Re: Incredible weakness/sleepiness

[Guest guest]

That sounds to me like Fatigue and this is what most men with low testosterone

suffer from. Do what your Dr. tells you.

Co-Moderator

Phil

> From: <gibcast@...>

> Subject: Incredible weakness/sleepiness

> " NTHA-Chat " <NTHA-Chat >,

" " < >

> Date: Wednesday, September 8, 2010, 6:02 AM

> FT3 is not very low but not very high

> either.

>

> I have in the past days felt VERY weak and sleepy All the

> time. Hettoghe tils

> Me to increase Thyroid to 120 mg from 105 mg today. He also

> told me to start testo gel again asap.

>

> Can low testo give this heavy sleepiness and Tiredness and

> weakness? Cause pulse is 75-80

> And temp is 98.4 to 98.6 F now so I fint seem very hypo by

> those.

>

> T.

>

> Sendt fra min iPhone

>

>

>      

>

>

> ------------------------------------

>

>

[Guest guest]

Well he told me to start the gel again last week, I didnt, cause I wanted to run

a full hormone panel first, which I ill try to do tomorrow. So I'll draw blood

tomorrow and apply the gel after that's done. Then I'll check out the reaults

the following week.

T.

Sendt fra min iPhone

Den 8. sep. 2010 kl. 17.34 skrev philip georgian <pmgamer18@...>:

That sounds to me like Fatigue and this is what most men with low testosterone

suffer from. Do what your Dr. tells you.

Co-Moderator

Phil

> From: <gibcast@...>

> Subject: Incredible weakness/sleepiness

> " NTHA-Chat " <NTHA-Chat >,

" " < >

> Date: Wednesday, September 8, 2010, 6:02 AM

> FT3 is not very low but not very high

> either.

>

> I have in the past days felt VERY weak and sleepy All the

> time. Hettoghe tils

> Me to increase Thyroid to 120 mg from 105 mg today. He also

> told me to start testo gel again asap.

>

> Can low testo give this heavy sleepiness and Tiredness and

> weakness? Cause pulse is 75-80

> And temp is 98.4 to 98.6 F now so I fint seem very hypo by

> those.

>

> T.

>

> Sendt fra min iPhone

>

>

>

>

>

> ------------------------------------

>

>

[Guest guest]

I also wonder, about my lower temps, which are 0.2 to 0.4 F lower than normal,

why this happened exactly after I upped my DHEA to 35 mg every day instead of

every other day. Could be a coincidence - BUT I doubt low testosterone gives me

lower temperatures! Or can it? I increased to 2 grains today, which is the same

dose as I was taking 2 months ago. I will start Testosterone gel tomorrow. I

also need to start Vitamin A and Iron. But is it smart to start all 4/do 4

changes at one time? I've already upped ERFA Thyroid AND plan to start

Testosterone gel tomorrow. Is it safe to start Iron again, as well as the

Vitamin A again tomorrow???

Doesn't large Vitamin A doses make the liver struggle? I already have high liver

enzymes. Hertoghe recommended " Liver Detox " - A product sold thru Nutri Pharma

in Europe. I already ordered, based on Lethal Lee's suggestion, Life Extension's

Silymarin from iHerb.com!

Can't hurt to try it can it?

I feel a but nautious and dry in my mouth... Could that be the liver bugging me?

> From: <gibcast@...>

> Subject: Incredible weakness/sleepiness

> " NTHA-Chat " <NTHA-Chat >,

" " < >

> Date: Wednesday, September 8, 2010, 6:02 AM

> FT3 is not very low but not very high

> either.

>

> I have in the past days felt VERY weak and sleepy All the

> time. Hettoghe tils

> Me to increase Thyroid to 120 mg from 105 mg today. He also

> told me to start testo gel again asap.

>

> Can low testo give this heavy sleepiness and Tiredness and

> weakness? Cause pulse is 75-80

> And temp is 98.4 to 98.6 F now so I fint seem very hypo by

> those.

>

> T.

>

> Sendt fra min iPhone

>

>

>      

>

>

> ------------------------------------

>

>

[Guest guest]

Good Idea this way you will know how your levels look off TRT.

Co-Moderator

Phil

>

> > From: <gibcast@...>

> > Subject: Incredible

> weakness/sleepiness

> > " NTHA-Chat "

> <NTHA-Chat >,

> " "

> < >

> > Date: Wednesday, September 8, 2010, 6:02 AM

> > FT3 is not very low but not very high

> > either.

> >

> > I have in the past days felt VERY weak and sleepy All

> the

> > time. Hettoghe tils

> > Me to increase Thyroid to 120 mg from 105 mg today. He

> also

> > told me to start testo gel again asap.

> >

> > Can low testo give this heavy sleepiness and Tiredness

> and

> > weakness? Cause pulse is 75-80

> > And temp is 98.4 to 98.6 F now so I fint seem very

> hypo by

> > those.

> >

> > T.

> >

> > Sendt fra min iPhone

> >

> >

> >       

> >

> >

> > ------------------------------------

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Unless I will die acutely because I am SO low on Testosterone that I won't make

it til Friday! I must wait 2 days - Til Friday, to do the blood draw!

Anyway..... Then I have been 1 month without TRT! SO...... It'll be interesting

to see what the result is! Guess low range, and in worse case, below it. It was

in the 5% low range when I came to Hertoghe. The Total Testosterone.

Phil, if Total is low range, and Index is high (98%) - What should one follow?

Why did GP's always tell me Index is ALL that matters? Index is the the relation

between Total Testo and SHBG. The added up number!

>

> > From: <gibcast@...>

> > Subject: Incredible

> weakness/sleepiness

> > " NTHA-Chat "

> <NTHA-Chat >,

> " "

> < >

> > Date: Wednesday, September 8, 2010, 6:02 AM

> > FT3 is not very low but not very high

> > either.

> >

> > I have in the past days felt VERY weak and sleepy All

> the

> > time. Hettoghe tils

> > Me to increase Thyroid to 120 mg from 105 mg today. He

> also

> > told me to start testo gel again asap.

> >

> > Can low testo give this heavy sleepiness and Tiredness

> and

> > weakness? Cause pulse is 75-80

> > And temp is 98.4 to 98.6 F now so I fint seem very

> hypo by

> > those.

> >

> > T.

> >

> > Sendt fra min iPhone

> >

> >

> >       

> >

> >

> > ------------------------------------

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

When you say index here it's free free is only 1 to 2% of all the T in your body

so if your total is low index can be high and mean nothing 2% of a low number is

nothing.

You will not Die.

Co-Moderator

Phil

>

> >

>

> > > From: <gibcast@...>

>

> > > Subject: Incredible

>

> > weakness/sleepiness

>

> > > " NTHA-Chat "

>

> > <NTHA-Chat >,

>

> > " "

>

> > < >

>

> > > Date: Wednesday, September 8, 2010, 6:02 AM

>

> > > FT3 is not very low but not very high

>

> > > either.

>

> > >

>

> > > I have in the past days felt VERY weak and sleepy

> All

>

> > the

>

> > > time. Hettoghe tils

>

> > > Me to increase Thyroid to 120 mg from 105 mg

> today. He

>

> > also

>

> > > told me to start testo gel again asap.

>

> > >

>

> > > Can low testo give this heavy sleepiness and

> Tiredness

>

> > and

>

> > > weakness? Cause pulse is 75-80

>

> > > And temp is 98.4 to 98.6 F now so I fint seem

> very

>

> > hypo by

>

> > > those.

>

> > >

>

> > > T.

>

> > >

>

> > > Sendt fra min iPhone

>

> > >

>

> > >

>

> > >       

>

> > >

>

> > >

>

> > > ------------------------------------

>

> > >

>

> > >

[Guest guest]

No it's not Free! Free Testosterone is Free Testosterone! INDEX is Total

Testosterone divided by 10 times the DHBG! Or am I way off here? We need to sort

this out......

Example of a test I did in Norway:

4 August 2009, I drew blood at the GP's which was analyzed at www.Furst.no

(Norwegian site) - It's a good hormone lab in Norway. I got these results:

S-Testosterone 15 (8 - 35 nmol/l)S-SHBG 16 (8 - 60 nmol/l)

Testosterone Index 9.2 (2.3 - 9.9) ----- MINE WAS ALWAYS IN THE TOP RANGE!!!!!!!

Text from website:

" Fri testosteron index (FTI) = 10 x Testosterone/SHBG Reference area: Women 0,1

– 0,6 Reference area: Men 2,3 – 9,9 "

>

> >

>

> > > From: <gibcast@...>

>

> > > Subject: Incredible

>

> > weakness/sleepiness

>

> > > " NTHA-Chat "

>

> > <NTHA-Chat >,

>

> > " "

>

> > < >

>

> > > Date: Wednesday, September 8, 2010, 6:02 AM

>

> > > FT3 is not very low but not very high

>

> > > either.

>

> > >

>

> > > I have in the past days felt VERY weak and sleepy

> All

>

> > the

>

> > > time. Hettoghe tils

>

> > > Me to increase Thyroid to 120 mg from 105 mg

> today. He

>

> > also

>

> > > told me to start testo gel again asap.

>

> > >

>

> > > Can low testo give this heavy sleepiness and

> Tiredness

>

> > and

>

> > > weakness? Cause pulse is 75-80

>

> > > And temp is 98.4 to 98.6 F now so I fint seem

> very

>

> > hypo by

>

> > > those.

>

> > >

>

> > > T.

>

> > >

>

> > > Sendt fra min iPhone

>

> > >

>

> > >

>

> > >       

>

> > >

>

> > >

>

> > > ------------------------------------

>

> > >

>

> > >

[Guest guest]

My thinking is the low range on the Index T looks like Free.

http://www.medical.siemens.com/siemens/en_GLOBAL/gg_diag_FBAs/files/news_views/s\

pring00/techreports/zb158-a.pdf

Co-Moderator

Phil

>

> >

>

> > >

>

> >

>

> > > > From: <gibcast@...>

>

> >

>

> > > > Subject: Incredible

>

> >

>

> > > weakness/sleepiness

>

> >

>

> > > > " NTHA-Chat "

>

> >

>

> > > <NTHA-Chat >,

>

> >

>

> > > " "

>

> >

>

> > > < >

>

> >

>

> > > > Date: Wednesday, September 8, 2010, 6:02 AM

>

> >

>

> > > > FT3 is not very low but not very high

>

> >

>

> > > > either.

>

> >

>

> > > >

>

> >

>

> > > > I have in the past days felt VERY weak and

> sleepy

>

> > All

>

> >

>

> > > the

>

> >

>

> > > > time. Hettoghe tils

>

> >

>

> > > > Me to increase Thyroid to 120 mg from 105

> mg

>

> > today. He

>

> >

>

> > > also

>

> >

>

> > > > told me to start testo gel again asap.

>

> >

>

> > > >

>

> >

>

> > > > Can low testo give this heavy sleepiness

> and

>

> > Tiredness

>

> >

>

> > > and

>

> >

>

> > > > weakness? Cause pulse is 75-80

>

> >

>

> > > > And temp is 98.4 to 98.6 F now so I fint

> seem

>

> > very

>

> >

>

> > > hypo by

>

> >

>

> > > > those.

>

> >

>

> > > >

>

> >

>

> > > > T.

>

> >

>

> > > >

>

> >

>

> > > > Sendt fra min iPhone

>

> >

>

> > > >

>

> >

>

> > > >

>

> >

>

> > > >       

>

> >

>

> > > >

>

> >

>

> > > >

>

> >

>

> > > > ------------------------------------

>

> >

>

> > > >

>

> >

>

> > > >

[Guest guest]

I shouldn't Even Pretend I know more than you Phil. I am a total newbie with

Testosterone. They do call it FREE testo index, so....

Ok so mine was always top range and GPs loved that result.

But it's S-Testo that counts most?

Sendt fra min iPhone

Den 8. sep. 2010 kl. 23.06 skrev philip georgian <pmgamer18@...>:

My thinking is the low range on the Index T looks like Free.

http://www.medical.siemens.com/siemens/en_GLOBAL/gg_diag_FBAs/files/news_views/s\

pring00/techreports/zb158-a.pdf

Co-Moderator

Phil

>

> >

>

> > >

>

> >

>

> > > > From: <gibcast@...>

>

> >

>

> > > > Subject: Incredible

>

> >

>

> > > weakness/sleepiness

>

> >

>

> > > > " NTHA-Chat "

>

> >

>

> > > <NTHA-Chat >,

>

> >

>

> > > " "

>

> >

>

> > > < >

>

> >

>

> > > > Date: Wednesday, September 8, 2010, 6:02 AM

>

> >

>

> > > > FT3 is not very low but not very high

>

> >

>

> > > > either.

>

> >

>

> > > >

>

> >

>

> > > > I have in the past days felt VERY weak and

> sleepy

>

> > All

>

> >

>

> > > the

>

> >

>

> > > > time. Hettoghe tils

>

> >

>

> > > > Me to increase Thyroid to 120 mg from 105

> mg

>

> > today. He

>

> >

>

> > > also

>

> >

>

> > > > told me to start testo gel again asap.

>

> >

>

> > > >

>

> >

>

> > > > Can low testo give this heavy sleepiness

> and

>

> > Tiredness

>

> >

>

> > > and

>

> >

>

> > > > weakness? Cause pulse is 75-80

>

> >

>

> > > > And temp is 98.4 to 98.6 F now so I fint

> seem

>

> > very

>

> >

>

> > > hypo by

>

> >

>

> > > > those.

>

> >

>

> > > >

>

> >

>

> > > > T.

>

> >

>

> > > >

>

> >

>

> > > > Sendt fra min iPhone

>

> >

>

> > > >

>

> >

>

> > > >

>

> >

>

> > > >

>

> >

>

> > > >

>

> >

>

> > > >

>

> >

>

> > > > ------------------------------------

>

> >

>

> > > >

>

> >

>

> > > >

[Guest guest]

Your doing fine with this your just not feeling good and when this happens it's

hard to do anything.

Both Total or S Testosterone and Index or Free are very important. Older men

had good levels of Total T but there Free T is low this is what works in the

body the rest is bound up Bio Testosterone is not working but used when needed.

So to feel good you need good levels of Total with Free and to do this keep

Estradiol levels down.

Co-Moderator

Phil

> >

> > >

> >

> > > >

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > > From: <gibcast@...>

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > > Subject: Incredible

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > weakness/sleepiness

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > > " NTHA-Chat "

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > <NTHA-Chat >,

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > " "

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > < >

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > > Date: Wednesday, September 8, 2010,

> 6:02 AM

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > > FT3 is not very low but not very high

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > > either.

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > >

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > > I have in the past days felt VERY weak

> and

> > sleepy

> >

> > > All

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > the

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > > time. Hettoghe tils

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > > Me to increase Thyroid to 120 mg from

> 105

> > mg

> >

> > > today. He

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > also

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > > told me to start testo gel again asap.

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > >

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > > Can low testo give this heavy

> sleepiness

> > and

> >

> > > Tiredness

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > and

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > > weakness? Cause pulse is 75-80

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > > And temp is 98.4 to 98.6 F now so I

> fint

> > seem

> >

> > > very

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > hypo by

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > > those.

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > >

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > > T.

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > >

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > > Sendt fra min iPhone

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > >

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > >

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > >       

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > >

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > >

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > > ------------------------------------

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > >

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > >

[Guest guest]

Thanks for the support, Phil!

Speaking of these things, let's look at the latest hormone bloodwork I've done,

again:

***28/7/2010*** (Medicament fasting blood sample, however not food fasting)

Estradiol-17-Beta 0.16 (<0.18 nmol/l) Note: Too high? Should be lower

today though!

S-Testosterone 15 (8 - 35 nmol/l) Note: I did not apply Testosterone gel

in the evenings before this blood test, only in the mornings, except the

morning of the blood draw!

S-SHBG 12 (8 - 60 nmol/l)

Free Testosterone Index 12.5 (2.3 - 9.9) Note: FTI = testosteron (nmol/l)

x 10/SHBG (nmol/l)

DHEA-Sulfate 4.3 (1.6 - 12.0 umol/l)

S-DHEA 6.3 (5.3 - 31.7 nmol/l)

S-Trijodtyronin 2.0 (1.2 - 2.7 nmol/l)

Reverse T3: 0.30 (0.14 - 0.54)

S-Aldosteron 138 (70 - 800 pmol/l) Note: I did not salt-fast for this sample!

S-17-OH-Progesteron 0.7 (1.8 - 10.4 nmol/l)

S-IGF1 63.1 (11.0 - 40.0 nmol/l)

S-IGHBP3 122 (49 - 176 nmol/l)

25-OH-vit D3 155 (50 - 150 nmol/l)

S-Vitamin A (retinol) 2.5 (>0.7 umol/l)

S-Vitamin E 54 (14 - 50 umol/l)

S-Vitamin K (K1, fyllokinon) 0.7 (0.1 - 2.2 ng/ml)

***26/7/2010*** (Samples below done 100% fasting, except intake of 10 mg

HC with 500 ml plain water first.)

S-Potassium 4.1 (3.6 - 4.6)

S-Sodium 141 (137 - 145)

S-Magnesium 0.96 (0,71 - 0,94 mmol/L)

S-Cortisol 738 (138 - 635 nmol/L)

S-Chloride 103 (100 - 110 mmol/L)

S-Calcium 2.40 (2.15 - 2.51 mmol/L)

S-Phosphorus 0.92 (0.75 - 1.65 mmol/L)

***2/9/2010*** (Samples below while NOT taking Iron or Testosterone gel

for the last 3 weeks.)

Hematocrit 53 (40 - 50)

Hemoglobin 17.2 (13.4 - 17.0 g/dL NORIP)

RBC 5.95 (4,2 - 5,7 x 1012 /L NORIP)

------------------------------------------------------

How is it possible to have an above range " Index " ? It was always top range,

like 9.6 or whatever. Now it was 12.5!!!

> >

> > >

> >

> > > >

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > > From: <gibcast@...>

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > > Subject: Incredible

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > weakness/sleepiness

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > > " NTHA-Chat "

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > <NTHA-Chat >,

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > " "

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > < >

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > > Date: Wednesday, September 8, 2010,

> 6:02 AM

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > > FT3 is not very low but not very high

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > > either.

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > >

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > > I have in the past days felt VERY weak

> and

> > sleepy

> >

> > > All

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > the

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > > time. Hettoghe tils

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > > Me to increase Thyroid to 120 mg from

> 105

> > mg

> >

> > > today. He

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > also

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > > told me to start testo gel again asap.

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > >

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > > Can low testo give this heavy

> sleepiness

> > and

> >

> > > Tiredness

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > and

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > > weakness? Cause pulse is 75-80

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > > And temp is 98.4 to 98.6 F now so I

> fint

> > seem

> >

> > > very

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > hypo by

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > > those.

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > >

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > > T.

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > >

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > > Sendt fra min iPhone

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > >

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > >

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > >       

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > >

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > >

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > > ------------------------------------

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > >

> >

> > >

> >

> > > > >

[Guest guest]

Your free is high but your Total is low how is this possable it means your Free

T or Index is not bound out now if you had higher levels of Total or S T you

would be fine. Your Free is only a % or your Total so if your Total is low and

your Free is higer it means the amount of Total is not all bound up. Not all

the Testosterone in your body works only the BIO and Free work but to feel

better you need higher levels of Total T.

Co-Moderator

Phil

>

> > >

>

> > > >

>

> > >

>

> > > > >

>

> > >

>

> > > >

>

> > >

>

> > > > > > From: <gibcast@...>

>

> > >

>

> > > >

>

> > >

>

> > > > > > Subject:

> Incredible

>

> > >

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> > > >

>

> > >

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> > > > > weakness/sleepiness

>

> > >

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> > > >

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> > >

>

> > > > > > " NTHA-Chat "

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> > >

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> > > >

>

> > >

>

> > > > > <NTHA-Chat >,

>

> > >

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> > > >

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> > >

>

> > > > > " "

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> > >

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> > > >

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> > >

>

> > > > > < >

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> > >

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> > > >

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> > >

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> > > > > > Date: Wednesday, September 8,

> 2010,

>

> > 6:02 AM

>

> > >

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> > > >

>

> > >

>

> > > > > > FT3 is not very low but not very

> high

>

> > >

>

> > > >

>

> > >

>

> > > > > > either.

>

> > >

>

> > > >

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> > >

>

> > > > > >

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> > >

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> > > >

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> > >

>

> > > > > > I have in the past days felt VERY

> weak

>

> > and

>

> > > sleepy

>

> > >

>

> > > > All

>

> > >

>

> > > >

>

> > >

>

> > > > > the

>

> > >

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> > > >

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> > >

>

> > > > > > time. Hettoghe tils

>

> > >

>

> > > >

>

> > >

>

> > > > > > Me to increase Thyroid to 120 mg

> from

>

> > 105

>

> > > mg

>

> > >

>

> > > > today. He

>

> > >

>

> > > >

>

> > >

>

> > > > > also

>

> > >

>

> > > >

>

> > >

>

> > > > > > told me to start testo gel again

> asap.

>

> > >

>

> > > >

>

> > >

>

> > > > > >

>

> > >

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> > > >

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> > >

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> > > > > > Can low testo give this heavy

>

> > sleepiness

>

> > > and

>

> > >

>

> > > > Tiredness

>

> > >

>

> > > >

>

> > >

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> > > > > and

>

> > >

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> > > >

>

> > >

>

> > > > > > weakness? Cause pulse is 75-80

>

> > >

>

> > > >

>

> > >

>

> > > > > > And temp is 98.4 to 98.6 F now so

> I

>

> > fint

>

> > > seem

>

> > >

>

> > > > very

>

> > >

>

> > > >

>

> > >

>

> > > > > hypo by

>

> > >

>

> > > >

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> > >

>

> > > > > > those.

>

> > >

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> > > >

>

> > >

>

> > > > > >

>

> > >

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> > > >

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> > >

>

> > > > > > T.

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> > >

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> > > >

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> > >

>

> > > > > >

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> > >

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> > > >

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> > >

>

> > > > > > Sendt fra min iPhone

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> > >

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> > > >

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> > >

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> > > > > >

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> > >

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> > > >

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> > >

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> > > > > >

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> > >

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> > > >

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> > >

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> > > > > >       

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> > > > > >

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> > > >

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> > >

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> > > > > >

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> > >

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> > > >

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> > >

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> > > > > >

> ------------------------------------

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> > > > > >

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> > > > > >