Re: Copper Reduction Questions

[Guest guest]

Why can't you do ALA?

>

> Hi all,

>

> I am new to this board. A couple months ago, blood testing showed my 3.5 year

old (severe focus/attention issues and sensory-seeker, delayed social, receptive

language, behavior issues) has very high copper levels, and doc was concerned.

Even though his zinc was also fairly high, our DAN instructed us to supplement

with 20 mg of zinc at night. (I am doing our DD hair elements test next week.)

We have been BIG nut eaters, and I've cut that out as well - except my half

non-working brain forgot to take out the organic almond milk we give him at

night in place of regular milk.

>

> I took out the almond milk finally last week, but I have yet to find a rice

milk with NO calcium (since my son drinks it at night, and we are supplementing

with zinc at night). Any advice? DS does not like hemp or coconut milk.

>

> Do I need to reduce copper *before* we can chelate? I know for sure that I

cannot do ALA.

>

> Has anyone had luck with molybdenum? From my reading it seems to be a metal,

which makes me nervous. Is it safe for our children? I have also read milk

thistle to be a great supplement for liver health in high copper kids.

>

> I was supposed to do another blood test 8 weeks after I started the zinc, to

see if the copper has come down. Well, its been 8 weeks, and I'm just now

pulling the almond milk, thanks to my silly mistake. Dont want to poke my son

needlessly, so I'm going to wait another 4-8 weeks or so before the blood test.

Anyone have experience on HOW LONG this takes, using supplements, to reduce

copper?

>

> Thanks for your help.

>

> a

>

[Guest guest]

I read in the files that ALA produces a natural buildup of copper in the body.

Don't do it if you already have a copper issue.

> >

> > Hi all,

> >

> > I am new to this board. A couple months ago, blood testing showed my 3.5

year old (severe focus/attention issues and sensory-seeker, delayed social,

receptive language, behavior issues) has very high copper levels, and doc was

concerned. Even though his zinc was also fairly high, our DAN instructed us to

supplement with 20 mg of zinc at night. (I am doing our DD hair elements test

next week.) We have been BIG nut eaters, and I've cut that out as well - except

my half non-working brain forgot to take out the organic almond milk we give him

at night in place of regular milk.

> >

> > I took out the almond milk finally last week, but I have yet to find a rice

milk with NO calcium (since my son drinks it at night, and we are supplementing

with zinc at night). Any advice? DS does not like hemp or coconut milk.

> >

> > Do I need to reduce copper *before* we can chelate? I know for sure that I

cannot do ALA.

> >

> > Has anyone had luck with molybdenum? From my reading it seems to be a metal,

which makes me nervous. Is it safe for our children? I have also read milk

thistle to be a great supplement for liver health in high copper kids.

> >

> > I was supposed to do another blood test 8 weeks after I started the zinc, to

see if the copper has come down. Well, its been 8 weeks, and I'm just now

pulling the almond milk, thanks to my silly mistake. Dont want to poke my son

needlessly, so I'm going to wait another 4-8 weeks or so before the blood test.

Anyone have experience on HOW LONG this takes, using supplements, to reduce

copper?

> >

> > Thanks for your help.

> >

> > a

> >

>

[Guest guest]

a,

Our son has had a problem regulating copper since all this started, and we

have supplemented with extra zinc ever since to keep his copper levels in

check. We are chelating per AC Protocol using ALA only.

Haven

[Guest guest]

Thanks Haven, good to know. Do you test the copper regularly to make sure its

within normal limits? I believe high copper may be one of our main issues

resulting in developmental delay and hyperactivity. I don't know why his body

isn't processing it.

a

>

> a,

>

> Our son has had a problem regulating copper since all this started, and we

> have supplemented with extra zinc ever since to keep his copper levels in

> check. We are chelating per AC Protocol using ALA only.

>

> Haven

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

He continues on extra zinc, and we check copper/zinc ration at least twice a

year.

Haven

[Guest guest]

Scullcap helps balance copper zinc ratio,also the homeopathic remedy cuprum

met does same thing,i put our son on scull cap and he is def calmer,get it

from pure herbs good brand,you could google joyous messenger website the

author tenna merchent speaks about copper zinc imbalance

On Tue, Mar 22, 2011 at 4:00 PM, a <ericarbak@...> wrote:

>

>

> Thanks Haven, good to know. Do you test the copper regularly to make sure

> its within normal limits? I believe high copper may be one of our main

> issues resulting in developmental delay and hyperactivity. I don't know why

> his body isn't processing it.

>

> a

>

>

>

> >

> > a,

> >

> > Our son has had a problem regulating copper since all this started, and

> we

> > have supplemented with extra zinc ever since to keep his copper levels in

> > check. We are chelating per AC Protocol using ALA only.

> >

> > Haven

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

We bagan chelaltion w high copper. Using molybednum and zinc brought the copper

down to the point to where we actually supp a bit now. ALA for chelation did not

seem to affect copper level that much for us.

> > >

> > > a,

> > >

> > > Our son has had a problem regulating copper since all this started, and

> > we

> > > have supplemented with extra zinc ever since to keep his copper levels in

> > > check. We are chelating per AC Protocol using ALA only.

> > >

> > > Haven

> > >

> > >

> > >

[Guest guest]

how did you determine a copper/zinc imbalance??

From: mbrookh <mbrookh@...>

Subject: [ ] Re: Copper Reduction Questions

Date: Thursday, March 24, 2011, 7:27 AM

 

We bagan chelaltion w high copper. Using molybednum and zinc brought the copper

down to the point to where we actually supp a bit now. ALA for chelation did not

seem to affect copper level that much for us.

> > >

> > > a,

> > >

> > > Our son has had a problem regulating copper since all this started, and

> > we

> > > have supplemented with extra zinc ever since to keep his copper levels in

> > > check. We are chelating per AC Protocol using ALA only.

> > >

> > > Haven

> > >

> > >

> > >

[Guest guest]

blood is how we determined it. Plasma and serum. We were looking for about a

1:1 relationship. Although his initial copper:zinc imbalance was quite large,

we did not notice behavioral changes once we got the numbers closer in balance.

It was quite easy for me to get his levels 'normal', with oral molybdenum and

oral zinc picolinate. Took about 4 months.

Pam

> > > >

> > > > a,

> > > >

> > > > Our son has had a problem regulating copper since all this started, and

> > > we

> > > > have supplemented with extra zinc ever since to keep his copper levels

in

> > > > check. We are chelating per AC Protocol using ALA only.

> > > >

> > > > Haven

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

[Guest guest]

Thank you . Enormously helpful.

a

> > > >

> > > > a,

> > > >

> > > > Our son has had a problem regulating copper since all this started, and

> > > we

> > > > have supplemented with extra zinc ever since to keep his copper levels

in

> > > > check. We are chelating per AC Protocol using ALA only.

> > > >

> > > > Haven

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

[Guest guest]

My son used to have very high copper.

We supplement with zinc monomethionine and molybdenum and have stuck with this

for years. His zinc/copper ratio is now very good, but ALA chelation did upset

this for a long time.

Consider switching to DMPS for about 30 rounds. Once you get a lot of mercury

out, the copper will begin to improve and you can resume ALA chelation with far

fewer problems.

Steve

> > > >

> > > > a,

> > > >

> > > > Our son has had a problem regulating copper since all this started, and

> > > we

> > > > have supplemented with extra zinc ever since to keep his copper levels

in

> > > > check. We are chelating per AC Protocol using ALA only.

> > > >

> > > > Haven

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

[Guest guest]

Thanks Steve. How much zinc and molybdenum?

a

> > > > >

> > > > > a,

> > > > >

> > > > > Our son has had a problem regulating copper since all this started,

and

> > > > we

> > > > > have supplemented with extra zinc ever since to keep his copper levels

in

> > > > > check. We are chelating per AC Protocol using ALA only.

> > > > >

> > > > > Haven

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

[Guest guest]

We give 25mg a day of zinc monomethionine most days and 300mcg molybdenum, but

give more during or immediately after a round of chelation.

In the past when copper was a huge issue for us we would give 25-30mg zinc and

500mcg moly twice a day. We also used zinc sulphate cream liberally on top of

this.

It took years to normalise copper and ALA chelation really made things

difficult. (It also helped, but temporary side-effects could be very taxing)

In retrospect, I think all people fighting mercury problems should start

chelation with DMPS when possible because

1: the side effects are milder

2: the dosing intervals are longer (8 hours compared to 3 for ALA), so sleep is

less disrupted for both the parent and the child. As the child's functioning

improves (as it will after continued DMPS chelation), both parent and child will

have more energy and better health to face ALA chelation.

3: As the DMPS reduces mercury, copper will also begin to stablise, so

side-effects from ALA chelation will be milder.

I reckon about 30 rounds of DMPS, then switching to ALA/DMSA would work well for

most people

Steve

> > > > > >

> > > > > > a,

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Our son has had a problem regulating copper since all this started,

and

> > > > > we

> > > > > > have supplemented with extra zinc ever since to keep his copper

levels in

> > > > > > check. We are chelating per AC Protocol using ALA only.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Haven

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

[Guest guest]

Thanks Steve.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > a,

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Our son has had a problem regulating copper since all this

started, and

> > > > > > we

> > > > > > > have supplemented with extra zinc ever since to keep his copper

levels in

> > > > > > > check. We are chelating per AC Protocol using ALA only.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Haven

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

[Guest guest]

Steve -- you have an excellent point.

My health was so compromised, that in 4 years, I only have in about 45

rounds of chelation. Trying to teach full-time on such low energy reserves

meant I didn't get much else done.

I would lose 3 nights sleep a week and I was already chronically exhausted.

Plus, I'd forget dosing and have to stop rounds. I'd be at almost 100

rounds, if I didn't have to stop dosing for all the times I forgot. I did

set my phone with an alarm, but sometimes would forget it or not hear it in

my purse or over the kid's noise. I don't have to you that short-term memory

problems are huge for mercury toxics.

It would have significantly helped me to just have to dose 3 times a day

compared to 7 with the DMPS. By now, my health is probably 25-30% improved.

I chelate 3 days and 2 nights, so I don't have to face as much sleep

loss, and I've got enough mercury out, that I can sometimes fall back asleep.

No matter what I did for those first years, I would not fall asleep after I

woke up after my middle of the night dose. Sometimes Melatonin and other

things would help, but often I became use to it or didn't have the right

dose, so it was ineffective (I tried many doses).

I still usually face one night of sleeplessness, which is much better than

the 3 nights from my early chelating days. I wish I'd had your

recommendation back then. I'd read about it of course, but it wasn't often

used, and

I believe you needed a prescription to get it. A lot of us chelate without

a prescription or doctor's help. Do you know of any place it can be

purchased without one? I'd be open to considering rotating a round of that

with

a round of DMSA/ALA chelation, because it would help me get more rounds in

so I could make more progress.

Thank you,

Rosegvr

[Guest guest]

this doesn't happen if you use dmsa with it. Ala only slows the excretion of

copper it doesn't make it higher. Taking molybdenum and zinc daily as per

Amalgam Illness by Andy Cutler will reduce the copper as well as proper frequent

low dose chelation with dmsa/ala.

We've had many high copper kids on our list who have corrected their copper in

this way.

A LOT of mercury people retain copper.

Get rid of the mercury and the copper will go down

Jan

> >

> > >

> > > Hi all,

> > >

> > > I am new to this board. A couple months ago, blood testing showed my 3.5

year old (severe focus/attention issues and sensory-seeker, delayed social,

receptive language, behavior issues) has very high copper levels, and doc was

concerned. Even though his zinc was also fairly high, our DAN instructed us to

supplement with 20 mg of zinc at night. (I am doing our DD hair elements test

next week.) We have been BIG nut eaters, and I've cut that out as well - except

my half non-working brain forgot to take out the organic almond milk we give him

at night in place of regular milk.

> > >

> > > I took out the almond milk finally last week, but I have yet to find a

rice milk with NO calcium (since my son drinks it at night, and we are

supplementing with zinc at night). Any advice? DS does not like hemp or coconut

milk.

> > >

> > > Do I need to reduce copper *before* we can chelate? I know for sure that I

cannot do ALA.

> > >

> > > Has anyone had luck with molybdenum? From my reading it seems to be a

metal, which makes me nervous. Is it safe for our children? I have also read

milk thistle to be a great supplement for liver health in high copper kids.

> > >

> > > I was supposed to do another blood test 8 weeks after I started the zinc,

to see if the copper has come down. Well, its been 8 weeks, and I'm just now

pulling the almond milk, thanks to my silly mistake. Dont want to poke my son

needlessly, so I'm going to wait another 4-8 weeks or so before the blood test.

Anyone have experience on HOW LONG this takes, using supplements, to reduce

copper?

> > >

> > > Thanks for your help.

> > >

> > > a

> > >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Thanks Jan, good to know. Receiving results from our DD hair elements test early

next week. Looking forward to seeing what's really going on so we can move

forward if necessary.

a

> > > >

> > > > Hi all,

> > > >

> > > > I am new to this board. A couple months ago, blood testing showed my 3.5

year old (severe focus/attention issues and sensory-seeker, delayed social,

receptive language, behavior issues) has very high copper levels, and doc was

concerned. Even though his zinc was also fairly high, our DAN instructed us to

supplement with 20 mg of zinc at night. (I am doing our DD hair elements test

next week.) We have been BIG nut eaters, and I've cut that out as well - except

my half non-working brain forgot to take out the organic almond milk we give him

at night in place of regular milk.

> > > >

> > > > I took out the almond milk finally last week, but I have yet to find a

rice milk with NO calcium (since my son drinks it at night, and we are

supplementing with zinc at night). Any advice? DS does not like hemp or coconut

milk.

> > > >

> > > > Do I need to reduce copper *before* we can chelate? I know for sure that

I cannot do ALA.

> > > >

> > > > Has anyone had luck with molybdenum? From my reading it seems to be a

metal, which makes me nervous. Is it safe for our children? I have also read

milk thistle to be a great supplement for liver health in high copper kids.

> > > >

> > > > I was supposed to do another blood test 8 weeks after I started the

zinc, to see if the copper has come down. Well, its been 8 weeks, and I'm just

now pulling the almond milk, thanks to my silly mistake. Dont want to poke my

son needlessly, so I'm going to wait another 4-8 weeks or so before the blood

test. Anyone have experience on HOW LONG this takes, using supplements, to

reduce copper?

> > > >

> > > > Thanks for your help.

> > > >

> > > > a

> > > >

> > >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Hi

You will need a doctor's scrip to get DMPS. That's why we didn't start with it.

I wanted oral DMPS but our doc would only prescribe transdermal (Buttar was all

the rage at the time).

We did one round of t/dermal with glutathione, which was a disaster. Our son

went feral on the glutathione.

I threw the stuff out and talked our doc into a scrip for t/dermal without

glutathione.

The next few months were great -- I chelated in four-day rounds every two weeks.

Side-effects were minimal and I slept well.

I'm not the only one who has found this. I remember Andy saying he chelated

himself with DMPS and found it much easier that other chelators.

It's a pain, but I would consider looking for a doctor who works with a decent

comounding pharmacist. Now that Buttar is no longer trendy, getting oral DMPS

shouldn't be a problem.

You'll still need to use ALA eventually, but you can make huge strides in the

meantime on DMPS and be in a much better position when you start ALA.

Steve

>

> Steve -- you have an excellent point.

>

> My health was so compromised, that in 4 years, I only have in about 45

> rounds of chelation. Trying to teach full-time on such low energy reserves

> meant I didn't get much else done.

>

> I would lose 3 nights sleep a week and I was already chronically exhausted.

> Plus, I'd forget dosing and have to stop rounds. I'd be at almost 100

> rounds, if I didn't have to stop dosing for all the times I forgot. I did

> set my phone with an alarm, but sometimes would forget it or not hear it in

> my purse or over the kid's noise. I don't have to you that short-term memory

> problems are huge for mercury toxics.

>

> It would have significantly helped me to just have to dose 3 times a day

> compared to 7 with the DMPS. By now, my health is probably 25-30% improved.

> I chelate 3 days and 2 nights, so I don't have to face as much sleep

> loss, and I've got enough mercury out, that I can sometimes fall back asleep.

> No matter what I did for those first years, I would not fall asleep after I

> woke up after my middle of the night dose. Sometimes Melatonin and other

> things would help, but often I became use to it or didn't have the right

> dose, so it was ineffective (I tried many doses).

>

> I still usually face one night of sleeplessness, which is much better than

> the 3 nights from my early chelating days. I wish I'd had your

> recommendation back then. I'd read about it of course, but it wasn't often

used, and

> I believe you needed a prescription to get it. A lot of us chelate without

> a prescription or doctor's help. Do you know of any place it can be

> purchased without one? I'd be open to considering rotating a round of that

with

> a round of DMSA/ALA chelation, because it would help me get more rounds in

> so I could make more progress.

>

> Thank you,

>

>

> Rosegvr

>

>

>