Re: U.S. Department of Justice opens investigation on Judge Rotenberg Cente

February 23, 2010

We have seen this before. They will drag in a bunch of parents and even some

former students that have been convinced that their methods work. These people

testify that the procedures are " therapy " and have helped them.

Several years ago at the 's Law hearing in NJ I pointed out that while

many of these parents had shown pictures of their smiling, happy children, the

most recent pictures of and our son had been taken by a medical

examiner.

U.S. Department of Justice opens investigation on Judge Rotenberg Cente

2/23/2010

The Judge Rotenberg Center (JRC) is probably the best known and most

controversial special education school in the world. The JRC describes itself

as:

The JUDGE ROTENBERG CENTER (JRC) is a special needs school in Canton,

Massachusetts serving ages 3-adult. For 38 years JRC has provided very effective

education and treatment to both emotionally disturbed students with conduct,

behavior, emotional, and/or psychiatric problems and developmentally delayed

students with autistic-like behaviors. Plese click on the link below to read

the full article.

http://leftbrainrig htbrain.co. uk/2010/02/ u-s-department- of-justice-

opens-investigat ion-on-judge- rotenberg- cente/

..

February 23, 2010

Ricky,

Every mental case who is opposed to curing autism also opposes Judge Rotenberg.

Show me you're different than these morons and tell me your solution on how to

help these kids. I always ask this question and nobody has ever replied. Will

you be the first?

>

> We have seen this before. They will drag in a bunch of parents and even some

former students that have been convinced that their methods work. These people

testify that the procedures are " therapy " and have helped them.

> Several years ago at the 's Law hearing in NJ I pointed out that while

many of these parents had shown pictures of their smiling, happy children, the

most recent pictures of and our son had been taken by a medical

examiner.

>

> U.S. Department of Justice opens investigation on Judge Rotenberg Cente

>

> 2/23/2010

> The Judge Rotenberg Center (JRC) is probably the best known and most

controversial special education school in the world. The JRC describes itself

as:

>

> The JUDGE ROTENBERG CENTER (JRC) is a special needs school in Canton,

Massachusetts serving ages 3-adult. For 38 years JRC has provided very effective

education and treatment to both emotionally disturbed students with conduct,

behavior, emotional, and/or psychiatric problems and developmentally delayed

students with autistic-like behaviors. Plese click on the link below to read

the full article.

> http://leftbrainrig htbrain.co. uk/2010/02/ u-s-department- of-justice-

opens-investigat ion-on-judge- rotenberg- cente/

>

> .

>

February 24, 2010

Dang, almost 9000 people on this list and you ask little old ME for an

answer? I'm flattered.

I do know that while we are trying to cure these kids we should be

treating them with compassion and understanding, and not zapping them

with mini-tazers, hold them in restraints until they pass out or die. I

also know that when parents like you consider their children " brain dead

vegetables " , they probably think any school or other facility is going

to think of their kid the same way.

Now, what do you think a school should be doing to help these kids?

> >

> > We have seen this before. They will drag in a bunch of parents and

even some former students that have been convinced that their methods

work. These people testify that the procedures are " therapy " and have

helped them.

> > Several years ago at the 's Law hearing in NJ I pointed out

that while many of these parents had shown pictures of their smiling,

happy children, the most recent pictures of and our son

had been taken by a medical examiner.

> >

> > U.S. Department of Justice opens investigation on Judge Rotenberg

Cente

> >

> > 2/23/2010

> > The Judge Rotenberg Center (JRC) is probably the best known and most

controversial special education school in the world. The JRC describes

itself as:

> >

> > The JUDGE ROTENBERG CENTER (JRC) is a special needs school in

Canton, Massachusetts serving ages 3-adult. For 38 years JRC has

provided very effective education and treatment to both emotionally

disturbed students with conduct, behavior, emotional, and/or psychiatric

problems and developmentally delayed students with autistic-like

behaviors. Plese click on the link below to read the full article.

> > http://leftbrainrig htbrain.co. uk/2010/02/ u-s-department-

of-justice- opens-investigat ion-on-judge- rotenberg- cente/

> >

> > .

> >

February 25, 2010

Rick, My son WAS a brain dead vegetable until I chelated him and he started to

become human again, the way he was for his first ten months of life before

thimerosal scrambled his brain. Having been an employee at one of those asylums

(schools), I can assure you that the children who are placed there ARE

considered to be brain dead vegetables and are treated as such.

Kids who go to JRC are sent there because their behavior is impossible for

anyone to control and they are a danger to themselves. Those shocks can prevent

death since the kids are not slamming their skulls into cement or trying to

pluck their eyeballs out. Those shocks are better for the kids than doing

nothing, which is what you propose. Of course, checking for mercury and

chelating it out of their brains if it's there would be a better solution. In

the meantime, I'd rather have a live son who was shocked than a dead one who was

allowed to crack his skull open on the pavement.

> > >

> > > We have seen this before. They will drag in a bunch of parents and

> even some former students that have been convinced that their methods

> work. These people testify that the procedures are " therapy " and have

> helped them.

> > > Several years ago at the 's Law hearing in NJ I pointed out

> that while many of these parents had shown pictures of their smiling,

> happy children, the most recent pictures of and our son

> had been taken by a medical examiner.

> > >

> > > U.S. Department of Justice opens investigation on Judge Rotenberg

> Cente

> > >

> > > 2/23/2010

> > > The Judge Rotenberg Center (JRC) is probably the best known and most

> controversial special education school in the world. The JRC describes

> itself as:

> > >

> > > The JUDGE ROTENBERG CENTER (JRC) is a special needs school in

> Canton, Massachusetts serving ages 3-adult. For 38 years JRC has

> provided very effective education and treatment to both emotionally

> disturbed students with conduct, behavior, emotional, and/or psychiatric

> problems and developmentally delayed students with autistic-like

> behaviors. Plese click on the link below to read the full article.

> > > http://leftbrainrig htbrain.co. uk/2010/02/ u-s-department-

> of-justice- opens-investigat ion-on-judge- rotenberg- cente/

> > >

> > > .

> > >

February 25, 2010

" Brain dead vegetable " ? What is the DSM IV code for that one?

Remember the Terri Schiavo case in Florida a few years ago? The ONLY

person who claimed that she was a " brain dead vegetable " was her

husband. Her parents and siblings never referred to her as a " brain dead

vegetable " . Her husband wanted the plug pulled so he could collect the

life insurance, marry his girl friend and go on living la dolce vita.

Did you bother to actually check the link in the original post?

http://leftbrainrightbrain.co.uk/2010/02/u-s-department-of-justice-opens\

-investigation-on-judge-rotenberg-cente/#ixzz0gZY0azfM

<http://leftbrainrightbrain.co.uk/2010/02/u-s-department-of-justice-open\

s-investigation-on-judge-rotenberg-cente/#ixzz0gZY0azfM>

It read in part;

" A combination of mechanical restraint and GED skin shock is also

used to administer a consequence to students that attempt to remove the

GED from their bodies. In instances where this combined aversive

approach is used, the student, over a period of time specified on his or

her behavior program, is mechanically restrained on a platform and GED

shocks are applied at varying intervals. … An example of this is

found on one NYS student's behavior program; a consequence for

pulling a fire alarm is to receive 5 GED [shocks], over a 10-minute

period, while being restrained on a four-point board. " That isn't

for doing anything self-injurius, that was for pulling a fire alarm. It

was pure, after the fact punishment.

Another event was also described;

" … one young man got tired of picking out matching shapes on a

computer screen. But his teacher demanded that he continue and pinched

him on the palm for disobeying. The young man …made a guttural noise

of protest and tried to get up. In a second, two staffers had thrown him

face down on the floor. This only made him more agitated. Then came a

squirt in the face with ammonia water. The man spent a minute on the

floor, trying to move and protest, but was restrained by one

staffer's knee in his back and another's grip on his arm. "

That also was not a life threatening event. In fact, the staffer helped

exacerbate the situation. All the young man wanted to do was express

that he was tired of picking shapes and he ended up getting his hand

pinched and then prone restrained and had ammonia squrted in his face.

Each staff action was accelerating the situation.

I'm sure that if someone did all that to you for any reason, you would

be fighting mad too.

> > > >

> > > > We have seen this before. They will drag in a bunch of parents

and

> > even some former students that have been convinced that their

methods

> > work. These people testify that the procedures are " therapy " and

have

> > helped them.

> > > > Several years ago at the 's Law hearing in NJ I pointed

out

> > that while many of these parents had shown pictures of their

smiling,

> > happy children, the most recent pictures of and our son

> > had been taken by a medical examiner.

> > > >

> > > > U.S. Department of Justice opens investigation on Judge

Rotenberg

> > Cente

> > > >

> > > > 2/23/2010

> > > > The Judge Rotenberg Center (JRC) is probably the best known and

most

> > controversial special education school in the world. The JRC

describes

> > itself as:

> > > >

> > > > The JUDGE ROTENBERG CENTER (JRC) is a special needs school in

> > Canton, Massachusetts serving ages 3-adult. For 38 years JRC has

> > provided very effective education and treatment to both emotionally

> > disturbed students with conduct, behavior, emotional, and/or

psychiatric

> > problems and developmentally delayed students with autistic-like

> > behaviors. Plese click on the link below to read the full article.

> > > > http://leftbrainrig htbrain.co. uk/2010/02/ u-s-department-

> > of-justice- opens-investigat ion-on-judge- rotenberg- cente/

> > > >

> > > > .

> > > >

February 25, 2010

And would you prefer that someone held your kid in a prone restraint,

unable to breathe, until he passed out or died? Or just until the lack

of oxygen caused permanent brain damage?

>

> Rick, My son WAS a brain dead vegetable

February 25, 2010

" Brain dead vegetable " ? What is the DSM IV code for that?

I suspect there are a lot of parents on this list who's children are or

were as extremely autistic as your son, but I doubt that any, other than

you, ever referred to them as " brain dead vegetables " .

Did you bother to read the story in the link

http://leftbrainrightbrain.co.uk/2010/02/u-s-department-of-justice-opens\

-investigation-on-judge-rotenberg-cente/#ixzz0gZlExLtC

<http://leftbrainrightbrain.co.uk/2010/02/u-s-department-of-justice-open\

s-investigation-on-judge-rotenberg-cente/#ixzz0gZlExLtC> ?

… An example of this is found on one NYS student's behavior

program; a consequence for pulling a fire alarm is to receive 5 GED

[shocks], over a 10-minute period, while being restrained on a

four-point board. "

That wasn't to prevent any injury, it was an after the fact punishment.

Another part read; " … one young man got tired of picking out

matching shapes on a computer screen. But his teacher demanded that he

continue and pinched him on the palm for disobeying. The young man

…made a guttural noise of protest and tried to get up. In a second,

two staffers had thrown him face down on the floor. This only made him

more agitated. Then came a squirt in the face with ammonia water. The

man spent a minute on the floor, trying to move and protest, but was

restrained by one staffer's knee in his back and another's grip

on his arm. "

In this case, the staff continually exacerbated the situation, perhaps

to justify the abuse. I'm sure that if someone pinched your hand,

sprayed ammonia in your face and held you down in a prone position, you

would get more agitated rather than calming down.

> > > >

> > > > We have seen this before. They will drag in a bunch of parents

and

> > even some former students that have been convinced that their

methods

> > work. These people testify that the procedures are " therapy " and

have

> > helped them.

> > > > Several years ago at the 's Law hearing in NJ I pointed

out

> > that while many of these parents had shown pictures of their

smiling,

> > happy children, the most recent pictures of and our son

> > had been taken by a medical examiner.

> > > >

> > > > U.S. Department of Justice opens investigation on Judge

Rotenberg

> > Cente

> > > >

> > > > 2/23/2010

> > > > The Judge Rotenberg Center (JRC) is probably the best known and

most

> > controversial special education school in the world. The JRC

describes

> > itself as:

> > > >

> > > > The JUDGE ROTENBERG CENTER (JRC) is a special needs school in

> > Canton, Massachusetts serving ages 3-adult. For 38 years JRC has

> > provided very effective education and treatment to both emotionally

> > disturbed students with conduct, behavior, emotional, and/or

psychiatric

> > problems and developmentally delayed students with autistic-like

> > behaviors. Plese click on the link below to read the full article.

> > > > http://leftbrainrig htbrain.co. uk/2010/02/ u-s-department-

> > of-justice- opens-investigat ion-on-judge- rotenberg- cente/

> > > >

> > > > .

> > > >

February 25, 2010

Rick, I'd rather have my kid shocked than held in restraints. But, since

that's not my only options, I'll choose to listen to Andy and cure him instead.

> >

> > Rick, My son WAS a brain dead vegetable

>

February 25, 2010

Rick,

You probably don't realize that every word on that moronic blog is a carefully

considered lie. All you have to do is look at everything that is written there

and you should be able to discover the dishonesty.

> > > > >

> > > > > We have seen this before. They will drag in a bunch of parents

> and

> > > even some former students that have been convinced that their

> methods

> > > work. These people testify that the procedures are " therapy " and

> have

> > > helped them.

> > > > > Several years ago at the 's Law hearing in NJ I pointed

> out

> > > that while many of these parents had shown pictures of their

> smiling,

> > > happy children, the most recent pictures of and our son

>

> > > had been taken by a medical examiner.

> > > > >

> > > > > U.S. Department of Justice opens investigation on Judge

> Rotenberg

> > > Cente

> > > > >

> > > > > 2/23/2010

> > > > > The Judge Rotenberg Center (JRC) is probably the best known and

> most

> > > controversial special education school in the world. The JRC

> describes

> > > itself as:

> > > > >

> > > > > The JUDGE ROTENBERG CENTER (JRC) is a special needs school in

> > > Canton, Massachusetts serving ages 3-adult. For 38 years JRC has

> > > provided very effective education and treatment to both emotionally

> > > disturbed students with conduct, behavior, emotional, and/or

> psychiatric

> > > problems and developmentally delayed students with autistic-like

> > > behaviors. Plese click on the link below to read the full article.

> > > > > http://leftbrainrig htbrain.co. uk/2010/02/ u-s-department-

> > > of-justice- opens-investigat ion-on-judge- rotenberg- cente/

> > > > >

> > > > > .

> > > > >

February 25, 2010

How is it that everything that isn't written by you is a lie and

moronic?

> > > > > >

> > > > > > We have seen this before. They will drag in a bunch of

parents

> > and

> > > > even some former students that have been convinced that their

> > methods

> > > > work. These people testify that the procedures are " therapy " and

> > have

> > > > helped them.

> > > > > > Several years ago at the 's Law hearing in NJ I

pointed

> > out

> > > > that while many of these parents had shown pictures of their

> > smiling,

> > > > happy children, the most recent pictures of and our son

> >

> > > > had been taken by a medical examiner.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > U.S. Department of Justice opens investigation on Judge

> > Rotenberg

> > > > Cente

> > > > > >

> > > > > > 2/23/2010

> > > > > > The Judge Rotenberg Center (JRC) is probably the best known

and

> > most

> > > > controversial special education school in the world. The JRC

> > describes

> > > > itself as:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > The JUDGE ROTENBERG CENTER (JRC) is a special needs school

in

> > > > Canton, Massachusetts serving ages 3-adult. For 38 years JRC has

> > > > provided very effective education and treatment to both

emotionally

> > > > disturbed students with conduct, behavior, emotional, and/or

> > psychiatric

> > > > problems and developmentally delayed students with autistic-like

> > > > behaviors. Plese click on the link below to read the full

article.

> > > > > > http://leftbrainrig htbrain.co. uk/2010/02/ u-s-department-

> > > > of-justice- opens-investigat ion-on-judge- rotenberg- cente/

> > > > > >

> > > > > > .

> > > > > >

February 25, 2010

And if he is never completely cured? Are you planning to put an

invisible fence around your yard and keep him in a dog collar all of his

life?

> > >

> > > Rick, My son WAS a brain dead vegetable

> >

February 25, 2010

Leitch's blog is not the same as " everything " . Please stop embarassing

yourself with unintelligent remarks here.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > We have seen this before. They will drag in a bunch of

> parents

> > > and

> > > > > even some former students that have been convinced that their

> > > methods

> > > > > work. These people testify that the procedures are " therapy " and

> > > have

> > > > > helped them.

> > > > > > > Several years ago at the 's Law hearing in NJ I

> pointed

> > > out

> > > > > that while many of these parents had shown pictures of their

> > > smiling,

> > > > > happy children, the most recent pictures of and our son

> > >

> > > > > had been taken by a medical examiner.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > U.S. Department of Justice opens investigation on Judge

> > > Rotenberg

> > > > > Cente

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > 2/23/2010

> > > > > > > The Judge Rotenberg Center (JRC) is probably the best known

> and

> > > most

> > > > > controversial special education school in the world. The JRC

> > > describes

> > > > > itself as:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > The JUDGE ROTENBERG CENTER (JRC) is a special needs school

> in

> > > > > Canton, Massachusetts serving ages 3-adult. For 38 years JRC has

> > > > > provided very effective education and treatment to both

> emotionally

> > > > > disturbed students with conduct, behavior, emotional, and/or

> > > psychiatric

> > > > > problems and developmentally delayed students with autistic-like

> > > > > behaviors. Plese click on the link below to read the full

> article.

> > > > > > > http://leftbrainrig htbrain.co. uk/2010/02/ u-s-department-

> > > > > of-justice- opens-investigat ion-on-judge- rotenberg- cente/

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > .

> > > > > > >

February 25, 2010

Rick,

I'm glad to hear that works for your son but I'll find a different solution.

> > > >

> > > > Rick, My son WAS a brain dead vegetable

> > >

February 25, 2010

Try to remember who said what. You said " I'd rather have my kid shocked

than held in restraints " .

I asked what you plan to do if you can't cure him to your satisfaction.

> > > > >

> > > > > Rick, My son WAS a brain dead vegetable

> > > >

February 26, 2010

AND EVERY PERSON WHO IS TRYING TO CURE AUTISM IS OPPOSED TO ROTENBERG,

SO WHAT IS YOUR POINT?

> >

> > We have seen this before. They will drag in a bunch of parents and

even some former students that have been convinced that their methods

work. These people testify that the procedures are " therapy " and have

helped them.

> > Several years ago at the 's Law hearing in NJ I pointed out

that while many of these parents had shown pictures of their smiling,

happy children, the most recent pictures of and our son

had been taken by a medical examiner.

> >

> > U.S. Department of Justice opens investigation on Judge Rotenberg

Cente

> >

> > 2/23/2010

> > The Judge Rotenberg Center (JRC) is probably the best known and most

controversial special education school in the world. The JRC describes

itself as:

> >

> > The JUDGE ROTENBERG CENTER (JRC) is a special needs school in

Canton, Massachusetts serving ages 3-adult. For 38 years JRC has

provided very effective education and treatment to both emotionally

disturbed students with conduct, behavior, emotional, and/or psychiatric

problems and developmentally delayed students with autistic-like

behaviors. Plese click on the link below to read the full article.

> > http://leftbrainrig htbrain.co. uk/2010/02/ u-s-department-

of-justice- opens-investigat ion-on-judge- rotenberg- cente/

> >

> > .

> >

February 26, 2010

I think you might be a bit confused as to what the term " Brain Dead "

actually means. So I am going to let the AMA explain it to you.

http://jama.ama-assn.org/cgi/content/full/301/11/1172

<http://jama.ama-assn.org/cgi/content/full/301/11/1172>

SUMMARY OF THE ORIGINAL ARTICLE

A Definition of Irreversible Coma: Report of the Ad Hoc Committee of the

Harvard Medical School to Examine the Definition of Brain Death

Ad Hoc Committee of the Harvard Medical School to Examine the Definition

of Brain Death

JAMA. 1968;205(6):337-340.

This landmark classic article was the first to quantitatively define the

clinical and laboratory criteria used to measure the presence of brain

death. The study included " only those comatose individuals who have no

discernible central nervous system activity. " Criteria to establish the

presence of irreversible coma included (1) unreceptivity and

unresponsitivity; (2) no movements or breathing; (3) no reflexes (brain

stem); and (4) flat electroencephalogram. These criteria are still

considered to be reliable and acceptable by the medical community and

have become established into law, which states that brain death is

equivalent to death and that all artificial support systems sustaining

heart, respiratory, and metabolic functions can be legally stopped.

Pay real close attention to the simple terms that you can understand;

irreversible, no movements or breathing, no reflexes.

> > > >

> > > > We have seen this before. They will drag in a bunch of parents

and

> > even some former students that have been convinced that their

methods

> > work. These people testify that the procedures are " therapy " and

have

> > helped them.

> > > > Several years ago at the 's Law hearing in NJ I pointed

out

> > that while many of these parents had shown pictures of their

smiling,

> > happy children, the most recent pictures of and our son

> > had been taken by a medical examiner.

> > > >

> > > > U.S. Department of Justice opens investigation on Judge

Rotenberg

> > Cente

> > > >

> > > > 2/23/2010

> > > > The Judge Rotenberg Center (JRC) is probably the best known and

most

> > controversial special education school in the world. The JRC

describes

> > itself as:

> > > >

> > > > The JUDGE ROTENBERG CENTER (JRC) is a special needs school in

> > Canton, Massachusetts serving ages 3-adult. For 38 years JRC has

> > provided very effective education and treatment to both emotionally

> > disturbed students with conduct, behavior, emotional, and/or

psychiatric

> > problems and developmentally delayed students with autistic-like

> > behaviors. Plese click on the link below to read the full article.

> > > > http://leftbrainrig htbrain.co. uk/2010/02/ u-s-department-

> > of-justice- opens-investigat ion-on-judge- rotenberg- cente/

> > > >

> > > > .

> > > >

February 26, 2010

Any chance you could take this off-list?

TJ

________________________________

From: rick_tallman1 <rick_tallman1@...>

Sent: Fri, February 26, 2010 9:29:11 AM

Subject: [ ] Re: U.S. Department of Justice opens investigation on

Judge Rotenberg Cente

Â

AND EVERY PERSON WHO IS TRYING TO CURE AUTISM IS OPPOSED TO ROTENBERG,

SO WHAT IS YOUR POINT?

> >

> > We have seen this before. They will drag in a bunch of parents and

even some former students that have been convinced that their methods

work. These people testify that the procedures are " therapy " and have

helped them.

> > Several years ago at the 's Law hearing in NJ I pointed out

that while many of these parents had shown pictures of their smiling,

happy children, the most recent pictures of and our son

had been taken by a medical examiner.

> >

> > U.S. Department of Justice opens investigation on Judge Rotenberg

Cente

> >

> > 2/23/2010

> > The Judge Rotenberg Center (JRC) is probably the best known and most

controversial special education school in the world. The JRC describes

itself as:

> >

> > The JUDGE ROTENBERG CENTER (JRC) is a special needs school in

Canton, Massachusetts serving ages 3-adult. For 38 years JRC has

provided very effective education and treatment to both emotionally

disturbed students with conduct, behavior, emotional, and/or psychiatric

problems and developmentally delayed students with autistic-like

behaviors. Plese click on the link below to read the full article.

> > http://leftbrainrig htbrain.co. uk/2010/02/ u-s-department-

of-justice- opens-investigat ion-on-judge- rotenberg- cente/

> >

> > .

> >

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