Re: Re: Paw-Paw, graviolia

[Guest guest]

In a little over 3 months, my wife's tumor marker (for bile duct cancer)

literally exploded from normal to nearly 2000.  Her recent pet scan (taken

yesterday) shows multiple tumors covering her liver.  During this same time

period, the only difference in our diets has been is we added ORAC and

OPC3  (suppliments from Market America) to our diet.  We have also have been

taking every vitamin/supplement (powered greens) for years.

This is my big question.  I recently read about PAW-PAW and Gravoila, how they

reduce the ATP prodution in cancer cells, breaking up tumors, etc...but

I need more specific information from people like yourself who are more familiar

with these products.   I all read that they must be taken without any addition

supplements/vitamins to be affective.   Is this true? 

God bless all of you for your dedication in helping all those who are seeking

needed answers!

Neill

[Guest guest]

Neil,

It is best to avoid  extra Vit C and such as supplements 

while taking  Paw Paw but normal  Juice and natural intake of

vitamins is fine.

I would suggest  also Low dose naltrexone for  her as well.  All are compatible.

http://www.low dose naltrexone.org/

dee

http://www.ldn4cancer.com/

In a little over 3 months, my wife's tumor marker (for bile duct

cancer)literally exploded from normal to nearly 2000.  Her recent

pet scan (taken yesterday) shows multiple tumors covering her

liver.  During this same time period, the only difference in

our diets has been is we added ORAC and OPC3  (suppliments from Market America)

to our diet.  We have also have been taking every vitamin/supplement (powered

greens) for years.

This is my big question.  I recently read about PAW-PAW and

Gravoila, how they reduce the ATP prodution in cancer cells,

breaking up tumors, etc...but I need more specific

information from people like yourself who are more familiar with

these products.   I all read that they must be taken without

any addition supplements/ vitamins to be affective. Is this true? 

[Guest guest]

You know, for me, I chose to take Protocel 50 which also reduces the ATP of

cells and Germanium and enzymes when I couldn't digest very well. I made sure

all the supplements I took was for my metabolic type so the ATP level did not

increase and that my body would have a chance to digest this tumor. The brain

tumor took 14 years to fight away but only 1 1/2 years on Protocel 50. I also

took PAW-PAW when I could stomach the tea at its strongest with no honey in it.

It was fine. I think it is a good product but being that my tumors were not

yeast-based, PAW-PAW did not improve or hurt my condition. It just helped 'clean

up the blood'.

Johanne

From: neill russell

Sent: Wednesday, September 24, 2008 8:18 AM

Subject: Re: [ ] Re: Paw-Paw, graviolia

In a little over 3 months, my wife's tumor marker (for bile duct cancer)

literally exploded from normal to nearly 2000. Her recent pet scan (taken

yesterday) shows multiple tumors covering her liver. During this same time

period, the only difference in our diets has been is we added ORAC and OPC3

(suppliments from Market America) to our diet. We have also have been taking

every vitamin/supplement (powered greens) for years.

This is my big question. I recently read about PAW-PAW and Gravoila, how they

reduce the ATP prodution in cancer cells, breaking up tumors, etc...but I need

more specific information from people like yourself who are more familiar with

these products. I all read that they must be taken without any addition

supplements/vitamins to be affective. Is this true?

God bless all of you for your dedication in helping all those who are seeking

needed answers!

Neill

[Guest guest]

Neill,

Paw paw and graviola are botanically related plants. They both contain

chemicals called annonaceous acetogenins. Paw paw has a lot fewer types

of acetogenins, but the ones it contains are much stronger. The

acetogenins in graviola are not as potent, but there are many more

varieties than in the paw paw. A person could take both products and

they would probably have a synergistic effect. They do limit ATP

production. Most of their effect is on rapidly growing cells, so tumor

cells are particularly influenced. There may also be suppression of

normal cells, which might produce some fatigue at first. Normal cells

can tolerate ATP suppression much better than cancer cells. Only use

these products with food in the stomach.

Initially there was a lot of concern that a variety of antioxidants

might inhibit paw paw. This has proven untrue, for the most part. Some

reasonable supplementation with antioxidants is ok. You might still

want to avoid coenzyme Q10 and any type of drug that stimulates the thyroid.

Cantron and Protocel (similar synthetic formulas) also inhibit ATP

production, working on a different phase of electron transport then

either graviola or paw paw. The list of things to avoid are a bit

greater with either of these. Supplemental amounts of antioxidants are

discouraged. The products themselves are potent antioxidants. All

these products are likely synergistic. I suggest starting each

separately and for a couple of weeks before adding the next component.

This will minimize overly exuberant Herxheimer reactions.

Mike

neill russell wrote:

>

>

> In a little over 3 months, my wife's tumor marker (for bile duct

> cancer) literally exploded from normal to nearly 2000. Her recent pet

> scan (taken yesterday) shows multiple tumors covering her liver.

> During this same time period, the only difference in our diets has

> been is we added ORAC and OPC3 (suppliments from Market America) to

> our diet. We have also have been taking every vitamin/supplement

> (powered greens) for years.

>

> This is my big question. I recently read about PAW-PAW and Gravoila,

> how they reduce the ATP prodution in cancer cells, breaking up tumors,

> etc...but I need more specific information from people like yourself

> who are more familiar with these products. I all read that they must

> be taken without any addition supplements/vitamins to be affective.

> Is this true?

>

> God bless all of you for your dedication in helping all those who are

> seeking needed answers!

> Neill

>

>

[Guest guest]

The effective version of paw paw is made from the twigs of the North

American species. They must be harvested in the spring. The twigs

contain much higher amounts of the acetogenins than do the leaves or

fruit. The paw paw is generally not taken as a tea, but comes in

standardized capsules. The standardized version is Cel Reg. One takes 1

capsule, 4 times per day with food. I would not use another brand.

Cell reg was formulated under the direction of Jerry McLaughlin, the

primary paw paw researcher.

The way paw paw works on tumor cells has nothing to do with yeast. The

template of its double ringed acetogenins fortuitously fits electron

transport chain receptor sites along the mitochondrial membrane and

blocks other reactants. The effect is an inhibition of the chain at a

focal point resulting in a free radical cascade which can damage the

mitochondria. The reason paw paw, graviola and Cantron/Protocel all

work on brain tumors is that they all easily cross the blood brain

barrier, which most substances don't do.

Mike

Johanne wrote:

>

> You know, for me, I chose to take Protocel 50 which also reduces the

> ATP of cells and Germanium and enzymes when I couldn't digest very

> well. I made sure all the supplements I took was for my metabolic type

> so the ATP level did not increase and that my body would have a chance

> to digest this tumor. The brain tumor took 14 years to fight away but

> only 1 1/2 years on Protocel 50. I also took PAW-PAW when I could

> stomach the tea at its strongest with no honey in it. It was fine. I

> think it is a good product but being that my tumors were not

> yeast-based, PAW-PAW did not improve or hurt my condition. It just

> helped 'clean up the blood'.

>

> Johanne

>

> .

>

>

[Guest guest]

Mike,

1) While taking PolyMVA, i was told to stop graviola..Can you shed light on this

subject?

have you heard of Nutranomics Amazon Protocol? I was taking it..it seems to have

worked for a lot of people with large tumors, and they use a lot of things like

cats claw, astragalus.. many other things, too numerous to mention, along with

the graviola..but I stopped due to the Ploy MVA..

I have nothing against Poly MVA, but I am stopping after i finish the bottle,

because you also cant take any heavy metal detoxes , zeolite, etc, with it, or

too much Vitamin C, etc

2) BTW,re Hulda ..I know she has many wacky theories, but parasites could

very well be a cause of some cancers..

For e.g., one cause of bladder ca is suppsoed to be a parasite from N.

Africa..schistomiasis ( spelled something like that !!). It attacches to the

lining of the bladder, and inflames it ,eventually causing the cancer.

Also, Quillan at the Cancer covention aid that fungus CAN morph into a

parasite.

3) he also said that once he had a pt who had a toe fungus..all her toes were

black, so he gave her a prescription fo Nizoral, and made a ,mistake, making the

prescription long term , instead of just for 6 weeks.

A year later he ran into her, and she said " Thanks, I have been taking the

Nizoral for a year, and my cancer is GONE " ..That's when he first had the idea

that fungus could be a cause of cancer. Of course Nizoral can be very damaging

longterm, so I am not advocating that. But I am doing parasite, fungal and

heavy metal detox ( after I finish the Poly MVA)

4) Also, I agree that wheat grass juice can and has cured many cancers and other

diseases

From: Golden, D.C.

Neill,

Paw paw and graviola are botanically related plants. They both contain

chemicals called annonaceous acetogenins. Paw paw has a lot fewer types of

acetogenins, but the ones it contains are much stronger. The acetogenins in

graviola are not as potent, but there are many more varieties than in the paw

paw. A person could take both products and they would probably have a

synergistic effect. They do limit ATP production. Most of their effect is on

rapidly growing cells, so tumor cells are particularly influenced. There may

also be suppression of normal cells, which might produce some fatigue at first.

Normal cells can tolerate ATP suppression much better than cancer cells. Only

use these products with food in the stomach.

Initially there was a lot of concern that a variety of antioxidants might

inhibit paw paw. This has proven untrue, for the most part. Some reasonable

supplementation with antioxidants is ok. You might still want to avoid coenzyme

Q10 and any type of drug that stimulates the thyroid.

Cantron and Protocel (similar synthetic formulas) also inhibit ATP

production, working on a different phase of electron transport then

either graviola or paw paw. The list of things to avoid are a bit

greater with either of these. Supplemental amounts of antioxidants are

discouraged. The products themselves are potent antioxidants. All

these products are likely synergistic. I suggest starting each

separately and for a couple of weeks before adding the next component. This

will minimize overly exuberant Herxheimer reactions.

Mike

[Guest guest]

...my response are below....

VINCENT TOKATLIAN wrote:

>

> Mike,

>

> 1) While taking PolyMVA, i was told to stop graviola..Can you shed

> light on this subject?

>

Yes, PolyMVA provides an exotic metal to drive electron transport. The

goal is to rev the cancer cell into crashing. The " death event " for the

cell is still via oxidation by free radicals. For this reason the use

of antioxidants is also discouraged. Paw paw and the like would probably

work counter to the goal of PolyMVA and vice versa.

Mike....more to follow due to editing problems...

>

>

> .

>

>

[Guest guest]

,

The more I read about , the lower my opinion goes.

Yes, parasites can cause cancer, bacteria can cause cancer, virus can

cause cancer, toxic chemicals can cause cancer (creosote was the first

carcinogen ever identified. It caused scrotal cancer in chimney

sweeps.), mechanical irritation can cause cancer( consider mesothelioma

due to lung penetration by asbestos fibers (chemically inert)), and

radiation can cause cancer. What is the commonality here? Well, one

thing is that each of these things causes inflammation. Other

endogenous chemicals that make us more inflammatory are often known to

be connected to cancer (consider estrogen, consider polyunsaturated

fats...) So, it appears to me that cancer is fundamentally triggered by

inflammation...independent of the cause of the inflammation.

Fungus already is a parasite, so it does not have to be transformed into

anything. Yeast and fungus can morph back and forth. If you are

suggesting that fungus can morph into a completely unrelated type of

organism, such as schistosoma....no, outside of divine intervention,

that can't happen.

Mike

VINCENT TOKATLIAN wrote:

>

> Mike,

>

> 1

>

> 2) BTW,re Hulda ..I know she has many wacky theories, but

> parasites could very well be a cause of some cancers..

> For e.g., one cause of bladder ca is suppsoed to be a parasite from N.

> Africa..schistomiasis ( spelled something like that !!). It attacches

> to the lining of the bladder, and inflames it ,eventually causing the

> cancer.

> Also, Quillan at the Cancer covention aid that fungus CAN

> morph into a parasite.

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

I just said what Pat Quillan said...I did NOt say that the parasite that may

cause bladder ca morphs from a fungus

From: Golden, D.C.

,

The more I read about , the lower my opinion goes.

Yes, parasites can cause cancer, bacteria can cause cancer, virus can cause

cancer, toxic chemicals can cause cancer (creosote was the first carcinogen ever

identified. It caused scrotal cancer in chimney

sweeps.), mechanical irritation can cause cancer( consider mesothelioma due to

lung penetration by asbestos fibers (chemically inert)), and radiation can cause

cancer. What is the commonality here? Well, one thing is that each of these

things causes inflammation. Other endogenous chemicals that make us more

inflammatory are often known to be connected to cancer (consider estrogen,

consider polyunsaturated fats...) So, it appears to me that cancer is

fundamentally triggered by inflammation...independent of the cause of the

inflammation. Fungus already is a parasite, so it does not have to be

transformed into anything. Yeast and fungus can morph back and forth. If you are

suggesting that fungus can morph into a completely unrelated type of organism,

such as schistosoma....no, outside of divine intervention, that can't happen.