Re: Re: Testosterone and E2 are good for the Heart.

[Guest guest]

I also posted this at Dr. 's forum there are a lot of Dr.'s there with low

T.

http://www.musclechatroom.com/forum/showthread.php?t=16035

Co-Moderator

Phil

> From: marc200134470 <cfs38@...>

> Subject: Re: Testosterone and E2 are good for the Heart.

>

> Date: Saturday, January 1, 2011, 2:11 PM

> Kind of interesting I guess, but if

> you feel like garbage and can't perform as a man what is the

> purpose of a longer life especially if you have these

> problems fairly young? I guess if the lifestyle of a eunich

> suits a man it might be a good idea to simply go all the way

> and have a sex change operation.

>

> This new doc I am seeing mentioned all about the different

> estrogens, and how SOME are protective in men while others

> are bad.

>

> I may print this off and take it with me next time that I

> see him.

> For the time being, I am still going to lower my E2, but

> try to not make it too low.

>

> Medical studies are an ever changing thing. People jump on

> the bandwagon and after a few years often find out another

> study has 'proven' what they are doing is killing them.

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

> ------------------------------------

>

>

[Guest guest]

Here is more to think about when it comes to too much Estraidol. This was just

posted at Dr. 's and I feel it's all about balance keeps good levels for

both men and women.

====================================================

#15 20 Hours Ago

Technophile

Member Join Date: Dec 11, 2010

Posts: 64

Re: Testosterone and E2 are good for the Heart.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Are we now to ignore this: http://www.lef.org/magazine/mag2008/...ng-Male_01.htm

Estradiol Higher in Male Heart Attack Victims

A study published just last year compared blood levels of testosterone and

estradiol in men suffering acute myocardial infarction (heart attack) with those

who had previously suffered a heart attack.

Sex hormones were measured in patients presenting with acute heart attack,

patients with old heart attack, and patients with normal coronary arteries. The

results showed significantly higher levels of estradiol in both groups of heart

attack patients compared with those without coronary disease.4 As would be

expected from numerous prior studies, heart attack victims also had decreased

testosterone levels.

The reason many men suffer from excess estradiol and deficient testosterone is

that their aging bodies produce less testosterone while more of their beneficial

testosterone is converted (aromatized) into estradiol. The pathological result

is an altering of the ratio of testosterone to estrogen, creating estrogen

dominance.5 This imbalance of estrogen overload and testosterone insufficiency

is an often overlooked cause of cardiovascular disease.

Fortunately, there are safe methods to block the aromatase enzyme in order to

lower excess estrogen while boosting free testosterone levels.

High Estrogen in Men With Coronary Atherosclerosis

An invasive diagnostic procedure known as a coronary angiogram can measure the

degree of atherosclerosis present in the arteries feeding the heart muscle.

Researchers used angiogram-confirmed cases of coronary atherosclerosis to

ascertain the effects of sex hormones and other metabolic factors in a group of

men aged 40-60 years.

Compared with healthy age-matched controls, men with coronary atherosclerosis

had low testosterone, higher levels of estrone (another potent estrogen), and a

low level of testosterone in the presence of a high level of estradiol.6 These

findings led the researchers to conclude their study by stating, “low levels

of total testosterone, testosterone/estradiol ratio and free androgen index and

higher levels of estrone in men with coronary artery disease appear together

with many features of metabolic syndrome and may be involved in the pathogenesis

of coronary atherosclerosis.â€

In a study conducted a year later by another research group, angiograms were

used to measure the extent of coronary atherosclerosis in a group of men with

stable coronary artery disease. The finding showed significant positive

correlations between estradiol levels and other known atherosclerotic risk

factors.7 The scientists concluded their study by stating, “our results

indicate a possible role of estradiol in promoting the development of

atherogenic lipid milieu in men with coronary artery disease.â€

These two recent studies validate other reports showing that excess estrogen

promotes atherosclerosis in men.

Could it be that the bodies of men with coronary artery disease produce more

estradiol as a defensive/healing measure? In other words, can high estradiol be

merely an indicator of looming cardiovascular disease, rather than a cause?

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Last edited by Technophile; 20 Hours Ago at 05:36 PM.

Co-Moderator

Phil

> From: marc200134470 <cfs38@...>

> Subject: Re: Testosterone and E2 are good for the Heart.

>

> Date: Sunday, January 2, 2011, 11:52 AM

> Seems you have started an interesting

> discussion over there.

>

> To me I think it might simply be a matter of level,......as

> in 'moderation' with everything.

> Maybe 20 to 30 is just right, maybe even 25 to 30, but I

> question having levels in the fifties or higher.

>

> Heck, at that level we are basically becoming a woman in

> terms of hormone levels.

> Myself, I am going to try and shoot for the 25 to 30 range

> if possible. Obviously I have a ways to drop from the level

> of 52.

>

> Will start to see tomorrow I guess, as I am supposed to

> take the Arimidex Monday, and Thursday.

>

> I have 'spotty' night/morning wood that doesn't last all

> that long, and really isn't rock hard per se. Every once in

> awhile I will not notice ANY, and on occasion I will get an

> erection that makes me feel like my penis is going to

> explode and even turns it almost purple in color.

>

> If in the next couple of weeks this pattern starts to

> change dramatically I will know what is causing it since I

> have been this way for quite some time now.

>

>

>

>

>

> ------------------------------------

>

>

[Guest guest]

I also concur that E2 levels of 10 are not healthy for a man.  I took the

sensitive E2 test a few months ago and got an 8 pg/ml.  This might explain why

I have had erection problems the last couple of years and I am only 25.

 

Why was it so low?  Well I did take steroids for only two weeks..that could be

why...  I am taking DHEA to combat this and l-arginine to help with erections

and thus far I have seen positive results although not 100 percent better. 

Hopefully I will be able test again soon for E2 to see if there has been an

increase.

From: marc200134470 <cfs38@...>

Subject: Re: Testosterone and E2 are good for the Heart.

Date: Sunday, January 2, 2011, 12:15 PM

 

I certainly am not a doc, nor do I know nearly as much as many of you here, but

I think what you said makes sense, and I concur.

Most likely an E2 level of 10 would be bad for a man, but also a level of 50 or

higher.

Wonder if anyone has ever tested the E2 levels of normal, healthy younger males,

as in late twenties/early thirties?

IF they happen to run in that 20 to 30 range, I would say that is where we need

to be overall. Of course there are always exceptions, but I am talking about a

random sampling of 'healthy' males that are not taking ANY kind of hormones.

[Guest guest]

most men that did a round of steroids had some kind of problem with

Estraidol but they were higher levels you need to check your SHBG and if your

Total T levels are low and your not on TRT try doing some HCG this will bring up

your Estradiol levels.

Co-Moderator

Phil

>

>

> From: marc200134470 <cfs38@...>

> Subject: Re: Testosterone and E2 are good

> for the Heart.

>

> Date: Sunday, January 2, 2011, 12:15 PM

>

>

>  

>

>

>

> I certainly am not a doc, nor do I know nearly as much as

> many of you here, but I think what you said makes sense, and

> I concur.

>

> Most likely an E2 level of 10 would be bad for a man, but

> also a level of 50 or higher.

>

> Wonder if anyone has ever tested the E2 levels of normal,

> healthy younger males, as in late twenties/early thirties?

>

> IF they happen to run in that 20 to 30 range, I would say

> that is where we need to be overall. Of course there are

> always exceptions, but I am talking about a random sampling

> of 'healthy' males that are not taking ANY kind of

> hormones.

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>      

>

>

[Guest guest]

Here is what Life has said for yrs. after testing a lot of men. To high is bad

for your heart and prostate and to low is not good.

http://www.lef.org/magazine/mag2008/nov2008_Dangers-of-Excess-Estrogen-in-the-Ag\

ing-Male_01.htm

==================================================

Most Life Extension members know that too little cholesterol (below 150 mg/dL)

can be more dangerous than too much cholesterol (levels over 200 mg/dL). The

same may hold true for estrogen. We have recommended that ideal ranges for

estradiol for most aging men are between 20 and 30 pg/mL of blood. Below 18

pg/mL increases osteoporosis risk, while levels greater than 30 pg/mL increase

heart attack and stroke incidence.

Co-Moderator

Phil

> From: marc200134470 <cfs38@...>

> Subject: Re: Testosterone and E2 are good for the Heart.

>

> Date: Sunday, January 2, 2011, 2:15 PM

> I certainly am not a doc, nor do I

> know nearly as much as many of you here, but I think what

> you said makes sense, and I concur.

>

> Most likely an E2 level of 10 would be bad for a man, but

> also a level of 50 or higher.

>

> Wonder if anyone has ever tested the E2 levels of normal,

> healthy younger males, as in late twenties/early thirties?

>

> IF they happen to run in that 20 to 30 range, I would say

> that is where we need to be overall. Of course there are

> always exceptions, but I am talking about a random sampling

> of 'healthy' males that are not taking ANY kind of

> hormones.

>

>

>

> ------------------------------------

>

>

[Guest guest]

I have at least 69 pg/ml now... :-( I am afraid I can die from a heart attack...

I sent Hertoghe an email today, but he has not replied. I guess he doesn't think

it's dangerous for me to have such a HIGH level of E2 as I have now...

So the only solution is to take Arimidex, right? Are the any side-effects taking

it?

> From: marc200134470 <cfs38@...>

> Subject: Re: Testosterone and E2 are good for the Heart.

>

> Date: Sunday, January 2, 2011, 2:15 PM

> I certainly am not a doc, nor do I

> know nearly as much as many of you here, but I think what

> you said makes sense, and I concur.

>

> Most likely an E2 level of 10 would be bad for a man, but

> also a level of 50 or higher.

>

> Wonder if anyone has ever tested the E2 levels of normal,

> healthy younger males, as in late twenties/early thirties?

>

> IF they happen to run in that 20 to 30 range, I would say

> that is where we need to be overall. Of course there are

> always exceptions, but I am talking about a random sampling

> of 'healthy' males that are not taking ANY kind of

> hormones.

>

>

>

> ------------------------------------

>

>

[Guest guest]

Your not going to have a heart attack I was very high over 90 for about 10 yrs

before I figured out it was Estraidol. The only side effect I know of taking

Arimidex is your can drive your Estraidol levels to low doing this and keeping

them to low can cause bone loss.

===================================================

How To Take Arimdex and not go down on your Estradiol to Low.

What I found is if you go to low taking arimidex, it's the length of time your

to low, if your too low say for 8 weeks it can take your body a longer time to

make more Estradiol. Bottom line is to know how not to go to low. Keep a log on

your dose and how you feel men going to low can't get it up taking Viagra. I

went to low when I first tried Arimidex and did not know about going to low or

how one feels to low, so I was low a good 8 weeks. I did not know I was low

until my next labs.

The best gage I have found to control your Estradiol levels is to gage your

night time and morning wood. At good levels or what I call the sweet spot you

get your night time and morning wood back so strong it will wake you up and you

can hang a coat on it.

Most men do good taking .25 mgs or 1/4 of a 1mg. pill, I use a pill cutter to

cut the small pill in half then I stand it on the cut end and use a single edge

razor to cut this in half. A good way to take arimidex is by how high your

levels are. I tested over 90 pg/ml so we tried doing .5 mgs every other day

after 8 weeks my next set of labs showed it did not move below 90, test said

>90. So we did .5 mgs. every day in about 2 weeks I got some strong night time

and morning wood back after not having them for many yrs.

I kept doing this dose and in 8 weeks my next set of labs said <20 back in the

day labs were like this they did not have to good labs we have today they could

not read lower the 20. My Dr. told me this looks to low to stop taking the

Arimidex. The one thing I noticed was my wood stopped and stopping the Arimidex

my wood came back in about 7 weeks my next test at 8 weeks was 24 pg/ml. So we

went back on the Arimidex but the Dr. told me to take .5 mgs every 3 days I was

on this dose not a week and lost wood. This is when I figured out going to low

you lose wood. And the longer your too low the longer it takes to get levels

back up.

I stopped the arimidex right away and got my wood back in 4 days. I then after

playing with the dose for a time found the best dose is .25mgs every 2 to 3

days.

So lets say your labs are less the 50 pg/ml if your take .5 mgs you can go down

so dam fast your miss the sweet spot of your wood and go to low. It's best with

lower levels 50 and under to do less Arimidex .25mgs every 2 days if later your

lose wood when it comes back go to every 3 days.

I have found estradiol is the hardest hormone to control, it goes up or down

from month to month some times I need .25mgs every 2 days other times I need

..25mgs everyday most of the time I do well on every 3 days.

So between wood and labs I do great and so do most of the men I have told this

to. I keep a log on how much I am taking and how I feel. Doing this and reading

back in my log I was able to tell when I was going to high or to low my Dr. lets

me dose my arimidex by how I feel.

Over the yrs. I have posted this story until I am blue in the face.

Co-Moderator

Phil

>

>

>

> > From: marc200134470 <cfs38@...>

>

> > Subject: Re: Testosterone and E2 are

> good for the Heart.

>

> >

>

> > Date: Sunday, January 2, 2011, 2:15 PM

>

> > I certainly am not a doc, nor do I

>

> > know nearly as much as many of you here, but I think

> what

>

> > you said makes sense, and I concur.

>

> >

>

> > Most likely an E2 level of 10 would be bad for a man,

> but

>

> > also a level of 50 or higher.

>

> >

>

> > Wonder if anyone has ever tested the E2 levels of

> normal,

>

> > healthy younger males, as in late twenties/early

> thirties?

>

> >

>

> > IF they happen to run in that 20 to 30 range, I would

> say

>

> > that is where we need to be overall. Of course there

> are

>

> > always exceptions, but I am talking about a random

> sampling

>

> > of 'healthy' males that are not taking ANY kind of

>

> > hormones.

>

> >

>

> >

>

> >

>

> > ------------------------------------

>

> >

>

> >