Guest guest Posted March 17, 2010 Report Share Posted March 17, 2010 You still might be better off with your PA Dr. Endo's are not good Dr.'s for this problem and I am betting they will not give you Arimidex or HCG. And yes LH will be low on TRT your brain sees the added T in your blood and slows down sending this LH and FSH message to your testis. Co-Moderator Phil > From: br7ok <brshop@...> > Subject: Brett's new labs! > > Date: Wednesday, March 17, 2010, 1:44 AM > Hello, > I finally got my lab results from the blood work last > Monday the 8th of March. > T total 876 > T free 190.6 > T BioAvalable 416.9 > Estradiol 59 > > I am going to see a ENDO tomorrow, I am going to ask > him to RX me some Arimidex. Also I want to find out about > getting on some hCG. > > They also did: > LH <0.2 > Not sure what the range should be on that. Anybody > know? I don't know what it was to start. I > figure the T Cyp shots have me pretty well shut down, don't > you think? > > Now you want a good laugh? > I asked my PA's office if I should were a skirt and > hi-heels when I go back to see him on Friday. The lab > report has me as " Female " ! > Before I noticed that I couldn't figure out what are these > reference ranges 2-24 for total T. What language are > we speaking here??? Now it makes since. > That would be some woman with total T at > 876. LOL > Thanks, > Brett > > > > ------------------------------------ > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 17, 2010 Report Share Posted March 17, 2010 Right you are Phil. We had a good conversation with Dr Wong the Endo but he said he wasn't comfortable prescribing anything that wasn't FDA approved for that use and I didn't push him to do it. He did understand the reason for testing the free and bio T and not just total T like my PA had started doing. We discussed some of the protocol that I had printed out from Dr Crisler's website and he was open minded about it. He even suggested I go to Michigan to see him. I left him with some of Dr Crisler's literature the " a recipe for success " and the other one about hCG. In the end he did seem like he was interested in what Dr Crisler had to say about it. He offered to send me to the Mayo clinic in ville FL. I just don't see as that would be going anywhere either. He also expressed his concern that with doing shots every 4 days my tests even being taken before the next shot were showing me at the elevated level left from the last shot instead of a lower level after it had worn off. Which leaves me wondering what do they think the point in what we are doing here anyway. Had I not already experienced the steady level of using the Androgel and knowing what a good steady delivery can do I am not so sure I would have liked this stuff, had I started with the T Cyp at 200mg every 2 weeks from the start. I don't think my wife totally understood this until I asked her what it was like when you used to have your monthly period with a woman's natural hormone changes. She proceeded to tell me what it was like. Then I asked her would what to endure that if you had a choice? That's when I think she began to really understood a little bit what it felt like. I am sure what I felt by the 8th day coming off that big 200mg dose was worse for me that what the typical woman goes through with her monthly period. Dr Wong said as expected that while I was all ready taking TRT it is difficult to tell whether I was primary or secondary. Phil how did you ever figure out you were secondary after you were already in treatment? I am going to order some Arimidex from ADC and do what you suggested before. Sometime later I would like to try some hCG but I am not so sure about that or where I can get it. The Dr Wong said I could buy it at a health food store. ??? After we figured he must have been talking about HGH. Anyway thanks again Phil Brett Re: Brett's new labs! You still might be better off with your PA Dr. Endo's are not good Dr.'s for this problem and I am betting they will not give you Arimidex or HCG. And yes LH will be low on TRT your brain sees the added T in your blood and slows down sending this LH and FSH message to your testis. Co-Moderator Phil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 18, 2010 Report Share Posted March 18, 2010 Brett go see Dr. Dach MD http://www.drdach.com/Natural_Medicine_101.html 954-983-1443 4700 Sheridan Suite T Hollywood Fl 33021 Dr. likes this Dr. Bio Identical Hormones and talks about him at his forum a lot. Even if you have to drive a long way to see him your better off. How I found out I am Secondary was with the help of Dr. on the forums. He posted back to me telling me to show his post to my Dr. to get him to let me try HCG. Here is a copy of it. ==================================================== He probably feels that since you suffer primary hypogonadism (I am guessing) there is no use in adding HCG to your protocol. There are several reasons why this is not so. First, you have not lost all Leydig cells, so any HCG you take will stimulate those who still function to produce endogenous testosterone. This will support testicular size. We should not ignore this aesthetic consideration. Next, if he reads my work, he will learn that HPTA-suppressed (as all TRT patients are to some extent) also suffer decreased pregenenolone levels, which is the first step after CHOL in all three hormonal pathways which begin with CHOL. HCG increases pregnenolone production, and therefore restores a more natural balance of our hormones. Next, nearly all TRT patients who add in HCG to their regimens report an increased sense of well-being and also libido. These are genuine quality of life issues. Finally, I just instinctively do not want all those LH receptors (including those we have yet to discover and appreciate) unstimulated. ==================================================== My Dr. put me on HCG doing 500IU's 3x's a week saying if I am true Primary my levels will not change. After the 15th shot we did labs at the time my labs top of range here in town was 1593 my levels were 600 on the HCG they came back at 1200. So I am not Primary my Testis do work. He ordered an MRI on my Pituitary and nothing showed up but I got sick after an auto accident where I hit my head into the roof of the car. He then took all my copys of labs going back 23 yrs and sent them to a Dr. he knows that is up on Pituitary problems. This Dr. sent my Dr. a report saying my labs were screaming I have a Pituitary Problem. Most Dr.'s look at labs very fast and even if your in the normal range but the low end for more then on test it's a flag going up that most if not all Dr.'s miss. So I ended up needing to treat my low Cortisol, Thyroid and due to the low Thyroid I needed to treat my low Ferritin and Iron levels. Due to my low Adrenals I needed to treat my low Aldosterone levels. And now after knowing I was low normal on Growth Hormone I am now on this. One needs to know if they are Secondary or Hypopituitary so there Dr. will look for things like this or send you to one that knows about it. And Endo's and Uro's don't know about it. I can't express how important it is to do the testing to find out why one is low on Testosterone before going on TRT after you go on it it is very hard to find the problem. I can't thank Dr. enough for his help and I never seen him or payed him any money. I feel he saved my Life. If you have not seen my story it's at this link and an update about my heart. http://forums.realthyroidhelp.com/viewtopic.php?f=5 & t=9239 Co-Moderator Phil > From: Brett Savage <brshop@...> > Subject: Re: Brett's new labs! > > Date: Thursday, March 18, 2010, 1:05 AM > Right you are Phil. > We had a good conversation with Dr Wong the > Endo but he said he wasn't > comfortable prescribing anything that wasn't FDA approved > for that use and I > didn't push him to do it. He did understand the > reason for testing the free > and bio T and not just total T like my PA had started > doing. We discussed > some of the protocol that I had printed out from Dr > Crisler's website > and he was open minded about it. He even suggested I > go to Michigan to see > him. I left him with some of Dr Crisler's literature > the " a recipe for > success " and the other one about hCG. In the end he > did seem like he was > interested in what Dr Crisler had to say about > it. He offered to send me > to the Mayo clinic in ville FL. I just don't > see as that would be > going anywhere either. > > He also expressed his concern that with doing > shots every 4 days my > tests even being taken before the next shot were showing me > at the elevated > level left from the last shot instead of a lower level > after it had worn > off. Which leaves me wondering what do they think the > point in what we are > doing here anyway. Had I not already experienced the > steady level of using > the Androgel and knowing what a good steady delivery can do > I am not so sure > I would have liked this stuff, had I started with the T Cyp > at 200mg every 2 > weeks from the start. I don't think my wife totally > understood this until I > asked her what it was like when you used to have your > monthly period with a > woman's natural hormone changes. She proceeded to > tell me what it was like. > Then I asked her would what to endure that if you had a > choice? That's when > I think she began to really understood a little bit what it > felt like. I am > sure what I felt by the 8th day coming off that big 200mg > dose was worse for > me that what the typical woman goes through with her > monthly period. > > Dr Wong said as expected that while I was all > ready taking TRT it is > difficult to tell whether I was primary or secondary. > Phil how did you ever > figure out you were secondary after you were already in > treatment? > > I am going to order some Arimidex from ADC > and do what you suggested > before. > Sometime later I would like to try some hCG > but I am not so sure about > that or where I can get it. The Dr Wong said I could > buy it at a health > food store. ??? After we figured he must > have been talking about HGH. > Anyway thanks again Phil > Brett > > Re: Brett's new labs! > > > You still might be better off with your PA Dr. Endo's are > not good Dr.'s for > this problem and I am betting they will not give you > Arimidex or HCG. > > And yes LH will be low on TRT your brain sees the added T > in your blood and > slows down sending this LH and FSH message to your testis. > Co-Moderator > Phil > > > > ------------------------------------ > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 18, 2010 Report Share Posted March 18, 2010 This Dr is close to me, so he will work with Dr Crisler? I wanted to see Dr Crisler but it would be cheaper to see this doc for me. Sent via BlackBerry from T-Mobile Re: Brett's new labs! > > Date: Thursday, March 18, 2010, 1:05 AM > Right you are Phil. > We had a good conversation with Dr Wong the > Endo but he said he wasn't > comfortable prescribing anything that wasn't FDA approved > for that use and I > didn't push him to do it. He did understand the > reason for testing the free > and bio T and not just total T like my PA had started > doing. We discussed > some of the protocol that I had printed out from Dr > Crisler's website > and he was open minded about it. He even suggested I > go to Michigan to see > him. I left him with some of Dr Crisler's literature > the " a recipe for > success " and the other one about hCG. In the end he > did seem like he was > interested in what Dr Crisler had to say about > it. He offered to send me > to the Mayo clinic in ville FL. I just don't > see as that would be > going anywhere either. > > He also expressed his concern that with doing > shots every 4 days my > tests even being taken before the next shot were showing me > at the elevated > level left from the last shot instead of a lower level > after it had worn > off. Which leaves me wondering what do they think the > point in what we are > doing here anyway. Had I not already experienced the > steady level of using > the Androgel and knowing what a good steady delivery can do > I am not so sure > I would have liked this stuff, had I started with the T Cyp > at 200mg every 2 > weeks from the start. I don't think my wife totally > understood this until I > asked her what it was like when you used to have your > monthly period with a > woman's natural hormone changes. She proceeded to > tell me what it was like. > Then I asked her would what to endure that if you had a > choice? That's when > I think she began to really understood a little bit what it > felt like. I am > sure what I felt by the 8th day coming off that big 200mg > dose was worse for > me that what the typical woman goes through with her > monthly period. > > Dr Wong said as expected that while I was all > ready taking TRT it is > difficult to tell whether I was primary or secondary. > Phil how did you ever > figure out you were secondary after you were already in > treatment? > > I am going to order some Arimidex from ADC > and do what you suggested > before. > Sometime later I would like to try some hCG > but I am not so sure about > that or where I can get it. The Dr Wong said I could > buy it at a health > food store. ??? After we figured he must > have been talking about HGH. > Anyway thanks again Phil > Brett > > Re: Brett's new labs! > > > You still might be better off with your PA Dr. Endo's are > not good Dr.'s for > this problem and I am betting they will not give you > Arimidex or HCG. > > And yes LH will be low on TRT your brain sees the added T > in your blood and > slows down sending this LH and FSH message to your testis. > Co-Moderator > Phil > > > > ------------------------------------ > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 18, 2010 Report Share Posted March 18, 2010 That is great news and your Dr. will get dam good at this working with Dr. . Co-Moderator Phil > > > From: Brett Savage <brshop@...> > > Subject: Re: Brett's new labs! > > > > Date: Thursday, March 18, 2010, 1:05 AM > > Right you are Phil. > > We had a good conversation with Dr Wong the > > Endo but he said he wasn't > > comfortable prescribing anything that wasn't FDA > approved > > for that use and I > > didn't push him to do it. He did understand the > > reason for testing the free > > and bio T and not just total T like my PA had started > > doing. We discussed > > some of the protocol that I had printed out from Dr > > > Crisler's website > > and he was open minded about it. He even suggested > I > > go to Michigan to see > > him. I left him with some of Dr Crisler's > literature > > the " a recipe for > > success " and the other one about hCG. In the end he > > did seem like he was > > interested in what Dr Crisler had to say about > > it. He offered to send me > > to the Mayo clinic in ville FL. I just don't > > see as that would be > > going anywhere either. > > > > He also expressed his concern that with doing > > shots every 4 days my > > tests even being taken before the next shot were > showing me > > at the elevated > > level left from the last shot instead of a lower > level > > after it had worn > > off. Which leaves me wondering what do they think > the > > point in what we are > > doing here anyway. Had I not already experienced > the > > steady level of using > > the Androgel and knowing what a good steady delivery > can do > > I am not so sure > > I would have liked this stuff, had I started with the > T Cyp > > at 200mg every 2 > > weeks from the start. I don't think my wife totally > > understood this until I > > asked her what it was like when you used to have your > > monthly period with a > > woman's natural hormone changes. She proceeded to > > tell me what it was like. > > Then I asked her would what to endure that if you had > a > > choice? That's when > > I think she began to really understood a little bit > what it > > felt like. I am > > sure what I felt by the 8th day coming off that big > 200mg > > dose was worse for > > me that what the typical woman goes through with her > > monthly period. > > > > Dr Wong said as expected that while I was all > > ready taking TRT it is > > difficult to tell whether I was primary or > secondary. > > Phil how did you ever > > figure out you were secondary after you were already > in > > treatment? > > > > I am going to order some Arimidex from ADC > > and do what you suggested > > before. > > Sometime later I would like to try some hCG > > but I am not so sure about > > that or where I can get it. The Dr Wong said I > could > > buy it at a health > > food store. ??? After we figured he must > > have been talking about HGH. > > Anyway thanks again Phil > > Brett > > > > Re: Brett's new labs! > > > > > > You still might be better off with your PA Dr. Endo's > are > > not good Dr.'s for > > this problem and I am betting they will not give you > > Arimidex or HCG. > > > > And yes LH will be low on TRT your brain sees the > added T > > in your blood and > > slows down sending this LH and FSH message to your > testis. > > Co-Moderator > > Phil > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------ > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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