Re: New - best tests for various metals

March 2, 2008

>

> Hi, I'm new to this list and have a few questions about metals. So far

> we have had a hair metals analysis done for my son, showing moderately

> high levels for aluminum, antimony, arsenic and tin. Hair mercury was

> low. Now I'm not sure if the hair test is the best place to start, or

> if we should be doing blood or urine tests. Which test(s) are best to

> determine his levels of various metals?

>

The least invasive, most useful test is the hair ESSENTIAL ELEMENTS

test (from DDI). On that test mercury poisoning often shows up as

deranged mineral transport. (The deranged mineral transport decreases

the person's ability to excrete metals - mercury poisoned people often

show low levels of mercury on a hair toxic elements test). The

results can be posted to this group where there are a number of people

familiar with deciphering the test.

If your toxic elements test was just done recently at DDI you could

phone and tell them that the wrong test was ordered. They will do the

right test free of charge if they haven't discarded the sample yet.

The moderately high levels of aluminum and antinomy could be an

artifact of mercury poisoning. The mod high level of arsenic is a

concern.

Another test that is often useful if the urine porphyrin's test.

There is a file in the files section of this group for help with

understanding the porphyrin test result.

> Also, I was wondering about testing myself for metals, since we are

> hoping to try to have another baby. If I am toxic in metals, then I

> think I should find this out ahead of time and address it. What tests

> do you recommend for me?

>

Same as above.

Do not do a urine challenge test. The high dose of challenge agent

moves too much metal at one time leading to damage and worsening of

symptoms. The results are not very useful.

J

> Thank you for your time and input!

> Sheri

>

March 2, 2008

Hi Sheri,

Welcome to the list. Was it a DDI hair elements test? Did you apply the

counting rules? Blood or urine tests for metals won't tell you much useful,

unless he has recent new exposure. DDI hair elements hair test with counting

rules applied for you, too. You can order the test without a doc through DLS

(Direct Lab Services). If you mention this list they'll give you a discount.

If you want help interpreting the results you can post them here and people will

chime in.

S S

New - best tests for various metals

Posted by: " Sheri " ksmiller@... sherimiller75

Sat Mar 1, 2008 10:13 pm (PST)

Hi, I'm new to this list and have a few questions about metals. So far

we have had a hair metals analysis done for my son, showing moderately

high levels for aluminum, antimony, arsenic and tin. Hair mercury was

low. Now I'm not sure if the hair test is the best place to start, or

if we should be doing blood or urine tests. Which test(s) are best to

determine his levels of various metals?

Also, I was wondering about testing myself for metals, since we are

hoping to try to have another baby. If I am toxic in metals, then I

think I should find this out ahead of time and address it. What tests

do you recommend for me?

Thank you for your time and input!

Sheri

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March 2, 2008

Thankyou for the responses! No, we didn't have a DDI test (what does

DDI stand for, by the way). We were having some testing done throught

Great Plains Laboratory, so we ordered their hair heavy metals and

essential elements test as well. Now I realize that perhaps this

wasn't the best test for determining metal toxicity, but now I know

better! How do I contact the lab you recommend? I'm in Canada - do

you know if that would be a problem? Also, would I need a doctor's

order?

Thanks again for all the help! Metals and chelation is new to me. We

are currently GFCFSF (plus others) and treating yeast. We will soon

start an anti-viral protocol, and are exploring chelation as well. My

son on the spectrum is 3 years old, and I have a 15 month old daughter

as well that we want to do testing on just in case.

Thanks again,

Sheri

March 2, 2008

After glancing through the photos in the group, I've realized that

maybe the test we had done through Great Plains was the right test.

I've posted my son's results in an album named " M " . If you

wouldn't mind taking a look and telling me what you think, I would

really appreciate any input.

I really can't thank you enough!

Sheri

March 2, 2008

Where are these pictures everyone is posting? I don't see them...

>

> After glancing through the photos in the group, I've realized that

> maybe the test we had done through Great Plains was the right test.

> I've posted my son's results in an album named " M " . If you

> wouldn't mind taking a look and telling me what you think, I would

> really appreciate any input.

>

> I really can't thank you enough!

> Sheri

>

March 2, 2008

> Where are these pictures everyone is posting? I don't see them...

On my screen, I click on " Photos " on the left hand side of the screen.

Then people have individual albums posted.

March 2, 2008

>

> Thankyou for the responses! No, we didn't have a DDI test (what does

> DDI stand for, by the way). We were having some testing done throught

> Great Plains Laboratory,

Great Plains does the same tests as Doctors Data Inc

J

so we ordered their hair heavy metals and

> essential elements test as well. Now I realize that perhaps this

> wasn't the best test for determining metal toxicity, but now I know

> better! How do I contact the lab you recommend? I'm in Canada - do

> you know if that would be a problem? Also, would I need a doctor's

> order?

>

> Thanks again for all the help! Metals and chelation is new to me. We

> are currently GFCFSF (plus others) and treating yeast. We will soon

> start an anti-viral protocol, and are exploring chelation as well. My

> son on the spectrum is 3 years old, and I have a 15 month old daughter

> as well that we want to do testing on just in case.

>

> Thanks again,

> Sheri

>

March 2, 2008

It doesn't meet a counting rule (statistical tool to estimate

probability of deranged mineral transport) but it looks suspicious

because of the very low mercury. If he has NO amalgam fillings and no

recent exposures to mercury (no more vaccines!) you could do a trial

of chelation. Side effects with a trial of chelation indicate

toxicity. Some people even observe gains with a chelation trial. It

would be good to chelate arsenic out.

J

>

> After glancing through the photos in the group, I've realized that

> maybe the test we had done through Great Plains was the right test.

> I've posted my son's results in an album named " M " . If you

> wouldn't mind taking a look and telling me what you think, I would

> really appreciate any input.

>

> I really can't thank you enough!

> Sheri

>

March 2, 2008

Hi Sheri,

What are these counting rules you are refering to on the hair test?

Thanks

>

> Hi Sheri,

> Welcome to the list. Was it a DDI hair elements test? Did you

apply the counting rules? Blood or urine tests for metals won't tell

you much useful, unless he has recent new exposure. DDI hair

elements hair test with counting rules applied for you, too. You can

order the test without a doc through DLS (Direct Lab Services). If

you mention this list they'll give you a discount. If you want help

interpreting the results you can post them here and people will chime

in.

> S S

>

> New - best tests for various metals

> Posted by: " Sheri " ksmiller@... sherimiller75

> Sat Mar 1, 2008 10:13 pm (PST)

>

> Hi, I'm new to this list and have a few questions about metals. So

far

> we have had a hair metals analysis done for my son, showing

moderately

> high levels for aluminum, antimony, arsenic and tin. Hair mercury

was

> low. Now I'm not sure if the hair test is the best place to start,

or

> if we should be doing blood or urine tests. Which test(s) are best

to

> determine his levels of various metals?

>

> Also, I was wondering about testing myself for metals, since we are

> hoping to try to have another baby. If I am toxic in metals, then I

> think I should find this out ahead of time and address it. What

tests

> do you recommend for me?

>

> Thank you for your time and input!

> Sheri

>

> _______________________________________________

> Join Excite! - http://www.excite.com

> The most personalized portal on the Web!

>

March 3, 2008

Hi ,

Here is what I found about the counting rules:

http://home.earthlink.net/~moriam/HOW_TO_hair_test.html#counting_rules

Sheri

March 4, 2008

The test we got done to determine our daughter's mercury toxicity was

from France- the kit is free, but you pay when you send the urine

back. It is different than the regular urine tests that simply check

for mercury. This is a urinary prophyrin test that can actually

determine if there is mercury in the body tissue, based on the

results of certain chemical reactions occuring in the urine (sorry I

can't explain the details of the test very well)- our DAN dr ordered

the test, but you can order it yourself.

http://www.labbio.net

click on " English " , then " autism " , then " intoxication with heavy

metals-urinary porphyrin profile " , then " how to do this test " , then

there is the email contact to order the test.

Elissa

>

> Thankyou for the responses! No, we didn't have a DDI test (what

does

> DDI stand for, by the way). We were having some testing done

throught

> Great Plains Laboratory, so we ordered their hair heavy metals and

> essential elements test as well. Now I realize that perhaps this

> wasn't the best test for determining metal toxicity, but now I know

> better! How do I contact the lab you recommend? I'm in Canada -

do

> you know if that would be a problem? Also, would I need a doctor's

> order?

>

> Thanks again for all the help! Metals and chelation is new to me.

We

> are currently GFCFSF (plus others) and treating yeast. We will

soon

> start an anti-viral protocol, and are exploring chelation as well.

My

> son on the spectrum is 3 years old, and I have a 15 month old

daughter

> as well that we want to do testing on just in case.

>

> Thanks again,

> Sheri

>

March 4, 2008

Counting rules were developed by Andy Cutler, PhD (Chemistry), and mercury

poisoning survivor, who sometimes participates on this list. Mercury toxic

people generally can't even get rid of mercury via the hair. Mercury typically

doesn't show up as high on hair tests for this reason but mercury does cause

disordered mineral transport. The counting rules look for disordered mineral

transport (essential elements like calcium, potassium, magnesium, etc, all out

of whack) which indicates a highly likelihood of mercury toxicity.

S S

Re: New - best tests for various metals

Posted by: " cindyleehan " cindyleehan@... cindyleehan

Sun Mar 2, 2008 9:24 pm (PST)

Hi Sheri,

What are these counting rules you are refering to on the hair test?

Thanks

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March 4, 2008

Elissa. My understanding so far is that it would find mercury in the

liver/kidney, rather than anywhere else. Also that it is highly sensitive to

handling and produces a high false negative rate, which might be relevant given

the need to ship to France.

Is this understanding correct?

Dave.

------------------

Re: New - best tests for various metals

Posted by: " elissamercadogroups " elissamercadogroups@...

elissamercadogroups

Date: Tue Mar 4, 2008 9:16 am ((PST))

The test we got done to determine our daughter's mercury toxicity was

from France- the kit is free, but you pay when you send the urine

back. It is different than the regular urine tests that simply check

for mercury. This is a urinary prophyrin test that can actually

determine if there is mercury in the body tissue, based on the

results of certain chemical reactions occuring in the urine (sorry I

can't explain the details of the test very well)- our DAN dr ordered

the test, but you can order it yourself.

http://www.labbio.net

click on " English " , then " autism " , then " intoxication with heavy

metals-urinary porphyrin profile " , then " how to do this test " , then

there is the email contact to order the test.

Elissa

March 6, 2008

It's called a urine porphyrin test- it tests the level of different

porphyrins in the urine, which correlates to different processes that

are affected by different metals (I know, horrible explanation).

Anyway, the one that was very high for Jennah was the one that

corresponds to mercury. I just saw that Great Plains actually has a

urine porphyrin test now- I wonder if it tests the same thing...I

wich I had the money to get another test done. But I take comfort in

knowing that we are doing the urine test while chelating to make sure

the mercury is actually coming out.

>

> Elissa. My understanding so far is that it would find mercury in

the liver/kidney, rather than anywhere else. Also that it is highly

sensitive to handling and produces a high false negative rate, which

might be relevant given the need to ship to France.

>

> Is this understanding correct?

>

> Dave.

>

> ------------------

>

> Re: New - best tests for various metals

> Posted by: " elissamercadogroups " elissamercadogroups@...

elissamercadogroups

> Date: Tue Mar 4, 2008 9:16 am ((PST))

>

> The test we got done to determine our daughter's mercury toxicity

was

> from France- the kit is free, but you pay when you send the urine

> back. It is different than the regular urine tests that simply

check

> for mercury. This is a urinary prophyrin test that can actually

> determine if there is mercury in the body tissue, based on the

> results of certain chemical reactions occuring in the urine (sorry

I

> can't explain the details of the test very well)- our DAN dr

ordered

> the test, but you can order it yourself.

>

> http://www.labbio.net

>

> click on " English " , then " autism " , then " intoxication with heavy

> metals-urinary porphyrin profile " , then " how to do this test " , then

> there is the email contact to order the test.

>

> Elissa

>

March 7, 2008

Hi All

Wanted to jump in here with this one. We have done a urinary porphyrin

test recently and the only thing that showed up was arsenic. Does this

mean that there is no mercury in the body to chelate? And...can there

still be mercury in the brain?

I'm not yet well versed with chelation, so if anyone can help with this

question, that would be great.

Thanks

Loretta

March 7, 2008

Have you done a hair test? Usually on the porphyrin test, if

porphyrins are elevated above a certain level you have mercury. I

highly doubt there is NO mercury in the body/brain. That is virtually

impossible now days.

Was this test a French Porphyrin test, what lab did it? If you have

the results post them so others can check them.

You can order a hair elements test from www.directlabs.com

Posting the results here to see if mercury is a problem as well as any

other metals.

The basis of a porphyrin test is that when certain heavy metals are in

the body, mainly mercury or Lead they cause the body to spill

porphyrins (product of blood cell production) into the urine. This

does not normally happen unless mercury is in the body. There is a

Lead porphyrin test also, that uses another type of porphyrins which

is why I mention it. So if you the porphyrin levels were above

normal...that indicates mercury. I am not sure how they found aresnic

in that test, unless they were also analyzing the urine for heavy metals.

>

> Hi All

>

> Wanted to jump in here with this one. We have done a urinary porphyrin

> test recently and the only thing that showed up was arsenic. Does this

> mean that there is no mercury in the body to chelate? And...can there

> still be mercury in the brain?

>

> I'm not yet well versed with chelation, so if anyone can help with this

> question, that would be great.

>

> Thanks

>

> Loretta

>

March 8, 2008

Loretta,

ALA chelates both arsenic and mercury (from body and brain)...I presume the

individual has NO mercury amalgam dental fillings. Consider ALA chelation using

Andy's protocol. Also consider identifying and reducing/removing sources of

exposure to arsenic. www.danasview.net/metals

S S

Re: New - best tests for various metals

Posted by: " loretta " wojii@... thebuzzzgirl

Fri Mar 7, 2008 7:12 pm (PST)

Hi All

Wanted to jump in here with this one. We have done a urinary porphyrin

test recently and the only thing that showed up was arsenic. Does this

mean that there is no mercury in the body to chelate? And...can there

still be mercury in the brain?

I'm not yet well versed with chelation, so if anyone can help with this

question, that would be great.

Thanks

Loretta

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Join Excite! - http://www.excite.com

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March 9, 2008

Hi

We are using DMSA for a couple of months and then we will be using ALA.

We started the first round last week end but stopped at the last dose

for the first night. After giving the first dose of DMSA my son began

sneezing and sneezing. He did not have a cold or any signs of illness

prior to the first dose. It came on suddenly and quite strongly. They

were very 'wet' sneezes and he also started to get a sore throat,

headache and dizziness. Concentration was really hard for him too.

These symptoms lasted for nearly a week after. We weren't sure if it

was the DMSA or whether he just happened to get a cold. He hasn't had a

cold for a long time and the sneezing started pretty much with in 1/2

hour of the first dose and would slightly worsen with each subsequent

dose. He has reacted to seafood and now carries an epipen and the

sneezing was the same type of sneezing he had with the seafood reaction,

except the sneezing with the DMSA was far worse but did not progress to

the face swelling etc.

The doctor we are now seeing for chelation is using Andy Cutler's

protocol. My son has no amalgam fillings, but does have a couple of

stainless steel crowns. Can chelation still be done if these are

present? Someone else has just posted this question too.

Any thoughts on the sneezing etc would be appreciated too.

Thanks for your help and I will look up the web site you mentioned also.

Thanks kindly

Loretta

March 9, 2008

Hi Jada

Thanks for your response. The urinary porphyrin test we did was not

from France but through Metametrix. 'Urinary Profile - Urine.' The

reading for Copro I/Copro III was 0.9 with the ref range being <=0.6.

The test stated this was High. Total porphyrins was 21 with ref range

being <=297. The comments read 'A high value for the Copro I/Copro III

ratio indicates a more specific association with the toxic effects of

arsenic.'

I'm finding it hard to understand test results, as you can probably

tell. I have so much information to read yet. I don't know if the

above info sheds any light or makes more sense to you.

We have had hair tests done, the last one being in 2005 through

InterClinical Laboratories. They are based in Australia. I don't know

how they compare to DDI testing. I would be certain that there is

mercury in my son's brain. I was a dental assistant for a number of

years before my pregnancy and was chair side assisting whilst I was

pregnant. So lots of exposure here.

Loretta

March 9, 2008

Some people chelate with ALA only if there's not a lead issue. So you started

with 1/8mg/lb every 4 hours day and night? Is it straight DMSA or is it laced

with glutathione? The stainless steel crowns don't have mercury fillings under

them?

S S

Re: New - best tests for various metals

Posted by: " loretta " wojii@... thebuzzzgirl

Sun Mar 9, 2008 12:30 am (PST)