liver flush 16

[Guest guest]

still passing alot of very large stones. seems to be endless. i drank 9 ounces

of oil last night to see if this would be better.i think this helped stimulate

the release of more stones.

in between this cleanse and the last one i tried eating whatever i wanted, and

it helped alot.

here is my theory. after each of the previous flushes, i would immediately feel

more stones move, and ready themselves for release... which was very disturbing.

i notied that after each of these flushes my appetite would be for some sort of

heavy cooked food, like meat. for a few of them i ignored my instinct and

followed the directions by just drinking juices and eating light. but this never

seemed to work out.

then the last flush i just ate any old thing. meat, ice cream, some raw foods.

whatever i wanted. it was still a bit uncomfortable, but alot more bearable. i

think that the body has certain modes or discrete states. like when you go to a

smoky bar, after a while you acclaimate to it. whereas if you are walking down

the street on a beautiful day with fresh air, and the person on front of you is

smoking, it's maddening. the body is getting two different and opposing signals.

so the some seems worse than in the smoky bar.

in a similar way, with the cleanses, initiating a cleansing process, and then

stopping it slowly is sort of confusing. hence eating ice cream or meat can

actually provide a benefit of resetting the body state to one of non-cleansing.

whereas eating light will continue the cleansing mode but the closed duct will

not allow any more stones to pass. two opposing signals. i'm sure most people

wouldn't feel well doing this. but i haven't had normal digestion in over a

decade. so there is no normal to fall back to, and the body does its best to

reach homeostasis with whatever tools it has at the given moment. in a way it's

sort of like homeopathy at the gross level.

[Guest guest]

Dear Arthur,

When you do a cleansing, your gallbladder is heavily working -

performing extra contractions due to increased oil in the system.

After this heavy labor, the gallbladder may actually be swollen.

That is one of the reasons to eat light - not to continue in

cleansing mode, but to give the bladder time to regain strength

and " normalcy " .

Eating heavy foods may not have an immediate effect on the cleansing

process, but will put a heavier burden on your organs - This in turn

may increase the amount of time to heal your total system.

Food for thought.......(.......or thought for food)

~Suzanne

> then the last flush i just ate any old thing. meat, ice cream, some

raw foods. whatever i wanted. it was still a bit uncomfortable, but

alot more bearable.

> in a similar way, with the cleanses, initiating a cleansing

process, and then stopping it slowly is sort of confusing. hence

eating ice cream or meat can actually provide a benefit of resetting

the body state to one of non-cleansing. whereas eating light will

continue the cleansing mode but the closed duct will not allow any

more stones to pass.>

[Guest guest]

i agree with you in theory. and this might be your reality. but for the past

years i have eaten a high fat diet to facilitate colon cleansing. so this amount

of oil is actually not much of a departure from my normal diet. i drank 9 ounces

of oil last night like it was water. the weakness i feel is more stones stuck

in the gall bladder or stuck in the liver. i think this is what causes my

swelling. this is probably not the case with everyone or even the case for most

people. but i feel it is the case with me. i feel highly energized after passing

the stones, and then my energy drops low after eating-- no matter what i eat.

so, i'm going to trust myself on this and flush as often as i can without

getting too weak. over the years i have noticed that things are not always what

they seem. weakness masks itself as strength and vice versa.

if what you said was true, then my gall bladder would be swollen and irritated

right after the cleanse. this is not the case. it feels nice and warm and fuzzy

after the cleanse. then when i eat it starts acting up. and i've tried the

juices in the past, and still had problems.

i have even noticed the same swollen feeling from not eating. what i think is

going on is that, signals are being sent to the liver to make bile, and it has

been clogged for many years. my intuition tells me that faster i go, the better,

for now.

i think it all depends where you are coming from. for a normal healthy person

this is probably very bad advice. for a person who has been chronically ill,

this may be good advice, or it may be poor advice.

i am doing another flush tomorrow as i feel most of strength back now after

eating a good amount of food.

like i said, i have not had a normal system in quite some time. so applying the

logic of a healthy body to my body does not work. there is no normal for me to

fall back to until i regain my health. i will assume that if and when i get to

that state, then the light foods will work just fine.

[Guest guest]

Hello again,

In my humble opinion, you are on a path that may lead to much poor

health than you already experience.

Doing flushes too close to each other are not healthy. I hope that

you are trying to eat foods that will help to heal your gallbladder

and liver.

Your poor health may be a result of your general nutritianal habits.

Perhaps consultation with a certified nutritionist would be

beneficial.

Wishing you success on your pathway to health.

~Suzanne

>my intuition tells me that faster i go, the better, for now.

>

> i think it all depends where you are coming from. for a normal

healthy person this is probably very bad advice. for a person who has

been chronically ill, this may be good advice, or it may be poor

advice.

>

> i am doing another flush tomorrow as i feel most of strength back

now after eating a good amount of food.

[Guest guest]

Suzanne,

Arthur has CFS like myself.

From my experience, I very much doubt that this collection of symptoms is

caused by nutrition deficiencies alone. The symptoms are just too severe

I went to nutritionists in teh beginning but found they all say the same

thing, which is what they have learned, rather, than what seems appropriate

to my circumstances. For example, I was told to eat complex carbs, yet,

everytime I ate any carbs I would get very spacey. I think now this

spaciness is due to my mitochondria not handling sugar properly and that

needs to be addressed (which I am doing by eliminating toxins and addressing

glutathione, but it is a very long road). So I urge caution for those with

CFS to visit nutritionists.

But, I , too, am concerned about doing the flushes too close together.

After my first one, my BM's were not normal in color and I think that was

due to not enough good bacteria after the flush.

----- Original Message -----

From: " suzanne_on_ca " <suzanne_on_ca@...>

<gallstones >

Sent: Thursday, May 23, 2002 8:05 PM

Subject: Re: liver flush 16

> Hello again,

>

> In my humble opinion, you are on a path that may lead to much poor

> health than you already experience.

>

> Doing flushes too close to each other are not healthy. I hope that

> you are trying to eat foods that will help to heal your gallbladder

> and liver.

>

> Your poor health may be a result of your general nutritianal habits.

>

> Perhaps consultation with a certified nutritionist would be

> beneficial.

>

> Wishing you success on your pathway to health.

>

> ~Suzanne

>

> >my intuition tells me that faster i go, the better, for now.

> >

> > i think it all depends where you are coming from. for a normal

> healthy person this is probably very bad advice. for a person who has

> been chronically ill, this may be good advice, or it may be poor

> advice.

> >

> > i am doing another flush tomorrow as i feel most of strength back

> now after eating a good amount of food.

>

>

>

>

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[Guest guest]

what foods would you recommend i use for my gall bladder and liver. i am drawn

to eat more veggies these days. things like beets, avocado, greens, lime and

water, unheated honey, black beans, tomatos, watermelon. raw organic beef liver

is the best thing i have encountered for strengthening the liver, but i think

what i need now is cleansing. i will revisit building tissue when these flushes

have chilled out.

my colon and small intestine have been very impacted over the years. i have

passed over 100 pounds of gunk from the intestines, and the only thing that

seems to help is adding fats in the diet to help lubricate the release of this

waste. i also have lung problems and a dry hacking cough. fats seem to help

lubricate my lungs as well, and promote healing. i think people think of fat as

politically incorrect, but it heas heped me tremendously over the years.

i have sought help from over 40 'certified' nutritionists in the past. over 100

doctors. i have only found 2 people that have helped me so far. if there were

someone in the world that i trusted with my health i would seek their advice.

the best i have come up with so far is to trust myself. i have yet to meet a

human being who understands the human body. many people pretend, kid themselves

and others into thinking they know how things work, but my life experience has

taught me that no one really knows what is going on. some people have great

insights, and partial truths. i pick up what i perceive as truth and move

forward.

i have read that it is wise to wait between flushes, but my life experience is

that i feel better when doing more.

one of the people that i have some trust in required me to send him a detailed

history of my health since birth. this seems reasonable to me, and helped to

inspire some trust. another person has encouraged me to trust myself. this also

inspires confidence.

often when people enounter a different viewpoint than their own, they think it

will lead down the path of destruction. i am getting this sense from you.

i suspect that alot of my health problems stem from the massive amounts of

antibiotics i was given as a child and teenager. i also suspect that i am

dealing with mercury poisoning. medical tests have shown low thyroid and adrenal

function. i am hoping that the flushes will relieve stress on my adrenal glands

and allow them to heal. i have learned how to take care of my intestines with

diet.

when my liver is cleaned out, i will revisit my diet. i feel my appetite

changing dramatically as a result of the flushes.

8 years ago i was a vegetable, unable to move from out of bed. i have come a

long way, so something i am doing is working. i attribute my success so far to

what i have learned about diet. i have read hundreds of books on diet. not that

this means anything in the real world. i think the liver flush will help me

improve even farther than i have so far. already i have a much improved sense of

well-being. i can't wait to see what happens when the stones are gone.

sometimes i come up with theories, and they seem naive to people who think

inside the box. and yet every time i trust my intuition my health seems to

improve.

the reason i am doing so many flushes is that i feel that every time i eat, bile

flow is completely obstructed. i feel that this is infinitely more dangerous

than doing the flushes. i tried to address the problem with diet mainly using

raw foods, but my liver is too clogged up to go slowly. my preference would be

to go slowly, but this did not pan out for me, and i needed to take more

aggressive steps. my health problems warrant taking some risks. i try to

minimize them, but when something feels right i run with the ball. a healthy

person would not do well with what i am doing.

[Guest guest]

Off the top of my head, I recall that beets and dandelion are good

for the gallbladder liver. Please look in the group's bookmark

section for more info.

I do understand that it is very difficult, especially when faced with

severe medical problems, to get treatment streamlined to your

particular case. Continue searching and you will be doing your best

effort to achieve better health. But keep an open mind and listen

carefully/unbiased.

As far as you doing flushes so closely to one another... what are you

doing to replace the electrolytes which are expelled with each

flush? Are you getting any leg cramps or other symptems of nutrient

defficiency?

Everyone has a different viewpoint - hopefully one can respect

another human being for having their own view point. I do feel it a

part of my human calling - to help you see as much a part of the

total picture if I feel that it is to the betterment of your

health. But it is your responsibility to choose how you will act

upon the info. Remain respectful and choose your own path.

Wishing you success on your pathway to better health,

~Suzanne

> what foods would you recommend i use for my gall bladder and liver.

> i have sought help from over 40 'certified' nutritionists in the

past. over 100 doctors.

> i have read that it is wise to wait between flushes>

> often when people enounter a different viewpoint than their own,

they think it will lead down the path of destruction. i am getting

this sense from you.

[Guest guest]

to replace electrolytes i just eat or drink whatever i want. often this seems to

be salty foods. it seems to take me only a day or two to recover if i eat alot

of food.

i am not pushing passed my limits, just up to them.

i have had signs of nutritional deficiency for over 10 years, so there is no

normal for me to fall back to. it is a calculated risk to do so many cleanses.

so far it seems to be panning out.

i ate a large meal after that flush. nachos, chili, salad, potato chips. later

in the evening it felt like my body as was actually absorbing the food rather

than it causing distress. a great feeling.

i remain open to advice that strikes me as true for me at the moment. i think i

understood the intent of your message, and i am appreciative of your concern. at

the same time i feel like i need to draw lines at times so that people don't

assume i am a moron. i admittedly have a short fuse for people like this. that's

my problem. no apologies.

<<But keep an open mind and listen

carefully/unbiased.

>>

thanks, but i don't need you to tell me this.

<<But it is your responsibility to choose how you will act

upon the info.>>

i don't need you to tell me this either.

[Guest guest]

Arthur,

Just some thoughts here about eating all kinds of fat while flushing.

For me I found that for a few days right after a flush I could eat

anything without problems or colic pain. The large amounts of olive

oil in my system seemed to provide the 'coating' needed to make

things move along faster in my digestive system. Or, the oil helped

to absorb the foods without the need for large amounts of bile.

Whatever the case the flush will help you to either absorb or

eliminate the foods faster.

Dale has some great information on the types of fats that are good

for your body and the types that should be avoided like the processed

fats and foods. Maybe he can comment on your theory of practice.

I know it may seem to be working for your body on this next point but

it should be studied further to be sure. Gallstones can be made as

quickly as a few days or a week if you are ingesting the types of

food that will promote stones. Cholesterol can get out of whack and

cause stones to be made faster. While flushing your liver and

gallbladder it is better to diet properly to remove the toxins and

buildup of sludge or stones faster while not creating more.

You have said that you want to get to the bottom of the 'stones' in

your flushing. You may be actually making them as fast as you are

eliminating them. This reminds me (once again) of the girl who

flushed 133 times over 4 1/2 years eliminating over 6,000 of these

soft bile balls (stones) and was wondering when it would all stop.

This could be why. Increasing the oil and getting more could be an

indication that you are making more faster by eating everything

instead of getting the 'years of stones' out faster. Also without

dieting correctly you could be making more as well.

Some promoters of stone formation is rapid weight gain or loss.

Everyone wants to get past the problems they are having but nowhere

have I read in the liver cleanse sites about eating wild and flushing

daily. Maybe it will be a new breakthrough in flush methods. Let us

know if it is before the 4 1/2 years. :-)

Anyway, just some things to look into.

Good luck with your study and attempt for better results.

Barry.

> to replace electrolytes i just eat or drink whatever i want. often

this seems to be salty foods. it seems to take me only a day or two

to recover if i eat alot of food.

>

> i am not pushing passed my limits, just up to them.

>

> i have had signs of nutritional deficiency for over 10 years, so

there is no normal for me to fall back to. it is a calculated risk to

do so many cleanses. so far it seems to be panning out.

>

> i ate a large meal after that flush. nachos, chili, salad, potato

chips. later in the evening it felt like my body as was actually

absorbing the food rather than it causing distress. a great feeling.

>

> i remain open to advice that strikes me as true for me at the

moment. i think i understood the intent of your message, and i am

appreciative of your concern. at the same time i feel like i need to

draw lines at times so that people don't assume i am a moron. i

admittedly have a short fuse for people like this. that's my problem.

no apologies.

>

> <<But keep an open mind and listen

> carefully/unbiased.

> >>

>

> thanks, but i don't need you to tell me this.

>

> <<But it is your responsibility to choose how you will act

> upon the info.>>

>

> i don't need you to tell me this either.

>

>

>