Re: Re: Exactly how are normal ranges of testosterone determined by laboratories??

[Guest guest]

That last part: How do we know out Optimum testo level? We can't!

My Total T was ever much above midrange. Now it's where it was while i was

optimal thyroid, about midrange. Hertoghe wants my testosterone to be in the

very upper range though.

I am sure he wants that for all men.

Sendt fra min iPhone

Den 26. jan. 2011 kl. 20.10 skrev " Barb " <baba@...>:

" Normal " is a statistical term meaning 95% of the population. You're supposed to

measure " healthy " people, plot their levels on a graph, and just chop off the

top and bottom 2.5% to get this normal curve. It should be symmetrical. I called

Quest Labs about the Free T3 (thyroid) curve, because I was having an argument

with someone about the ranges. Turns out that is not a normal curve, but

negatively skewed, meaning probably 80% of the values are to the right of the

midpoint. In any case, being " in-range " does not equate to good health.

Logically, if you look at the Quest ranges, does it make sense that someone can

have 4 times as much testosterone and still be as " normal " as the guy with 260?

Healthy is probably somewhere towards the middle, which would be 630. From there

you might extend out a couple hundred points, so 430-830 might be a better

range. I know DH has a major estrogen problem if his levels are in the 800s. He

does better in the 550-650 range.

Then there is the fact that some men are naturally higher testosterone than

others. A deep voice and naturally muscular build without working out are signs,

I think, of higher testosterone. So what's an optimal number for one may be too

much or too little for another.

JMHO,

Barb

>

> The normal range for total T in men is 241-827 ng/dl according to Labcorp and

260-1000 ng/dl according to Quest Laboratories.

>

> What is the methodology used to determine that these are the " normal range "

for testosterone???

>

[Guest guest]

I only took Thyroid 3+ years ago. Hertoghe told me that if you rely

On ONE hormone alone, the system will be stressed. Meaning I stressed my Thyroid

taking ONLY T4 and T3.

Sendt fra min iPhone

Den 26. jan. 2011 kl. 20.35 skrev " Barb " <baba@...>:

Your doctor is probably bound by the Standard of Care to keep you within range.

Have your thyroid levels been checked, meaning a Free T3, and Free T4 and not

just a TSH? Many here compensate by taking more testosterone than needed because

thyroid is too low. Both apparently give you energy.

Going from 100/wk to 50/wk is a pretty drastic drop. I would try something like

70 mg/every 5 days. You won't get as high, but you also won't go as low. And

it'd probably keep you in range.

Barb

> > >

> > > The normal range for total T in men is 241-827 ng/dl according to Labcorp

and 260-1000 ng/dl according to Quest Laboratories.

> > >

> > > What is the methodology used to determine that these are the " normal

range " for testosterone???

> > >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

When you test in 3 days after your shot your testing your peak levels most Dr.

not up on this will do that lower your dose. You need to test on the day of

your next shot but before it. It's when we go down to low we feel bad.

Co-Moderator

Phil

> From: cvictorg <cvgrashow@...>

> Subject: Re: Exactly how are normal ranges of testosterone

determined by laboratories??

>

> Date: Wednesday, January 26, 2011, 2:18 PM

> This is what I don't

> understand.  Let's say the doc prescribes me 100mgs of

> test cyp per week.  I go in for blood work 2 or 3 days

> after my last injection.  My levels come back as 1250

> and I feel great.  The doc will say my levels are to

> high and reduce my dose to 50-75mgs per week to get my

> levels down to around 800 or so.

>

> Suppose I feel like crap at 800 but great at 1200-1300??

>

> What to do then??

>

>

> > >

> > > The normal range for total T in men is 241-827

> ng/dl according to Labcorp and 260-1000 ng/dl according to

> Quest Laboratories.

> > >

> > > What is the methodology used to determine that

> these are the " normal range " for testosterone???

> > >

> >

>

>

>

>

> ------------------------------------

>

>

[Guest guest]

Most will shoot for the Upper 1/3 of your labs range for a young man. Yet some

men do fine at lower levels and if you can get by on them you will have less

problems with E2 levels.

Co-Moderator

Phil

> From: <gibcast@...>

> Subject: Re: Re: Exactly how are normal ranges of testosterone

determined by laboratories??

> " " < >

> Date: Wednesday, January 26, 2011, 2:42 PM

> That last part: How do we know out

> Optimum testo level? We can't!

>

> My Total T was ever much above midrange. Now it's where it

> was while i was optimal thyroid, about midrange. Hertoghe

> wants my testosterone to be in the very upper range though.

>

> I am sure he wants that for all men.

>

> Sendt fra min iPhone

>

> Den 26. jan. 2011 kl. 20.10 skrev " Barb " <baba@...>:

>

> " Normal " is a statistical term meaning 95% of the

> population. You're supposed to measure " healthy " people,

> plot their levels on a graph, and just chop off the top and

> bottom 2.5% to get this normal curve. It should be

> symmetrical. I called Quest Labs about the Free T3 (thyroid)

> curve, because I was having an argument with someone about

> the ranges. Turns out that is not a normal curve, but

> negatively skewed, meaning probably 80% of the values are to

> the right of the midpoint. In any case, being " in-range "

> does not equate to good health.

>

> Logically, if you look at the Quest ranges, does it make

> sense that someone can have 4 times as much testosterone and

> still be as " normal " as the guy with 260? Healthy is

> probably somewhere towards the middle, which would be 630.

> From there you might extend out a couple hundred points, so

> 430-830 might be a better range. I know DH has a major

> estrogen problem if his levels are in the 800s. He does

> better in the 550-650 range.

>

> Then there is the fact that some men are naturally higher

> testosterone than others. A deep voice and naturally

> muscular build without working out are signs, I think, of

> higher testosterone. So what's an optimal number for one may

> be too much or too little for another.

>

> JMHO,

> Barb

>

>

> >

> > The normal range for total T in men is 241-827 ng/dl

> according to Labcorp and 260-1000 ng/dl according to Quest

> Laboratories.

> >

> > What is the methodology used to determine that these

> are the " normal range " for testosterone???

> >

>

>

>

>

>

>      

>

>

[Guest guest]

That's My point: I felt AWESOME being midrange and also lower, on testosterone.

I Think it was thyroid that drove me. Thyroid was my main source of energy.

Hertoghe does NOT like it when ONE hormone drives a body; too much stress on one

hormone!

But that was Total T.

My free testosterone index was always high! What do you make out of that?

Sendt fra min iPhone

Den 26. jan. 2011 kl. 22.36 skrev philip georgian <pmgamer18@...>:

Most will shoot for the Upper 1/3 of your labs range for a young man. Yet some

men do fine at lower levels and if you can get by on them you will have less

problems with E2 levels.

Co-Moderator

Phil

> From: <gibcast@...>

> Subject: Re: Re: Exactly how are normal ranges of testosterone

determined by laboratories??

> " " < >

> Date: Wednesday, January 26, 2011, 2:42 PM

> That last part: How do we know out

> Optimum testo level? We can't!

>

> My Total T was ever much above midrange. Now it's where it

> was while i was optimal thyroid, about midrange. Hertoghe

> wants my testosterone to be in the very upper range though.

>

> I am sure he wants that for all men.

>

> Sendt fra min iPhone

>

> Den 26. jan. 2011 kl. 20.10 skrev " Barb " <baba@...>:

>

> " Normal " is a statistical term meaning 95% of the

> population. You're supposed to measure " healthy " people,

> plot their levels on a graph, and just chop off the top and

> bottom 2.5% to get this normal curve. It should be

> symmetrical. I called Quest Labs about the Free T3 (thyroid)

> curve, because I was having an argument with someone about

> the ranges. Turns out that is not a normal curve, but

> negatively skewed, meaning probably 80% of the values are to

> the right of the midpoint. In any case, being " in-range "

> does not equate to good health.

>

> Logically, if you look at the Quest ranges, does it make

> sense that someone can have 4 times as much testosterone and

> still be as " normal " as the guy with 260? Healthy is

> probably somewhere towards the middle, which would be 630.

> From there you might extend out a couple hundred points, so

> 430-830 might be a better range. I know DH has a major

> estrogen problem if his levels are in the 800s. He does

> better in the 550-650 range.

>

> Then there is the fact that some men are naturally higher

> testosterone than others. A deep voice and naturally

> muscular build without working out are signs, I think, of

> higher testosterone. So what's an optimal number for one may

> be too much or too little for another.

>

> JMHO,

> Barb

>

>

> >

> > The normal range for total T in men is 241-827 ng/dl

> according to Labcorp and 260-1000 ng/dl according to Quest

> Laboratories.

> >

> > What is the methodology used to determine that these

> are the " normal range " for testosterone???

> >

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Symptoms always have to be taken into account.

I have issues with ones that suggest changing something just from a lab

level and before taking into account how the person feels. I mean, we can

generally tell when something's off from the lab levels, but sometimes that

low hormone level is not where it's all at, or at least not the top

priority.

Erm, so, how is insisting that total T be higher (despite your account that

seems to suggest testosterone isn't so low for your body) not focusing too

much on one hormone?

-Nigel

On 26 January 2011 16:09, <gibcast@...> wrote:

>

>

> That's My point: I felt AWESOME being midrange and also lower, on

> testosterone. I Think it was thyroid that drove me. Thyroid was my main

> source of energy. Hertoghe does NOT like it when ONE hormone drives a body;

> too much stress on one hormone!

>

> But that was Total T.

>

> My free testosterone index was always high! What do you make out of that?

>

> Sendt fra min iPhone

>

[Guest guest]

There is so much worry about Estrogen, It seems most men here moved next door to

their doc's practice....

My question is, does high Estrogen cause so many health problems it must be

properly treated?

Re: Re: Exactly how are normal ranges of testosterone

determined by laboratories??

Symptoms always have to be taken into account.

I have issues with ones that suggest changing something just from a lab

level and before taking into account how the person feels. I mean, we can

generally tell when something's off from the lab levels, but sometimes that

low hormone level is not where it's all at, or at least not the top

priority.

Erm, so, how is insisting that total T be higher (despite your account that

seems to suggest testosterone isn't so low for your body) not focusing too

much on one hormone?

-Nigel

On 26 January 2011 16:09, <gibcast@...> wrote:

>

>

> That's My point: I felt AWESOME being midrange and also lower, on

> testosterone. I Think it was thyroid that drove me. Thyroid was my main

> source of energy. Hertoghe does NOT like it when ONE hormone drives a body;

> too much stress on one hormone!

>

> But that was Total T.

>

> My free testosterone index was always high! What do you make out of that?

>

> Sendt fra min iPhone

>

[Guest guest]

Free T is only 1 to 2 % of your Total T so if your Total T is low with a higher

Free T it's not as good as a higher Free T with a better Total T.

Co-Moderator

Phil

>

> > From: <gibcast@...>

> > Subject: Re: Re: Exactly how are normal

> ranges of testosterone determined by laboratories??

> > " "

> < >

> > Date: Wednesday, January 26, 2011, 2:42 PM

> > That last part: How do we know out

> > Optimum testo level? We can't!

> >

> > My Total T was ever much above midrange. Now it's

> where it

> > was while i was optimal thyroid, about midrange.

> Hertoghe

> > wants my testosterone to be in the very upper range

> though.

> >

> > I am sure he wants that for all men.

> >

> > Sendt fra min iPhone

> >

> > Den 26. jan. 2011 kl. 20.10 skrev " Barb " <baba@...>:

> >

> > " Normal " is a statistical term meaning 95% of the

> > population. You're supposed to measure " healthy "

> people,

> > plot their levels on a graph, and just chop off the

> top and

> > bottom 2.5% to get this normal curve. It should be

> > symmetrical. I called Quest Labs about the Free T3

> (thyroid)

> > curve, because I was having an argument with someone

> about

> > the ranges. Turns out that is not a normal curve, but

> > negatively skewed, meaning probably 80% of the values

> are to

> > the right of the midpoint. In any case, being

> " in-range "

> > does not equate to good health.

> >

> > Logically, if you look at the Quest ranges, does it

> make

> > sense that someone can have 4 times as much

> testosterone and

> > still be as " normal " as the guy with 260? Healthy is

> > probably somewhere towards the middle, which would be

> 630.

> > From there you might extend out a couple hundred

> points, so

> > 430-830 might be a better range. I know DH has a

> major

> > estrogen problem if his levels are in the 800s. He

> does

> > better in the 550-650 range.

> >

> > Then there is the fact that some men are naturally

> higher

> > testosterone than others. A deep voice and naturally

> > muscular build without working out are signs, I think,

> of

> > higher testosterone. So what's an optimal number for

> one may

> > be too much or too little for another.

> >

> > JMHO,

> > Barb

> >

> >

> > >

> > > The normal range for total T in men is 241-827

> ng/dl

> > according to Labcorp and 260-1000 ng/dl according to

> Quest

> > Laboratories.

> > >

> > > What is the methodology used to determine that

> these

> > are the " normal range " for testosterone???

> > >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >       

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

More and more everyday new stuff about high E's in men are coming out. Too much

is bad not enough is just as bad.

http://www.lef.org/magazine/mag2008/nov2008_Dangers-of-Excess-Estrogen-in-the-Ag\

ing-Male_01.htm

Co-Moderator

Phil

>

> >

> >

> > That's My point: I felt AWESOME being midrange and

> also lower, on

> > testosterone. I Think it was thyroid that drove me.

> Thyroid was my main

> > source of energy. Hertoghe does NOT like it when ONE

> hormone drives a body;

> > too much stress on one hormone!

> >

> > But that was Total T.

> >

> > My free testosterone index was always high! What do

> you make out of that?

> >

> > Sendt fra min iPhone

> >

>

>