Re: Grapeseed Extract, GSE, dose?

[Guest guest]

Do you mean Grapefruit Seed Extract?

Grape Seed Extract is used by some with ME/CFIDS. It is a vasodilator so those

with dysautonomia issues generally don't do well on it.

Grapefruit Seed Extract is used by some with Lyme. Many have tremendous die off

reactions with it so start low and go slow. I myself have regained some

cognitive skills (desperately needed) using it. I started a few months ago and

after each herx has ended, I increase only by a drop or two a day depending on

how much I think I can handle at the time. (The herxing, at least with me, can

be pretty wicked though. I might add, if I could avoid the herxing with Lyme I

sure would but I don't seem to progress forward unless there is a herx.) It did

get some bad press a while back that seemed inconclusive to me. After

researching it fairly extensively, I decided to go ahead and I'm glad I did. It

seems to really penetrate and I've found greater positive results (after the

herxing) with it than being on antibiotics for 1 1/2 years. There's lots on the

internet if you google it. It has also been discussed at Lymenet.

I personally started with drops as it is easier to control the dosage but it is

available in capsules as well. Started with a a few drops twice a day and

increased slowly after each major herx. My son (19) could only tolerate 3 drops

twice a day to start. He started 6 weeks ago and has had 2 or 3 major herxes and

is now at 6 drops twice a day.

One popular brand people with Lyme are using is by NutriBiotic, using a

Citricidal (patented) formula. I think this is the one that Rosner talks

about in his book " Top Ten Lyme Treatments " , although I don't have his book to

check. Apparently he has devoted a whole chapter to GSE. I would love to know

what else he says about it so if anyone has his book and can post about it, I'd

sure appreciate it. I have also used Solaray and have just ordered some more of

this brand as I think it may be a little stronger.

Anyway, I've written too much - didn't mean to. (I'm usually fairly quiet - no

energy!)

Good Luck Purple Foxglove with whatever you decide.

Best Wishes from Canada - heat wave over here this weekend.

[ ] Grapeseed Extract, GSE, dose?

Hello,

My young,green, holistic MD says Grape Seed Extract is safe, and i've heard

it's a cyst-buster. & nbsp; Does anyone know the dosage? & nbsp; I haven't noticed

Selma mentioning it.

& nbsp;

Thanks,

purpleffoxglove

[Guest guest]

Not sure WHY you want to herx. & nbsp; I do everything in my power so I don't

herx. & nbsp; I want to feel GOOD, all the time if possible. & nbsp; Unfortunately

it is not possible.

& nbsp;

Have you done Buhner's herbs?

& nbsp;

Jim.

###

From: Barbara & lt;brfifield@... & gt;

Subject: Re: [ ] Grapeseed Extract, GSE, dose?

Date: Saturday, June 7, 2008, 7:53 AM

Do you mean Grapefruit Seed Extract?

Grape Seed Extract is used by some with ME/CFIDS. It is a vasodilator so those

with dysautonomia issues generally don't do well on it.

Grapefruit Seed Extract is used by some with Lyme. Many have tremendous die off

reactions with it so start low and go slow. I myself have regained some

cognitive skills (desperately needed) using it. I started a few months ago and

after each herx has ended, I increase only by a drop or two a day depending on

how much I think I can handle at the time. (The herxing, at least with me, can

be pretty wicked though. I might add, if I could avoid the herxing with Lyme I

sure would but I don't seem to progress forward unless there is a herx.) It did

get some bad press a while back that seemed inconclusive to me. After

researching it fairly extensively, I decided to go ahead and I'm glad I did. It

seems to really penetrate and I've found greater positive results (after the

herxing) with it than being on antibiotics for 1 1/2 years. There's lots on the

internet if you google it. It has also been discussed at Lymenet.

I personally started with drops as it is easier to control the dosage but it is

available in capsules as well. Started with a a few drops twice a day and

increased slowly after each major herx. My son (19) could only tolerate 3 drops

twice a day to start. He started 6 weeks ago and has had 2 or 3 major herxes and

is now at 6 drops twice a day.

One popular brand people with Lyme are using is by NutriBiotic, using a

Citricidal (patented) formula. I think this is the one that Rosner talks

about in his book " Top Ten Lyme Treatments " , although I don't have his book to

check. Apparently he has devoted a whole chapter to GSE. I would love to know

what else he says about it so if anyone has his book and can post about it, I'd

sure appreciate it. I have also used Solaray and have just ordered some more of

this brand as I think it may be a little stronger.

Anyway, I've written too much - didn't mean to. (I'm usually fairly quiet - no

energy!)

Good Luck Purple Foxglove with whatever you decide.

Best Wishes from Canada - heat wave over here this weekend.

[Guest guest]

Hello Barbara,

I just thought to this post this brief discussion by Rosner (The

Top 10 Lyme Disease Treaments) of the GSE you mentioned which I found

posted online:

" Grapefruit Seed Extract

(not to be confused with grape seed extract)

Grapefruit seed extract is a powerful natural antibiotic that has

produced herx reactions and improvement in Lyme Disease sufferers who

use it. It is also commonly used for the prevention and treatment of

Candida.

The brand of grapefruit seed extract most commonly purchased by Lyme

Disease community members is:

www.nutriteam.com

Product name, “NutriBiotic Tabletsâ€

The other suggested natural antibiotic supplements are found on this

same link (nothing new as far as herbs--Buhner is mentioned on this

page as well):

http://www.lymebook.com/lyme-grapefruit-lauricidin-colloidal-silver-samento

Both the index and the table of contents are posted online so it

should make it easy to decide if it is worth purchasing the book.

best,

>

> Do you mean Grapefruit Seed Extract?

>

> Grape Seed Extract is used by some with ME/CFIDS. It is a

vasodilator so those with dysautonomia issues generally don't do well

on it.

>

> Grapefruit Seed Extract is used by some with Lyme. Many have

tremendous die off reactions with it so start low and go slow. I

myself have regained some cognitive skills (desperately needed) using

it. I started a few months ago and after each herx has ended, I

increase only by a drop or two a day depending on how much I think I

can handle at the time. (The herxing, at least with me, can be pretty

wicked though. I might add, if I could avoid the herxing with Lyme I

sure would but I don't seem to progress forward unless there is a

herx.) It did get some bad press a while back that seemed inconclusive

to me. After researching it fairly extensively, I decided to go ahead

and I'm glad I did. It seems to really penetrate and I've found

greater positive results (after the herxing) with it than being on

antibiotics for 1 1/2 years. There's lots on the internet if you

google it. It has also been discussed at Lymenet.

>

> I personally started with drops as it is easier to control the

dosage but it is available in capsules as well. Started with a a few

drops twice a day and increased slowly after each major herx. My son

(19) could only tolerate 3 drops twice a day to start. He started 6

weeks ago and has had 2 or 3 major herxes and is now at 6 drops twice

a day.

>

> One popular brand people with Lyme are using is by NutriBiotic,

using a Citricidal (patented) formula. I think this is the one that

Rosner talks about in his book " Top Ten Lyme Treatments " ,

although I don't have his book to check. Apparently he has devoted a

whole chapter to GSE. I would love to know what else he says about it

so if anyone has his book and can post about it, I'd sure appreciate

it. I have also used Solaray and have just ordered some more of this

brand as I think it may be a little stronger.

>

> Anyway, I've written too much - didn't mean to. (I'm usually fairly

quiet - no energy!)

>

> Good Luck Purple Foxglove with whatever you decide.

>

> Best Wishes from Canada - heat wave over here this weekend.

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Jim,

It is not that I want to herx Jim but that I seem to be one of those people that

don't make any progress forward until I do herx. I would certainly prefer not to

but then nothing changes for me - no improvement. So I try to familiarize myself

with the substance I'm using and the reaction I'm having to it and push the

dosage just enough to herx but not flatten myself for days on end.

Yes, I'm doing Buhner - introducing them one at a time and doing other adjuncts

as well. I am one of those who need to start low and go slow. Some of Buhners

herbs such as Knotweed are vasodilators and so give me problems with

dysautonomia issues. Red root is a blood coagulant and I seem to need substances

that thin the blood so I've ordered some Cleavers to give that a try. Cats Claw

is proving beneficial but I've only worked up to 4 a day. As soon as I get some

appointments out of the way that I need to be able to function for, I'll take

the next step and double the dose.

How are you making out with your re-infection Jim?

Best Wishes,

Barbara

Re: [ ] Grapeseed Extract, GSE, dose?

Date: Saturday, June 7, 2008, 7:53 AM

Do you mean Grapefruit Seed Extract?

Grape Seed Extract is used by some with ME/CFIDS. It is a vasodilator so those

with dysautonomia issues generally don't do well on it.

Grapefruit Seed Extract is used by some with Lyme. Many have tremendous die

off reactions with it so start low and go slow. I myself have regained some

cognitive skills (desperately needed) using it. I started a few months ago and

after each herx has ended, I increase only by a drop or two a day depending on

how much I think I can handle at the time. (The herxing, at least with me, can

be pretty wicked though. I might add, if I could avoid the herxing with Lyme I

sure would but I don't seem to progress forward unless there is a herx.) It did

get some bad press a while back that seemed inconclusive to me. After

researching it fairly extensively, I decided to go ahead and I'm glad I did. It

seems to really penetrate and I've found greater positive results (after the

herxing) with it than being on antibiotics for 1 1/2 years. There's lots on the

internet if you google it. It has also been discussed at Lymenet.

I personally started with drops as it is easier to control the dosage but it

is available in capsules as well. Started with a a few drops twice a day and

increased slowly after each major herx. My son (19) could only tolerate 3 drops

twice a day to start. He started 6 weeks ago and has had 2 or 3 major herxes and

is now at 6 drops twice a day.

One popular brand people with Lyme are using is by NutriBiotic, using a

Citricidal (patented) formula. I think this is the one that Rosner talks

about in his book " Top Ten Lyme Treatments " , although I don't have his book to

check. Apparently he has devoted a whole chapter to GSE. I would love to know

what else he says about it so if anyone has his book and can post about it, I'd

sure appreciate it. I have also used Solaray and have just ordered some more of

this brand as I think it may be a little stronger.

Anyway, I've written too much - didn't mean to. (I'm usually fairly quiet - no

energy!)

Good Luck Purple Foxglove with whatever you decide.

Best Wishes from Canada - heat wave over here this weekend.

[Guest guest]

Okay, if it works for you.  I hate pain, so try to do all I can to keep away

from it.

 

The only real problem I am having since my reinfection is that my right shoulder

has been very painful.  I have never had that before.  I am using ice and heat

on it today.  Hope it gets better soon, it is depressing.  I have upped my herbs

too.  I would add in an abx, but my stomach just can't take them.  My stomach is

fine these days without them.  It is the TOTAl way we feel, that counts with

me.  Like many abx help on some problems for some people, but the side effects

are sometimes worse than the cure.

 

Jim.

###

From: Barbara <brfifield@...>

Subject: Re: [ ] Grapeseed Extract, GSE, dose?

Date: Sunday, June 8, 2008, 9:24 AM

Hi Jim,

It is not that I want to herx Jim but that I seem to be one of those people that

don't make any progress forward until I do herx. I would certainly prefer not to

but then nothing changes for me - no improvement. So I try to familiarize myself

with the substance I'm using and the reaction I'm having to it and push the

dosage just enough to herx but not flatten myself for days on end.

Yes, I'm doing Buhner - introducing them one at a time and doing other adjuncts

as well. I am one of those who need to start low and go slow. Some of Buhners

herbs such as Knotweed are vasodilators and so give me problems with

dysautonomia issues. Red root is a blood coagulant and I seem to need substances

that thin the blood so I've ordered some Cleavers to give that a try. Cats Claw

is proving beneficial but I've only worked up to 4 a day. As soon as I get some

appointments out of the way that I need to be able to function for, I'll take

the next step and double the dose.

How are you making out with your re-infection Jim?

Best Wishes,

Barbara

[Guest guest]

I am trying noni juice and grape seed extract(both in small amounts

throughout the day; the gse in capsule form) for my lipomas(fatty tissue

tumors) and

they appear to be softening a little. This is on recommendation of another

site that is having some remarkable success in shrinking their tumors with this

combo.-

Robin

In a message dated 6/7/2008 3:56:03 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time,

purpleffoxglove@... writes:

Hello,

My young,green, holistic MD says Grape Seed Extract is safe, and i've heard

it's a cyst-buster. & nbsp; Does anyone know the dosage? & nbsp; I haven't

noticed Selma mentioning it.

& nbsp;

Thanks,

purpleffoxglove

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

**************Get trade secrets for amazing burgers. Watch " Cooking with

Tyler Florence " on AOL Food.

(http://food.aol.com/tyler-florence?video=4? & NCID=aolfod00030000000002)

[Guest guest]

Hi Jim,

I'm sorry to hear about your shoulder. I get what I call 'frozen shoulder

syndrome' as well as 'frozen hip syndrome' where everything becomes very painful

and usually ends up ceaseing up for a time. I've heard others refer to this by

the same name. I googled it once but forget what I found out.

I understand exactly where you're coming from on the herxing and if there was a

way for me to avoid any more pain or increased symptoms and yet still move

forward - I certainly would!!! I've suffered enough with this for more than 25

years. After being bedridden for years, this is the best I've been for oh so

long. I'm thankful that I can take joy in such simple things like a little

gardening, cleaning out a long oerdue cupboard, etc., that I haven't been able

to do for years. Maybe once the pathogen load is down it will be easier for me.

I suspect there are more pathogens than Bb at play in me.

I really appreciate your point of view and just want to thank you again for all

of your comments and direction you so freely pass along to myself and others on

this list.

Best Wishes,

Barbara

Re: [ ] Grapeseed Extract, GSE, dose?

Date: Sunday, June 8, 2008, 9:24 AM

Hi Jim,

It is not that I want to herx Jim but that I seem to be one of those people

that don't make any progress forward until I do herx. I would certainly prefer

not to but then nothing changes for me - no improvement. So I try to familiarize

myself with the substance I'm using and the reaction I'm having to it and push

the dosage just enough to herx but not flatten myself for days on end.

Yes, I'm doing Buhner - introducing them one at a time and doing other

adjuncts as well. I am one of those who need to start low and go slow. Some of

Buhners herbs such as Knotweed are vasodilators and so give me problems with

dysautonomia issues. Red root is a blood coagulant and I seem to need substances

that thin the blood so I've ordered some Cleavers to give that a try. Cats Claw

is proving beneficial but I've only worked up to 4 a day. As soon as I get some

appointments out of the way that I need to be able to function for, I'll take

the next step and double the dose.

How are you making out with your re-infection Jim?

Best Wishes,

Barbara

[Guest guest]

Hi again Barbara,

I don't think you are missing much about GSE from the Rosner book as

only two pages are listed in the index which discuss GSE. Evidently

the other page is only a one page discussion (if that) as we

already know the other online posted page has a mere one paragraph

mention of it.

best,

>

> Hi ,

>

> Thank you for posting this information. I did see this previously

and was really curious what else he has written in his chapter on GSE.

The book looks good but the current finanical position dictates

weighing each and every purchase.

>

> Thanks again ,

> Best Wishes

> Barbara

>

[Guest guest]

-I agree that those of us with dysauto have to try GSE very carefully if at

all--I tried it and it did nothing for me re Lyme but it DID nip a flu/cold in

the bud fast about 2 yrs ago

as for Rosners top ten book...dont bother buying--ever--...I have the book--a

big WASTE of paper/trees--as typical for one of his books--the index lists p 155

for it--and not a whit is mentioned--it also lists p 94 and it has a scant 1/3

page--a far cry from the " whole chapter "

I will print in entirety what it says if for no other reasons but to prevent

others from wasting their money on it AND to prove how useless all the info is

in the book:

[Grapefruit seed extract is a powerful natural antibiotic that has produced herx

reactions and improvement in Lyme Disease sufferers who use it. It is also

commonly used for the prevention and treatment of Candida.]

WOW what earth shattering info---and btw NOT one word is backed up by any sort

of citation or provable--and triple spaced too--so it takes up that 1/3 page!!!!

he then writes:

[The brand of grapefruit seed extract most commonly purchased by Lyme Disease

community members are:

www.nutriteam.com Product name " Nutribiotic Tablets " ]

THIS is so false and Im guessing he gets commisssion why else print it--what Ive

seen is what Barb said--most use the LQUID as I do/did:

NUTRIBIOTIC original GSE liquid concentrate available everywhere!!! white bottle

about 2 oz red cap.

per bottle: mix 5-15 drops in glass water or juice 1-3 times daily ( you may

wish to ask your health prof. how high to go and how many hrs apart from other

meds---if grapefruits have a chemical interacts with many drugs Im guessing the

seeds may too)

Im not convinced it gets " cystic' forms, and the Herxes felt may be other

bacteria/viral die off as Ive not seen very good proof of it getting the active

Lyme either

as with all things like this--carefully try with a good health prof on board and

if it helps--continue.

Finette

[Guest guest]

re Rosner book

the index and contents wont help either in deciding if worth buying it---editing

carelessness means much of whats listed isnt where its supposed to be if at

all...and scant info anyway--read my previous posts re this problem

simply dont bother buying

Finette