How to use insulin syringes for injections?

[Guest guest]

Hi,

Dr's office injected first testosterone Wednesday afternoon and gave

me a script for Depo Test 200g/ml inject 1cc q 2 weeks. Syringe

prescription is 3cc w 22 1 and 1/2 in needles. Area has no brusing but

still hurts.

I already know from the posts that it would be better to do a half

dose every week, and use a smaller needle to inject.

Questions

1. It does not appear that the insulin syringes I have come apart? So

how do I get the testosterone in them to inject it? (If I draw with it

then I'll have dulled it.)

2. If I do it every week then at the end of the cycle when Dr wants a

blood test should I be expecting it to still be in range if we are

injecting the correct dose?

3. What is the difference between using 1 1/2 in needle as Dr. wrote

for vs. 1/2 inch needles like I have and hope will cause less pain?

Does it mean I can't get to a vein? I " m assuming it will mean a subQ

and slower absorption and therefore more level amounts in the body

instead of going up high and crashing.

4. In US with insurance how much should I expect the vial to cost?

Still waiting on results of blood work that was draw before injection

was given, but he didn't think he lab had the ability to test E2.

Larry

[Guest guest]

Hi Larry-

I hope your weekend has gone well so far.

1) It sounds like the syringe you have is a combo syringe with a

needle. Or it may be a pre-load in which insulin is inserted into it

(rather than drawn by the needle). It may not allow you to switch

needles. There are individual syringes sold separately from needles.

Becton-Dickinson have 1 mL/cc tuberculin syringes which allow any

size needle to be fixed onto them. (By the way, ReliOn just had a

recall on syringes due to inappropriately labeled markings [which can

result in injecting more than indicated]. Hopefully, you don't have

the ReliOn [Walmart] brand.)

2) Assuming 100 mg/wk Depo T/Test Cyp. is the " correct " dose for you

(it's a good starting point), you should finish the week near the

lower end of the reference range or perhaps slightly below it. That

would show that you aren't overdosing (though might be underdosing,

depending on how low you are). Dr. reports variation & how

difficult it is to predict exactly how a man will respond, but

generally, 100 mg/wk Depo T parallels normal weekly production of

testosterone. Again, however, you need to have estradiol tested to

make sure it doesn't sap your improvement despite a " good "

testosterone reading. Every 10 points over 25 pg/mL can sap a good

chunk of testosterone- perhaps around 100 ng/dL.

3) Shorter needles will make it take longer to draw the oil out of the

vial. As for which provides better, more level absorption- IM or sub

Q- I couldn't say. Anyone want to weigh in here with their

experiences? At 100 mg Depo T per week, you aren't likely to crash.

Depo T/Test Cyp. was designed to last about a week (vs. Test. Prop.,

which is active for about 2-3 days).

4) A vial should cost around $30-$40, depending on its size (5mL or 10

mL) & where you fill the prescription. $30 might be a fair estimate

for monthly Depo T cost (though even a 5 mL vial should last you

almost 10 weeks at your dosage strength). Sometimes insurance covers

it, sometimes it doesn't.

Good point about E2- you need to get the " sensitive " or

" ultrasensitive " test- whichever one is available & affordable.

Labcorp offers a sensitive E2 test, whereas Quest does an

ultrasensitive test. These tests report male reference ranges for

estradiol, so they will show an actual number if you are below 15

pg/mL or above 53 pg/mL (vs. other estradiol tests designed for women).

Hope you're experiencing the benefits of T already.

~Xian

>

> Hi,

>

> Dr's office injected first testosterone Wednesday afternoon and gave

> me a script for Depo Test 200g/ml inject 1cc q 2 weeks. Syringe

> prescription is 3cc w 22 1 and 1/2 in needles. Area has no brusing but

> still hurts.

>

> I already know from the posts that it would be better to do a half

> dose every week, and use a smaller needle to inject.

>

> Questions

>

> 1. It does not appear that the insulin syringes I have come apart? So

> how do I get the testosterone in them to inject it? (If I draw with it

> then I'll have dulled it.)

>

> 2. If I do it every week then at the end of the cycle when Dr wants a

> blood test should I be expecting it to still be in range if we are

> injecting the correct dose?

>

> 3. What is the difference between using 1 1/2 in needle as Dr. wrote

> for vs. 1/2 inch needles like I have and hope will cause less pain?

> Does it mean I can't get to a vein? I " m assuming it will mean a subQ

> and slower absorption and therefore more level amounts in the body

> instead of going up high and crashing.

>

> 4. In US with insurance how much should I expect the vial to cost?

>

> Still waiting on results of blood work that was draw before injection

> was given, but he didn't think he lab had the ability to test E2.

>

>

> Larry

>

[Guest guest]

Thanks for commenting, .

Allow me to clarify some things. I'm not a promoter of any particular

size or syringe, so long as one can read the amount drawn into the

syringe easily & can minimize pain. My mention of insulin *syringes*

(not insulin needles) was due to the fact that they are somewhat

easier to fill & have more markings so you can get a more precise

measurement of how much you're injecting. Insulin syringes can be

used either for IM or subQ injections. In message #45413, matttaylor

mentions using insulin syringes to inject into the vastus lateralis

(outer muscle of the leg). One fact to note about insulin syringes is

that they aren't *recommended* for measurement purposes of fractions

of a mL/cc; rather, they have delineations for " units " . However, I

have personally compared them to 5 mL syringes & have found their 10

unit delineations correspond more or less to every .1 mL on the larger

syringe. Also, insulin *syringes* (not needle/syringe combos) allow

you to switch the needle size. Here's a pic so we can make sure we're

referring to the same item :

http://www.jrsmedical.com/SYRINGES_ONLY/BND309602/product.aspx

The needle size I suggested was *not* an insulin needle. It was a 27

G needle, which is bigger than an insulin needle. I mentioned it

because 1) it doesn't hurt as much as larger needles (25, 22, or 20 G)

& 2) it doesn't take quite as long to inject all the oil using a 27 G

needle vs. a 30 G needle. Go to message #45923 which details about

the needle sizes used by other members on this group.

As for expense, in the same message above (#45413) by matttaylor, he

mentioned the cost of 10 mL 200 mg/mL Test Cyp/Depo T as $42.50 for

those with a Sam's Club business membership. If your injection

schedule is 100 mg once per week, this quantity could last you almost

20 weeks (allowing for some inadvertent loss of oil during injection

time). Again, prices vary across the country.

In matt's message, he mentions a more frequent dosing schedule done

with smaller amounts- 28 mg every other day. A more popular strategy

by patients of Dr. Crisler (including some men in this group) is

50 mg Test Cyp. every 3 days. If you consider this ( & don't mind more

frequent injection), you should talk with your doctor first & educate

him on T to E2 conversion.

In any event, I hope you find what works for you to help you feel

better & spend less money.

~Xian

> >

> > Hi,

> >

> > Dr's office injected first testosterone Wednesday afternoon and gave

> > me a script for Depo Test 200g/ml inject 1cc q 2 weeks. Syringe

> > prescription is 3cc w 22 1 and 1/2 in needles. Area has no brusing but

> > still hurts.

> >

> > I already know from the posts that it would be better to do a half

> > dose every week, and use a smaller needle to inject.

> >

> > Questions

> >

> > 1. It does not appear that the insulin syringes I have come apart? So

> > how do I get the testosterone in them to inject it? (If I draw with it

> > then I'll have dulled it.)

> >

> > 2. If I do it every week then at the end of the cycle when Dr wants a

> > blood test should I be expecting it to still be in range if we are

> > injecting the correct dose?

> >

> > 3. What is the difference between using 1 1/2 in needle as Dr. wrote

> > for vs. 1/2 inch needles like I have and hope will cause less pain?

> > Does it mean I can't get to a vein? I " m assuming it will mean a subQ

> > and slower absorption and therefore more level amounts in the body

> > instead of going up high and crashing.

> >

> > 4. In US with insurance how much should I expect the vial to cost?

> >

> > Still waiting on results of blood work that was draw before injection

> > was given, but he didn't think he lab had the ability to test E2.

> >

> >

> > Larry

> >

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Larry, welcome to the group and the needle.

You don't want diabetes syringes with permanently attached needles.

They bend, can break in the vial or body (they do I have had it

happen) and can be quite dull out of the box. You can use a 1ml or 3ml

syringe. Either will work but 3ml are easier to find and come with

luer lock tips which means the tip stays on until you twist it off.

The 1ml use Luer slip tips which aren't entirely stable. I give

hydromorphone injections with the 1ml so I can control the smaller

amounts better but when I am flicking the air bubbles out I often have

the syringe and needle separate requiring me to redo the injection

preparation and waste medication. Unless you are giving less then 1ml

injections stick with the 3ml syringes. If you insist on the 1ml you

want teburculin syringes with luer slip tips.

In terms of needles, anything can be used to draw but the easiest is a

18g. If you are doing IM don't use anything above 27g and that is

pushing it. People who are new to injecting are often shaky and the

smaller the needle the more damage is done internally when you wiggle

the needle. Also that fine and the likelihood of breaking a needle off

in your leg rises. If you aren't obese a half inch needle can reach

the muscle but if you are stick with a 1 inch or 1.5 inch. A 25g 1

inch needle is usually all people need.

Most muscle soreness goes away with practice and not wiggling the

needle in your leg. Also try taking some time to relax your leg, sit

on the couch with your legs up, massage the area before and after the

shot, insert the needle and inject slowly and steadily will eliminate

or greatly reduce the soreness. You can also use warm compresses

before and after. Make sure the testosterone is body temperature not

room temperature, try keeping the vial in your armpit for a few

minutes or drop the vial in a glass of warm water.

If you have the same total dosage it doesn't matter how often you

inject your total testosterone levels should stay the same.

The half inch needles are generally used for subcutaneous injections

another method beside IM to deliver the T. You can always hit a vein

no matter what size needle you use. Always pull back on the plunger to

be sure no matter what style of injecting you use unless you

particularly want to die a painful death. I am not joking injecting

testosterone in oil suspension into a vein can cause a lethal blood

clot (been there don't want to do it again). There is a lot of info in

the archives on subQ testosterone.

No idea about the cost in the states but compounding is much cheaper.

trannyboy