Guest guest Posted July 12, 2001 Report Share Posted July 12, 2001 Hello Moonbeam, Maybe you could reed better the messages before you give your reaction. It wasn't Cliff who wrote this but I was the one. Beside that I used the words of my doctor and specialist who is the best alternative doctor in the Netherlands and not my own words.(Valstar is doctor and biologist and already for more than twenty years specialised in complementary treatment of cancer and aids, with a lot of publications in wellknown medical magazines, also in the regular ones. And that's not only my opinion but the opinion of many, many people, even of the majority of the regular medical world in the Netherlands). If I ask respect for each others opinion in this group than doesn't that mean that all what you say and write in this group isn't right. Also doesn't mean that if I of aomeone else critisise one of your statements that this mean that I will support chemo and other regular drugs. At my site are mentioned 109 randomised (some double blind) studies about nutrional supplements and herbs. And beside this list at my site also published 7 schedules about the effects of nutritional supplements as adjuvant with chemo , radiation and hormonal therapies. All with official published references, most randomised and some double blind. Probably you are a man/woman (?) who does a lot of good work and research, but your toes are quite long if someone doesn't agree with you. And please again I would like to show and receive respect for each individuals opinion. With this answer you don't do that in my eyes. I donn't mind if you want to do this, but it decreases the value of your contributions in this group, at least that's my opinion. With kindly regards Kees Braam (ex-cancerpatient for already four years now with help of diet and nutritional supplements) webmaster www.kanker-actueel.nl > Hi Cliff, > I notice that you say the group is too much into alternative treatments > and by implication should concentrate more on patented chemotherapeutic drugs. > I respect that opinion. > Also I dont throw mud, please elucidate the mud that I threw so I can stop doing it. > > It is not true that each cancer needs a different type of treatment. But it is true > that drug companies make their money through this process. It is true that doctors rely > on patented chemotherapeutic drugs. > I asked a doctor about cancer treatment, who admitted it was all just a big financial > game with the drug companies running the show and the FDA participating and doctors > simply towed the line to keep every body involved financially well off. > > Naturally if you ask such a doctor he will tell you to rely on patented drugs. Thats Ok > too. But what if the chemo doesnt work? > > I am glad you dont put my proven research on your website. Please stick to patented > chemotherapeutic drugs at your site. > > Especially please dont mention the 5 year follow up, which showed twice the cancer cure > rate using beta glucan in Japan. > > > moonbeam (WEBMASTER) > > > > > > > > Gr. Kees Braam > > webmaster www.kanker-actueel.nl > > > > Flax-seed oil & diabetes > > > > DIABETICS ARE NOT ALLOWED TO TAKE IN ANY EXTRA FATTY ACIDS, > > > > PARTICULARLY FLAX-SEED OIL See, I am a former lawyer, not a medical > > > > doctor, > > > >............ having encouraged me to take heavy-doses > > > > of flax-oit that is POISON for a diabetic. > > > > > > Hi, > > > everyone should consult their health professional before any > > > protocol is used. > > > > > > > First I thought that the beta-glucan caused my blood sugar level to > > > > skyrocket since it is a derivative of polysaccharides. > > > > > > As it happens fears about beta glucan seem to be unfounded. > > > Reference > > 1 + > > > 2 > > > > > > > studies, research publications showing the DANGER FOR DIABETICS of the > > > > flax-seed oil. You caused me tremendous pain, depression, unslept > > > > nights and a lot of expenses (I had to visit two times my GP, > > > > > > When you asked your GP if it was OK to take the Flax OIl, what did he > > say? > > > > > > moonbeam > > > > > > Get HUGE info at http://www.cures for cancer.ws, and post your own links > > > there. > > Unsubscribe by sending email to cures for cancer-unsubscribeegroups or by > > visiting http://www.bobhurt.com/subunsub.mv > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 12, 2001 Report Share Posted July 12, 2001 i would like to respectfully request that if someone on this list has something to say to an individual, that they would please say it to them in a private email. this list is about SHARING, not airing our differences. i think we're all old enough and experienced enough to realize that we're not going to agree with what everyone says. i am growing very weary of this " he said, she said " stuff. and at the risk of sounding like a broken record, i'd like to again suggest qigong- which very easily purges the organs of frustration, anger, resentment, etc respectfully, -dianna >Hello Moonbeam, > >Maybe you could reed better the messages before you give your reaction. It >wasn't Cliff who wrote this but I was the one. > >Beside that I used the words of my doctor and specialist who is the best >alternative doctor in the Netherlands and not my own words.(Valstar is >doctor and biologist and already for more than twenty years specialised in >complementary treatment of cancer and aids, with a lot of publications in >wellknown medical magazines, also in the regular ones. And that's not only >my opinion but the opinion of many, many people, even of the majority of the >regular medical world in the Netherlands). > >If I ask respect for each others opinion in this group than doesn't that >mean that all what you say and write in this group isn't right. Also doesn't >mean that if I of aomeone else critisise one of your statements that this >mean that I will support chemo and other regular drugs. > >At my site are mentioned 109 randomised (some double blind) studies about >nutrional supplements and herbs. And beside this list at my site also >published 7 schedules about the effects of nutritional supplements as >adjuvant with chemo , radiation and hormonal therapies. All with official >published references, most randomised and some double blind. > >Probably you are a man/woman (?) who does a lot of good work and research, >but your toes are quite long if someone doesn't agree with you. And please >again I would like to show and receive respect for each individuals opinion. >With this answer you don't do that in my eyes. I donn't mind if you want to >do this, but it decreases the value of your contributions in this group, at >least that's my opinion. > >With kindly regards >Kees Braam (ex-cancerpatient for already four years now with help of diet >and nutritional supplements) >webmaster www.kanker-actueel.nl > > >> Hi Cliff, >> I notice that you say the group is too much into >alternative treatments >> and by implication should concentrate more on patented chemotherapeutic >drugs. >> I respect that opinion. >> Also I dont throw mud, please elucidate the mud that I threw so I can >stop doing it. >> >> It is not true that each cancer needs a different type of treatment. But >it is true >> that drug companies make their money through this process. It is true >that doctors rely >> on patented chemotherapeutic drugs. >> I asked a doctor about cancer treatment, who admitted it was all just a >big financial >> game with the drug companies running the show and the FDA participating >and doctors >> simply towed the line to keep every body involved financially well off. >> >> Naturally if you ask such a doctor he will tell you to rely on patented >drugs. Thats Ok >> too. But what if the chemo doesnt work? >> >> I am glad you dont put my proven research on your website. Please stick >to patented >> chemotherapeutic drugs at your site. >> >> Especially please dont mention the 5 year follow up, which showed twice >the cancer cure >> rate using beta glucan in Japan. >> >> >> moonbeam (WEBMASTER) >> >> >> > >> > >> > Gr. Kees Braam >> > webmaster www.kanker-actueel.nl >> > >> > Flax-seed oil & diabetes >> > > > DIABETICS ARE NOT ALLOWED TO TAKE IN ANY EXTRA FATTY ACIDS, >> > > > PARTICULARLY FLAX-SEED OIL See, I am a former lawyer, not a medical >> > > > doctor, >> > > >............ having encouraged me to take heavy-doses >> > > > of flax-oit that is POISON for a diabetic. >> > > >> > > Hi, >> > > everyone should consult their health professional before >any >> > > protocol is used. >> > > >> > > > First I thought that the beta-glucan caused my blood sugar level to >> > > > skyrocket since it is a derivative of polysaccharides. >> > > >> > > As it happens fears about beta glucan seem to be unfounded. >> > > Reference >> > 1 + >> > > 2 >> > > >> > > > studies, research publications showing the DANGER FOR DIABETICS of >the >> > > > flax-seed oil. You caused me tremendous pain, depression, unslept >> > > > nights and a lot of expenses (I had to visit two times my GP, >> > > >> > > When you asked your GP if it was OK to take the Flax OIl, what did >he >> > say? >> > > >> > > moonbeam >> > > >> > > Get HUGE info at http://www.cures for cancer.ws, and post your own links >> > > there. >> > Unsubscribe by sending email to cures for cancer-unsubscribeegroups or by >> > visiting http://www.bobhurt.com/subunsub.mv > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 4, 2001 Report Share Posted September 4, 2001 Noah pesha wrote: > It seems I made some enemies. I am completly sincere. > Everyone has preferences. I came onto this board to > see if there would be reverse discrimination and you > know what I found it. Other than the fact that this list is not a dating service, I really don't have too much of a problem about tall men seeking short women. Lord knows there's enough LP men who will ONLY go after tall women. However, if shortness is your only criteria for desirability, then you are bigoted as any racist. It's like saying " I only date black women because they are better in bed. " (Note: I cannot verify nor deny the accuracy of the previous statement. I only use it as an example.) If you believe for some reason that short women are " more noble in spirit " or have kinder hearts, then you are also prejudiced. Short women are humans in smaller packages. Complete with all the flaws and virtues than come with being human. > A 6'2 dwarf? YES! Where I live I am surrounded > by athletes all well over 6'7 furthermore I recently > went on a whale watch and when I looked into that > creatures basketball sized eyes I was humbled at how > small I was and how great his spirit was but i felt a > connection. I think this is where you are pissing people off, including me. At 6'2 " and healthy (I presume), you are nowhere close to being a dwarf or understanding the daily trials we endure. If you can answer YES to all of the following, then you might have a clue: 1. Did your parents cry - not for joy - when you were born? 2. Did your mother's doctor suggest she have an abortion, rather than another child? 3. Has a doctor ever called you an " it. " ? 4. Did the school district ever try to put you in special ed classes even though you were obviously as smart or smarter than the other kids? 5. Do you wake up in the morning with your joints hurting so bad it sometimes takes you 30 minutes to crawl out of bed? 6. Do children stare at you, laugh and point? 7. Do adults avoid eye contact? 8. Have you been the butt of jokes at: an office party, on the radio, on a sitcom, on the internet? 9. Have you tried to buy a car (or a house) and not be taken seriously by the salesman? 10. Do you avoid malls and shopping centers because you just can't deal with the crowd? 11. Have you ever been denied a opportunity to go: hiking, skiing, surfing, motorcycle riding, play football, baseball, basketball, etc., with you friends because you physically couldn't hack it? 12. Did you sit at home on weekends in high school while all your friends enjoyed a normal dating life? 13. Have you ever be denied a job, based on your size? 14. Do you regularly have to have surgeries bad for joints or medications for pain? 15. Have you ever wanted to commit suicide? Walk in our shoes for a while before you make stupid claims. I would love to be 6'2 " and to NOT call myself a dwarf. Bill (the OTHER) Bradford > === > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 5, 2001 Report Share Posted September 5, 2001 Those points you brought up Bill did hit the nail on the head what we LP's go through each and every day. Here were a few others I have and most likely others have as well: -Been turned down for an apartment by being told I need to live at home with my parents since I am too small to try and live on my own. (and I am 4' 3 1/2 " !) -In regards to jobs, been told by an employer, " Why would I hire someone like you!? " Even though at that time I had 7 yrs experience in that field. -My parents went through this one- when house hunting, been turned down by mortgage lenders and realtors (this was back in the early 60's). -Or the patronizing line- " You're so little and cute, life must be fun for you. Being so short must be easy. I bet you get your clothes in the childrens department. " -Or when we do land a job, to not be paid the same as the 'average' employee even when we are doing the same job, same skills. Assuming just because we are short, our bills must be half of what average sized people pay. (yeah right, we wish) Just thought I would add these that I've gone through and fought off. Dawn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 5, 2001 Report Share Posted September 5, 2001 It seems like it's ok, but it's not ok for this person to be interested in a shorter woman, because he's not a person with dwarfism. Second of all, I had looked over your questions, and I took the questions and answered them according to myself, as a person with dwarfism , I answered NO to most of the questions, except for, 5, 11, and 14, which I answered as " Yes, but you don't have to have dwarfism to understand this! " I must not be a person with dwarfism, I shouldn't be on this list, because I can't understand what everyone else goes through. Why is this list so discriminating? People make it sound like Dwarfism is so different from all the other disabilities, and that no on can understand them. and you are wrong! Many types of disabilities face harassment, abuse, stares, teasing, every single day! And it's OK to have a preference to what you are looking for in a person. This person didn't state that he would ONLY date LPs. As you have stated that there are LP men who will ONLY date average sized women, why put this man in a horrible category without getting to know him, and give leeway to those with dwarfism. I know I shouldn't be complaining, I've thought about unscribing from this list, because I get so frustrated. This is the most discriminating, prejudice, negative group I've run into. Then why do I stay? Because every once in a while there are some valuable information! a (a person who doesn't sit home on weekends just because they can't get a date and play " oh poor pitiful me, I have dwarfism, I'm special, no one understands me! " ) > Other than the fact that this list is not a dating service, I really don't have too much of a problem about tall men seeking short women. Lord knows there's enough LP men who will ONLY go > after tall women. > > However, if shortness is your only criteria for desirability, then you are bigoted as any racist. It's like saying " I only date black women because they are better in bed. " (Note: I > cannot verify nor deny the accuracy of the previous statement. I only use it as an example.) If you believe for some reason that short women are " more noble in spirit " or have kinder > hearts, then you are also prejudiced. Short women are humans in smaller packages. Complete with all the flaws and virtues than come with being human. > > > A 6'2 dwarf? YES! Where I live I am surrounded > > by athletes all well over 6'7 furthermore I recently > > went on a whale watch and when I looked into that > > creatures basketball sized eyes I was humbled at how > > small I was and how great his spirit was but i felt a > > connection. > > I think this is where you are pissing people off, including me. At 6'2 " and healthy (I presume), you are nowhere close to being a dwarf or understanding the daily trials we endure. If you > can answer YES to all of the following, then you might have a clue: > > 1. Did your parents cry - not for joy - when you were born? > 2. Did your mother's doctor suggest she have an abortion, rather than another child? > 3. Has a doctor ever called you an " it. " ? > 4. Did the school district ever try to put you in special ed classes even though you were obviously as smart or smarter than the other kids? > 5. Do you wake up in the morning with your joints hurting so bad it sometimes takes you 30 minutes to crawl out of bed? > 6. Do children stare at you, laugh and point? > 7. Do adults avoid eye contact? > 8. Have you been the butt of jokes at: an office party, on the radio, on a sitcom, on the internet? > 9. Have you tried to buy a car (or a house) and not be taken seriously by the salesman? > 10. Do you avoid malls and shopping centers because you just can't deal with the crowd? > 11. Have you ever been denied a opportunity to go: hiking, skiing, surfing, motorcycle riding, play football, baseball, basketball, etc., with you friends because you physically couldn't > hack it? > 12. Did you sit at home on weekends in high school while all your friends enjoyed a normal dating life? > 13. Have you ever be denied a job, based on your size? > 14. Do you regularly have to have surgeries bad for joints or medications for pain? > 15. Have you ever wanted to commit suicide? > > Walk in our shoes for a while before you make stupid claims. > > I would love to be 6'2 " and to NOT call myself a dwarf. > > Bill (the OTHER) Bradford > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 5, 2001 Report Share Posted September 5, 2001 In a message dated 9/5/01 6:26:18 PM Central Daylight Time, nha@... writes: > A comment & I got from the owner of an antique store we happened to > venture into was " Gee, I didn't know the circus was in town! " . The woman > couldn't believe that I worked for a computer company and worked for > the phone company. > > > So how did she find out you worked for a computer and phone company? > Someone that crude doesn't deserve an explanation..... I would have said > " Gee, I didn't know there were other antique stores in town " and walked > out. I agree that most people don't think about what they are saying but > that was just stupid. > I make a living being this size and I get a lot of remarks but sometimes > you have to put your foot down. > Just my feelings..... > Irwin Royes > world's smallest magician Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 5, 2001 Report Share Posted September 5, 2001 What happened to you all is about the most unthinking, unkind comment a person could make. God, where are people's BRAINS??????? It is 2001, not 1901!!!!! ------ Re: respect Date Sent: 06 Sep 2001 12:13 AM A comment & I got from the owner of an antique store we happened to venture into was " Gee, I didn't know the circus was in town! " . The woman couldn't believe that I worked for a computer company and worked for the phone company. Connors The Not Home Alone Pet Sitting Service Covering Lee, NH and surrounding towns http://www.petsitters.com/nothomealone nha@... ICQ# 21974486 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 5, 2001 Report Share Posted September 5, 2001 A comment & I got from the owner of an antique store we happened to venture into was " Gee, I didn't know the circus was in town! " . The woman couldn't believe that I worked for a computer company and worked for the phone company. Connors The Not Home Alone Pet Sitting Service Covering Lee, NH and surrounding towns http://www.petsitters.com/nothomealone nha@... ICQ# 21974486 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 5, 2001 Report Share Posted September 5, 2001 A comment & I got from the owner of an antique store we happened to venture into was " Gee, I didn't know the circus was in town! " . The woman couldn't believe that I worked for a computer company and worked for the phone company. Connors The Not Home Alone Pet Sitting Service Covering Lee, NH and surrounding towns http://www.petsitters.com/nothomealone nha@... ICQ# 21974486 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 6, 2001 Report Share Posted September 6, 2001 Soon after we got back from Russia with Jianna we were at a local festivala nd ran into someoen I had known since I was a little kid. We stood talkigna nd they asked about Jianna and I simply said she was a dwarf. In all seriousness this sweet old man looked at me and said " Oh, Im so sorry " .. She was in all likelyhood the first LP he had ever seen outside of tv. apryl Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 6, 2001 Report Share Posted September 6, 2001 You should have told him... " I didn't know either. Looks like their baboon has escaped... " Doncha hate that all the good comebacks only come through hindsight? Steve In a message dated 9/5/01 7:26:16 PM Eastern Daylight Time, nha@... writes: > A comment & I got from the owner of an antique store we happened to > venture into was " Gee, I didn't know the circus was in town! " . The woman > couldn't believe that I worked for a computer company and worked for > the phone company. > > > > Connors > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 6, 2001 Report Share Posted September 6, 2001 In a message dated 9/5/01 7:32:56 PM Eastern Daylight Time, hollandc@... writes: << What happened to you all is about the most unthinking, unkind comment a person could make. God, where are people's BRAINS??????? It is 2001, not 1901!!!! >> Actually, this is exactly what I was thinking...it's hard to believe that people say things like this. I don't think I'VE even heard a comment like this... Kind of cool- my Mommy and I really do think alike! (The person that said the above!) Martha Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 19, 2006 Report Share Posted January 19, 2006 Oh this sounds like a school I'd have loved to go to. Maybe other schools will pick up on the idea. although I can imagine it would be difficult to change the rules in some cases. Once kids are used to disrespect and bullying, they won't like to change. Lwaxy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 19, 2006 Report Share Posted January 19, 2006 Oh this sounds like a school I'd have loved to go to. Maybe other schools will pick up on the idea. although I can imagine it would be difficult to change the rules in some cases. Once kids are used to disrespect and bullying, they won't like to change. Lwaxy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 21, 2007 Report Share Posted May 21, 2007 Hi WoodyWe have tried to educate; it is difficult, but sometimes the sun shines through. In the midst of a conversation with a civil servant from the Cabinet Office last year, he stopped me and said, "I've just realised, when I talk to Professor Farringdon (criminologist), he talks all the time of identifying risks but you are not doing that. You are talking of needs and strengths and resources." Yes! That is what health visitors do! We then went on to talk about how important that mindset was in the context of engaging the parents, who often feel themselves under seige, but who nevertheless will accept support offered in a spirit of empowerment and respect.  Sadly, since then, the nurses have taken over, and of course the Olds model is based on nurses visiting, because they don't have health visitors or midwives in the US. I think there is too little realisation of two key differences between here and the States; one is that their nurses are trained very differently from ours. Also (Woody, you will have tell me if I am misrepresenting your home country), there is a much clearer and more directive stance towards minorities and disadvantaged groups than would be acceptable in this country. The big thing that is recognised, is the lack of the kind of welfare provision for all families that is widespread across Europe, and of course, much, much wider health inequalities than there are in this country; all of which should raise questions about whether the Olds model will actually deliver the shining results promised. I have taken to being a 'posy professor' and reminding folk that pilots (indeed, research studies and replications) do not always show what you want them to. At least they are evaluating this one.  I did have a rather strange email conversation a few months ago in which it was being proposed that:1. The 'intensive home visiting' programme should be piloted separately from the standard health visiting service, to ensure it is actually delivered as per Olds programme, but that2. It should be delivered with a view to it being integrated into the standard health visiting service in due course, but that3. To avoid 'putting parents off' (because health visitors are so unpopular with 'needy mothers'), the visitors should be called 'nurse home visitors'Apart from exploding quietly (hard to shout on email) about the negative stereotyping, I questioned the labelling of the programme as 'intensive,' suggesting that might be a bit off putting; and then asked if they proposed training the health visitor to lie about their qualification? (you can just imagine the introductions: "I am nurse come to visit," "Oh, right, so does mean you are not a health visitor?" ) What is the visitor supposed to say? Yes, I'm especially undertrained to meet your additional needs? Or, yes, I am a health visitor, but I'm a bit ashamed of it, because so many people say we're unpopular? And how would that help to integrate the Olds approach with the regular service?   I hope the idea has been vetoed and that areas where the pilots are taking place are clearly identifying themselves as health visitors. Then perhaps we can, as Woody suggests, promote strengths and needs rather than risks and problems, and the idea of 'respect' for parents, rather than the Newspeak that suggests we should 'disrespect' and blame them, under the respect banner!  best wishesOn 21 May 2007, at 09:42, Woody Caan wrote:Dear Senators,What did people feel about the front page headline in the Guardian (16/05/07) "Unborn babies targeted in crackdown on criminality"?The nurse family partnership may or may not be a Good Thing, but the labelling of a "hardcore" of the poorest and most marginalised families as a criminal class worries me more and more, especially after recent meetings about DATs and about Respect...this Spring I tried to talk to a key advisor of Gordon Brown, the LSE's Lord Giddens, that existing Respect legislation could be easily misused by a local community to 'ethnically cleanse' minorities like Gypsy Travellers, and now a depressed teenage mother who comes to believe that her unborn baby is The Problem may not behave in the way Prof. Olds hopes. Projection of guilt and anger and then punishment, is a very deep and universal type of defence, in the face of complex and alarming issues...Looking forward to and Alyson's perinatal mental health meeting on July 6th: hopefully we can prevent a witchhunt against Criminal Spawn of Evil Mothers (I can see the Sun headline already!). I can see the finger of referral to the nurseparentpartnership service for the youngest and least supported Mothers being pointed by an education welfare officer, a child and family social worker or a midwife- these are not professions who historically have done well by Looked-After Children, whom I predict could become a focus of targeting around "criminality", so let's see if we can educate them to take a more emancipatory approach to this clientele?Woody. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 21, 2007 Report Share Posted May 21, 2007 Any way , the fact that health visitors are not popular has been disproved by the FPI YOUGOV poll of 5,000 parents recently showing that 76% of parents want health visitors. Eight out of ten parents agreed that 'all new parents could benefit from a good health visitor who visits enough times to build up a relationship'. Only 17% felt that parents could get help from other sources and that only those who are struggling the most need help from a health visitor. So maybe that will also help Gill with her arguments about universal health visiting. Everyone who receives the Community Practitioner Journal should have a copy of the report which I believe is not popular in the DH. I wonder why! best wishes, Re: Respect Hi Woody We have tried to educate; it is difficult, but sometimes the sun shines through. In the midst of a conversation with a civil servant from the Cabinet Office last year, he stopped me and said, "I've just realised, when I talk to Professor Farringdon (criminologist), he talks all the time of identifying risks but you are not doing that. You are talking of needs and strengths and resources." Yes! That is what health visitors do! We then went on to talk about how important that mindset was in the context of engaging the parents, who often feel themselves under seige, but who nevertheless will accept support offered in a spirit of empowerment and respect. Sadly, since then, the nurses have taken over, and of course the Olds model is based on nurses visiting, because they don't have health visitors or midwives in the US. I think there is too little realisation of two key differences between here and the States; one is that their nurses are trained very differently from ours. Also (Woody, you will have tell me if I am misrepresenting your home country), there is a much clearer and more directive stance towards minorities and disadvantaged groups than would be acceptable in this country. The big thing that is recognised, is the lack of the kind of welfare provision for all families that is widespread across Europe, and of course, much, much wider health inequalities than there are in this country; all of which should raise questions about whether the Olds model will actually deliver the shining results promised. I have taken to being a 'posy professor' and reminding folk that pilots (indeed, research studies and replications) do not always show what you want them to. At least they are evaluating this one. I did have a rather strange email conversation a few months ago in which it was being proposed that: 1. The 'intensive home visiting' programme should be piloted separately from the standard health visiting service, to ensure it is actually delivered as per Olds programme, but that 2. It should be delivered with a view to it being integrated into the standard health visiting service in due course, but that 3. To avoid 'putting parents off' (because health visitors are so unpopular with 'needy mothers'), the visitors should be called 'nurse home visitors' Apart from exploding quietly (hard to shout on email) about the negative stereotyping, I questioned the labelling of the programme as 'intensive,' suggesting that might be a bit off putting; and then asked if they proposed training the health visitor to lie about their qualification? (you can just imagine the introductions: "I am nurse come to visit," "Oh, right, so does mean you are not a health visitor?" ) What is the visitor supposed to say? Yes, I'm especially undertrained to meet your additional needs? Or, yes, I am a health visitor, but I'm a bit ashamed of it, because so many people say we're unpopular? And how would that help to integrate the Olds approach with the regular service? I hope the idea has been vetoed and that areas where the pilots are taking place are clearly identifying themselves as health visitors. Then perhaps we can, as Woody suggests, promote strengths and needs rather than risks and problems, and the idea of 'respect' for parents, rather than the Newspeak that suggests we should 'disrespect' and blame them, under the respect banner! best wishes On 21 May 2007, at 09:42, Woody Caan wrote: Dear Senators,What did people feel about the front page headline in the Guardian (16/05/07) "Unborn babies targeted in crackdown on criminality"?The nurse family partnership may or may not be a Good Thing, but the labelling of a "hardcore" of the poorest and most marginalised families as a criminal class worries me more and more, especially after recent meetings about DATs and about Respect...this Spring I tried to talk to a key advisor of Gordon Brown, the LSE's Lord Giddens, that existing Respect legislation could be easily misused by a local community to 'ethnically cleanse' minorities like Gypsy Travellers, and now a depressed teenage mother who comes to believe that her unborn baby is The Problem may not behave in the way Prof. Olds hopes. Projection of guilt and anger and then punishment, is a very deep and universal type of defence, in the face of complex and alarming issues...Looking forward to and Alyson's perinatal mental health meeting on July 6th: hopefully we can prevent a witchhunt against Criminal Spawn of Evil Mothers (I can see the Sun headline already!). I can see the finger of referral to the nurseparentpartnership service for the youngest and least supported Mothers being pointed by an education welfare officer, a child and family social worker or a midwife- these are not professions who historically have done well by Looked-After Children, whom I predict could become a focus of targeting around "criminality", so let's see if we can educate them to take a more emancipatory approach to this clientele?Woody. -- This email has been verified as Virus free Virus Protection and more available at http://www.plus.net Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 21, 2007 Report Share Posted May 21, 2007 Hi Woody, and all I don't know what will be evaluated from a pilot study in the nurse family partnership programme given that it took 25 years of Old's programmes to fuly demonstrate the benefits in different and varied cultures to the uk, as well as a different service structure -or lack of it. However I do commend the financing of more services to those traditionally under-served and strongly feel that reaching the hard to reach with equitable services might be the first thing to evaluate, not least if fathers are included. It was heartening to hear recently mothers and fathers from really disadvantaged backgrounds eager to learn more about safe handling of babies and coping mechanisms for crying and so on. They expressed how difficult life is with small children and how confidence is lacking in the early days, escpecially for fathers who had particular feelings of being marginalised in health care around the ante and post natal period. They felt that if learning was specifically for them and followed their needs and interests they had a lot to gain. These particular parents were also disadvantaged by low literacy skills and wanted easy access to information and skills suggesting tactile means to demonstrate with a doll and large cartoon type pictures with ticks and crosses and smiles or frown for what to do or not. They were full of ideas as altenatives to leaflets, books and posters. Perhaps an evaluation by the clients the service will be aimed at on the most appropriate approaches would be an idea to start with? The health visitor I was working with is now approached by fathers and asked if she is the health visitor for Dads. She invites them to be at home at the first visit and makes a point of speaking with each individually. There is so much to be built on in the positive aspects of health visiting Dr Coles PhD BA RHV RGN Honorary Senior Research Fellow Department of Child Health Cardiff School of Medicine Cardiff University Heath Park Cardiff CF14 4XN Telephone: Department Secretary 02920 743374/5 >>> Cowley <sarahcowley183@...> 21/05/07 11:39 AM >>> Hi Woody We have tried to educate; it is difficult, but sometimes the sun shines through. In the midst of a conversation with a civil servant from the Cabinet Office last year, he stopped me and said, " I've just realised, when I talk to Professor Farringdon (criminologist), he talks all the time of identifying risks but you are not doing that. You are talking of needs and strengths and resources. " Yes! That is what health visitors do! We then went on to talk about how important that mindset was in the context of engaging the parents, who often feel themselves under seige, but who nevertheless will accept support offered in a spirit of empowerment and respect. Sadly, since then, the nurses have taken over, and of course the Olds model is based on nurses visiting, because they don't have health visitors or midwives in the US. I think there is too little realisation of two key differences between here and the States; one is that their nurses are trained very differently from ours. Also (Woody, you will have tell me if I am misrepresenting your home country), there is a much clearer and more directive stance towards minorities and disadvantaged groups than would be acceptable in this country. The big thing that is recognised, is the lack of the kind of welfare provision for all families that is widespread across Europe, and of course, much, much wider health inequalities than there are in this country; all of which should raise questions about whether the Olds model will actually deliver the shining results promised. I have taken to being a 'posy professor' and reminding folk that pilots (indeed, research studies and replications) do not always show what you want them to. At least they are evaluating this one. I did have a rather strange email conversation a few months ago in which it was being proposed that: 1. The 'intensive home visiting' programme should be piloted separately from the standard health visiting service, to ensure it is actually delivered as per Olds programme, but that 2. It should be delivered with a view to it being integrated into the standard health visiting service in due course, but that 3. To avoid 'putting parents off' (because health visitors are so unpopular with 'needy mothers'), the visitors should be called 'nurse home visitors' Apart from exploding quietly (hard to shout on email) about the negative stereotyping, I questioned the labelling of the programme as 'intensive,' suggesting that might be a bit off putting; and then asked if they proposed training the health visitor to lie about their qualification? (you can just imagine the introductions: " I am nurse come to visit, " " Oh, right, so does mean you are not a health visitor? " ) What is the visitor supposed to say? Yes, I'm especially undertrained to meet your additional needs? Or, yes, I am a health visitor, but I'm a bit ashamed of it, because so many people say we're unpopular? And how would that help to integrate the Olds approach with the regular service? I hope the idea has been vetoed and that areas where the pilots are taking place are clearly identifying themselves as health visitors. Then perhaps we can, as Woody suggests, promote strengths and needs rather than risks and problems, and the idea of 'respect' for parents, rather than the Newspeak that suggests we should 'disrespect' and blame them, under the respect banner! best wishes On 21 May 2007, at 09:42, Woody Caan wrote: > Dear Senators, > > What did people feel about the front page headline in the Guardian > (16/05/07) " Unborn babies targeted in crackdown on criminality " ? > > The nurse family partnership may or may not be a Good Thing, but the > labelling of a " hardcore " of the poorest and most marginalised > families as a > criminal class worries me more and more, especially after recent > meetings > about DATs and about Respect... > this Spring I tried to talk to a key advisor of Gordon Brown, the > LSE's Lord > Giddens, that existing Respect legislation could be easily misused > by a > local community to 'ethnically cleanse' minorities like Gypsy > Travellers, > and now a depressed teenage mother who comes to believe that her > unborn baby > is The Problem may not behave in the way Prof. Olds hopes. > Projection of > guilt and anger and then punishment, is a very deep and universal > type of > defence, in the face of complex and alarming issues... > > Looking forward to and Alyson's perinatal mental health > meeting on > July 6th: hopefully we can prevent a witchhunt against Criminal > Spawn of > Evil Mothers (I can see the Sun headline already!). I can see the > finger of > referral to the nurseparentpartnership service for the youngest and > least > supported Mothers being pointed by an education welfare officer, a > child and > family social worker or a midwife- these are not professions who > historically have done well by Looked-After Children, whom I > predict could > become a focus of targeting around " criminality " , so let's see if > we can > educate them to take a more emancipatory approach to this clientele? > > Woody. > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 10, 2008 Report Share Posted March 10, 2008 well, I think the question was whether anyone had tried using Splenda or brown sugar and people responded with reasons as to why they haven't and posted further information about Splenda. I didn't see anything wrong with any of the answers. I personally DO appreciate information being shared in this group. People have a choice to read something and also what they do with the information. Many people here choose to be conscientious of what they put into their bodies - that's how many of us became familiar with KT in the first place. I would kindly ask each reader to respect the other members and be conscientious of the fact that we are not all the same which can truly be an asset rather than a handicap. Peace Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 22, 2010 Report Share Posted September 22, 2010 Hey Aspie parents Are any of you struggling with respect or should I say lack thereof? My son is 8. When he's good, he's gold. When he's awful, he's AWFUL. Even though I have been teaching respect since babyhood, and he has been progressing in SO many areas, it seems like this area is getting worse. The older he gets and the more he picks up in school, at home, and from media, the less he seems to grasp the concept of respecting adults. He has ALWAYS struggled with egocentrism--particularly applicable to conversation. He simply doesn't understand that all conversation should stem from him and everyone else should immediately halt all attention to ANYTHING and EVERYTHING else if he wants to talk or starts talking. I've been working hard on making him understand that that's not how the world works and helping to teach him how to adapt to the world the way it is. BUT more recently, he has become SO disrespectful. He will almost instantly start a meltdown when others talk, including cussing at his grandparents if he wants the floor. I'm at a loss! No measure of discipline seems to work anymore--he just screams that he doesn't care--and I can tell he's already so far into meltdown mode that it's not even him talking. I've tried to talk to him about it many times--OUTSIDE of the situation. I'll wait until later and everyone is calm and it is not happening before I'll address how important respect for adults is. He's a computer/web kid and he googles everything and watches videos on anything/everything he is interested in. I've tried to get him to watch Leave It to Beaver, Father Knows Best or even BRady Bunch, so he can see the appropriate way to talk to adults. He tried LITB first and refused to watch it because it was black and white and then quit. Any suggestions??!! I'm so scared he's going to keep getting worse and, truthfully, I feel like I don't have much control! Lori Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 22, 2010 Report Share Posted September 22, 2010 i can reelate to you so much its very hard to sit down and talk about what went down.they get mad nasty at times. with me i try let my jason know he can talk about anything no matter what somes times that helps. i know disrespectful behavior can drive u nuts. and you just respond to bad behavior. i read a lot of books to help me relate to jd he 14 From: l8elucretia@... <l8elucretia@...>Subject: ( ) respectAspergers Treatment Date: Wednesday, September 22, 2010, 2:19 PM Hey Aspie parentsAre any of you struggling with respect or should I say lack thereof?My son is 8. When he's good, he's gold. When he's awful, he's AWFUL.Even though I have been teaching respect since babyhood, and he has been progressing in SO many areas, it seems like this area is getting worse. The older he gets and the more he picks up in school, at home, and from media, the less he seems to grasp the concept of respecting adults.He has ALWAYS struggled with egocentrism--particularly applicable to conversation. He simply doesn't understand that all conversation should stem from him and everyone else should immediately halt all attention to ANYTHING and EVERYTHING else if he wants to talk or starts talking. I've been working hard on making him understand that that's not how the world works and helping to teach him how to adapt to the world the way it is.BUTmore recently, he has become SO disrespectful. He will almost instantly start a meltdown when others talk, including cussing at his grandparents if he wants the floor. I'm at a loss! No measure of discipline seems to work anymore--he just screams that he doesn't care--and I can tell he's already so far into meltdown mode that it's not even him talking.I've tried to talk to him about it many times--OUTSIDE of the situation. I'll wait until later and everyone is calm and it is not happening before I'll address how important respect for adults is. He's a computer/web kid and he googles everything and watches videos on anything/everything he is interested in. I've tried to get him to watch Leave It to Beaver, Father Knows Best or even BRady Bunch, so he can see the appropriate way to talk to adults. He tried LITB first and refused to watch it because it was black and white and then quit. Any suggestions??!!I'm so scared he's going to keep getting worse and, truthfully, I feel like I don't have much control!Lori Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 22, 2010 Report Share Posted September 22, 2010 My son is 7 and in the same boat. Maybe not as bad, but we're a year behind you. In my case they said it was ODD (Oppositional defiant disorder). Nice labeling, but it doesn't help me get the respect I'm looking for. Any way they gave us books to read and the positive reinforcement, rewarding system. It worked for awhile, but we we're not consistant with it and things got back to defiancy. I'm afraid I'm looking for those answers also. I just wanted to say you're not alone. Maybe family therapy would help. That's what was suggested to us. People said it was a family issue, not just a child gone bad so to speak. Cathleen From: "l8elucretia@..." <l8elucretia@...>Aspergers Treatment Sent: Wed, September 22, 2010 7:19:01 AMSubject: ( ) respect Hey Aspie parentsAre any of you struggling with respect or should I say lack thereof?My son is 8. When he's good, he's gold. When he's awful, he's AWFUL.Even though I have been teaching respect since babyhood, and he has been progressing in SO many areas, it seems like this area is getting worse. The older he gets and the more he picks up in school, at home, and from media, the less he seems to grasp the concept of respecting adults.He has ALWAYS struggled with egocentrism--particularly applicable to conversation. He simply doesn't understand that all conversation should stem from him and everyone else should immediately halt all attention to ANYTHING and EVERYTHING else if he wants to talk or starts talking. I've been working hard on making him understand that that's not how the world works and helping to teach him how to adapt to the world the way it is.BUTmore recently, he has become SO disrespectful. He will almost instantly start a meltdown when others talk, including cussing at his grandparents if he wants the floor. I'm at a loss! No measure of discipline seems to work anymore--he just screams that he doesn't care--and I can tell he's already so far into meltdown mode that it's not even him talking.I've tried to talk to him about it many times--OUTSIDE of the situation. I'll wait until later and everyone is calm and it is not happening before I'll address how important respect for adults is. He's a computer/web kid and he googles everything and watches videos on anything/everything he is interested in. I've tried to get him to watch Leave It to Beaver, Father Knows Best or even BRady Bunch, so he can see the appropriate way to talk to adults. He tried LITB first and refused to watch it because it was black and white and then quit. Any suggestions??!!I'm so scared he's going to keep getting worse and, truthfully, I feel like I don't have much control!Lori Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 22, 2010 Report Share Posted September 22, 2010 Hi CathleenThanks for responding. Sometimes it’s nice just to know we’re not alone!! I’ve tried so hard with positive reinforcement, but it’s almost like he seeks out NEGATIVE attention over positive!! Family therapy, huh? Hmmm… So have they changed the dx to ASP now? From: [mailto: ] On Behalf Of Cathleen VeloriaSent: Wednesday, September 22, 2010 11:02 AM Subject: Re: ( ) respect My son is 7 and in the same boat. Maybe not as bad, but we're a year behind you. In my case they said it was ODD (Oppositional defiant disorder). Nice labeling, but it doesn't help me get the respect I'm looking for.Any way they gave us books to read and the positive reinforcement, rewarding system. It worked for awhile, but we we're not consistant with it and things got back to defiancy.I'm afraid I'm looking for those answers also. I just wanted to say you're not alone. Maybe family therapy would help. That's what was suggested to us. People said it was a family issue, not just a child gone bad so to speak. Cathleen From: " l8elucretia@... " <l8elucretia@...>Aspergers Treatment Sent: Wed, September 22, 2010 7:19:01 AMSubject: ( ) respect Hey Aspie parentsAre any of you struggling with respect or should I say lack thereof?My son is 8. When he's good, he's gold. When he's awful, he's AWFUL.Even though I have been teaching respect since babyhood, and he has been progressing in SO many areas, it seems like this area is getting worse. The older he gets and the more he picks up in school, at home, and from media, the less he seems to grasp the concept of respecting adults.He has ALWAYS struggled with egocentrism--particularly applicable to conversation. He simply doesn't understand that all conversation should stem from him and everyone else should immediately halt all attention to ANYTHING and EVERYTHING else if he wants to talk or starts talking. I've been working hard on making him understand that that's not how the world works and helping to teach him how to adapt to the world the way it is.BUTmore recently, he has become SO disrespectful. He will almost instantly start a meltdown when others talk, including cussing at his grandparents if he wants the floor. I'm at a loss! No measure of discipline seems to work anymore--he just screams that he doesn't care--and I can tell he's already so far into meltdown mode that it's not even him talking.I've tried to talk to him about it many times--OUTSIDE of the situation. I'll wait until later and everyone is calm and it is not happening before I'll address how important respect for adults is. He's a computer/web kid and he googles everything and watches videos on anything/everything he is interested in. I've tried to get him to watch Leave It to Beaver, Father Knows Best or even BRady Bunch, so he can see the appropriate way to talk to adults. He tried LITB first and refused to watch it because it was black and white and then quit. Any suggestions??!!I'm so scared he's going to keep getting worse and, truthfully, I feel like I don't have much control!Lori Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 22, 2010 Report Share Posted September 22, 2010 I find out in a couple of weeks when I see a child neuropsychologist and get him tested. He shows all the signs of Asperger's accept the monotone voice. It's a mother's instinct. I don't want him to have AS,he already has diagnosed ADHD, but I need to know the truth. We are struggling with a lot of AS symptoms of my son. Cathleen From: Lori Lashley <l8elucretia@...> Sent: Wed, September 22, 2010 6:00:55 PMSubject: RE: ( ) respect Hi Cathleen Thanks for responding. Sometimes it’s nice just to know we’re not alone!! I’ve tried so hard with positive reinforcement, but it’s almost like he seeks out NEGATIVE attention over positive!! Family therapy, huh? Hmmm… So have they changed the dx to ASP now? From: [mailto: ] On Behalf Of Cathleen VeloriaSent: Wednesday, September 22, 2010 11:02 AM Subject: Re: ( ) respect My son is 7 and in the same boat. Maybe not as bad, but we're a year behind you. In my case they said it was ODD (Oppositional defiant disorder). Nice labeling, but it doesn't help me get the respect I'm looking for. Any way they gave us books to read and the positive reinforcement, rewarding system. It worked for awhile, but we we're not consistant with it and things got back to defiancy. I'm afraid I'm looking for those answers also. I just wanted to say you're not alone. Maybe family therapy would help. That's what was suggested to us. People said it was a family issue, not just a child gone bad so to speak. Cathleen From: "l8elucretia@..." <l8elucretia@...>Aspergers Treatment Sent: Wed, September 22, 2010 7:19:01 AMSubject: ( ) respect Hey Aspie parentsAre any of you struggling with respect or should I say lack thereof?My son is 8. When he's good, he's gold. When he's awful, he's AWFUL.Even though I have been teaching respect since babyhood, and he has been progressing in SO many areas, it seems like this area is getting worse. The older he gets and the more he picks up in school, at home, and from media, the less he seems to grasp the concept of respecting adults.He has ALWAYS struggled with egocentrism--particularly applicable to conversation. He simply doesn't understand that all conversation should stem from him and everyone else should immediately halt all attention to ANYTHING and EVERYTHING else if he wants to talk or starts talking. I've been working hard on making him understand that that's not how the world works and helping to teach him how to adapt to the world the way it is.BUTmore recently, he has become SO disrespectful. He will almost instantly start a meltdown when others talk, including cussing at his grandparents if he wants the floor. I'm at a loss! No measure of discipline seems to work anymore--he just screams that he doesn't care--and I can tell he's already so far into meltdown mode that it's not even him talking.I've tried to talk to him about it many times--OUTSIDE of the situation. I'll wait until later and everyone is calm and it is not happening before I'll address how important respect for adults is. He's a computer/web kid and he googles everything and watches videos on anything/everything he is interested in. I've tried to get him to watch Leave It to Beaver, Father Knows Best or even BRady Bunch, so he can see the appropriate way to talk to adults. He tried LITB first and refused to watch it because it was black and white and then quit. Any suggestions??!!I'm so scared he's going to keep getting worse and, truthfully, I feel like I don't have much control!Lori Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 22, 2010 Report Share Posted September 22, 2010 It’s definitely a mother’s instinct! My son doesn’t have the monotone voice either. He’s got everything else down pat though! The ADHD too! 7-minute attention span…PERIOD! From: [mailto: ] On Behalf Of Cathleen VeloriaSent: Wednesday, September 22, 2010 7:47 PM Subject: Re: ( ) respect I find out in a couple of weeks when I see a child neuropsychologist and get him tested. He shows all the signs of Asperger's accept the monotone voice. It's a mother's instinct. I don't want him to have AS,he already has diagnosed ADHD, but I need to know the truth. We are struggling with a lot of AS symptoms of my son. Cathleen From: Lori Lashley <l8elucretia@...> Sent: Wed, September 22, 2010 6:00:55 PMSubject: RE: ( ) respect Hi CathleenThanks for responding. Sometimes it’s nice just to know we’re not alone!! I’ve tried so hard with positive reinforcement, but it’s almost like he seeks out NEGATIVE attention over positive!! Family therapy, huh? Hmmm… So have they changed the dx to ASP now? From: [mailto: ] On Behalf Of Cathleen VeloriaSent: Wednesday, September 22, 2010 11:02 AM Subject: Re: ( ) respect My son is 7 and in the same boat. Maybe not as bad, but we're a year behind you. In my case they said it was ODD (Oppositional defiant disorder). Nice labeling, but it doesn't help me get the respect I'm looking for.Any way they gave us books to read and the positive reinforcement, rewarding system. It worked for awhile, but we we're not consistant with it and things got back to defiancy.I'm afraid I'm looking for those answers also. I just wanted to say you're not alone. Maybe family therapy would help. That's what was suggested to us. People said it was a family issue, not just a child gone bad so to speak. Cathleen From: " l8elucretia@... " <l8elucretia@...>Aspergers Treatment Sent: Wed, September 22, 2010 7:19:01 AMSubject: ( ) respect Hey Aspie parentsAre any of you struggling with respect or should I say lack thereof?My son is 8. When he's good, he's gold. When he's awful, he's AWFUL.Even though I have been teaching respect since babyhood, and he has been progressing in SO many areas, it seems like this area is getting worse. The older he gets and the more he picks up in school, at home, and from media, the less he seems to grasp the concept of respecting adults.He has ALWAYS struggled with egocentrism--particularly applicable to conversation. He simply doesn't understand that all conversation should stem from him and everyone else should immediately halt all attention to ANYTHING and EVERYTHING else if he wants to talk or starts talking. I've been working hard on making him understand that that's not how the world works and helping to teach him how to adapt to the world the way it is.BUTmore recently, he has become SO disrespectful. He will almost instantly start a meltdown when others talk, including cussing at his grandparents if he wants the floor. I'm at a loss! No measure of discipline seems to work anymore--he just screams that he doesn't care--and I can tell he's already so far into meltdown mode that it's not even him talking.I've tried to talk to him about it many times--OUTSIDE of the situation. I'll wait until later and everyone is calm and it is not happening before I'll address how important respect for adults is. He's a computer/web kid and he googles everything and watches videos on anything/everything he is interested in. I've tried to get him to watch Leave It to Beaver, Father Knows Best or even BRady Bunch, so he can see the appropriate way to talk to adults. He tried LITB first and refused to watch it because it was black and white and then quit. Any suggestions??!!I'm so scared he's going to keep getting worse and, truthfully, I feel like I don't have much control!Lori Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 23, 2010 Report Share Posted September 23, 2010 Wow Lori, We have a lot in common. Too bad you're not here in San Diego. Maybe we can IM through chat. Do you do that? It's fun and you don't have to wait a day to see responses. My son also bounces off the walls until midnight, his usual bedtime. Outside of this forum I would never admit that because I would be afraid of sounding like a horrible Mom. But not here, where people understand I feel more comfortable, but I still hate that he's rebounding from his meds so late. By the way, does your son take meds for his ADHD. Forgive me if you've already mentioned this. My attention span is not so great either,lol. Cathleen From: Lori Lashley <l8elucretia@...> Sent: Wed, September 22, 2010 8:19:54 PMSubject: RE: ( ) respect It’s definitely a mother’s instinct! My son doesn’t have the monotone voice either. He’s got everything else down pat though! The ADHD too! 7-minute attention span…PERIOD! From: [mailto: ] On Behalf Of Cathleen VeloriaSent: Wednesday, September 22, 2010 7:47 PM Subject: Re: ( ) respect I find out in a couple of weeks when I see a child neuropsychologist and get him tested. He shows all the signs of Asperger's accept the monotone voice. It's a mother's instinct. I don't want him to have AS,he already has diagnosed ADHD, but I need to know the truth. We are struggling with a lot of AS symptoms of my son. Cathleen From: Lori Lashley <l8elucretia@...> Sent: Wed, September 22, 2010 6:00:55 PMSubject: RE: ( ) respect Hi Cathleen Thanks for responding. Sometimes it’s nice just to know we’re not alone!! I’ve tried so hard with positive reinforcement, but it’s almost like he seeks out NEGATIVE attention over positive!! Family therapy, huh? Hmmm… So have they changed the dx to ASP now? From: [mailto: ] On Behalf Of Cathleen VeloriaSent: Wednesday, September 22, 2010 11:02 AM Subject: Re: ( ) respect My son is 7 and in the same boat. Maybe not as bad, but we're a year behind you. In my case they said it was ODD (Oppositional defiant disorder). Nice labeling, but it doesn't help me get the respect I'm looking for. Any way they gave us books to read and the positive reinforcement, rewarding system. It worked for awhile, but we we're not consistant with it and things got back to defiancy. I'm afraid I'm looking for those answers also. I just wanted to say you're not alone. Maybe family therapy would help. That's what was suggested to us. People said it was a family issue, not just a child gone bad so to speak. Cathleen From: "l8elucretia@..." <l8elucretia@...>Aspergers Treatment Sent: Wed, September 22, 2010 7:19:01 AMSubject: ( ) respect Hey Aspie parentsAre any of you struggling with respect or should I say lack thereof?My son is 8. When he's good, he's gold. When he's awful, he's AWFUL.Even though I have been teaching respect since babyhood, and he has been progressing in SO many areas, it seems like this area is getting worse. The older he gets and the more he picks up in school, at home, and from media, the less he seems to grasp the concept of respecting adults.He has ALWAYS struggled with egocentrism--particularly applicable to conversation. He simply doesn't understand that all conversation should stem from him and everyone else should immediately halt all attention to ANYTHING and EVERYTHING else if he wants to talk or starts talking. I've been working hard on making him understand that that's not how the world works and helping to teach him how to adapt to the world the way it is.BUTmore recently, he has become SO disrespectful. He will almost instantly start a meltdown when others talk, including cussing at his grandparents if he wants the floor. I'm at a loss! No measure of discipline seems to work anymore--he just screams that he doesn't care--and I can tell he's already so far into meltdown mode that it's not even him talking.I've tried to talk to him about it many times--OUTSIDE of the situation. I'll wait until later and everyone is calm and it is not happening before I'll address how important respect for adults is. He's a computer/web kid and he googles everything and watches videos on anything/everything he is interested in. I've tried to get him to watch Leave It to Beaver, Father Knows Best or even BRady Bunch, so he can see the appropriate way to talk to adults. He tried LITB first and refused to watch it because it was black and white and then quit. Any suggestions??!!I'm so scared he's going to keep getting worse and, truthfully, I feel like I don't have much control!Lori Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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