Re: need help with the labs

November 22, 2009

Yes but in condition before raising estrogens we need to see how they are

metabolized so to speak to not add more fuel to the fire..This is where dr's

mess up and end up potentially doing severe harm to patients

> > >

> > > >Phil, you have 27 yrs of TRT history? You didn't

> > have ED issues in the beginning? Retro, I don't know your

> > history , but the same question applies to your history as

> > well. I thought low T and ED go hand-in-hand.

> > > >

> > > >I have no choice but to be patient with the

> > process back to where I'd like to be. I quess I have to

> > accept the outcome. There was a guy posting here last month

> > saying his penial function did'nt return. I don't know his

> > situation, but maybe this is what's in my future. Since I

> > have a history of testicular cancer, maybe this could be a

> > factor. I had radiation though, not chemo.

> > >

> > > If I recall your T is so low your E2 is low also. that

> > would be an ED

> > > issue and libido killer.

> > >

> > > I suspect when you get your T up and your E2 down,

> > things will

> > > improve.

> > >

> >

> > ------------------------------------

> >

November 22, 2009

I had my Beta hCG checked this pass june as a routine test for my

testicular cancer survailance. It came in at <2 (range 0-9). Probably

adding this will help a lot. Here's an interesting link for any guy that

had testicular cancer . www.ergo-log.com/hcg.html

<http://www.ergo-log.com/hcg.html> .

> > > > > >

> > > > > > >Phil, you have 27 yrs of TRT history?

> > > You didn't

> > > > > have ED issues in the beginning? Retro, I don't

> > > know your

> > > > > history , but the same question applies to your

> > > history as

> > > > > well. I thought low T and ED go hand-in-hand.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >I have no choice but to be patient with

> > > the

> > > > > process back to where I'd like to be. I quess I

> > > have to

> > > > > accept the outcome. There was a guy posting here

> > > last month

> > > > > saying his penial function did'nt return. I don't

> > > know his

> > > > > situation, but maybe this is what's in my future.

> > > Since I

> > > > > have a history of testicular cancer, maybe this

> > > could be a

> > > > > factor. I had radiation though, not chemo.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > If I recall your T is so low your E2 is low

> > > also. that

> > > > > would be an ED

> > > > > > issue and libido killer.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I suspect when you get your T up and your E2

> > > down,

> > > > > things will

> > > > > > improve.

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > ------------------------------------

> > > > >

November 29, 2009

I am now on 10 gram compounded cream for 2 weeks now. My T came in at 460, down

from 544 (5 gram) 2 weeks ago. How could it go down? Other test results are not

in but probably my E2 is still very low. I did forget to fast the morning of the

test. This just depresses the shit out of me.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >Phil, you have 27 yrs of TRT history?

> > > > You didn't

> > > > > > have ED issues in the beginning? Retro, I don't

> > > > know your

> > > > > > history , but the same question applies to your

> > > > history as

> > > > > > well. I thought low T and ED go hand-in-hand.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >I have no choice but to be patient with

> > > > the

> > > > > > process back to where I'd like to be. I quess I

> > > > have to

> > > > > > accept the outcome. There was a guy posting here

> > > > last month

> > > > > > saying his penial function did'nt return. I don't

> > > > know his

> > > > > > situation, but maybe this is what's in my future.

> > > > Since I

> > > > > > have a history of testicular cancer, maybe this

> > > > could be a

> > > > > > factor. I had radiation though, not chemo.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > If I recall your T is so low your E2 is low

> > > > also. that

> > > > > > would be an ED

> > > > > > > issue and libido killer.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > I suspect when you get your T up and your E2

> > > > down,

> > > > > > things will

> > > > > > > improve.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > ------------------------------------

> > > > > >

November 29, 2009

Jim how are you putting on this cream when I was on it I put it on the in side

of my forearms. I don't feel this is working for you did you get this cream

from your Dr. it's not getting through your skin try shots starting at 100 mgs

every week.

Co-Moderator

Phil

> From: jim <virtuosa150@...>

> Subject: Re: need help with the labs

>

> Date: Sunday, November 29, 2009, 5:59 AM

> I am now on 10 gram compounded cream

> for 2 weeks now. My T came in at 460, down from 544 (5 gram)

> 2 weeks ago. How could it go down? Other test results are

> not in but probably my E2 is still very low. I did forget to

> fast the morning of the test. This just depresses the shit

> out of me.

>

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >Phil, you have 27

> yrs of TRT history?

> > > > > You didn't

> > > > > > > have ED issues in the

> beginning? Retro, I don't

> > > > > know your

> > > > > > > history , but the same

> question applies to your

> > > > > history as

> > > > > > > well. I thought low T and ED

> go hand-in-hand.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >I have no choice but

> to be patient with

> > > > > the

> > > > > > > process back to where I'd

> like to be. I quess I

> > > > > have to

> > > > > > > accept the outcome. There was

> a guy posting here

> > > > > last month

> > > > > > > saying his penial function

> did'nt return. I don't

> > > > > know his

> > > > > > > situation, but maybe this is

> what's in my future.

> > > > > Since I

> > > > > > > have a history of testicular

> cancer, maybe this

> > > > > could be a

> > > > > > > factor. I had radiation

> though, not chemo.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > If I recall your T is so

> low your E2 is low

> > > > > also. that

> > > > > > > would be an ED

> > > > > > > > issue and libido

> killer.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > I suspect when you get

> your T up and your E2

> > > > > down,

> > > > > > > things will

> > > > > > > > improve.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> ------------------------------------

> > > > > > >

November 29, 2009

Phil is right how did you apply the gel. Did you touch it with your fingers.

Since absorption is not going well and thyroid looks optimal shots would be the

way to go because we do not want to waste time and get you feeling better. We

tried and it was not for you.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >Phil, you have 27

> > yrs of TRT history?

> > > > > > You didn't

> > > > > > > > have ED issues in the

> > beginning? Retro, I don't

> > > > > > know your

> > > > > > > > history , but the same

> > question applies to your

> > > > > > history as

> > > > > > > > well. I thought low T and ED

> > go hand-in-hand.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >I have no choice but

> > to be patient with

> > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > process back to where I'd

> > like to be. I quess I

> > > > > > have to

> > > > > > > > accept the outcome. There was

> > a guy posting here

> > > > > > last month

> > > > > > > > saying his penial function

> > did'nt return. I don't

> > > > > > know his

> > > > > > > > situation, but maybe this is

> > what's in my future.

> > > > > > Since I

> > > > > > > > have a history of testicular

> > cancer, maybe this

> > > > > > could be a

> > > > > > > > factor. I had radiation

> > though, not chemo.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > If I recall your T is so

> > low your E2 is low

> > > > > > also. that

> > > > > > > > would be an ED

> > > > > > > > > issue and libido

> > killer.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > I suspect when you get

> > your T up and your E2

> > > > > > down,

> > > > > > > > things will

> > > > > > > > > improve.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > ------------------------------------

> > > > > > > >

November 29, 2009

I have been using compounded T cream for more than 3 years (switched from

Androgel). I got results (improvement) from day 1. It really works well with

me.

If you are using cream (not a gel with alcohol), try trimming your skin hair (do

not use a razor; use a beard trimmer or nail scisors) on the application site

and give the cream a new try.

Also, I prefer my thighs (sides) or hamstrings instead of my arms. I apply the

cream twice a day: morning (left) evening (right) thigh. Rub it on well until

it completely dissapears (do not have to press hard on skin; gentle rub is all

that is needed). Leave the skin uncovered (do not put on pants) for about 5

minutes and then, enjoy life.

If this does not work, then shots may be for you.

Best of luck!

Flaco.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >Phil, you have 27

> > > yrs of TRT history?

> > > > > > > You didn't

> > > > > > > > > have ED issues in the

> > > beginning? Retro, I don't

> > > > > > > know your

> > > > > > > > > history , but the same

> > > question applies to your

> > > > > > > history as

> > > > > > > > > well. I thought low T and ED

> > > go hand-in-hand.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >I have no choice but

> > > to be patient with

> > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > process back to where I'd

> > > like to be. I quess I

> > > > > > > have to

> > > > > > > > > accept the outcome. There was

> > > a guy posting here

> > > > > > > last month

> > > > > > > > > saying his penial function

> > > did'nt return. I don't

> > > > > > > know his

> > > > > > > > > situation, but maybe this is

> > > what's in my future.

> > > > > > > Since I

> > > > > > > > > have a history of testicular

> > > cancer, maybe this

> > > > > > > could be a

> > > > > > > > > factor. I had radiation

> > > though, not chemo.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > If I recall your T is so

> > > low your E2 is low

> > > > > > > also. that

> > > > > > > > > would be an ED

> > > > > > > > > > issue and libido

> > > killer.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > I suspect when you get

> > > your T up and your E2

> > > > > > > down,

> > > > > > > > > things will

> > > > > > > > > > improve.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > ------------------------------------

> > > > > > > > >

November 29, 2009

I put on the forearm, then rub both forearms together. I never touch it with my

hands. I rub it in as good as possible. Are there extreme ups and downs with the

injectables?

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >Phil, you have 27

> > > yrs of TRT history?

> > > > > > > You didn't

> > > > > > > > > have ED issues in the

> > > beginning? Retro, I don't

> > > > > > > know your

> > > > > > > > > history , but the same

> > > question applies to your

> > > > > > > history as

> > > > > > > > > well. I thought low T and ED

> > > go hand-in-hand.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >I have no choice but

> > > to be patient with

> > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > process back to where I'd

> > > like to be. I quess I

> > > > > > > have to

> > > > > > > > > accept the outcome. There was

> > > a guy posting here

> > > > > > > last month

> > > > > > > > > saying his penial function

> > > did'nt return. I don't

> > > > > > > know his

> > > > > > > > > situation, but maybe this is

> > > what's in my future.

> > > > > > > Since I

> > > > > > > > > have a history of testicular

> > > cancer, maybe this

> > > > > > > could be a

> > > > > > > > > factor. I had radiation

> > > though, not chemo.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > If I recall your T is so

> > > low your E2 is low

> > > > > > > also. that

> > > > > > > > > would be an ED

> > > > > > > > > > issue and libido

> > > killer.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > I suspect when you get

> > > your T up and your E2

> > > > > > > down,

> > > > > > > > > things will

> > > > > > > > > > improve.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > ------------------------------------

> > > > > > > > >

November 29, 2009

I do shots gels and creams don't get through my skin thyroid problem. I do like

Dr. Shippen " The Testosterone Syndrome " author dose I do shots every 3 days and

add in HCG the 2 days each in between this keeps me leveled and holds down

Estradiol and keeps my blood thinner.

A lot of men do great just doing a 100 mgs shot every week and adding 250 IU's

of HCG the 2 days each just before there next T shot. Others do shot 2x's a

week.

Co-Moderator

Phil

> From: jim <virtuosa150@...>

> Subject: Re: need help with the labs

>

> Date: Sunday, November 29, 2009, 11:33 AM

> I put on the forearm, then rub both

> forearms together. I never touch it with my hands. I rub it

> in as good as possible. Are there extreme ups and downs with

> the injectables?

>

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >Phil,

> you have 27

> > > > yrs of TRT history?

> > > > > > > > You didn't

> > > > > > > > > > have ED issues

> in the

> > > > beginning? Retro, I don't

> > > > > > > > know your

> > > > > > > > > > history , but

> the same

> > > > question applies to your

> > > > > > > > history as

> > > > > > > > > > well. I

> thought low T and ED

> > > > go hand-in-hand.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >I

> have no choice but

> > > > to be patient with

> > > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > > process back

> to where I'd

> > > > like to be. I quess I

> > > > > > > > have to

> > > > > > > > > > accept the

> outcome. There was

> > > > a guy posting here

> > > > > > > > last month

> > > > > > > > > > saying his

> penial function

> > > > did'nt return. I don't

> > > > > > > > know his

> > > > > > > > > > situation, but

> maybe this is

> > > > what's in my future.

> > > > > > > > Since I

> > > > > > > > > > have a history

> of testicular

> > > > cancer, maybe this

> > > > > > > > could be a

> > > > > > > > > > factor. I had

> radiation

> > > > though, not chemo.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > If I

> recall your T is so

> > > > low your E2 is low

> > > > > > > > also. that

> > > > > > > > > > would be an

> ED

> > > > > > > > > > > issue and

> libido

> > > > killer.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > I suspect

> when you get

> > > > your T up and your E2

> > > > > > > > down,

> > > > > > > > > > things will

> > > > > > > > > > > improve.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > ------------------------------------

> > > > > > > > > >

> Links

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > -fullfeatured

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> ------------------------------------

> > > > > > > >

November 29, 2009

The shots to me seem like they would be the way to go. Don't have to smear the

cream all over. Once the proper protocol is found, I would think it would be a

matter of routine, of course keeping the eye on the E2 level. My E2 seems like

it will never rise. amybe I should go on a mega dose of hcg for a few weeks.

Just my speculation, I don't really know.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >Phil,

> > you have 27

> > > > > yrs of TRT history?

> > > > > > > > > You didn't

> > > > > > > > > > > have ED issues

> > in the

> > > > > beginning? Retro, I don't

> > > > > > > > > know your

> > > > > > > > > > > history , but

> > the same

> > > > > question applies to your

> > > > > > > > > history as

> > > > > > > > > > > well. I

> > thought low T and ED

> > > > > go hand-in-hand.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >I

> > have no choice but

> > > > > to be patient with

> > > > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > > > process back

> > to where I'd

> > > > > like to be. I quess I

> > > > > > > > > have to

> > > > > > > > > > > accept the

> > outcome. There was

> > > > > a guy posting here

> > > > > > > > > last month

> > > > > > > > > > > saying his

> > penial function

> > > > > did'nt return. I don't

> > > > > > > > > know his

> > > > > > > > > > > situation, but

> > maybe this is

> > > > > what's in my future.

> > > > > > > > > Since I

> > > > > > > > > > > have a history

> > of testicular

> > > > > cancer, maybe this

> > > > > > > > > could be a

> > > > > > > > > > > factor. I had

> > radiation

> > > > > though, not chemo.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > If I

> > recall your T is so

> > > > > low your E2 is low

> > > > > > > > > also. that

> > > > > > > > > > > would be an

> > ED

> > > > > > > > > > > > issue and

> > libido

> > > > > killer.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > I suspect

> > when you get

> > > > > your T up and your E2

> > > > > > > > > down,

> > > > > > > > > > > things will

> > > > > > > > > > > > improve.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > ------------------------------------

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > Links

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > -fullfeatured

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > ------------------------------------

> > > > > > > > >

November 29, 2009

Talk to your Dr. about it low E2 levels are just as bad as being to high. I use

a small needle 27g 1ml. x 1/2 " lg. needle and shoot into my thigh not bit of

pain and my levels are great.

Co-Moderator

Phil

> From: jim <virtuosa150@...>

> Subject: Re: need help with the labs

>

> Date: Sunday, November 29, 2009, 1:55 PM

>

> The shots to me seem like they would be the way to go.

> Don't have to smear the cream all over. Once the proper

> protocol is found, I would think it would be a matter of

> routine, of course keeping the eye on the E2 level. My E2

> seems like it will never rise. amybe I should go on a mega

> dose of hcg for a few weeks. Just my speculation, I don't

> really know.

>

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> >Phil,

> > > you have 27

> > > > > > yrs of TRT history?

> > > > > > > > > > You didn't

> > > > > > > > > > > > have

> ED issues

> > > in the

> > > > > > beginning? Retro, I don't

> > > > > > > > > > know your

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> history , but

> > > the same

> > > > > > question applies to your

> > > > > > > > > > history as

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> well. I

> > > thought low T and ED

> > > > > > go hand-in-hand.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> >I

> > > have no choice but

> > > > > > to be patient with

> > > > > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> process back

> > > to where I'd

> > > > > > like to be. I quess I

> > > > > > > > > > have to

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> accept the

> > > outcome. There was

> > > > > > a guy posting here

> > > > > > > > > > last month

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> saying his

> > > penial function

> > > > > > did'nt return. I don't

> > > > > > > > > > know his

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> situation, but

> > > maybe this is

> > > > > > what's in my future.

> > > > > > > > > > Since I

> > > > > > > > > > > > have

> a history

> > > of testicular

> > > > > > cancer, maybe this

> > > > > > > > > > could be a

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> factor. I had

> > > radiation

> > > > > > though, not chemo.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> If I

> > > recall your T is so

> > > > > > low your E2 is low

> > > > > > > > > > also. that

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> would be an

> > > ED

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> issue and

> > > libido

> > > > > > killer.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> I suspect

> > > when you get

> > > > > > your T up and your E2

> > > > > > > > > > down,

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> things will

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> improve.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > >

> ------------------------------------

> > > > > > > > > > > >

>

> > > Links

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> -fullfeatured

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > ------------------------------------

> > > > > > > > > >

> Links

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > -fullfeatured

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this

> message have

> > > been removed]

> > > > > > >

> > > > > >

> ------------------------------------

> > > > > >

November 30, 2009

That's right, the symptoms of low E can mimick that of high.

But make sure the testing you have done for the E is valid; unless it's a

sensitive or ultrasensitive assay, it is not. And NEVER treat E based upon

saliva testing. The saliva glands make their own sex hormones.

I have had only two cases of valid low E in thousands of patients. I used DHEA

to elevate same.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > >Phil,

> > > > you have 27

> > > > > > > yrs of TRT history?

> > > > > > > > > > > You didn't

> > > > > > > > > > > > > have

> > ED issues

> > > > in the

> > > > > > > beginning? Retro, I don't

> > > > > > > > > > > know your

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > history , but

> > > > the same

> > > > > > > question applies to your

> > > > > > > > > > > history as

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > well. I

> > > > thought low T and ED

> > > > > > > go hand-in-hand.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > >I

> > > > have no choice but

> > > > > > > to be patient with

> > > > > > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > process back

> > > > to where I'd

> > > > > > > like to be. I quess I

> > > > > > > > > > > have to

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > accept the

> > > > outcome. There was

> > > > > > > a guy posting here

> > > > > > > > > > > last month

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > saying his

> > > > penial function

> > > > > > > did'nt return. I don't

> > > > > > > > > > > know his

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > situation, but

> > > > maybe this is

> > > > > > > what's in my future.

> > > > > > > > > > > Since I

> > > > > > > > > > > > > have

> > a history

> > > > of testicular

> > > > > > > cancer, maybe this

> > > > > > > > > > > could be a

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > factor. I had

> > > > radiation

> > > > > > > though, not chemo.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > If I

> > > > recall your T is so

> > > > > > > low your E2 is low

> > > > > > > > > > > also. that

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > would be an

> > > > ED

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > issue and

> > > > libido

> > > > > > > killer.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > I suspect

> > > > when you get

> > > > > > > your T up and your E2

> > > > > > > > > > > down,

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > things will

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > improve.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > ------------------------------------

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> >

> > > > Links

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > -fullfeatured

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > ------------------------------------

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > Links

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > -fullfeatured

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this

> > message have

> > > > been removed]

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > ------------------------------------

> > > > > > >

November 30, 2009

No there are not severe ups and downs and with your ability to handle the

estrogen you have a great advantage over most men ...

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >Phil, you have 27

> > > > yrs of TRT history?

> > > > > > > > You didn't

> > > > > > > > > > have ED issues in the

> > > > beginning? Retro, I don't

> > > > > > > > know your

> > > > > > > > > > history , but the same

> > > > question applies to your

> > > > > > > > history as

> > > > > > > > > > well. I thought low T and ED

> > > > go hand-in-hand.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >I have no choice but

> > > > to be patient with

> > > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > > process back to where I'd

> > > > like to be. I quess I

> > > > > > > > have to

> > > > > > > > > > accept the outcome. There was

> > > > a guy posting here

> > > > > > > > last month

> > > > > > > > > > saying his penial function

> > > > did'nt return. I don't

> > > > > > > > know his

> > > > > > > > > > situation, but maybe this is

> > > > what's in my future.

> > > > > > > > Since I

> > > > > > > > > > have a history of testicular

> > > > cancer, maybe this

> > > > > > > > could be a

> > > > > > > > > > factor. I had radiation

> > > > though, not chemo.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > If I recall your T is so

> > > > low your E2 is low

> > > > > > > > also. that

> > > > > > > > > > would be an ED

> > > > > > > > > > > issue and libido

> > > > killer.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > I suspect when you get

> > > > your T up and your E2

> > > > > > > > down,

> > > > > > > > > > things will

> > > > > > > > > > > improve.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > ------------------------------------

> > > > > > > > > >

November 30, 2009

I can't wait to get the ball rolling on this.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >Phil, you have 27

> > > > > yrs of TRT history?

> > > > > > > > > You didn't

> > > > > > > > > > > have ED issues in the

> > > > > beginning? Retro, I don't

> > > > > > > > > know your

> > > > > > > > > > > history , but the same

> > > > > question applies to your

> > > > > > > > > history as

> > > > > > > > > > > well. I thought low T and ED

> > > > > go hand-in-hand.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >I have no choice but

> > > > > to be patient with

> > > > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > > > process back to where I'd

> > > > > like to be. I quess I

> > > > > > > > > have to

> > > > > > > > > > > accept the outcome. There was

> > > > > a guy posting here

> > > > > > > > > last month

> > > > > > > > > > > saying his penial function

> > > > > did'nt return. I don't

> > > > > > > > > know his

> > > > > > > > > > > situation, but maybe this is

> > > > > what's in my future.

> > > > > > > > > Since I

> > > > > > > > > > > have a history of testicular

> > > > > cancer, maybe this

> > > > > > > > > could be a

> > > > > > > > > > > factor. I had radiation

> > > > > though, not chemo.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > If I recall your T is so

> > > > > low your E2 is low

> > > > > > > > > also. that

> > > > > > > > > > > would be an ED

> > > > > > > > > > > > issue and libido

> > > > > killer.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > I suspect when you get

> > > > > your T up and your E2

> > > > > > > > > down,

> > > > > > > > > > > things will

> > > > > > > > > > > > improve.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > ------------------------------------

> > > > > > > > > > >

November 30, 2009

Often when T is low E comes up in comparison. So does DHT.

Not sure why, but its like when, in the hot summer, your lawn burns up. But the

weeds then thrive.

>

> >Phil, you have 27 yrs of TRT history? You didn't have ED issues in the

beginning? Retro, I don't know your history , but the same question applies to

your history as well. I thought low T and ED go hand-in-hand.

> >

> >I have no choice but to be patient with the process back to where I'd like to

be. I quess I have to accept the outcome. There was a guy posting here last

month saying his penial function did'nt return. I don't know his situation, but

maybe this is what's in my future. Since I have a history of testicular cancer,

maybe this could be a factor. I had radiation though, not chemo.

>

> If I recall your T is so low your E2 is low also. that would be an ED

> issue and libido killer.

>

> I suspect when you get your T up and your E2 down, things will

> improve.

>

November 30, 2009

Not true. DHEA and 7-keto DHEA are almost comnpletely different substances. You

cannot get the 7-keto form to perform as DHEA does in normalizing pathways.

DHEA's inclusion as a sex hormone is a good thing (unless you take too much).

7-keto is for dieting.

> > > > >

> > > > > >Phil, you have 27 yrs of TRT history? You didn't

> > > > have ED issues in the beginning? Retro, I don't know your

> > > > history , but the same question applies to your history as

> > > > well. I thought low T and ED go hand-in-hand.

> > > > > >

> > > > > >I have no choice but to be patient with the

> > > > process back to where I'd like to be. I quess I have to

> > > > accept the outcome. There was a guy posting here last month

> > > > saying his penial function did'nt return. I don't know his

> > > > situation, but maybe this is what's in my future. Since I

> > > > have a history of testicular cancer, maybe this could be a

> > > > factor. I had radiation though, not chemo.

> > > > >

> > > > > If I recall your T is so low your E2 is low also. that

> > > > would be an ED

> > > > > issue and libido killer.

> > > > >

> > > > > I suspect when you get your T up and your E2 down,

> > > > things will

> > > > > improve.

> > > > >

> > > >

> > > > ------------------------------------

> > > >

December 2, 2009

Just got more blood test results. In addition to the 460 T, my E2 is at 8, down

from 14 a few weeks ago. How the F... does this happen? All thyroid looks ok

except reverse T3 which is high. I've read about a compounded sustained release

T3. Anyone know about this?

I have an appt. with HAN & Dr. O coming up. We'll be discussing injectible T and

hCG. What's a good dose of each? I don't want any starter dose of this stuff. I

want a dose that will show some results.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >Phil, you have 27 yrs of TRT history?

> > > > > You didn't

> > > > > > > have ED issues in the beginning? Retro, I don't

> > > > > know your

> > > > > > > history , but the same question applies to your

> > > > > history as

> > > > > > > well. I thought low T and ED go hand-in-hand.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >I have no choice but to be patient with

> > > > > the

> > > > > > > process back to where I'd like to be. I quess I

> > > > > have to

> > > > > > > accept the outcome. There was a guy posting here

> > > > > last month

> > > > > > > saying his penial function did'nt return. I don't

> > > > > know his

> > > > > > > situation, but maybe this is what's in my future.

> > > > > Since I

> > > > > > > have a history of testicular cancer, maybe this

> > > > > could be a

> > > > > > > factor. I had radiation though, not chemo.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > If I recall your T is so low your E2 is low

> > > > > also. that

> > > > > > > would be an ED

> > > > > > > > issue and libido killer.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > I suspect when you get your T up and your E2

> > > > > down,

> > > > > > > things will

> > > > > > > > improve.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > ------------------------------------

> > > > > > >

December 3, 2009

You can get a cicker or jump start shot of 200 mgs then do 100 mgs every week

after a time do labs see if your feeling better and your labs are up into the

upper 1/3 of your labs range. Hard and Dr. O are dam good at this. One needs

to do about 250 IU's of HCG the 2 days each befor your next shot this helps keep

you leveled.

Co-Moderator

Phil

> From: jim <virtuosa150@...>

> Subject: Re: need help with the labs

>

> Date: Wednesday, December 2, 2009, 7:29 PM

> Just got more blood test results. In

> addition to the 460 T, my E2 is at 8, down from 14 a few

> weeks ago. How the F... does this happen? All thyroid looks

> ok except reverse T3 which is high. I've read about a

> compounded sustained release T3. Anyone know about this?

>

> I have an appt. with HAN & Dr. O coming up. We'll be

> discussing injectible T and hCG. What's a good dose of each?

> I don't want any starter dose of this stuff. I want a dose

> that will show some results.

>

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >Phil, you have

> 27 yrs of TRT history?

> > > > > > You didn't

> > > > > > > > have ED issues in the

> beginning? Retro, I don't

> > > > > > know your

> > > > > > > > history , but the same

> question applies to your

> > > > > > history as

> > > > > > > > well. I thought low T

> and ED go hand-in-hand.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >I have no

> choice but to be patient with

> > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > process back to where

> I'd like to be. I quess I

> > > > > > have to

> > > > > > > > accept the outcome.

> There was a guy posting here

> > > > > > last month

> > > > > > > > saying his penial

> function did'nt return. I don't

> > > > > > know his

> > > > > > > > situation, but maybe

> this is what's in my future.

> > > > > > Since I

> > > > > > > > have a history of

> testicular cancer, maybe this

> > > > > > could be a

> > > > > > > > factor. I had radiation

> though, not chemo.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > If I recall your T

> is so low your E2 is low

> > > > > > also. that

> > > > > > > > would be an ED

> > > > > > > > > issue and libido

> killer.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > I suspect when you

> get your T up and your E2

> > > > > > down,

> > > > > > > > things will

> > > > > > > > > improve.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> ------------------------------------

> > > > > > > >

December 4, 2009

Would 200 mg shots for several weeks be too much and higher hcg as well? What

could be added to bring up low cortisol levels and address high rt3? None of

these numbers are going in the right direction.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >Phil, you have

> > 27 yrs of TRT history?

> > > > > > > You didn't

> > > > > > > > > have ED issues in the

> > beginning? Retro, I don't

> > > > > > > know your

> > > > > > > > > history , but the same

> > question applies to your

> > > > > > > history as

> > > > > > > > > well. I thought low T

> > and ED go hand-in-hand.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >I have no

> > choice but to be patient with

> > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > process back to where

> > I'd like to be. I quess I

> > > > > > > have to

> > > > > > > > > accept the outcome.

> > There was a guy posting here

> > > > > > > last month

> > > > > > > > > saying his penial

> > function did'nt return. I don't

> > > > > > > know his

> > > > > > > > > situation, but maybe

> > this is what's in my future.

> > > > > > > Since I

> > > > > > > > > have a history of

> > testicular cancer, maybe this

> > > > > > > could be a

> > > > > > > > > factor. I had radiation

> > though, not chemo.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > If I recall your T

> > is so low your E2 is low

> > > > > > > also. that

> > > > > > > > > would be an ED

> > > > > > > > > > issue and libido

> > killer.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > I suspect when you

> > get your T up and your E2

> > > > > > > down,

> > > > > > > > > things will

> > > > > > > > > > improve.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > ------------------------------------

> > > > > > > > >

December 4, 2009

Your first shot can be 200 mgs but after this one you must do a lower dose 100

mgs every week to start. Do add in HCG but only do 250 IU's the 2 days before

your next shot each. Doing this will keep you leveled and feeling better. In

about 8 weeks do labs I do these.

Here is what I am have done at Quest Labs

Estradiol sensitive Code #4021

Testosterone, Free, Bioavailable & Total LC/MS/MS Code # 14966X.

Your Dr. can all to this what he feels he needs like checking your blood to see

if it's getting to thick.

If you not feeling better on this and your labs are not up into the upper 1/3 of

your labs range with your Estraidol down to about 20 pg/ml add in more. We keep

Estradiol levels down taking Arimidex if you need to use this post to us so we

can tell you how to take this and not go down to low.

Co-Moderator

Phil

> From: jim <virtuosa150@...>

> Subject: Re: need help with the labs

>

> Date: Friday, December 4, 2009, 6:33 AM

> Would 200 mg shots for several weeks

> be too much and higher hcg as well? What could be added to

> bring up low cortisol levels and address high rt3? None of

> these numbers are going in the right direction.

>

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >Phil,

> you have

> > > 27 yrs of TRT history?

> > > > > > > > You didn't

> > > > > > > > > > have ED issues

> in the

> > > beginning? Retro, I don't

> > > > > > > > know your

> > > > > > > > > > history , but

> the same

> > > question applies to your

> > > > > > > > history as

> > > > > > > > > > well. I

> thought low T

> > > and ED go hand-in-hand.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >I

> have no

> > > choice but to be patient with

> > > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > > process back

> to where

> > > I'd like to be. I quess I

> > > > > > > > have to

> > > > > > > > > > accept the

> outcome.

> > > There was a guy posting here

> > > > > > > > last month

> > > > > > > > > > saying his

> penial

> > > function did'nt return. I don't

> > > > > > > > know his

> > > > > > > > > > situation, but

> maybe

> > > this is what's in my future.

> > > > > > > > Since I

> > > > > > > > > > have a history

> of

> > > testicular cancer, maybe this

> > > > > > > > could be a

> > > > > > > > > > factor. I had

> radiation

> > > though, not chemo.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > If I

> recall your T

> > > is so low your E2 is low

> > > > > > > > also. that

> > > > > > > > > > would be an

> ED

> > > > > > > > > > > issue and

> libido

> > > killer.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > I suspect

> when you

> > > get your T up and your E2

> > > > > > > > down,

> > > > > > > > > > things will

> > > > > > > > > > > improve.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > ------------------------------------

> > > > > > > > > >

> Links

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > -fullfeatured

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > ------------------------------------

> > > > > > > >

December 4, 2009

My estradiol level is 8, down from 15 4 weeks ago. So there is no need to

address the adrenal and thyroid issues at this time? This doesn't sound right.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >Phil,

> > you have

> > > > 27 yrs of TRT history?

> > > > > > > > > You didn't

> > > > > > > > > > > have ED issues

> > in the

> > > > beginning? Retro, I don't

> > > > > > > > > know your

> > > > > > > > > > > history , but

> > the same

> > > > question applies to your

> > > > > > > > > history as

> > > > > > > > > > > well. I

> > thought low T

> > > > and ED go hand-in-hand.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >I

> > have no

> > > > choice but to be patient with

> > > > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > > > process back

> > to where

> > > > I'd like to be. I quess I

> > > > > > > > > have to

> > > > > > > > > > > accept the

> > outcome.

> > > > There was a guy posting here

> > > > > > > > > last month

> > > > > > > > > > > saying his

> > penial

> > > > function did'nt return. I don't

> > > > > > > > > know his

> > > > > > > > > > > situation, but

> > maybe

> > > > this is what's in my future.

> > > > > > > > > Since I

> > > > > > > > > > > have a history

> > of

> > > > testicular cancer, maybe this

> > > > > > > > > could be a

> > > > > > > > > > > factor. I had

> > radiation

> > > > though, not chemo.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > If I

> > recall your T

> > > > is so low your E2 is low

> > > > > > > > > also. that

> > > > > > > > > > > would be an

> > ED

> > > > > > > > > > > > issue and

> > libido

> > > > killer.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > I suspect

> > when you

> > > > get your T up and your E2

> > > > > > > > > down,

> > > > > > > > > > > things will

> > > > > > > > > > > > improve.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > ------------------------------------

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > Links

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > -fullfeatured

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > ------------------------------------

> > > > > > > > >

December 4, 2009

I would get leveled off first then test this.

Co-Moderator

Phil

> From: jim <virtuosa150@...>

> Subject: Re: need help with the labs

>

> Date: Friday, December 4, 2009, 10:03 AM

> My estradiol level is 8, down from 15

> 4 weeks ago. So there is no need to address the adrenal and

> thyroid issues at this time? This doesn't sound right.

>

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> >Phil,

> > > you have

> > > > > 27 yrs of TRT history?

> > > > > > > > > > You didn't

> > > > > > > > > > > > have

> ED issues

> > > in the

> > > > > beginning? Retro, I don't

> > > > > > > > > > know your

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> history , but

> > > the same

> > > > > question applies to your

> > > > > > > > > > history as

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> well. I

> > > thought low T

> > > > > and ED go hand-in-hand.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> >I

> > > have no

> > > > > choice but to be patient with

> > > > > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> process back

> > > to where

> > > > > I'd like to be. I quess I

> > > > > > > > > > have to

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> accept the

> > > outcome.

> > > > > There was a guy posting here

> > > > > > > > > > last month

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> saying his

> > > penial

> > > > > function did'nt return. I don't

> > > > > > > > > > know his

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> situation, but

> > > maybe

> > > > > this is what's in my future.

> > > > > > > > > > Since I

> > > > > > > > > > > > have

> a history

> > > of

> > > > > testicular cancer, maybe this

> > > > > > > > > > could be a

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> factor. I had

> > > radiation

> > > > > though, not chemo.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> If I

> > > recall your T

> > > > > is so low your E2 is low

> > > > > > > > > > also. that

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> would be an

> > > ED

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> issue and

> > > libido

> > > > > killer.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> I suspect

> > > when you

> > > > > get your T up and your E2

> > > > > > > > > > down,

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> things will

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> improve.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > ------------------------------------

> > > > > > > > > > > >

>

> > > Links

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > -fullfeatured

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > ------------------------------------

> > > > > > > > > >

> Links

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > -fullfeatured

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this

> message have

> > > been

> > > > > removed]

> > > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > ------------------------------------

> > > > >

December 4, 2009

When you mess with one hormone it can cause a reactions in others and that is

what you are most likely expereincing.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >Phil, you have

> > > 27 yrs of TRT history?

> > > > > > > > You didn't

> > > > > > > > > > have ED issues in the

> > > beginning? Retro, I don't

> > > > > > > > know your

> > > > > > > > > > history , but the same

> > > question applies to your

> > > > > > > > history as

> > > > > > > > > > well. I thought low T

> > > and ED go hand-in-hand.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > >I have no

> > > choice but to be patient with

> > > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > > process back to where

> > > I'd like to be. I quess I

> > > > > > > > have to

> > > > > > > > > > accept the outcome.

> > > There was a guy posting here

> > > > > > > > last month

> > > > > > > > > > saying his penial

> > > function did'nt return. I don't

> > > > > > > > know his

> > > > > > > > > > situation, but maybe

> > > this is what's in my future.

> > > > > > > > Since I

> > > > > > > > > > have a history of

> > > testicular cancer, maybe this

> > > > > > > > could be a

> > > > > > > > > > factor. I had radiation

> > > though, not chemo.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > If I recall your T

> > > is so low your E2 is low

> > > > > > > > also. that

> > > > > > > > > > would be an ED

> > > > > > > > > > > issue and libido

> > > killer.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > I suspect when you

> > > get your T up and your E2

> > > > > > > > down,

> > > > > > > > > > things will

> > > > > > > > > > > improve.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > ------------------------------------

> > > > > > > > > >

December 4, 2009

So just addressing the T and E2 problem 1st, then the thyroid and adrenals? This

seems to be the general concensus. Should I order HCG from ADC and if so, what

potency?

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >Phil, you have

> > > > 27 yrs of TRT history?

> > > > > > > > > You didn't

> > > > > > > > > > > have ED issues in the

> > > > beginning? Retro, I don't

> > > > > > > > > know your

> > > > > > > > > > > history , but the same

> > > > question applies to your

> > > > > > > > > history as

> > > > > > > > > > > well. I thought low T

> > > > and ED go hand-in-hand.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >I have no

> > > > choice but to be patient with

> > > > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > > > process back to where

> > > > I'd like to be. I quess I

> > > > > > > > > have to

> > > > > > > > > > > accept the outcome.

> > > > There was a guy posting here

> > > > > > > > > last month

> > > > > > > > > > > saying his penial

> > > > function did'nt return. I don't

> > > > > > > > > know his

> > > > > > > > > > > situation, but maybe

> > > > this is what's in my future.

> > > > > > > > > Since I

> > > > > > > > > > > have a history of

> > > > testicular cancer, maybe this

> > > > > > > > > could be a

> > > > > > > > > > > factor. I had radiation

> > > > though, not chemo.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > If I recall your T

> > > > is so low your E2 is low

> > > > > > > > > also. that

> > > > > > > > > > > would be an ED

> > > > > > > > > > > > issue and libido

> > > > killer.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > I suspect when you

> > > > get your T up and your E2

> > > > > > > > > down,

> > > > > > > > > > > things will

> > > > > > > > > > > > improve.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > ------------------------------------

> > > > > > > > > > >

December 4, 2009

Yes get some HCG Dr. now starts men right away on it. Doing 250 IU's 2 x's

a week is 2000 IU's a month and mixing it with Bac. water it's only good 30

days. Get the Corion 2000 IU's or Ovidac 2000 IU's the both come in a vial.

http://www.alldaychemist.com/searchindex.php?search_query=N & p=2

And get there Bacteriostatic water.

http://www.alldaychemist.com/searchindex.php?search_query=B

Don't mix it with the water that comes with it it will not last more then a day.

Co-Moderator

Phil

> From: jim <virtuosa150@...>

> Subject: Re: need help with the labs

>

> Date: Friday, December 4, 2009, 1:26 PM

> So just addressing the T and E2

> problem 1st, then the thyroid and adrenals? This seems to be

> the general concensus. Should I order HCG from ADC and if

> so, what potency?

>

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> >Phil, you have

> > > > > 27 yrs of TRT history?

> > > > > > > > > > You didn't

> > > > > > > > > > > > have

> ED issues in the

> > > > > beginning? Retro, I don't

> > > > > > > > > > know your

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> history , but the same

> > > > > question applies to your

> > > > > > > > > > history as

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> well. I thought low T

> > > > > and ED go hand-in-hand.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> >I have no

> > > > > choice but to be patient with

> > > > > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> process back to where

> > > > > I'd like to be. I quess I

> > > > > > > > > > have to

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> accept the outcome.

> > > > > There was a guy posting here

> > > > > > > > > > last month

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> saying his penial

> > > > > function did'nt return. I don't

> > > > > > > > > > know his

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> situation, but maybe

> > > > > this is what's in my future.

> > > > > > > > > > Since I

> > > > > > > > > > > > have

> a history of

> > > > > testicular cancer, maybe this

> > > > > > > > > > could be a

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> factor. I had radiation

> > > > > though, not chemo.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> If I recall your T

> > > > > is so low your E2 is low

> > > > > > > > > > also. that

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> would be an ED

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> issue and libido

> > > > > killer.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> I suspect when you

> > > > > get your T up and your E2

> > > > > > > > > > down,

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> things will

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> improve.

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > ------------------------------------

> > > > > > > > > > > >

>

December 4, 2009

If I get 2000 IU's hCG, what size bac water do you suggest. Also, if I got

several (4? maybe more)hCG, do the stay fresh if not mixed? Would I need extra

vials?

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > >Phil, you have

> > > > > > 27 yrs of TRT history?

> > > > > > > > > > > You didn't

> > > > > > > > > > > > > have

> > ED issues in the

> > > > > > beginning? Retro, I don't

> > > > > > > > > > > know your

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > history , but the same

> > > > > > question applies to your

> > > > > > > > > > > history as

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > well. I thought low T

> > > > > > and ED go hand-in-hand.

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > >I have no

> > > > > > choice but to be patient with

> > > > > > > > > > > the

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > process back to where

> > > > > > I'd like to be. I quess I

> > > > > > > > > > > have to

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > accept the outcome.

> > > > > > There was a guy posting here

> > > > > > > > > > > last month

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > saying his penial

> > > > > > function did'nt return. I don't

> > > > > > > > > > > know his

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > situation, but maybe

> > > > > > this is what's in my future.

> > > > > > > > > > > Since I

> > > > > > > > > > > > > have

> > a history of

> > > > > > testicular cancer, maybe this

> > > > > > > > > > > could be a

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > factor. I had radiation

> > > > > > though, not chemo.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > If I recall your T

> > > > > > is so low your E2 is low

> > > > > > > > > > > also. that

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > would be an ED

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > issue and libido

> > > > > > killer.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > I suspect when you

> > > > > > get your T up and your E2

> > > > > > > > > > > down,

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > things will

> > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > improve.

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > ------------------------------------

> > > > > > > > > > > > >

> >

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