questions and tell you what to do about it. good luck sherryFrom: andie <andie6294@...> Sent: Wednesday, May 20, 2009 10:48:25 PMSubject: ( ) Re: What type of testing/screening/assessment should I be asking for? Thanks for the advice! I requested an evaluation in the beginning of the school year. They sent the school psychologist to observe her, and she said that liese's (very odd) behaviors were a mere maturity issue. This woman observed her in class (kindergarten, mind you) for 1.5 hrs ONE DAY. She decided that liese's learning wasn't being effected enough to warrant an evaluation. She has since been dx w AS, OCD tendencies, and possible ADHD. I want to know now how to HELP HER, and what accommodations to ask the school for! I suppose I could wait and jump through the school district's hoops once she gets into 1st grade. In the mean time, I've found a place called the neuroscience assessment center which is part of the university children's hospital. > > > Your school should be able to do an educational evaluation.? I would request one from the school in writing.? A complete educational evaluation should give you some ideas where her problem areas are.? If you don't like the school's assessment, you can request one from an independent source at their expense.? But if she is having so much trouble with math, seems like it would show up.? > > Also, when teaching math, use concrete examples.? Instead of counting what comes after a number, get five pencils and "add" one more pencil.? Then count how many.? Any time you can make it visual, it might help.? Also there is a math program geared towards kids with math problems called "touch math."? I know our elementary school uses this in the resource math class. > -->? > http://www.touchmath.com/ > > Here is a link to an article on dyscalculia -->? http://www.ldonline.org/article/Dyscalculia > > > ?Roxanna > > Autism Happens > > > > > > > ( ) What type of testing/screening/ assessment should I be asking for? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > And from whom? > > > > I really want to have my daughter (6 in mid-July) evaluated and screened for learning disabilities. She's almost classic AS, rather mild, but she also has HUGE issues with math. I spent a ridiculous amount of time today trying to get through to her what 'plus 1' means. No kidding. I tried explaining it every different way I could think of (one more than X, what's the next number after X?) and with EVERY new question, I had to end up holding up my fingers and spelling it out to her! She has MAJOR problems with distraction, has to have constant prodding to finish a task... she's making me batty!! > > > > Anyway, I'm wondering to whom I would take her to do a real assessment to rule out and then hopefully definitively diagnose the learning struggles so I can get her the proper help. Any suggestions? > > > > She's seen a neurologist - he was the one to dx AS based on the history I'd supplied, and a psychologist, who suggested the neuro workup to rule out neurological pathology vs AS or ADHD. I was told today about a neuroscience assessment center (of course there's a very long waiting list to get in), but am I also correct to say that a neuropsych does this type of screening? > > > > I just don't quite know what to push for. We live far, FAR from any place where these resources are available, and I'd like to do some one-stop-shopping and find out how to help this kid before she goes back to school in August. > > > > Thanks to all of you in advance for your wisdom. It's such a great blessing to have somewhere to go for advice! > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 21, 2009 Report Share Posted May 21, 2009 > > Thanks for the advice! I requested an evaluation in the beginning of the school year. They sent the school psychologist to observe her, and she said that liese's (very odd) behaviors were a mere maturity issue. It is quite possible that you will continue to get responses like this until you get her seen by an autism specialist. It might make a world of difference if you can push the school to have her seen by someone with specific training in autism. Some schools have autism specialists on staff or contract and some don't. By law, you should be able to request an autism evaluation if she is showing the symptoms, but in reality it is often impossible to make that happen without already having a dx in hand. In light of this, you might want to go ahead and schedule an appointment with the neuroscience assessment center you found. Your daughter is young; it will not be the end of the world if you wait a year for a dx. Something to know is that the private evals and school evals are not an either or thing. You need them both, if you can manage it. In our case, once we got to an autism specialist (in our case a team of autism specialists), the school evals were more in-depth regarding academic issues, while the private evals were more in-depth in other issues, including some educational issues that weren't purely academic. The neuroscience center may well do more than a screening, if you ask. They can do a very comprehensive eval that can be very helpful to you. If it is like ours, it will end up being used by many people to help make decisions for at least a couple of years. It will really help you get to the bottom of what your daughters problems actually are, so you can see where she needs help more clearly. But in the meantime, now that you have a dx, you should be able to argue affectively that this woman that observed her did not have the appropriate training and request someone who does (maybe put it a little more nicely!). You are doing all the right things--don't be discouraged. These things take time; you will get there! Ruth Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 21, 2009 Report Share Posted May 21, 2009 Ruth you really are doing an amazing job. You not only have the most current info on social skills and executive function you have many accomodations in place (something I haven't been able to accomplish in our school). And you even got your nerupsych to participate even more than he/she wanted to ...how fantastic!!! You are a role model for us! Pam -- In , " r_woman2 " <me2ruth@...> wrote: > > > > > > I had an idea Ruth to have a neuropsych explain learning stratgies to the school (how to learn strategies). I haven't met with the > > neuropych yet (this weekend) but I get the sense that the ball is > > being thrown over the fence. The neuropsychs do tests > > but aren't really educators. Let's see if I get anywhere with this. > > Yeah, I did this sort of indirectly when we got our neuropsych eval a couple of years ago. Our neuropsych eval has really been the root of everything that has happened at school for our son. It got used over and over again. It included quite an extensive recommendations section. > > I couldn't get our neuropsych to come to any meetings, but he did have a postdoc student of his talk to the school diag. This wasn't terribly effective, as she was too young and inexperienced. > > But another thing he did that helped a lot was have the postdoc student write a special addendum to the eval (in consultation with himself) about initiation difficulties and our son specifically. It was 3 or 4 pages long, and again, has been used over and over again by school staff. He did this after I complained about all the problems we were having with the school staff thinking our son was just willfully being lazy when he sat in class doing nothing, not understanding that he really didn't know what he was supposed to be doing. > > > A good book is " Executive Function in Education " by Lynn > > Meltzer Phd (yeah! an actual learning consultant). > > Yes! I have this book too (recommended by the neuropsych). I'm going to have to bring out the section on math, because for some reason the autism team is focusing on writing and executive dysfunction and ignoring math problems. I think this is because my son is gifted in language arts and is quite clearly underachieving in that area, whereas in math they consider him to be just average anyway. So, I'm going to have to build a case for reality. Although part of me thinks we don't want to try to do too much, and maybe it is okay to just focus on the writing as long as he is doing average in grade-level math with the accommodations he has (which he is, even a little above average). > > > But in the public schools most kids don't > > need this level of skill development > > Pam, you will be surprised. Nowadays, the public schools have a track where the kids can start taking AP or IB classes their sophomore or junior year in high school. They have enough AP classes that they can take 3 or 4 AP at a time their junior and senior years. Not that any but the most gifted and motivated students could handle that. I know neither of my kids will be doing that! And the kids can't succeed in these AP classes if they don't have the background or the study skills like you describe. That is what the Pre-AP classes in jr high and the first couple of years in high school are about. > > As an aside, the autism team is recommending my son be encouraged to get back into the Pre-AP/AP track with accommodations for his organizational/planning deficits (no change in content). We discussed starting out with just one class. They didn't say much, but I know from experience that the accommodations will need to be ironed out. Anyway, I'm so happy for my son. He's been really missing the intellectual stimulation of the more advanced classes. One of the autism team members has a husband/2 kids with Asperger who are gifted, so she was very familiar with all these issues and very attentive. That was probably a big stroke of luck to get her on the team. I think I probably have her to thank. > > I've been bugging my son for weeks, anticipating the possibility of this decision, and he's decided he wants to try history. Getting him to make a decision like that is really quit a big step for him. It really did take him all that time to make it, as he was emoting over how he wanted to take two. It was a big step for him to get over the emoting and feeling like it wasn't fair and making a decision within reality. My aspie is finally maturing! > > > Don't burn out Ruth you are doing an amazing job. > > Thanks, Pam and group! I really appreciate the support! > > Ruth > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 21, 2009 Report Share Posted May 21, 2009 > > Ruth you really are doing an amazing job. You not only have > the most current info on social skills and executive function > you have many accomodations in place (something I haven't been able to accomplish in our school). And you even got your nerupsych > to participate even more than he/she wanted to ...how fantastic!!! > > You are a role model for us! LOL, thanks Pam! Keep in mind it all hasn't happened yet, and this comes on top of MANY failures and lots of learning things the hard way. And I've had so much help from these lists. I really don't know where we'd be if I hadn't had this resource. And I have to give the school staff a lot of credit. They are so oppositional and conterproductive sometimes, but if you can get them to understand the need and get them to pick up the ball, sometimes they will really run with it. So, I definitely can't claim all the credit for finally getting somewhere. Ruth Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 21, 2009 Report Share Posted May 21, 2009 Andie, at the minimal ask for this: 1. Class setting with an aide or in class support staff. 2. Extra time for math Then pick what seems like it applies. These are some of what we had in first grade. 3. Extra time for transitions 4. Grade her on work completed 5. Avoid overstatments, sacasim 6. Aide for class trips 7. Buddy to accomply her to bathroom or out of the room. 8. Aide for firedrills (don't leave her to follow group) 9. Scheduled bathroom breaks (if there are any accidents) 10. Female buddy to sit with her at lunch. 11. Female seat mate and not in a group seating. (my daughter perceived this as her friend) 12. Reduce motor skill tasks (things that need cutting, getting up and down). 13. In class support teacher or aide helps her get her belongs together and into her bookbag. 14. Faciliate group projects 15. Extra set of books (probably not necesarry until 3rd grade) 16. No timed tests (grade her on what she completed) 17. Do not require her to be accomplished in math before introducing next concept. (unless concepts are the issue and not calculations). 18. Reduce number of problems on a page. want more or is this enough ... 19. PE don't allow peer picking 20. PE Help her suceed in PE pair with like skilled student Whew ....need more let me think 21. OT or PT as needed 22. Speech pragmatics 23. Counseling lunch bunch with female peers OK? Pam > > > > > > Your school should be able to do an educational evaluation.? I would request one from the school in writing.? A complete educational evaluation should give you some ideas where her problem areas are.? If you don't like the school's assessment, you can request one from an independent source at their expense.? But if she is having so much trouble with math, seems like it would show up.? > > > > Also, when teaching math, use concrete examples.? Instead of counting what comes after a number, get five pencils and " add " one more pencil.? Then count how many.? Any time you can make it visual, it might help.? Also there is a math program geared towards kids with math problems called " touch math. " ? I know our elementary school uses this in the resource math class. > > -->? > > http://www.touchmath.com/ > > > > Here is a link to an article on dyscalculia -->? http://www.ldonline.org/article/Dyscalculia > > > > > > ?Roxanna > > > > Autism Happens > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ( ) What type of testing/screening/assessment should I be asking for? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > And from whom? > > > > > > > > I really want to have my daughter (6 in mid-July) evaluated and screened for learning disabilities. She's almost classic AS, rather mild, but she also has HUGE issues with math. I spent a ridiculous amount of time today trying to get through to her what 'plus 1' means. No kidding. I tried explaining it every different way I could think of (one more than X, what's the next number after X?) and with EVERY new question, I had to end up holding up my fingers and spelling it out to her! She has MAJOR problems with distraction, has to have constant prodding to finish a task... she's making me batty!! > > > > > > > > Anyway, I'm wondering to whom I would take her to do a real assessment to rule out and then hopefully definitively diagnose the learning struggles so I can get her the proper help. Any suggestions? > > > > > > > > She's seen a neurologist - he was the one to dx AS based on the history I'd supplied, and a psychologist, who suggested the neuro workup to rule out neurological pathology vs AS or ADHD. I was told today about a neuroscience assessment center (of course there's a very long waiting list to get in), but am I also correct to say that a neuropsych does this type of screening? > > > > > > > > I just don't quite know what to push for. We live far, FAR from any place where these resources are available, and I'd like to do some one-stop-shopping and find out how to help this kid before she goes back to school in August. > > > > > > > > Thanks to all of you in advance for your wisdom. It's such a great blessing to have somewhere to go for advice! > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 21, 2009 Report Share Posted May 21, 2009 Request a full educational evaluation in writing. Ignore the school psych's stunt. And also, if they repeat that they don't think she needs an evaluation, get their refusal to evaluate in writing. If they have not done that, write and request that you be told why they are refusing to evaluate. I would put in the letter how much time she spent observing and specifically what she observed to make her decision. Roxanna Autism Happens ( ) What type of testing/screening/assessment should I be asking for? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > And from whom? > > > > I really want to have my daughter (6 in mid-July) evaluated and screened for learning disabilities. She's almost classic AS, rather mild, but she also has HUGE issues with math. I spent a ridiculous amount of time today trying to get through to her what 'plus 1' means. No kidding. I tried explaining it every different way I could think of (one more than X, what's the next number after X?) and with EVERY new question, I had to end up holding up my fingers and spelling it out to her! She has MAJOR problems with distraction, has to have constant prodding to finish a task... she's making me batty!! > > > > Anyway, I'm wondering to whom I would take her to do a real assessment to rule out and then hopefully definitively diagnose the learning struggles so I can get her the proper help. Any suggestions? > > > > She's seen a neurologist - he was the one to dx AS based on the history I'd supplied, and a psychologist, who suggested the neuro workup to rule out neurological pathology vs AS or ADHD. I was told today about a neuroscience assessment center (of course there's a very long waiting list to get in), but am I also correct to say that a neuropsych does this type of screening? > > > > I just don't quite know what to push for. We live far, FAR from any place where these resources are available, and I'd like to do some one-stop-shopping and find out how to help this kid before she goes back to school in August. > > > > Thanks to all of you in advance for your wisdom. It's such a great blessing to have somewhere to go for advice! > We found the real 'Hotel California' and the 'Seinfeld' diner. What will you find? Explore WhereItsAt.com. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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