Guest guest Posted January 8, 2005 Report Share Posted January 8, 2005 Andrographis Parts used and where grown Andrographis originated in the plains of India, and it also grows in China. The leaves and flowers are used medicinally. Andrographis has been used in connection with the following conditions (refer to the individual health concern for complete information): Rating Health Concerns 3Stars Common coldImmune functionInfection 2Stars Dysentery 1Star HIV infectionIndigestionViral hepatitis 3Stars Reliable and relatively consistent scientific data showing a substantial health benefit. 2Stars Contradictory, insufficient, or preliminary studies suggesting a health benefit or minimal health benefit. 1Star For an herb, supported by traditional use but minimal or no scientific evidence. For a supplement, little scientific support and/or minimal health benefit. Historical or traditional use (may or may not be supported by scientific studies) Andrographis has long been used in traditional Indian andChinese herbal medicine. The most common reported uses were for digestive problems (as is the case with most non-toxic bitter herbs such as andrographis), snakebite, and infections ranging from malaria to dysentery.1 2 Interestingly, some of these uses have been validated by modern scientific research. Although the roots were sometimes used in traditional medicine, the leaves and flowers are now more commonly used. Active constituents The major constituents in andrographis are diterpene lactones known as andrographolides. These bitter constituents are believed to have immune-stimulating, anti-inflammatory, fertility-decreasing, liver-protective, and bile secretion-stimulating actions.3 Though some older studies suggested andrographis was antibacterial, modern research has been unable to confirm this finding.4 Several double-blind clinical trials have found that andrographis can help reduce symptom severity in people with common colds. 5 6 7 8 9 Though the earliest clinical trial among these showed modest benefits, later studies have tended to be more supportive. Standardized andrographis extract combined with eleuthero (Siberian ginseng), known as Kan jang, has also been shown in a double-blind clinical trial to reduce symptoms of the common cold.10 A preliminary uncontrolled study using isolated andrographolide found that while it tended to decrease viral load and increase CD4 lymphocyte levels in people with HIV infection, at the amount used, the preparation led to side effects, including headache, fatigue, a bitter/metallic taste in the mouth, and elevated liver enzymes (which returned to normal after the medication was stopped).11 It is unknown whether the andrographolides used in this study directly killed HIV or had an immune-strengthening effect. Andrographis has proven helpful in combination with antibiotics for people with dysentery, a severe form of diarrhea. 12 It has also shown preliminary benefit for people with chronic viral hepatitis. 13 How much is usually taken? Andrographis is generally available as capsules with dried herb or as standardized extracts (containing 11.2 mg andrographolides per 200 mg of extract). For dried herb, 500–3,000 mg are taken three times per day. In clinical trials, 100 mg of a standardized extract were taken two times per day to treat the common cold.14 For indigestion, andrographis may be taken as a tea. Use 1 teaspoon (5 grams) of the herb for each cup (250 ml) of hot water. Allow the mixture to stand for 10–15 minutes before drinking (sip before meals). Are there any side effects or interactions? Some people develop intestinal upset when taking andrographis. If this occurs, reduce the amount taken or take it with meals. Headache, fatigue, a bitter/metallic taste, and elevated liver enzymes were reported in one trial with HIV-infected people taking high doses of isolated andrographolides.15 This has not been reported in people using whole andrographis or standardized extracts at the amounts recommended above. As with all bitter herbs, andrographis may aggravate ulcers and heartburn. The safety of andrographis during pregnancy and breast-feeding is unknown. At the time of writing, there were no well-known drug interactions with andrographis. References 1. Nadkarni AK, Nadkarni KM. Indian Materia Medica vol 1. Bombay: Popular Prakashan, 1976, 101–3. 2. Bensky D, Gamble A, Kaptchuk T. Chinese Herbal Medicine Materia Medica Revised Edition. Seattle: Eastland Press, 1993, 95. 3. Bone K. The story of Andrographis paniculata, a new “immune system” herb. Nutrition & Healing 1998;Sept:3, 4, 8, 9 [review]. 4. Leelarasamee A, Trakulsomboon S, Sittisomwong N. Undetectable anti-bacterial activity of Andrographis paniculata (Burma) Wall. ex ness. J Med Assoc Thai1990;73:299–304. 5. Thamlikitkul V, Dechatiwongse T, Theerapong S, et al. Efficacy of Andrographis paniculata, Nees for pharyngotonsillitis in adults. J Med Assoc Thai 1991;74:437–42. 6. Melchior J, Palm S, Wikman G. Controlled clinical study of standardized Andrographis paniculata extract in common cold–a pilot trial. Phytomedicine 1996;3:314–8. 7. Hancke J, Burgos R, Caceres D, Wikman G. A double-blind study with a new monodrug Kan Jang: decrease of symptoms and improvement in recovery from commoncolds. Phytother Res 1995;9:559–62. 8. Cáceres DD, Hancke JL, Burgos RA, et al. Use of visual analogue scale measurements (VAS) to assess the effectiveness of standardized Andrographis paniculataextract SHA-10 in reducing the symptoms of common cold. A randomized double blind-placebo study. Phytomedicine 1999;6:217–23. 9. Caceres DD, Hancke JL, Burgos RA, et al. Use of visual analogue scale measurements (VAS) to asses the effectiveness of standardized Andrographis paniculataextract SHA-10 in reducing the symptoms of common cold. A randomized double blind-placebo study. Phytomedicine 1999;6:217–23. 10. Melchior J, Spasov AA, Ostrovskij OV, et al. Double-blind, placebo-controlled pilot and phase III study of activity of standardized Andrographis paniculataHerba Ness extract fixed combination (Kan jang) in the treatment of uncomplicated upper-respiratory tract infection. Phytomedicine 2000;7:341–50. 11. Calabrese C, Berman SH, Babish JG, et al. A phase I trail of andrographolide in HIV positive patients and normal volunteers. Phytother Res 2000;14:333–8. 12. Thanagkul B, Chaichantipayut C. Double-blind study of Andrographis paniculata Nees and tetracycline in acute diarrhea and bacillary dysentery. RamathibodiMed J 1985;8:57–61. 13. Chaturvedi GN, Tomar GS, Tiwari SK, Singh KP. Clinical studies on kalmegh (Andrographis paniculata) in infective hepatitis. J Int Inst Ayurveda 1983;2:208–11. 14. Bone K. The story of Andrographis paniculata, a new “immune system” herb. Nutrition & Healing 1998;September:3, 4, 8, 9 [review]. 15. Calabrese C, Berman SH, Babish JG, et al. A phase I trail of andrographolide in HIV positive patients and normal volunteers. Phytother Res 2000;14:333–8.../Images/LogoCpyrt.gif Copyright © 2004 Healthnotes, Inc. All rights reserved. www.healthnotes.com Learn more about Healthnotes, the company.Learn more about the authors of Healthnotes. The information presented in Healthnotes is for informational purposes only. It is based on scientific studies (human, animal, or in vitro), clinical experience,or traditional usage as cited in each article. The results reported may not necessarily occur in all individuals. For many of the conditions discussed,treatment with prescription or over-the-counter medication is also available. Consult your doctor, practitioner, and/or pharmacist for any health problemand before using any supplements or before making any changes in prescribed medications. Information expires March 2005. images/clear Nature's Way Andrographis - 60 Vcaps images/clearNature's Way Andrographis - 60 Vcaps images/clearRetail price:$11.99 Our price:$6.95 You save:42%Nature's Way Andrographis - 60 Vcaps detailsimages/clearBuy Nature's Way Andrographis - 60 Vcaps images/clear images/clear images/clear images/clear images/clear seals/Secure-White98x102Home |Products |Whats New |Company |Science |FREE eNewsletter |Site MapAffiliates |Privacy Policy |Site Terms of Use |Terms and Conditions of Saleindximages/5star67images/clearindximages/trsteFinalMarkimages/clearHACKER SAFE certified sites prevent over 99.9% of hacker crime. images/am_cclogo_visaimages/am_cclogo_mcimages/am_cclogo_aeimages/am_cclogo_d Copyright ©2005 Vitacost.com. All rights reserved • Designated trademarks and brands are the property of their respective owners. The products and the claims made about specific products on or through this site have not been evaluated by Vitacost.com or the United States Food and DrugAdministration and are not approved to diagnose, treat, cure or prevent disease. The information provided on this site is for informational purposes onlyand is not intended as a substitute for advice from your physician or other health care professional or any information contained on or in any productlabel or packaging. You should not use the information on this site for diagnosis or treatment of any health problem or for prescription of any medicationor other treatment. You should consult with a healthcare professional before starting any diet, exercise or supplementation program, before taking anymedication, or if you have or suspect you might have a health problem. Andrographis Botanical name: Andrographis paniculata Common names: Chiretta, Chuan xin lian, Kalmegh, KirataList of 7 items• Botany• Helpful for• Traditional use• How it works• Amount to take• Side Effects & Interactions• Referenceslist end Parts used and where grown Andrographis originated in the plains of India, and it also grows in China. The leaves and flowers are used medicinally. Andrographis has been used in connection with the following conditions (refer to the individual health concern for complete information): RatingHealth Concerns3Stars Common coldImmune functionInfection2Stars Dysentery1Star HIV infectionIndigestionViral hepatitis3Stars Reliable and relatively consistent scientific data showing a substantial health benefit.2Stars Contradictory, insufficient, or preliminary studies suggesting a health benefit or minimal health benefit.1Star For an herb, supported by traditional use but minimal or no scientific evidence. For a supplement, little scientific support and/or minimal healthbenefit. Historical or traditional use (may or may not be supported by scientific studies) Andrographis has long been used in traditional Indian andChinese herbal medicine.The most common reported uses were for digestive problems (as is the case with most non-toxic bitter herbs such as andrographis), snakebite, andinfectionsranging from malaria to dysentery.1 2 Interestingly, some of these uses have been validated by modern scientific research. Although the roots were sometimesused in traditional medicine, the leaves and flowers are now more commonly used. Active constituents The major constituents in andrographis are diterpene lactones known as andrographolides. These bitter constituents are believed to haveimmune-stimulating,anti-inflammatory, fertility-decreasing, liver-protective, and bile secretion-stimulating actions.3 Though some older studies suggested andrographis wasantibacterial, modern research has been unable to confirm this finding.4 Several double-blind clinical trials have found that andrographis can help reduce symptom severity in people withcommon colds.5 6 7 8 9 Though the earliest clinical trial among these showed modest benefits, later studies have tended to be more supportive. Standardized andrographisextract combined witheleuthero(Siberian ginseng), known as Kan jang, has also been shown in a double-blind clinical trial to reduce symptoms of the common cold.10 A preliminary uncontrolled study using isolated andrographolide found that while it tended to decrease viral load and increase CD4 lymphocyte levels inpeople withHIV infection,at the amount used, the preparation led to side effects, including headache, fatigue, a bitter/metallic taste in the mouth, and elevated liver enzymes (whichreturned to normal after the medication was stopped).11 It is unknown whether the andrographolides used in this study directly killed HIV or had an immune-strengtheningeffect. Andrographis has proven helpful in combination withantibioticsfor people with dysentery, a severe form ofdiarrhea.12 It has also shown preliminary benefit for people with chronic viralhepatitis.13 How much is usually taken? Andrographis is generally available as capsules with dried herb or as standardized extracts (containing 11.2 mg andrographolides per 200 mg of extract).For dried herb, 500–3,000 mg are taken three times per day. In clinical trials, 100 mg of a standardized extract were taken two times per day to treatthecommon cold.14 Forindigestion,andrographis may be taken as a tea. Use 1 teaspoon (5 grams) of the herb for each cup (250 ml) of hot water. Allow the mixture to stand for 10–15 minutesbefore drinking (sip before meals). Are there any side effects or interactions? Some people develop intestinal upset when taking andrographis. If this occurs, reduce the amount taken or take it with meals. Headache, fatigue, a bitter/metallictaste, and elevated liver enzymes were reported in one trial with HIV-infected people taking high doses of isolated andrographolides.15 This has not beenreported in people using whole andrographis or standardized extracts at the amounts recommended above. As with all bitter herbs, andrographis may aggravateulcersandheartburn.The safety of andrographis duringpregnancyand breast-feeding is unknown. At the time of writing, there were no well-known drug interactions with andrographis. References 1. Nadkarni AK, Nadkarni KM. Indian Materia Medica vol 1. Bombay: Popular Prakashan, 1976, 101–3. 2. Bensky D, Gamble A, Kaptchuk T. Chinese Herbal Medicine Materia Medica Revised Edition. Seattle: Eastland Press, 1993, 95. 3. Bone K. The story of Andrographis paniculata, a new “immune system” herb. Nutrition & Healing 1998;Sept:3, 4, 8, 9 [review]. 4. Leelarasamee A, Trakulsomboon S, Sittisomwong N. Undetectable anti-bacterial activity of Andrographis paniculata (Burma) Wall. ex ness. J Med Assoc Thai1990;73:299–304. 5. Thamlikitkul V, Dechatiwongse T, Theerapong S, et al. Efficacy of Andrographis paniculata, Nees for pharyngotonsillitis in adults. J Med Assoc Thai 1991;74:437–42. 6. Melchior J, Palm S, Wikman G. Controlled clinical study of standardized Andrographis paniculata extract in common cold–a pilot trial. Phytomedicine 1996;3:314–8. 7. Hancke J, Burgos R, Caceres D, Wikman G. A double-blind study with a new monodrug Kan Jang: decrease of symptoms and improvement in recovery from commoncolds. Phytother Res 1995;9:559–62. 8. Cáceres DD, Hancke JL, Burgos RA, et al. Use of visual analogue scale measurements (VAS) to assess the effectiveness of standardized Andrographis paniculataextract SHA-10 in reducing the symptoms of common cold. A randomized double blind-placebo study. Phytomedicine 1999;6:217–23. 9. Caceres DD, Hancke JL, Burgos RA, et al. Use of visual analogue scale measurements (VAS) to asses the effectiveness of standardized Andrographis paniculataextract SHA-10 in reducing the symptoms of common cold. A randomized double blind-placebo study. Phytomedicine 1999;6:217–23. 10. Melchior J, Spasov AA, Ostrovskij OV, et al. Double-blind, placebo-controlled pilot and phase III study of activity of standardized Andrographis paniculataHerba Ness extract fixed combination (Kan jang) in the treatment of uncomplicated upper-respiratory tract infection. Phytomedicine 2000;7:341–50. 11. Calabrese C, Berman SH, Babish JG, et al. A phase I trail of andrographolide in HIV positive patients and normal volunteers. Phytother Res 2000;14:333–8. 12. Thanagkul B, Chaichantipayut C. Double-blind study of Andrographis paniculata Nees and tetracycline in acute diarrhea and bacillary dysentery. RamathibodiMed J 1985;8:57–61. 13. Chaturvedi GN, Tomar GS, Tiwari SK, Singh KP. Clinical studies on kalmegh (Andrographis paniculata) in infective hepatitis. J Int Inst Ayurveda 1983;2:208–11. 14. Bone K. The story of Andrographis paniculata, a new “immune system” herb. Nutrition & Healing 1998;September:3, 4, 8, 9 [review]. 15. Calabrese C, Berman SH, Babish JG, et al. A phase I trail of andrographolide in HIV positive patients and normal volunteers. Phytother Res 2000;14:333–8.../Images/LogoCpyrt.gif Copyright © 2004 Healthnotes, Inc. All rights reserved. www.healthnotes.com Learn more about Healthnotes, the company.Learn more about the authors of Healthnotes. The information presented in Healthnotes is for informational purposes only. It is based on scientific studies (human, animal, or in vitro), clinical experience,or traditional usage as cited in each article. The results reported may not necessarily occur in all individuals. For many of the conditions discussed,treatment with prescription or over-the-counter medication is also available. Consult your doctor, practitioner, and/or pharmacist for any health problemand before using any supplements or before making any changes in prescribed medications. Information expires March 2005. images/clear Nature's Way Andrographis - 60 Vcaps images/clearNature's Way Andrographis - 60 Vcaps images/clearRetail price:$11.99 Our price:$6.95 You save:42%Nature's Way Andrographis - 60 Vcaps detailsimages/clearBuy Nature's Way Andrographis - 60 Vcaps images/clear images/clear images/clear images/clear images/clear seals/Secure-White98x102Home |Products |Whats New |Company |Science |FREE eNewsletter |Site MapAffiliates |Privacy Policy |Site Terms of Use |Terms and Conditions of Saleindximages/5star67images/clearindximages/trsteFinalMarkimages/clearHACKER SAFE certified sites prevent over 99.9% of hacker crime. images/am_cclogo_visaimages/am_cclogo_mcimages/am_cclogo_aeimages/am_cclogo_d Copyright ©2005 Vitacost.com. All rights reserved • Designated trademarks and brands are the property of their respective owners. The products and the claims made about specific products on or through this site have not been evaluated by Vitacost.com or the United States Food and DrugAdministration and are not approved to diagnose, treat, cure or prevent disease. The information provided on this site is for informational purposes onlyand is not intended as a substitute for advice from your physician or other health care professional or any information contained on or in any productlabel or packaging. You should not use the information on this site for diagnosis or treatment of any health problem or for prescription of any medicationor other treatment. You should consult with a healthcare professional before starting any diet, exercise or supplementation program, before taking anymedication, or if you have or suspect you might have a health problem. http://www.vitacost.com/science/hn/Herb/Andrographis.htm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 19, 2006 Report Share Posted August 19, 2006 YOU BITCH!!!! > > Hey Tony, here's a good herb! Ha, ha, just kidding, so you don't have > to write an essay about herbs and infections. I am not really very > into herbs, except in my food and my garden. > > However, I feel it's my duty to report that I started taking > andrographis as a support to my abx routine and suddenly I had the > sore ear cartilage that I get every time I start a new abx. Barb has > said that spirochetes like to live in ears. Tony doesn't believe in > spirochetes or Lyme, however, I feel that there is something > happening here! I've been taking resveratrol lately too, which may > increase blood flow and decrease inflammation. (Yes, I've been > reading Buhner.) > > Just giving you a hard time Tony! All in fun. > > - Kate > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 19, 2006 Report Share Posted August 19, 2006 Hey KAte I'm on my way out to have a few drinks in the aussie tradition.. I'll see if I can come back with a few extra superlatives(sp) to add to this posting...I'll actually attack the herbs myself hopps and barley. cheers tony (who's looking like he's beaten this scurge 100%) > > Hey Tony, here's a good herb! Ha, ha, just kidding, so you don't have > to write an essay about herbs and infections. I am not really very > into herbs, except in my food and my garden. > > However, I feel it's my duty to report that I started taking > andrographis as a support to my abx routine and suddenly I had the > sore ear cartilage that I get every time I start a new abx. Barb has > said that spirochetes like to live in ears. Tony doesn't believe in > spirochetes or Lyme, however, I feel that there is something > happening here! I've been taking resveratrol lately too, which may > increase blood flow and decrease inflammation. (Yes, I've been > reading Buhner.) > > Just giving you a hard time Tony! All in fun. > > - Kate > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 19, 2006 Report Share Posted August 19, 2006 *********had the sore ear cartilage that I get every time I start a new abx****** KAte In my doctors prescribing book and book of recommendations, the sore ear cartilage comes up as 'chondritis of the pina'-frequent causes are gram negatives mainly pseudonomas, recommended treatment is ciprofloxacin.Classifying this as an indicator of lyme is silly IMO because I am sure that having TMJ, often a rotting jaw, the ear is only millimeters away... so I would place my focus on what is going on in the region. Just something to think about and even discuss with your doctor- the chondritis issue.... which is also present in many other parts of the anatomy- Rib cage is an egs... tony > > Hey Tony, here's a good herb! Ha, ha, just kidding, so you don't have > to write an essay about herbs and infections. I am not really very > into herbs, except in my food and my garden. > > However, I feel it's my duty to report that I started taking > andrographis as a support to my abx routine and However, I feel it's my duty to report that I started taking andrographis as a support to my abx routine and suddenly I had the sore ear cartilage that I get every time I start a new abx > sore ear cartilage that I get every time I start a new abx. Barb has suddenly I had the > said that spirochetes like to live in ears. Tony doesn't believe in > spirochetes or Lyme, however, I feel that there is something > happening here! I've been taking resveratrol lately too, which may > increase blood flow and decrease inflammation. (Yes, I've been > reading Buhner.) > > Just giving you a hard time Tony! All in fun. > > - Kate > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 19, 2006 Report Share Posted August 19, 2006 But Tony, don't you think it's possible that people might also have chetes in the jaw/ear region? I don't know, can chetes penetrate and live in bone? I know it's frustrating for you (and me) that no one even believes in the staph/pseudomonas pathogenisis problem, but I don't think that means we should discount every other organism. Could be a co-infection situation, right? I guess my question has always been (probably since I don't have a lyme dx) is why do people believe that lyme is a destructive pathogen (despite the CDC's disagreement) and yet they don't believe staph is? Almost everyone who's gotten an osteomyelitis dx has got pathogenic staph as one of their main organisms. And it's pretty close to indestructible with regular antibiotics. My bone staph is exactly the same as the staph in my nose, as far as its sensitivities and resistances. Anyway, has anyone had biopsies that show spirochetes or lyme organisms in their bones? penny dumbaussie2000 <dumbaussie2000@...> wrote: *********had thesore ear cartilage that I get every time I start a new abx******KAteIn my doctors prescribing book and book of recommendations, the sore ear cartilage comes up as 'chondritis of the pina'-frequent causes are gram negatives mainly pseudonomas, recommended treatment is ciprofloxacin.Classifying this as an indicator of lyme is silly IMO because I am sure that having TMJ, often a rotting jaw, the ear is only millimeters away... so I would place my focus on what is going on in the region.Just something to think about and even discuss with your doctor- the chondritis issue.... which is also present in many other parts of the anatomy- Rib cage is an egs...tony>> Hey Tony, here's a good herb! Ha, ha, just kidding, so you don't have > to write an essay about herbs and infections. I am not really very > into herbs, except in my food and my garden.> > However, I feel it's my duty to report that I started taking > andrographis as a support to my abx routine and However, I feel it's my duty to report that I started takingandrographis as a support to my abx routine and suddenly I had thesore ear cartilage that I get every time I start a new abx> sore ear cartilage that I get every time I start a new abx. Barb has suddenly I had the > said that spirochetes like to live in ears. Tony doesn't believe in > spirochetes or Lyme, however, I feel that there is something > happening here! I've been taking resveratrol lately too, which may > increase blood flow and decrease inflammation. (Yes, I've been > reading Buhner.)> > Just giving you a hard time Tony! All in fun.> > - Kate> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 19, 2006 Report Share Posted August 19, 2006 Penny How do you even start to explain this? I have an ear that's inflammed, what to do? Some people will tell you do garlic, or do one of a number of herbs and spices. I say do a culture and sensitivity so you know what your dealing with.No!! say many, we have been diagnosed lyme or mycoplasma, so the pseudonomas infection is rediculous? even though it's culturable and has all the bells and whistles of what's required by infections,especially chronic cases alla!!!!!!!!!!!!cystic fibrosis.. But no!! we have to treat lyme and mycoplasims. Now no offence to all you strong lymies out there, but if your taking a huge battering aka. spinal column is like a person that should be 156 years old, you really want home truths as opposed to flippant theory.Sorry to tell you you need more facts than a purchased lyme diagnosis and mycoplasim diagnosis that they hand out at shopping malls on the back of the docket....Just get as much FACTS AS POSSABLE, we are on this planet a short time we don't need crap at any level. If you have spirochetes swimming around your bloodstream TREAT THEM, Just don't get stuck in a maybe this maybe that scenario..especially when all treatments are not the same. tony > > > > Hey Tony, here's a good herb! Ha, ha, just kidding, so you don't > have > > to write an essay about herbs and infections. I am not really very > > into herbs, except in my food and my garden. > > > > However, I feel it's my duty to report that I started taking > > andrographis as a support to my abx routine and However, I feel > it's my duty to report that I started taking > andrographis as a support to my abx routine and suddenly I had the > sore ear cartilage that I get every time I start a new abx > > sore ear cartilage that I get every time I start a new abx. Barb > has suddenly I had the > > said that spirochetes like to live in ears. Tony doesn't believe > in > > spirochetes or Lyme, however, I feel that there is something > > happening here! I've been taking resveratrol lately too, which may > > increase blood flow and decrease inflammation. (Yes, I've been > > reading Buhner.) > > > > Just giving you a hard time Tony! All in fun. > > > > - Kate > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 19, 2006 Report Share Posted August 19, 2006 Tony, control yourself. You seem to believe that soil can contain beneficial phages, so why couldn't plants contain some beneficial agents? You know, every time somebody criticizes you, I always stick up for you. I actually like you. So I'm not going to take your response personally. I listen to you, and I tried to get penicillin to try some high dose therapy but Canada Customs got it instead of me. Believe me, some of us are trying to act on your suggestions, but it's very difficult going. - Kate Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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