Re: Immunosuppressant Drugs and Echinacea

[Guest guest]

My rheumatologist said that the two herbs a person with RA should

stay away from are ginseng and echineacea.

Sierra

> There has been much discussion recently about the biologic RA drugs

> and their tendency to cause increased infections (Respiratory,

Sinus

> etc). I am on Abatacept (drug being studied for RA) and I had my

> second infusion on Tuesday. I went to the Dr. today because I am

> sick, and they said that I have a respiratory infection. I had

been

> on Enbrel for over 2 years with no problems. Teh Dr. started me on

> an antibiotic.

>

> My father said I should take echinacea to help me get better. My

> question is this. If we take drugs that intentionally supress our

> immune system, because that is what is needed to treat our RA, is

> there any point in taking echinacea which is supposed to help boost

> out immune system?

>

> It seems like a silly question, but which is stronger? The drug to

> boost the immune system or the one intentionally supressing it? If

> I take echinacea, will it lessen the effects of the biologic drug?

>

> Anyone have any ideas or thoughts on this?

>

> Thanks,

> Miriam

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 10/3/2005 9:50:58 P.M. Central Standard Time, samrocci@... writes:

This brings up some interesting questions... What about doing things like drinking OJ to boost our immune systems during cold and flu season? Do we ever want to "boost" it if we are always trying to medically suppress it? Good thought provoking question~!

Sam

I should hope we could boost our immune system, mine was terrible before I got RA.

OJ works good, as do vitamins and vitamin C.

I suck on Zinc lozenges when I feel a cold coming on.

Becky

[Guest guest]

Wow, that's interesting. I will call my doctor tomorrow and ask

about it. Especially since I am on this new drug that is being

tested. It just seemed so funny, the idea of taking it when the

biologic drugs intentionally do the opposite. My dad is REAL big

into herbs and stuff like that.

Thanks for your response,

Miriam

> > There has been much discussion recently about the biologic RA

drugs

> > and their tendency to cause increased infections (Respiratory,

> Sinus

> > etc). I am on Abatacept (drug being studied for RA) and I had

my

> > second infusion on Tuesday. I went to the Dr. today because I

am

> > sick, and they said that I have a respiratory infection. I had

> been

> > on Enbrel for over 2 years with no problems. Teh Dr. started me

on

> > an antibiotic.

> >

> > My father said I should take echinacea to help me get better.

My

> > question is this. If we take drugs that intentionally supress

our

> > immune system, because that is what is needed to treat our RA,

is

> > there any point in taking echinacea which is supposed to help

boost

> > out immune system?

> >

> > It seems like a silly question, but which is stronger? The drug

to

> > boost the immune system or the one intentionally supressing it?

If

> > I take echinacea, will it lessen the effects of the biologic

drug?

> >

> > Anyone have any ideas or thoughts on this?

> >

> > Thanks,

> > Miriam

[Guest guest]

I've always been warned by my RD's and

internal medicine doctor to not to take echinacea with RA.

"To be safe, don't take it if you have lupus, rheumatoid

arthritis, tuberculosis, or multiple sclerosis, or are HIV-positive or

pregnant."

http://www.berkeleywellness.com/html/ds/dsEchinacea.php

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Maggie

http://www.4HockeyFans.com

http://www.4FloridaHockey.com

MSN: Maggies1429

AOL: Maggies85

It seems like a silly question, but which is stronger? The drug to boost the immune system or the one intentionally supressing it? If I take echinacea, will it lessen the effects of the biologic drug?

Anyone have any ideas or thoughts on this?

Thanks,

Miriam

[Guest guest]

Hi all- I recently got over a cold. Wierdest thing I ever had. Sore throat to start, and as it moved up into my head, I took Zicam. Its a nasal spray. It claims to shorten the duration of a cold. Usually when it goes up into my head, I used octivin or an anti histamine which dries me up and traps the infection in my sinuses. Using zicam though, I had a runny nose, and felt the urge to blow my nose alot. I had one day of slightly yellow discharge but it ran clear the rest of the time. The cold lasted for five days, peaking only slightly on the third day. Its important to note, when you have a cold or infection you are prohibited from taking mtx or a DMARD or Biologic because it lowers your immune system. Your immune system needs to fight the cold until its better. It worked for me. Your immune system regulating to fight your cold symptoms is important. I am back on MTX with remicade on wednesday now, and my immune system is its old suppressed self. yours, Deborah

[Guest guest]

This brings up some interesting questions... What about doing things like drinking OJ to boost our immune systems during cold and flu season? Do we ever want to "boost" it if we are always trying to medically suppress it?Good thought provoking question~!SamOn Oct 3, 2005, at 5:00 PM, mpalevsky_bunnylover wrote: Wow, that's interesting.  I will call my doctor tomorrow and ask about it.  Especially since I am on this new drug that is being tested.  It just seemed so funny, the idea of taking it when the biologic drugs intentionally do the opposite.  My dad is REAL big into herbs and stuff like that. Thanks for your response, Miriam > > There has been much discussion recently about the biologic RA drugs > > and their tendency to cause increased infections (Respiratory, > Sinus > > etc).  I am on Abatacept (drug being studied for RA) and I had my > > second infusion on Tuesday.  I went to the Dr. today because I am > > sick, and they said that I have a respiratory infection.  I had > been > > on Enbrel for over 2 years with no problems.  Teh Dr. started me on > > an antibiotic. > > > > My father said I should take echinacea to help me get better.  My > > question is this.  If we take drugs that intentionally supress our > > immune system, because that is what is needed to treat our RA, is > > there any point in taking echinacea which is supposed to help boost > > out immune system? > > > > It seems like a silly question, but which is stronger?  The drug to > > boost the immune system or the one intentionally supressing it?  If > > I take echinacea, will it lessen the effects of the biologic drug? > > > > Anyone have any ideas or thoughts on this? > > > > Thanks, > > Miriam

[Guest guest]

It's not really the entire immune system that is overactive but only some components and that might differ from person to person. That's probably the main reason that some medicines work for some people and other medicines work for other people. If we build up all of the immune system we do more good than harm. It's even better if we can selectively boost the parts of the immune system that are weak and don't boost the parts that are overactive. Unfortunately it is trial and error to find out what medications work and it is also trial and error to see what foods help or hurt. It really takes patience and discipline if we really want to understand RA and how it affects us individually. God bless.

----- Original Message -----

From: Sam Rocci

Rheumatoid Arthritis

Sent: Monday, October 03, 2005 7:48 PM

Subject: Re: Re: Immunosuppressant Drugs and Echinacea

This brings up some interesting questions... What about doing things like drinking OJ to boost our immune systems during cold and flu season? Do we ever want to "boost" it if we are always trying to medically suppress it?

Good thought provoking question~!

Sam

On Oct 3, 2005, at 5:00 PM, mpalevsky_bunnylover wrote:

Wow, that's interesting. I will call my doctor tomorrow and ask about it. Especially since I am on this new drug that is being tested. It just seemed so funny, the idea of taking it when the biologic drugs intentionally do the opposite. My dad is REAL big into herbs and stuff like that.Thanks for your response,Miriam> > There has been much discussion recently about the biologic RA drugs > > and their tendency to cause increased infections (Respiratory, > Sinus > > etc). I am on Abatacept (drug being studied for RA) and I had my > > second infusion on Tuesday. I went to the Dr. today because I am > > sick, and they said that I have a respiratory infection. I had > been > > on Enbrel for over 2 years with no problems. Teh Dr. started me on > > an antibiotic.> > > > My father said I should take echinacea to help me get better. My > > question is this. If we take drugs that intentionally supress our > > immune system, because that is what is needed to treat our RA, is > > there any point in taking echinacea which is supposed to help boost > > out immune system?> > > > It seems like a silly question, but which is stronger? The drug to > > boost the immune system or the one intentionally supressing it? If > > I take echinacea, will it lessen the effects of the biologic drug?> > > > Anyone have any ideas or thoughts on this?> > > > Thanks,> > Miriam

[Guest guest]

I've heard the same thing about Echinacea. Apparently it selectively boosts the part of the immune system that is overactive in many cases of RA. There are probably other cases of RA where it would not hurt, but why take the chance? God bless.

----- Original Message -----

From: Maggie

Rheumatoid Arthritis

Sent: Monday, October 03, 2005 5:44 PM

Subject: Re: Immunosuppressant Drugs and Echinacea

I've always been warned by my RD's and internal medicine doctor to not to take echinacea with RA."To be safe, don't take it if you have lupus, rheumatoid arthritis, tuberculosis, or multiple sclerosis, or are HIV-positive or pregnant."http://www.berkeleywellness.com/html/ds/dsEchinacea.php

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Maggie

http://www.4HockeyFans.com

http://www.4FloridaHockey.com

MSN: Maggies1429

AOL: Maggies85

It seems like a silly question, but which is stronger? The drug to boost the immune system or the one intentionally supressing it? If I take echinacea, will it lessen the effects of the biologic drug?

Anyone have any ideas or thoughts on this?

Thanks,

Miriam

[Guest guest]

I have read that same recommendation in the ARTHRITIS TODAY magazine, from the arthritis organization. you could check that at arthritis.org gentle hugs! Marcia snowdrift52003 <snowdrift52003@...> wrote:

My rheumatologist said that the two herbs a person with RA should stay away from are ginseng and echineacea.Sierra> There has been much discussion recently about the biologic RA drugs > and their tendency to cause increased infections (Respiratory, Sinus > etc). I am on Abatacept (drug being studied for RA) and I had my > second infusion on Tuesday. I went to the Dr. today because I am > sick, and they said that I have a respiratory infection. I had been > on Enbrel for over 2 years with no problems. Teh Dr. started me on > an antibiotic.> > My father said I should take echinacea to help me get better. My > question is this. If we take drugs that

intentionally supress our > immune system, because that is what is needed to treat our RA, is > there any point in taking echinacea which is supposed to help boost > out immune system?> > It seems like a silly question, but which is stronger? The drug to > boost the immune system or the one intentionally supressing it? If > I take echinacea, will it lessen the effects of the biologic drug?> > Anyone have any ideas or thoughts on this?> > Thanks,> Miriam

for Good Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort.

[Guest guest]

Our immune systems are already " boosted " naturally--that's the

problem! Our goal is to tame them.

Sierra

> > > > There has been much discussion recently about the biologic RA

> > drugs

> > > > and their tendency to cause increased infections (Respiratory,

> > > Sinus

> > > > etc). I am on Abatacept (drug being studied for RA) and I had

> > my

> > > > second infusion on Tuesday. I went to the Dr. today because I

> > am

> > > > sick, and they said that I have a respiratory infection. I

had

> > > been

> > > > on Enbrel for over 2 years with no problems. Teh Dr. started

me

> > on

> > > > an antibiotic.

> > > >

> > > > My father said I should take echinacea to help me get better.

> > My

> > > > question is this. If we take drugs that intentionally supress

> > our

> > > > immune system, because that is what is needed to treat our RA,

> > is

> > > > there any point in taking echinacea which is supposed to help

> > boost

> > > > out immune system?

> > > >

> > > > It seems like a silly question, but which is stronger? The

drug

> > to

> > > > boost the immune system or the one intentionally supressing

it?

> > If

> > > > I take echinacea, will it lessen the effects of the biologic

> > drug?

> > > >

> > > > Anyone have any ideas or thoughts on this?

> > > >

> > > > Thanks,

> > > > Miriam

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

I am going for total knee replacement on Wednesday.....wish me luck!!!

Thanks

Marcia Stoyle <marciastoyle@...> wrote:

I have read that same recommendation in the ARTHRITIS TODAY magazine, from the arthritis organization. you could check that at arthritis.org gentle hugs! Marcia snowdrift52003 <snowdrift52003@...> wrote: My rheumatologist said that the two herbs a person with RA should stay away from are ginseng and echineacea.Sierra> There has been much discussion recently about the biologic RA drugs > and their tendency to cause increased infections (Respiratory, Sinus > etc). I am on Abatacept (drug being studied for RA) and I had my > second infusion on Tuesday. I went to the Dr. today because I am > sick, and they said that I have a respiratory infection. I had been > on Enbrel for over 2 years with no problems. Teh Dr. started me on > an antibiotic.> > My father said I should take echinacea to help me get better. My > question is this. If we take drugs that

intentionally supress our > immune system, because that is what is needed to treat our RA, is > there any point in taking echinacea which is supposed to help boost > out immune system?> > It seems like a silly question, but which is stronger? The drug to > boost the immune system or the one intentionally supressing it? If > I take echinacea, will it lessen the effects of the biologic drug?> > Anyone have any ideas or thoughts on this?> > Thanks,> Miriam

for GoodClick here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort.

for Good Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort.

[Guest guest]

Good Luck on your surgery and wishing you a fast recovery.

Dorey

www.LivingWithRheumatoidArthritis.com

----- Original Message -----

From: NKM

Rheumatoid Arthritis

Sent: Tuesday, October 04, 2005 9:56 PM

Subject: Re: Re: Immunosuppressant Drugs and Echinacea

I am going for total knee replacement on Wednesday.....wish me luck!!!

Thanks

Marcia Stoyle <marciastoyle@...> wrote:

I have read that same recommendation in the ARTHRITIS TODAY magazine, from the arthritis organization. you could check that at arthritis.org gentle hugs! Marcia snowdrift52003 <snowdrift52003@...> wrote: My rheumatologist said that the two herbs a person with RA should stay away from are ginseng and echineacea.Sierra> There has been much discussion recently about the biologic RA drugs > and their tendency to cause increased infections (Respiratory, Sinus > etc). I am on Abatacept (drug being studied for RA) and I had my > second infusion on Tuesday. I went to the Dr. today because I am > sick, and they said that I have a respiratory infection. I had been > on Enbrel for over 2 years with no problems. Teh Dr. started me on > an antibiotic.> > My father said I should take echinacea to help me get better. My > question is this. If we take drugs that intentionally supress our > immune system, because that is what is needed to treat our RA, is > there any point in taking echinacea which is supposed to help boost > out immune system?> > It seems like a silly question, but which is stronger? The drug to > boost the immune system or the one intentionally supressing it? If > I take echinacea, will it lessen the effects of the biologic drug?> > Anyone have any ideas or thoughts on this?> > Thanks,> Miriam

for GoodClick here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort.

for GoodClick here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort.

[Guest guest]

I found the zicam worked well for me, too. However there have been

some problems with the nasal spray. In some people it has caused a

total loss of the sense of smell. I changed to the throat spray, and

it seems to work just as well. I use it every time I fly because I

always seemed to get a cold after flying on an airplane. Since using

the zicam I haven't had a cold after flying.

Sharon

> Hi all- I recently got over a cold. Wierdest thing I ever had.

Sore throat

> to start, and as it moved up into my head, I took Zicam. Its a

nasal spray.

> It claims to shorten the duration of a cold. Usually when it goes

up into my

> head, I used octivin or an anti histamine which dries me up and

traps the

> infection in my sinuses. Using zicam though, I had a runny nose,

and felt the

> urge to blow my nose alot. I had one day of slightly yellow

discharge but it

> ran clear the rest of the time. The cold lasted for five days,

peaking only

> slightly on the third day. Its important to note, when you have a

cold or

> infection you are prohibited from taking mtx or a DMARD or Biologic

because it

> lowers your immune system. Your immune system needs to fight the

cold until its

> better. It worked for me. Your immune system regulating to fight

your cold

> symptoms is important. I am back on MTX with remicade on wednesday

now, and my

> immune system is its old suppressed self. yours, Deborah

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 10/5/2005 1:51:16 A.M. Central Standard Time, snowdrift52003@... writes:

Our immune systems are already "boosted" naturally--that's the problem! Our goal is to tame them.Sierra

I am still confused about what RA is, except that my body has turned against me.

I've never had a good immune system. I was sick all the time as a kid and still catch

everything that comes by, including viruses and illnesses I have never heard of before,

so it would seem that I have an under active immune system.

The RA started after I had been ill with one virus after another in the winter of 2002-03.

Becky

[Guest guest]

>

> I am still confused about what RA is, > Becky

There's a lot of good info. on the web. The arthritis foundation

website is good; I'd recommend talking to your doctor more, too.

Knowledge is power.

Sierra

[Guest guest]

In my opinion it's not that the immune system is overactive or underactive. The problem is that the immune system has made a mistake so it thinks our joints or some components of them are intruders and it tries to eliminate them. There are a lot of components to the joints and a lot of components to the immune system. I think RA is a large variety of diseases that have some symptoms in common. In some people it may be an overactive immune system overall and in others it may be an underactive but misdirected immune system. I have not seen these ideas expressed anywhere else but they are my conclusions by following several message boards over a period of a few years. God bless.

----- Original Message -----

From: StarsHutch@...

Rheumatoid Arthritis

Sent: Wednesday, October 05, 2005 6:08 PM

Subject: Re: Re: Immunosuppressant Drugs and Echinacea

I am still confused about what RA is, except that my body has turned against me.

I've never had a good immune system. I was sick all the time as a kid and still catch

everything that comes by, including viruses and illnesses I have never heard of before,

so it would seem that I have an under active immune system.

The RA started after I had been ill with one virus after another in the winter of 2002-03.

Becky