RE: If you have primary why would you take hcg? Read more from the MESO-Rx Steroid

[Guest guest]

Because it can help you in different ways and who knows? Nothing is set in

stone. If my testes can get larger, for the first time in my whole life, ill

take it. All I have is hope.

If you have primary why would you take hcg? Read more

from the MESO-Rx Steroid

Question - Can HcG be used to treat hypergonadotropic hypogonadism (primary

hypogonadism), and if so, how and at what dosage?

Answer - Primary hypogonadism or HYPERgonadotropic hypogonadism is testicular

failure. So the answer in general is no.

If this is correct why then id hcg used??

Crisler says this

Any physician who administers TRT will, within the first few months of doing

so, field complaints from their patients because they are now experiencing

troubling testicular atrophy. Irrespective of the numerous and abundant benefits

of TRT, men never enjoy seeing their genitals shrinking! Testicular atrophy

occurs because the depressed LH level, secondary to the HPTA suppression TRT

induces, no longer supports them. It is well known that HCG—a Luteinizing

Hormone (LH) analog—will effectively, and dramatically, restore the testicles to

previous form and function. It accomplishes this due to shared moiety between

the alpha subunits of both hormones.

So, that satisfies an aesthetic consideration which should not be ignored. Now

let's delve into the pharmacodynamics of the TRT medications. For those

employing injectable

testosterone cypionate, the cypionate ester provides a 5-8 day half-life,

depending upon the specific metabolism, activity level, and overall health of

the patient. It is now well-established that appropriate TRT using IM injections

must be dosed at weekly intervals, in order to avoid seating the patient on a

hormonal,

[The entire original message is not included]

[Guest guest]

Problem is all I can find on the web is anecdotal evidence - no hard studies

>

> Because it can help you in different ways and who knows? Nothing is set in

stone. If my testes can get larger, for the first time in my whole life, ill

take it. All I have is hope.

>

> If you have primary why would you take hcg? Read more

from the MESO-Rx Steroid

>

>

> Question - Can HcG be used to treat hypergonadotropic hypogonadism (primary

hypogonadism), and if so, how and at what dosage?

>

> Answer - Primary hypogonadism or HYPERgonadotropic hypogonadism is testicular

failure. So the answer in general is no.

>

> If this is correct why then id hcg used??

>

> Crisler says this

>

> Any physician who administers TRT will, within the first few months of doing

so, field complaints from their patients because they are now experiencing

troubling testicular atrophy. Irrespective of the numerous and abundant benefits

of TRT, men never enjoy seeing their genitals shrinking! Testicular atrophy

occurs because the depressed LH level, secondary to the HPTA suppression TRT

induces, no longer supports them. It is well known that HCG—a Luteinizing

Hormone (LH) analog—will effectively, and dramatically, restore the testicles to

previous form and function. It accomplishes this due to shared moiety between

the alpha subunits of both hormones.

>

> So, that satisfies an aesthetic consideration which should not be ignored.

Now let's delve into the pharmacodynamics of the TRT medications. For those

employing injectable

> testosterone cypionate, the cypionate ester provides a 5-8 day half-life,

depending upon the specific metabolism, activity level, and overall health of

the patient. It is now well-established that appropriate TRT using IM injections

must be dosed at weekly intervals, in order to avoid seating the patient on a

hormonal,

>

> [The entire original message is not included]

>

>

[Guest guest]

No solid case studies so you never know. Hope for the best cvictorg, all I want

is to be able to conceive.

If you have primary why would you take hcg? Read more

from the MESO-Rx Steroid

>

>

> Question - Can HcG be used to treat hypergonadotropic hypogonadism (primary

hypogonadism), and if so, how and at what dosage?

>

> Answer - Primary hypogonadism or HYPERgonadotropic hypogonadism is testicular

failure. So the answer in general is no.

>

> If this is correct why then id hcg used??

>

> Crisler says this

>

> Any physician who administers TRT will, within the first few months of doing

so, field complaints from their patients because they are now experiencing

troubling testicular atrophy. Irrespective of the numerous and abundant benefits

of TRT, men never enjoy seeing their genitals shrinking! Testicular atrophy

occurs because the depressed

[The entire original message is not included]

[Guest guest]

When your on TRT your HPTA gets shut down so what this means is your Pituitary

slows down sending the LH message to your body and your testis. So your Lh

cells are not being told to work and you have some in your brain. Taking HCG

acts like LH and tell the cells to work. Plus if your T levels were 200 the HCG

will make your Testis make that much T.

Co-Moderator

Phil

> From: cvictorg <cvgrashow@...>

> Subject: If you have primary why would you take hcg? Read more

from the MESO-Rx Steroid

>

> Date: Saturday, February 12, 2011, 4:12 PM

> Question - Can HcG be used to treat

> hypergonadotropic hypogonadism (primary hypogonadism), and

> if so, how and at what dosage?

>

> Answer - Primary hypogonadism or HYPERgonadotropic

> hypogonadism is testicular failure. So the answer in general

> is no.

>

> If this is correct why then id hcg used??

>

> Crisler says this

>

> Any physician who administers TRT will, within the first

> few months of doing so, field complaints from their patients

> because they are now experiencing troubling testicular

> atrophy. Irrespective of the numerous and abundant benefits

> of TRT, men never enjoy seeing their genitals shrinking!

> Testicular atrophy occurs because the depressed LH level,

> secondary to the HPTA suppression TRT induces, no longer

> supports them. It is well known that HCG—a Luteinizing

> Hormone (LH) analog—will effectively, and dramatically,

> restore the testicles to previous form and function. It

> accomplishes this due to shared moiety between the alpha

> subunits of both hormones.

>

> So, that satisfies an aesthetic consideration which should

> not be ignored. Now let's delve into the pharmacodynamics of

> the TRT medications. For those employing injectable

> testosterone cypionate, the cypionate ester provides a 5-8

> day half-life, depending upon the specific metabolism,

> activity level, and overall health of the patient. It is now

> well-established that appropriate TRT using IM injections

> must be dosed at weekly intervals, in order to avoid seating

> the patient on a hormonal, and emotional, roller coaster.

> Adding in some HCG toward the end of the weekly " cycle "

> compensates for the drop in serum androgen levels by the

> half-life of the cypionate ester. Certainly the body thrives

> on regularity, and supplementing the TRT with endogenous

> testosterone production at just the right time—without

> inappropriately raising androgen OR estrogen (more on that

> later)—approximates the excellent performance stability of

> transdermal testosterone delivery systems for those who, for

> whatever reason or reasons, prefer test cyp.

>

> But there's another metabolic reason to employ this

> protocol. The P450 Side Chain Cleavage enzyme, which

> converts CHOL into pregnenolone at the initiation of all

> three metabolic pathways CHOL serves as precursor (the sex

> hormones, glucocorticoids and mineralcorticoids), is

> actively stimulated, or depressed, by LH concentrations. It

> is intuitively consistent that during conditions of lowered

> testosterone levels, commensurate increases in LH production

> would serve to stimulate this conversion from CHOL into

> these pathways, thereby feeding more raw material for

> increased hormone production. And vice versa. Thus the

> addition of HCG (which also stimulates the P450scc enzyme)

> helps restore a more natural balance of the hormones within

> this pathway in patients who are entirely, or even

> partially, HPTA-suppressed.

>

> http://healthfully.org/malehormones/id11.html

>

> An interesting new way of increasing testosterone levels in

> men has been achieved through the use of human chorionic

> gonadotropin (hCG). hCG is a hormone that is able to bind to

> lutenizing hormone (LH) receptors with the same binding

> affinity as LH. Administration of hCG can, therefore, mimic

> the same effect as LH and increase testosterone production

> by stimulating Leydig cells in the testicles. In men who

> still have a functional LH/testosterone control loop,

> testosterone production with hCG is the most physiologic

> method and is not associated with the testicular atrophy

> that can occasionally happen with direct testosterone

> administration. The preferred method of administering hCG is

> to give self-administered subcutaneous doses with a tiny

> insulin syringe twice weekly. With normal aging, the

> testicles will at some point stop responding to the LH and

> hCG signals. If testosterone levels do not rise in a patient

> receiving hCG after 6 weeks, we know the " disconnect "

> between the testicles and the pituitary gland has occurred

> and direct testosterone supplementation is the preferred

> route

>

> As far as I can see the only reason for taking hcg is to

> prevent testicular atrophy

>

> Question - Are there any studies showing that use of hcg

> reverses testicular atrophy?

>

> I mean if you're primary - why would you need hcg??

>

>

>

> ------------------------------------

>

>

[Guest guest]

Here is a copy of a post to me from Dr. to help me get my Dr. to let me try

HCG. At the time Dr.'s told me I was Primary. Trying the HCG my labs doubled

after 15 shots of HCG telling me and my Dr. I am not Primary I am Secondary.

====================================================

He probably feels that since you suffer primary hypogonadism (I am guessing)

there is no use in adding HCG to your protocol. There are several reasons why

this is not so. First, you have not lost all Leydig cells, so any HCG you take

will stimulate those who still function to produce endogenous testosterone.

This will support testicular size. We should not ignore this aesthetic

consideration.

Next, if he reads my work, he will learn that HPTA-suppressed (as all TRT

patients are to some extent) also suffer decreased pregenenolone levels, which

is the first step after CHOL in all three hormonal pathways which begin with

CHOL. HCG increases pregnenolone production, and therefore restores a more

natural balance of our hormones.

Next, nearly all TRT patients who add in HCG to their regimens report an

increased sense of well-being and also libido. These are genuine quality of life

issues.

Finally, I just instinctively do not want all those LH receptors (including

those we have yet to discover and appreciate) unstimulated.

---------------------------------------------------

This link supports what Dr. feels about the use of HCG.

http://jcem.endojournals.org/cgi/content/abstract/90/5/2595

Co-Moderator

Phil

> From: uu1845@... <uu1845@...>

> Subject: RE: If you have primary why would you take hcg? Read

more from the MESO-Rx Steroid

>

> Date: Saturday, February 12, 2011, 5:44 PM

> Because it can help you in different

> ways and who knows? Nothing is set in stone. If my testes

> can get larger, for the first time in my whole life, ill

> take it. All I have is hope.

>

> If you have primary why would you

> take hcg? Read more from the MESO-Rx Steroid

>

>

> Question - Can HcG be used to treat hypergonadotropic

> hypogonadism (primary hypogonadism), and if so, how and at

> what dosage?

>

> Answer - Primary hypogonadism or HYPERgonadotropic

> hypogonadism is testicular failure. So the answer in general

> is no.

>

> If this is correct why then id hcg used??

>

> Crisler says this

>

> Any physician who administers TRT will, within the first

> few months of doing so, field complaints from their patients

> because they are now experiencing troubling testicular

> atrophy. Irrespective of the numerous and abundant benefits

> of TRT, men never enjoy seeing their genitals shrinking!

> Testicular atrophy occurs because the depressed LH level,

> secondary to the HPTA suppression TRT induces, no longer

> supports them. It is well known that HCG—a Luteinizing

> Hormone (LH) analog—will effectively, and dramatically,

> restore the testicles to previous form and function. It

> accomplishes this due to shared moiety between the alpha

> subunits of both hormones.

>

> So, that satisfies an aesthetic consideration which should

> not be ignored. Now let's delve into the pharmacodynamics of

> the TRT medications. For those employing injectable

> testosterone cypionate, the cypionate ester provides a 5-8

> day half-life, depending upon the specific metabolism,

> activity level, and overall health of the patient. It is now

> well-established that appropriate TRT using IM injections

> must be dosed at weekly intervals, in order to avoid seating

> the patient on a hormonal,

>

> [The entire original message is not included]

>

>

[Guest guest]

This is what I have to say about this if your looking for studies to back up the

use of HCG in men with low T forget it. First everything out there is about the

use of HCG for DIET and there ads.

What we have learned about TRT is way a head of even what is in the AACE

Guidelines. Dr.'s like Shippen and Dr. two of the best there is are the

cutting edge for TRT and far ahead of any studies you will find. They treat

thousands of men.

Men that are doing good on TRT read Dr. Shippens book " The Testosterone

Syndrome " and Dr. 's papers at this site www.allthingsmale.com. TRT: A

Recipe for Success and his HCG update.

And the new book out by Vergel called " Testosterone: A Man's Guide " .

Even E. Barry Gordon, MD

at http://www.thehiddendisease.com/

is cutting edge but I don't think he is yet up on high Estradiol.

Dr. Karlis Ullis is a top Dr. also so you see reading old dated studies is not

keep you up to date.

Even the new updated Endo- Soc. Guildelines is not very good.

http://www.endo-society.org/guidelines/final/upload/FINAL-Androgens-in-Men-Stand\

alone.pdf

Co-Moderator

Phil

> From: cvictorg <cvgrashow@...>

> Subject: Re: If you have primary why would you take hcg? Read

more from the MESO-Rx Steroid

>

> Date: Saturday, February 12, 2011, 6:15 PM

> Problem is all I can find on the web

> is anecdotal evidence - no hard studies

>

>

>

> >

> > Because it can help you in different ways and who

> knows? Nothing is set in stone. If my testes can get larger,

> for the first time in my whole life, ill take it. All I have

> is hope.

> >

> > If you have primary why would

> you take hcg? Read more from the MESO-Rx Steroid

> >

> > 

> > Question - Can HcG be used to treat hypergonadotropic

> hypogonadism (primary hypogonadism), and if so, how and at

> what dosage?

> >

> >  Answer - Primary hypogonadism or

> HYPERgonadotropic hypogonadism is testicular failure. So the

> answer in general is no.

> >

> >  If this is correct why then id hcg used??

> >

> >  Crisler says this

> >

> >  Any physician who administers TRT will, within

> the first few months of doing so, field complaints from

> their patients because they are now experiencing troubling

> testicular atrophy. Irrespective of the numerous and

> abundant benefits of TRT, men never enjoy seeing their

> genitals shrinking! Testicular atrophy occurs because the

> depressed LH level, secondary to the HPTA suppression TRT

> induces, no longer supports them. It is well known that

> HCG—a Luteinizing Hormone (LH) analog—will effectively,

> and dramatically, restore the testicles to previous form and

> function. It accomplishes this due to shared moiety between

> the alpha subunits of both hormones.

> >

> >  So, that satisfies an aesthetic consideration

> which should not be ignored. Now let's delve into the

> pharmacodynamics of the TRT medications. For those employing

> injectable

> >  testosterone cypionate, the cypionate ester

> provides a 5-8 day half-life, depending upon the specific

> metabolism, activity level, and overall health of the

> patient. It is now well-established that appropriate TRT

> using IM injections must be dosed at weekly intervals, in

> order to avoid seating the patient on a hormonal,

> >

> > [The entire original message is not included]

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Phil, thank you but I am not reading anyone about this specific thing.all I have

is hope. That's it. Maybe something will work or not. Right now reading stuff

about why things is harder for me on TRT makes me depressed. Its sas strangers

online seem to care more about me than my own family but I am blessed

nevertheless. If you ever come to ny, youe first lap dance is on me.

RE: If you have primary why would you take hcg? Read

more from the MESO-Rx Steroid

Here is a copy of a post to me from Dr. to help me get my Dr. to let me try

HCG. At the time Dr.'s told me I was Primary. Trying the HCG my labs doubled

after 15 shots of HCG telling me and my Dr. I am not Primary I am Secondary.

====================================================

He probably feels that since you suffer primary hypogonadism (I am guessing)

there is no use in adding HCG to your protocol. There are several reasons why

this is not so. First, you have not lost all Leydig cells, so any HCG you take

will stimulate those who still function to produce endogenous testosterone.

This will support testicular size. We should not ignore this aesthetic

consideration.

Next, if he reads my work, he will learn that HPTA-suppressed (as all TRT

patients are to some extent) also suffer decreased pregenenolone levels, which

is the first step after CHOL in all three hormonal pathways which begin with

CHOL. HCG increases pregnenolone production, and therefore restores a more

natural balance of our hormones.

Next, nearly all TRT patients who add in HCG to their regimens report an

increased sense of well-being and also libido. These are genuine quality of life

issues.

Finally, I just instinctively do not want all those LH receptors (including

those we have yet to discover and appreciate) unstimulated.

------------------------------

[The entire original message is not included]

[Guest guest]

Gee a Thanks but no thanks I get my love from my wife. A cup of Coffee would be

great. Please don't let this crap make you feel depressed you have enough on

your plate you don't need to do more to your self.

I got to bed every night thanking GOD for the day and Praying for the Next one.

Co-Moderator

Phil

> From: uu1845@... <uu1845@...>

> Subject: RE: If you have primary why would you take hcg? Read

more from the MESO-Rx Steroid

>

> Date: Sunday, February 13, 2011, 12:04 PM

> Phil, thank you but I am not reading

> anyone about this specific thing.all I have is hope. That's

> it. Maybe something will work or not. Right now reading

> stuff about why things is harder for me on TRT makes me

> depressed. Its sas strangers online seem to care more about

> me than my own family but I am blessed nevertheless. If you

> ever come to ny, youe first lap dance is on me.

>

> RE: If you have primary why would

> you take hcg? Read more from the MESO-Rx Steroid

>

>

> Here is a copy of a post to me from Dr. to help me get

> my Dr. to let me try HCG. At the time Dr.'s told me I was

> Primary. Trying the HCG my labs doubled after 15 shots of

> HCG telling me and my Dr. I am not Primary I am Secondary.

> ====================================================

> He probably feels that since you suffer primary

> hypogonadism (I am guessing) there is no use in adding HCG

> to your protocol. There are several reasons why this is not

> so. First, you have not lost all Leydig cells, so any HCG

> you take will stimulate those who still function to produce

> endogenous testosterone.

>

> This will support testicular size. We should not ignore

> this aesthetic consideration.

>

> Next, if he reads my work, he will learn that

> HPTA-suppressed (as all TRT patients are to some extent)

> also suffer decreased pregenenolone levels, which is the

> first step after CHOL in all three hormonal pathways which

> begin with CHOL. HCG increases pregnenolone production, and

> therefore restores a more natural balance of our hormones.

>

> Next, nearly all TRT patients who add in HCG to their

> regimens report an increased sense of well-being and also

> libido. These are genuine quality of life issues.

>

> Finally, I just instinctively do not want all those LH

> receptors (including those we have yet to discover and

> appreciate) unstimulated.

> ------------------------------

>

> [The entire original message is not included]

>

>