Re: anchors vs. vertical lifts

[Guest guest]

e:

Hi. I want to thank you for being a friend to me through my ordeal and upcoming surgery. If there is anything I can do for you, please just ask!

Hugs,

-Marie

[Guest guest]

No, my plastic surgeon called anchor mastopexies "outdated"--not just for me but as a whole generally speaking. As for reductions for super sized breast--that I don't know.

[Guest guest]

:

You're correct, I do not question your technique--how you practice medicine is your business. I'm stating what my doc said. He's different from you--PS vary in their philosophy and technique. As Martha says, beauty is in the eye of the beholder and artists do things differently.

LM

[Guest guest]

,

I don't know about that donut thing--I'll ask him.

LM

[Guest guest]

: From your posts you appear to be very angry. This board is to give people information about explants and needs to retain a positive and helpful tone and I am trying to explain why we use different techniques for different circumstances. I am sorry that you choose to attack my statements but I am sure that there are more effective means for you to deal with this anger. I just spent 7 hours putting back together a face after a motorcycle accident in a patient with no eyelids and his eye in danger. He is in the ICU in critcal condition so this conversation seems particularly unimportant. If you wish to debate me please have the courtesy to check out the references that I gave you. .

-----Original Message-----From: perlesetlacet@... [mailto:perlesetlacet@...]Sent: Monday, October 07, 2002 4:30 PM Subject: Re: anchors vs. vertical lifts:I think you need to tell Dr. Feng she has a lot to learn........not.My doc did do ONE anchor lift in five years--it's because the patient wanted it. I suppose with everything in life there is an EXCEPTION or TWO. Geez, I thought we were speaking in general. All I know is if I know that a doc who uses the anchor technique and outtie stitches on the breasts as a normal part of his/her practice, I'd run in the other direction! I went to a looser of a PS once--shame on him, for me to go to another doc like him again--shame on me.LM

[Guest guest]

: I agree that the anchor pattern is rarely needed. I state I have only done it twice in 10 years. I even consider it dangerous in regards to tissue loss. But to say it is never indicated is not correct. I believe your surgeon and Feng would agree that there are certain times it is the only technique that will work. One example which is very simple is the patient with a long submammary scar that is preexisting and horizontal skin excess called pseudoptosis. You and should want accurate information on this board if it is to be credible. .

-----Original Message-----From: perlesetlacet@... [mailto:perlesetlacet@...]Sent: Monday, October 07, 2002 4:15 PM Subject: Re: anchors vs. vertical lifts:Yes, the vertical scar one typically notices first but with an anchor cut, the long scar under the breast looks worse--in my opinion. I can see this scar in my cleavage and sides--it sux. Believe me when I tell you, having this *anchor job* is not pleasing. It's too late for me -- what's done is done -- but if other women can avoid this happening to them, it makes it worth it for me to speak up.Take care,LM

[Guest guest]

: I agree with Feng that for you an anchor pattern is unnessary but think of the few patients who might need this approach and are reading the information on this board. .

-----Original Message-----From: Heer [mailto:idagirl@...]Sent: Monday, October 07, 2002 12:29 PM Subject: Re: anchors vs. vertical lifts

That was what she said, but she may have meant never with someone like me, with my type issues, ya know what I mean? Maybe she said it is unnecessary, not sure I just know she told me that it does not need to be done. I asked her why some women get scars (like patty did( in the crease with explant and she just said that it is not necessary and that she has great success with vertical lifts.

----- Original Message -----

From: Dr. Kolb

Sent: Monday, October 07, 2002 10:06 AM

Subject: RE: anchors vs. vertical lifts

: Are you sure she never? As I said earlier this is a mathematical formula and in some rare (ie two times in 10 years) I have had to use an anchor. Most plastic surgeons would not say never. .

-----Original Message-----From: Heer [mailto:idagirl@...]Sent: Monday, October 07, 2002 9:26 AM Subject: Re: anchors vs. vertical lifts

Actually if you ever have visited explantation.com there are a ton of ladies who have had the same experience as me, that is that the scar from the vertical lift fades the best, the nipple scars are often the only thing one can really see after healing is done. Anyhow I don't see the point in arguing. Most women who got implants in the first place have little to no breast tissue, so a crease incision is not really hidden once they are explanted and lifted, because at least most of us end up very small. I know that if I had crease incisions they would show, because I don't have enough breast tissue to hang over them, imparticularly when I lift up my arms or lay down on the bed, etc. These would be times when the crease scar would show. I cannot of course say for sure if they would have healed as well as my vertical scar or not, if they would have, then I guess they also would not show, but as Patty has stated, her vertical scar is invisible, her crease scars are red and obvious. Why would one part of her body scar more than another part? Was this because of the surgeon or just the placement of the scar of what? I do not have an answer for this. If she was to try to get a revision would she end up with smaller breasts too?

I think also that with an anchor lift you are adding another incision, so why do it unless it is really needed? As Dr Feng herself told me, there is no reason usually EVER to use an anchor lift. Those were her exact words to me, when I was there in December of 1999. So i am only going by what I was told by my Dr.

C

----- Original Message -----

From: Dr. Kolb

Sent: Monday, October 07, 2002 5:57 AM

Subject: RE: anchors vs. vertical lifts

The vertical scars are usually the most obvious in postop photos as the periareolar and fold incisions are often hidden. You may be the exception , but I am talking about what is true for the majority of patients. .

-----Original Message-----From: Heer [mailto:idagirl@...]Sent: Sunday, October 06, 2002 8:38 PM Subject: Re: anchors vs. vertical lifts

That is really funny that you say that as all the women I know(tons) have had vertical scars and love them. I for one cannot even find mine any more. Now the ones around the nipple I can find and if I had any in the crease they would show since my breasts are so small

----- Original Message -----

From: Dr. Kolb

Sent: Saturday, October 05, 2002 5:54 PM

Subject: RE: anchors vs. vertical lifts

I am referring to mastopexies. There is an article in the last PRS journal from Chile describing when one need to convert a donut to a verticle and a verticle to an anchor. Look at it and it will be clear what I am talking about. Constricted breast and pseudoptosis also need to be corrected often with a scar in the fold which is usually very well hidden. It is usually the verticle scar that patient's don't like. .

-----Original Message-----From: perlesetlacet@... [mailto:perlesetlacet@...]Sent: Saturday, October 05, 2002 3:50 PM Subject: Re: anchors vs. vertical lifts:Are you referring to extra large breasted women having reductions or simply a lift? I saw his photos of women with D size breasts with a vertical lift and they look perky and good.What plastic surgery book do you recommend I look at? Any with a current 2001+ date on them? I'll have to ask my PS about this.Thanks. Take care.-Marie

[Guest guest]

e: I was not disagreeing with anything that or -Marie said but with what they stated that their plastic surgeons said. Both have admitted that the plastic surgeons may have been addressing their particular cases. This is my whole point that blanket statements are not always true. You should feel better now as I detected that you have been annoyed by some of my posts. Why not reply to my questions regarding your sutures and allergies instead of fighting. .

-----Original Message-----From: e Rene [mailto:e_Rene@...]Sent: Tuesday, October 08, 2002 12:18 AM Subject: Re: anchors vs. vertical lifts

Dr. Kolb,

While I run the risk of ruffling some feathers here, I will speak my mind anyway, just as you have chosen to do as indicated in your previous 3 emails. So, for anyone who does not want to engage in an "open forum," then delete this email now.

First of all, I take offense to the way you have addressed -Marie and . Both of these women, as does EVERYONE in this group, provide excellent information in different ways, shapes, and forms. Some women have more knowledge in certains areas than others. Because of this, we all complement one another and we all attempt to help women sort through various issues, whether it be the BI issue or something else.

However, just because you are a MD, does not mean you know more than anyone else or everyone else in this group. Yes, you are a MD, and obviously, you have medical knowledge that goes beyond all of ours. But that doesn't make what you have to say 100% correct, all the time, everytime. You may choose to practice medicine one way, but that doesn't mean that it is the only way. And while you may not agree with certain techniques used in plastic surgery by other physicians, there are physicians out there who do things the way they do for various reasons. And just because you cite medical journal articles doesn't mean that that is the way it should be. As you well know, most of the studies/case studies published are those that are supported in the form of grants by a drug company or medical device manufacturer, medical school, or teaching institution. Teaching institutions and medical schools are in turn funded by drug companies or medical device companies. Many of these studies are flawed, and results are not printed (or are selectively withheld) to ensure that the study gets published, and as a result, many studies are corrupt. So, what I'm trying to say is that just because something is printed in a medical journal doesn't make it the "right way."

I also have to add that I feel that your statement to -Marie "if you give me his phone #, I will call him and ask him" [about external sutures and anchor pattern mastopexies] is rather immature. What does it matter? You perform your surgeries the way you are comfortable with, and let the rest of the plastic surgeons in this country practice the way they are comfortable with. I also feel that your statement addressed to both and -Marie "you and should want accurate info on this board if it is to be credible" is also demeaning and uncalled for. No one is providing anyone with incorrect information. Trust me, if there is grossly incorrect information, or misinformation, there are those of us in this group who will speak up, me being one of them. I think that everyone strives to provide the most accurate, up to date information we can, and when in doubt, we seek help and info from others, yourself included. But I strongly think that overall, we, as a group, minus your medical expetise, do very well. I may not be a MD, but I am a RN with a Bachelors Degree, completed 2 yrs of med school, and have training as a legal nurse consultant. So, I'd say that I'm a pretty well educated, intelligent, woman, who has, unfortunately, been forced into the role of being a pt one too many times. Hence, I know what it's like to be on both sides of the coin and can empathize with these women.

This group is a support group. It is about being able to voice your concerns, fears, frustrations, problems and whatever else you need to bounce off people. And it is a place that we should feel "safe." We should not fear recrimination or backlash. So, for -Marie to voice her opinions regarding mastopexies is her right. She is not defaming anyone, she is not demeaning anyone, she is not hurting anyone. She is stating her opinion, and while you, and others, may not agree, she is entitled to speak her mind. Perhaps if you don't like her questioning you or your techniques, then maybe you should learn how to redirect your insecurities.

With all due respect,

e

----- Original Message -----

From: Dr. Kolb

Sent: Monday, October 07, 2002 8:33 PM

Subject: RE: anchors vs. vertical lifts

: From your posts you appear to be very angry. This board is to give people information about explants and needs to retain a positive and helpful tone and I am trying to explain why we use different techniques for different circumstances. I am sorry that you choose to attack my statements but I am sure that there are more effective means for you to deal with this anger. I just spent 7 hours putting back together a face after a motorcycle accident in a patient with no eyelids and his eye in danger. He is in the ICU in critcal condition so this conversation seems particularly unimportant. If you wish to debate me please have the courtesy to check out the references that I gave you. .

-----Original Message-----From: perlesetlacet@... [mailto:perlesetlacet@...]Sent: Monday, October 07, 2002 4:30 PM Subject: Re: anchors vs. vertical lifts:I think you need to tell Dr. Feng she has a lot to learn........not.My doc did do ONE anchor lift in five years--it's because the patient wanted it. I suppose with everything in life there is an EXCEPTION or TWO. Geez, I thought we were speaking in general. All I know is if I know that a doc who uses the anchor technique and outtie stitches on the breasts as a normal part of his/her practice, I'd run in the other direction! I went to a looser of a PS once--shame on him, for me to go to another doc like him again--shame on me.LM

[Guest guest]

I sited the journal because I was asked to. Please rereview the post. My problem is that I am damned if I do and damned if I don't. Some of the people on this board appear to have issues with doctors in general and it colors their judgement in my opinion. The two articles I listed show the scientific principles used to determine which kind of mastopexy is needed. I found them interesting and shared them with the group. You attack the scientific paradigm in general. Why? .

-----Original Message-----From: e Rene [mailto:e_Rene@...]Sent: Tuesday, October 08, 2002 12:18 AM Subject: Re: anchors vs. vertical lifts

Dr. Kolb,

While I run the risk of ruffling some feathers here, I will speak my mind anyway, just as you have chosen to do as indicated in your previous 3 emails. So, for anyone who does not want to engage in an "open forum," then delete this email now.

First of all, I take offense to the way you have addressed -Marie and . Both of these women, as does EVERYONE in this group, provide excellent information in different ways, shapes, and forms. Some women have more knowledge in certains areas than others. Because of this, we all complement one another and we all attempt to help women sort through various issues, whether it be the BI issue or something else.

However, just because you are a MD, does not mean you know more than anyone else or everyone else in this group. Yes, you are a MD, and obviously, you have medical knowledge that goes beyond all of ours. But that doesn't make what you have to say 100% correct, all the time, everytime. You may choose to practice medicine one way, but that doesn't mean that it is the only way. And while you may not agree with certain techniques used in plastic surgery by other physicians, there are physicians out there who do things the way they do for various reasons. And just because you cite medical journal articles doesn't mean that that is the way it should be. As you well know, most of the studies/case studies published are those that are supported in the form of grants by a drug company or medical device manufacturer, medical school, or teaching institution. Teaching institutions and medical schools are in turn funded by drug companies or medical device companies. Many of these studies are flawed, and results are not printed (or are selectively withheld) to ensure that the study gets published, and as a result, many studies are corrupt. So, what I'm trying to say is that just because something is printed in a medical journal doesn't make it the "right way."

I also have to add that I feel that your statement to -Marie "if you give me his phone #, I will call him and ask him" [about external sutures and anchor pattern mastopexies] is rather immature. What does it matter? You perform your surgeries the way you are comfortable with, and let the rest of the plastic surgeons in this country practice the way they are comfortable with. I also feel that your statement addressed to both and -Marie "you and should want accurate info on this board if it is to be credible" is also demeaning and uncalled for. No one is providing anyone with incorrect information. Trust me, if there is grossly incorrect information, or misinformation, there are those of us in this group who will speak up, me being one of them. I think that everyone strives to provide the most accurate, up to date information we can, and when in doubt, we seek help and info from others, yourself included. But I strongly think that overall, we, as a group, minus your medical expetise, do very well. I may not be a MD, but I am a RN with a Bachelors Degree, completed 2 yrs of med school, and have training as a legal nurse consultant. So, I'd say that I'm a pretty well educated, intelligent, woman, who has, unfortunately, been forced into the role of being a pt one too many times. Hence, I know what it's like to be on both sides of the coin and can empathize with these women.

This group is a support group. It is about being able to voice your concerns, fears, frustrations, problems and whatever else you need to bounce off people. And it is a place that we should feel "safe." We should not fear recrimination or backlash. So, for -Marie to voice her opinions regarding mastopexies is her right. She is not defaming anyone, she is not demeaning anyone, she is not hurting anyone. She is stating her opinion, and while you, and others, may not agree, she is entitled to speak her mind. Perhaps if you don't like her questioning you or your techniques, then maybe you should learn how to redirect your insecurities.

With all due respect,

e

----- Original Message -----

From: Dr. Kolb

Sent: Monday, October 07, 2002 8:33 PM

Subject: RE: anchors vs. vertical lifts

: From your posts you appear to be very angry. This board is to give people information about explants and needs to retain a positive and helpful tone and I am trying to explain why we use different techniques for different circumstances. I am sorry that you choose to attack my statements but I am sure that there are more effective means for you to deal with this anger. I just spent 7 hours putting back together a face after a motorcycle accident in a patient with no eyelids and his eye in danger. He is in the ICU in critcal condition so this conversation seems particularly unimportant. If you wish to debate me please have the courtesy to check out the references that I gave you. .

-----Original Message-----From: perlesetlacet@... [mailto:perlesetlacet@...]Sent: Monday, October 07, 2002 4:30 PM Subject: Re: anchors vs. vertical lifts:I think you need to tell Dr. Feng she has a lot to learn........not.My doc did do ONE anchor lift in five years--it's because the patient wanted it. I suppose with everything in life there is an EXCEPTION or TWO. Geez, I thought we were speaking in general. All I know is if I know that a doc who uses the anchor technique and outtie stitches on the breasts as a normal part of his/her practice, I'd run in the other direction! I went to a looser of a PS once--shame on him, for me to go to another doc like him again--shame on me.LM

[Guest guest]

Dr. Kolb, While I run the risk of ruffling some feathers here, I will speak my mind anyway, just as you have chosen to do as indicated in your previous 3 emails. So, for anyone who does not want to engage in an "open forum," then delete this email now. First of all, I take offense to the way you have addressed -Marie and . Both of these women, as does EVERYONE in this group, provide excellent information in different ways, shapes, and forms. Some women have more knowledge in certains areas than others. Because of this, we all complement one another and we all attempt to help women sort through various issues, whether it be the BI issue or something else. However, just because you are a MD, does not mean you know more than anyone else or everyone else in this group. Yes, you are a MD, and obviously, you have medical knowledge that goes beyond all of ours. But that doesn't make what you have to say 100% correct, all the time, everytime. You may choose to practice medicine one way, but that doesn't mean that it is the only way. And while you may not agree with certain techniques used in plastic surgery by other physicians, there are physicians out there who do things the way they do for various reasons. And just because you cite medical journal articles doesn't mean that that is the way it should be. As you well know, most of the studies/case studies published are those that are supported in the form of grants by a drug company or medical device manufacturer, medical school, or teaching institution. Teaching institutions and medical schools are in turn funded by drug companies or medical device companies. Many of these studies are flawed, and results are not printed (or are selectively withheld) to ensure that the study gets published, and as a result, many studies are corrupt. So, what I'm trying to say is that just because something is printed in a medical journal doesn't make it the "right way." I also have to add that I feel that your statement to -Marie "if you give me his phone #, I will call him and ask him" [about external sutures and anchor pattern mastopexies] is rather immature. What does it matter? You perform your surgeries the way you are comfortable with, and let the rest of the plastic surgeons in this country practice the way they are comfortable with. I also feel that your statement addressed to both and -Marie "you and should want accurate info on this board if it is to be credible" is also demeaning and uncalled for. No one is providing anyone with incorrect information. Trust me, if there is grossly incorrect information, or misinformation, there are those of us in this group who will speak up, me being one of them. I think that everyone strives to provide the most accurate, up to date information we can, and when in doubt, we seek help and info from others, yourself included. But I strongly think that overall, we, as a group, minus your medical expetise, do very well. I may not be a MD, but I am a RN with a Bachelors Degree, completed 2 yrs of med school, and have training as a legal nurse consultant. So, I'd say that I'm a pretty well educated, intelligent, woman, who has, unfortunately, been forced into the role of being a pt one too many times. Hence, I know what it's like to be on both sides of the coin and can empathize with these women. This group is a support group. It is about being able to voice your concerns, fears, frustrations, problems and whatever else you need to bounce off people. And it is a place that we should feel "safe." We should not fear recrimination or backlash. So, for -Marie to voice her opinions regarding mastopexies is her right. She is not defaming anyone, she is not demeaning anyone, she is not hurting anyone. She is stating her opinion, and while you, and others, may not agree, she is entitled to speak her mind. Perhaps if you don't like her questioning you or your techniques, then maybe you should learn how to redirect your insecurities. With all due respect, e ----- Original Message ----- From: Dr. Kolb Sent: Monday, October 07, 2002 8:33 PM Subject: RE: anchors vs. vertical lifts : From your posts you appear to be very angry. This board is to give people information about explants and needs to retain a positive and helpful tone and I am trying to explain why we use different techniques for different circumstances. I am sorry that you choose to attack my statements but I am sure that there are more effective means for you to deal with this anger. I just spent 7 hours putting back together a face after a motorcycle accident in a patient with no eyelids and his eye in danger. He is in the ICU in critcal condition so this conversation seems particularly unimportant. If you wish to debate me please have the courtesy to check out the references that I gave you. . -----Original Message-----From: perlesetlacet@... [mailto:perlesetlacet@...]Sent: Monday, October 07, 2002 4:30 PM Subject: Re: anchors vs. vertical lifts:I think you need to tell Dr. Feng she has a lot to learn........not.My doc did do ONE anchor lift in five years--it's because the patient wanted it. I suppose with everything in life there is an EXCEPTION or TWO. Geez, I thought we were speaking in general. All I know is if I know that a doc who uses the anchor technique and outtie stitches on the breasts as a normal part of his/her practice, I'd run in the other direction! I went to a looser of a PS once--shame on him, for me to go to another doc like him again--shame on me.LM

[Guest guest]

Dr. Kolb, You are the one being immature. I have replied to your posts about sutures. Who else would I address those posts to? All of my responses to the suture controversy have been in response to your emails--and all include your previous email in my response. Because I don't have my op notes from my explant, I have emailed Dr. Huang to ask her what she used, and in addition, I have emailed several doctors what they would do with a pt who had multiple allergies to meds as well as sutures, and how they would treat this pt as far as sutures go. So, as soon as I get their responses, I will let you know. I will also let you know the reasoning behind my neurosurgeon's decision to use subcuticular sutures when I talk to him this wk, and why he chose to go that route instead of using dissolvable sutures. e ----- Original Message ----- From: Dr. Kolb Sent: Monday, October 07, 2002 10:00 PM Subject: RE: anchors vs. vertical lifts e: I was not disagreeing with anything that or -Marie said but with what they stated that their plastic surgeons said. Both have admitted that the plastic surgeons may have been addressing their particular cases. This is my whole point that blanket statements are not always true. You should feel better now as I detected that you have been annoyed by some of my posts. Why not reply to my questions regarding your sutures and allergies instead of fighting. . -----Original Message-----From: e Rene [mailto:e_Rene@...]Sent: Tuesday, October 08, 2002 12:18 AM Subject: Re: anchors vs. vertical lifts Dr. Kolb, While I run the risk of ruffling some feathers here, I will speak my mind anyway, just as you have chosen to do as indicated in your previous 3 emails. So, for anyone who does not want to engage in an "open forum," then delete this email now. First of all, I take offense to the way you have addressed -Marie and . Both of these women, as does EVERYONE in this group, provide excellent information in different ways, shapes, and forms. Some women have more knowledge in certains areas than others. Because of this, we all complement one another and we all attempt to help women sort through various issues, whether it be the BI issue or something else. However, just because you are a MD, does not mean you know more than anyone else or everyone else in this group. Yes, you are a MD, and obviously, you have medical knowledge that goes beyond all of ours. But that doesn't make what you have to say 100% correct, all the time, everytime. You may choose to practice medicine one way, but that doesn't mean that it is the only way. And while you may not agree with certain techniques used in plastic surgery by other physicians, there are physicians out there who do things the way they do for various reasons. And just because you cite medical journal articles doesn't mean that that is the way it should be. As you well know, most of the studies/case studies published are those that are supported in the form of grants by a drug company or medical device manufacturer, medical school, or teaching institution. Teaching institutions and medical schools are in turn funded by drug companies or medical device companies. Many of these studies are flawed, and results are not printed (or are selectively withheld) to ensure that the study gets published, and as a result, many studies are corrupt. So, what I'm trying to say is that just because something is printed in a medical journal doesn't make it the "right way." I also have to add that I feel that your statement to -Marie "if you give me his phone #, I will call him and ask him" [about external sutures and anchor pattern mastopexies] is rather immature. What does it matter? You perform your surgeries the way you are comfortable with, and let the rest of the plastic surgeons in this country practice the way they are comfortable with. I also feel that your statement addressed to both and -Marie "you and should want accurate info on this board if it is to be credible" is also demeaning and uncalled for. No one is providing anyone with incorrect information. Trust me, if there is grossly incorrect information, or misinformation, there are those of us in this group who will speak up, me being one of them. I think that everyone strives to provide the most accurate, up to date information we can, and when in doubt, we seek help and info from others, yourself included. But I strongly think that overall, we, as a group, minus your medical expetise, do very well. I may not be a MD, but I am a RN with a Bachelors Degree, completed 2 yrs of med school, and have training as a legal nurse consultant. So, I'd say that I'm a pretty well educated, intelligent, woman, who has, unfortunately, been forced into the role of being a pt one too many times. Hence, I know what it's like to be on both sides of the coin and can empathize with these women. This group is a support group. It is about being able to voice your concerns, fears, frustrations, problems and whatever else you need to bounce off people. And it is a place that we should feel "safe." We should not fear recrimination or backlash. So, for -Marie to voice her opinions regarding mastopexies is her right. She is not defaming anyone, she is not demeaning anyone, she is not hurting anyone. She is stating her opinion, and while you, and others, may not agree, she is entitled to speak her mind. Perhaps if you don't like her questioning you or your techniques, then maybe you should learn how to redirect your insecurities. With all due respect, e ----- Original Message ----- From: Dr. Kolb Sent: Monday, October 07, 2002 8:33 PM Subject: RE: anchors vs. vertical lifts : From your posts you appear to be very angry. This board is to give people information about explants and needs to retain a positive and helpful tone and I am trying to explain why we use different techniques for different circumstances. I am sorry that you choose to attack my statements but I am sure that there are more effective means for you to deal with this anger. I just spent 7 hours putting back together a face after a motorcycle accident in a patient with no eyelids and his eye in danger. He is in the ICU in critcal condition so this conversation seems particularly unimportant. If you wish to debate me please have the courtesy to check out the references that I gave you. . -----Original Message-----From: perlesetlacet@... [mailto:perlesetlacet@...]Sent: Monday, October 07, 2002 4:30 PM Subject: Re: anchors vs. vertical lifts:I think you need to tell Dr. Feng she has a lot to learn........not.My doc did do ONE anchor lift in five years--it's because the patient wanted it. I suppose with everything in life there is an EXCEPTION or TWO. Geez, I thought we were speaking in general. All I know is if I know that a doc who uses the anchor technique and outtie stitches on the breasts as a normal part of his/her practice, I'd run in the other direction! I went to a looser of a PS once--shame on him, for me to go to another doc like him again--shame on me.LM

[Guest guest]

From what you have stated, his techniques may not be that different from mine except I sometimes use a few external suture in addition to two internal layers that are removed in 4 to 7 days depending on how far the patient has to travel. Does he do periareolar donuts or only use the verticoal mastopexy? .

-----Original Message-----From: perlesetlacet@... [mailto:perlesetlacet@...]Sent: Tuesday, October 08, 2002 1:48 AM Subject: Re: anchors vs. vertical lifts:You're correct, I do not question your technique--how you practice medicine is your business. I'm stating what my doc said. He's different from you--PS vary in their philosophy and technique. As Martha says, beauty is in the eye of the beholder and artists do things differently. LM

[Guest guest]

-----Original Message-----[Dr. Kolb] I perfer the anchor pattern for most reductions for two reasons. Most of the abnormal cancer prone tissue can be removed with this technique instead and the vertical technique and function of being able to breast feed in also better preserved which I feel is important for the baby's immune system. I have one reduction with an 8 year follow-up. She came in which breast feeding her second child. This is an important aspect that men can forget for some reason. . From: perlesetlacet@... [mailto:perlesetlacet@...]Sent: Tuesday, October 08, 2002 1:42 AM Subject: Re: anchors vs. vertical lifts

No, my plastic surgeon called anchor mastopexies "outdated"--not just for me but as a whole generally speaking. As for reductions for super sized breast--that I don't know.

[Guest guest]

At the time I responded to your post I had not read the post about the sutures. Was your neck scar horizontal or vertical? .

-----Original Message-----From: e Rene [mailto:e_Rene@...]Sent: Tuesday, October 08, 2002 1:22 AM Subject: Re: anchors vs. vertical lifts

Dr. Kolb,

You are the one being immature. I have replied to your posts about sutures. Who else would I address those posts to? All of my responses to the suture controversy have been in response to your emails--and all include your previous email in my response. Because I don't have my op notes from my explant, I have emailed Dr. Huang to ask her what she used, and in addition, I have emailed several doctors what they would do with a pt who had multiple allergies to meds as well as sutures, and how they would treat this pt as far as sutures go. So, as soon as I get their responses, I will let you know. I will also let you know the reasoning behind my neurosurgeon's decision to use subcuticular sutures when I talk to him this wk, and why he chose to go that route instead of using dissolvable sutures.

e

----- Original Message -----

From: Dr. Kolb

Sent: Monday, October 07, 2002 10:00 PM

Subject: RE: anchors vs. vertical lifts

e: I was not disagreeing with anything that or -Marie said but with what they stated that their plastic surgeons said. Both have admitted that the plastic surgeons may have been addressing their particular cases. This is my whole point that blanket statements are not always true. You should feel better now as I detected that you have been annoyed by some of my posts. Why not reply to my questions regarding your sutures and allergies instead of fighting. .

-----Original Message-----From: e Rene [mailto:e_Rene@...]Sent: Tuesday, October 08, 2002 12:18 AM Subject: Re: anchors vs. vertical lifts

Dr. Kolb,

While I run the risk of ruffling some feathers here, I will speak my mind anyway, just as you have chosen to do as indicated in your previous 3 emails. So, for anyone who does not want to engage in an "open forum," then delete this email now.

First of all, I take offense to the way you have addressed -Marie and . Both of these women, as does EVERYONE in this group, provide excellent information in different ways, shapes, and forms. Some women have more knowledge in certains areas than others. Because of this, we all complement one another and we all attempt to help women sort through various issues, whether it be the BI issue or something else.

However, just because you are a MD, does not mean you know more than anyone else or everyone else in this group. Yes, you are a MD, and obviously, you have medical knowledge that goes beyond all of ours. But that doesn't make what you have to say 100% correct, all the time, everytime. You may choose to practice medicine one way, but that doesn't mean that it is the only way. And while you may not agree with certain techniques used in plastic surgery by other physicians, there are physicians out there who do things the way they do for various reasons. And just because you cite medical journal articles doesn't mean that that is the way it should be. As you well know, most of the studies/case studies published are those that are supported in the form of grants by a drug company or medical device manufacturer, medical school, or teaching institution. Teaching institutions and medical schools are in turn funded by drug companies or medical device companies. Many of these studies are flawed, and results are not printed (or are selectively withheld) to ensure that the study gets published, and as a result, many studies are corrupt. So, what I'm trying to say is that just because something is printed in a medical journal doesn't make it the "right way."

I also have to add that I feel that your statement to -Marie "if you give me his phone #, I will call him and ask him" [about external sutures and anchor pattern mastopexies] is rather immature. What does it matter? You perform your surgeries the way you are comfortable with, and let the rest of the plastic surgeons in this country practice the way they are comfortable with. I also feel that your statement addressed to both and -Marie "you and should want accurate info on this board if it is to be credible" is also demeaning and uncalled for. No one is providing anyone with incorrect information. Trust me, if there is grossly incorrect information, or misinformation, there are those of us in this group who will speak up, me being one of them. I think that everyone strives to provide the most accurate, up to date information we can, and when in doubt, we seek help and info from others, yourself included. But I strongly think that overall, we, as a group, minus your medical expetise, do very well. I may not be a MD, but I am a RN with a Bachelors Degree, completed 2 yrs of med school, and have training as a legal nurse consultant. So, I'd say that I'm a pretty well educated, intelligent, woman, who has, unfortunately, been forced into the role of being a pt one too many times. Hence, I know what it's like to be on both sides of the coin and can empathize with these women.

This group is a support group. It is about being able to voice your concerns, fears, frustrations, problems and whatever else you need to bounce off people. And it is a place that we should feel "safe." We should not fear recrimination or backlash. So, for -Marie to voice her opinions regarding mastopexies is her right. She is not defaming anyone, she is not demeaning anyone, she is not hurting anyone. She is stating her opinion, and while you, and others, may not agree, she is entitled to speak her mind. Perhaps if you don't like her questioning you or your techniques, then maybe you should learn how to redirect your insecurities.

With all due respect,

e

----- Original Message -----

From: Dr. Kolb

Sent: Monday, October 07, 2002 8:33 PM

Subject: RE: anchors vs. vertical lifts

: From your posts you appear to be very angry. This board is to give people information about explants and needs to retain a positive and helpful tone and I am trying to explain why we use different techniques for different circumstances. I am sorry that you choose to attack my statements but I am sure that there are more effective means for you to deal with this anger. I just spent 7 hours putting back together a face after a motorcycle accident in a patient with no eyelids and his eye in danger. He is in the ICU in critcal condition so this conversation seems particularly unimportant. If you wish to debate me please have the courtesy to check out the references that I gave you. .

-----Original Message-----From: perlesetlacet@... [mailto:perlesetlacet@...]Sent: Monday, October 07, 2002 4:30 PM Subject: Re: anchors vs. vertical lifts:I think you need to tell Dr. Feng she has a lot to learn........not.My doc did do ONE anchor lift in five years--it's because the patient wanted it. I suppose with everything in life there is an EXCEPTION or TWO. Geez, I thought we were speaking in general. All I know is if I know that a doc who uses the anchor technique and outtie stitches on the breasts as a normal part of his/her practice, I'd run in the other direction! I went to a looser of a PS once--shame on him, for me to go to another doc like him again--shame on me.LM

[Guest guest]

Amen.

-Marie

[Guest guest]

do you think that the horizontal cut itself because of the direction leaves a more noticeable scar than a vertical one? Anyhow you cannot get a lot of lift from just a crease incision anyhow, doesn't the lift part come from the vertical part, why do you need a crease incision with a lift that is my question here?

----- Original Message -----

From: perlesetlacet@...

Sent: Monday, October 07, 2002 4:16 PM

Subject: Re: anchors vs. vertical lifts

:There is NO JUSTIFICATION for what this PS did to me. My scars were big before the explant from the mastopexy from hell he gave me, and he made them a bit bigger with an IMPROPER EXPLANT. Even if I had been given 5 inch scars from a normal anchor cut--that would still suck--albeit not as much--but I'd still be left with more ugly UNNECESSARY scarring. I would have been delighted to have skinny scars with a vertical lift. Just think, if that were done right to begin with, I'd been thousands of dollars richer for not having to have repeated surgeries, happier, healthier and have my fucking hair too. Sorry, but as my doc said, there was no excuse for this...LM

[Guest guest]

I do want accurate information on this board. I never said that an anchor should never be used I only said what my Dr told me, which was that it is usually never needed. I am not sure why you are upset at me, since I don't think I ever was rude to you, i have thanked you for your information always , and it is much appreciated. I think that some women on this board have been through hell and have a right to be upset and that some slack should be given to people who have been through so much pain and suffering.

----- Original Message -----

From: Dr. Kolb

Sent: Monday, October 07, 2002 8:53 PM

Subject: RE: anchors vs. vertical lifts

: I agree that the anchor pattern is rarely needed. I state I have only done it twice in 10 years. I even consider it dangerous in regards to tissue loss. But to say it is never indicated is not correct. I believe your surgeon and Feng would agree that there are certain times it is the only technique that will work. One example which is very simple is the patient with a long submammary scar that is preexisting and horizontal skin excess called pseudoptosis. You and should want accurate information on this board if it is to be credible. .

-----Original Message-----From: perlesetlacet@... [mailto:perlesetlacet@...]Sent: Monday, October 07, 2002 4:15 PM Subject: Re: anchors vs. vertical lifts:Yes, the vertical scar one typically notices first but with an anchor cut, the long scar under the breast looks worse--in my opinion. I can see this scar in my cleavage and sides--it sux. Believe me when I tell you, having this *anchor job* is not pleasing. It's too late for me -- what's done is done -- but if other women can avoid this happening to them, it makes it worth it for me to speak up.Take care,LM

[Guest guest]

I would still warn them that they should use caution when getting an anchor lift, that was really my point here, I never said anything on this board that was inappropriate.

----- Original Message -----

From: Dr. Kolb

Sent: Monday, October 07, 2002 9:07 PM

Subject: RE: anchors vs. vertical lifts

: I agree with Feng that for you an anchor pattern is unnessary but think of the few patients who might need this approach and are reading the information on this board. .

-----Original Message-----From: Heer [mailto:idagirl@...]Sent: Monday, October 07, 2002 12:29 PM Subject: Re: anchors vs. vertical lifts

That was what she said, but she may have meant never with someone like me, with my type issues, ya know what I mean? Maybe she said it is unnecessary, not sure I just know she told me that it does not need to be done. I asked her why some women get scars (like patty did( in the crease with explant and she just said that it is not necessary and that she has great success with vertical lifts.

----- Original Message -----

From: Dr. Kolb

Sent: Monday, October 07, 2002 10:06 AM

Subject: RE: anchors vs. vertical lifts

: Are you sure she never? As I said earlier this is a mathematical formula and in some rare (ie two times in 10 years) I have had to use an anchor. Most plastic surgeons would not say never. .

-----Original Message-----From: Heer [mailto:idagirl@...]Sent: Monday, October 07, 2002 9:26 AM Subject: Re: anchors vs. vertical lifts

Actually if you ever have visited explantation.com there are a ton of ladies who have had the same experience as me, that is that the scar from the vertical lift fades the best, the nipple scars are often the only thing one can really see after healing is done. Anyhow I don't see the point in arguing. Most women who got implants in the first place have little to no breast tissue, so a crease incision is not really hidden once they are explanted and lifted, because at least most of us end up very small. I know that if I had crease incisions they would show, because I don't have enough breast tissue to hang over them, imparticularly when I lift up my arms or lay down on the bed, etc. These would be times when the crease scar would show. I cannot of course say for sure if they would have healed as well as my vertical scar or not, if they would have, then I guess they also would not show, but as Patty has stated, her vertical scar is invisible, her crease scars are red and obvious. Why would one part of her body scar more than another part? Was this because of the surgeon or just the placement of the scar of what? I do not have an answer for this. If she was to try to get a revision would she end up with smaller breasts too?

I think also that with an anchor lift you are adding another incision, so why do it unless it is really needed? As Dr Feng herself told me, there is no reason usually EVER to use an anchor lift. Those were her exact words to me, when I was there in December of 1999. So i am only going by what I was told by my Dr.

C

----- Original Message -----

From: Dr. Kolb

Sent: Monday, October 07, 2002 5:57 AM

Subject: RE: anchors vs. vertical lifts

The vertical scars are usually the most obvious in postop photos as the periareolar and fold incisions are often hidden. You may be the exception , but I am talking about what is true for the majority of patients. .

-----Original Message-----From: Heer [mailto:idagirl@...]Sent: Sunday, October 06, 2002 8:38 PM Subject: Re: anchors vs. vertical lifts

That is really funny that you say that as all the women I know(tons) have had vertical scars and love them. I for one cannot even find mine any more. Now the ones around the nipple I can find and if I had any in the crease they would show since my breasts are so small

----- Original Message -----

From: Dr. Kolb

Sent: Saturday, October 05, 2002 5:54 PM

Subject: RE: anchors vs. vertical lifts

I am referring to mastopexies. There is an article in the last PRS journal from Chile describing when one need to convert a donut to a verticle and a verticle to an anchor. Look at it and it will be clear what I am talking about. Constricted breast and pseudoptosis also need to be corrected often with a scar in the fold which is usually very well hidden. It is usually the verticle scar that patient's don't like. .

-----Original Message-----From: perlesetlacet@... [mailto:perlesetlacet@...]Sent: Saturday, October 05, 2002 3:50 PM Subject: Re: anchors vs. vertical lifts:Are you referring to extra large breasted women having reductions or simply a lift? I saw his photos of women with D size breasts with a vertical lift and they look perky and good.What plastic surgery book do you recommend I look at? Any with a current 2001+ date on them? I'll have to ask my PS about this.Thanks. Take care.-Marie