Re: Diagnosing Aspergers in toddler?

[Guest guest]

Bridget – My son (now 20 years old) had some of the same characteristics

you describe ­­– rigidity, difficulty with transitions/changes,

melt downs, difficulty interacting with peers (did much better with younger

children or adults), etc. He was, and is, very bright.

Unfortunately, little was known about Aspergers (it wasn’t officially recognized

in the U.S. until 1994) and he did not get diagnosed until he was 15. He

had been diagnosed with ADHD at the age of 5. Let me also add that just because

your child has some of the same characteristics that mine had doesn’t

mean he has AS – I am just answering your question. And, I don’t

know if there is a magical age that a child has to be before a professional

will give them a diagnosis - maybe someone else on this list could answer that.

From:

[mailto: ] On

Behalf Of bridget

Sent: Monday, July 05, 2010 1:11 PM

Subject: ( ) Diagnosing Aspergers in toddler?

Hi all,

I am new to this group. My son who is going to be 3 in the fall was recently dx

with sensory processing disorder, and I have suspicions about mild Asperger's

as well (though he has not been dx with AS at this point). We recently had a

meeting with the early intervention services, and the child psychologist said

that although she would not be surprised if my son was dx with AS at some point

in the future, she did not feel comfortable making that dx now. The concerns I

have that make me wonder about AS, other than the sensory issues, include

lining things up, hyperlexia, rigid thinking, difficulty with transitions,

quick to melt down, odd phrasing (which his OT said sounded atypical for his

age, but typical for AS), obsessions with trains, and much better social

interactions with adults than peers. He is very, very bright (can spell and

read some words and do simple math in his head), and the psychologist from

early intervention plans to do some cognitive and IQ testing later this week.

She did not, however, do any formal diagnostic testing for AS, such as the ADOS

test. Her reasoning for not wanting to give a dx of AS at this time was that my

son's interactions with adults are so strong and that he has obsessions, but

can be distracted from them with some effort. She also wondered if some of his

social issues with peers stem from being very bright, although I know that

being gifted and having AS are not mutually exclusive.

What I was wondering is if this sounds like any of your kids at this age? The

psychologist did recommend that we continue to pursue evaluation with our local

TEACCH center (have sent in a questionnaire, but it takes months to be seen),

so she is not saying that my son does not have AS, just that she is not sure

enough to dx. My son starts his first preschool in the fall, so it is important

to me to have a more clear picture of his needs before throwing him into a room

full of toddlers to sink or swim.

I would greatly appreciate input from other parents who have been through this

process already!

Thanks,

Bridget

[Guest guest]

Thanks, . I think you nailed it on the head - at what point does having

some of the symptoms warrant a dx? That is what we are wrestling with right now.

I feel like if my son does in fact have AS, I would rather find out sooner

rather than later; I am not worried about the whole " label " issue - better to

know than to hide from the facts. Of course, if my little guy does has some of

the symptoms, but does not meet the criteria, we would want to know that too.

The psychologist we saw through early intervention seemed good overall, but AS

is not her field of expertise. While only certain people can officially

diagnose, I often find that parents who have been through a situation know at

least as much as the professionals, which is why I am hoping to get some insight

from everyone here.

Thanks again,

Bridget

>

> Bridget - My son (now 20 years old) had some of the same characteristics you

> describe --- rigidity, difficulty with transitions/changes, melt downs,

> difficulty interacting with peers (did much better with younger children or

> adults), etc. He was, and is, very bright. Unfortunately, little was known

> about Aspergers (it wasn't officially recognized in the U.S. until 1994) and

> he did not get diagnosed until he was 15. He had been diagnosed with ADHD

> at the age of 5. Let me also add that just because your child has some of

> the same characteristics that mine had doesn't mean he has AS - I am just

> answering your question. And, I don't know if there is a magical age that a

> child has to be before a professional will give them a diagnosis - maybe

> someone else on this list could answer that.

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

> From:

> [mailto: ] On Behalf Of bridget

> Sent: Monday, July 05, 2010 1:11 PM

>

> Subject: ( ) Diagnosing Aspergers in toddler?

>

>

>

> Hi all,

>

> I am new to this group. My son who is going to be 3 in the fall was recently

> dx with sensory processing disorder, and I have suspicions about mild

> Asperger's as well (though he has not been dx with AS at this point). We

> recently had a meeting with the early intervention services, and the child

> psychologist said that although she would not be surprised if my son was dx

> with AS at some point in the future, she did not feel comfortable making

> that dx now. The concerns I have that make me wonder about AS, other than

> the sensory issues, include lining things up, hyperlexia, rigid thinking,

> difficulty with transitions, quick to melt down, odd phrasing (which his OT

> said sounded atypical for his age, but typical for AS), obsessions with

> trains, and much better social interactions with adults than peers. He is

> very, very bright (can spell and read some words and do simple math in his

> head), and the psychologist from early intervention plans to do some

> cognitive and IQ testing later this week. She did not, however, do any

> formal diagnostic testing for AS, such as the ADOS test. Her reasoning for

> not wanting to give a dx of AS at this time was that my son's interactions

> with adults are so strong and that he has obsessions, but can be distracted

> from them with some effort. She also wondered if some of his social issues

> with peers stem from being very bright, although I know that being gifted

> and having AS are not mutually exclusive.

>

> What I was wondering is if this sounds like any of your kids at this age?

> The psychologist did recommend that we continue to pursue evaluation with

> our local TEACCH center (have sent in a questionnaire, but it takes months

> to be seen), so she is not saying that my son does not have AS, just that

> she is not sure enough to dx. My son starts his first preschool in the fall,

> so it is important to me to have a more clear picture of his needs before

> throwing him into a room full of toddlers to sink or swim.

>

> I would greatly appreciate input from other parents who have been through

> this process already!

>

> Thanks,

>

> Bridget

>

[Guest guest]

Dr. Stanley Greenspan has written so much on DX of babies with autism

and on early interventions for babies and toddlers(floortime social

interaction). He has two web sites. If you want the info I can

pass it on.

To answer your question he does sound like he has AS.

My daughter had difficult transitions since she was a baby.

My daughter did not get a DX of AS until she was 9 years old by

that point it was so very very obvious! I have found with my

daughter that because she was so very gifted verbally

and smart professionals called it " anxiety " over and over.

I had to start video taping her with her peers to make

a " case " . She does also have anxiety. Many AS kids do.

And by 9 years old they could test for executive function

deficits (she has them but not obvious, but explains

why she didn't like school).

The most helpful intervention for my daughter has been

behavior therapy, we rehearse what we do, we rehearse

places we had meltdowns and we do lots of re-dos. We also

reduce stimulation dramatically. We shorten our day, we

go out between 9am -3pm and then reduce stimulation in the

evening.

For my daughter a very low dose of zoloft starting at age 11,

reduced the meltdowns from daily to one a week or so.

No one is going to give young child medication unless

they are hurtng themselves or others often. Kids with

anxiety need to suffer along it seems to a preteen age

(unless they have severe persistent anxiety).

Best wishes,

Pam

>

> Hi all,

>

> I am new to this group. My son who is going to be 3 in the fall was recently

dx with sensory processing disorder, and I have suspicions about mild Asperger's

as well (though he has not been dx with AS at this point). We recently had a

meeting with the early intervention services, and the child psychologist said

that although she would not be surprised if my son was dx with AS at some point

in the future, she did not feel comfortable making that dx now. The concerns I

have that make me wonder about AS, other than the sensory issues, include lining

things up, hyperlexia, rigid thinking, difficulty with transitions, quick to

melt down, odd phrasing (which his OT said sounded atypical for his age, but

typical for AS), obsessions with trains, and much better social interactions

with adults than peers. He is very, very bright (can spell and read some words

and do simple math in his head), and the psychologist from early intervention

plans to do some cognitive and IQ testing later this week. She did not, however,

do any formal diagnostic testing for AS, such as the ADOS test. Her reasoning

for not wanting to give a dx of AS at this time was that my son's interactions

with adults are so strong and that he has obsessions, but can be distracted from

them with some effort. She also wondered if some of his social issues with peers

stem from being very bright, although I know that being gifted and having AS are

not mutually exclusive.

>

> What I was wondering is if this sounds like any of your kids at this age? The

psychologist did recommend that we continue to pursue evaluation with our local

TEACCH center (have sent in a questionnaire, but it takes months to be seen), so

she is not saying that my son does not have AS, just that she is not sure enough

to dx. My son starts his first preschool in the fall, so it is important to me

to have a more clear picture of his needs before throwing him into a room full

of toddlers to sink or swim.

>

> I would greatly appreciate input from other parents who have been through this

process already!

>

> Thanks,

>

> Bridget

>

[Guest guest]

( ) Re: Diagnosing Aspergers in toddler?

Dr. Stanley Greenspan has written so much on DX of babies with autism

and on early interventions for babies and toddlers(floortime social

interaction). He has two web sites. If you want the info I can

pass it on.

To answer your question he does sound like he has AS.

My daughter had difficult transitions since she was a baby.

My daughter did not get a DX of AS until she was 9 years old by

that point it was so very very obvious! I have found with my

daughter that because she was so very gifted verbally

and smart professionals called it " anxiety " over and over.

I had to start video taping her with her peers to make

a " case " . She does also have anxiety. Many AS kids do.

And by 9 years old they could test for executive function

deficits (she has them but not obvious, but explains

why she didn't like school).

The most helpful intervention for my daughter has been

behavior therapy, we rehearse what we do, we rehearse

places we had meltdowns and we do lots of re-dos. We also

reduce stim

[Guest guest]

>

> Hi all,

>

> I am new to this group. My son who is going to be 3 in the fall was recently

dx with sensory processing disorder, and I have suspicions about mild Asperger's

as well (though he has not been dx with AS at this point). We recently had a

meeting with the early intervention services, and the child psychologist said

that although she would not be surprised if my son was dx with AS at some point

in the future, she did not feel comfortable making that dx now. The concerns I

have that make me wonder about AS, other than the sensory issues, include lining

things up, hyperlexia, rigid thinking, difficulty with transitions, quick to

melt down, odd phrasing (which his OT said sounded atypical for his age, but

typical for AS), obsessions with trains, and much better social interactions

with adults than peers. He is very, very bright (can spell and read some words

and do simple math in his head), and the psychologist from early intervention

plans to do some cognitive and IQ testing later this week. She did not, however,

do any formal diagnostic testing for AS, such as the ADOS test. Her reasoning

for not wanting to give a dx of AS at this time was that my son's interactions

with adults are so strong and that he has obsessions, but can be distracted from

them with some effort. She also wondered if some of his social issues with peers

stem from being very bright, although I know that being gifted and having AS are

not mutually exclusive.

>

> What I was wondering is if this sounds like any of your kids at this age? The

psychologist did recommend that we continue to pursue evaluation with our local

TEACCH center (have sent in a questionnaire, but it takes months to be seen), so

she is not saying that my son does not have AS, just that she is not sure enough

to dx. My son starts his first preschool in the fall, so it is important to me

to have a more clear picture of his needs before throwing him into a room full

of toddlers to sink or swim.

>

> I would greatly appreciate input from other parents who have been through this

process already!

>

> Thanks,

>

> Bridget

>

hi bridget

the way you describe your son sounds exactly as i would have described my son at

that age. my son was diagnosed at just under 4 years old, he is now 19....i yes

i concur with another post in saying that during that time, " aspergers " was

nearly unheard of in the US.

thankfully, we had a very progessive child psychiatrist . one thing that the

doctor required before diagnosis was a full medical workup on my son. that

included an EEG by a child neurologist, and he actually is the first one who

said the word aspergers to us.interestingly, my sons's brain waves were

measuring like that of a 9 - 11 year old...and he was only 3 and a half. to this

day he has superior IQ.

i beleive that a diagnosis of autism /aspergers is not usually given until the

age of 4.

the benefit of having a diagnosis we found, was that our son then qualified for

medical assitance...the katie beckett program here( im not sure what your state

offers) and virutally all of his medical care and council/therapy was covered

100%.

all the best to you and your family

[Guest guest]

He sounds exactly like my boy at that age and we had the same problem. I

couldn't get them to even consider an AS diagnosis until he was 6. He was just

recently diagnosed. Pick up lots of books and pursue therapy for the sensory

problems. Also, Model Me Kids has great social skill videos for all ages, I

would suggest ordering a couple. AS is just harder to diagnose early than some

of the other PDDs. I have heard about three year olds being diagnosed, but in

my experience it hasn't worked that way at least where we live. Early on, I

found the books about spd to be more helpful than the ones about AS. They

seemed to be more geared towards younger kids while the ones on AS that I have

center more on older children. Probably because kids tend to be diagnosed

later.

>

> Hi all,

>

> I am new to this group. My son who is going to be 3 in the fall was recently

dx with sensory processing disorder, and I have suspicions about mild Asperger's

as well (though he has not been dx with AS at this point). We recently had a

meeting with the early intervention services, and the child psychologist said

that although she would not be surprised if my son was dx with AS at some point

in the future, she did not feel comfortable making that dx now. The concerns I

have that make me wonder about AS, other than the sensory issues, include lining

things up, hyperlexia, rigid thinking, difficulty with transitions, quick to

melt down, odd phrasing (which his OT said sounded atypical for his age, but

typical for AS), obsessions with trains, and much better social interactions

with adults than peers. He is very, very bright (can spell and read some words

and do simple math in his head), and the psychologist from early intervention

plans to do some cognitive and IQ testing later this week. She did not, however,

do any formal diagnostic testing for AS, such as the ADOS test. Her reasoning

for not wanting to give a dx of AS at this time was that my son's interactions

with adults are so strong and that he has obsessions, but can be distracted from

them with some effort. She also wondered if some of his social issues with peers

stem from being very bright, although I know that being gifted and having AS are

not mutually exclusive.

>

> What I was wondering is if this sounds like any of your kids at this age? The

psychologist did recommend that we continue to pursue evaluation with our local

TEACCH center (have sent in a questionnaire, but it takes months to be seen), so

she is not saying that my son does not have AS, just that she is not sure enough

to dx. My son starts his first preschool in the fall, so it is important to me

to have a more clear picture of his needs before throwing him into a room full

of toddlers to sink or swim.

>

> I would greatly appreciate input from other parents who have been through this

process already!

>

> Thanks,

>

> Bridget

>

[Guest guest]

I may be wrong, however it seems to me that since an Asperger's diagnosis requires evidence of very, very difficult social skills as well as a limited range of interests, an accurate diagnosis can and should only be done once a child enters kindergarten, at the earliest. The social interaction piece can only be observed over time among peers, and high intellectual abilities and even ADHD can be misdiagnosed as AS.

[Guest guest]

I had not realized that there is an average minimum age for an AS dx - is that

just because the social aspect is too hard to figure out when kids are younger?

The EEG was very interesting; I had not realized that it could be a helpful tool

in making an AS dx.

Thanks for the info on the Beckett waiver - I had never heard of that

program. Even if we are never able to make use of the program, I passed the info

along to a friend whose child might qualify for it, so that was a great tip!

Bridget

> >

> > Hi all,

> >

> > I am new to this group. My son who is going to be 3 in the fall was recently

dx with sensory processing disorder, and I have suspicions about mild Asperger's

as well (though he has not been dx with AS at this point). We recently had a

meeting with the early intervention services, and the child psychologist said

that although she would not be surprised if my son was dx with AS at some point

in the future, she did not feel comfortable making that dx now. The concerns I

have that make me wonder about AS, other than the sensory issues, include lining

things up, hyperlexia, rigid thinking, difficulty with transitions, quick to

melt down, odd phrasing (which his OT said sounded atypical for his age, but

typical for AS), obsessions with trains, and much better social interactions

with adults than peers. He is very, very bright (can spell and read some words

and do simple math in his head), and the psychologist from early intervention

plans to do some cognitive and IQ testing later this week. She did not, however,

do any formal diagnostic testing for AS, such as the ADOS test. Her reasoning

for not wanting to give a dx of AS at this time was that my son's interactions

with adults are so strong and that he has obsessions, but can be distracted from

them with some effort. She also wondered if some of his social issues with peers

stem from being very bright, although I know that being gifted and having AS are

not mutually exclusive.

> >

> > What I was wondering is if this sounds like any of your kids at this age?

The psychologist did recommend that we continue to pursue evaluation with our

local TEACCH center (have sent in a questionnaire, but it takes months to be

seen), so she is not saying that my son does not have AS, just that she is not

sure enough to dx. My son starts his first preschool in the fall, so it is

important to me to have a more clear picture of his needs before throwing him

into a room full of toddlers to sink or swim.

> >

> > I would greatly appreciate input from other parents who have been through

this process already!

> >

> > Thanks,

> >

> > Bridget

> >

> hi bridget

> the way you describe your son sounds exactly as i would have described my son

at that age. my son was diagnosed at just under 4 years old, he is now 19....i

yes i concur with another post in saying that during that time, " aspergers " was

nearly unheard of in the US.

> thankfully, we had a very progessive child psychiatrist . one thing that the

doctor required before diagnosis was a full medical workup on my son. that

included an EEG by a child neurologist, and he actually is the first one who

said the word aspergers to us.interestingly, my sons's brain waves were

measuring like that of a 9 - 11 year old...and he was only 3 and a half. to this

day he has superior IQ.

> i beleive that a diagnosis of autism /aspergers is not usually given until the

age of 4.

> the benefit of having a diagnosis we found, was that our son then qualified

for medical assitance...the katie beckett program here( im not sure what your

state offers) and virutally all of his medical care and council/therapy was

covered 100%.

> all the best to you and your family

>

[Guest guest]

I think you should see a professional outside of that early intervention group. A good evaluation in all areas can pin down what is going on. It's true that being gifted could cause the problems as well as AS but some of those things are not completely explained. For instance, hyperlexia will involve more than just early reading and obsession with numbers. If it's really hyperlexia, then it's probably AS as well. But again, you'd be seeing other problems with speech. A good speech evaluation that covers all areas of speech development would help sort that out. Also, you say things like the OT thinks his speech is similar to having AS. I would rather hear that from the ST.

My younger ds could be distracted from things but then, he also has ADHD. lol. So sometimes these pat little observations are not really helpful or useful as diagnostic tools. I agree with you that it would be important to find out what you are dealing with before starting school so that you can address all areas of need, as if required.

Roxanna

Whenever I feel blue, I start breathing again.

( ) Diagnosing Aspergers in toddler?

Hi all,

I am new to this group. My son who is going to be 3 in the fall was recently dx with sensory processing disorder, and I have suspicions about mild Asperger's as well (though he has not been dx with AS at this point). We recently had a meeting with the early intervention services, and the child psychologist said that although she would not be surprised if my son was dx with AS at some point in the future, she did not feel comfortable making that dx now. The concerns I have that make me wonder about AS, other than the sensory issues, include lining things up, hyperlexia, rigid thinking, difficulty with transitions, quick to melt down, odd phrasing (which his OT said sounded atypical for his age, but typical for AS), obsessions with trains, and much better social interactions with adults than peers. He is very, very bright (can spell and read some words and do simple math in his head), and the psychologist from early intervention plans to do some cognitive and IQ testing later t

his week. She did not, however, do any formal diagnostic testing for AS, such as the ADOS test. Her reasoning for not wanting to give a dx of AS at this time was that my son's interactions with adults are so strong and that he has obsessions, but can be distracted from them with some effort. She also wondered if some of his social issues with peers stem from being very bright, although I know that being gifted and having AS are not mutually exclusive.

What I was wondering is if this sounds like any of your kids at this age? The psychologist did recommend that we continue to pursue evaluation with our local TEACCH center (have sent in a questionnaire, but it takes months to be seen), so she is not saying that my son does not have AS, just that she is not sure enough to dx. My son starts his first preschool in the fall, so it is important to me to have a more clear picture of his needs before throwing him into a room full of toddlers to sink or swim.

I would greatly appreciate input from other parents who have been through this process already!

Thanks,

Bridget

[Guest guest]

I don't agree. I think our socialization begins at birth as a child begins a long process of building these skills. From making eye contact to smiling in response to words and sounds - it builds up like a tower of skills. They have basic measurement of what skills a child needs to be doing at certain ages - milestones - and I would not wait to put him in school before asking questions if there is a problem. There are a lot of play skills going on well before a child gets to kindergarten as well as socialization and verbal skills. We know from experience that early intervention is so important and I think we under-utilize the information we have. I saw an article the other day and meant to send it but I didn't. Anyway, it was about a study that was done where they recorded the babbling of kids and were able to pick out the kids with autism just based on how many, what kind and the sounds being made.

found the study! --> http://www.aolnews.com/science/article/autism-study-babys-babble-may-contain-vital-clues/19559884

Roxanna

Whenever I feel blue, I start breathing again.

( ) Re: Diagnosing Aspergers in toddler?

I may be wrong, however it seems to me that since an Asperger's diagnosis requires evidence of very, very difficult social skills as well as a limited range of interests, an accurate diagnosis can and should only be done once a child enters kindergarten, at the earliest. The social interaction piece can only be observed over time among peers, and high intellectual abilities and even ADHD can be misdiagnosed as AS.

[Guest guest]

Yes, an interesting point and well-said! Thanks for the link! Yes, I agree with you in that I would definitely not wait for any kind of intervention. Early intervention is so important! But in regards to an actual diagnosis, would a "pdd-nos" diagnosis be more common at a very early age? Can Asperger's Syndrome, whose defining characteristics are lack of appropriate peer-level social interaction and limited interests, truly be gauged in pre-school aged children who primarily participate, peer-wise, in parallel play?

---------------------------------------------------------

" From making eye contact to smiling in response to words and sounds - it builds up like a tower of skills. They have basic measurement of what skills a child needs to be doing at certain ages - milestones - and I would not wait to put him in school before asking questions if there is a problem. There are a lot of play skills going on well before a child gets to kindergarten as well as socialization and verbal skills. "

[Guest guest]

Thanks for the support, Roxanna. Last week, we had a meeting with the preschool

services in our school department to see if my son will qualify to receive

services through them when he turns 3. It was a very positive meeting, and it

turns out that the coordinator of preschool services for our school district has

a child with a condition which includes sensory processing difficulties, so she

has a very good understanding of SPD, with which my son has already been dx. In

speaking with a local parent advocate group, the coordinator also has a very

good reputation for being reasonable and doing her best to find a reason to

qualify children for help. For instance, we had taken the Vineland adaptive

scales test and my son scored just barely below average (84 total - his verbal

skills pulled up his overall score), so she gave us the ABAS II adaptive

behavior test to take to see if we could come up with an even lower score.

We also filled out an ASRS checklist for the school psychologist, with the

promise that if she believes further evaluation is warranted, she will perform

the ADOS test, which is what we have been wanting to have done. When I did the

checklist, I had a feeling that enough of the answers were going to point to the

need for further evaluation. To my surprise, the evaluation submitted by the

early intervention psychologist made several references to " Asperger's like

behaviors " , which can only help our case. I guess that just because she was not

prepared to make a dx herself does not mean that she does not believe that he

may well have AS. I started reading the Tony Attwood book about AS, and one of

the first things he mentioned was that children may interact so well with adult

evaluators that the dx is easily missed.

In the meantime, my son has also started seeing a developmental therapist in

addition to OT, who agrees with the likely dx of AS, based on both peer

interactions and his unusual interests for his age (maps, house numbers, air

conditioning units, etc.) If the preschool services psychologist declines to do

an ADOS, the developmental therapist has a different psychologist who can do it,

so either way we should not have to wait until an opening at TEACCH. While we

will not have an answer before my son starts preschool in early September, I

feel like we are at least moving in the right direction. I will keep you all

posted...

Bridget

>

>

> I think you should see a professional outside of that early intervention

group. A good evaluation in all areas can pin down what is going on. It's true

that being gifted could cause the problems as well as AS but some of those

things are not completely explained. For instance, hyperlexia will involve more

than just early reading and obsession with numbers. If it's really hyperlexia,

then it's probably AS as well. But again, you'd be seeing other problems with

speech. A good speech evaluation that covers all areas of speech development

would help sort that out. Also, you say things like the OT thinks his speech is

similar to having AS. I would rather hear that from the ST.

>

> My younger ds could be distracted from things but then, he also has ADHD.

lol. So sometimes these pat little observations are not really helpful or

useful as diagnostic tools. I agree with you that it would be important to find

out what you are dealing with before starting school so that you can address all

areas of need, as if required.

>

>

>

>

> Roxanna

> Whenever I feel blue, I start breathing again.

>

>

>

>

>

> ( ) Diagnosing Aspergers in toddler?

>

>

>

>

>

> Hi all,

>

> I am new to this group. My son who is going to be 3 in the fall was recently

dx with sensory processing disorder, and I have suspicions about mild Asperger's

as well (though he has not been dx with AS at this point). We recently had a

meeting with the early intervention services, and the child psychologist said

that although she would not be surprised if my son was dx with AS at some point

in the future, she did not feel comfortable making that dx now. The concerns I

have that make me wonder about AS, other than the sensory issues, include lining

things up, hyperlexia, rigid thinking, difficulty with transitions, quick to

melt down, odd phrasing (which his OT said sounded atypical for his age, but

typical for AS), obsessions with trains, and much better social interactions

with adults than peers. He is very, very bright (can spell and read some words

and do simple math in his head), and the psychologist from early intervention

plans to do some cognitive and IQ testing later t his week. She did not,

however, do any formal diagnostic testing for AS, such as the ADOS test. Her

reasoning for not wanting to give a dx of AS at this time was that my son's

interactions with adults are so strong and that he has obsessions, but can be

distracted from them with some effort. She also wondered if some of his social

issues with peers stem from being very bright, although I know that being gifted

and having AS are not mutually exclusive.

>

> What I was wondering is if this sounds like any of your kids at this age? The

psychologist did recommend that we continue to pursue evaluation with our local

TEACCH center (have sent in a questionnaire, but it takes months to be seen), so

she is not saying that my son does not have AS, just that she is not sure enough

to dx. My son starts his first preschool in the fall, so it is important to me

to have a more clear picture of his needs before throwing him into a room full

of toddlers to sink or swim.

>

> I would greatly appreciate input from other parents who have been through this

process already!

>

> Thanks,

>

> Bridget

>

[Guest guest]

Thanks, Roxanna. I posted a reply yesterday, but for some reason it did not

appear, so here goes again...My son will be turning 3 in the fall, so last week

we had our first meeting to try to qualify for the school district preschool

services as he ages out of early intervention. It was a very positive meeting

(the director has a very good reputation in the community for helping kids

qualify, rather than being obstructive), and they will be doing some additional

evaluations. We filled out the ASRS autism checklist for their psychologist,

with the promise that she will do an ADOS test if she thinks the ASRS shows a

need for further evaluation. We also re-did the sensory profile checklist (which

was useful, because we are aware of some visual sensitivities now that we had

not noticed the first time we did it). The director also had us do the ABAS II

adaptive scales test. Early intervention had previously done the Vineland

adaptive test, and my son scored a composite of 84, which is just one point into

the below average range (his verbal skills pulled him up), so she thought it

would be worth taking a different test to see if his score would be lower, to

aid in qualifying. He scored in the 99% on the Weschler, so if we can show a

large enough gap between cognitive and functional abilities, that should be

useful in building the case for services.

You had mentioned that a speech therapist would be useful in determining if my

son's language patterns indicate AS, and he will be seen by a speech therapist

as part of his evaluation. Everyone at the school district is on vacation right

now except the director, so we are in a bit of a holding pattern at the moment.

In the meantime, we have also started working with a developmental therapist,

who also thinks that a dx of AS is appropriate, based especially on my son's

unusual interests (reading maps, street numbers, air conditioning units, that

sort of thing) and his trouble with peer interactions (she has actually come to

play dates). If the school district declines to do the ADOS for some reason, she

has the name of another psychologist who can do it, so either way we won't have

to wait months and months to be seen at TEACCH. Interestingly enough, the early

intervention psychologist who did not feel comfortable making a dx of AS has

been talking to someone at TEACCH, who did say that further evaluation for AS is

warranted, based on her observations. I was pleased that the early intervention

psychologist made references to " Asperger's like behaviors " in her evaluation

(which went to the school district). Although she was not prepared to make a dx

herself, she apparently still thinks it is a strong possibility, which can only

help our case in getting the ADOS.

For now, we are trying to make some informal arrangements with my son's

preschool to help meet his sensory needs, since the school district will not

come to a final decision about his eligibility for an IEP until after school

begins in September. I will keep you all posted, and thanks for the support!

Bridget

>

>

> I think you should see a professional outside of that early intervention

group. A good evaluation in all areas can pin down what is going on. It's true

that being gifted could cause the problems as well as AS but some of those

things are not completely explained. For instance, hyperlexia will involve more

than just early reading and obsession with numbers. If it's really hyperlexia,

then it's probably AS as well. But again, you'd be seeing other problems with

speech. A good speech evaluation that covers all areas of speech development

would help sort that out. Also, you say things like the OT thinks his speech is

similar to having AS. I would rather hear that from the ST.

>

> My younger ds could be distracted from things but then, he also has ADHD.

lol. So sometimes these pat little observations are not really helpful or

useful as diagnostic tools. I agree with you that it would be important to find

out what you are dealing with before starting school so that you can address all

areas of need, as if required.

>

>

>

>

> Roxanna

> Whenever I feel blue, I start breathing again.

>

>

>

>

>

> ( ) Diagnosing Aspergers in toddler?

>

>

>

>

>

> Hi all,

>

> I am new to this group. My son who is going to be 3 in the fall was recently

dx with sensory processing disorder, and I have suspicions about mild Asperger's

as well (though he has not been dx with AS at this point). We recently had a

meeting with the early intervention services, and the child psychologist said

that although she would not be surprised if my son was dx with AS at some point

in the future, she did not feel comfortable making that dx now. The concerns I

have that make me wonder about AS, other than the sensory issues, include lining

things up, hyperlexia, rigid thinking, difficulty with transitions, quick to

melt down, odd phrasing (which his OT said sounded atypical for his age, but

typical for AS), obsessions with trains, and much better social interactions

with adults than peers. He is very, very bright (can spell and read some words

and do simple math in his head), and the psychologist from early intervention

plans to do some cognitive and IQ testing later t his week. She did not,

however, do any formal diagnostic testing for AS, such as the ADOS test. Her

reasoning for not wanting to give a dx of AS at this time was that my son's

interactions with adults are so strong and that he has obsessions, but can be

distracted from them with some effort. She also wondered if some of his social

issues with peers stem from being very bright, although I know that being gifted

and having AS are not mutually exclusive.

>

> What I was wondering is if this sounds like any of your kids at this age? The

psychologist did recommend that we continue to pursue evaluation with our local

TEACCH center (have sent in a questionnaire, but it takes months to be seen), so

she is not saying that my son does not have AS, just that she is not sure enough

to dx. My son starts his first preschool in the fall, so it is important to me

to have a more clear picture of his needs before throwing him into a room full

of toddlers to sink or swim.

>

> I would greatly appreciate input from other parents who have been through this

process already!

>

> Thanks,

>

> Bridget

>

[Guest guest]

My daughter received the PDD-NOS label at 2 and they weren't totally sure if she was going to go toward Autism or Asperger's at that point. She was diagnosed with this after early intervention diagnosed the sensory integration disorder. My daughter was diagnosed on the spectrum by a developmental physician and I would NOT rely on a psychologist for something so important. They are out of their league on something like this IMO.

Jen HOn Sat, Jul 24, 2010 at 12:37 PM, Cassie Murray <ringmurray@...> wrote:

 

Yes, an interesting point and well-said! Thanks for the link! Yes, I agree with you in that I would definitely not wait for any kind of intervention. Early intervention is so important! But in regards to an actual diagnosis, would a " pdd-nos " diagnosis be more common at a very early age? Can Asperger's Syndrome, whose defining characteristics are lack of appropriate peer-level social interaction and limited interests, truly be gauged in pre-school aged children who primarily participate, peer-wise, in parallel play?

---------------------------------------------------------

 

"  From making eye contact to smiling in response to words and sounds - it builds up like a tower of skills.  They have basic measurement of what skills a child needs to be doing at certain ages - milestones - and I would not wait to put him in school before asking questions if there is a problem.  There are a lot of play skills going on well before a child gets to kindergarten as well as socialization and verbal skills.  "

 

-- ***The Will Of God Will Never Take You ... Where the Grace Of God Will Not Protect You***

[Guest guest]

I would argue that it depends on the psychologist. We got a working diagnosis from the developmental pediatrician who then referred us to a psychologist to confirm the diagnosis. We were very blessed that we got a psychologist who specializes in childhood ASD and works in a clinic with another psychologist who specializes in ASD and an OT. In fact, the entire clinic is focused on childhood ASD. We'd been trying to get some kind of evaluation for years, so while our daughter is now 7 and just got her dx, I believe had we been able to get to these good folks years ago, they would have least given her PDD-NOS and monitored her as she got older.

~Cheryl S.

-- Re: ( ) Re: Diagnosing Aspergers in toddler?

My daughter received the PDD-NOS label at 2 and they weren't totally sure if she was going to go toward Autism or Asperger's at that point. She was diagnosed with this after early intervention diagnosed the sensory integration disorder. My daughter was diagnosed on the spectrum by a developmental physician and I would NOT rely on a psychologist for something so important. They are out of their league on something like this IMO.Jen H.

[Guest guest]

Could you please explain the difference between PPD-NOS and Asperger's? My son

has no speech delay (well, except pragmatic) and scored well above average

cognitively on the WPPSI, so I do not expect that he would receive a dx of

classic autism. The people with whom we have worked so far while awaiting formal

testing (occupational therapist, developmental therapist, and the early

intervention psychologist) have all said that they believe my son will likely be

dx with Asperger's at some point.

Thanks,

Bridget

>

> >

> >

> > Yes, an interesting point and well-said! Thanks for the link! Yes, I agree

> > with you in that I would definitely not wait for any kind of intervention.

> > Early intervention is so important! But in regards to an actual diagnosis,

> > would a " pdd-nos " diagnosis be more common at a very early age? Can

> > Asperger's Syndrome, whose defining characteristics are lack of appropriate

> > peer-level social interaction and limited interests, truly be gauged in

> > pre-school aged children who primarily participate, peer-wise, in parallel

> > play?

> >

> > ---------------------------------------------------------

> >

> >

> >

> > " From making eye contact to smiling in response to words and sounds - it

> > builds up like a tower of skills. They have basic measurement of what

> > skills a child needs to be doing at certain ages - milestones - and I would

> > not wait to put him in school before asking questions if there is a

> > problem. There are a lot of play skills going on well before a child gets

> > to kindergarten as well as socialization and verbal skills. "

> >

> >

> >

> >

>

>

>

> --

>

> ***The Will Of God Will Never Take You ...

> Where the Grace Of God Will Not Protect You***

>

[Guest guest]

I think it would depend on the doctor you are seeing as to how soon they would dx AS and what labels they feel comfortable using. Then it will also depend on the child - how severe the issues are - as to how soon you would be able to dx it. I see what you mean too about how it would be hard to tell. But the AS kids I have seen usually stand out even at the younger ages. They tend to use a bigger vocabulary (not all do), the way they talk and how it sounds can be interesting, and there are problems even then with social skills being absent as well as play skills often being limited or obsessive. They are pretty rigid in their thinking as well when it comes to social concepts. You are going to see little quirks even early on. You may also see other problems happening like ADHD, auditory processing delays, OCD, tics, inability to understand simple questions, time concepts, problems with literal language, etc. Play is one thing in the mix but even within that, if your kid spends his time lining up cars instead of driving them around the carpet or if he gets excited when he walks into a house and sees a vacuum cleaner and never even glances at the pile of toys in the corner, or spends his time spinning the toys instead of playing with them, you are going to note that these are play skills that are a bit odd. Even within solitary play, you will see quirks going on.

Roxanna

Whenever I feel blue, I start breathing again.

Re: ( ) Re: Diagnosing Aspergers in toddler?

Yes, an interesting point and well-said! Thanks for the link! Yes, I agree with you in that I would definitely not wait for any kind of intervention. Early intervention is so important! But in regards to an actual diagnosis, would a "pdd-nos" diagnosis be more common at a very early age? Can Asperger's Syndrome, whose defining characteristics are lack of appropriate peer-level social interaction and limited interests, truly be gauged in pre-school aged children who primarily participate, peer-wise, in parallel play?

---------------------------------------------------------

" From making eye contact to smiling in response to words and sounds - it builds up like a tower of skills. They have basic measurement of what skills a child needs to be doing at certain ages - milestones - and I would not wait to put him in school before asking questions if there is a problem. There are a lot of play skills going on well before a child gets to kindergarten as well as socialization and verbal skills. "

[Guest guest]

A lot of syndromes have overlap (eg ADHD, AS, OCD, bipolar) and it may become

more obvious as get older and interact more.

Is there any harm in finding out some helpful strategies and doing them with

your child even before an " official " diagnosis? eg if you think your child has

social skills problems and/or meltdowns, can try some of the strategies that

work for AS kids

Miranda

> >

> > Bridget - My son (now 20 years old) had some of the same characteristics you

> > describe --- rigidity, difficulty with transitions/changes, melt downs,

> > difficulty interacting with peers (did much better with younger children or

> > adults), etc. He was, and is, very bright. Unfortunately, little was known

> > about Aspergers (it wasn't officially recognized in the U.S. until 1994) and

> > he did not get diagnosed until he was 15. He had been diagnosed with ADHD

> > at the age of 5. Let me also add that just because your child has some of

> > the same characteristics that mine had doesn't mean he has AS - I am just

> > answering your question. And, I don't know if there is a magical age that a

> > child has to be before a professional will give them a diagnosis - maybe

> > someone else on this list could answer that.

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > From:

> > [mailto: ] On Behalf Of bridget

> > Sent: Monday, July 05, 2010 1:11 PM

> >

> > Subject: ( ) Diagnosing Aspergers in toddler?

> >

> >

> >

> > Hi all,

> >

> > I am new to this group. My son who is going to be 3 in the fall was recently

> > dx with sensory processing disorder, and I have suspicions about mild

> > Asperger's as well (though he has not been dx with AS at this point). We

> > recently had a meeting with the early intervention services, and the child

> > psychologist said that although she would not be surprised if my son was dx

> > with AS at some point in the future, she did not feel comfortable making

> > that dx now. The concerns I have that make me wonder about AS, other than

> > the sensory issues, include lining things up, hyperlexia, rigid thinking,

> > difficulty with transitions, quick to melt down, odd phrasing (which his OT

> > said sounded atypical for his age, but typical for AS), obsessions with

> > trains, and much better social interactions with adults than peers. He is

> > very, very bright (can spell and read some words and do simple math in his

> > head), and the psychologist from early intervention plans to do some

> > cognitive and IQ testing later this week. She did not, however, do any

> > formal diagnostic testing for AS, such as the ADOS test. Her reasoning for

> > not wanting to give a dx of AS at this time was that my son's interactions

> > with adults are so strong and that he has obsessions, but can be distracted

> > from them with some effort. She also wondered if some of his social issues

> > with peers stem from being very bright, although I know that being gifted

> > and having AS are not mutually exclusive.

> >

> > What I was wondering is if this sounds like any of your kids at this age?

> > The psychologist did recommend that we continue to pursue evaluation with

> > our local TEACCH center (have sent in a questionnaire, but it takes months

> > to be seen), so she is not saying that my son does not have AS, just that

> > she is not sure enough to dx. My son starts his first preschool in the fall,

> > so it is important to me to have a more clear picture of his needs before

> > throwing him into a room full of toddlers to sink or swim.

> >

> > I would greatly appreciate input from other parents who have been through

> > this process already!

> >

> > Thanks,

> >

> > Bridget

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Thanks for the good information, Roxanna. We absolutely see some of the things

you mentioned. The developmental therapist we are working with particularly sees

the rigid thinking and some unusual interests. My son definitely likes toys (not

just vacuum cleaners - lol), but he also wants to do things like take walks to

look at house numbers. He is very much into lining things up, all sorts of

things. He has a huge vocabulary and does tend to say phrases with the words in

an odd order - for instance he says " That name is? " instead of " What is his

name? " . He certainly takes things literally, but I am unclear about how much of

that is just being not quite yet 3 years old. When we eventually get in to see

the speech therapist for his evaluation for school system services, they have

said they will assess his pragmatic speech.

We do see problems with social skills as well, which is why we see the DT. My

son does have quite a few children we see often, but he does not necessarily

have a lot of interaction with them when we do, although he is very social with

adults. At times he can have some appropriate interactions with his friends, but

he also tends to run away from them a lot, and while they ask him to come play,

he never asks them. When we go on play dates at other people's houses, he often

hangs out in the kitchen, spelling with their alphabet magnets. The sensory

processing disorder definitely plays a role in his social issues - yesterday he

hit a friend who had just touched him lightly (sensory defensiveness is

something we are working on with OT). There is absolutely a tendency to be rigid

in play; my son's obsession is trains and he will not only tell you where to

move your train on the track, but exactly how to hold it with your fingers.

Could you please explain the auditory processing delays? Something I was just

discussing with the developmental therapist is that my son very frequently asks

us to repeat what we have just said. His general hearing has been checked and it

is fine, and sometimes you can kind of tease out of him what it was that he just

heard. " Did you hear me? What did I say? " , that sort of thing. The DT thinks

that he might be buying time with the question to process what he has heard. Is

that the sort of thing you mean by auditory processing delay?

Thanks!

Bridget

>

> I think it would depend on the doctor you are seeing as to how soon they would

dx AS and what labels they feel comfortable using. Then it will also depend on

the child - how severe the issues are - as to how soon you would be able to dx

it. I see what you mean too about how it would be hard to tell. But the AS

kids I have seen usually stand out even at the younger ages. They tend to use a

bigger vocabulary (not all do), the way they talk and how it sounds can be

interesting, and there are problems even then with social skills being absent as

well as play skills often being limited or obsessive. They are pretty rigid in

their thinking as well when it comes to social concepts. You are going to see

little quirks even early on. You may also see other problems happening like

ADHD, auditory processing delays, OCD, tics, inability to understand simple

questions, time concepts, problems with literal language, etc. Play is one

thing in the mix but even within that, if your kid spends his time lining up

cars instead of driving them around the carpet or if he gets excited when he

walks into a house and sees a vacuum cleaner and never even glances at the pile

of toys in the corner, or spends his time spinning the toys instead of playing

with them, you are going to note that these are play skills that are a bit odd.

Even within solitary play, you will see quirks going on.

>

>

>

>

>

> Roxanna

> Whenever I feel blue, I start breathing again.

>

>

>

>

>

> Re: ( ) Re: Diagnosing Aspergers in toddler?

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

> Yes, an interesting point and well-said! Thanks for the link! Yes, I agree

with you in that I would definitely not wait for any kind of intervention. Early

intervention is so important! But in regards to an actual diagnosis, would a

" pdd-nos " diagnosis be more common at a very early age? Can Asperger's Syndrome,

whose defining characteristics are lack of appropriate peer-level social

interaction and limited interests, truly be gauged in pre-school aged children

who primarily participate, peer-wise, in parallel play?

> ---------------------------------------------------------

>

> " From making eye contact to smiling in response to words and sounds - it

builds up like a tower of skills. They have basic measurement of what skills a

child needs to be doing at certain ages - milestones - and I would not wait to

put him in school before asking questions if there is a problem. There are a

lot of play skills going on well before a child gets to kindergarten as well as

socialization and verbal skills. "

>

[Guest guest]

Wow, Bridget:

You are describing my toddler almost to a tee. He is 2 years old (July 30th),

and was officially diagnosed AS about a week before his second birthday. The

social tendencies that your son has are identical to mine. He would rather not

play with kids, and when he is around them, he is more apt to just watch. If

another kid takes something from him, he becomes almost expressionless and lets

the object go. I really hate seeing that happen. When he was younger, he used

to cry and try to get it back. He plays with toys in a weird way. He has a

bunch of jungle animal figurines, and I try to play with him like they should be

played with (pretend play), but he would rather topple them over and wobble

them. He loves trains, but I didnt see that as obsessive (I just figured most

boys his age are into the Train). I really really want to know, when did

your son acquire speech? Mine is barely uttering some articulations, and he is

still eating Gerber purees-no self feeding and nothing with texture. We are

about to start ABA therapy, but the cost is STAGGERING at 2500 per month. I am

hoping it only needs to happen for a couple of years. Gio (my boy) is in speech

and OT privately, and then the state provides additional speech therapy 2x per

week, a developmental specialist 1x per week and and behaviorial aide (due to

start this week) 1x per week. It seems like a lot, but I havent been blown away

by any therapy as yet, and am placing a lot of hope in the ABA.

> >

> > I think it would depend on the doctor you are seeing as to how soon they

would dx AS and what labels they feel comfortable using. Then it will also

depend on the child - how severe the issues are - as to how soon you would be

able to dx it. I see what you mean too about how it would be hard to tell. But

the AS kids I have seen usually stand out even at the younger ages. They tend

to use a bigger vocabulary (not all do), the way they talk and how it sounds can

be interesting, and there are problems even then with social skills being absent

as well as play skills often being limited or obsessive. They are pretty rigid

in their thinking as well when it comes to social concepts. You are going to

see little quirks even early on. You may also see other problems happening like

ADHD, auditory processing delays, OCD, tics, inability to understand simple

questions, time concepts, problems with literal language, etc. Play is one

thing in the mix but even within that, if your kid spends his time lining up

cars instead of driving them around the carpet or if he gets excited when he

walks into a house and sees a vacuum cleaner and never even glances at the pile

of toys in the corner, or spends his time spinning the toys instead of playing

with them, you are going to note that these are play skills that are a bit odd.

Even within solitary play, you will see quirks going on.

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > Roxanna

> > Whenever I feel blue, I start breathing again.

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > Re: ( ) Re: Diagnosing Aspergers in toddler?

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > Yes, an interesting point and well-said! Thanks for the link! Yes, I agree

with you in that I would definitely not wait for any kind of intervention. Early

intervention is so important! But in regards to an actual diagnosis, would a

" pdd-nos " diagnosis be more common at a very early age? Can Asperger's Syndrome,

whose defining characteristics are lack of appropriate peer-level social

interaction and limited interests, truly be gauged in pre-school aged children

who primarily participate, peer-wise, in parallel play?

> > ---------------------------------------------------------

> >

> > " From making eye contact to smiling in response to words and sounds - it

builds up like a tower of skills. They have basic measurement of what skills a

child needs to be doing at certain ages - milestones - and I would not wait to

put him in school before asking questions if there is a problem. There are a

lot of play skills going on well before a child gets to kindergarten as well as

socialization and verbal skills. "

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Hi ,

The train thing is funny - I guess it is not so much that the little boys like

them, but the degree. For instance, my son always takes a train to bed at night,

and if he wakes up in the middle of the night, will get out of bed to " choo

choo " in the dark. He asks to go places that have train tables, like and

Noble, and then as soon as he gets home goes right to his own train tracks. He

also taught himself to spell , , and Percy.

In answer to your question, my son is a big talker. He said his first word (da

da) at around 9 months and now speaks in sentences. Before he was verbal, we

used baby signs with him, which was helpful. The first sign he learned was the

one for " no more " . He will also eat regular table foods, although he is somewhat

particular about texture and will not eat anything with " speckles " on it,

despite the fact that he loves strongly flavored and spicy food. I think he

believes that speckles are dirty... although somehow he has no problem eating a

donut with sprinkles - lol. I will say that my son is the opposite of yours when

it comes to another child taking a toy from him - he will fight tooth and nail

to retain possession, and if it is a train, even more so. We work a lot on the

ideas of sharing and taking turns.

I hope that you have success with the ABA floortime. We have not tried anything

like that. I can't said that we have gotten a whole lot out of the developmental

therapist so far, although I have learned a few useful techniques like picture

schedules. OT, however, has been amazing for my son. He has been dx with sensory

processing disorder, and seeing the OT twice a week for crashing, crushing, and

climbing has done wonders for his overall personality at home. (We also try to

do a lot of the same things at home as the OT does at the sensory gym.)She is

also working to help my son cope with his auditory sensitivities and tactile

defensiveness. The tactile defensiveness definitely plays a role in my son's

social issues, because he does not like to have other kids very close to him and

he will hit them if they touch him unexpectedly. He starts preschool in a few

weeks, which should be interesting!

Good luck - I hope that floortime works out for your son!

Bridget

> > >

> > > I think it would depend on the doctor you are seeing as to how soon they

would dx AS and what labels they feel comfortable using. Then it will also

depend on the child - how severe the issues are - as to how soon you would be

able to dx it. I see what you mean too about how it would be hard to tell. But

the AS kids I have seen usually stand out even at the younger ages. They tend

to use a bigger vocabulary (not all do), the way they talk and how it sounds can

be interesting, and there are problems even then with social skills being absent

as well as play skills often being limited or obsessive. They are pretty rigid

in their thinking as well when it comes to social concepts. You are going to

see little quirks even early on. You may also see other problems happening like

ADHD, auditory processing delays, OCD, tics, inability to understand simple

questions, time concepts, problems with literal language, etc. Play is one

thing in the mix but even within that, if your kid spends his time lining up

cars instead of driving them around the carpet or if he gets excited when he

walks into a house and sees a vacuum cleaner and never even glances at the pile

of toys in the corner, or spends his time spinning the toys instead of playing

with them, you are going to note that these are play skills that are a bit odd.

Even within solitary play, you will see quirks going on.

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Roxanna

> > > Whenever I feel blue, I start breathing again.

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Re: ( ) Re: Diagnosing Aspergers in toddler?

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Yes, an interesting point and well-said! Thanks for the link! Yes, I agree

with you in that I would definitely not wait for any kind of intervention. Early

intervention is so important! But in regards to an actual diagnosis, would a

" pdd-nos " diagnosis be more common at a very early age? Can Asperger's Syndrome,

whose defining characteristics are lack of appropriate peer-level social

interaction and limited interests, truly be gauged in pre-school aged children

who primarily participate, peer-wise, in parallel play?

> > > ---------------------------------------------------------

> > >

> > > " From making eye contact to smiling in response to words and sounds - it

builds up like a tower of skills. They have basic measurement of what skills a

child needs to be doing at certain ages - milestones - and I would not wait to

put him in school before asking questions if there is a problem. There are a

lot of play skills going on well before a child gets to kindergarten as well as

socialization and verbal skills. "

> > >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

APD is a problem with the brain processing what it is hearing, yes. They might take longer to process what is being said or asked, have problems remembering more than one or two tasks at a time or they might hear words differently than they sound. For instance, if you say "Watch out for the pig", he might hear "Watch out for the big" and wonder, "Big what?" I have had a lot of conversations just like that. lol. I like your description of how your ds says things oddly, my 13 yo is the very same way.

Roxanna

Whenever I feel blue, I start breathing again.

Re: ( ) Re: Diagnosing Aspergers in toddler?

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> Yes, an interesting point and well-said! Thanks for the link! Yes, I agree with you in that I would definitely not wait for any kind of intervention. Early intervention is so important! But in regards to an actual diagnosis, would a "pdd-nos" diagnosis be more common at a very early age? Can Asperger's Syndrome, whose defining characteristics are lack of appropriate peer-level social interaction and limited interests, truly be gauged in pre-school aged children who primarily participate, peer-wise, in parallel play?

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> " From making eye contact to smiling in response to words and sounds - it builds up like a tower of skills. They have basic measurement of what skills a child needs to be doing at certain ages - milestones - and I would not wait to put him in school before asking questions if there is a problem. There are a lot of play skills going on well before a child gets to kindergarten as well as socialization and verbal skills. "

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[Guest guest]

Roxanna, did your son ever do this...my little guy sometimes likes to say words

like he is sounding them out, either by the phonics of each letter or by

syllable. So for bus, he might say " buh-uh-sss " . It is at times when he is

speaking, not looking at written words, and they are familiar words, not ones he

is still trying to learn. I think it is actually a game to him - sometimes he

wants to say a word with me, alternating each syllable back and forth between

us. My son, who will be 3 next month, is very into letters and the written word

in general. We have been doing picture schedules with him, which he absolutely

loves, and the other day, he had taken his numbers and letters and made a

numbered " schedule " on the floor, with items numbered 1-7 in a list! He is many

things, but never boring!

Bridget

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> > I think it would depend on the doctor you are seeing as to how soon they

would dx AS and what labels they feel comfortable using. Then it will also

depend on the child - how severe the issues are - as to how soon you would be

able to dx it. I see what you mean too about how it would be hard to tell. But

the AS kids I have seen usually stand out even at the younger ages. They tend

to use a bigger vocabulary (not all do), the way they talk and how it sounds can

be interesting, and there are problems even then with social skills being absent

as well as play skills often being limited or obsessive. They are pretty rigid

in their thinking as well when it comes to social concepts. You are going to

see little quirks even early on. You may also see other problems happening like

ADHD, auditory processing delays, OCD, tics, inability to understand simple

questions, time concepts, problems with literal language, etc. Play is one

thing in the mix but even within that, if you r kid spends his time lining up

cars instead of driving them around the carpet or if he gets excited when he

walks into a house and sees a vacuum cleaner and never even glances at the pile

of toys in the corner, or spends his time spinning the toys instead of playing

with them, you are going to note that these are play skills that are a bit odd.

Even within solitary play, you will see quirks going on.

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> > Roxanna

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> > Re: ( ) Re: Diagnosing Aspergers in toddler?

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> > Yes, an interesting point and well-said! Thanks for the link! Yes, I agree

with you in that I would definitely not wait for any kind of intervention. Early

intervention is so important! But in regards to an actual diagnosis, would a

" pdd-nos " diagnosis be more common at a very early age? Can Asperger's Syndrome,

whose defining characteristics are lack of appropriate peer-level social

interaction and limited interests, truly be gauged in pre-school aged children

who primarily participate, peer-wise, in parallel play?

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> > " From making eye contact to smiling in response to words and sounds - it

builds up like a tower of skills. They have basic measurement of what skills a

child needs to be doing at certain ages - milestones - and I would not wait to

put him in school before asking questions if there is a problem. There are a

lot of play skills going on well before a child gets to kindergarten as well as

socialization and verbal skills. "

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[Guest guest]

No, my ds never sounded things out like that. It could be he has hyperlexia. An important skill in reading is to hear all the individual sounds that a word makes. This might be dating myself a lot here, but we used to watch a tv show (Electric company?) where they went through and said words in syllables like that to help kids learn to hear the sounds of each word. lol. My 13 yo ds has hyperlexia and while he didn't sound things out, he did read before he could use language (he could not say, "Mom, I need a drink" but he could read it.) He was also intensely fascinated with numbers as well as letters and was doing multiplication and division by pre-k/k, though just as far behind in social skills and spoken language skills.

Roxanna

Whenever I feel blue, I start breathing again.

Re: ( ) Re: Diagnosing Aspergers in toddler?

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> > Yes, an interesting point and well-said! Thanks for the link! Yes, I agree with you in that I would definitely not wait for any kind of intervention. Early intervention is so important! But in regards to an actual diagnosis, would a "pdd-nos" diagnosis be more common at a very early age? Can Asperger's Syndrome, whose defining characteristics are lack of appropriate peer-level social interaction and limited interests, truly be gauged in pre-school aged children who primarily participate, peer-wise, in parallel play?

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> > " From making eye contact to smiling in response to words and sounds - it builds up like a tower of skills. They have basic measurement of what skills a child needs to be doing at certain ages - milestones - and I would not wait to put him in school before asking questions if there is a problem. There are a lot of play skills going on well before a child gets to kindergarten as well as socialization and verbal skills. "

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[Guest guest]

From: Roxanna <MadIdeas@...> Sent: Sat, August 7, 2010 9:52:48 PMSubject: Re: ( ) Re: Diagnosing Aspergers in toddler?

APD is a problem with the brain processing what it is hearing, yes. They might take longer to process what is being said or asked, have problems remembering more than one or two tasks at a time or they might hear words differently than they sound. For instance, if you say "Watch out for the pig", he might hear "Watch out for the big" and wonder, "Big what?" I have had a lot of conversations just like that. lol. I like your description of how your ds says things oddly, my 13 yo is the very same way.

RoxannaWhenever I feel blue, I start breathing again.

Re: ( ) Re: Diagnosing Aspergers in toddler?> > > > > > > > Yes, an interesting point and well-said! Thanks for the link! Yes, I agree with you in that I would definitely not wait for any kind of intervention. Early intervention is so important! But in regards to an actual diagnosis,

would a "pdd-nos" diagnosis be more common at a very early age? Can Asperger's Syndrome, whose defining characteristics are lack of appropriate peer-level social interaction and limited interests, truly be gauged in pre-school aged children who primarily participate, peer-wise, in parallel play?> ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- ---------> > " From making eye contact to smiling in response to words and sounds - it builds up like a tower of skills. They have basic measurement of what skills a child needs to be doing at certain ages - milestones - and I would not wait to put him in school before asking questions if there is a problem. There are a lot of play skills going on well before a child gets to kindergarten as well as socialization and verbal skills. ">

So is mine, we try very hard not to laugh but sometimes it is just soo funny. My son was talking to my sister the other day and she had said a neighbor was remodeling their bathroom so they couldnt use their bathroom, they kept coming over to her house, anyway he says to her " cant they use a peterpotty? " she looked at him and said "a what" he says " you know Aunt Michele, where they go outside, a peter potty?" by this time it is extremely hard for me not to crack up so i said "son , do you mean a porter potty? " he says "yes, its the same thing " and walks out of the room my sister was standing there and we were both about to die laughing but we held it together. he also says things backwards, like brushtooth instead of toothbrush, he used to say wash car and the list goes on, he has improved but he still says somethings backwards or knows what he wants to say but doesnt say it exactly right. Speech

therapy helps him alot with those things though i think.