Re: Help with my Endocronologist

[Guest guest]

How high 1000 is depends on the range for your particular test. This

should be on the printout you got. Some tests top at 800-850 and some at

over 1000. Most physicians are reluctant to prescribe you over the

" normal " range. This is referred to as " supraphysiologic " and can bring

on a range of other problems.

You are using gel that is relatively short acting so it should be easy

to manipulate your tests into any range your endo is comfortable with.

Cutting down before your test should do the trick. I don't know this

from personal experience because I use TC injections myself.

From:

[mailto: ] On Behalf Of generalusgrant

Sent: Wednesday, August 05, 2009 12:35 PM

Subject: Help with my Endocronologist

For years I unwittingly suffered from low testosterone. Fatique, low

libido and anxiety. In April I had a blood test and my level was 317 (I

am 47 years old). It was a pain in the neck with my HMO, but I finally

got a prescription for Androgel.

On 8 pumps a day I got my levels up to 1013. I realize this is a great

result for the gels. I have felt better in the past 3 months than I have

felt in 20 years.

My Endocronologist just phoned and was livid my levels were so

" ridiculously high. " He said in good conscience he can't keep

prescribing the Androgel because " normal " is between 200-800. I told him

200 was not even normal for a 90 year old man. He said 1,000 for a t.

level is " obscene " and " unhealthy. "

What a bunch of nonsense. I have NEVER felt better in my life and now he

wants to cut me down to three swipes a day.

He has scheduled another blood test in 4 weeks.

From everything I have read, 1,000 testosterone level is high normal for

someone in their 40's, right?

I feel fabulous and am worried he will try and cut me off the Androgel.

Suggestions on what I should do are welcomed. Thank you.

[Guest guest]

There is no way your levels are this high on 8 pumps of Andorgel or 10 grams.

If you did not take a good shower in the morning before doing your labs and you

put on the gel first you can spike up your labs most men only do about 600 to

700 on this dose. So do your labs over again if you did the above take a shower

so you know you washed off all of yesterdays gels in some is on your skin even

after 24 yrs when they stick the needle in to take the blood it will spike up

your labs. If you can't do your labs first thing in the morning then go home of

into the bathroom at the Dr's office and put on the gel after. Put the gel on

after a shower but don't get any on the spot they take the blood from and do the

lags 6 hrs. after you put on the gel for the first 4 to 5 hrs your levels spike

way up after you put on the gel.

This happens all the time we put on the gel do labs labs come back high Dr. goes

nuts and lowers your levels and you crash. Call him tell him if you put on the

gel first then did your labs that you read it can spike up your results.

Co-Moderator

Phil

> From: generalusgrant <generalusgrant@...>

> Subject: Help with my Endocronologist

>

> Date: Wednesday, August 5, 2009, 1:35 PM

> For years I unwittingly suffered from

> low testosterone. Fatique, low libido and anxiety. In April

> I had a blood test and my level was 317 (I am 47 years old).

> It was a pain in the neck with my HMO, but I finally got a

> prescription for Androgel.

>

> On 8 pumps a day I got my levels up to 1013. I realize this

> is a great result for the gels. I have felt better in the

> past 3 months than I have felt in 20 years.

>

> My Endocronologist just phoned and was livid my levels were

> so " ridiculously high. " He said in good conscience he can't

> keep prescribing the Androgel because " normal " is between

> 200-800. I told him 200 was not even normal for a 90 year

> old man. He said 1,000 for a t. level is " obscene " and

> " unhealthy. "

>

> What a bunch of nonsense. I have NEVER felt better in my

> life and now he wants to cut me down to three swipes a day.

>

> He has scheduled another blood test in 4 weeks.

>

> From everything I have read, 1,000 testosterone level is

> high normal for someone in their 40's, right?

>

> I feel fabulous and am worried he will try and cut me off

> the Androgel.

>

> Suggestions on what I should do are welcomed. Thank you.

>

>

>

> ------------------------------------

>

>

[Guest guest]

We don't want to tell people to do things like this why see the Dr. and pay him

then do something different then he says. Read my reply to him.

Co-Moderator

Phil

> From: Bush <jbush@...>

> Subject: RE: Help with my Endocronologist

>

> Date: Wednesday, August 5, 2009, 3:09 PM

> How high 1000 is depends on the range

> for your particular test. This

> should be on the printout you got. Some tests top at

> 800-850 and some at

> over 1000. Most physicians are reluctant to prescribe you

> over the

> " normal " range. This is referred to as " supraphysiologic "

> and can bring

> on a range of other problems.

>

>

>

> You are using gel that is relatively short acting so it

> should be easy

> to manipulate your tests into any range your endo is

> comfortable with.

> Cutting down before your test should do the trick. I don't

> know this

> from personal experience because I use TC injections

> myself.

>

>

>

> From:

> [mailto: ]

> On Behalf Of generalusgrant

> Sent: Wednesday, August 05, 2009 12:35 PM

>

> Subject: Help with my Endocronologist

>

>

>

>  

>

> For years I unwittingly suffered from low testosterone.

> Fatique, low

> libido and anxiety. In April I had a blood test and my

> level was 317 (I

> am 47 years old). It was a pain in the neck with my HMO,

> but I finally

> got a prescription for Androgel.

>

> On 8 pumps a day I got my levels up to 1013. I realize this

> is a great

> result for the gels. I have felt better in the past 3

> months than I have

> felt in 20 years.

>

> My Endocronologist just phoned and was livid my levels were

> so

> " ridiculously high. " He said in good conscience he can't

> keep

> prescribing the Androgel because " normal " is between

> 200-800. I told him

> 200 was not even normal for a 90 year old man. He said

> 1,000 for a t.

> level is " obscene " and " unhealthy. "

>

> What a bunch of nonsense. I have NEVER felt better in my

> life and now he

> wants to cut me down to three swipes a day.

>

> He has scheduled another blood test in 4 weeks.

>

> From everything I have read, 1,000 testosterone level is

> high normal for

> someone in their 40's, right?

>

> I feel fabulous and am worried he will try and cut me off

> the Androgel.

>

> Suggestions on what I should do are welcomed. Thank you.

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

On Wed, 05 Aug 2009 17:35:14 -0000, you wrote:

>For years I unwittingly suffered from low testosterone. Fatique, low libido and

anxiety. In April I had a blood test and my level was 317 (I am 47 years old).

It was a pain in the neck with my HMO, but I finally got a prescription for

Androgel.

>

>On 8 pumps a day I got my levels up to 1013. I realize this is a great result

for the gels. I have felt better in the past 3 months than I have felt in 20

years.

>

>My Endocronologist just phoned and was livid my levels were so " ridiculously

high. " He said in good conscience he can't keep prescribing the Androgel because

" normal " is between 200-800. I told him 200 was not even normal for a 90 year

old man. He said 1,000 for a t. level is " obscene " and " unhealthy. "

>

>What a bunch of nonsense. I have NEVER felt better in my life and now he wants

to cut me down to three swipes a day.

>

>He has scheduled another blood test in 4 weeks.

>

>From everything I have read, 1,000 testosterone level is high normal for

someone in their 40's, right?

>

>I feel fabulous and am worried he will try and cut me off the Androgel.

>

>Suggestions on what I should do are welcomed. Thank you.

Most of us do great in the 650 to 800 range. You'll need to keep an

eye on E2 - estradiol - levels too. Such high T has negative effects,

blood thickening leading to stroke and heart risks. High E2 and other

things. Your Doc is right.

[Guest guest]

On Wed, 5 Aug 2009 12:27:51 -0700 (PDT), you wrote:

>There is no way your levels are this high on 8 pumps of Andorgel or 10 grams.

Oh it's absolutely possible. I was at 800 on 7.5 gr. A packet and a

half.

[Guest guest]

Phil, it IS possible my t. levels are this high. They were 1400 last month. I

washed thoroughly before going in for the blood test.

I am taking 8 swipes and have gone from 317 to a little over 1,000. This is not

a skewed result, I have a similar result from two weeks ago.

[Guest guest]

It's passable I have seen it all but if you did a good shower and did not put on

the gel before the blood test then your to high and need to cut back to say 7.5

grams. Also talk to your Dr. about adding HCG to this do 250 IU's every 3 days

doing this will keep your testis from getting smaller and keep your LH cells

working. Doing TRT your brain sees the Testosterone in your blood and slows

down the messages of LH and FSH sent to your testis and body adding HCG it acts

like LH and FSH.

Here is a cut and paste of what Dr. www.allthingsmale.com told me to help

get my Dr. to let me do HCG and a link about it.

http://jcem.endojournals.org/cgi/content/abstract/90/5/2595

=========================================================================

He probably feels that since you suffer primary hypogonadism (I am guessing)

there is no use in adding HCG to your protocol. There are several reasons why

this is not so. First, you have not lost all Leydig cells, so any HCG you take

will stimulate those who still function to produce endogenous testosterone.

This will support testicular size. We should not ignore this aesthetic

consideration.

Next, if he reads my work, he will learn that HPTA-suppressed (as all TRT

patients are to some extent) also suffer decreased pregenenolone levels, which

is the first step after CHOL in all three hormonal pathways which begin with

CHOL. HCG increases pregnenolone production, and therefore restores a more

natural balance of our hormones.

Next, nearly all TRT patients who add in HCG to their regimens report an

increased sense of well-being and also libido. These are genuine quality of life

issues.

Finally, I just instinctively do not want all those LH receptors (including

those we have yet to discover and appreciate) unstimulated.

Co-Moderator

Phil

> From: generalusgrant <generalusgrant@...>

> Subject: Re: Help with my Endocronologist

>

> Date: Wednesday, August 5, 2009, 10:56 PM

> Phil, it IS possible my t. levels are

> this high. They were 1400 last month. I washed thoroughly

> before going in for the blood test.

>

> I am taking 8 swipes and have gone from 317 to a little

> over 1,000. This is not a skewed result, I have a similar

> result from two weeks ago.

>

>

>

> ------------------------------------

>

>

[Guest guest]

I agree --7.5 g/day keeps me at 800-- it is possible!! I think we might be the

exception but it is possible and real.

Re: Help with my Endocronologist

On Wed, 5 Aug 2009 12:27:51 -0700 (PDT), you wrote:

>There is no way your levels are this high on 8 pumps of Andorgel or 10 grams.

Oh it's absolutely possible. I was at 800 on 7.5 gr. A packet and a

half.

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