Re: E2- soy protein, soy lecithin

[Guest guest]

Soy dose not make E2 levels go up but has a marker that looks like E2 to the

brain so in men drinking a lot of soy milk there brain will will see this marker

as Testosterone and slow down sending the LH and FSH message to there testis to

make more T. You see the brain in men can't tell the diff. between E2 and

Testosterone because E2 is made from Testosterone. So men that eat or drink a

lot of soy will have low LH and FSH levels with low E2 levels and low

Testosterone.

Soy works great for some women that have very high levels of Estrogen there

brain thinks the soy marker is Estrogen and tells there body to stop making it.

I don't feel your E2 levels are 4 because Hardasnails got the same results 4 on

his labs and he feels like he is to high even took .25 mgs of Arimidex and felt

better. I feel your feeling bad because your T levels fell and this make us

feel dam bad.

I feel for myself it better for me to get my T levels up and to take something

to bring down E2 when it goes to high. For me lowering my dose of T or HCG I

crash and burn and a lot of guys I talk to do the same thing.

I feel it's a small price to pay to have higher levels of T and to have to take

Arimidex to keep E2 down.

Co-Moderator

Phil

> From: jim <virtuosa150@...>

> Subject: E2- soy protein, soy lecithin

>

> Date: Friday, January 22, 2010, 8:39 AM

> I got this bad problem with E2 that

> won't come up. Every morning I have a protein bar that has

> soy protein and soy lecithin. I aslo take a supplement of

> lecithin.

>

> Does soy conclusively raise or lower E2? How much would

> have to be consumed to effect the E2 level?

>

> Thanks

>

>

>

> ------------------------------------

>

>

[Guest guest]

Do all men with high E2 get the problems with their nipples? I never had this.

All the other symptoms of either high or low E2 are the same. Is this correct?

I'm gonna shoot the hcg everyday for a while.

>

> > From: jim <virtuosa150@...>

> > Subject: E2- soy protein, soy lecithin

> >

> > Date: Friday, January 22, 2010, 8:39 AM

> > I got this bad problem with E2 that

> > won't come up. Every morning I have a protein bar that has

> > soy protein and soy lecithin. I aslo take a supplement of

> > lecithin.

> >

> > Does soy conclusively raise or lower E2? How much would

> > have to be consumed to effect the E2 level?

> >

> > Thanks

> >

> >

> >

> > ------------------------------------

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

No not all men get this and the ones that do don't get it all the time why I

can't say the last time my E2 jumped up on me I had not idea it was happening I

just started having Panic Attacks in the middle of the night. I have had them

for yrs. until I found out it was from high levels of E2.

Men just starting on TRT can get sore and hard nipples from the change in there

Testosterone levels. Some men get a bad taste in there mouth others like my

self and Hardasnails will get a rash in a small area. I get it between my

little toe on my right foot. As levels go up wood gets weaker and then stops

going to low wood grinds to a halt.

Co-Moderator

Phil

> From: jim <virtuosa150@...>

> Subject: Re: E2- soy protein, soy lecithin

>

> Date: Friday, January 22, 2010, 9:41 AM

> Do all men with high E2 get the

> problems with their nipples? I never had this. All the other

> symptoms of either high or low E2 are the same. Is this

> correct? I'm gonna shoot the hcg everyday for a while.

>

>

> >

> > > From: jim <virtuosa150@...>

> > > Subject: E2- soy protein, soy

> lecithin

> > >

> > > Date: Friday, January 22, 2010, 8:39 AM

> > > I got this bad problem with E2 that

> > > won't come up. Every morning I have a protein bar

> that has

> > > soy protein and soy lecithin. I aslo take a

> supplement of

> > > lecithin.

> > >

> > > Does soy conclusively raise or lower E2? How much

> would

> > > have to be consumed to effect the E2 level?

> > >

> > > Thanks

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > ------------------------------------

> > >

> > >

[Guest guest]

I've had a rash behind my ear for a year now. Can't be from high E2 though. Yes

my wood has ground to a halt. Couldn't get a hard on if my life depended on it.

> > >

> > > > From: jim <virtuosa150@>

> > > > Subject: E2- soy protein, soy

> > lecithin

> > > >

> > > > Date: Friday, January 22, 2010, 8:39 AM

> > > > I got this bad problem with E2 that

> > > > won't come up. Every morning I have a protein bar

> > that has

> > > > soy protein and soy lecithin. I aslo take a

> > supplement of

> > > > lecithin.

> > > >

> > > > Does soy conclusively raise or lower E2? How much

> > would

> > > > have to be consumed to effect the E2 level?

> > > >

> > > > Thanks

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > ------------------------------------

> > > >

> > > >

[Guest guest]

Your back on HCG and your levels will come back up Hard is having them rerun his

labs maybe it's not to late to run yours again. Look now you know never low

your dose of T or HCG to control E2 it dose not work. Start today keeping a log

on how you feel and what you taking. So you can see how your body reacts to

your HCG and or T meds try to figure out when your going high or falling low

it's not all the hard. My Dr. lets me adjust my dose of Arimidex to how I feel

and my labs are just a tool to prove I am doing it right. I have weeks where I

can do the same dose .25 Mg's every 3 days then for some reason my levels jump

up and I need more then I will fall to low and need to back off on the dose.

You will get dam good at this.

Co-Moderator

Phil

> From: jim <virtuosa150@...>

> Subject: Re: E2- soy protein, soy lecithin

>

> Date: Friday, January 22, 2010, 10:30 AM

> I've had a rash behind my ear for a

> year now. Can't be from high E2 though. Yes my wood has

> ground to a halt. Couldn't get a hard on if my life depended

> on it.

>

>

> > > >

> > > > > From: jim <virtuosa150@>

> > > > > Subject: E2- soy

> protein, soy

> > > lecithin

> > > > >

> > > > > Date: Friday, January 22, 2010, 8:39

> AM

> > > > > I got this bad problem with E2 that

> > > > > won't come up. Every morning I have a

> protein bar

> > > that has

> > > > > soy protein and soy lecithin. I aslo

> take a

> > > supplement of

> > > > > lecithin.

> > > > >

> > > > > Does soy conclusively raise or lower

> E2? How much

> > > would

> > > > > have to be consumed to effect the E2

> level?

> > > > >

> > > > > Thanks

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > ------------------------------------

> > > > >

> > > > >

[Guest guest]

I started keeping a log 1/4. By that time I had been feeling lousy. My hcg

hadn't been reduced yet.

> > > > >

> > > > > > From: jim <virtuosa150@>

> > > > > > Subject: E2- soy

> > protein, soy

> > > > lecithin

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Date: Friday, January 22, 2010, 8:39

> > AM

> > > > > > I got this bad problem with E2 that

> > > > > > won't come up. Every morning I have a

> > protein bar

> > > > that has

> > > > > > soy protein and soy lecithin. I aslo

> > take a

> > > > supplement of

> > > > > > lecithin.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Does soy conclusively raise or lower

> > E2? How much

> > > > would

> > > > > > have to be consumed to effect the E2

> > level?

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Thanks

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > ------------------------------------

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

[Guest guest]

And lower it did not help any there are many things that are covered up and as

you peel off the layers you find other things wrong.

Co-Moderator

Phil

> From: jim <virtuosa150@...>

> Subject: Re: E2- soy protein, soy lecithin

>

> Date: Friday, January 22, 2010, 11:41 AM

> I started keeping a log 1/4. By that

> time I had been feeling lousy. My hcg hadn't been reduced

> yet.

>

>

> > > > > >

> > > > > > > From: jim

> <virtuosa150@>

> > > > > > > Subject: E2-

> soy

> > > protein, soy

> > > > > lecithin

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Date: Friday, January 22,

> 2010, 8:39

> > > AM

> > > > > > > I got this bad problem with

> E2 that

> > > > > > > won't come up. Every morning

> I have a

> > > protein bar

> > > > > that has

> > > > > > > soy protein and soy lecithin.

> I aslo

> > > take a

> > > > > supplement of

> > > > > > > lecithin.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Does soy conclusively raise

> or lower

> > > E2? How much

> > > > > would

> > > > > > > have to be consumed to effect

> the E2

> > > level?

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Thanks

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> ------------------------------------

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

[Guest guest]

I believe joint pain is a unique marker of dropping E2 too low.

~Xian

>

> Do all men with high E2 get the problems with their nipples? I never had this.

All the other symptoms of either high or low E2 are the same. Is this correct?

I'm gonna shoot the hcg everyday for a while.

>

[Guest guest]

Absolutely it is. I had it and tendonitis when my E2 was low. Then I went on

hcg, my T went up to 860 and E2 to 22. I was starting to feel good. Then I

started feeling bad again. Now the tendonitis is starting to come back. My E2 is

4. For some reason it crashed after 3 weeks on hcg.

> >

> > Do all men with high E2 get the problems with their nipples? I never had

this. All the other symptoms of either high or low E2 are the same. Is this

correct? I'm gonna shoot the hcg everyday for a while.

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Strange indeed. Total speculation on my part, but I wonder if you're converting

more testosterone to DHT than estradiol.

I also wonder if the bad experiences Phil and others listed regarding DHEA

supplementation might provide a helpful lead for you. They found their estradiol

increasing significantly from DHEA supplementation. Perhaps HAN/Dr. Overbeck

have this potential setup in mind when the timing is right. Not a suggestion,

as I trust they know better than me.

~Xian

> > >

> > > Do all men with high E2 get the problems with their nipples? I never had

this. All the other symptoms of either high or low E2 are the same. Is this

correct? I'm gonna shoot the hcg everyday for a while.

> > >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Not a conclusize answer, but there is concern that soy has dose-dependent

effects upon men and women. It was implicated as the cause of gynecomastia for

one man consuming mega-doses of soy milk

(http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/576784_3).

Soy also affects various hormone producing cells differently, as it seems to

decrease the activity of certain forms of the 17b HSD enzyme (which converts

Androstenedione to Testosterone) in breast cancer cells

(http://tinyurl.com/ybpob2k or http://preview.tinyurl.com/ybpob2k) while

increasing the enzyme's activity in granulosa (ovarian) cells

(http://humrep.oxfordjournals.org/cgi/content/full/18/3/487). If its multiple

effects upon women parallels some of its effects upon men, soy may disrupt

testosterone and/or estrogen synthesis.

Likewise, differing sources report soy

increases aromatase in hepatic cells (http://tinyurl.com/ydn8jvv or

http://preview.tinyurl.com/ydn8jvv),

decreases it in the granulosa cells

(http://humrep.oxfordjournals.org/cgi/content/full/18/3/487),

and has no effect on aromatase in the brain. Dr. Blaylock, a retired

neurosurgeon, claims in a rather wholesale fashion that soy increases aromatase

activity

(http://preview.tinyurl.com/y9ep7t9) or (http://tinyurl.com/y9ep7t9)

Short answer is that soy does so much that its hard to track. I took it as well

as flaxseed for 2 years inconsistently and 1 year consistently, and took only

one estradiol test while on it. The result while on soy & flaxseed came back at

14 pg/mL, below the optimal reference range. However, I can't say that any low

E2 symptoms bothered me more at that time than now. Since stopping both

phytoestrogenic foods, my e2 has gone up to between 22-25 pg/mL and my DHT has

gone up about 6 points (from 22 to 28 ng/dL). By the same token, I worked out

more frequently prior to discontinuing the phytoestrogens, so who knows what

effect that would have on both blood tests. In response to your question about

" how much soy " , I was consuming 3/4 cup of edamame.

~Xian

>

> I got this bad problem with E2 that won't come up. Every morning I have a

protein bar that has soy protein and soy lecithin. I aslo take a supplement of

lecithin.

>

> Does soy conclusively raise or lower E2? How much would have to be consumed to

effect the E2 level?

>

> Thanks

>

[Guest guest]

I lift weights regularly and I have been having pains in my tendons in my

forearms. I also take 200 mg of DIM per day and suffer from night sweats.

Could this be an indicator that my E2 is too low???

In a message dated 1/22/2010 8:29:35 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,

calvin1564@... writes:

I believe joint pain is a unique marker of dropping E2 too low.

~Xian

>

> Do all men with high E2 get the problems with their nipples? I never had

this. All the other symptoms of either high or low E2 are the same. Is

this correct? I'm gonna shoot the hcg everyday for a while.

>

[Guest guest]

Xian, Thanks for the time you put into your last post. I'll look at all the

links and try to form some kind of conclusion. I think I'll cut out soy

containing products as best as posibble. Thanks again.

> >

> > I got this bad problem with E2 that won't come up. Every morning I have a

protein bar that has soy protein and soy lecithin. I aslo take a supplement of

lecithin.

> >

> > Does soy conclusively raise or lower E2? How much would have to be consumed

to effect the E2 level?

> >

> > Thanks

> >

>

[Guest guest]

It's warned (by whom I don't know) that the use of DHEA supplementation should

be avoided by men that have a history of testicular cancer (ME)or prostate

cancer. I read something to the effect that it may " feed " the cancer growth

reoccurance. I don't understand it, but will stay away from DHEA unless used

under guidance.

> > > >

> > > > Do all men with high E2 get the problems with their nipples? I never had

this. All the other symptoms of either high or low E2 are the same. Is this

correct? I'm gonna shoot the hcg everyday for a while.

> > > >

> > >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Jim the other day Hard called me his E2 come back same lab at 4 I find this odd

some thing is wrong with the lab he is having it rerun. Talk to him about this.

Co-Moderator

Phil

> From: jim <virtuosa150@...>

> Subject: Re: E2- soy protein, soy lecithin

>

> Date: Friday, January 22, 2010, 9:16 PM

> Absolutely it is. I had it and

> tendonitis when my E2 was low. Then I went on hcg, my T went

> up to 860 and E2 to 22. I was starting to feel good. Then I

> started feeling bad again. Now the tendonitis is starting to

> come back. My E2 is 4. For some reason it crashed after 3

> weeks on hcg.

>

>

> > >

> > > Do all men with high E2 get the problems with

> their nipples? I never had this. All the other symptoms of

> either high or low E2 are the same. Is this correct? I'm

> gonna shoot the hcg everyday for a while.

> > >

> >

>

>

>

>

> ------------------------------------

>

>

[Guest guest]

Well I finely got the DHEA out of my system and need to lower my Arimidex going

down to low now but what a ride this was I was doing 1mgs a day to keep my

levels down then when I seen my labs 3x's above the top of the range and stopped

the DHEA I was able to start taking less Arimidex. I finely feel like I am

going down to low. But with me to high a level of E2 I have Panic problems.

Co-Moderator

Phil

> From: d00fu524 <calvin1564@...>

> Subject: Re: E2- soy protein, soy lecithin

>

> Date: Saturday, January 23, 2010, 1:16 AM

> Strange indeed.  Total

> speculation on my part, but I wonder if you're converting

> more testosterone to DHT than estradiol. 

>

> I also wonder if the bad experiences Phil and others listed

> regarding DHEA supplementation might provide a helpful lead

> for you. They found their estradiol increasing significantly

> from DHEA supplementation.  Perhaps HAN/Dr. Overbeck

> have this potential setup in mind when the timing is

> right.  Not a suggestion, as I trust they know better

> than me.

>

> ~Xian

>

>

> > > >

> > > > Do all men with high E2 get the problems

> with their nipples? I never had this. All the other symptoms

> of either high or low E2 are the same. Is this correct? I'm

> gonna shoot the hcg everyday for a while.

> > > >

> > >

> >

>

>

>

>

> ------------------------------------

>

>

[Guest guest]

Going through same thing laid off adex and morning wood started to comeback

slightly. I speculate that DHEA is not needed for people with low cholesterol

because it can only drive it lower. Once the adrenals and thyroid are regulated

properly DHEA may not be used as efficently in the body anymore. Actually dhea

burns cholesterol in some people this is not a good thing who have genetically

low cholesterol to begin with. Mine was low as 89 at one time total cholesterol

dr said it was awesome...I find out that lower cholesterol under 160 you are

more likely for deprssion and early death. Actually there is scientific data to

back up why DHEA is not good for people with low cholesterol. Your body lowers

it for a reason so it does not burn up all your fats and lipids

> > > > >

> > > > > Do all men with high E2 get the problems

> > with their nipples? I never had this. All the other symptoms

> > of either high or low E2 are the same. Is this correct? I'm

> > gonna shoot the hcg everyday for a while.

> > > > >

> > > >

> > >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > ------------------------------------

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

I never seen labs from men on Soy for Estradiol or E's but there brain sees this

like it's testosterone and slows down the message of LH and FSH to the testis

and they look like they are Secondary. Stopping the SOY there levels come back

up seen this a few times now. In women doing soy when they have high levels of

E's there brain sees it as high E and slows down making E's so this can lower a

man's E's levels but it's also lowering there Testosterone. Now if your on TRT

I don't know how this would have an effect on the man.

Co-Moderator

Phil

> From: d00fu524 <calvin1564@...>

> Subject: Re: E2- soy protein, soy lecithin

>

> Date: Saturday, January 23, 2010, 2:09 AM

> Not a conclusize answer, but there is

> concern that soy has dose-dependent effects upon men and

> women.  It was implicated as the cause of gynecomastia

> for one man consuming mega-doses of soy milk

(http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/576784_3). 

>

> Soy also affects various hormone producing cells

> differently, as it seems to decrease the activity of certain

> forms of the 17b HSD enzyme (which converts Androstenedione

> to Testosterone) in breast cancer cells (http://tinyurl.com/ybpob2k or

http://preview.tinyurl.com/ybpob2k) while increasing

> the enzyme's activity in granulosa (ovarian) cells

(http://humrep.oxfordjournals.org/cgi/content/full/18/3/487). 

> If its multiple effects upon women parallels some of its

> effects upon men, soy may disrupt testosterone and/or

> estrogen synthesis. 

>

> Likewise, differing sources report soy

>   increases aromatase in hepatic cells (http://tinyurl.com/ydn8jvv or

http://preview.tinyurl.com/ydn8jvv),

>

>   decreases it in the granulosa cells

(http://humrep.oxfordjournals.org/cgi/content/full/18/3/487),

>

> and has no effect on aromatase in the brain.  Dr.

> Blaylock, a retired neurosurgeon, claims in a rather

> wholesale fashion that soy increases aromatase activity

> (http://preview.tinyurl.com/y9ep7t9) or (http://tinyurl.com/y9ep7t9)

>

> Short answer is that soy does so much that its hard to

> track.  I took it as well as flaxseed for 2 years

> inconsistently and 1 year consistently, and took only one

> estradiol test while on it.  The result while on soy

> & flaxseed came back at 14 pg/mL, below the optimal

> reference range.  However, I can't say that any low E2

> symptoms bothered me more at that time than now.  Since

> stopping both phytoestrogenic foods, my e2 has gone up to

> between 22-25 pg/mL and my DHT has gone up about 6 points

> (from 22 to 28 ng/dL).  By the same token, I worked out

> more frequently prior to discontinuing the phytoestrogens,

> so who knows what effect that would have on both blood

> tests.  In response to your question about " how much

> soy " , I was consuming 3/4 cup of edamame.

>

> ~Xian

>

>

> >

> > I got this bad problem with E2 that won't come up.

> Every morning I have a protein bar that has soy protein and

> soy lecithin. I aslo take a supplement of lecithin.

> >

> > Does soy conclusively raise or lower E2? How much

> would have to be consumed to effect the E2 level?

> >

> > Thanks

> >

>

>

>

>

> ------------------------------------

>

>

[Guest guest]

After examining the scenerio like my self and phil, jim burns through HCG like

no tomorrow so in this case he would need a fresh batch of hcg every 2 weeks

inorder to over come this issue. His numbers where looking good at 837 with e2

22 then something went wacky. I bet it was his hcg was lossing effect causing

him to drop. After 14 days hcg is useless in my body. So only suggestion is if

insurance will cover it instructions are discard after 2 weeks on his script or

goto we place a huge order from ADC to avoid this. One way or another you will

need HCG so if it comes from here and your pharmacy. Or better I have a better

solution. Undo the top bottle cut the hcg tablet into quaters. Find a place on

like that sells bottles that you can see and store the other in a sealed bottle

till you are ready. This way from 10,000 ius you get 4 x 2500 ius bottles for

price of one. All you do is mix it with bacterio static water and you are good

to go..Problemed solved.

> > > >

> > > > Do all men with high E2 get the problems with

> > their nipples? I never had this. All the other symptoms of

> > either high or low E2 are the same. Is this correct? I'm

> > gonna shoot the hcg everyday for a while.

> > > >

> > >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > ------------------------------------

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Soy can potentially increase rt3 by lowering iodine levels as well.

> > >

> > > I got this bad problem with E2 that won't come up. Every morning I have a

protein bar that has soy protein and soy lecithin. I aslo take a supplement of

lecithin.

> > >

> > > Does soy conclusively raise or lower E2? How much would have to be

consumed to effect the E2 level?

> > >

> > > Thanks

> > >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Yes and I am on drugs to lower my cholesterol levels and they are below the

normal range my Heart Dr. says this is where he wants it.

Co-Moderator

Phil

> From: hardasnails1973 <hardasnails1973@...>

> Subject: Re: E2- soy protein, soy lecithin

>

> Date: Saturday, January 23, 2010, 10:25 AM

> Going through same thing laid off

> adex and morning wood started to comeback slightly.  I

> speculate that DHEA is not needed for people with low

> cholesterol because it can only drive it lower. Once the

> adrenals and thyroid are regulated properly DHEA may not be

> used as efficently in the body anymore.  Actually dhea

> burns cholesterol in some people this is not a good thing

> who have genetically low cholesterol to begin with. Mine was

> low as 89 at one time total cholesterol dr said it was

> awesome...I find out that lower cholesterol under 160 you

> are more likely for deprssion and early death. 

> Actually there is scientific data to back up why DHEA is not

> good for people with low cholesterol.  Your body lowers

> it for a reason so it does not burn up all your fats and

> lipids

>

>

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Do all men with high E2 get the

> problems

> > > with their nipples? I never had this. All the

> other symptoms

> > > of either high or low E2 are the same. Is this

> correct? I'm

> > > gonna shoot the hcg everyday for a while.

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > ------------------------------------

> > >

> > >

[Guest guest]

I never seen HCG in a tablet in a vial so this is a new one on me.

Co-Moderator

Phil

> From: hardasnails1973 <hardasnails1973@...>

> Subject: Re: E2- soy protein, soy lecithin

>

> Date: Saturday, January 23, 2010, 10:36 AM

> After examining the scenerio like my

> self and phil, jim burns through HCG like no tomorrow so in

> this case he would need a fresh batch of hcg every 2 weeks

> inorder to over come this issue.  His numbers where

> looking good at 837 with e2 22 then something went

> wacky.  I bet it was his hcg was lossing effect causing

> him to drop.  After 14 days hcg is useless in my body.

> So only suggestion is if insurance will cover it

> instructions are discard after 2 weeks on his script or goto

> we place a huge order from ADC to avoid this.  One way

> or another you will need HCG so if it comes from here and

> your pharmacy. Or better I have a better solution. Undo the

> top bottle cut the hcg tablet into quaters. Find a place on

> like that sells bottles that you can see and store the other

> in a sealed bottle till you are ready. This way from 10,000

> ius you get 4 x 2500 ius bottles for price of one.  All

> you do is mix it with bacterio static water and you are good

> to go..Problemed solved.

>

>

> > > > >

> > > > > Do all men with high E2 get the

> problems with

> > > their nipples? I never had this. All the other

> symptoms of

> > > either high or low E2 are the same. Is this

> correct? I'm

> > > gonna shoot the hcg everyday for a while.

> > > > >

> > > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > ------------------------------------

> > >

> > >

[Guest guest]

The prescription hcg I've been getting thus far was been granular. My insurance

doesn't cover hcg. I do submit prescriptions to my company for reimbusment. 2x

per month would be a lot to submit, considering the other presciptions I put in

for. Things are tight at my company, don't want to give them a reason to get rid

of me. 1x per month I don't think would be bad. The other hcg I'll get from ADC.

> > > > >

> > > > > Do all men with high E2 get the problems with

> > > their nipples? I never had this. All the other symptoms of

> > > either high or low E2 are the same. Is this correct? I'm

> > > gonna shoot the hcg everyday for a while.

> > > > >

> > > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > ------------------------------------

> > >

> > >

[Guest guest]

when was the last time you had your E2 checked? I know that when my E2 went up

from 8 to 22, my tendonitis and shoulder ache pretty much went away. I'm not

getting any night sweats.

> >

> > Do all men with high E2 get the problems with their nipples? I never had

> this. All the other symptoms of either high or low E2 are the same. Is

> this correct? I'm gonna shoot the hcg everyday for a while.

> >

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

So if I stop the DIM, and I feel ok it means that my E2 was too low, is

this right???

In a message dated 1/23/2010 2:32:47 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,

pmgamer18@... writes:

Only one way to tell stop the DIM and see or do labs. I not sure about the

kind of DIM your on if it's not tables I think it's not Indolplex/DIM and

the kind in caps don't work very good. But doing 200 mgs is a lot my

Indolplex/DIM is a 120 mgs tablet and I was cutting this in half.

Co-Moderator

Phil

> From: _gviceman77@..._ (mailto:gviceman77@...)

<_gviceman77@..._ (mailto:gviceman77@...) >

> Subject: Re: E2- soy protein, soy lecithin

> _ @hypogonadismhyp_

(mailto: )

> Date: Saturday, January 23, 2010, 11:39 AM

> I lift weights regularly and I have

> been having pains in my tendons in my

> forearms. I also take 200 mg of DIM per day and

> suffer from night sweats.

>

> Could this be an indicator that my E2 is too low???

>

>

> In a message dated 1/22/2010 8:29:35 P.M. Eastern Standard

> Time,

> _calvin1564@sbcglobacalvi_ (mailto:calvin1564@...)

> writes:

>

>

>

>

> I believe joint pain is a unique marker of dropping E2 too

> low.

>

> ~Xian

>

>

> >

> > Do all men with high E2 get the problems with

> their nipples? I never had

> this. All the other symptoms of either high or low E2

> are the same. Is

> this correct? I'm gonna shoot the hcg everyday for a

> while.

> >

>

>

>

>

>

> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

>

>

>

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