Guest guest Posted October 15, 2009 Report Share Posted October 15, 2009 These areas are the next great frontiers of medicine, to become common practice 10-15 yrs. from now. The men that formed this society, men that are able to think outside the box that was taught them in medical school, how do they get the narrow-sighted MD's onboard? I've read there may be as many as 30 million men that are hormone challenged. Think of the savings in medical bills if all docs were educated on mens hormonal needs. I went through 4 doctors before I found the one that I feel will get me back to where I should be. A lot of guys have been through many more than that. How does the message get out? > > It's from Dr. 's site posted by JanSz. > The official Web Site of the International Hormone Society > http://intlhormonesociety.org/index.php?option=com_content & task=view & id=37 & Itemi\ d=71 > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 16, 2009 Report Share Posted October 16, 2009 You are point one with this one I pray in a short time things will change one only needs to show there Dr. this link to get him on board if this dose not work on the Dr. then you know he is not good. I see this problem now for many yrs and it's sad to say it's not getting any better. Yes it's great we have the web and there are a lot more forums about this problem but for every men that finds one there are 1000 fold that don't. Co-Moderator Phil > From: jim <virtuosa150@...> > Subject: Re: This is a great read. > > Date: Thursday, October 15, 2009, 8:15 PM > These areas are the next great > frontiers of medicine, to become common practice 10-15 yrs. > from now. The men that formed this society, men that are > able to think outside the box that was taught them in > medical school, how do they get the narrow-sighted MD's > onboard? > > I've read there may be as many as 30 million men that are > hormone challenged. Think of the savings in medical bills if > all docs were educated on mens hormonal needs. I went > through 4 doctors before I found the one that I feel will > get me back to where I should be. A lot of guys have been > through many more than that. > > How does the message get out? > > > > > > It's from Dr. 's site posted by JanSz. > > The official Web Site of the International Hormone > Society > > http://intlhormonesociety.org/index.php?option=com_content & task=view & id=37 & Itemi\ d=71 > > > > > > > ------------------------------------ > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 16, 2009 Report Share Posted October 16, 2009 Are the hormones looked upon by the average MD as a black art and to stay away from? > > > > > > It's from Dr. 's site posted by JanSz. > > > The official Web Site of the International Hormone > > Society > > > http://intlhormonesociety.org/index.php?option=com_content & task=view & id=37 & Itemi\ d=71 > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------ > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 16, 2009 Report Share Posted October 16, 2009 I agree... this is a good read. http://intlhormonesociety.org/ index.php?option=com_content & task=view & id=37 & Itemid=71 I'm concerned about these sentences: > Testosterone can convert into estradiol, high levels of which have > adverse effects in men. These include gynecomastia, benign > prostatic hypertrophy (in particular prostate stromal hyperplasia), > and possibly myocardial infarction. I had a heart attack back in April, which was a complete surprise. I was in fairly good shape. Cholesterol ~240, BP controlled with Norvasc at 120/80. No family history of heart disease. My total T was ~ 140 and had been dropping for at least 10 years. I'm secondary, and an MRI of my pituitary was normal. My local doctor had me on 200 mg Enanthate shots every three weeks, and I did this for seven months. Although my total T levels were 600 - 700 mid cycle, I hated the " roller coaster ride " so I decided I'd see Dr. Crisler. He put me on 100 mg Cyp shots once a week, and 250 IU HCG twice a week. I felt much better on Crisler's protocol. My first urine test showed my Testerone level was too high, and my E2 was through the roof. He dropped my Cyp Shots to 80 mg, and added 0.5 mg Arimidex twice a week. I had my heart attack, and luckily only needed three stents. I was thankful that there was no damage to my heart, and that I didn't need open-heart surgery. I'm wondering if my High E2 caused or contributed to my surprise heart attack. My cardiologist suspected I might be diabetic since my blood vessels reacted like a diabetic's during my angioplasties. I've had very stable, very normal blood sugar levels all my life. I did a second urine test. Testosterone was a tad high, but ok. E2 was now too low (~11). Dr. Crisler told me that the apparent diabetic-like response of my blood vessels was caused by the low E2. He modified my Arimidex dosage; I now take 0.5 mg on shot day, then 0.25 mg three days later. He felt confident that my levels would be balanced on this treatment, and that he " was at my disposal. " He had done his job. My primary-care physician was never keen on TRT, and he figured the heart attack was a direct result of the Testosterone. I told Dr. Crisler and he REALLY took my PCP's statements personally, and figured I'd want to stop TRT. I do feel better on TRT, so I'm continuing (so far.) I figure that my heart disease stuff has been building for years, but I wonder if TRT accelerated/exacerbated the problem. I must have had high E2 for the better part of a year, especially when I had 200 mg shots every three weeks - E2 must have been incredibly high. Now that my hormones are (hopefully) fairly balanced, should I be concerned about further heart issues? Thanks (and sorry for the rambling post) Ray Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 16, 2009 Report Share Posted October 16, 2009 I just don't know one would see you at the bottom of the range say it's 250 and your at 251 they say your normal. Others send men to see Endo's or Uro's these Dr. know less then most family Dr.'s so you end up wasting more time. Other Dr.'s see your low and treat you without looking deeper into the problem to find out why your low. This was the problem I had all my hormone levels were what they called low normal but my Testosterone this was below normal. So they treated the Testosterone not paying any att. to my low normal Cortisol levels and Thyroid. I mean if your below normal on Cotrisol your dead. So this went on for 23 yrs until I add HCG to my T shots and my levels doubled this told me not them I am Hypopituitary now we treat all my hormones and this Tue I am going on HGH so I treat Testosterone, Cortisol, Thyroid, Aldosterone, Ferritin with Iron and a mess of other things like Vit.-D, B-12, Folic Acid and I use Arimidex to keep my Estradiol levels down what a dam mess. Co-Moderator Phil > From: jim <virtuosa150@...> > Subject: Re: This is a great read. > > Date: Friday, October 16, 2009, 10:53 AM > Are the hormones looked upon by the > average MD as a black art and to stay away from? > > > > > > > > > > It's from Dr. 's site posted by JanSz. > > > > The official Web Site of the International > Hormone > > > Society > > > > http://intlhormonesociety.org/index.php?option=com_content & task=view & id=37 & Itemi\ d=71 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------ > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 16, 2009 Report Share Posted October 16, 2009 Ray I am just getting over having heart bypass sugary Dr. is a good friend of mine he was calling my wife when I was in the hosp. My heart Dr. told me he thinks it was my low hormones that caused my blockage. I never had a heart attack I just had heartburn. We did a stress test I feel this is a waste of money showed nothing so I insisted they do more so they did a 24 bit scan this showed I have 2 bad blockages they tried to do a Coronary angioplasty but it was calcified and they could not get past it. So my heart Dr. turned me over to a Heart surgeon this A hole took me off TRT and when I was out of surgery in ICU my bones there were held together with wire became infected and I feel it was because of the surgeon taking me off TRT. It's a long story you can read it at this link. The part about my heart is the update. http://forums.realthyroidhelp.com/viewtopic.php?f=5 & t=9239 My heart Dr. told me when I seen him after getting out of the hosp. that has he known the Dr. was going to take me off TRT he would have stopped him. My heart Dr. was an Endo treating people for pituitary and hormone problems in Italy when he come here 20yrs ago he became a heart Dr. I am lucky to have him because he is up on my Pituitary and hormone problems. He feel the main hormone that might have did this to my heart is my Growth Hormones they have been low normal for yrs. Now he is getting my Family Dr. to put me on HGH. I never had high level of Cholesterol levels in my life but I went over 10 yrs with high levels of Estradiol and feel your on to something here and I will ask my Heart Dr. about this the next time I see him. Co-Moderator Phil > From: Ray <rgdavis@...> > Subject: Re: This is a great read. > > Cc: " Ray " <rgdavis@...> > Date: Friday, October 16, 2009, 11:38 AM > I agree... this is a good read. > http://intlhormonesociety.org/ > index.php?option=com_content & task=view & id=37 & Itemid=71 > I'm concerned > about these sentences: > > > Testosterone can convert into estradiol, high levels > of which have > > adverse effects in men. These include gynecomastia, > benign > > prostatic hypertrophy (in particular prostate stromal > hyperplasia), > > and possibly myocardial infarction. > > I had a heart attack back in April, which was a complete > surprise. I > was in fairly good shape. Cholesterol ~240, BP > controlled with > Norvasc at 120/80. No family history of heart > disease. > > My total T was ~ 140 and had been dropping for at least 10 > years.   > I'm secondary, and an MRI of my pituitary was normal. > > My local doctor had me on 200 mg Enanthate shots every > three weeks, > and I did this for seven months. Although my total T > levels were 600 > - 700 mid cycle, I hated the " roller coaster ride " so I > decided I'd > see Dr. Crisler. He put me on 100 mg Cyp shots once a > week, and 250 > IU HCG twice a week. I felt much better on Crisler's > protocol. > > My first urine test showed my Testerone level was too high, > and my E2 > was through the roof. He dropped my Cyp Shots to 80 > mg, and added > 0.5 mg Arimidex twice a week. > > I had my heart attack, and luckily only needed three > stents. I was > thankful that there was no damage to my heart, and that I > didn't need > open-heart surgery. I'm wondering if my High E2 > caused or > contributed to my surprise heart attack. > > My cardiologist suspected I might be diabetic since my > blood vessels > reacted like a diabetic's during my angioplasties. > I've had very > stable, very normal blood sugar levels all my life. > > I did a second urine test. Testosterone was a tad > high, but ok. E2 > was now too low (~11). Dr. Crisler told me that the > apparent > diabetic-like response of my blood vessels was caused by > the low E2.   > He modified my Arimidex dosage; I now take 0.5 mg on shot > day, then > 0.25 mg three days later.   He felt > confident that my levels would be > balanced on this treatment, and that he " was at my > disposal. "  He had > done his job. > > My primary-care physician was never keen on TRT, and he > figured the > heart attack was a direct result of the Testosterone. > I told Dr. > Crisler and he REALLY took my PCP's statements personally, > and > figured I'd want to stop TRT. I do feel better on > TRT, so I'm > continuing (so far.) > > I figure that my heart disease stuff has been building for > years, but > I wonder if TRT accelerated/exacerbated the problem. > I must have had > high E2 for the better part of a year, especially when I > had 200 mg > shots every three weeks - E2 must have been incredibly > high. > > Now that my hormones are (hopefully) fairly balanced, > should I be > concerned about further heart issues? > > Thanks (and sorry for the rambling post) > > Ray > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 17, 2009 Report Share Posted October 17, 2009 GP, Endo & Uro's are narrowsighted. They can only see one symptom and don't test further. I believe in testing. How can a person be treated if you don't know what to treat? But then once tested, a doctor has to know how to put the info together. Most doctors are dumb. What do they teach these guys in school? I read somewhere that medical students get 40 hrs. of training on nutrition. probably none on hormones. I'm lucky. I live real close to HAN and Dr. O. These two have a through knowledge and do a lot of tests. I'm already starting to feel better. I think its from adressing my adrenal and vitamin D issues. I don't think the dose of T is high enough, but it's a start. > > > > > > > > > > It's from Dr. 's site posted by JanSz. > > > > > The official Web Site of the International > > Hormone > > > > Society > > > > > http://intlhormonesociety.org/index.php?option=com_content & task=view & id=37 & Itemi\ d=71 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------ > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 17, 2009 Report Share Posted October 17, 2009 Very true jim and even the best HRT specialist do not look out side the box to other causes such as toxcity, lifestyles, nutritoinal imbalances, daily stresses, ect to look for the cause vs just treat the symptoms. Jim like you said it is a start and do to your past medical condition we will error on the side of caution till we know how you will respond. After 2 weeks I told you to get blood work done then we will adjust accordingly. With the vitamin D and adrenal support its all working together. You are feeling better just in a week just in that self should be encouraging as well. > > > > > > > > > > > > It's from Dr. 's site posted by JanSz. > > > > > > The official Web Site of the International > > > Hormone > > > > > Society > > > > > > http://intlhormonesociety.org/index.php?option=com_content & task=view & id=37 & Itemi\ d=71 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------ > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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