Re: HCG question for Brad

[Guest guest]

Those that are scrambling...are they prescription users or online buyers? I

called the local walgreens and they had HCG in Novarel brand. It comes in 10000

IUs though.

I have an appt with Endo on thursday. i'm going to ask for the HCG

stimulation test and see if it works. if so...i'll continue with that. as for

your earlier post...is there anything else that went on in your medical history

that may explain the low testicular capacity? or it just happened out of the

blue? After 4 months of feeling like shit and having zero libido i had my T

levels drawn and they came back 267ng/dl. after quitting propecia they went up

to 460 but that's it. it's been there for 8 months. I have slight gynecomastia,

heavy abdominal weight, fatigue, erectile issues, occasionally do not ejaculate

(E2 is 18). like i've said before, i want to see if I can get T levels up

without TRT. i think there are some that have been successful with this. do u

know of any?

brad999us <no_reply > wrote:

Organon is no longer producing Pregnyl so everyone is scrambling to

get the other brands.

Brad

>

> Jack for some reason men are having trouble finding HCG there is a

shotage of it and every one you call it is on back order.

> Phil

>

[Guest guest]

>

> Those that are scrambling...are they prescription users or online

>buyers? I called the local walgreens and they had HCG in Novarel

>brand. It comes in 10000 IUs though.

>

10000IU vials are fine. I talked the Ferring, the Novarel makers,

awhile back. They had the product but due to demand it was being

carefully allocated. They told me the practical effect was that

pharmacies that don't have novarel in stock would experience a delay

of a day or two more than would otherwise be the case.

> I have an appt with Endo on thursday. i'm going to ask for the

>HCG stimulation test and see if it works. if so...i'll continue with

>that. as for your earlier post...is there anything else that went on

>in your medical history that may explain the low testicular capacity?

No. I looked at lists of " causes " several times in various resources.

None of the listed causes seemed to apply to me.

>or it just happened out of the blue? After 4 months of feeling like

>shit and having zero libido i had my T levels drawn and they came >back

>267ng/dl. after quitting propecia they went up to 460 but that's it.

>it's been there for 8 months. I have slight gynecomastia, heavy

>abdominal weight, fatigue, erectile issues, occasionally do not

>ejaculate (E2 is 18). like i've said before, i want to see if I can

>get T levels up without TRT. i think there are some that have been

>successful with this. do u know of any?

>

Getting prolactin down may help those with prolactin secreting tumors.

Discontinuing certain meds could help some (see Shippen for a list,

there are probably other resources). Passage of time may " cure " those

who are shut down due to a steroid cycle. Aside from that, the

choices are one or another form of testosterone and/or hcg. I think

the usual " jump-starting " discussions are not helpful for truly

hypogonadal men.

Brad

[Guest guest]

I think I'll find out if im truley hypogonadal with the stim test. i guess the

clomiphene test will tell me the same thing. i wonder which is easier/more

comfortable for a Dr to prescribe. also, i'll be having my Uro do it and not an

Endo. i haven't had a solid erection in 10 days...i quit taking the synthroid 3

days ago. my Endo is ready to prescribe Viagra..something im not interested in

trying cuz it won't fix all my other symptoms of feeling like shit.

any suggestion on the clomiphene or HCG stim test? which is more value added?

both seem pretty same to me...as they increase the signals to see if the testes

respond.

brad999us <no_reply > wrote:

>

> Those that are scrambling...are they prescription users or online

>buyers? I called the local walgreens and they had HCG in Novarel

>brand. It comes in 10000 IUs though.

>

10000IU vials are fine. I talked the Ferring, the Novarel makers,

awhile back. They had the product but due to demand it was being

carefully allocated. They told me the practical effect was that

pharmacies that don't have novarel in stock would experience a delay

of a day or two more than would otherwise be the case.

> I have an appt with Endo on thursday. i'm going to ask for the

>HCG stimulation test and see if it works. if so...i'll continue with

>that. as for your earlier post...is there anything else that went on

>in your medical history that may explain the low testicular capacity?

No. I looked at lists of " causes " several times in various resources.

None of the listed causes seemed to apply to me.

>or it just happened out of the blue? After 4 months of feeling like

>shit and having zero libido i had my T levels drawn and they came >back

>267ng/dl. after quitting propecia they went up to 460 but that's it.

>it's been there for 8 months. I have slight gynecomastia, heavy

>abdominal weight, fatigue, erectile issues, occasionally do not

>ejaculate (E2 is 18). like i've said before, i want to see if I can

>get T levels up without TRT. i think there are some that have been

>successful with this. do u know of any?

>

Getting prolactin down may help those with prolactin secreting tumors.

Discontinuing certain meds could help some (see Shippen for a list,

there are probably other resources). Passage of time may " cure " those

who are shut down due to a steroid cycle. Aside from that, the

choices are one or another form of testosterone and/or hcg. I think

the usual " jump-starting " discussions are not helpful for truly

hypogonadal men.

Brad

[Guest guest]

The Clomid test is a pill do it and if you get sides stop.

Phil

Jack <rockin813@...> wrote:

I think I'll find out if im truley hypogonadal with the stim test. i guess the

clomiphene test will tell me the same thing. i wonder which is easier/more

comfortable for a Dr to prescribe. also, i'll be having my Uro do it and not an

Endo. i haven't had a solid erection in 10 days...i quit taking the synthroid 3

days ago. my Endo is ready to prescribe Viagra..something im not interested in

trying cuz it won't fix all my other symptoms of feeling like shit.

any suggestion on the clomiphene or HCG stim test? which is more value added?

both seem pretty same to me...as they increase the signals to see if the testes

respond.

brad999us wrote:

>

> Those that are scrambling...are they prescription users or online

>buyers? I called the local walgreens and they had HCG in Novarel

>brand. It comes in 10000 IUs though.

>

10000IU vials are fine. I talked the Ferring, the Novarel makers,

awhile back. They had the product but due to demand it was being

carefully allocated. They told me the practical effect was that

pharmacies that don't have novarel in stock would experience a delay

of a day or two more than would otherwise be the case.

> I have an appt with Endo on thursday. i'm going to ask for the

>HCG stimulation test and see if it works. if so...i'll continue with

>that. as for your earlier post...is there anything else that went on

>in your medical history that may explain the low testicular capacity?

No. I looked at lists of " causes " several times in various resources.

None of the listed causes seemed to apply to me.

>or it just happened out of the blue? After 4 months of feeling like

>shit and having zero libido i had my T levels drawn and they came >back

>267ng/dl. after quitting propecia they went up to 460 but that's it.

>it's been there for 8 months. I have slight gynecomastia, heavy

>abdominal weight, fatigue, erectile issues, occasionally do not

>ejaculate (E2 is 18). like i've said before, i want to see if I can

>get T levels up without TRT. i think there are some that have been

>successful with this. do u know of any?

>

Getting prolactin down may help those with prolactin secreting tumors.

Discontinuing certain meds could help some (see Shippen for a list,

there are probably other resources). Passage of time may " cure " those

who are shut down due to a steroid cycle. Aside from that, the

choices are one or another form of testosterone and/or hcg. I think

the usual " jump-starting " discussions are not helpful for truly

hypogonadal men.

Brad

[Guest guest]

>

> I think I'll find out if im truley hypogonadal with the stim test. i

guess the clomiphene test will tell me the same thing. i wonder which

is easier/more comfortable for a Dr to prescribe. also, i'll be having

my Uro do it and not an Endo. i haven't had a solid erection in 10

days...i quit taking the synthroid 3 days ago. my Endo is ready to

prescribe Viagra..something im not interested in trying cuz it won't

fix all my other symptoms of feeling like shit.

>

> any suggestion on the clomiphene or HCG stim test? which is more

value added? both seem pretty same to me...as they increase the

signals to see if the testes respond.

>

>

>

I had the clomiphene stim test so I am very comfortable recommending

that. I had a baseline testosterone level plus LH/FSH. Then 7 days

of clomiphene at 100mgs/day. On the 7th or 8th day I had blood taken

again for testosterone plus LH and FSH. I experienced no sides from

clomiphene.

Although I like the clomiphene stim test, I have nothing against the

hcg test.

Brad

[Guest guest]

thanks for the posts brad and phil. i'll push for the clomiphene stim test.

brad...what was ur baseline T levels prior to the test? i take it after the

test the T was 415...was your LH well above the reference range? sounds though

it was. as for the 7 days of taking the pill...are u allowed to drink? im

going to vegas next wknd thur-sun.....and endo appt isn't until thurs. if

drinking doesn't matter (i imagine it does) than i'll wait till i get back from

vegas to start the 7 days. i already have the baseline tests at 460 T ng/dl at

7am...supporting low Free T #s as well. LH is 4 and FSH is 6.

thanks again.

brad999us <no_reply > wrote:

>

> I think I'll find out if im truley hypogonadal with the stim test. i

guess the clomiphene test will tell me the same thing. i wonder which

is easier/more comfortable for a Dr to prescribe. also, i'll be having

my Uro do it and not an Endo. i haven't had a solid erection in 10

days...i quit taking the synthroid 3 days ago. my Endo is ready to

prescribe Viagra..something im not interested in trying cuz it won't

fix all my other symptoms of feeling like shit.

>

> any suggestion on the clomiphene or HCG stim test? which is more

value added? both seem pretty same to me...as they increase the

signals to see if the testes respond.

>

>

>

I had the clomiphene stim test so I am very comfortable recommending

that. I had a baseline testosterone level plus LH/FSH. Then 7 days

of clomiphene at 100mgs/day. On the 7th or 8th day I had blood taken

again for testosterone plus LH and FSH. I experienced no sides from

clomiphene.

Although I like the clomiphene stim test, I have nothing against the

hcg test.

Brad

[Guest guest]

>

> thanks for the posts brad and phil. i'll push for the clomiphene

> stim test.

>

> brad...what was ur baseline T levels prior to the test?

It was 415ng/dl before and after. So my testes were already at their

maximum capacity. Before clomiphene LH and FSH were right at the

midpoint of the reference range. After, slightly above the upper limit.

Alcohol wasn't an issue for me because I don't drink anyway. I don't

know if alcohol is a problem or not. I would wait till your return to

start. The purpose of the test is to get as clear an answer as

possible so I wouldn't introduce any other variables unnecessarily.

Brad

>i take it

>after the test the T was 415...was your LH well above the reference

>range? sounds though it was. as for the 7 days of taking the

>pill...are u allowed to drink? im going to vegas next wknd

>thur-sun.....and endo appt isn't until thurs. if drinking doesn't

>matter (i imagine it does) than i'll wait till i get back from vegas

>to start the 7 days. i already have the baseline tests at 460 T ng/dl

>at 7am...supporting low Free T #s as well. LH is 4 and FSH is 6.

>

> thanks again.

>

[Guest guest]

Jack do the test when you get back just so you don't have sides and ruin your

trip.

Phil

Jack <rockin813@...> wrote:

thanks for the posts brad and phil. i'll push for the clomiphene stim test.

brad...what was ur baseline T levels prior to the test? i take it after the test

the T was 415...was your LH well above the reference range? sounds though it

was. as for the 7 days of taking the pill...are u allowed to drink? im going to

vegas next wknd thur-sun.....and endo appt isn't until thurs. if drinking

doesn't matter (i imagine it does) than i'll wait till i get back from vegas to

start the 7 days. i already have the baseline tests at 460 T ng/dl at

7am...supporting low Free T #s as well. LH is 4 and FSH is 6.

thanks again.

brad999us wrote:

>

> I think I'll find out if im truley hypogonadal with the stim test. i

guess the clomiphene test will tell me the same thing. i wonder which

is easier/more comfortable for a Dr to prescribe. also, i'll be having

my Uro do it and not an Endo. i haven't had a solid erection in 10

days...i quit taking the synthroid 3 days ago. my Endo is ready to

prescribe Viagra..something im not interested in trying cuz it won't

fix all my other symptoms of feeling like shit.

>

> any suggestion on the clomiphene or HCG stim test? which is more

value added? both seem pretty same to me...as they increase the

signals to see if the testes respond.

>

>

>

I had the clomiphene stim test so I am very comfortable recommending

that. I had a baseline testosterone level plus LH/FSH. Then 7 days

of clomiphene at 100mgs/day. On the 7th or 8th day I had blood taken

again for testosterone plus LH and FSH. I experienced no sides from

clomiphene.

Although I like the clomiphene stim test, I have nothing against the

hcg test.

Brad

[Guest guest]

Each test have a specific purpose. The Clomid stimulation test

specifically tests the pituitary to determine if one is secondary

hypogonadal. HCG test is to specifically test the testicles to

determine if they are functioning properly (primary hypogonadal).

A doc will determine which test to perform based on LH/FSH levels.

> >

> > Those that are scrambling...are they prescription users or online

> >buyers? I called the local walgreens and they had HCG in Novarel

> >brand. It comes in 10000 IUs though.

> >

>

> 10000IU vials are fine. I talked the Ferring, the Novarel makers,

> awhile back. They had the product but due to demand it was being

> carefully allocated. They told me the practical effect was that

> pharmacies that don't have novarel in stock would experience a delay

> of a day or two more than would otherwise be the case.

>

>

> > I have an appt with Endo on thursday. i'm going to ask for the

> >HCG stimulation test and see if it works. if so...i'll continue

with

> >that. as for your earlier post...is there anything else that went

on

> >in your medical history that may explain the low testicular

capacity?

>

> No. I looked at lists of " causes " several times in various

resources.

> None of the listed causes seemed to apply to me.

>

>

> >or it just happened out of the blue? After 4 months of feeling like

> >shit and having zero libido i had my T levels drawn and they came

>back

> >267ng/dl. after quitting propecia they went up to 460 but that's it.

> >it's been there for 8 months. I have slight gynecomastia, heavy

> >abdominal weight, fatigue, erectile issues, occasionally do not

> >ejaculate (E2 is 18). like i've said before, i want to see if I can

> >get T levels up without TRT. i think there are some that have been

> >successful with this. do u know of any?

> >

>

> Getting prolactin down may help those with prolactin secreting

tumors.

> Discontinuing certain meds could help some (see Shippen for a list,

> there are probably other resources). Passage of time may " cure "

those

> who are shut down due to a steroid cycle. Aside from that, the

> choices are one or another form of testosterone and/or hcg. I think

> the usual " jump-starting " discussions are not helpful for truly

> hypogonadal men.

>

> Brad

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

problem is i don't have a dr that is knowledgable to do this as i've been

suffering for a year with no action/plan.

my LH is 4 and FSH is 6 while my T 460 (7am). im thinking i need to do a

clomid stim test to see why my LH isn't higher seeing my T is lower. i had other

tests with LH at 3. what do you think?

sikdogg <sikdogg@...> wrote:

Each test have a specific purpose. The Clomid stimulation test

specifically tests the pituitary to determine if one is secondary

hypogonadal. HCG test is to specifically test the testicles to

determine if they are functioning properly (primary hypogonadal).

A doc will determine which test to perform based on LH/FSH levels.

> >

> > Those that are scrambling...are they prescription users or online

> >buyers? I called the local walgreens and they had HCG in Novarel

> >brand. It comes in 10000 IUs though.

> >

>

> 10000IU vials are fine. I talked the Ferring, the Novarel makers,

> awhile back. They had the product but due to demand it was being

> carefully allocated. They told me the practical effect was that

> pharmacies that don't have novarel in stock would experience a delay

> of a day or two more than would otherwise be the case.

>

>

> > I have an appt with Endo on thursday. i'm going to ask for the

> >HCG stimulation test and see if it works. if so...i'll continue

with

> >that. as for your earlier post...is there anything else that went

on

> >in your medical history that may explain the low testicular

capacity?

>

> No. I looked at lists of " causes " several times in various

resources.

> None of the listed causes seemed to apply to me.

>

>

> >or it just happened out of the blue? After 4 months of feeling like

> >shit and having zero libido i had my T levels drawn and they came

>back

> >267ng/dl. after quitting propecia they went up to 460 but that's it.

> >it's been there for 8 months. I have slight gynecomastia, heavy

> >abdominal weight, fatigue, erectile issues, occasionally do not

> >ejaculate (E2 is 18). like i've said before, i want to see if I can

> >get T levels up without TRT. i think there are some that have been

> >successful with this. do u know of any?

> >

>

> Getting prolactin down may help those with prolactin secreting

tumors.

> Discontinuing certain meds could help some (see Shippen for a list,

> there are probably other resources). Passage of time may " cure "

those

> who are shut down due to a steroid cycle. Aside from that, the

> choices are one or another form of testosterone and/or hcg. I think

> the usual " jump-starting " discussions are not helpful for truly

> hypogonadal men.

>

> Brad

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Jack,

Call around and find a DO (Doctor of Osteopathy) that knows how to do hormone

replacement therapy for males. Get a second opinion on diagnosis and treatment

options

from him/her. If that doc impresses you, let him be the one to treat you.

See also " Finding a Male Hormone Doctor " in the Files section here.

I went 5 years without proper treatment, through a GP & 2 endos. Wish I'd known

enough

to find a good doc from the start.

Bruce

>

> problem is i don't have a dr that is knowledgable to do this as i've been

suffering for a

year with no action/plan.