Re: Re: Glutathione Patch Question-A good or bad idea?

[Guest guest]

I did read what Andy thinks about in his book last night. Come to think of

it......Mickie did take oral Glutathione back in 2006 and and early on back

in 2003, it didnt' seem to help much. He did regress, but I don't know if it

was the Glutathione or the Valtrex, the MB12 shots, etc. I was watching a

documentary done a by a father of a little girl, that had her on mb12 shots

and because the dose was so high for her, it accelerated the methilation

process so much that it made her have these horrible meltdowns and lowering

the dose did not stop them so she was not able to take it again.

I'm wondering why my friend says she feels better and is off all other

medications. Could it be, that since glutathione supports the liver and her

body is probably trying and has for years to get rid of the mercury, her

liver is doing better with the glutathione?

On Wed, Nov 3, 2010 at 10:01 AM, surfacer <serich@...> wrote:

>

>

> Glutathione can and does bind with mercury resulting in its excretion.

> Since glutathione only has one SH (thiol) group, it takes two glutathione

> molecules to bind with one mercury.

>

> From Molecular Biology and Toxicology of Metals by Rudolfs Zalups:

>

> " In a situation where there are twice as many molecules of glutathione to

> inorganic mercuric ions, there will be a tendency for each inorganic

> mercuric ion to be bonded to the sulfur atoms of two molecules of

> glutathione in a linear II coordinate covalent complex. "

>

> However, giving transdermal glutathione is not likely to result in much

> mercury detoxification as each cell must make its own from its precursors.

>

>

>

> >

> > I only know that Andy says NOT to use glutathione on mercury toxic

> people. I don't recall why, but I searched onibasu and found these

> statements about glutathione and mercury toxic people.

> >

> > " Some get horribly, permanently worse, and can't be recovered with proper

> chelation. There is also no clear benefit. The cost is MUCH too large

> considering unknown benefit.

> >

> > Glutathione is ONE of many chemicals used in detoxification pathways. The

> proponents talk as if it will magically remove heavy metals. It won't. It

> only has one SH (thiol) group, so behaves like other sulfur foods making

> metal toxic people sicker.

>

> >

> > It makes much more sense to give antioxidants to help to preserve the

> glutathione that is there (glutathione acts and an antioxidant) and to

> supply the precursors so that the body can make the amount of glutathione

> that it needs.

> >

> >

>

>

>

--

Zurama

Mickie 13yrs

Round #36

15mg DMSA 15mg ALA

[Guest guest]

glutathione helps with methylation and so if her sulfation process is working

well, then she can get rid of the oxidative build-up and it will help her feel

better. If your sulfation process is screwed up too, then the methyl donor will

not only help, it will make things worse. It's like a garbage disposal...you

can drop an entire watermelon in the top of the sink, but until the bottom blade

can catch up and grind up the melon and then it drains down the sink, it will

back up and cause a mess. It doesn't matter how much you put in the top

(methylation) , if the bottom process (sulfation) can't get rid of it you will

get buildup (oxidative stress). That's why some folks and kids do poorly on

methyl b12. They need a sulphur donor, not a methyl donor.

nancy j.

Help TACA help families with autism. We can win $50,000. Please vote every day

in November. http://www.refresheverything.com/tacarealhelpnow

>

> >

> >

> > Glutathione can and does bind with mercury resulting

> in its excretion.

> > Since glutathione only has one SH (thiol) group, it

> takes two glutathione

> > molecules to bind with one mercury.

> >

> > From Molecular Biology and Toxicology of Metals by

> Rudolfs Zalups:

> >

> > " In a situation where there are twice as many

> molecules of glutathione to

> > inorganic mercuric ions, there will be a tendency for

> each inorganic

> > mercuric ion to be bonded to the sulfur atoms of two

> molecules of

> > glutathione in a linear II coordinate covalent

> complex. "

> >

> > However, giving transdermal glutathione is not likely

> to result in much

> > mercury detoxification as each cell must make its own

> from its precursors.

> >

> >

> >

> > >

> > > I only know that Andy says NOT to use glutathione

> on mercury toxic

> > people. I don't recall why, but I searched onibasu and

> found these

> > statements about glutathione and mercury toxic

> people.

> > >

> > > " Some get horribly, permanently worse, and can't

> be recovered with proper

> > chelation. There is also no clear benefit. The cost is

> MUCH too large

> > considering unknown benefit.

> > >

> > > Glutathione is ONE of many chemicals used in

> detoxification pathways. The

> > proponents talk as if it will magically remove heavy

> metals. It won't. It

> > only has one SH (thiol) group, so behaves like other

> sulfur foods making

> > metal toxic people sicker.

> >

> > >

> > > It makes much more sense to give antioxidants to

> help to preserve the

> > glutathione that is there (glutathione acts and an

> antioxidant) and to

> > supply the precursors so that the body can make the

> amount of glutathione

> > that it needs.

> > >

> > >

> >

> > 

> >

>

>

>

> --

> Zurama

> Mickie 13yrs

> Round #36

> 15mg DMSA 15mg ALA

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

the way we figured it out was looking back at all the supps our guy has been on

and seeing which things worked and which things caused regression.  Without

exception everything that had worked was a sulphur donor and everything that

made him crazy was a methyl donor.  I have a great presentation done by Dr.

Jerry Kartzinel at a DAN! that explains it in great detail and lists the sulphur

donors and the methyl donors.  It's posted in the archives under " Dr. Jerry,

Methylation Pathways " . Very interesting reading if you want to know the science

behind methylation/sulfation.

nancy j.

Help TACA help families with autism. We can win $50,000. Please vote every day

in November. http://www.refresheverything.com/tacarealhelpnow

From: mrboysmom <misterboysmom@...>

Subject: [ ] Re: Glutathione Patch Question-A good or bad idea?

Date: Wednesday, November 3, 2010, 8:48 PM

 

So how do you know if your sulfation process is working? How do you know

if you need a sulphur donor instead of a methyl donor?

Deb

> > > >

> > > > I only know that Andy says NOT to use glutathione

> > on mercury toxic

> > > people. I don't recall why, but I searched onibasu and

> > found these

> > > statements about glutathione and mercury toxic

> > people.

> > > >

> > > > " Some get horribly, permanently worse, and can't

> > be recovered with proper

> > > chelation. There is also no clear benefit. The cost is

> > MUCH too large

> > > considering unknown benefit.

> > > >

> > > > Glutathione is ONE of many chemicals used in

> > detoxification pathways. The

> > > proponents talk as if it will magically remove heavy

> > metals. It won't. It

> > > only has one SH (thiol) group, so behaves like other

> > sulfur foods making

> > > metal toxic people sicker.

> > >

> > > >

> > > > It makes much more sense to give antioxidants to

> > help to preserve the

> > > glutathione that is there (glutathione acts and an

> > antioxidant) and to

> > > supply the precursors so that the body can make the

> > amount of glutathione

> > > that it needs.

> > > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > 

> > >

> >

> >

> >

> > --

> > Zurama

> > Mickie 13yrs

> > Round #36

> > 15mg DMSA 15mg ALA

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Thank you! I'm definately going to read it. It's not something I was aware

off. I remembered that he seem to do well with MB12, then regressed, but I

didn't undestand why.

I'm worried about the glutathione he did take years ago. I've read here that

the damage is not reversible. Is this final? Is there something I can do

now?

Zurama

On Thu, Nov 4, 2010 at 8:17 AM, nancy cook <endofautism@...> wrote:

>

>

> the way we figured it out was looking back at all the supps our guy has

> been on and seeing which things worked and which things caused regression.

> Without exception everything that had worked was a sulphur donor and

> everything that made him crazy was a methyl donor. I have a great

> presentation done by Dr. Jerry Kartzinel at a DAN! that explains it in great

> detail and lists the sulphur donors and the methyl donors. It's posted in

> the archives under " Dr. Jerry, Methylation Pathways " . Very interesting

> reading if you want to know the science behind methylation/sulfation.

>

>

> nancy j.

>

> Help TACA help families with autism. We can win $50,000. Please vote every

> day in November. http://www.refresheverything.com/tacarealhelpnow

>

>

>

> From: mrboysmom <misterboysmom@... <misterboysmom%40pacbell.net>>

> Subject: [ ] Re: Glutathione Patch Question-A good or bad

> idea?

>

> < %40>

> Date: Wednesday, November 3, 2010, 8:48 PM

>

>

>

>

> So how do you know if your sulfation process is working? How do you know if

> you need a sulphur donor instead of a methyl donor?

>

> Deb

>

>

>

> > > > >

>

> > > > > I only know that Andy says NOT to use glutathione

>

> > > on mercury toxic

>

> > > > people. I don't recall why, but I searched onibasu and

>

> > > found these

>

> > > > statements about glutathione and mercury toxic

>

> > > people.

>

> > > > >

>

> > > > > " Some get horribly, permanently worse, and can't

>

> > > be recovered with proper

>

> > > > chelation. There is also no clear benefit. The cost is

>

> > > MUCH too large

>

> > > > considering unknown benefit.

>

> > > > >

>

> > > > > Glutathione is ONE of many chemicals used in

>

> > > detoxification pathways. The

>

> > > > proponents talk as if it will magically remove heavy

>

> > > metals. It won't. It

>

> > > > only has one SH (thiol) group, so behaves like other

>

> > > sulfur foods making

>

> > > > metal toxic people sicker.

>

> > > >

>

> > > > >

>

> > > > > It makes much more sense to give antioxidants to

>

> > > help to preserve the

>

> > > > glutathione that is there (glutathione acts and an

>

> > > antioxidant) and to

>

> > > > supply the precursors so that the body can make the

>

> > > amount of glutathione

>

> > > > that it needs.

>

> > > > >

>

> > > > >

>

> > > >

>

> > > >

>

> > > >

>

> > >

>

> > >

>

> > >

>

> > > --

>

> > > Zurama

>

> > > Mickie 13yrs

>

> > > Round #36

>

> > > 15mg DMSA 15mg ALA

>

> > >

>

> > >

>

> > >

[Guest guest]

I am very interested in this discussion as well.  , I found the 1-pg chart

under " files, " but do not see the detailed presentation.  Am I looking in the

wrong place? 

 

My son also has severe sulfation issues.  He is very sensitive to phenols and I

do what I can in the way of epsom salt baths, low-phenol diet, etc.  So he also

has had problems tolerating ALA. He was doing well on 2mg, but then last weekend

I bumped it up to 5mg and he was a mess!  It's so sad and frustrating to me that

we've been chelating for about 1.5 years now and his body is still so

sensitive!  At the same time though he tolerates DMSA very well, in addition to

B12 injections and Folinic acid (folapro). 

 

Is the best approach to continue working on sulfation issues?  Or methylation?

Will ALA eventually resolve the sulfation issues do you think?  This is all so

confusing!  Thanks so much for any advice you can offer.

>

> From: mrboysmom <misterboysmom@... <misterboysmom%40pacbell.net>>

> Subject: [ ] Re: Glutathione Patch Question-A good or bad

> idea?

>

> < %40>

> Date: Wednesday, November 3, 2010, 8:48 PM

>

>

>

>

> So how do you know if your sulfation process is working? How do you know if

> you need a sulphur donor instead of a methyl donor?

>

> Deb

>

>

>

> > > > >

>

> > > > > I only know that Andy says NOT to use glutathione

>

> > > on mercury toxic

>

> > > > people. I don't recall why, but I searched onibasu and

>

> > > found these

>

> > > > statements about glutathione and mercury toxic

>

> > > people.

>

> > > > >

>

> > > > > " Some get horribly, permanently worse, and can't

>

> > > be recovered with proper

>

> > > > chelation. There is also no clear benefit. The cost is

>

> > > MUCH too large

>

> > > > considering unknown benefit.

>

> > > > >

>

> > > > > Glutathione is ONE of many chemicals used in

>

> > > detoxification pathways. The

>

> > > > proponents talk as if it will magically remove heavy

>

> > > metals. It won't. It

>

> > > > only has one SH (thiol) group, so behaves like other

>

> > > sulfur foods making

>

> > > > metal toxic people sicker.

>

> > > >

>

> > > > >

>

> > > > > It makes much more sense to give antioxidants to

>

> > > help to preserve the

>

> > > > glutathione that is there (glutathione acts and an

>

> > > antioxidant) and to

>

> > > > supply the precursors so that the body can make the

>

> > > amount of glutathione

>

> > > > that it needs.

>

> > > > >

>

> > > > >

>

> > > >

>

> > > >

>

> > > >

>

> > >

>

> > >

>

> > >

>

> > > --

>

> > > Zurama

>

> > > Mickie 13yrs

>

> > > Round #36

>

> > > 15mg DMSA 15mg ALA

>

> > >

>

> > >

>

> > >

[Guest guest]

I can't find it either......Complicated for sure!!

On Thu, Nov 4, 2010 at 9:41 AM, Elyse <ecrocks23@...> wrote:

>

>

> I am very interested in this discussion as well. , I found the 1-pg

> chart under " files, " but do not see the detailed presentation. Am I looking

> in the wrong place?

>

> My son also has severe sulfation issues. He is very sensitive to phenols

> and I do what I can in the way of epsom salt baths, low-phenol diet, etc.

> So he also has had problems tolerating ALA. He was doing well on 2mg, but

> then last weekend I bumped it up to 5mg and he was a mess! It's so sad and

> frustrating to me that we've been chelating for about 1.5 years now and his

> body is still so sensitive! At the same time though he tolerates DMSA very

> well, in addition to B12 injections and Folinic acid (folapro).

>

> Is the best approach to continue working on sulfation issues? Or

> methylation? Will ALA eventually resolve the sulfation issues do you think?

> This is all so confusing! Thanks so much for any advice you can offer.

>

>

>

> >

> > From: mrboysmom <misterboysmom@...

<misterboysmom%40pacbell.net><misterboysmom%

> 40pacbell.net>>

>

> > Subject: [ ] Re: Glutathione Patch Question-A good or bad

> > idea?

> >

> >

< %40>< %

> 40>

>

> > Date: Wednesday, November 3, 2010, 8:48 PM

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > So how do you know if your sulfation process is working? How do you know

> if

> > you need a sulphur donor instead of a methyl donor?

> >

> > Deb

> >

> >

> >

> > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > I only know that Andy says NOT to use glutathione

> >

> > > > on mercury toxic

> >

> > > > > people. I don't recall why, but I searched onibasu and

> >

> > > > found these

> >

> > > > > statements about glutathione and mercury toxic

> >

> > > > people.

> >

> > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > " Some get horribly, permanently worse, and can't

> >

> > > > be recovered with proper

> >

> > > > > chelation. There is also no clear benefit. The cost is

> >

> > > > MUCH too large

> >

> > > > > considering unknown benefit.

> >

> > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > Glutathione is ONE of many chemicals used in

> >

> > > > detoxification pathways. The

> >

> > > > > proponents talk as if it will magically remove heavy

> >

> > > > metals. It won't. It

> >

> > > > > only has one SH (thiol) group, so behaves like other

> >

> > > > sulfur foods making

> >

> > > > > metal toxic people sicker.

> >

> > > > >

> >

> > > > > >

> >

> > > > > > It makes much more sense to give antioxidants to

> >

> > > > help to preserve the

> >

> > > > > glutathione that is there (glutathione acts and an

> >

> > > > antioxidant) and to

> >

> > > > > supply the precursors so that the body can make the

> >

> > > > amount of glutathione

> >

> > > > > that it needs.

> >

> > > > > >

> >

> > > > > >

> >

> > > > >

> >

> > > > >

> >

> > > > >

> >

> > > >

> >

> > > >

> >

> > > >

> >

> > > > --

> >

> > > > Zurama

> >

> > > > Mickie 13yrs

> >

> > > > Round #36

> >

> > > > 15mg DMSA 15mg ALA

> >

> > > >

> >

> > > >

> >

> > > >

[Guest guest]

I deleted the old file and reloaded the complete report. Then I chose it to

make sure it loaded to my desktop. It worked for me, so you should all be able

to download it to your desktops. It's a great report and really helps

understand methyl vs sulfur. If you have any more problems, let me know and I

can send it to you personally.

nancy j.

Help TACA help families with autism. We can win $50,000. Please vote every day

in November. http://www.refresheverything.com/tacarealhelpnow

> > >

> > > From: mrboysmom <misterboysmom@...

> <misterboysmom%40pacbell.net><misterboysmom%

> > 40pacbell.net>>

> >

> > > Subject: [ ] Re: Glutathione Patch

> Question-A good or bad

> > > idea?

> > >

> > >

> < %40>< %

> > 40>

> >

> > > Date: Wednesday, November 3, 2010, 8:48 PM

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > So how do you know if your sulfation process is

> working? How do you know

> > if

> > > you need a sulphur donor instead of a methyl

> donor?

> > >

> > > Deb

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > I only know that Andy says

> NOT to use glutathione

> > >

> > > > > on mercury toxic

> > >

> > > > > > people. I don't recall why, but I

> searched onibasu and

> > >

> > > > > found these

> > >

> > > > > > statements about glutathione and

> mercury toxic

> > >

> > > > > people.

> > >

> > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > " Some get horribly,

> permanently worse, and can't

> > >

> > > > > be recovered with proper

> > >

> > > > > > chelation. There is also no clear

> benefit. The cost is

> > >

> > > > > MUCH too large

> > >

> > > > > > considering unknown benefit.

> > >

> > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > Glutathione is ONE of many

> chemicals used in

> > >

> > > > > detoxification pathways. The

> > >

> > > > > > proponents talk as if it will

> magically remove heavy

> > >

> > > > > metals. It won't. It

> > >

> > > > > > only has one SH (thiol) group, so

> behaves like other

> > >

> > > > > sulfur foods making

> > >

> > > > > > metal toxic people sicker.

> > >

> > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > > It makes much more sense to

> give antioxidants to

> > >

> > > > > help to preserve the

> > >

> > > > > > glutathione that is there

> (glutathione acts and an

> > >

> > > > > antioxidant) and to

> > >

> > > > > > supply the precursors so that the

> body can make the

> > >

> > > > > amount of glutathione

> > >

> > > > > > that it needs.

> > >

> > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > >

> > >

> > > > > >

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > --

> > >

> > > > > Zurama

> > >

> > > > > Mickie 13yrs

> > >

> > > > > Round #36

> > >

> > > > > 15mg DMSA 15mg ALA

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have

> been removed]

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > > ------------------------------------

> > >

> > > > >

> > >

> > > > >

> =======================================================

> > >

> > > > >