Re: Is Post Lyme Disease Syndrome the same as Chronic Lyme or distinct from it?

[Guest guest]

peter,

just thot i would throw this out there for fatigue. liposomal glutathoine

and energy multi plex by researched nutritionals helped me tremendously and

i also take liquid dmg that i get from the health food store. best wishes

On Sun, Mar 20, 2011 at 10:07 PM, petermbrisbane <

petermengede2000@...> wrote:

>

>

> I'm just trying to decipher the following message sent through Lymeinfo

> regarding PLDS and would appreciate your informed opinion.

>

> ContactsLymeInfo Anti-Borrelia burgdorferi antibody

> profile in post-Lyme

> disease syndrome

> Chandra A, Wormser GP, Marques AR, Latov N, Alaedini A.

> Clinical Vaccine and Immunology, published online ahead of

> print on 16 March 2011.

>

> http://dx.doi.org/10.1128/CVI.00002-11

>

> Abstract

>

> Patients with post-Lyme disease syndrome (PLDS) report

> persistent symptoms of pain, fatigue, and/or concentration

> and memory disturbances despite antibiotic treatment for

> Lyme borreliosis. The etiopathogenesis of these symptoms

> remains unknown and no effective therapies have been

> identified.

>

> We sought to examine the anti-borrelia antibody profile in

> affected patients with the aim of finding clues to the

> mechanism of the syndrome and its relationship to the

> original spirochetal infection. Serum specimens from 54

> borrelial seropositive PLDS patients were examined for

> antibodies to B. burgdorferi proteins p18, p25, p28, p30,

> p31, p34, p39, p41, p45, p58, p66, p93, and VlsE by

> automated immunoblotting and software-assisted band

> analysis. Presence of serum antibodies to the 31 kDa band

> was further investigated by examination of reactivity

> against purified recombinant OspA protein. Control specimens

> included sera from 14 borrelial seropositive individuals

> with a history of early localized or disseminated Lyme

> disease who were symptom-free (post-Lyme healthy), as well

> as 20 healthy individuals without serologic evidence or

> history of Lyme disease.

>

> In comparison to the post-Lyme healthy group, higher

> frequencies of antibody to p28 (p <0.05), p30 (p <0.05), p31

> (p <0.0001), and p34 (p <0.05) proteins were found in the

> PLDS group. Assessment of antibody reactivity to recombinant

> OspA confirmed the presence of elevated levels in PLDS

> patients (p <0.005). The described anti-borrelia antibody

> profile in PLDS offers clues about the course of the

> antecedent infection in affected patients, which may be

> useful for understanding the pathogenic mechanism of the

> disease.

>

> http://dx.doi.org/10.1128/CVI.00002-11

>

> I've had PLDS that's flared up and down for 17 years and have constantly

> treid to find treatment though GPs in New York, took part in a Stoneybrook

> University Hospital Chronic Lyme study, where Western Blots and a spinal tap

> returned negative results. I thought all options were closed when I moved

> back to Queensland until I found this group. I tried the Buhner Protocol for

> four months last year and found that it produced a crushing fatigue. I'm now

> working with a great doctor who's having a go at it, am pulsing ABX,

> Plaquinel, and herbal supplements but haven't experienced any herxing other

> than the Bughner fatigue. All lupus, rheumatic tests are negative.

>

> Are there any options for people with PLDS. Indeed, is there anything

> credible written on the topic?

>

> I guess I'll stay the course until Dr N is next over and see what develops.

>

>

> Thanks,

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

What is liposomal mean?  Is that a transdermal?

>

I'm just trying to decipher the following message sent through Lymeinfo

> regarding PLDS and would appreciate your informed opinion.

>

>

[Guest guest]

>

>

> I've had PLDS that's flared up and down for 17 years and have constantly treid

to find treatment though GPs in New York, took part in a Stoneybrook University

Hospital Chronic Lyme study, where Western Blots and a spinal tap returned

negative results.

just to be sure: with PLDS you mean you had Lyme (EM/positive test), were

treated with ABX for some time and still have complaints many years later? For

me it's just chronic Lyme, PLDS is an invention of some people who don't want to

accept the reality of Lyme disease.

> Are there any options for people with PLDS. Indeed, is there anything credible

written on the topic?

IMHO there is hardly any good research, mostly thanks (NOT ...) to some of the

people who wrote the article you mention. At least Wormser now admits that PLDS

is not 'just in the mind' and that there is something objectively different

(wrong?) with these patients that can be tested.

The bad thing is that he still talks about 'antecedent infection' etc., meaning

that they are convinced the Borrelia infection is gone, which is nonsense IMHO

(too much evidence of the contrary for most chronic patients). And because of

this, they are still doing the wrong research. I fear that there will be no real

progress until Wormser, Marques etc. retire from the research community

At the moment I think your only options are 'lifestyle changes' and trying

different ABX, herbs and detox protocols until you find a combination that works

for you ...

[Guest guest]

>

> My LLMD, Cameron, recently published research which supports the theory

that Bb can persistent despite abx treatment..

This has been proven over and over again for lab animals, so why would humans be

any different. The only problem is that you can't 'experiment' with humans to

verify the theory. Unlike lab animals, you can't sacrifice humans after the

experiment to take biopsies of the brain etc. This makes it almost impossible to

provide real proof.

I have now read the full article about PLS, and I have to say there are some

good points in the discussion. They are shifting their story (apparently the old

version of 'it is all in the head' was no longer believable). The major problem

is that they keep talking about past infection, apparently based on negative

serology after treatment. We know that this point of view is patently wrong ...

There are some suggestions for further research in there, that could lead to

treatments for chronic lyme down the road. Just wonder why it took so long for

them to accept ... maybe Wormser has a patent pending now, related to PLS

treatment?