Guest guest Posted November 23, 2010 Report Share Posted November 23, 2010 Depression can be and is very often caused by low T. It's one of the most prominent symptoms. Re: Low t and Big D I believe depression is caused by low thyroid. http://depression.about.com/od/thyroid1/a/hypothryoidism.htm Low thyroid can correlate with low testosterone. > > is there any evidence that low t can cause depression. I understand depression can be a result of low t but can it be a cause? > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 23, 2010 Report Share Posted November 23, 2010 Hi Barb, I agree about depression being caused by low thyroid, but I believe that other low hormone levels also can cause depression. When I started TRT, my thyroid levels actually dropped but I felt much better. I never thought of myself as being depressed until after I realized how much better I felt after starting Testosterone. Coincidentally, my estradiol levels went up after first starting TRT which probably should have caused me to feel more depressed. According to my doctor, Estrogen acts as a MAO (monoamine oxidase) - basically the opposite effect of MAOIs (monoamine oxidase Inhibitors); estrogen decreases the availability of serotonin in the brain. Here is a blurb about MAOIs (the opposite of what estrogen does) from the mayoclinic web site: Researchers believe MAOIs relieve depression by preventing the enzyme monoamine oxidase from metabolizing the neurotransmitters norepinephrine (nor-ep-ih-NEF-rin), serotonin (ser-oh-TOE-nin) and dopamine (DOE-puh-mene) in the brain. As a result, these levels remain high in the brain, boosting mood. (From: http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/maois/MH00072) I do realize that this is the opposite of most of the literature available, but from personal observation, I guess I have to agree with my doctor. My mother has had severe depression for decades and has tried most AD drugs without success. When she started to take bio-identical progesterone (i.e. Prometrium), the change was dramatic and very positive. Of course, after leveling off with the Progesterone, she started to increase her thyroid meds and continued to feel even better. My girlfriend also had severe depression and was taking the max dosage of the AD drug Citalopram (60mg) prior to starting to take Prometrium. Now she doesn't take Citalopram at all anymore. From: [mailto: ] On Behalf Of Barb Sent: Tuesday, November 23, 2010 9:06 PM Subject: Re: Low t and Big D I believe depression is caused by low thyroid. http://depression.about.com/od/thyroid1/a/hypothryoidism.htm Low thyroid can correlate with low testosterone. > > is there any evidence that low t can cause depression. I understand depression can be a result of low t but can it be a cause? > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 24, 2010 Report Share Posted November 24, 2010 I beg to differ with you on this. Co-Moderator Phil > From: bgfitnessny@... <bgfitnessny@...> > Subject: Re: Re: Low t and Big D > > Date: Tuesday, November 23, 2010, 10:07 PM > > Depression can be and is very often caused by low T. It's > one of the most prominent symptoms. > > > > > > > > > Re: Low t and Big D > > > > > > > I believe depression is caused by low thyroid. > http://depression.about.com/od/thyroid1/a/hypothryoidism.htm > > Low thyroid can correlate with low testosterone. > > > > > > is there any evidence that low t can cause depression. > I understand depression can be a result of low t but can it > be a cause? > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 24, 2010 Report Share Posted November 24, 2010 Thanks for the excellent article from Dr. no! I always learn something new from his articles. Someday, I am just going to have to sit down and read everything he has! Lol From: [mailto: ] On Behalf Of Barb Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2010 9:39 AM Subject: Re: Low t and Big D Yes, testosterone is involved in your well-being, and so are the neurotransmitters and other hormones, as described. But thyroid is in there too. It would be erroneous to say that it is any one thing over the other. It is probably the combination of all them, and they have to be at proper ratios for wellness. For anyone interested in the details, here's an excellent post from Dr. no about depression where he names EVERYTHING involved, even the weather! http://www.definitivemind.com/forums/showthread.php?t=567 <http://www.definitivemind.com/forums/showthread.php?t=567 & highlight=depress ion+testosterone+thyroid> & highlight=depression+testosterone+thyroid " Low thyroid hormone can predispose one to depression. Cold weather can predispose one to depression. Cold weather forces the nervous system to increase body heat generation by increasing sympathetic nervous sytem activity. This can cause insomnia. But it also can lead to increased inflammatory immune system activity that eventually lead to sickness behaviors and depression. Suboptimal nutrition is a common contributor toward depression. Even when people think they have good nutrition, when nutritional analysis is done, they often are deficient in several nutrients. Modern diets are particularly deficient in numerous nutrients. A good starting point with diet is the book " Nourishing Traditions " by Sally Fallon. A problem in treatment is that often practitioners have not thought about what is an " optimal " as oppose to " deficient " level for individual nutrients when it comes to mental function. B12 deficiency, for example, starts at 550 pg/mL where neuron demyelination starts, not 200 pg/mL, where most would consider supplementation. Further, since B12 is artificially elevated by Folate, a higher dose may be necessary. A Methylmalonic acid level may also need to be checked to make sure B12 is even working. Iron deficiency is also often not recognized. A Ferritin level needs to be checked but often is not. Iron metabolism is also dependent on Vitamin A metabolism. Vitamin D is often deficient. However, I think current supplementation dosing guidelines are low compared to what people use to get in traditional diets. Mental health often needs higher dosing for Vitamin D. There are complexities involved with treatment that need to be addressed when one attempts to optimize nutrition. Gastrointestinal problems - such as pathogenic bacterial or yeast infections, irritable bowel syndrome, etc. - are a common problem which can cause fatigue and depression. Depression usually has multiple underlying pathophysiological causes. Suboptimal thyroid and suboptimal adrenal function are just two of the many problems that can exist simultaneously to cause depression. Mental function is highly preserved function. It takes a lot of hits to cause mental illness. The problems can be stratified along four general groups: Structural problems include neurodegenerative changes such as loss of glial cell mass or myelination, suboptimal intestinal flora. Signaling problems include problems with norepinephrine, serotonin, dopamine, thyroid, inflammatory cytokines, adrenal hormones, testosterone, estrogens, leptin, insulin, renin-angiotensin-aldosterone, etc. Metabolic and Nutritional problems include problems with gluconeogenesis, lipid metabolism, intestinal transport, mitochondrial function, problems with the citric acid cycle, signal transduction problems, nutritional deficiencies - of which a myriad are possible. Psychological and social problems and stresses - of which there are a nearly infinite variety. Achieving wellness involves identifying each individual problem which are contributing to depression and addressing them. The treatment interventions include psychosocial interventions, nervous system interventions (such as the psychiatric medications), endocrine interventions, immune system interventions, and metabolic and nutritional interventions. Thus, an comprehensive assessement and treatment is often needed. In psychiatry, this avoids trial and error work and achieves better results. When one aims for wellness, the key to treatment is optimization of the various systems involved. For example, when it comes to thyroid hormone, one not only has to adjust thyroid signaling until it is optimal, but to also address the nutritional aspects of thyroid function and to address immune system problems which can impair thyroid function. When it comes to adrenal function, one has to address immune system problems, nutritional problems and nervous system problems that may cause dysregulation of the adrenal glands. These days, I, often, do not need to do adrenal signaling support by adding hydrocortisone or other hormones when I address the other systemic problems because adrenal dysregulation is often secondary to these other issues. __________________ - Romeo B. no, MD, physician, psychiatrist " > > > > is there any evidence that low t can cause depression. I understand depression can be a result of low t but can it be a cause? > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 24, 2010 Report Share Posted November 24, 2010 Hi Barb, I know what you mean about his posts being like a college lecture! At least you don't walk away wishing that he would have explained it more! My doctor is Dr. Lyle Lundblad from the Midwest Institute of Urology (Edina, MN). He is an Osteopath and a Urologist. As far as I know, he hasn't published anything yet. But, he did once say, " someday when I publish my book. " From: [mailto: ] On Behalf Of Barb Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2010 1:59 PM Subject: Re: Low t and Big D Believe it or not, that's what I'm trying to do, but it's such slow reading, cause each of his posts is like a college lecture! Who is your doc, BTW? You actually know about neurotransmitters, and no's site is the only place I've seen them discussed. I've read numerous books and multiple forums, but he's the only one that truly gets the big picture. Barb > > > > > > is there any evidence that low t can cause depression. I understand > depression can be a result of low t but can it be a cause? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 29, 2010 Report Share Posted November 29, 2010 I hope your good now been down that road it a bad road. Co-Moderator Phil > From: james <jimevans_2000@...> > Subject: Re: Low t and Big D > > Date: Monday, November 29, 2010, 4:43 PM > When I run out of testosterone for my > injections, within a couple of weeks I enter into a horrible > depression, so I'd say, yes, low T can definitely cause > depression. > > > > > > is there any evidence that low t can cause depression. > I understand depression can be a result of low t but can it > be a cause? > > > > > > > ------------------------------------ > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You are posting as a guest. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.