Re: would like to hear opinions...

[Guest guest]

"Generally I think it's true what the docs say about ASD, 'Genetics load the gun, environment pulls the trigger.'" (quoted from the email below) massively struck a chord for me as I have a slightly different opinion in that there is *possibly* a different trigger.

In the case of various families with ASD members I have spoken to, and within my own too, without exception there seems to have been a massively stressful situation the ASD member has gone through usually in their fairly early childhood that seems to become the trigger. In my DD's case she had a cyst that she was probably born with but that got so big she couldn't breathe and had to have emergency surgery to remove (much longer and complicated story than that in the details), my husband was severely bullied in his early school life (held upside over a 4th floor balcony by his ankles), another lady I spoke to about this, her son's head was held down the toilet whilst it was flushed at school, several others went through traumatic birth situations. Without exception in my own limited research, some kind of trauma seems to be indicated and I have also wondered if this holds true for a lot of the controversy surrounding the MMR as well as the age at which it is administered (around 1 year old) the child is fully trusting of all around it and not anticipating what must seem like a deliberate infliction of pain by an adult and some of them are simply not able to handle that (I do realise this is hugely simplified because there are also reports of rashes and physical reactions too but that is still stress on their bodies) - which could possibly explain why the studies come back with conflicting results yet the parents involved are adamant that is what the *cause* was.

I am very interested to know if this theory holds good with you all too? ie there is a genetic disposition but a traumatic event has possibly been the trigger?

If this offends anybody, that is also not my intention, I know sometimes on here topics that come up can upset people.

a

From: april_qian

Sent: Wednesday, June 02, 2010 11:15 PM

Subject: Re: ( ) Bad research on how GFCF does not work and our experience

I want to clarify my original intent on sending this. I totally agree and so far there is no scientific proof GFCF makes a difference for ALL autistic kids. We strictly followed the diet, KNOWING it might not make any difference. We saw gradual change, and very distinct change when we put our ds back on GC for 2 weeks. He is more communicative and in context, but he's still him:- writing and drawing all the time and fascinated with numbers, letters and electronics. It's not a cure and we didn't expect so. We still attend special ed for ASD, etc.We didn't do any of the potentially harmful treatments like chelation, massive vitamins. We wanted to see if the least pervasive treatment, i.e. diet would change anything and it did. Generally I think it's true what the docs say about ASD, "Genetics load the gun, environment pulls the trigger." We cannot eliminate the geeky genes now (too late for that), but we should try and find the most harmful thing in the environment and eliminate that for our kids who for one reason or another may react more to these than others.I think the medical and scientific society should try to understand how the GCFC works, how long it takes, what might or might not cause something, etc., when they go ahead and spend all the money and time on research. If it doesn't work for some, why, if it does work for some others, why. That's the kind of research we need. Why are they still trying to find IF it works, just read the thousands of parent stories that it did for them, for decades.

[Guest guest]

My ASD boy was adopted from foster care at the age of 13 months... one of 4 sibs that we adopted. He, the next to youngest, is only one with ASD.

Situational? Who knows? At this point, we don't care. We just love him and wish to do the best by him that we can-

However, we do see the wisdom in knowing what causes this, either genetics, medications, situation, etc. so that in the future it might be avoided.

Still, we love our ASD kid, his quirky behavior and the joy he brings to us.

From: paulahenderson@...Date: Thu, 3 Jun 2010 09:30:14 +0100Subject: Re: ( ) would like to hear opinions...

"Generally I think it's true what the docs say about ASD, 'Genetics load the gun, environment pulls the trigger.'" (quoted from the email below) massively struck a chord for me as I have a slightly different opinion in that there is *possibly* a different trigger.

In the case of various families with ASD members I have spoken to, and within my own too, without exception there seems to have been a massively stressful situation the ASD member has gone through usually in their fairly early childhood that seems to become the trigger. In my DD's case she had a cyst that she was probably born with but that got so big she couldn't breathe and had to have emergency surgery to remove (much longer and complicated story than that in the details), my husband was severely bullied in his early school life (held upside over a 4th floor balcony by his ankles), another lady I spoke to about this, her son's head was held down the toilet whilst it was flushed at school, several others went through traumatic birth situations. Without exception in my own limited research, some kind of trauma seems to be indicated and I have also wondered if this holds true for a lot of the controversy surrounding the MMR as well as the age at which it is administered (around 1 year old) the child is fully trusting of all around it and not anticipating what must seem like a deliberate infliction of pain by an adult and some of them are simply not able to handle that (I do realise this is hugely simplified because there are also reports of rashes and physical reactions too but that is still stress on their bodies) - which could possibly explain why the studies come back with conflicting results yet the parents involved are adamant that is what the *cause* was.

I am very interested to know if this theory holds good with you all too? ie there is a genetic disposition but a traumatic event has possibly been the trigger?

If this offends anybody, that is also not my intention, I know sometimes on here topics that come up can upset people.

a

From: april_qian

Sent: Wednesday, June 02, 2010 11:15 PM

Subject: Re: ( ) Bad research on how GFCF does not work and our experience

I want to clarify my original intent on sending this. I totally agree and so far there is no scientific proof GFCF makes a difference for ALL autistic kids. We strictly followed the diet, KNOWING it might not make any difference. We saw gradual change, and very distinct change when we put our ds back on GC for 2 weeks. He is more communicative and in context, but he's still him:- writing and drawing all the time and fascinated with numbers, letters and electronics. It's not a cure and we didn't expect so. We still attend special ed for ASD, etc.We didn't do any of the potentially harmful treatments like chelation, massive vitamins. We wanted to see if the least pervasive treatment, i.e. diet would change anything and it did. Generally I think it's true what the docs say about ASD, "Genetics load the gun, environment pulls the trigger." We cannot eliminate the geeky genes now (too late for that), but we should try and find the most harmful thing in the environment and eliminate that for our kids who for one reason or another may react more to these than others.I think the medical and scientific society should try to understand how the GCFC works, how long it takes, what might or might not cause something, etc., when they go ahead and spend all the money and time on research. If it doesn't work for some, why, if it does work for some others, why. That's the kind of research we need. Why are they still trying to find IF it works, just read the thousands of parent stories that it did for them, for decades.

[Guest guest]

I don't spend too much energy on " why " at this point, but I definitely see a

genetic propensity on my husband's side. There are male family members

throughout the generations that had some clearly Aspergerish tendencies, but it

seems milder than our situation. My son did have a vary traumatic birth with

horrible suctioning that left a huge hematoma on his head and soft tissue damage

in his jaw. I did read one steady which suggested a correlation between such

deliveries and ASD. However, there's definitely a hereditary component for us.

-Mich

---- a <paulahenderson@...> wrote:

> " Generally I think it's true what the docs say about ASD, 'Genetics load the

gun, environment pulls the trigger.' " (quoted from the email below) massively

struck a chord for me as I have a slightly different opinion in that there is

*possibly* a different trigger.

>

> In the case of various families with ASD members I have spoken to, and within

my own too, without exception there seems to have been a massively stressful

situation the ASD member has gone through usually in their fairly early

childhood that seems to become the trigger. In my DD's case she had a cyst that

she was probably born with but that got so big she couldn't breathe and had to

have emergency surgery to remove (much longer and complicated story than that in

the details), my husband was severely bullied in his early school life (held

upside over a 4th floor balcony by his ankles), another lady I spoke to about

this, her son's head was held down the toilet whilst it was flushed at school,

several others went through traumatic birth situations. Without exception in my

own limited research, some kind of trauma seems to be indicated and I have also

wondered if this holds true for a lot of the controversy surrounding the MMR as

well as the age at which it is administered (around 1 year old) the child is

fully trusting of all around it and not anticipating what must seem like a

deliberate infliction of pain by an adult and some of them are simply not able

to handle that (I do realise this is hugely simplified because there are also

reports of rashes and physical reactions too but that is still stress on their

bodies) - which could possibly explain why the studies come back with

conflicting results yet the parents involved are adamant that is what the

*cause* was.

>

> I am very interested to know if this theory holds good with you all too? ie

there is a genetic disposition but a traumatic event has possibly been the

trigger?

>

> If this offends anybody, that is also not my intention, I know sometimes on

here topics that come up can upset people.

>

> a

>

>

> From: april_qian

> Sent: Wednesday, June 02, 2010 11:15 PM

>

> Subject: Re: ( ) Bad research on how GFCF does not work and our

experience

>

>

>

> I want to clarify my original intent on sending this.

>

> I totally agree and so far there is no scientific proof GFCF makes a

difference for ALL autistic kids. We strictly followed the diet, KNOWING it

might not make any difference. We saw gradual change, and very distinct change

when we put our ds back on GC for 2 weeks. He is more communicative and in

context, but he's still him:- writing and drawing all the time and fascinated

with numbers, letters and electronics. It's not a cure and we didn't expect so.

We still attend special ed for ASD, etc.

>

> We didn't do any of the potentially harmful treatments like chelation, massive

vitamins. We wanted to see if the least pervasive treatment, i.e. diet would

change anything and it did.

>

> Generally I think it's true what the docs say about ASD, " Genetics load the

gun, environment pulls the trigger. " We cannot eliminate the geeky genes now

(too late for that), but we should try and find the most harmful thing in the

environment and eliminate that for our kids who for one reason or another may

react more to these than others.

>

> I think the medical and scientific society should try to understand how the

GCFC works, how long it takes, what might or might not cause something, etc.,

when they go ahead and spend all the money and time on research. If it doesn't

work for some, why, if it does work for some others, why. That's the kind of

research we need. Why are they still trying to find IF it works, just read the

thousands of parent stories that it did for them, for decades.

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

a,

Maybe so--let me explain.

My son was born with Pentalogy of Cantrell--a rare upper midline disorder. It happens between 3-10 days of conception. In the womb are insides are spinning, then they come in and your actual abdomen forms around it. My sons didn't all make it in on time--so he was born with a bit of the inside testine on the outside. I got to bring him home the first time at 3.5 mths old. He was on a feeding tube, didn't eat till he was one-when he kept pulling it out and no one could put it in right (only the ONE doctor 5 hrs away) so it kept closing up. My dad force-fed him, for a weekend. Then he started eating--never had another problem with him not eating. The speech therapist said it was amazing--she had never experienced that before. He went for about 2 mths before this happened. She tried to get him to eat, using puddings, special cups, etc.

So now he is doing great--average to high intelligence, but still needs maintenance heart surgeries every 3-4 years. He looks maybe 2-3 years younger than his age--shorter and thinner. Other than that, no one has ever mentioned anything odd about him, besides wow your kid is REALLY smart--I think that is the little professor issue.

So maybe this could have been a catalyst? Not sure. I do know that his condition was not considered genetic--they said it was a fluke. He was only 1 of 10 to survive his condition in 1999. He was the 93rd case ever.

Hugs,

Kristal

Purrs & Kisses,

Kristal of Digi Kitty

The Kitty who loves Digi!

Designer for the VDBC "More" Team - you can see my designs HERE!!!

From: a <paulahenderson@...>Subject: Re: ( ) would like to hear opinions... Date: Thursday, June 3, 2010, 4:30 AM

"Generally I think it's true what the docs say about ASD, 'Genetics load the gun, environment pulls the trigger.'" (quoted from the email below) massively struck a chord for me as I have a slightly different opinion in that there is *possibly* a different trigger.

In the case of various families with ASD members I have spoken to, and within my own too, without exception there seems to have been a massively stressful situation the ASD member has gone through usually in their fairly early childhood that seems to become the trigger. In my DD's case she had a cyst that she was probably born with but that got so big she couldn't breathe and had to have emergency surgery to remove (much longer and complicated story than that in the details), my husband was severely bullied in his early school life (held upside over a 4th floor balcony by his ankles), another lady I spoke to about this, her son's head was held down the toilet whilst it was flushed at school, several others went through traumatic birth situations. Without exception in my own limited research, some kind of trauma seems to be indicated and I have also wondered if this holds true for a lot of the

controversy surrounding the MMR as well as the age at which it is administered (around 1 year old) the child is fully trusting of all around it and not anticipating what must seem like a deliberate infliction of pain by an adult and some of them are simply not able to handle that (I do realise this is hugely simplified because there are also reports of rashes and physical reactions too but that is still stress on their bodies) - which could possibly explain why the studies come back with conflicting results yet the parents involved are adamant that is what the *cause* was.

I am very interested to know if this theory holds good with you all too? ie there is a genetic disposition but a traumatic event has possibly been the trigger?

If this offends anybody, that is also not my intention, I know sometimes on here topics that come up can upset people.

a

From: april_qian

Sent: Wednesday, June 02, 2010 11:15 PM

Subject: Re: ( ) Bad research on how GFCF does not work and our experience

I want to clarify my original intent on sending this. I totally agree and so far there is no scientific proof GFCF makes a difference for ALL autistic kids. We strictly followed the diet, KNOWING it might not make any difference. We saw gradual change, and very distinct change when we put our ds back on GC for 2 weeks. He is more communicative and in context, but he's still him:- writing and drawing all the time and fascinated with numbers, letters and electronics. It's not a cure and we didn't expect so. We still attend special ed for ASD, etc.We didn't do any of the potentially harmful treatments like chelation, massive vitamins. We wanted to see if the least pervasive treatment, i.e. diet would change anything and it did. Generally I think it's true what the docs say about ASD, "Genetics load the gun, environment pulls the trigger." We cannot eliminate the geeky genes now (too late for that), but we should try and find the

most harmful thing in the environment and eliminate that for our kids who for one reason or another may react more to these than others.I think the medical and scientific society should try to understand how the GCFC works, how long it takes, what might or might not cause something, etc., when they go ahead and spend all the money and time on research. If it doesn't work for some, why, if it does work for some others, why. That's the kind of research we need. Why are they still trying to find IF it works, just read the thousands of parent stories that it did for them, for decades.

[Guest guest]

I don't know what to think about the cause for our own family. The trauma sounds intriguing considering our own situation. Our AS son had a Periodic Fever Syndrome () which began when he was 3 months old. He had high fevers (104-105) for 3 days every 2 weeks from start to start of fever. Meaning with day before starting to come down with it and day after fever recovering he only had 9 days of 'normal' without fever issues then it would start all over again. Tylenol, Motrin did little to relieve the fever and it would spike again before time to give meds again was up. We tested for everything the docs thought possible, even DNA testing along those lines and nothing showed positive so the dx was . Found an MD who suggested having his tonsils removed at 2yrs8mo and the fevers stopped. Strep and other

throat cultures were always negative, so we are not exactly sure why this works for kids.

Anyway, that was VERY VERY traumatic for Tyler to go through. So, we wonder about genetic disposition (my DH has AS characteristics) or the high fevers causing damage, or combination of the two.

It is amazing to me to see how sweet and loving our boy is despite all the challenges he has faced, and is still facing, at such a young age.

As far as my DH, his childhood was not the best environment. His stepfather was, and still is, very abusive to him mentally during which my DH got to see none of that treatment dished out to his younger siblings who were 'full blood' of both his stepfather and mother. My DH doesn't talk much about that part of his life, but I have met his parents several times and see evidence of it still today (and he is now in his early 40's).

We know nothing of my DH's biological father, his mother won't give up any information other than a name that was on my DH's old birth certificate. I inquired because of the medical issues we had early on with Tyler - I was hoping to find out about genetic issues. So, I cannot say further back in the gene pool.

Anyway, thought the idea of this was interesting to atleast ponder. I am not offended in the least.

By the way my DS with AS also had a reaction to vaccines when he was 16 months old. He had a SEVERE episode of Erythema Multiforme (crazy weird rash like skin reaction that morphs over the ENTIRE body scalp, genitals, eye lids, everywhere). Starts out like little bug bites and the red spots grow into big solid circles that morph into larger and larger circles that become just the outline of the circle in red (center back to skin color) and grow and grow until they run into eachother and no part of the skin is left unaffected. It did go away, but we had to give him mild steroids. The GUESS from the pediatrician and ER doc was one of the vaccines he had been administered the week before. There GUESS was the Hep A - but he received 5 shots at once and MMR was one of them. I read somewhere that the amount of mercury in the vaccinations when given together with several at a time is way above reccomended allowances by

the FDA. Also having to fight off so many introductions to the immune system at once is not easy.

That being said, I am NOT against immunization and NOT saying anyone should or should not be. It is a personal decision for every parent. I still get our children vaccinated, but I don't allow more than 2 at a time now, and just have to make more visits.

Wow, sorry so long!

~ Pruden

From: a <paulahenderson@...>Subject: Re: ( ) would like to hear opinions... Date: Thursday, June 3, 2010, 1:30 AM

"Generally I think it's true what the docs say about ASD, 'Genetics load the gun, environment pulls the trigger.'" (quoted from the email below) massively struck a chord for me as I have a slightly different opinion in that there is *possibly* a different trigger.

In the case of various families with ASD members I have spoken to, and within my own too, without exception there seems to have been a massively stressful situation the ASD member has gone through usually in their fairly early childhood that seems to become the trigger. In my DD's case she had a cyst that she was probably born with but that got so big she couldn't breathe and had to have emergency surgery to remove (much longer and complicated story than that in the details), my husband was severely bullied in his early school life (held upside over a 4th floor balcony by his ankles), another lady I spoke to about this, her son's head was held down the toilet whilst it was flushed at school, several others went through traumatic birth situations. Without exception in my own limited research, some kind of trauma seems to be indicated and I have also wondered if this holds true for a lot of the

controversy surrounding the MMR as well as the age at which it is administered (around 1 year old) the child is fully trusting of all around it and not anticipating what must seem like a deliberate infliction of pain by an adult and some of them are simply not able to handle that (I do realise this is hugely simplified because there are also reports of rashes and physical reactions too but that is still stress on their bodies) - which could possibly explain why the studies come back with conflicting results yet the parents involved are adamant that is what the *cause* was.

I am very interested to know if this theory holds good with you all too? ie there is a genetic disposition but a traumatic event has possibly been the trigger?

If this offends anybody, that is also not my intention, I know sometimes on here topics that come up can upset people.

a

From: april_qian

Sent: Wednesday, June 02, 2010 11:15 PM

Subject: Re: ( ) Bad research on how GFCF does not work and our experience

I want to clarify my original intent on sending this. I totally agree and so far there is no scientific proof GFCF makes a difference for ALL autistic kids. We strictly followed the diet, KNOWING it might not make any difference. We saw gradual change, and very distinct change when we put our ds back on GC for 2 weeks. He is more communicative and in context, but he's still him:- writing and drawing all the time and fascinated with numbers, letters and electronics. It's not a cure and we didn't expect so. We still attend special ed for ASD, etc.We didn't do any of the potentially harmful treatments like chelation, massive vitamins. We wanted to see if the least pervasive treatment, i.e. diet would change anything and it did. Generally I think it's true what the docs say about ASD, "Genetics load the gun, environment pulls the trigger." We cannot eliminate the geeky genes now (too late for that), but we should try and find the

most harmful thing in the environment and eliminate that for our kids who for one reason or another may react more to these than others.I think the medical and scientific society should try to understand how the GCFC works, how long it takes, what might or might not cause something, etc., when they go ahead and spend all the money and time on research. If it doesn't work for some, why, if it does work for some others, why. That's the kind of research we need. Why are they still trying to find IF it works, just read the thousands of parent stories that it did for them, for decades.

[Guest guest]

exactly the way we feel--we wouldn't change him for the world--(well maybe those fits sometimes--hahah!)

Purrs & Kisses,

Kristal of Digi Kitty

The Kitty who loves Digi!

Designer for the VDBC "More" Team - you can see my designs HERE!!!

From: The High Desert Halls Wah Hoooo <highdeserthalls@...>Subject: RE: ( ) would like to hear opinions...Aspergers Treatment Date: Thursday, June 3, 2010, 10:38 AM

My ASD boy was adopted from foster care at the age of 13 months... one of 4 sibs that we adopted. He, the next to youngest, is only one with ASD.Situational? Who knows? At this point, we don't care. We just love him and wish to do the best by him that we can-However, we do see the wisdom in knowing what causes this, either genetics, medications, situation, etc. so that in the future it might be avoided.Still, we love our ASD kid, his quirky behavior and the joy he brings to us.

From: paulahenderson@ ua-solutions. netDate: Thu, 3 Jun 2010 09:30:14 +0100Subject: Re: ( ) would like to hear opinions...

"Generally I think it's true what the docs say about ASD, 'Genetics load the gun, environment pulls the trigger.'" (quoted from the email below) massively struck a chord for me as I have a slightly different opinion in that there is *possibly* a different trigger.

In the case of various families with ASD members I have spoken to, and within my own too, without exception there seems to have been a massively stressful situation the ASD member has gone through usually in their fairly early childhood that seems to become the trigger. In my DD's case she had a cyst that she was probably born with but that got so big she couldn't breathe and had to have emergency surgery to remove (much longer and complicated story than that in the details), my husband was severely bullied in his early school life (held upside over a 4th floor balcony by his ankles), another lady I spoke to about this, her son's head was held down the toilet whilst it was flushed at school, several others went through traumatic birth situations. Without exception in my own limited research, some kind of trauma seems to be indicated and I have also wondered if this holds true for a lot of the

controversy surrounding the MMR as well as the age at which it is administered (around 1 year old) the child is fully trusting of all around it and not anticipating what must seem like a deliberate infliction of pain by an adult and some of them are simply not able to handle that (I do realise this is hugely simplified because there are also reports of rashes and physical reactions too but that is still stress on their bodies) - which could possibly explain why the studies come back with conflicting results yet the parents involved are adamant that is what the *cause* was.

I am very interested to know if this theory holds good with you all too? ie there is a genetic disposition but a traumatic event has possibly been the trigger?

If this offends anybody, that is also not my intention, I know sometimes on here topics that come up can upset people.

a

From: april_qian

Sent: Wednesday, June 02, 2010 11:15 PM

Subject: Re: ( ) Bad research on how GFCF does not work and our experience

I want to clarify my original intent on sending this. I totally agree and so far there is no scientific proof GFCF makes a difference for ALL autistic kids. We strictly followed the diet, KNOWING it might not make any difference. We saw gradual change, and very distinct change when we put our ds back on GC for 2 weeks. He is more communicative and in context, but he's still him:- writing and drawing all the time and fascinated with numbers, letters and electronics. It's not a cure and we didn't expect so. We still attend special ed for ASD, etc.We didn't do any of the potentially harmful treatments like chelation, massive vitamins. We wanted to see if the least pervasive treatment, i.e. diet would change anything and it did. Generally I think it's true what the docs say about ASD, "Genetics load the gun, environment pulls the trigger." We cannot eliminate the geeky genes now (too late for that), but we should try and find the

most harmful thing in the environment and eliminate that for our kids who for one reason or another may react more to these than others.I think the medical and scientific society should try to understand how the GCFC works, how long it takes, what might or might not cause something, etc., when they go ahead and spend all the money and time on research. If it doesn't work for some, why, if it does work for some others, why. That's the kind of research we need. Why are they still trying to find IF it works, just read the thousands of parent stories that it did for them, for decades.

[Guest guest]

I saw this and had to respond. Traumatic - well, Daddy went to Iraq for sixteen very formative months. And I know that when he was extended after 12, I did not handle it well. Some of 's tendencies did worsen during this period. Though, to be honest, I'm not sure if this would have been the case as already showed speech delay by this period. Of course, for all of the studies that have concluded otherwise, I have to say did have relatively normal development until about a year old. And I have to wonder about his vaccination schedule. We had missed some and the doctor just caught him up at that appointment. Also, I was not supposed to conceive when I did due to my own vaccinations I received while enlisted

in the Army. I do agree completely with the statement, "Genetics load the gun, environment pulls the trigger." There are autistic cousins on my husband's side of the family. And there is bipolar disorder and ADD on my side. (The DH and I were considered "gifted" NT children.) But, honestly, I can think of a thousand possible environmental triggers. I've stopped trying to drive myself crazy with the "how did I break my child?" questioning.I just try to be careful with both of my children now. I am extremely vigilant about making sure they receive their proper rest and keep their stress to a minimum. I refuse to experiment with any drug therapies. This is because sleep deprivation, stress, and drug use/abuse (something I will need to discuss with them as they get older as recreational usage is most commonly the culprit) have all played contributing roles preceding the initial

diagnoses/breakdowns of my father, grandmother, great-uncles, great-grandfather, and great-great grandmother with bipolar disorder. In the case of my great-great grandmother, it is assumed due to stories about her (and subsequent diagnoses of her descendants), but she died of suicide long before diagnosis was common (possible?).I keep our family running on a routine that I try not to vary greatly because the stability is ideal for both children to feel relaxed and safe. I also try to keep their diets healthy with as many whole foods as they will eat and multi-vitamins just because I want to make sure their bodies have the nutrients they need to function at their best capacity. These things and good sleep are good common sense things for all children, but I know that mine have the potential to be more sensitive than another child may be just

because of the beautiful genetic Molotov cocktail DH and I have bequeath to them. And Coralie WAS placed on an altered vaccination schedule (as will any other children we might have in the future.) Just. In. Case.I hope my tone does not convey irritation or offense. I am not. I do have very passionate feelings associated with what I have written and believe, however. From: a <paulahenderson@...> Sent: Thu, June 3, 2010 3:30:14

AMSubject: Re: ( ) would like to hear opinions...

"Generally I think it's true what the docs say about ASD, 'Genetics load the gun, environment pulls the trigger.'" (quoted from the email below) massively struck a chord for me as I have a slightly different opinion in that there is *possibly* a different trigger.

In the case of various families with ASD members I have spoken to, and within my own too, without exception there seems to have been a massively stressful situation the ASD member has gone through usually in their fairly early childhood that seems to become the trigger. In my DD's case she had a cyst that she was probably born with but that got so big she couldn't breathe and had to have emergency surgery to remove (much longer and complicated story than that in the details), my husband was severely bullied in his early school life (held upside over a 4th floor balcony by his ankles), another lady I spoke to about this, her son's head was held down the toilet whilst it was flushed at school, several others went through traumatic birth situations. Without exception in my own limited research, some kind of trauma seems to be indicated and I have also wondered if this holds true for a lot of the controversy surrounding the MMR as well as the age at which it is administered (around 1 year old) the child is fully trusting of all around it and not anticipating what must seem like a deliberate infliction of pain by an adult and some of them are simply not able to handle that (I do realise this is hugely simplified because there are also reports of rashes and physical reactions too but that is still stress on their bodies) - which could possibly explain why the studies come back with conflicting results yet the parents involved are adamant that is what the *cause* was.

I am very interested to know if this theory holds good with you all too? ie there is a genetic disposition but a traumatic event has possibly been the trigger?

If this offends anybody, that is also not my intention, I know sometimes on here topics that come up can upset people.

a

From: april_qian

Sent: Wednesday, June 02, 2010 11:15 PM

Subject: Re: ( ) Bad research on how GFCF does not work and our experience

I want to clarify my original intent on sending this. I totally agree and so far there is no scientific proof GFCF makes a difference for ALL autistic kids. We strictly followed the diet, KNOWING it might not make any difference. We saw gradual change, and very distinct change when we put our ds back on GC for 2 weeks. He is more communicative and in context, but he's still him:- writing and drawing all the time and fascinated with numbers, letters and electronics. It's not a cure and we didn't expect so. We still attend special ed for ASD, etc.We didn't do any of the potentially harmful treatments like chelation, massive vitamins. We wanted to see if the least pervasive treatment, i.e. diet would change anything and it did. Generally I think it's true what the docs say about ASD, "Genetics load the gun, environment pulls the trigger." We cannot eliminate the geeky genes now (too late for that), but we should try and find the most harmful thing in the environment and eliminate that for our kids who for one reason or another may react more to these than others.I think the medical and scientific society should try to understand how the GCFC works, how long it takes, what might or might not cause something, etc., when they go ahead and spend all the money and time on research. If it doesn't work for some, why, if it does work for some others, why. That's the kind of research we need. Why are they still trying to find IF it works, just read the thousands of parent stories that it did for them, for decades.

[Guest guest]

It's not an offensive question to ask. I doubt you would be able to

prove this theory because I can't see the connection. I think

childhood trauma would cause it's own problems but that would not be

autism. It might be other things like a mental illness or anxiety

problem, post-traumatic stress disorder. It might cause behaviors to

increase in someone already autistic. In kids who are autistic, who

knows. Some of these kids have no reaction to what is going on around

them, others over react to everything around them. So how it affects

them is going to depend on the trauma and the person's ability to cope.

But it isn't going to cause autism.

As for the shot causing the trauma, remember that autism is a

neurological disorder. The brain is put together in unusual ways that

we have yet to unscramble (hence the " puzzle piece " logo). I know

people do believe that causes autism in otherwise normal healthy kids.

I actually have an ironic story to this end: I had my 3rd ds (he's 10

yo now) and after the first two were dx'd with autism, I was naturally

a bit paranoid about my youngest ds's development. I delayed a lot of

his shots along the way. Not so much because I really believed it

caused autism but more because I was too scared not to. lol. And it

didn't hurt to wait an extra year here and there and he did get all his

shots. But it didn't change anything. The ironic part was after the

big shot I had delayed from age 2 to age 3, we went in and got the

shots and within one week he began talking. I kind of laughed because

technically speaking, I should be blaming/praising that set of vaccines

for curing my kid. In the end, though, it was just time for his speech

to kick in and we were grateful.

Autism is already there. I think anytime you add stress in any way to

a person, you are taxing those coping skills. It depends on that

individual as to how that will play out. I don't think that is

specific to autism but is true for everyone. Even regarding the " diet "

- anytime you eliminate a problem someone is coping with, you are

improving their ability to cope overall. So that is where I think this

idea that the diet " cures " or " fixes " autism or it's symptoms comes

from. You eliminate what is a drag on their coping abilities so that

they can focus on learning something new or improving behaviors.

People connect the " wrong " dots, IMO. But it's hard to have the

conversation as people are usually screaming if you don't just buy into

it.

If you have never read a great article called, " Balancing the tray " , it

really helps explain how I view these things and I recommend it, if

nothing more than getting a new POV to how you see this. I will upload

it into our file section and I will also send out an email with this

article for anyone who is interested.

Roxanna

Whenever I feel blue, I start breathing again.

Re: ( ) would like to hear opinions...

" Generally I think it's true what the docs say about ASD, 'Genetics

load the gun, environment pulls the trigger.' " (quoted from the email

below) massively struck a chord for me as I have a slightly different

opinion in that there is *possibly* a different trigger. 

 

In the case of various families with ASD members I have spoken to, and

within my own too, without exception there seems to have been a

massively stressful situation the ASD member has gone through usually

in their fairly early childhood that seems to become the trigger.  In

my DD's case she had a cyst that she was probably born with but that

got so big she couldn't breathe and had to have emergency surgery to

remove (much longer and complicated story than that in the details), my

husband was severely bullied in his early school life (held upside over

a 4th floor balcony by his ankles), another lady I spoke to about this,

her son's head was held down the toilet whilst it was flushed at

school, several others went through traumatic birth situations. 

Without exception in my own limited research, some kind of trauma seems

to be indicated and I have also wondered if this holds true for a lot

of the controversy surrounding the MMR as well as the age at which it

is administered (around 1 year old) the child is fully trusting of all

around it and not anticipating what must seem like a deliberate

infliction of pain by an adult and some of them are simply not able to

handle that (I do realise this is hugely simplified because there are

also reports of rashes and physical reactions too but that is still

stress on their bodies) - which could possibly explain why the studies

come back with conflicting results yet the parents involved are adamant

that is what the *cause* was.

 

I am very interested to know if this theory holds good with you all

too?  ie there is a genetic disposition but a traumatic event has

possibly been the trigger?

 

If this offends anybody, that is also not my intention, I know

sometimes on here topics that come up can upset people.

 

a

[Guest guest]

Hi Roxanna,

Yet again you hit the nail on the head in many ways, particularly with the article you posted as well. I did not mean at all that autism was caused by trauma but that it could be a possible trigger to the loaded genetics, in the same way environmental factors/conception drugs/foods/allergies etc (insert latest research in whatever field as appropriate) can also be which is also why there is no defining "causal" link despite all the studies etc. Having said that, I think you best sum up many of the issues in this reply. You have a way of cutting through all the layers and getting right to the heart of an issue - thanks.

a

From: Roxanna

Sent: Friday, June 04, 2010 3:47 PM

Subject: Re: ( ) would like to hear opinions...

It's not an offensive question to ask. I doubt you would be able to prove this theory because I can't see the connection. I think childhood trauma would cause it's own problems but that would not be autism. It might be other things like a mental illness or anxiety problem, post-traumatic stress disorder. It might cause behaviors to increase in someone already autistic. In kids who are autistic, who knows. Some of these kids have no reaction to what is going on around them, others over react to everything around them. So how it affects them is going to depend on the trauma and the person's ability to cope. But it isn't going to cause autism.As for the shot causing the trauma, remember that autism is a neurological disorder. The brain is put together in unusual ways that we have yet to unscramble (hence the "puzzle piece" logo). I know people do believe that causes autism in otherwise normal healthy kids. I actually have an ironic story to this end: I had my 3rd ds (he's 10 yo now) and after the first two were dx'd with autism, I was naturally a bit paranoid about my youngest ds's development. I delayed a lot of his shots along the way. Not so much because I really believed it caused autism but more because I was too scared not to. lol. And it didn't hurt to wait an extra year here and there and he did get all his shots. But it didn't change anything. The ironic part was after the big shot I had delayed from age 2 to age 3, we went in and got the shots and within one week he began talking. I kind of laughed because technically speaking, I should be blaming/praising that set of vaccines for curing my kid. In the end, though, it was just time for his speech to kick in and we were grateful.Autism is already there. I think anytime you add stress in any way to a person, you are taxing those coping skills. It depends on that individual as to how that will play out. I don't think that is specific to autism but is true for everyone. Even regarding the "diet" - anytime you eliminate a problem someone is coping with, you are improving their ability to cope overall. So that is where I think this idea that the diet "cures" or "fixes" autism or it's symptoms comes from. You eliminate what is a drag on their coping abilities so that they can focus on learning something new or improving behaviors. People connect the "wrong" dots, IMO. But it's hard to have the conversation as people are usually screaming if you don't just buy into it.If you have never read a great article called, "Balancing the tray", it really helps explain how I view these things and I recommend it, if nothing more than getting a new POV to how you see this. I will upload it into our file section and I will also send out an email with this article for anyone who is interested.RoxannaWhenever I feel blue, I start breathing again. Re: ( ) would like to hear opinions..."Generally I think it's true what the docs say about ASD, 'Genetics load the gun, environment pulls the trigger.'" (quoted from the email below) massively struck a chord for me as I have a slightly different opinion in that there is *possibly* a different trigger. In the case of various families with ASD members I have spoken to, and within my own too, without exception there seems to have been a massively stressful situation the ASD member has gone through usually in their fairly early childhood that seems to become the trigger. In my DD's case she had a cyst that she was probably born with but that got so big she couldn't breathe and had to have emergency surgery to remove (much longer and complicated story than that in the details), my husband was severely bullied in his early school life (held upside over a 4th floor balcony by his ankles), another lady I spoke to about this, her son's head was held down the toilet whilst it was flushed at school, several others went through traumatic birth situations. Without exception in my own limited research, some kind of trauma seems to be indicated and I have also wondered if this holds true for a lot of the controversy surrounding the MMR as well as the age at which it is administered (around 1 year old) the child is fully trusting of all around it and not anticipating what must seem like a deliberate infliction of pain by an adult and some of them are simply not able to handle that (I do realise this is hugely simplified because there are also reports of rashes and physical reactions too but that is still stress on their bodies) - which could possibly explain why the studies come back with conflicting results yet the parents involved are adamant that is what the *cause* was. I am very interested to know if this theory holds good with you all too? ie there is a genetic disposition but a traumatic event has possibly been the trigger? If this offends anybody, that is also not my intention, I know sometimes on here topics that come up can upset people. a