Re: Androgel vs. Copounded T Gels

[Guest guest]

Wolverfan,

I was on compounded T-gel before AndroGel (AG) was approved. I tried

10%...only brought T-level up to ~350....I wanted higher....10% if

highest concentration that a gel can hold....so I did 2x/dy

application of 10% T-gel...brought T up 530 (200-1000) and Free T of

25 (19-26)...tests on blood draw in uro's office. That was still

not high enough...so I'm on AG 10G/dy (5G applied 2x/dy) gives me T

levels...

12-5-01 - 29 dy 3-11-02 - 96 dy

Tests Serum 750 704 (241- 827)

%Free & Weak 47.7 37.6 (18.3 - 62.3)

F & W bound 357.7 264.7 (66.6 - 276.3)

Estradiol* 50 16 (0-54)

Estrogen* 124 44 (40 - 115)

T/E2 ratio 15 44

*1 mg Arimidex/dy for management

Compounded T-gel is considered generic so my insurance coppay was

$10/mo. AG is brand name and I pay $25/mo for two boxes AG.

T injections are actually less expensive...my copay for 10 ml Depo

Testosterone was $25 and I was injecting 100 mg/wk so a vial would

last me 10 wks. Injections raised my Free T too high...total/free T

8th day after last injection as determined on two different

occasions...

June 4th

Testosterone, total 989 (241-827)

free 42.0 (6.6 - 18.1)

July 9th 774

38.8

Someone commented that it's free T that's so readily converted to

estrogen...By Aug 2nd by estrogen was 198 (40-115) and estradiol 87

(<54)...that's when I went on Arimidex. Chry/Dim was ineffective

for me. I began AG ~1st of November.

Just my experiences,

OR eon

> I am not on androgel but I know many on this board are. I am

> wondering why so many people do not investigate using compounded T

> gels as opposed to just Androgel. It is my understanding that

> compounded T gels are less expensive, can be made with different

> bases, and the amount of T delivery or percentage can be fine tuned.

>

> For those that get an allergic reaction to the androgel, maybe a T

> gel made from say, an aloe vera base would be less reactionary.

> I am interested in your feedback.

[Guest guest]

" I am wondering why so many people do not investigate using

compounded T gels as opposed to just Androgel. "

I agree with OReon. I tried a compounded mixture in which 1ml had 25mg

of chrysin and 50mg of testosterone. I used it once a day and 5 hours

after putting it on my T level was only 200 (this was after using it

for 3 weeks without any other source of T)! Apparently it's absorbed

all at once and disappears quickly. Androgel delivers the T over a

longer period of time. My insurance wouldn't cover the compounded

gel, and I'd probably need to apply alot of it several times a day, so

I don't think I'll continue using it.

Since 5gm of Androgel only raised me to 300, I don't like that either

because I'd probably have to apply alot of it twice a day; not to

mention my estradiol was high.

No, I'm going back to shots if the HCG I'm trying doesn't work.

[Guest guest]

" I am wondering why so many people do not investigate using

compounded T gels as opposed to just Androgel. "

I agree with OReon. I tried a compounded mixture in which 1ml had 25mg

of chrysin and 50mg of testosterone. I used it once a day and 5 hours

after putting it on my T level was only 200 (this was after using it

for 3 weeks without any other source of T)! Apparently it's absorbed

all at once and disappears quickly. Androgel delivers the T over a

longer period of time. My insurance wouldn't cover the compounded

gel, and I'd probably need to apply alot of it several times a day, so

I don't think I'll continue using it.

Since 5gm of Androgel only raised me to 300, I don't like that either

because I'd probably have to apply alot of it twice a day; not to

mention my estradiol was high.

No, I'm going back to shots if the HCG I'm trying doesn't work.

[Guest guest]

Ybeslow180,

Actually I like the injections....just inject once a week and be

done with it.

But now I'm glad that I'm not on injections, as apparently there's

backorder of Depo-testosterone according to my pharmacy that I

checked with today. And that's being discussed at ASI-NG.

Someone posted source of compounded DepoTestosterone....that might be

a possibility now that Arimidex controls my Es so well!..

Hope HCG works out well for you!

OR eon

> " I am wondering why so many people do not investigate using

> compounded T gels as opposed to just Androgel. "

>

> I agree with OReon. I tried a compounded mixture in which 1ml had

25mg

> of chrysin and 50mg of testosterone. I used it once a day and 5

hours

> after putting it on my T level was only 200 (this was after using

it

> for 3 weeks without any other source of T)! Apparently it's

absorbed

> all at once and disappears quickly. Androgel delivers the T over a

> longer period of time. My insurance wouldn't cover the compounded

> gel, and I'd probably need to apply alot of it several times a day,

so

> I don't think I'll continue using it.

>

> Since 5gm of Androgel only raised me to 300, I don't like that

either

> because I'd probably have to apply alot of it twice a day; not to

> mention my estradiol was high.

>

> No, I'm going back to shots if the HCG I'm trying doesn't work.

[Guest guest]

Hi:

I am experienced with using compounded TRT (14 months), have a

terrific pharmacist (compounding pharmacy) in Canada, and I would

strongly recommend this option for list members who are able to gain

their doctor's support for going this route rather than AndroGel.

Over the year, as I have gained fresh blood test results and discussed

them with my doctor, I have in turn been able to consult with her for

advice on how to optimize the benefits of the TRT, including the most

helpful base to use. She also believes that the compounding creme may

be more effectively absorbed by the body--about that, I'm not sure,

but hope to know more after a fresh series of blood tests next week.

Yes, the cost is far less than for AndroGel. My typical month's

supply of compounding creme is about $35 U.S. ($52 Cdn), and I have

heard that AndroGel can run up to $150/month. My health insurance in

Canada has covered my creme, but I'm not sure how many plans in the

U.S. cover topical cremes of any type (I'm from the U.S. originally,

but haven't used an American health plan since the late 1990s).

By the way, for those of you who are interested in Dr. Shippen's

work, my pharmacist attended a workshop he presented last year in the

States and I now have an extensive set of notes she provided me from

his session. If you are able to handle an attachment in rich text

format, you can drop me a note and I will send you a copy. Just keep

in mind, these are notes, not a published document. But they contain

suggestions on various avenues for assessing and treating

hypodonadism, as well as some interesting case studies.

My e-mail address is skerlin@...

Kerlin, Ph.D.

Manager, DES Sons' Discussion Network:

des-sons

> I am not on androgel but I know many on this board are. I am

> wondering why so many people do not investigate using compounded T

> gels as opposed to just Androgel. It is my understanding that

> compounded T gels are less expensive, can be made with different

> bases, and the amount of T delivery or percentage can be fine tuned.

>

> For those that get an allergic reaction to the androgel, maybe a T

> gel made from say, an aloe vera base would be less reactionary.

> I am interested in your feedback.

[Guest guest]

O.K. Thanks for the feedback you guy's. That help's me understand a

little more about gel and cream T deliveries.

> > I am not on androgel but I know many on this board are. I am

> > wondering why so many people do not investigate using compounded

T

> > gels as opposed to just Androgel. It is my understanding that

> > compounded T gels are less expensive, can be made with different

> > bases, and the amount of T delivery or percentage can be fine

tuned.

> >

> > For those that get an allergic reaction to the androgel, maybe a

T

> > gel made from say, an aloe vera base would be less reactionary.

> > I am interested in your feedback.

[Guest guest]

" I am experienced with using compounded TRT (14 months), have a

terrific pharmacist (compounding pharmacy) in Canada.... "

I'm curious what your total and free T and estrogen/estradiol levels

are. Also, what concentration/amount of T creme do you use and how

often? My T levels drop of quickly during the day on it.