Bi-polar

[Guest guest]

Can a child have a milder form of Bi-Polar that isn't as extreme as your

daughter? Now I have started reading everything and seeing some signs of

bi-polar but not as severe. Ugg! This is all driving me crazy trying to

figure it out. I have a brother with Borderline Personality Disorder which I

believe is related to bi-polar. Our family is loaded with alcoholics, my son

struggles with writing, is very moody, when he is upset it is severe, when

he was only 3 I remember him running to his room yelling he was going to

kill himself, (where did he get that form? Has not said that since then and

he is now 9) Once put a hole in the wall, not ever again. Bossy with other

kids, always loud, etc, etc. As I have a appointment with a psychiatrist to

try some new meds I am really getting nervous on even how to communicate his

symptoms. He does not like to talk about any of this which makes it even

harder to figure out what is going on in his brain.

Another question, how is the mood stabilizer doing? What are the worse side

affects of those? Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated. I am the type

of mom that has to really research this stuff before just putting my son on

a med, makes me so nervous to think of him on multiple meds after the hard

time we just had on Adderal, Zoloft, and Celexa.

Thanks

Adele

_____

From:

[mailto: ] On Behalf Of jchabot

Sent: Monday, October 02, 2006 2:28 PM

Subject: RE: Re: Bi-Polar

I have a 9yr old daughter with bipolar and ocd. She took an SSRI at age 5

before the bipolar was diagnosed. She did not have any bad reaction to it.

It helped her anxiety tremendously.Even though it is a no-no to take an SSRI

with bipolar , my daughter has been on zoloft for 5 years , and cannot

function without it, although she is now also on a mood stabilizing med.It

took me 6 years to get her diagnosed properly, because these kids usually

get an alphabet soup diagnosis.It took several hospitalizations,

neuropsychiatric evaluations, and studies, and months of missed school.

There have been so many times my daughter has almost had to be removed from

my home because we could not handle her due to her raging.

My daughter had issues from infancy, which usually is the case with early

onset bipolar. Every child is different.I have gone to hell and back with my

daughter.My son is difficult also with the ocd and anxiety but is literally

a piece of cake compared to my daughter. The problem is , is children are

being diagnosed with bipolar left and right , when they don't really have

it. Like I've said before, if your child had it, there would not be one

doubt in your mind!!!!!!!!!!! These kids are a nightmare to deal with!!. I

love all my kids to death, but my bipolar child is completely unbelievable!

It's nothing like you could ever imagine! Unless your child had it.

My son (5) was put on 2 different SSRI's for ocd, and was climbing the

walls,raging hitting, jumping out of the car, etc, etc,.These are all

bipolar and adhd symptoms. Once we stopped the SSRI's and put him on an

antipsychotic, he turned into a different kid. The new doctor has said he

has a mood disorder due to the reaction to the SSRI's. I don't believe it

for one second, although he was diagnosed with one.I know that is not always

the case.

There is no mistaking a child with bipolar disorder, my son is nothing like

my daughter.I could go on and on for hours with things my daughter has done

that only a parent of a bipolar child would believe.

It's very difficult and confusing. If you have any questions feel free to

ask . I've been there.

Hugs

Judy

[Guest guest]

This thread is getting away from OCD so I hestitate to keep adding to

it, but I wanted to say a couple of things...

All cases of BP are not as severe as what Judy described in her dd,

but there are many children that share her dd's symptoms. There are

3 types of BP according to the DSM - BP1, BP2 and Cyclothymia (a

milder form of the disorder which may be more difficult to spot).

Very often child psychiatrists will simply give a child (whose brain

is still developing) a working dx of BP-NOS. A specific diagnosis is

often not applied until the late teen or early adult years.

My own son experieced only hypomania (hyper, silly, giddy, energetic)

before we put him on Zoloft for his OCD. The Zoloft made things FAR

worse. Of course we didn't know then (several years ago) what we

know now. We would never have given him the Zoloft without the

benefit of a mood stabilizer on board first. (His mood has been

stable now for 3 years BTW.)

In regard to SSRI medications and children with BP - caution is the

buzz word. Sometimes a child does fine on an SSRI for a few months

before developing problems. There isn't always an immediate

reaction, and there are exceptions where a child does well long term

(usually on a dose that falls on the low side).

I know many people with children who have BP (I used to volunteer at

CABF), and these kids don't all fit a particular pattern. In fact,

as Judy pointed out - expression of the disorder *even in siblings*

can be very different. Many parents have a child that is hypomanic,

but attribute to ADHD sx. Or a child that is mainly on the depressed

side and they overlook the brief periods of hypomania for what they

are.

Hope that helps. The Bipolar Child by Papolos (3rd edition just

released) should be a big help if anyone has further questions. The

Bipolar child is the pediatric BP what Freeing Your Child From OCD is

to pediatric OCD.

Khris

>

> I have a 9yr old daughter with bipolar and ocd. She took an SSRI at

age 5 before the bipolar was diagnosed. She did not have any bad

reaction to it. It helped her anxiety tremendously.Even though it is

a no-no to take an SSRI with bipolar , my daughter has been on

zoloft for 5 years , and cannot function without it, although she is

now also on a mood stabilizing med.It took me 6 years to get her

diagnosed properly, because these kids usually get an alphabet soup

diagnosis.It took several hospitalizations, neuropsychiatric

evaluations, and studies, and months of missed school. There have

been so many times my daughter has almost had to be removed from my

home because we could not handle her due to her raging.

> My daughter had issues from infancy, which usually is the case

with early onset bipolar. Every child is different.I have gone to

hell and back with my daughter.My son is difficult also with the ocd

and anxiety but is literally a piece of cake compared to my daughter.

The problem is , is children are being diagnosed with bipolar left

and right , when they don't really have it. Like I've said before, if

your child had it, there would not be one doubt in your

mind!!!!!!!!!!! These kids are a nightmare to deal with!!. I love

all my kids to death, but my bipolar child is completely

unbelievable! It's nothing like you could ever imagine! Unless your

child had it.

> My son (5) was put on 2 different SSRI's for ocd, and was

climbing the walls,raging hitting, jumping out of the car, etc,

etc,.These are all bipolar and adhd symptoms. Once we stopped the

SSRI's and put him on an antipsychotic, he turned into a different

kid. The new doctor has said he has a mood disorder due to the

reaction to the SSRI's. I don't believe it for one second, although

he was diagnosed with one.I know that is not always the case.

> There is no mistaking a child with bipolar disorder, my son is

nothing like my daughter.I could go on and on for hours with things

my daughter has done that only a parent of a bipolar child would

believe.

> It's very difficult and confusing. If you have any questions feel

free to ask . I've been there.

> Hugs

> Judy

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Kris,

Would you mind telling me the exact dose your child is on with all this.

Which mood stabilizer and what SSRI?

Thanks

_____

From:

[mailto: ] On Behalf Of Khris

Sent: Monday, October 02, 2006 5:17 PM

Subject: Re: Bi-Polar

This thread is getting away from OCD so I hestitate to keep adding to

it, but I wanted to say a couple of things...

All cases of BP are not as severe as what Judy described in her dd,

but there are many children that share her dd's symptoms. There are

3 types of BP according to the DSM - BP1, BP2 and Cyclothymia (a

milder form of the disorder which may be more difficult to spot).

Very often child psychiatrists will simply give a child (whose brain

is still developing) a working dx of BP-NOS. A specific diagnosis is

often not applied until the late teen or early adult years.

My own son experieced only hypomania (hyper, silly, giddy, energetic)

before we put him on Zoloft for his OCD. The Zoloft made things FAR

worse. Of course we didn't know then (several years ago) what we

know now. We would never have given him the Zoloft without the

benefit of a mood stabilizer on board first. (His mood has been

stable now for 3 years BTW.)

In regard to SSRI medications and children with BP - caution is the

buzz word. Sometimes a child does fine on an SSRI for a few months

before developing problems. There isn't always an immediate

reaction, and there are exceptions where a child does well long term

(usually on a dose that falls on the low side).

I know many people with children who have BP (I used to volunteer at

CABF), and these kids don't all fit a particular pattern. In fact,

as Judy pointed out - expression of the disorder *even in siblings*

can be very different. Many parents have a child that is hypomanic,

but attribute to ADHD sx. Or a child that is mainly on the depressed

side and they overlook the brief periods of hypomania for what they

are.

Hope that helps. The Bipolar Child by Papolos (3rd edition just

released) should be a big help if anyone has further questions. The

Bipolar child is the pediatric BP what Freeing Your Child From OCD is

to pediatric OCD.

Khris

>

> I have a 9yr old daughter with bipolar and ocd. She took an SSRI at

age 5 before the bipolar was diagnosed. She did not have any bad

reaction to it. It helped her anxiety tremendously.Even though it is

a no-no to take an SSRI with bipolar , my daughter has been on

zoloft for 5 years , and cannot function without it, although she is

now also on a mood stabilizing med.It took me 6 years to get her

diagnosed properly, because these kids usually get an alphabet soup

diagnosis.It took several hospitalizations, neuropsychiatric

evaluations, and studies, and months of missed school. There have

been so many times my daughter has almost had to be removed from my

home because we could not handle her due to her raging.

> My daughter had issues from infancy, which usually is the case

with early onset bipolar. Every child is different.I have gone to

hell and back with my daughter.My son is difficult also with the ocd

and anxiety but is literally a piece of cake compared to my daughter.

The problem is , is children are being diagnosed with bipolar left

and right , when they don't really have it. Like I've said before, if

your child had it, there would not be one doubt in your

mind!!!!!!!!!!! These kids are a nightmare to deal with!!. I love

all my kids to death, but my bipolar child is completely

unbelievable! It's nothing like you could ever imagine! Unless your

child had it.

> My son (5) was put on 2 different SSRI's for ocd, and was

climbing the walls,raging hitting, jumping out of the car, etc,

etc,.These are all bipolar and adhd symptoms. Once we stopped the

SSRI's and put him on an antipsychotic, he turned into a different

kid. The new doctor has said he has a mood disorder due to the

reaction to the SSRI's. I don't believe it for one second, although

he was diagnosed with one.I know that is not always the case.

> There is no mistaking a child with bipolar disorder, my son is

nothing like my daughter.I could go on and on for hours with things

my daughter has done that only a parent of a bipolar child would

believe.

> It's very difficult and confusing. If you have any questions feel

free to ask . I've been there.

> Hugs

> Judy

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Kris,

Also has your child gained weight on the mood stabilizer? I am really

worried about my son who has atendancy to gain weight anyway.

_____

From:

[mailto: ] On Behalf Of Khris

Sent: Monday, October 02, 2006 5:17 PM

Subject: Re: Bi-Polar

This thread is getting away from OCD so I hestitate to keep adding to

it, but I wanted to say a couple of things...

All cases of BP are not as severe as what Judy described in her dd,

but there are many children that share her dd's symptoms. There are

3 types of BP according to the DSM - BP1, BP2 and Cyclothymia (a

milder form of the disorder which may be more difficult to spot).

Very often child psychiatrists will simply give a child (whose brain

is still developing) a working dx of BP-NOS. A specific diagnosis is

often not applied until the late teen or early adult years.

My own son experieced only hypomania (hyper, silly, giddy, energetic)

before we put him on Zoloft for his OCD. The Zoloft made things FAR

worse. Of course we didn't know then (several years ago) what we

know now. We would never have given him the Zoloft without the

benefit of a mood stabilizer on board first. (His mood has been

stable now for 3 years BTW.)

In regard to SSRI medications and children with BP - caution is the

buzz word. Sometimes a child does fine on an SSRI for a few months

before developing problems. There isn't always an immediate

reaction, and there are exceptions where a child does well long term

(usually on a dose that falls on the low side).

I know many people with children who have BP (I used to volunteer at

CABF), and these kids don't all fit a particular pattern. In fact,

as Judy pointed out - expression of the disorder *even in siblings*

can be very different. Many parents have a child that is hypomanic,

but attribute to ADHD sx. Or a child that is mainly on the depressed

side and they overlook the brief periods of hypomania for what they

are.

Hope that helps. The Bipolar Child by Papolos (3rd edition just

released) should be a big help if anyone has further questions. The

Bipolar child is the pediatric BP what Freeing Your Child From OCD is

to pediatric OCD.

Khris

>

> I have a 9yr old daughter with bipolar and ocd. She took an SSRI at

age 5 before the bipolar was diagnosed. She did not have any bad

reaction to it. It helped her anxiety tremendously.Even though it is

a no-no to take an SSRI with bipolar , my daughter has been on

zoloft for 5 years , and cannot function without it, although she is

now also on a mood stabilizing med.It took me 6 years to get her

diagnosed properly, because these kids usually get an alphabet soup

diagnosis.It took several hospitalizations, neuropsychiatric

evaluations, and studies, and months of missed school. There have

been so many times my daughter has almost had to be removed from my

home because we could not handle her due to her raging.

> My daughter had issues from infancy, which usually is the case

with early onset bipolar. Every child is different.I have gone to

hell and back with my daughter.My son is difficult also with the ocd

and anxiety but is literally a piece of cake compared to my daughter.

The problem is , is children are being diagnosed with bipolar left

and right , when they don't really have it. Like I've said before, if

your child had it, there would not be one doubt in your

mind!!!!!!!!!!! These kids are a nightmare to deal with!!. I love

all my kids to death, but my bipolar child is completely

unbelievable! It's nothing like you could ever imagine! Unless your

child had it.

> My son (5) was put on 2 different SSRI's for ocd, and was

climbing the walls,raging hitting, jumping out of the car, etc,

etc,.These are all bipolar and adhd symptoms. Once we stopped the

SSRI's and put him on an antipsychotic, he turned into a different

kid. The new doctor has said he has a mood disorder due to the

reaction to the SSRI's. I don't believe it for one second, although

he was diagnosed with one.I know that is not always the case.

> There is no mistaking a child with bipolar disorder, my son is

nothing like my daughter.I could go on and on for hours with things

my daughter has done that only a parent of a bipolar child would

believe.

> It's very difficult and confusing. If you have any questions feel

free to ask . I've been there.

> Hugs

> Judy

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Adele, I sent you an email.

Khris

> >

> > I have a 9yr old daughter with bipolar and ocd. She took an SSRI

at

> age 5 before the bipolar was diagnosed. She did not have any bad

> reaction to it. It helped her anxiety tremendously.Even though it

is

> a no-no to take an SSRI with bipolar , my daughter has been on

> zoloft for 5 years , and cannot function without it, although she

is

> now also on a mood stabilizing med.It took me 6 years to get her

> diagnosed properly, because these kids usually get an alphabet soup

> diagnosis.It took several hospitalizations, neuropsychiatric

> evaluations, and studies, and months of missed school. There have

> been so many times my daughter has almost had to be removed from my

> home because we could not handle her due to her raging.

> > My daughter had issues from infancy, which usually is the case

> with early onset bipolar. Every child is different.I have gone to

> hell and back with my daughter.My son is difficult also with the

ocd

> and anxiety but is literally a piece of cake compared to my

daughter.

> The problem is , is children are being diagnosed with bipolar left

> and right , when they don't really have it. Like I've said before,

if

> your child had it, there would not be one doubt in your

> mind!!!!!!!!!!! These kids are a nightmare to deal with!!. I love

> all my kids to death, but my bipolar child is completely

> unbelievable! It's nothing like you could ever imagine! Unless your

> child had it.

> > My son (5) was put on 2 different SSRI's for ocd, and was

> climbing the walls,raging hitting, jumping out of the car, etc,

> etc,.These are all bipolar and adhd symptoms. Once we stopped the

> SSRI's and put him on an antipsychotic, he turned into a different

> kid. The new doctor has said he has a mood disorder due to the

> reaction to the SSRI's. I don't believe it for one second, although

> he was diagnosed with one.I know that is not always the case.

> > There is no mistaking a child with bipolar disorder, my son is

> nothing like my daughter.I could go on and on for hours with things

> my daughter has done that only a parent of a bipolar child would

> believe.

> > It's very difficult and confusing. If you have any questions feel

> free to ask . I've been there.

> > Hugs

> > Judy

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Hi Khris, a question, thought you may know the answer.

Can't a medication sometimes trigger a disorder? For instance, maybe

a person hasn't shown any signs, really, of BP but the SSRI brings it

out? Sort of like a med triggering tics that don't go away when

quitting the med. (simply put, let me know if you don't quite

understand what I'm asking)

(I know this seems to be getting away from OCD, but the SSRI

medications are used with OCD and so many here have kids with mixed

diagnoses so it's still relevant I think. And, hey, OCD can cause

such meltdowns, I'm sure BP?? has passed through a few minds

sometimes!)

>

> This thread is getting away from OCD so I hestitate to keep adding

to

> it, but I wanted to say a couple of things...

>

> All cases of BP are not as severe as what Judy described in her dd,

> but there are many children that share her dd's symptoms. There

are

> 3 types of BP according to the DSM - BP1, BP2 and Cyclothymia (a

> milder form of the disorder which may be more difficult to spot).

> Very often child psychiatrists will simply give a child (whose

brain

> is still developing) a working dx of BP-NOS.

[Guest guest]

Hi Adele,

My daughter has bipolar disorder 1 which is the worst type, but yes there are

other forms of mood disorders that are not as bad, like cyclothmia, and bipolar

II. There is also major depressive disorder. It does sound like your son may

have some type of mood disorder along with the ocd, but I'm not a doctor. You

seem to be experiencing some of the behaviors I have experienced with my

daughter, but with her it was just constant, and the rages were up to six hours

long. The combination of ocd and the mood disorder makes things much more

difficult.

Usually with a child you would get a diagnosis of mood disorder nos first

until things are more looked into.

My daughter is doing ok on the mood stabilizer but it is a constant battle,

it's always something.

Try purchasing < " The Bipolar Child " > It should answer many of your questions.

It also has all the side effects of all the medications. I have the third

edition which just came out. It's very informative. It's basically the same as

the first edition, but with more info on the newer drugs. some of the meds used

are also meds used for non compliant ocd like the antipsychotics and the blood

pressure meds.

You are doing the right thing. Research, and research, and don't be afraid to

speak up.

Hope this helps

hugs

Judy

[Guest guest]

Thanks Judy,

I just bought The Bipolar Child, 3rd edition last night. I can't get my nose

out of it. There is soo much there like my son except he hasn't shown any

violence at all. However, when he was on a SSRI he did show some violence.

I will continue to read this book and learn as much as possible.

Thanks

Adele

_____

From:

[mailto: ] On Behalf Of jchabot

Sent: Tuesday, October 03, 2006 8:17 AM

Subject: RE: Re: Bi-Polar

Hi Adele,

My daughter has bipolar disorder 1 which is the worst type, but yes there

are other forms of mood disorders that are not as bad, like cyclothmia, and

bipolar II. There is also major depressive disorder. It does sound like your

son may have some type of mood disorder along with the ocd, but I'm not a

doctor. You seem to be experiencing some of the behaviors I have experienced

with my daughter, but with her it was just constant, and the rages were up

to six hours long. The combination of ocd and the mood disorder makes things

much more difficult.

Usually with a child you would get a diagnosis of mood disorder nos first

until things are more looked into.

My daughter is doing ok on the mood stabilizer but it is a constant battle,

it's always something.

Try purchasing < " The Bipolar Child " > It should answer many of your

questions. It also has all the side effects of all the medications. I have

the third edition which just came out. It's very informative. It's basically

the same as the first edition, but with more info on the newer drugs. some

of the meds used are also meds used for non compliant ocd like the

antipsychotics and the blood pressure meds.

You are doing the right thing. Research, and research, and don't be afraid

to speak up.

Hope this helps

hugs

Judy

[Guest guest]

My dd is mercury toxic and we've been chelating her for 58 rounds so far. She

met the counting rules, and as I didn't trust anybody at the time, we also did

the French porphyrins test and she came out " remarkable " for mercury toxicity.

She is not autistic, although she is ADHD and probably bi-polar. We are using

AC protocol and all the recommended supplements, along with lithium orotate

twice a day (4.8 mg elemental lithium). While we saw some improvement in the

beginning of chelation, either we are in the stall period or it's too subtle to

see most of the time. My question is: how many people have cured their

bi-polar through chelation? How many rounds did it take you? Were there any

supplements you felt were more helpful to you?

Sorry - usually I can be positive and know we're on the right path, but I'm just

feeling overwhelmed this week and looking for some reassurance that I'm not

going to be looking for a residential treatment facility in a few more years.

sigh.

thxs

J

[Guest guest]

What improvements did you see at first?

On Feb 11, 2010, at 12:38 PM, bruce533 wrote:

> My dd is mercury toxic and we've been chelating her for 58 rounds so far. She

met the counting rules, and as I didn't trust anybody at the time, we also did

the French porphyrins test and she came out " remarkable " for mercury toxicity.

She is not autistic, although she is ADHD and probably bi-polar. We are using AC

protocol and all the recommended supplements, along with lithium orotate twice a

day (4.8 mg elemental lithium). While we saw some improvement in the beginning

of chelation, either we are in the stall period or it's too subtle to see most

of the time. My question is: how many people have cured their bi-polar through

chelation? How many rounds did it take you? Were there any supplements you felt

were more helpful to you?

>

> Sorry - usually I can be positive and know we're on the right path, but I'm

just feeling overwhelmed this week and looking for some reassurance that I'm not

going to be looking for a residential treatment facility in a few more years.

sigh.

>

> thxs

> J

>

>

[Guest guest]

I have heard this happening. I think it picks up again. Not sure. I hope you get

some answers. The same thing happened here.

On Feb 12, 2010, at 12:08 PM, bruce533 wrote:

> We're on round 59. We've eliminated all foods from her diet that we think are

a problem. 90% of the carpeting has been pulled (40 year old finished wood

floors underneath), house is lead-free and we don't think lead is a problem for

her at all anyhow. Mattress is in that extra-thick food-grade vinyl that is

supposed to eliminate off-gassing. Foods are mostly all organic, water is

filtered. Just haven't seen any noticeable improvement for the last year plus

several more months, so we've had a really long stall period that doesn't seem

to end.

> J

>

>

> > > >

> > > > > My dd is mercury toxic and we've been chelating her for 58 rounds so

far. She met the counting rules, and as I didn't trust anybody at the time, we

also did the French porphyrins test and she came out " remarkable " for mercury

toxicity. She is not autistic, although she is ADHD and probably bi-polar. We

are using AC protocol and all the recommended supplements, along with lithium

orotate twice a day (4.8 mg elemental lithium). While we saw some improvement in

the beginning of chelation, either we are in the stall period or it's too subtle

to see most of the time. My question is: how many people have cured their

bi-polar through chelation? How many rounds did it take you? Were there any

supplements you felt were more helpful to you?

> > > > >

> > > > > Sorry - usually I can be positive and know we're on the right path,

but I'm just feeling overwhelmed this week and looking for some reassurance that

I'm not going to be looking for a residential treatment facility in a few more

years. sigh.

> > > > >

> > > > > thxs

> > > > > J

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

[Guest guest]

Hi Jan,

We started out on meds, they didn't work well and had lots of side-effects,

switched to EMPower and had some good results but nowhere near perfect. We saw a

DAN dr. and had some testing done, tried supplementing vits/mins with bad

results. Started yeast treatment and had to stop b/c she became awful. Started

GF diet, didn't see big improvements but things got worse whenever she cheated

so we kept it going. Same with casein, egg, peanuts, artificial colors. Had

muscle testing done but it wasn't completely accurate for her. A lot of

supplements we tried, which seemed to be ok via muscle testing, seemed to make

her worse. We also tried chiropractic manipulation which did nothing. It has

been a lot of trial and error, and we made slow progress, but the irritability

did not really go away until the chelation. The choline also helped a lot

(sorry you can't use it). Is p-serine an option? I've heard it can be helpful.

Just a few more thoughts:

Have you done the saliva test to check for adrenal fatigue?

Have her thyroid levels been checked?

Could some of the supplements be causing problems? I ask because too much of

some things can make my daughter much worse, e.g. the EMPower, zinc, B vitamins

>

> Thanks .  Yes, my daughter has food allergies.  We're

GF/CF/SoyFree/artificial colors and flavors and preservatives free/honey

free/egg free.  She takes vit C, vit A, vit E, vit B complex, Vit D3, zinc,

magnesium, seleneium, chromium, biotin, GSE, CLO and omega 3's, evening primrose

oil, MCT oil, probiotics, taurine, l-theanine, milk thistle, lithium orotate,

MB12, ACE, pycnogenal, TriEnza, plus melatonin at bedtime.  (I didn't get them

out, so I could have forgotten something.)  The SCDiet was one of the best

things we've ever done for her, but she seems to have healed enough so that

we've added back rice aand potatoes and several GF flours.  We're still pretty

much all homemade foods and not doing processed stuff, plus most foods are

organic and water is filtered.  We also do epsom salt baths for her, and avoid

fluoride and shampoos and soaps.

>  

> Phosphatidyl choline contains soy, so that one's out for us.  We just recently

had her supplements muscle tested and eliminated the biotin and the buffered C

(replaced it with a different C).  Haven't tried the EMPower plus - it's got

copper and manganese and calcium, and we've just finally gotten her copper down

into the normal range, her manganese is still very high and it seemed to be the

calcium that was a problem for her in the buffered vit C we were using, so I'm

not sure it's something I want to try.

>  

> If chelation is the final puzzle piece for your daughter, then what else have

you tried besides the supplements listed?

> Thanks

> Jan

>  

> Re: Bi-polar

> Posted by: " khieken " khieken@...   khieken

> Sat Feb 13, 2010 10:47 am (PST)

>

>

> My 9yo daughter has a bipolar diagnosis. We are early in the chelation process

(12 rounds - ALA only), but I feel that this was the final piece of the puzzle

for her. I would classify her behavior as " normal " now, but am almost scared to

admit that for fear that it will revert back to the severe irritability she

experienced for so many years.

>

> Sorry if you posted this already, but does your child have food allergies and

on a special diet? Yeast protocol? These were big for us. My daughter takes

EMPower plus (mentioned in an earlier reply), omega 3s, phosphatidyl choline,

GSE, biotin, vit c and e, zinc, probiotics. At least for us, too much of a

supplement can be just as bad as not enough.

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

My daughter's focus was never disabling, but not great either. P-choline has

helped her a lot.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > My dd is mercury toxic and we've been chelating her for 58

rounds so far. She met the counting rules, and as I didn't trust anybody at the

time, we also did the French porphyrins test and she came out " remarkable " for

mercury toxicity. She is not autistic, although she is ADHD and probably

bi-polar. We are using AC protocol and all the recommended supplements, along

with lithium orotate twice a day (4.8 mg elemental lithium). While we saw some

improvement in the beginning of chelation, either we are in the stall period or

it's too subtle to see most of the time. My question is: how many people have

cured their bi-polar through chelation? How many rounds did it take you? Were

there any supplements you felt were more helpful to you?

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Sorry - usually I can be positive and know we're on the right

path, but I'm just feeling overwhelmed this week and looking for some

reassurance that I'm not going to be looking for a residential treatment

facility in a few more years. sigh.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > thxs

> > > > > > > > > J

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

[Guest guest]

, It is nice to know there are others that have children like mine. Are

your children able to attend school?

On Feb 13, 2010, at 7:22 PM, khieken wrote:

> Hi Jan,

> We started out on meds, they didn't work well and had lots of side-effects,

switched to EMPower and had some good results but nowhere near perfect. We saw a

DAN dr. and had some testing done, tried supplementing vits/mins with bad

results. Started yeast treatment and had to stop b/c she became awful. Started

GF diet, didn't see big improvements but things got worse whenever she cheated

so we kept it going. Same with casein, egg, peanuts, artificial colors. Had

muscle testing done but it wasn't completely accurate for her. A lot of

supplements we tried, which seemed to be ok via muscle testing, seemed to make

her worse. We also tried chiropractic manipulation which did nothing. It has

been a lot of trial and error, and we made slow progress, but the irritability

did not really go away until the chelation. The choline also helped a lot (sorry

you can't use it). Is p-serine an option? I've heard it can be helpful.

>

> Just a few more thoughts:

> Have you done the saliva test to check for adrenal fatigue?

>

> Have her thyroid levels been checked?

>

> Could some of the supplements be causing problems? I ask because too much of

some things can make my daughter much worse, e.g. the EMPower, zinc, B vitamins

>

>

>

> >

> > Thanks . Yes, my daughter has food allergies. We're

GF/CF/SoyFree/artificial colors and flavors and preservatives free/honey

free/egg free. She takes vit C, vit A, vit E, vit B complex, Vit D3, zinc,

magnesium, seleneium, chromium, biotin, GSE, CLO and omega 3's, evening primrose

oil, MCT oil, probiotics, taurine, l-theanine, milk thistle, lithium orotate,

MB12, ACE, pycnogenal, TriEnza, plus melatonin at bedtime. (I didn't get them

out, so I could have forgotten something.) The SCDiet was one of the best

things we've ever done for her, but she seems to have healed enough so that

we've added back rice aand potatoes and several GF flours. We're still pretty

much all homemade foods and not doing processed stuff, plus most foods are

organic and water is filtered. We also do epsom salt baths for her, and avoid

fluoride and shampoos and soaps.

> >

> > Phosphatidyl choline contains soy, so that one's out for us. We just

recently had her supplements muscle tested and eliminated the biotin and the

buffered C (replaced it with a different C). Haven't tried the EMPower plus -

it's got copper and manganese and calcium, and we've just finally gotten her

copper down into the normal range, her manganese is still very high and it

seemed to be the calcium that was a problem for her in the buffered vit C we

were using, so I'm not sure it's something I want to try.

> >

> > If chelation is the final puzzle piece for your daughter, then what else

have you tried besides the supplements listed?

> > Thanks

> > Jan

> >

> > Re: Bi-polar

> > Posted by: " khieken " khieken@... khieken

> > Sat Feb 13, 2010 10:47 am (PST)

> >

> >

> > My 9yo daughter has a bipolar diagnosis. We are early in the chelation

process (12 rounds - ALA only), but I feel that this was the final piece of the

puzzle for her. I would classify her behavior as " normal " now, but am almost

scared to admit that for fear that it will revert back to the severe

irritability she experienced for so many years.

> >

> > Sorry if you posted this already, but does your child have food allergies

and on a special diet? Yeast protocol? These were big for us. My daughter takes

EMPower plus (mentioned in an earlier reply), omega 3s, phosphatidyl choline,

GSE, biotin, vit c and e, zinc, probiotics. At least for us, too much of a

supplement can be just as bad as not enough.

> >

> >

> >

>

>

[Guest guest]

.... and she did not react to the P-Choline?

On Feb 13, 2010, at 7:23 PM, khieken wrote:

> My daughter's focus was never disabling, but not great either. P-choline has

helped her a lot.

>

>

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > My dd is mercury toxic and we've been chelating her for 58

rounds so far. She met the counting rules, and as I didn't trust anybody at the

time, we also did the French porphyrins test and she came out " remarkable " for

mercury toxicity. She is not autistic, although she is ADHD and probably

bi-polar. We are using AC protocol and all the recommended supplements, along

with lithium orotate twice a day (4.8 mg elemental lithium). While we saw some

improvement in the beginning of chelation, either we are in the stall period or

it's too subtle to see most of the time. My question is: how many people have

cured their bi-polar through chelation? How many rounds did it take you? Were

there any supplements you felt were more helpful to you?

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Sorry - usually I can be positive and know we're on the

right path, but I'm just feeling overwhelmed this week and looking for some

reassurance that I'm not going to be looking for a residential treatment

facility in a few more years. sigh.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > thxs

> > > > > > > > > > J

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

[Guest guest]

Just a comment: I don't know if this might help U, l found both p-choline and

p-serine both free from soy, corn, egg and wheat: bodybio Phosphatidylcholine

from www.e-lyte.com and seriphos from www.interplexus.com. My kid is 1000%

SCD since a year ago and hasn't shown any negatives from this.

Isa

Enviado desde mi oficina móvil BlackBerry® de Telcel

[ ] Re: Bi-polar

Hi Jan,

We started out on meds, they didn't work well and had lots of side-effects,

switched to EMPower and had some good results but nowhere near perfect. We saw a

DAN dr. and had some testing done, tried supplementing vits/mins with bad

results. Started yeast treatment and had to stop b/c she became awful. Started

GF diet, didn't see big improvements but things got worse whenever she cheated

so we kept it going. Same with casein, egg, peanuts, artificial colors. Had

muscle testing done but it wasn't completely accurate for her. A lot of

supplements we tried, which seemed to be ok via muscle testing, seemed to make

her worse. We also tried chiropractic manipulation which did nothing. It has

been a lot of trial and error, and we made slow progress, but the irritability

did not really go away until the chelation. The choline also helped a lot

(sorry you can't use it). Is p-serine an option? I've heard it can be helpful.

Just a few more thoughts:

Have you done the saliva test to check for adrenal fatigue?

Have her thyroid levels been checked?

Could some of the supplements be causing problems? I ask because too much of

some things can make my daughter much worse, e.g. the EMPower, zinc, B vitamins

>

> Thanks .  Yes, my daughter has food allergies.  We're

GF/CF/SoyFree/artificial colors and flavors and preservatives free/honey

free/egg free.  She takes vit C, vit A, vit E, vit B complex, Vit D3, zinc,

magnesium, seleneium, chromium, biotin, GSE, CLO and omega 3's, evening primrose

oil, MCT oil, probiotics, taurine, l-theanine, milk thistle, lithium orotate,

MB12, ACE, pycnogenal, TriEnza, plus melatonin at bedtime.  (I didn't get them

out, so I could have forgotten something.)  The SCDiet was one of the best

things we've ever done for her, but she seems to have healed enough so that

we've added back rice aand potatoes and several GF flours.  We're still pretty

much all homemade foods and not doing processed stuff, plus most foods are

organic and water is filtered.  We also do epsom salt baths for her, and avoid

fluoride and shampoos and soaps.

>  

> Phosphatidyl choline contains soy, so that one's out for us.  We just recently

had her supplements muscle tested and eliminated the biotin and the buffered C

(replaced it with a different C).  Haven't tried the EMPower plus - it's got

copper and manganese and calcium, and we've just finally gotten her copper down

into the normal range, her manganese is still very high and it seemed to be the

calcium that was a problem for her in the buffered vit C we were using, so I'm

not sure it's something I want to try.

>  

> If chelation is the final puzzle piece for your daughter, then what else have

you tried besides the supplements listed?

> Thanks

> Jan

>  

> Re: Bi-polar

> Posted by: " khieken " khieken@...   khieken

> Sat Feb 13, 2010 10:47 am (PST)

>

>

> My 9yo daughter has a bipolar diagnosis. We are early in the chelation process

(12 rounds - ALA only), but I feel that this was the final piece of the puzzle

for her. I would classify her behavior as " normal " now, but am almost scared to

admit that for fear that it will revert back to the severe irritability she

experienced for so many years.

>

> Sorry if you posted this already, but does your child have food allergies and

on a special diet? Yeast protocol? These were big for us. My daughter takes

EMPower plus (mentioned in an earlier reply), omega 3s, phosphatidyl choline,

GSE, biotin, vit c and e, zinc, probiotics. At least for us, too much of a

supplement can be just as bad as not enough.

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

No, she did not. But she had a horrible reaction to choline bitartrate, another

form of choline that Truehope recommends. It took me a while to work up the

nerve to try the p-choline, but happy I finally did because it really helps her.

Yes, my kids are able to attend school. They tend to be better at school than

at home.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > My dd is mercury toxic and we've been chelating her for 58

rounds so far. She met the counting rules, and as I didn't trust anybody at the

time, we also did the French porphyrins test and she came out " remarkable " for

mercury toxicity. She is not autistic, although she is ADHD and probably

bi-polar. We are using AC protocol and all the recommended supplements, along

with lithium orotate twice a day (4.8 mg elemental lithium). While we saw some

improvement in the beginning of chelation, either we are in the stall period or

it's too subtle to see most of the time. My question is: how many people have

cured their bi-polar through chelation? How many rounds did it take you? Were

there any supplements you felt were more helpful to you?

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > Sorry - usually I can be positive and know we're on the

right path, but I'm just feeling overwhelmed this week and looking for some

reassurance that I'm not going to be looking for a residential treatment

facility in a few more years. sigh.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > thxs

> > > > > > > > > > > J

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

[Guest guest]

Have you ever considered nutritional lithium? Elimination of excitotoxins?

On Fri, Feb 12, 2010 at 7:29 AM, bruce533 <bruce.craig@...> wrote:

>

>

> She learned to tie her shoes right away, and several months later she

> learned to ride a two-wheeler. Her hair is coming in thicker now and is not

> too thin and fine anymore. She was never ever sick before, and she's

> actually been sick a couple of times since we started chelation - not as

> sick as her little sister got with the same bug, but at least a reaction to

> the virus and a fever for a couple of days that looks more normal than never

> ever being sick. She doesn't rage at others anymore, although she can still

> do pretty good screaming fits/break pencils/throw small things - but no

> longer throwing furniture at others or attacking them. I realize this is

> huge, but we've been chelating for two years and all of this was seen within

> the first 8 months or so and now we just seem to be stuck in the longest

> stall. I recently upped her ALA to 15 mg per dose (she's 56 lbs) and we're

> on the 4th round of the higher dose now, so maybe we'll start seeing more

> changes.

> J

>

>

> >

> > > My dd is mercury toxic and we've been chelating her for 58 rounds so

> far. She met the counting rules, and as I didn't trust anybody at the time,

> we also did the French porphyrins test and she came out " remarkable " for

> mercury toxicity. She is not autistic, although she is ADHD and probably

> bi-polar. We are using AC protocol and all the recommended supplements,

> along with lithium orotate twice a day (4.8 mg elemental lithium). While we

> saw some improvement in the beginning of chelation, either we are in the

> stall period or it's too subtle to see most of the time. My question is: how

> many people have cured their bi-polar through chelation? How many rounds did

> it take you? Were there any supplements you felt were more helpful to you?

> > >

> > > Sorry - usually I can be positive and know we're on the right path, but

> I'm just feeling overwhelmed this week and looking for some reassurance that

> I'm not going to be looking for a residential treatment facility in a few

> more years. sigh.

> > >

> > > thxs

> > > J

> > >

> > >

> >

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Is he too young for a complete psyche work up by CAMHS Sara?

My oldest went when he was 13 and had some CBT it really seemed to help him, at the same time I used Inositol, P5P and Zinc, this was mostly for his anxiety and OCD but it did lift his moods, he always appeared different as a baby and toddler, not exactly unhappy but never happy if you know what I mean. Have you looked at Pyroluria? I will post a link, see if any of the symptoms are familiar.

Vicky

oh has she? I didn't know that! I'll definitely have a look.I wonder if anyone knows anything in terms of biomed on this list though, that'd be good,Sara x> > > > > > >> > > >> > > > Hi, Does anyone have any knowledge or experience of bi-polar?> > > > I'm just wondering (with no knowledge/ background whatsoever) if Tom> > > > might be bi-polar.> > > > He spends long periods being v. distant (maybe months) and then comes> > > > back to us but also does definitely get manic. He's manic now.> > > > He doesn't really get hyper, but he definitely gets manic.> > > > Any thoughts???> > > > Sara x> > > > > > > >> > >> >>

[Guest guest]

Is he too young for a complete psyche work up by CAMHS Sara?

My oldest went when he was 13 and had some CBT it really seemed to help him, at the same time I used Inositol, P5P and Zinc, this was mostly for his anxiety and OCD but it did lift his moods, he always appeared different as a baby and toddler, not exactly unhappy but never happy if you know what I mean. Have you looked at Pyroluria? I will post a link, see if any of the symptoms are familiar.

Vicky

oh has she? I didn't know that! I'll definitely have a look.I wonder if anyone knows anything in terms of biomed on this list though, that'd be good,Sara x> > > > > > >> > > >> > > > Hi, Does anyone have any knowledge or experience of bi-polar?> > > > I'm just wondering (with no knowledge/ background whatsoever) if Tom> > > > might be bi-polar.> > > > He spends long periods being v. distant (maybe months) and then comes> > > > back to us but also does definitely get manic. He's manic now.> > > > He doesn't really get hyper, but he definitely gets manic.> > > > Any thoughts???> > > > Sara x> > > > > > > >> > >> >>

[Guest guest]

Is he too young for a complete psyche work up by CAMHS Sara?

My oldest went when he was 13 and had some CBT it really seemed to help him, at the same time I used Inositol, P5P and Zinc, this was mostly for his anxiety and OCD but it did lift his moods, he always appeared different as a baby and toddler, not exactly unhappy but never happy if you know what I mean. Have you looked at Pyroluria? I will post a link, see if any of the symptoms are familiar.

Vicky

oh has she? I didn't know that! I'll definitely have a look.I wonder if anyone knows anything in terms of biomed on this list though, that'd be good,Sara x> > > > > > >> > > >> > > > Hi, Does anyone have any knowledge or experience of bi-polar?> > > > I'm just wondering (with no knowledge/ background whatsoever) if Tom> > > > might be bi-polar.> > > > He spends long periods being v. distant (maybe months) and then comes> > > > back to us but also does definitely get manic. He's manic now.> > > > He doesn't really get hyper, but he definitely gets manic.> > > > Any thoughts???> > > > Sara x> > > > > > > >> > >> >>

[Guest guest]

Have you looked at the link? scroll down to symptoms.

Vicky

Vicky, I've no idea. I've never been down this path. I don't know where to start to get a diagnosis or anything. Any ideas?

[Guest guest]

Have you looked at the link? scroll down to symptoms.

Vicky

Vicky, I've no idea. I've never been down this path. I don't know where to start to get a diagnosis or anything. Any ideas?

[Guest guest]

Have you looked at the link? scroll down to symptoms.

Vicky

Vicky, I've no idea. I've never been down this path. I don't know where to start to get a diagnosis or anything. Any ideas?

[Guest guest]

Hi Sara

 

What age is Tom?  The reason I ask is that boys can have an issue that arises at puberty as they migrate from infantile brain to adult brain.. so this is sometimes why teenage boys can go from sensible adult behaviour to irrational two year old tantrums.

 

My eldest has had a problem with his migration.. and it is often as if there are two personalities.. with lots of highs and lows

 

Tracey

 

Hi, Does anyone have any knowledge or experience of bi-polar?I'm just wondering (with no knowledge/ background whatsoever) if Tom might be bi-polar.He spends long periods being v. distant (maybe months) and then comes

back to us but also does definitely get manic. He's manic now.He doesn't really get hyper, but he definitely gets manic.Any thoughts???Sara x