Potty Training

May 16, 2001

<<Welcome Kathy !

<a and Kathy , This is good news to share on and .

High 5 to you both on the progress . I believe this will be my sons

(12) , year on his toileting . This will be my goal for him

this summer . We're doing the chart schedule , too . The book you've

mentioned Kathy is an excellent example .

Irma

In @y..., Green a <mashawnag@y...> wrote:

> we still often use a timer for nathan when he needs to

> do his doodee, lol, and let him look at a book, this

> way with his short attention he will sit for at least

> 5 minutes and we occasionally remind to push and he

> gets excited every little pebble,lol. We've been real

> excited, lately a few times nathan has yelled for for

> one of us, usually me, and we go check and he goes

> see, poopoo, so we help him wipe up with his popup

> wipes, those had to be invented by a mom,lol. He is

> getting good, and uses those at school too. shawna.

> --- UrthMan <outerspace@l...> wrote:

> > Hi

> > This is Kathy (my son scott is 11) was not

> > potty trained until he was 10 years old.

> > I had contacted Alta Regional to help me. They sent

> > me a behavior therapist from a school

> > that teaches only autistic children to our home.

> > The therapist would come 1 day a week for

> > 3-4 hours for about 2 months. We worked on

> > communication beside the potty training. We had

> > tried previously to potty train him ourselves and we

> > felt that he was not ready.

> >

> > The therapist told us keep a chart and I gave the

> > school charts as well. We began on a Saturday

> > morning and we had to bring him into the bathroom

> > every 15 minutes. We set an egg timer

> > to go off and he would understand what that meant.

> > Those 15 minutes seemd like 1 by the end

> > of the day, The next day we started out with every

> > 15 minutes and we extended it to 30 minutes

> > and on Monday morning the school had to continue on

> > the same program and in a couple of

> > days after we noticed that he was doing well we

> > extended it to every 1 hour. He never wet

> > his pants at school or outside - it was only when he

> > was at home in his room-where he felt

> > comfortable or sometimes to lazy to get up and go to

> > the bathroom. It has never bothered

> > to have wet pants or soiled pants. He would

> > stay in those pants all day if he could.

> > The chart was helpful in the fact that it showed us

> > his toileting patterns. It seemed that at 4:00 in

> > the afternoon would be the time for his BM and on

> > some days he would have as many as 5 BM's .

> >

> > We then worked out a schedule (from looking at his

> > past charts) and we would encourage him

> > to use the bathroom more during those hours when he

> > seemed to have his accidents. That worked and

> > since then he has done very well. When we started

> > the potty training we also made sure we taught

> > him to wash and dry his hands each and every time.

> > Today he is idependent in that area.

> > I will tell you that one book that we found to be

> > EXCELLENT is " STEPS TO INDEPENDENCE "

> > by Bruce L. Baker. ABC school for autism (they sent

> > the therapist to our home) required you to have

> > this book and learn from it or they would not send

> > the therapist to your house, and that book turned

> > out to be the best book that I have read. It is

> > more than a reading book , it has charts and

> > examples

> > of task-sequencing and how to break each project

> > into small steps. It has many examples of home

> > and school lessons.

> >

> > Good Luck

> > Kathy

> >

> > [Non-text portions of this message have been

> > removed]

> >

> > --------------------------------------------------

> > Checkout our homepage for information,

> > bookmarks, and photos of our kids. Share favorite

> > bookmarks, ideas, and other information by including

> > them. Don't forget, messages are a permanent record

> > of the archives for our list.

> >

> > --------------------------------------------

> >

May 17, 2001

Hi All,

We still have accidents and Zeb is not trained at night.We need stock in the

goodnight co.I find if he is stressed at school the accidents are more

frequent during the day.He does stay dry at school but mostly has his

accidents at home.We have had a few accidents at school but nothing major.I

can put him to bed and five minutes later he is soaked.So much for getting

him up at night to but him on the toilet.He does sleep all night and so do I

and I consider this my trade off at this point. I am afraid to put an alarm

on him for fear that I would scare him and he would be afraid to sleep so for

now I buy the goodnights.

Charlyne

May 17, 2001

, so we help him wipe up with his popup

> wipes, those had to be invented by a mom,lol. He is

> getting good, and uses those at school too. shawna

Hi listmates!

Hello to all the new participants on this list! I laugh

and cry with you all but don't post much. I am the

" other " Gail Mom to Ted (almost 10!) Ted was

taken off of diapers at age 8. We had a lot of accidents,

and still have an occasional one now. We also charted,

back and forth with the school. I was wondering what

popup wipes are? Is this like a tissue box would be?

Thanks,

Gail, mom to 20, 17, and Master Ted! age 9

gboughton@...

May 17, 2001

We get our diapers from the regional center here in California and now that

Brook has been identified through their " institutional deeming " program

apparently he will be getting medi-cal. It is not dependent on income or

other insurance only on the fact that he is deemed institutional. It is based

on Brook's assets or income of which he has none. I still hate that they have

to call it that!! Anyway apparently Medi-cal will either pay for the diapers

directly or the regional center will bill medi-cal, I'm not sure how it

works. The regional center here says they will only pay for 4 diapers a day,

which is ridiculous. I don't even think it's legal for them to do this.

I was wondering if they have this program in other states too for some

of you that have to buy your own diapers. I didn't know about it until last

week myself. You could check into it at your county welfare or Medicaid

office. It has to do with how low functioning your child is, not every client

of the regional center gets this. Anyway maybe some of you would get this

kind of benefit too. I believe they can also help to pay for respite and

dental care and some other services also. I'll find out more once we actually

get approved for it.

Marisa,

Mom to Miles 14, Brook 11, and Genevieve 3 yrs

May 17, 2001

Matt uses the " Goodnights " also. He is dry during the day, but soaks them

at night. He also uses them for BMs. He has very, very good control, but

will only deficate in the " pull up " (We started calling them pull-ups,

and even when we moved in size to ghe goodnights, we still call them pull

ups.) He is just starting to go a little in the toilet, and then

finishing in the pull up.

I agree. We all need stock in this company! They are NOT cheep!

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May 17, 2001

oh im sorry, they are called One-Ups wipes by pampers,

you can find them in most stores. i like to get them

in bulk at walmart, i know our local fareway doesnt

have them though, and ive requested many times, but

the hy-vee does, and pamida does they are cheaper here

than hy-vee,lol and they are right next to

eachother,lol. Anyways you can get regular size or the

big wipes size, and use them as other wipes or open

the upper lid and they come out like kleenexes. These

are excellent for nathan with his horrible FMS he

couldnt get any of the other ones singly out of the

containers using a handful at a time. Naw they arent

attatched wither like those little tub ones oh i hate

those fighting with the container to get them to rip

or come out of that splintered opening. The One-Ups

pampers wipes are in a dark green bolx with purple and

yellow on the front. shawna.

--- gboughton@... wrote:

>

> , so we help him wipe up with his popup

> > wipes, those had to be invented by a mom,lol. He

> is

> > getting good, and uses those at school too. shawna

>

> Hi listmates!

> Hello to all the new participants on this list! I

> laugh

> and cry with you all but don't post much. I am the

> " other " Gail Mom to Ted (almost 10!) Ted was

> taken off of diapers at age 8. We had a lot of

> accidents,

> and still have an occasional one now. We also

> charted,

> back and forth with the school. I was wondering

> what

> popup wipes are? Is this like a tissue box would

> be?

> Thanks,

> Gail, mom to 20, 17, and Master Ted! age

> 9

> gboughton@...

>

> --------------------------------------------------

> Checkout our homepage for information,

> bookmarks, and photos of our kids. Share favorite

> bookmarks, ideas, and other information by including

> them. Don't forget, messages are a permanent record

> of the archives for our list.

>

> --------------------------------------------

>

May 17, 2001

Wow Kathy! Sounds like you got it all! Ummmmm, where do you live? LOL

I'm moving to where ever it is!

Gail

<< Alta regional bought our diapers for years (age 3 - age 10) they have paid

for

behavior therapy twice, music therapy, respite care (which we have not used

for about 7 years) I have also received free help from local colleges.

Sacramento State University has a gymnastics class for the disabled which

has a 1:1. I call the local colleges and find out what type of teaching

classes (spec ed. or not) are being

taught because they need to find placements for the students to get class

credit or hands on training and that type of help comes in very handy when

you need some time

off. Alta regional is now helping with funding so that we can buy a

trike. His regional worker is the best and we just love her because she is

always motivated to find

answers to any of our questions. Our regional center also has a Down

Syndrome workshop every 2 months which have therapists, doctors, dentists,

etc. that will look at your child and help you with anything that you might

need. All of these services is at no cost to the client or their family. >>

May 17, 2001

Hi Marisa,

Alta regional bought our diapers for years (age 3 - age 10) they have paid

for

behavior therapy twice, music therapy, respite care (which we have not used

for about 7 years) I have also received free help from local colleges.

Sacramento State University has a gymnastics class for the disabled which

has a 1:1. I call the local colleges and find out what type of teaching

classes (spec ed. or not) are being

taught because they need to find placements for the students to get class

credit or hands on training and that type of help comes in very handy when

you need some time

off. Alta regional is now helping with funding so that we can buy a

trike. His regional worker is the best and we just love her because she is

always motivated to find

answers to any of our questions. Our regional center also has a Down

Syndrome workshop every 2 months which have therapists, doctors, dentists,

etc. that will look at your child and help you with anything that you might

need. All of these services is at no cost to the client or their family.

Has anyone else in California decided if they would like to meet with each

other. I think it would be lots of fun.. I am willing to travel so

anywhere

is fine with me. All the moms in this group sound like very nice people

with wonderful

families. Thanks, Kathy

Re: Re: Potty Training

> We get our diapers from the regional center here in California and now

that

> Brook has been identified through their " institutional deeming " program

> apparently he will be getting medi-cal. It is not dependent on income or

> other insurance only on the fact that he is deemed institutional. It is

based

> on Brook's assets or income of which he has none. I still hate that they

have

> to call it that!! Anyway apparently Medi-cal will either pay for the

diapers

> directly or the regional center will bill medi-cal, I'm not sure how it

> works. The regional center here says they will only pay for 4 diapers a

day,

> which is ridiculous. I don't even think it's legal for them to do this.

> I was wondering if they have this program in other states too for

some

> of you that have to buy your own diapers. I didn't know about it until

last

> week myself. You could check into it at your county welfare or Medicaid

> office. It has to do with how low functioning your child is, not every

client

> of the regional center gets this. Anyway maybe some of you would get this

> kind of benefit too. I believe they can also help to pay for respite and

> dental care and some other services also. I'll find out more once we

actually

> get approved for it.

> Marisa,

> Mom to Miles 14, Brook 11, and Genevieve 3 yrs

>

May 17, 2001

Thanks

Kathy

Re: Re: Potty Training

> >>Has anyone else in California decided if they would like to meet with

each

> >>other. I think it would be lots of fun.. I am willing to travel so

> >>anywhere

> >>is fine with me.

>

> I think it is tentative for Sept/Oct(cooler tthen) and at Marisa's place

in

> Orinda.

>

> & Garry, parents of (10 ds), (9 ds), JJ (7

> ds/autism/celiac), (6 ds/ADHD/Celiac), and Esther (4 ds). All

adopted.

>

> --------------------------------------------------

> Checkout our homepage for information, bookmarks, and photos

of our kids. Share favorite bookmarks, ideas, and other information by

including them. Don't forget, messages are a permanent record of the

archives for our list.

> --------------------------------------------

>

May 17, 2001

>>Has anyone else in California decided if they would like to meet with each

>>other. I think it would be lots of fun.. I am willing to travel so

>>anywhere

>>is fine with me.

I think it is tentative for Sept/Oct(cooler tthen) and at Marisa's place in

Orinda.

& Garry, parents of (10 ds), (9 ds), JJ (7

ds/autism/celiac), (6 ds/ADHD/Celiac), and Esther (4 ds). All adopted.

May 28, 2001

We are trying to potty train too. The teachers at school suggested that we

let listen to a Walkman with stories and books that he's really

interested in to distract him and give him a chance to go. This keeps him

occupied to sit for more than his usual 2 seconds. LOL

will sign " bathroom " , but only when prompted. At this point the

success we're having is due to our constant 1/2 to hour trips to the

bathroom. He doesn't seem to notice the sensation of urinating or a bowel

movement.

Well, good luck to us all!!!!

Judy

I shall pass this world but once; any good thing therefore I can do, or any

kindness I can show to any human being let me do it now. Let me not defer it

or neglect it, for I shall not pass this way again. -- Grellet

May 28, 2001

Yeah ! JJ .

Great job , . Especially because JJ 's gone through so much ,

medication wise . I know this is a challenge for us all . This is

definitely a job I'll be working with my son this summer .

He's going cold turkey , no pull-ups . Well maybe , during the

nights . Hugs to you and your husband on dealing with more than one

child in being the key to your childrens lives . Good Luck !

Irma , 12 , DS/ASD .

- In @y..., " Scherbert " <Scherb@c...> wrote:

> This is a note I just wrote to JJ's teacher as to his potty

training.

> Thought just maybe it would help another family doing training this

summer.

>

> > Scherbert's Toilet Schedule

> >

> >We use the adult toilet with a minimizer ring(it has a BIG

deflector)

> (e-amil me privately if you need info on this)

> >We started with every hour, then every 1/2 hour.

> >We used cotton underwear, until they are all dirty. Then go to

pull ups.

> >We used LOTS of praise!

> >In preperation we taped the lid up since this is a stim to bang

it.

> >Also put a " toilet " icon on the bathroom door AND on his

conversation

> >board. (Encourages matching. )

> >

> >JJ will bring you the toilet icon and take it with you to the

bathroom. At

> >the door he matches it to the other toilet icon.

> >Help as little as possible to take off underwear.

> >Put him up on toilet

> >Hand over hand-hands on thigh. " Good Boy--good hands on thighs. "

(you may

> >need to help him with this.)

> >I stand with my back to the wall next to the handle so he doesn't

flush

> >continuely. (yet another stim)

> >I put my left knee by him side, this is the way he tries to get

off, so I

> >hold him on long enough. JJ can get off the toilet himself.

> >Tell him to flex him stomach muscle. You can say " Sweese those

tummy

> >muscles " and place his hand about the tummy buttom gentley

applying pressure.

> >When he is done get his feet into undies, and encourage him to

pull them up

> >with as little help as possible.

> >On the way out JJ needs to take the toilet icon and put it on the

> >conversation board where it goes.

> >

> >JJ will go in to the bathroom a lot. For now I am encouraging him

to try

> >everytime. It has been a tiring 3 day week end. But he has had 3

days of

> >BM's on the toilet. And several times he has pee'd.

> >

> >AND Timmy is picking it up too IF he is in cotton undies instead

of

> >pull-ups. School and I think that Essie is ready also. SSSOOOO

by the end

> >of the summer I could have all the kids out of diapers during the

day!!!!

> >I have had kids in diapers for 12 years - and sometimes 4 in

diapers at the

> >same time!!

> >

> >Hope this helps! Just remember--PRAISE, ENCOURAGE, AND PRAISE

SOME MORE.

> >(We have not used food as a reward. In light of his recent 7

pound weight

> >gain lets stay away from that)

> >

>

> & Garry, parents of (10 ds), (9 ds), JJ (7

> ds/autism/celiac), (6 ds/ADHD/Celiac), and Esther (4 ds). All

adopted.

May 28, 2001

Yeah ! JJ .

Great job , . Especially because JJ 's gone through so much ,

medication wise . I know this is a challenge for us all . This is

definitely a job I'll be working with my son this summer .

He's going cold turkey , no pull-ups . Well maybe , during the

nights . Hugs to you and your husband on dealing with more than one

child in being the key to your childrens lives . Good Luck !

Irma , 12 , DS/ASD .

- In @y..., " Scherbert " <Scherb@c...> wrote:

> This is a note I just wrote to JJ's teacher as to his potty

training.

> Thought just maybe it would help another family doing training this

summer.

>

> > Scherbert's Toilet Schedule

> >

> >We use the adult toilet with a minimizer ring(it has a BIG

deflector)

> (e-amil me privately if you need info on this)

> >We started with every hour, then every 1/2 hour.

> >We used cotton underwear, until they are all dirty. Then go to

pull ups.

> >We used LOTS of praise!

> >In preperation we taped the lid up since this is a stim to bang

it.

> >Also put a " toilet " icon on the bathroom door AND on his

conversation

> >board. (Encourages matching. )

> >

> >JJ will bring you the toilet icon and take it with you to the

bathroom. At

> >the door he matches it to the other toilet icon.

> >Help as little as possible to take off underwear.

> >Put him up on toilet

> >Hand over hand-hands on thigh. " Good Boy--good hands on thighs. "

(you may

> >need to help him with this.)

> >I stand with my back to the wall next to the handle so he doesn't

flush

> >continuely. (yet another stim)

> >I put my left knee by him side, this is the way he tries to get

off, so I

> >hold him on long enough. JJ can get off the toilet himself.

> >Tell him to flex him stomach muscle. You can say " Sweese those

tummy

> >muscles " and place his hand about the tummy buttom gentley

applying pressure.

> >When he is done get his feet into undies, and encourage him to

pull them up

> >with as little help as possible.

> >On the way out JJ needs to take the toilet icon and put it on the

> >conversation board where it goes.

> >

> >JJ will go in to the bathroom a lot. For now I am encouraging him

to try

> >everytime. It has been a tiring 3 day week end. But he has had 3

days of

> >BM's on the toilet. And several times he has pee'd.

> >

> >AND Timmy is picking it up too IF he is in cotton undies instead

of

> >pull-ups. School and I think that Essie is ready also. SSSOOOO

by the end

> >of the summer I could have all the kids out of diapers during the

day!!!!

> >I have had kids in diapers for 12 years - and sometimes 4 in

diapers at the

> >same time!!

> >

> >Hope this helps! Just remember--PRAISE, ENCOURAGE, AND PRAISE

SOME MORE.

> >(We have not used food as a reward. In light of his recent 7

pound weight

> >gain lets stay away from that)

> >

>

> & Garry, parents of (10 ds), (9 ds), JJ (7

> ds/autism/celiac), (6 ds/ADHD/Celiac), and Esther (4 ds). All

adopted.

June 14, 2001

Toilet Training Made Semi-Easy

by Kent Moreno

>

The process of teaching a child to use the toilet can be a frustrating

one. This is especially true if the child has a developmental disability.

The protocol listed below has been used successfully, with individuals

with developmental disabilities of all ages.

In addition to the protocol listed below, It can be helpful if a child is

able to observe others using the toilet. This may be something which a

family is not comfortable with or is not appropriate in certain settings.

That's fine.

A major factor in the success of this program is based on the development

of an effective toileting schedule. To determine the right schedule for

the child, data needs to be taken for at least 2-3 days on how often the

child goes to the bathroom. To do this, dry pants checks should be done

every 20- 30 min (20 minutes is preferable). If your lucky, you can find

diapers which have a strip which changes color when the child voids

otherwise, it will be necessary to feel for moisture. Take special care

to write down the times of the day that the child defecates as most people

defecate at approximately the same time each day. This procedure is

called baseline data. Once 2-3 days of data has been gathered, it will

be necessary figure out approximately how often the child goes to the

bathroom. To do this, divide the number of waking minutes by the number

of times the child went to the bathroom.

The toileting schedule can now be set up. As a rule of thumb, the child

should be taken to the bathroom, twice as often as the child's average for

urinating and defecating. So, for example, if the child goes to the

bathroom an average of once an hour, the child would be taken to the

bathroom every 1/2 hour. When setting up the toileting schedule, keep in

mind the times of the day that the child is most likely to defecate and

try to have the toileting schedule occur close to these times.

Prior to taking the child to the bathroom, give the child a cue that it is

time to go to the bathroom. I recommend helping the child to make the

sign for toilet until they can make it independently. Using the sign for

toilet will not stop those children who are verbal from saying " toilet "

and will give the child a way of communicating when they have to go to the

bathroom once they have mastered the toileting procedure thus making a

toileting schedule unnecessary.

It is important that the bathroom be a very fun place. Reserve a couple

of the child's favorite toys or books which they can only have access to

while they are seated on the toilet. Also, music can be very helpful.

Mozart and Rockabilly (e.g. Ray Cyrus) seems to work well.

When having the child sit on the toilet, don't force it. The experience

needs to be a positive one. If the child doesn't want to sit on the

toilet, leave the bathroom and try again at the next scheduled time.

Also, don't have the child sit on the toilet for more than 5-7 minutes.

If the child is going to void in the toilet, they will usually do it

within that time frame. If the child voids in the toilet, make a big deal

out of it, praise the child verbally and tactilly (hugs, pats on the

back...) and give them access to a small very preferred edible reinforcer

(not always necessary). It will be important to reduce the use of the

edible reinforcers as quickly as possible but, in the early stages of

acquiring toileting skills, it will be important to make voiding in the

toilet an extremely momentous and positive experience for the child.

One modification which can be made to the protocol which many times will

increase the child's rate of success at voiding in the toilet is to give

them something to drink 15-20 min prior to the scheduled toileting time.

June 14, 2001

In a message dated 6/14/01 2:56:40 PM Eastern Daylight Time, alessin@...

writes:

> We only have a few short months until school starts

> and are beginning to be desperate.

Relax, your child doesn't need to be potty trained to go to school! We ended

up training Jimmy by putting him on a schedule - sent him into the bathroom

every 45 minutes....then increased it slowly. He wasn't REALLY trained until

he was about 7 - meaning independently identifying when he needs to go and

going himself without being reminded. He still needs help wiping at age

10.....

It'll happen - it just may take awhile!

June 15, 2001

Hi Joe. Potty training can be fun, if you think positively!!!! Our kids

pick up on our own negative vibes and nervousness. had very little

trouble in this area. We kept special toys and treats (cold cereal, mini

marshmallows) in the bathroom and used them solely for bathroom visits. We

started going every hour just to sit for a few minutes, then worked up to

every 90 minutes, etc. When " special things " happened, we would celebrate

like we won the lottery. It was fun and she thought she had done something

fabulous.

Her favorite bathroom activity was to look at catalogs and point to the

people--all little girls were her sister, all men were daddy, women were

mommy, older folks were grandparents,etc. It was a fun activity and she

eventually learned to enjoy that time.

Good luck

Jule, Mom to (30 y/o, ds, deaf, ocd)

June 15, 2001

Hey everyone! I haven't written in a while but I do lurk around now and

again. This issue came up and I couldn't help but ask some advise.

is almost 8 (ds) and still wets at night. About 3 weeks ago I stopped

buying pull ups because everyone (even some of you) have said that their

being wet is the only way to get them to stop using the pull ups. Well, I

have been doing sheets every day for three weeks. He seems totally

unaffected by being wet in the morning and will go and change his clothes and

put the wet things in the washer on his own.

Since I started this, he has had a number of accidents in school, which is

very unusual for him. He even pee'd on the floor and the bathroom at school,

locked himself in and was stamping his feet in the puddle.

So, my question is, should I not be pushing him on the nighttime issue since

he normally has no accidents? Should I give him back the pull ups? Will

this phase pass too??

Behavior lately is another area of great difficulty for us. We were doing so

well but that is another topic. Your thoughts on this would be greatly

appreciated.

Dawn

June 15, 2001

Hi Dawn. What types of medicine is on? Many times the side effects of

medicines, or the mixtures of meds, will cause this. 's doctor told me

that was not the case, but 's sister , who is a nurse, said it was.

We changed 's meds, and it stopped being a problem.

Jule, Mom to 30y/o

June 15, 2001

Thanks for that Kent but one thing surprised me.........

Also, music can be very helpful.Mozart and Rockabilly (e.g. Ray Cyrus)

seems to work well.

I thought you would say the Grateful Dead....lol

Di

August 22, 2001