Re: Arimidex Dosing or Progesterone to Lower E2- Dr

[Guest guest]

Thank you, Phil, & I meant no disrespect toward you or Dr. . I really wish

we had access some of the studies Dr. writes/reads so we could see the

figures behind his claims. He's probably acquired unpublished knowledge by

" simply " practicing medicine & paying attention to subjects others have left

unaddressed.

Is Dr. a member of the American Academy of Anti-Aging Medicine (A4M)? I

thought you mentioned he was. Has he published contributions there?

~Xian

> > > > >>

> > > > >> I find this topic coming up a lot and

> > need to warn

> > > > men not to add Progesterone to there body.

> > > > >> Here is what Dr. says about doing

> > this.

> > > > (Funny, when you take PREG, your PROG may rise,

> > but it

> > > > doesn't cause feminization. But if you give

> > straight PROG,

> > > > bad things happen.) and here is more.

> > > > >> (But you can still reason things out,

> > and apply

> > > > good 'ol Farner's Logic.

> > > > >>

> > > > >> There is not one valid study that proves

> > men

> > > > should take PROG. And many which prove he should

> > not.

> > > > >>

> > > > >> Simple, irrefutable facts:

> > > > >>

> > > > >> PROG elevates SHBG

> > > > >> Suppresses the HPTA

> > > > >> Causes gynocomastia

> > > > >> Causes impotence

> > > > >>

> > > > >> ...all feminizing features of a hormone.

> >

> > > > >> __________________

> > > > >> www.AllThingsMale.com

> > > > >>

> > > > >> Any information I may provide does not

> > substitute

> > > > for a proper medical evaluation by a medical

> > professional;

> > > > nor does it constitute doctor/patient

> > relationship, or

> > > > liability, in any way.)

> > > > >>

> > > >

> > ==========================================================================

> > > > >>

> > > > >> Dr. treats a ton of men for all

> > kinds of low

> > > > Testosterone and has been posting answers to

> > men's posts at

> > > > a lot of forums.  In all the yrs I have read

> > his

> > > > replies to men every one that did Progesterone

> > ended up with

> > > > big problems.

> > > > >>

> > > > >> There is a lot of crap on the web about

> > taking

> > > > this but not one good study shows this helps

> > men.

> > > > >>

> > > > >> Here is what one dam good DR. says about

> > it.

> > > > >>

> > > >

> > ==========================================================================

> > > > >> Originally Posted by marianco 

> > > > >> To examine the possible side effects of

> > > > Progesterone, one has to look at Progesterone's

> > roles.

> > > > >>

> > > > >> Progesterone is a precursor for

> > testosterone,

> > > > estradiol, cortisol, aldosterone, and

> > allopregnenolone and

> > > > allopregnanolone, etc.. Progesterone is broken

> > down to

> > > > Pregnanediol (inactive) after it is used.

> > > > >>

> > > > >> Progesterone is the precursor for

> > testosterone in

> > > > the testes. Increasing testosterone production

> > requires

> > > > increasing production of progesterone, its

> > precursor. HCG

> > > > can increase progesterone production in men. If

> > the increase

> > > > in progesterone leads to an increase in

> > testosterone, this

> > > > can have good or bad effects. Bad effects include

> > slowing

> > > > down the adrenal glands when one already has

> > adrenal

> > > > fatigue, excessive acne or hair loss, etc.

> > > > >>

> > > > >> Progesterone is a precursor for

> > estradiol.

> > > > Progesterone also increases the number of

> > estrogen

> > > > receptors. Either one can lead to signs of

> > excessive

> > > > estrogen signaling (e.g. gynecomastia,

> > aggressiveness,

> > > > fatigue (from lowered thyroid hormone in response

> > to

> > > > increased estrogen signaling), loss of libido,

> > etc. even if

> > > > Estradiol is controlled (since the signal is

> > stronger when

> > > > there are more estrogen receptors).

> > > > >>

> > > > >> Progesterone is a precursor for

> > Cortisol. In

> > > > women, it is a good replacement for

> > hydrocortisone

> > > > (cortisol). Generally, this doesn't lead to

> > excessive

> > > > Cortisol, since cortisol is made on demand.

> > > > >>

> > > > >> Progesterone is a precursor for

> > Aldosterone. This

> > > > usually doesn't lead to an excess in Aldosterone

> > since

> > > > Aldosterone has other controls - such as

> > salt-balance.

> > > > >>

> > > > >> Progesterone is a precursor for

> > Allopregnenolone

> > > > (both in brain and liver), and Allopregnanolone

> > (in brain).

> > > > Allopregnanolone is neuroprotective. This is how

> > > > Progesterone can be useful in stroke - to reduce

> > nervous

> > > > system damage from a stroke. Allopregnenolone

> > increases GABA

> > > > receptor sensitivity to GABA. This is how

> > Progesterone helps

> > > > reduce norepinephrine signaling, how Progesterone

> > can be

> > > > sedating and anti-anxiety, and how Progesterone

> > can be used

> > > > as an antiseizure medication. Excessive

> > allopregnenolone can

> > > > cause excessive sleepiness, loss of libido (since

> > libido

> > > > also depends on adequate but not excessive

> > norepinephrine

> > > > signaling - which gives us sexual excitement),

> > impaired

> > > > concentration, fatigue (since norepinephrine also

> > is a

> > > > signal for energy on demand), etc.

> > > > >>

> > > > >> Progesterone also reduces estradiol's

> > inhibitory

> > > > effect on thyroid hormone. I speculate that this

> > may involve

> > > > reducing thyroid binding protein production.

> > Thus, possibly

> > > > this can lead to excess thyroid signaling for

> > those

> > > > sensitive to thyroid signaling - such as those

> > with adrenal

> > > > fatigue.

> > > > >>

> > > > >> Progesterone also may reduce blood

> > pressure.

> > > > Dizziness may result from excess.

> > > > >>

> > > > >> Progesterone is also a

> > 5-alpha-reductase. This

> > > > blocks testosterone to DHT conversion. Excessive

> > > > progesterone may thus mean a reduction in body

> > hair, acne,

> > > > etc. - among other actions of DHT.

> > > > >>

> > > > >> I suppose you mean a 24-hour Urine

> > Steroid Hormone

> > > > Profile from RheinLabs.com when you say " rhein's

> > test " .

> > > > >>

> > > > >> I suppose you mean transdermal when you

> > wrote " TD

> > > > pregnenolone. "

> > > > >>

> > > > >> Taking pregnenolone before a 24-hour

> > urine hormone

> > > > profile depends on whether or not you want to see

> > the

> > > > effects of pregnenolone on one's hormone

> > metabolism. You

> > > > would need a before an after test.

> > > > >>

> > > > >> Since Pregnenolone is a precursor for

> > nearly all

> > > > of the substances tested, it can raise the level

> > of any one

> > > > of the substances it is a precursor to. Depending

> > on the

> > > > person, this may mean elevated testosterone and

> > precursors

> > > > or elevated progesterone and Pregnanediol,

> > elevated

> > > > Cortisol, or any other one or a combination of

> > these

> > > > signals/hormones.

> > > > >>

> > > > >> If one has ongoing treatment with

> > Pregnenolone,

> > > > then it would be useful to monitor its effects on

> > hormone

> > > > production by taking it while undergoing the

> > hormone profile

> > > > test. For example, I would want to know if

> > Pregnenolone is

> > > > converting excessively to Estradiol, resulting

> > in

> > > > destabilization of mood in some patients or

> > impaired muscle

> > > > mass gain in others.

> > > > >>

> > > > >> Cheers.

> > > > >>

> > > >

> > ==========================================================================

> > > > >> Pregnenolone is the starting point from

> > which all

> > > > steroid hormones are manufactured in our bodies.

> > Its

> > > > conversion in the body follows different

> > pathways, depending

> > > > on individual needs.  Dr. has his me take

> > this in

> > > > a cream.

> > > > >>

> > > > >>

> > > > >> Co-Moderator

> > > > >> Phil

> > > >

> > > > --

> > > >

> > > > Steve - dudescholar4@

> > > >

> > > > " The Problem with Socialism is that eventually

> > you

> > > > run out of Other People's Money. " --Margaret

> > Thatcher

> > > >

> > > > " Mistrust of Government is the Bedrock of

> > American

> > > > Patriotism "

> > > >

> > > > Take World's Smallest Political Quiz at

> > > > http://www.theadvocates.org/quiz.html

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > ------------------------------------

> > > >

> > > >

[Guest guest]

Yes he is a member of A4M and has published a lot there he keeps telling us he

is going to put them on his forum but the A4M stops him from doing this free.

So if one wants to read them they have to go there look them up and become a

paying member or pay to read just one. I feel this sucks but what can we do

about it.

I don't feel any disrespect I think your great and happy to have you here.

It's just point counter point.

Here is his Forum.

http://www.musclechatroom.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=2

Here is his web site.

www.allthingsmale.com

And here is Dr. no new site but not many men going there don't under stand

this to me he is one of the best.

http://www.definitivemind.com/forums/index.php

Co-Moderator

Phil

> From: d00fu524 <calvin1564@...>

> Subject: Re: Arimidex Dosing or Progesterone to Lower E2- Dr

>

> Date: Thursday, June 4, 2009, 12:59 AM

> Thank you, Phil, & I meant no

> disrespect toward you or Dr. .  I really wish we

> had access some of the studies Dr. writes/reads so we

> could see the figures behind his claims.  He's probably

> acquired unpublished knowledge by " simply " practicing

> medicine & paying attention to subjects others have left

> unaddressed. 

>

> Is Dr. a member of the American Academy of Anti-Aging

> Medicine (A4M)?   I thought you mentioned he

> was.  Has he published contributions there?

>

> ~Xian

>

>

> > > > > >>

> > > > > >> I find this topic coming up a

> lot and

> > > need to warn

> > > > > men not to add Progesterone to there

> body.

> > > > > >> Here is what Dr. says

> about doing

> > > this.

> > > > > (Funny, when you take PREG, your PROG

> may rise,

> > > but it

> > > > > doesn't cause feminization. But if you

> give

> > > straight PROG,

> > > > > bad things happen.) and here is more.

> > > > > >> (But you can still reason

> things out,

> > > and apply

> > > > > good 'ol Farner's Logic.

> > > > > >>

> > > > > >> There is not one valid study

> that proves

> > > men

> > > > > should take PROG. And many which prove

> he should

> > > not.

> > > > > >>

> > > > > >> Simple, irrefutable facts:

> > > > > >>

> > > > > >> PROG elevates SHBG

> > > > > >> Suppresses the HPTA

> > > > > >> Causes gynocomastia

> > > > > >> Causes impotence

> > > > > >>

> > > > > >> ...all feminizing features of

> a hormone.

> > >

> > > > > >> __________________

> > > > > >> www.AllThingsMale.com

> > > > > >>

> > > > > >> Any information I may provide

> does not

> > > substitute

> > > > > for a proper medical evaluation by a

> medical

> > > professional;

> > > > > nor does it constitute doctor/patient

> > > relationship, or

> > > > > liability, in any way.)

> > > > > >>

> > > > >

> > >

> ==========================================================================

> > > > > >>

> > > > > >> Dr. treats a ton of men

> for all

> > > kinds of low

> > > > > Testosterone and has been posting

> answers to

> > > men's posts at

> > > > > a lot of forums.  In all the yrs I

> have read

> > > his

> > > > > replies to men every one that did

> Progesterone

> > > ended up with

> > > > > big problems.

> > > > > >>

> > > > > >> There is a lot of crap on the

> web about

> > > taking

> > > > > this but not one good study shows this

> helps

> > > men.

> > > > > >>

> > > > > >> Here is what one dam good DR.

> says about

> > > it.

> > > > > >>

> > > > >

> > >

> ==========================================================================

> > > > > >> Originally Posted by

> marianco 

> > > > > >> To examine the possible side

> effects of

> > > > > Progesterone, one has to look at

> Progesterone's

> > > roles.

> > > > > >>

> > > > > >> Progesterone is a precursor

> for

> > > testosterone,

> > > > > estradiol, cortisol, aldosterone, and

> > > allopregnenolone and

> > > > > allopregnanolone, etc.. Progesterone is

> broken

> > > down to

> > > > > Pregnanediol (inactive) after it is

> used.

> > > > > >>

> > > > > >> Progesterone is the precursor

> for

> > > testosterone in

> > > > > the testes. Increasing testosterone

> production

> > > requires

> > > > > increasing production of progesterone,

> its

> > > precursor. HCG

> > > > > can increase progesterone production in

> men. If

> > > the increase

> > > > > in progesterone leads to an increase

> in

> > > testosterone, this

> > > > > can have good or bad effects. Bad

> effects include

> > > slowing

> > > > > down the adrenal glands when one

> already has

> > > adrenal

> > > > > fatigue, excessive acne or hair loss,

> etc.

> > > > > >>

> > > > > >> Progesterone is a precursor

> for

> > > estradiol.

> > > > > Progesterone also increases the number

> of

> > > estrogen

> > > > > receptors. Either one can lead to signs

> of

> > > excessive

> > > > > estrogen signaling (e.g. gynecomastia,

> > > aggressiveness,

> > > > > fatigue (from lowered thyroid hormone

> in response

> > > to

> > > > > increased estrogen signaling), loss of

> libido,

> > > etc. even if

> > > > > Estradiol is controlled (since the

> signal is

> > > stronger when

> > > > > there are more estrogen receptors).

> > > > > >>

> > > > > >> Progesterone is a precursor

> for

> > > Cortisol. In

> > > > > women, it is a good replacement for

> > > hydrocortisone

> > > > > (cortisol). Generally, this doesn't

> lead to

> > > excessive

> > > > > Cortisol, since cortisol is made on

> demand.

> > > > > >>

> > > > > >> Progesterone is a precursor

> for

> > > Aldosterone. This

> > > > > usually doesn't lead to an excess in

> Aldosterone

> > > since

> > > > > Aldosterone has other controls - such

> as

> > > salt-balance.

> > > > > >>

> > > > > >> Progesterone is a precursor

> for

> > > Allopregnenolone

> > > > > (both in brain and liver), and

> Allopregnanolone

> > > (in brain).

> > > > > Allopregnanolone is neuroprotective.

> This is how

> > > > > Progesterone can be useful in stroke -

> to reduce

> > > nervous

> > > > > system damage from a stroke.

> Allopregnenolone

> > > increases GABA

> > > > > receptor sensitivity to GABA. This is

> how

> > > Progesterone helps

> > > > > reduce norepinephrine signaling, how

> Progesterone

> > > can be

> > > > > sedating and anti-anxiety, and how

> Progesterone

> > > can be used

> > > > > as an antiseizure medication.

> Excessive

> > > allopregnenolone can

> > > > > cause excessive sleepiness, loss of

> libido (since

> > > libido

> > > > > also depends on adequate but not

> excessive

> > > norepinephrine

> > > > > signaling - which gives us sexual

> excitement),

> > > impaired

> > > > > concentration, fatigue (since

> norepinephrine also

> > > is a

> > > > > signal for energy on demand), etc.

> > > > > >>

> > > > > >> Progesterone also reduces

> estradiol's

> > > inhibitory

> > > > > effect on thyroid hormone. I speculate

> that this

> > > may involve

> > > > > reducing thyroid binding protein

> production.

> > > Thus, possibly

> > > > > this can lead to excess thyroid

> signaling for

> > > those

> > > > > sensitive to thyroid signaling - such

> as those

> > > with adrenal

> > > > > fatigue.

> > > > > >>

> > > > > >> Progesterone also may reduce

> blood

> > > pressure.

> > > > > Dizziness may result from excess.

> > > > > >>

> > > > > >> Progesterone is also a

> > > 5-alpha-reductase. This

> > > > > blocks testosterone to DHT conversion.

> Excessive

> > > > > progesterone may thus mean a reduction

> in body

> > > hair, acne,

> > > > > etc. - among other actions of DHT.

> > > > > >>

> > > > > >> I suppose you mean a 24-hour

> Urine

> > > Steroid Hormone

> > > > > Profile from RheinLabs.com when you say

> " rhein's

> > > test " .

> > > > > >>

> > > > > >> I suppose you mean transdermal

> when you

> > > wrote " TD

> > > > > pregnenolone. "

> > > > > >>

> > > > > >> Taking pregnenolone before a

> 24-hour

> > > urine hormone

> > > > > profile depends on whether or not you

> want to see

> > > the

> > > > > effects of pregnenolone on one's

> hormone

> > > metabolism. You

> > > > > would need a before an after test.

> > > > > >>

> > > > > >> Since Pregnenolone is a

> precursor for

> > > nearly all

> > > > > of the substances tested, it can raise

> the level

> > > of any one

> > > > > of the substances it is a precursor to.

> Depending

> > > on the

> > > > > person, this may mean elevated

> testosterone and

> > > precursors

> > > > > or elevated progesterone and

> Pregnanediol,

> > > elevated

> > > > > Cortisol, or any other one or a

> combination of

> > > these

> > > > > signals/hormones.

> > > > > >>

> > > > > >> If one has ongoing treatment

> with

> > > Pregnenolone,

> > > > > then it would be useful to monitor its

> effects on

> > > hormone

> > > > > production by taking it while

> undergoing the

> > > hormone profile

> > > > > test. For example, I would want to know

> if

> > > Pregnenolone is

> > > > > converting excessively to Estradiol,

> resulting

> > > in

> > > > > destabilization of mood in some

> patients or

> > > impaired muscle

> > > > > mass gain in others.

> > > > > >>

> > > > > >> Cheers.

> > > > > >>

> > > > >

> > >

> ==========================================================================

> > > > > >> Pregnenolone is the starting

> point from

> > > which all

> > > > > steroid hormones are manufactured in

> our bodies.

> > > Its

> > > > > conversion in the body follows

> different

> > > pathways, depending

> > > > > on individual needs.  Dr. has his

> me take

> > > this in

> > > > > a cream.

> > > > > >>

> > > > > >>

> > > > > >> Co-Moderator

> > > > > >> Phil

> > > > >

> > > > > --

> > > > >

> > > > > Steve - dudescholar4@

> > > > >

> > > > > " The Problem with Socialism is that

> eventually

> > > you

> > > > > run out of Other People's Money. "

> --Margaret

> > > Thatcher

> > > > >

> > > > > " Mistrust of Government is the Bedrock

> of

> > > American

> > > > > Patriotism "

> > > > >

> > > > > Take World's Smallest Political Quiz

> at

> > > > > http://www.theadvocates.org/quiz.html

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > ------------------------------------

> > > > >

> > > > >