Guest guest Posted April 15, 2002 Report Share Posted April 15, 2002 agnes@... writes: > We need your help here, your support and your jokes! > Yes - ESPECIALLY the corny ones. rach~ " Character is defined by what you choose to do when you know you could get by with doing anything at all. " Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 15, 2002 Report Share Posted April 15, 2002 Dear Stoners, I want to say 'thank you' for everyones support in this group over the last 4 months. , Lu, , Dale, Suzanne, Agnes, and many many more. I had surgery last Thursday and finally got my gallbladder out. It turns out that my gallbladder walls were diseased and would have produced more stones anyway. The walls were 4mm instead of the normal 2mm. There was a lot of preforming sandy grainy stuff stuck into the rough walls. Also puss was found inside. I kept the 1cm stone. It was nothing like I ever got out in a flush. Orangish, hard as a rock, crystalic like one of those rocks you buy in a rock store. It never would have reduced in size with dieting or herbs. It is so hard I can't believe that I made it. Anyway, I'm recoving fine from surgery and am now painfree, stonefree, and gallbladder free. I will take a picture of this stone and send it to anyone who wants to see it. barry@... Thank you all again for your help, information, motivation, encouragement, kind words, debating issues, laughs, etc. I wish for all of you who are searching for better health and happiness that you find it. Good luck. Barry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 15, 2002 Report Share Posted April 15, 2002 At 03:03 15.04.2002 +0000, you wrote: >Dear Stoners, > >There was a lot of preforming sandy grainy stuff stuck >into the rough walls. Also puss was found inside. Hello Barry, I hope you are ok after surgery. This sandy grainy stuff, what was that like? Was that also calcified? Best of health Agnes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 15, 2002 Report Share Posted April 15, 2002 Barry, are you planing on leaving us? ;-( Don't! Just because you are gallbladder free, doesn't mean you won't need flush or two from time to time ... Just yesterday, you have been promoted into group moderator! We need your help here, your support and your jokes! Stay with us! Agnes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 15, 2002 Report Share Posted April 15, 2002 Barry, You are needed here. Your experience brings out the real need for our western medical world and specifically how it applies to gallbladders. When we get so bad off healthwise that it's too late for natural remedies to work, our surgions and pharmecuticals keep us going. On the other hand, you tried and did what you could. I learn from all these experiences and want to do what I can before I get problems with my gall bladder. Hope you stay Vince >From: Agnes <agnes@...> >Reply-gallstones >gallstones >Subject: Re: SURGERY-STONEFREE >Date: Mon, 15 Apr 2002 06:12:49 +0200 > >Barry, > >are you planing on leaving us? ;-( > >Don't! > >Just because you are gallbladder free, doesn't mean you won't need flush or >two from time to time ... >Just yesterday, you have been promoted into group moderator! > >We need your help here, your support and your jokes! > >Stay with us! > >Agnes _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 15, 2002 Report Share Posted April 15, 2002 stop emailing me! Rachd1961@... wrote: agnes@... writes: > We need your help here, your support and your jokes! > Yes - ESPECIALLY the corny ones. rach~ " Character is defined by what you choose to do when you know you could get by with doing anything at all. " Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 15, 2002 Report Share Posted April 15, 2002 sounds like you are saying goodbye Barry - hope things work for you and that you stay symptom free... although I feel a bit confused... cheers -----Original Message----- From: barry91162 [mailto:barry91162@...] Sent: Monday, 15 April 2002 13:03 gallstones Subject: SURGERY-STONEFREE Dear Stoners, I want to say 'thank you' for everyones support in this group over the last 4 months. , Lu, , Dale, Suzanne, Agnes, and many many more. I had surgery last Thursday and finally got my gallbladder out. It turns out that my gallbladder walls were diseased and would have produced more stones anyway. The walls were 4mm instead of the normal 2mm. There was a lot of preforming sandy grainy stuff stuck into the rough walls. Also puss was found inside. I kept the 1cm stone. It was nothing like I ever got out in a flush. Orangish, hard as a rock, crystalic like one of those rocks you buy in a rock store. It never would have reduced in size with dieting or herbs. It is so hard I can't believe that I made it. Anyway, I'm recoving fine from surgery and am now painfree, stonefree, and gallbladder free. I will take a picture of this stone and send it to anyone who wants to see it. barry@... Thank you all again for your help, information, motivation, encouragement, kind words, debating issues, laughs, etc. I wish for all of you who are searching for better health and happiness that you find it. Good luck. Barry. Learn more from our experience, more then 200 liver flush stories: http:///messages/gallstones-testimonials Liver Cleanse Recipe: http://www.CureZone.com/cleanse/liver/ Liver Flush FAQ: http://curezone.com/forums/forum.asp?ForumID=73 Images: http://CureZone.com/image_gallery/cleanse_flush/ http://CureZone.com/image_gallery/intrahepatic_stones/ To unsubscribe, sned blank e-mail to: gallstones-unsubscribe and then reply to confirmation message! To Post message: gallstones Subscribe: gallstones-subscribe Web Sites for more information: http://CureZone.com/gallstones/ http://www.liverdoctor.com/ http://www.sensiblehealth.com/ http://www.cyberpog.com/health/index.htm http://www.relfe.com/gall_stone_cleanse.html http://www.cleansingorsurgery.com/ Group page: gallstones To change your subscription to digest send blank e-mail to: gallstones-digest To change your subscription to NO-MAIL send blank e-mail to: gallstones-nomail To change your subscription to NORMAL send blank e-mail to: gallstones-normal You are receiving this email because you elected to subscribe to the Gallstones group on 's groups. By joining the list you agree to hold yourself FULLY responsible FOR yourself! Have a nice day ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 15, 2002 Report Share Posted April 15, 2002 Hi Barry, I want to Ditto 's post and Agnes'. After having gone through what you have, you have so much valuable experience and knowledge you can share with others who are suffering....so, I hope you'll stick around. Also, I'm sure you're liver is healthier for all that flushing! I hope all continues to go well with your recovery, and hope you know that you can always find the support you need, here. Thanks for letting us know what happened. God Bless, Adrienne Agnes <agnes@...> wrote: Barry, are you planing on leaving us? ;-( Don't! Just because you are gallbladder free, doesn't mean you won't need flush or two from time to time ... Just yesterday, you have been promoted into group moderator! We need your help here, your support and your jokes! Stay with us! Agnes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 15, 2002 Report Share Posted April 15, 2002 Barry; I'm sure this surgery was a very difficult choice for you to make, and especially considering the number of flushes you've attempted to get this particular stone out. But, I believe you made the right choice in getting your gallbladder removed, and especailly so considering the condition it was in. Flushing certainly has worked for a lot of people who have the cholesterol type of stones, but these calcified types are just plain difficult to move by comparison. I know I dug deep many times when I first started flushing to see if there were any hard stones in the bottom of the bowel. You've certainly stepped into another stage of life to be totally stone free. I know there is no need to explain to you that this is just the start of living pain free as regards the gallbladder and that now the liver has to be considered in the process of keeping stones out of the body so as to be free from the pain that can emulate from the liver's ducts being congested with bile stones. So, congradulations in having had a sucessful gallbladder removal, and, if you would, please send me a copy of the picture you take of the calcified stone. Dale <<<<<<<<<<<<< Dear Stoners, I want to say 'thank you' for everyones support in this group over the last 4 months. , Lu, , Dale, Suzanne, Agnes, and many many more. I had surgery last Thursday and finally got my gallbladder out. It turns out that my gallbladder walls were diseased and would have produced more stones anyway. The walls were 4mm instead of the normal 2mm. There was a lot of preforming sandy grainy stuff stuck into the rough walls. Also puss was found inside. I kept the 1cm stone. It was nothing like I ever got out in a flush. Orangish, hard as a rock, crystalic like one of those rocks you buy in a rock store. It never would have reduced in size with dieting or herbs. It is so hard I can't believe that I made it. Anyway, I'm recoving fine from surgery and am now painfree, stonefree, and gallbladder free. I will take a picture of this stone and send it to anyone who wants to see it. barry@... Thank you all again for your help, information, motivation, encouragement, kind words, debating issues, laughs, etc. I wish for all of you who are searching for better health and happiness that you find it. Good luck. Barry. <<<<<<<<<<<<<<< Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 15, 2002 Report Share Posted April 15, 2002 Barry - I could sense from your emails that you were going to do this, it was getting discouraging for you. I was going to write and say why don't you just get it taken out, you've worked hard! Now you can move on and start focusing on other things..things other than your insides. There a world of people that need us out there, and sometimes, just sometimes, I think we can be a little too " body focused " , but that's just my two cents :-) I am going to try a few more flushes this summer, as I know I am not done, and if there aren't the results I hope for, will be doing as you did...giving myself until the fall to decide. Blessings to you! L. Meydrech, CN http://nutritionist.tripod.com/gallbladder.html ~ My Flushes http://nutritionist.tripod.com ~ Journey to Health & Auctions " A cheerful heart is good medicine " Prov. 17:22a ----- Original Message ----- From: barry91162 gallstones Sent: Sunday, April 14, 2002 10:03 PM Subject: SURGERY-STONEFREE Dear Stoners, I want to say 'thank you' for everyones support in this group over the last 4 months. , Lu, , Dale, Suzanne, Agnes, and many many more. I had surgery last Thursday and finally got my gallbladder out. It turns out that my gallbladder walls were diseased and would have produced more stones anyway. The walls were 4mm instead of the normal 2mm. There was a lot of preforming sandy grainy stuff stuck into the rough walls. Also puss was found inside. I kept the 1cm stone. It was nothing like I ever got out in a flush. Orangish, hard as a rock, crystalic like one of those rocks you buy in a rock store. It never would have reduced in size with dieting or herbs. It is so hard I can't believe that I made it. Anyway, I'm recoving fine from surgery and am now painfree, stonefree, and gallbladder free. I will take a picture of this stone and send it to anyone who wants to see it. barry@... Thank you all again for your help, information, motivation, encouragement, kind words, debating issues, laughs, etc. I wish for all of you who are searching for better health and happiness that you find it. Good luck. Barry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 15, 2002 Report Share Posted April 15, 2002 Hi Agnes, Thanks for the best wishes. I'm feeling great. I have a little pain in the scar area but overall the pain is very small. I saved my stone which is not like anything I've ever seen in my flushes. It's rounded, hard as stone, orangish, crystallic inside. The outside is formed in many small balls of calcium or cholesterol that has hardened (don't know which). The inside looks like one of those pretty crystal stones that you buy in a novelty store that was found in the ocean. Also, it has some weight to it. I saw the cut open gallbladder before it was sent to the lab. The inside had some clear-whitish like puss inside. The walls were dark and rough looking, bulbous. Not smooth. Hundreds of blackish grainy stuff was inbedded into the walls and floating in the liquidy stuff. I'm not a doctor but I will ask him more about it on Thursday when I get my stitch out. I was a little out of it after the surgery. Hope this helps in some way. Thanks for having such a great and helpful site. :-) Barry. > >Dear Stoners, > > > >There was a lot of preforming sandy grainy stuff stuck > >into the rough walls. Also puss was found inside. > > > Hello Barry, > I hope you are ok after surgery. > > This sandy grainy stuff, what was that like? > Was that also calcified? > > Best of health > Agnes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 15, 2002 Report Share Posted April 15, 2002 Barry, Oh you are very welcome. I have had such a good time bantering with you and I love your way with people, very gifted with charm and abundance of humor. I am so pleased that you are recovering and I sure would not want you to suffer along and how much a blessing it was for you to have it removed with that much trouble with it and not knowing that. You take care and I hope to see you from time to time sending in a post to let us know how it is you are doing!! And I would be interested in seeing that stone! ,-) Please send. Peace Lu ----- Original Message ----- From: barry91162 gallstones Sent: Sunday, April 14, 2002 10:03 PM Subject: SURGERY-STONEFREE Dear Stoners, I want to say 'thank you' for everyones support in this group over the last 4 months. , Lu, , Dale, Suzanne, Agnes, and many many more. I had surgery last Thursday and finally got my gallbladder out. It turns out that my gallbladder walls were diseased and would have produced more stones anyway. The walls were 4mm instead of the normal 2mm. There was a lot of preforming sandy grainy stuff stuck into the rough walls. Also puss was found inside. I kept the 1cm stone. It was nothing like I ever got out in a flush. Orangish, hard as a rock, crystalic like one of those rocks you buy in a rock store. It never would have reduced in size with dieting or herbs. It is so hard I can't believe that I made it. Anyway, I'm recoving fine from surgery and am now painfree, stonefree, and gallbladder free. I will take a picture of this stone and send it to anyone who wants to see it. barry@... Thank you all again for your help, information, motivation, encouragement, kind words, debating issues, laughs, etc. I wish for all of you who are searching for better health and happiness that you find it. Good luck. Barry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 15, 2002 Report Share Posted April 15, 2002 At 20:19 15.04.2002 +0000, you wrote: >Hi Agnes, >I saw the cut open gallbladder before it was sent to the lab. The >inside had some clear-whitish like puss inside. The walls were dark >and rough looking, bulbous. Not smooth. Hundreds of blackish grainy >stuff was inbedded into the walls and floating in the liquidy stuff. >I'm not a doctor but I will ask him more about it on Thursday when I >get my stitch out. I was a little out of it after the surgery. > Barry, thank you for this info. I am sure you will recover quickly. Few more questions. How big was your GB? Could you sense the smell of stones/gallbladder? Agnes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 16, 2002 Report Share Posted April 16, 2002 >>now the liver has to be considered in the process of keeping stones out of the body so as to be free from the pain that can emulate from the liver's ducts being congested with bile stones.<< As one who has lived it, I have to say that this has not been my experience at all. I do nothing special, I feel great, and am stone-free. Debra _________________________________________________________________ Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 16, 2002 Report Share Posted April 16, 2002 Barry, First, I wish you a speedy recovery. I presume that you ha laparascopy performed by a gastrologist, so by now you are certainly home and probably nearly fully recovered. >I saw the cut open gallbladder before it was sent to the lab. The >inside had some clear-whitish like puss inside. The walls were dark >and rough looking, bulbous. Not smooth. Hundreds of blackish grainy >stuff was inbedded into the walls and floating in the liquidy stuff. >I'm not a doctor but I will ask him more about it on Thursday when I >get my stitch out. I was a little out of it after the surgery. I wonder if and how these phenomena were observed on ultrasound prior to your operation. Did you and the physician expect to find them? I'd be interested in hearing from you what brought about the decision and what surprises, if any, there were when the operation had been performed. Were there any assumptions that you had made that were proved either correct or incorrect? And most importantly, although this might still be a bit early, can you take one step backward (figuratively) and comment on how this experience has affected your way of thinking and how has your approach to the liver-GB-stone-flushing universe either remained unchanged or has indeed undergone any modification. And how your advice to the rest of us has or has not changed. Once again, I wish you the best of health and a speedy and full recovery. --------------------------- IRA L. JACOBSON --------------------------- mailto:laser@... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 16, 2002 Report Share Posted April 16, 2002 Thanks Lu, Yeah, to be honest with you it feels good to have the gallstone problem gone for good. If I ever feel tightness from a stone forming in the commoon duct then I will have to do a flush to get it out but I don't really suspect that to happen. Thanks for those nice comments. I like the cool people in this group. Everyone is searching for health and happiness. It's a good place to share like-minded problems and solutions. Ain't the Interent great in that way? It's not all porn. haha I'm on my 5th day after 'removal' and I feel good. Just slight discomfort when I laugh, cough, or sneeze. Other than that it feels like having a bruise. I didn't have a BM for 3 days but I know that was because of the nervous tension of the surgery and I was eating lightly afterwards. Overall, no problems as of yet. If you want a 'stone pic' send me a personal request to my email at barry@... I've sent out a dozen already. My stone is going around the world. I'm going to put it in glass and display it as a conversation piece on my coffee table. haha 'The Year of the Stone'. Be Healthy. (Peace & Love) Barry. > Barry, > Oh you are very welcome. I have had such a good time bantering with you and I love your way with people, very gifted with charm and abundance of humor. I am so pleased that you are recovering and I sure would not want you to suffer along and how much a blessing it was for you to have it removed with that much trouble with it and not knowing that. You take care and I hope to see you from time to time sending in a post to let us know how it is you are doing!! And I would be interested in seeing that stone! ,-) Please send. > Peace > Lu > ----- Original Message ----- > From: barry91162 > gallstones@y... > Sent: Sunday, April 14, 2002 10:03 PM > Subject: SURGERY-STONEFREE > > > Dear Stoners, > > I want to say 'thank you' for everyones support in this group over > the last 4 months. , Lu, , Dale, Suzanne, Agnes, and many > many more. I had surgery last Thursday and finally got my gallbladder > out. It turns out that my gallbladder walls were diseased and would > have produced more stones anyway. The walls were 4mm instead of the > normal 2mm. There was a lot of preforming sandy grainy stuff stuck > into the rough walls. Also puss was found inside. I kept the 1cm > stone. It was nothing like I ever got out in a flush. Orangish, hard > as a rock, crystalic like one of those rocks you buy in a rock store. > It never would have reduced in size with dieting or herbs. It is so > hard I can't believe that I made it. > Anyway, I'm recoving fine from surgery and am now painfree, > stonefree, and gallbladder free. > > I will take a picture of this stone and send it to anyone who wants > to see it. barry@c... > > Thank you all again for your help, information, motivation, > encouragement, kind words, debating issues, laughs, etc. I wish for > all of you who are searching for better health and happiness that you > find it. Good luck. > > Barry. > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 16, 2002 Report Share Posted April 16, 2002 I'll agree with Debra here... I think the majority of stones that cause colic and problems are found inside the gallbladder where the bile stagnates and gets absorbed of it's water content. Gallstones will normally be progressed to the point of problematic inside the gallbladder. In only a very small percentage of people with bile problems will create stones that cause colic within the liver. Also, the common duct is bigger than the cystic duct and will hopefully eliminate any stones or sludge before it becomes a problem. On the other hand, if I even feel tightness from a common duct blockage of sludge or stones I will surely do a flush to clear the way. Even once or twice a year maintanance is not a bad idea for people with no symptoms but who know that they have had problems with bile in their past. Be Healthy. Barry. > >>now the liver has to > be considered in the process of keeping stones out of the body so as to be > free from the pain that can emulate from the liver's ducts being congested > with bile stones.<< > > As one who has lived it, I have to say that this has not been my experience > at all. I do nothing special, I feel great, and am stone-free. > > Debra > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 17, 2002 Report Share Posted April 17, 2002 At 18:02 16.04.2002 +0000, you wrote: >If you want a 'stone pic' send me a personal request to my email at >barry@... Barry, would you like to make an experiment with your stone? Treben (Author of " Health Through God's Pharmacy " sold in over 1 million) says that radish juice will dissolve stones in vitro and in vivo. Would you like to test your stone on freshly pressed radish juice (in vitro)? This will of course not be the proof or disproof that radish juice can or may do the same inside gallbladder (because juice will never reach the gallbladder, but some of it's ingredients may affect bile composition), but it is interesting to test that claim on real calcium stone. Please, find an accurate scale and get exact weight of your stone, before you put it into juice. Test it's weight after you take it out, too. If you put your stone in juice (take photo & scale), and then take photo/scale after 1 hour, 5 hours, 24 hours --- If no change, try to see if it can stay in juice for several days, and if there is any change. Also, it would be interesting to test it on freshly pressed apple juice? Are you curious enough to do it? I bet many people here would like to hear results ... Agnes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 17, 2002 Report Share Posted April 17, 2002 Hi Barry, I had a couple other thoughts I thought I'd share with you. I think you already know that I started doing the liver cleanse because I continued to have pain after surgery. I haven't had any pain since the 2nd cleanse. I know that Debra has posted that she has no problems whatsoever as a result of having her GB removed, but I can tell you that I do notice a difference. It's nothing major, but when I eat more fat than I usually would, and more often than not, it's the wrong kind of fat, i.e. butter or ice cream for example, I notice that I'm gassy and sometimes experience gas pain. It's just an irritating symptom I guess, but it does serve to remind me that I haven't been eating as well as I should. I do continue to drink organic apple juice and fresh squeezed grapefruit juice on a regular basis....which is good for your liver. And I've upped my water intake. Other than the forementioned symptoms, I feel so good that I'd really never know I'd had surgery....except for the memories and scars! A bit part of that I credit to the liver cleanse and my chiropractor! Adrienne --------------------------------- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 17, 2002 Report Share Posted April 17, 2002 Agnes, This is a good idea to test the desolving effects of radish juice, apple juice, etc on a removed gallstone but like you have said, it could prove nothing. The fact that those ingredients would never enter the gallbladder would make the experiment useless in effect. Maybe even if I spit on it a few times (saliva) it may desolve also? It is very hard and I'm not really sure of the calcium contents vs. the amount of cholesterol is in it. It may very well be a hard cholesterol stone instead of calcium. Can I tell that just by looking at it without it getting tested in a lab? Anyway, I want to 'keep it on display' for a while. I love looking at it and thinking about how much pain that little thing caused me. Maybe sometime in the near future I will play with testing and post the results on here. Thanks for the ideas. :-) Barry. > > >If you want a 'stone pic' send me a personal request to my email at > >barry@c... > > Barry, > would you like to make an experiment with your stone? > > > Treben (Author of " Health Through God's Pharmacy " sold in over 1 million) > says that radish juice will dissolve stones in vitro and in vivo. > > Would you like to test your stone on freshly pressed radish juice (in vitro)? > > > This will of course not be the proof or disproof that radish juice can or may > do the same inside gallbladder (because juice will never reach the gallbladder, > but some of it's ingredients may affect bile composition), but it is > interesting to test that claim on real calcium stone. > Please, find an accurate scale and get exact weight of your stone, before you > put it into juice. > Test it's weight after you take it out, too. > > If you put your stone in juice (take photo & scale), and then take photo/scale > after 1 hour, 5 hours, 24 hours --- > > If no change, try to see if it can stay in juice for several days, and if there > is any change. > > > Also, it would be interesting to test it on freshly pressed apple juice? > Are you curious enough to do it? > I bet many people here would like to hear results ... > > Agnes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 17, 2002 Report Share Posted April 17, 2002 In a message dated 4/17/02 6:56:18 AM Eastern Daylight Time, barry91162@... writes: > Even once or twice a year maintanance is not a bad idea for > people with no symptoms but who know that they have had problems with > bile in their past. > And it's also not a bad idea for people who haven't had problems at all but would like to prevent them in the future. When I think of all the people who have liver disease as they get older - might possibly be prevented with doing that regular lube job. rachel~ " Character is defined by what you choose to do when you know you could get by with doing anything at all. " Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 17, 2002 Report Share Posted April 17, 2002 Hi Ira, Thanks you for the best wishes. I'll try and answer all your questions. Some people may not like the answers but it is only the opinion of one. I didn't get laprascopic because the equipment was not available here in Cancun at this time. I had 'open' surgery which meant 3 days in the hospital instead of only 1 day. They want to keep you there to check for infection and feed you medication. I left after 2 days. Oh, the operation was performed by a middle aged general surgeon who had done over 200 open gallbladder removals. Excellent doc. I was very surprised that the operation was so easy. They put me out for 2 hours and I don't remember a thing. I woke up in the recovery room. The scar is the most amazing thing. I was expecting a long, wormy, ugly scar and it is exactly the opposite. It's a small 6 cm hairline looking cut with only one long-ways stitch holding it together. It looks like the scar will totally dissappear within 1 year. Amazing what they can do with cutting and stitching now. One reason my cut was only 6 cm instead of the doctors normal 8 cm was because I am thin and he could work with a smaller incision. Lapro is still the choice but the open surgery worked out just fine. I have very minimal discomfort in the scar area. Like an slight aching bruise. Only 1% of the pain caused by colic gallstones and a different feeling of pain altogether. I'd call it discomfort instead of pain. I didn't have a BM for 3 days after the surgery because of my personal stress factors and I was eating very lightly also. Was a little worried but now all is working fine down there. After surgery it takes about 3 to 7 days for the body to adjust to the change of cholesterol and flow of bile from the liver. 6 days is still too early to tell but I have been eating cheeses, popcorn, cake, etc in small amounts with no problems. I have to beef back up my weight and will be eating a lot more next week. I'll report any problems that may happen then. What was found in the gallbladder after surgery could not really be seen on ultrasound. Ultrasound showed the walls were 4mm instead of 2mm which turned out to be correct. Ultrasound showed the stone also. The grainy stuff only shows black on ultrasound and the doctor didn't expect to see anything except the stone when he opened the gallbladder. Why did I decide surgery? After 8 flushes, and still having the colic stone, I decided to take the lesser of the two evils. I can live without my gallbladder but I can't live with the pain anymore. I had lost too much weight as well and wanted to just get this gallstone stuff past me. I also wanted to have the freedom of choice with food. I want to eat what and whenever I want without pain or worrying about pain coming in the night. That is important for my own personal happiness. I have learned a lot about proper dieting here and will definitely watch my intake but I also want to have the freedom to choose. Surprises? The surgery was easier than I thought. Conclusions about cleanse methods... (This is the part some people may not like). I feel a lot different now about the whole flushing process. I think it works in the fact that it can help to cleanse the liver but I also believe that the liver is normally doing that on it's own in most cases anyway. As far as the gallbladder, I think the flush can help there also but for people with big, hard, colic stones it is a much lesser success rate. Maybe only 10% if that. I feel this is why people are flushing for months and years and still have the colic pain. Those hard stones just don't squeeze out easily. The hundreds of 'soft' stones that come out of the liver in a flush is not (in my opinion) the true definition of a gallstone. Gallstones are hard as rocks. The soft globs or balls of bile (mixed with oil or not) is not a stone or a potential problem in most ceses. Those 'balls' will normally exit the body through regular bodily function. Fasting and flushing only excellerates that process and the results can be viewed more quickly and visualably. Does the cleanse help? Sure it does. It helps eliminate toxins in the liver and ducts, sludge buildup, grainy duct sand, and potential stones. The flush is an extra boost and strength to what the body is normally doing. Will the flush get out hard, big gallstones. In my case no. In someone elses I'm sure it can. In most cases I think that is a harder battle to win by flushing. By all means it should be attempted to avoid surgery but if it doesn't work it is actually more potentially harmful to have a sluggish gallbladder or grainy sand forming more stones inside the gallbladder and should be dealt with before disease makes it worse. Maintanance. I will probably flush twice a year to help keep my common duct clear of any stagnant bile that could be forming sludge or sand. Tightness in the centralized duct area will alert me of that if needed. I don't expect that to ever happen because of the testimonies I've heard in the majority of cases but I could be another exception to that norm. Dieting well will help my liver to produce healthy bile. Hope my opinion helps in some ways. It is not meant to sway you in either direction on the debate of alternative cleansings or stones or whatever. Everyone must learn by experience, knowledge, and testimonies of others so that they can each make the right decisions and choices for their own personal health situations. I wish you great success on yours. Be Health and Happy. Barry. > Barry, > > First, I wish you a speedy recovery. I presume that you ha laparascopy > performed by a gastrologist, so by now you are certainly home and > probably nearly fully recovered. > > >I saw the cut open gallbladder before it was sent to the lab. The > >inside had some clear-whitish like puss inside. The walls were dark > >and rough looking, bulbous. Not smooth. Hundreds of blackish grainy > >stuff was inbedded into the walls and floating in the liquidy stuff. > >I'm not a doctor but I will ask him more about it on Thursday when I > >get my stitch out. I was a little out of it after the surgery. > > I wonder if and how these phenomena were observed on ultrasound prior to > your operation. Did you and the physician expect to find them? > > I'd be interested in hearing from you what brought about the decision and > what surprises, if any, there were when the operation had been > performed. Were there any assumptions that you had made that were proved > either correct or incorrect? > > And most importantly, although this might still be a bit early, can you > take one step backward (figuratively) and comment on how this experience > has affected your way of thinking and how has your approach to the > liver-GB-stone-flushing universe either remained unchanged or has indeed > undergone any modification. > > And how your advice to the rest of us has or has not changed. > > Once again, I wish you the best of health and a speedy and full recovery. > > --------------------------- > IRA L. JACOBSON > --------------------------- > mailto:laser@i... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 17, 2002 Report Share Posted April 17, 2002 Adrienne, Thanks for those tips. By research that I have done I'm not expecting anything to happen but I could be one of those chosen few. :-) If I get tightness or anything in the common duct or liver I will definitely clean it out with a few good flushes. I haven't experienced any gasses yet but It's only been 6 days. Thanks again. Barry. --- In gallstones@y..., Adrienne McLaughlin <adriennelynn1@y...> wrote: > > Hi Barry, > I had a couple other thoughts I thought I'd share with you. I think you already know that I started doing the liver cleanse because I continued to have pain after surgery. I haven't had any pain since the 2nd cleanse. I know that Debra has posted that she has no problems whatsoever as a result of having her GB removed, but I can tell you that I do notice a difference. It's nothing major, but when I eat more fat than I usually would, and more often than not, it's the wrong kind of fat, i.e. butter or ice cream for example, I notice that I'm gassy and sometimes experience gas pain. It's just an irritating symptom I guess, but it does serve to remind me that I haven't been eating as well as I should. I do continue to drink organic apple juice and fresh squeezed grapefruit juice on a regular basis....which is good for your liver. And I've upped my water intake. Other than the forementioned symptoms, I feel so good that I'd really never know I'd had surgery....except for the memories and scars! A bit part of that I credit to the liver cleanse and my chiropractor! > Adrienne > > > > > --------------------------------- > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 18, 2002 Report Share Posted April 18, 2002 At 02:19 17.04.2002 +0000, you wrote: >Anyway, I want to 'keep it on display' for a while. I love looking at >it and thinking about how much pain that little thing caused me. Give them a bath, once you get tired of looking :-) Agnes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 18, 2002 Report Share Posted April 18, 2002 My pet rock? To give it a bath I would have to take it out of the glass display case that is sitting on my coffee table as an interesting conversation piece. haha Maybe when I get tired of the little bugger I'll do the desolving tests for you. Or maybe I'll just toss it into the ocean and make a wish. :-) Barry. > > >Anyway, I want to 'keep it on display' for a while. I love looking at > >it and thinking about how much pain that little thing caused me. > > > Give them a bath, once you get tired of looking :-) > > Agnes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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